Ancient Aliens, Fallen Angels, Hidden Secrets Of The Vatican, The Coming Superhuman Race & Much More With Tim Alberino.

My name is Ben Greenfield, and on this episode of the Ben Greenfield Life podcast—

It's described in great detail. These vehicles apparently can hover in place. They can fly at great speeds. They discharge what appears to be missiles or lasers. These vehicles are written about in the Indian epics in the context of historical fact. They're coming with their technology and with their knowledge, so they're introducing into this Iron Age civilization technology that far surpasses anything we have today.

Faith. Family, fitness, health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and a whole lot more. Welcome to the show.

All right, folks, it's something I've hinted at a couple of times. We've never really done a podcast about topics like, say, UFOs or aliens or the Nephilim or anything like that, but I have been eating up the content and the book called Birthright by my guest on today's podcast, Timothy Alberino. And, he's like the Indiana Jones of lost civilizations and hidden treasures and legendary creatures. For me as a guy who has grown up in North Idaho and Eastern Washington, I've of course always known about the legend of Bigfoot, but Tim goes way beyond just Bigfoot and dives into a whole host of esoteric topics like alternative history and ancient methodologies and architecture, giants, cryptids, UFOs, alien abduction, transhumanism, occult conspiracies, eschatology, you name it, Tim's got something out there on it. And, he has some fantastic videos on his website. Obviously, you could go deep down the rabbit hole. And, I am going to put a link and resources for everything that we talk about including Timothy's fantastic book Birthright, if you go to bengreenfieldlife.com/birthright. That's bengreenfieldlife.com/birthright. Tim, welcome to the show, man.

Hey, Ben, thanks for inviting me.

No problem. By the way, you go by Tim or Timothy?

Tim's fine.

All right, cool. That saves me a few syllables. How'd you get into all this, man?

Well, I suppose it started when I was 18 years old and I got kicked out/dropped out of high school. Uh, and then I, I moved to the Amazon jungle, to the Amazon basin in Peru, and that's really where the journey began for me. Um, by the time I was 19, I was living in, in the Amazon and, and, uh, encountered, uh, all kinds of weird things and had some interesting encounters myself in terms of, uh, let's call it some paranormal stuff, and but also became familiarized with some of the legends in Peru. And then of course the megaliths and stories of giants. And so that's, that's really where things began for me, was in the Amazon basin of Peru.

The Amazon seems like kind of a random place to go after getting kicked out of high school. How'd that actually go down?

Well, truth be told, I was, uh, kicked out of high school, and then my, my first attempt at traveling abroad was, was Ireland. I had this dream of going to Ireland, and so I'll make a very long story very brief. I landed in Gatwick, London, in order to go up north to Scotland and cross over to Ireland. And we had this whole— me and my buddy had this whole 3-month-long trek planned, and they deported me from Gatwick the next day.

Really?

So first I got kicked out of high school, then I got kicked out of United Kingdom.

Were these for similar reasons? I mean, were you just walking around with a joint in your mouth or something like that?

Or— No, no, no, no.

Totally different reasons.

I was never a troublemaker in any way. I never did any kind of drugs. I didn't drink. I was actually very— I would say very straight-edge young man. In school, I just— that's kind of a different conversation, but let's Let's say that I wasn't excited about certain policies in school, like homework. I had my own policy, and that was that I didn't bring school home. Yeah. So the teachers would pass out homework, and I hated that place so much that I refused to bring it home. And so I would just sign my name and turn it back in. And very politely, I would, I was never, like I said, I was never a disruptive student, but I passed all my grades. But, uh, you know, I did so by the skin of my teeth. But school bored me to death, for one thing, and I wasn't very enthusiastic about the social interactions and the environment and the fakery of high school. So that was a different situation.

Yeah, and by the way, I'm nodding my head like I understand, but I was homeschooled K through 12, so it's a little bit of a foreign concept to me. But I think I get it. I'm just wondering if any of your teachers have had a chance to get their hands on your big books now and seen your videos.

I don't know. That would be very interesting. But I got kicked out of England for other reasons. In fact, the reason why they kicked me and my buddy out of England boils down to the fact that they didn't like the particular immigrations officer, this woman I was dealing with, she was not too fond of young white American Yankees. Male, I should say. Young, young white male American Yankees. That's the way she put it.

Yeah.

And so she, she, she called me a Yankee. It's the first time I've ever been called a Yankee in my entire life. And literally turned us around, put us on the plane home the next day. And how does that get me to Peru? Because when I came back to the United States, back to Cleveland, Ohio— well, actually a suburb of Cleveland, Ohio, Brook Park, Ohio, where I was, where I grew up, in which I was desperately trying to escape. It was just the, the doldrums of, of suburbia America. And I was quite an adventurous lad. And so when I came back, I was very depressed. I was distraught, to say the least. Like, I can't get out of here. And it just so happened my father was a pastor. It just so happened that there was this Mexican missionary, he was a Mexican-American missionary to Peru named Alfonso Felix, and he happened to be speaking at my dad's church like the week I came back from being deported from England. And my stepmother had been to Peru with Alfonso and she said, Tim, you need to go to Peru. She saw how depressed I was from getting ejected from from the United Kingdom, and she said, "You need to go to Peru." I didn't really have any desire to go to Peru, but it was the only option left. The door opened, and I ended up going down with Alfonso for a month or two, and then I came back to the United States to work for a couple of months just to save up enough money to leave for good. So, it was 18, 19 years old. 18 years old was the transition to Peru. By the time I was 19, I was living there.

Long-term.

Wow.

I'm chuckling as you talk about the young white male American Yankee. I feel like that could be a new pronoun, like the YWMA. That's right.

YWMA.

So obviously— Nobody really uses the term Yankee.

I feel like it's underutilized.

No, no. I mean, the last time I heard that was when I recommended my sons read Mark Twain's book, the Yankee, Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court. Great book, by the way. Yeah, who, uh, who need a good Mark Twain read. So anyways, um, you know, talking about Peru, obviously elephant in the room here. We have all the news headlines, at least at the time that you and I are recording this, about these alien attacks in, in Peru. I'm curious, have you returned to Peru since then? Is that, is that where your interest in, in, you know, things paranormal first arose? Since this situation that's unfolded in the jungle with these alleged Oh no, no, since, well, since, since you, you originally went there with this missionary, like, oh yes, did you get interested in the paranormal while there?

Yes, yes. So I ended up staying in Peru for a couple of years, just wandering around, mainly in the Amazon. I was, I was all over the place, including way up the river where this incident took place, uh, recently with the villagers and, and the aliens, the alleged aliens. Um, I was in the Andes as well. I was all over the place. I was kind of a vagabond. Um, and then I, after, and I had some, that's when I had some very interesting experiences. And then after that, I went back to Ohio briefly, back to, back to Cleveland, Ohio, and I ended up getting married to one of the young ladies in my dad's church, a thing I swore I would never do, by the way. And, uh, and then her and I moved to Peru.

Get married or get married to a church girl?

Well, I, I, I always said, look, if I'm going to get married, I'm not going to marry an American woman, especially an American woman from Cleveland, Ohio, and especially American woman from Cleveland, Ohio that happens to be a member of my dad's church.

And that is— you're not, you're not going to marry a Yankee.

And that is— yeah, exactly. And that is precisely what I did. So, uh, and then I, I, after we got married, we, we moved together to Peru, um, and the, the adventure continued in Peru for, for a number of years. All told, I lived about 10 years in the Amazon basin.

You said you had some interesting experiences there. It sounds like that got you a little bit interested in this whole paranormal piece. What were some of those experiences?

Well, um, I should— I guess I should say that one of the, one of the primary motivations to, to not, not necessarily going specifically to Peru, but, but leaving, leaving this, as I said, the doldrums of, of Suburbia America was, first of all, I had this insatiable appetite for adventure. That was the first thing. I just couldn't quench it. It was just insatiable. I mean, I, I, I, I, I read through The Chronicles of Narnia when I was, uh, when I was, um, you know, 10, 11, 12 years old. Then I, then I devoured The Lord of the Rings when I was a teenager. And I just had, as I said, I just, I just had an insatiable insatiable appetite for adventure. So that was part of the equation. But then the other part of the equation was I also had an insatiable appetite to encounter God. I grew up in church and I had very good upbringing, by the way. I had very good parents, grew up in a very healthy environment. And so, I'm thankful for that. But I was left with this this desire to have like a burning bush encounter with God. And I was willing to sacrifice everything to attain it. And I just felt like I was being drawn into the wilderness, so to speak, to get away from everything and to get by myself and to isolate myself somewhere and seek the face of God intensely for an extended period of time. And that's a very long story. But ultimately, I did do just that in the Amazon. And, I had quite the experience, which is a whole— it'd take me 3 hours to explain that. But, let's just say that for the sake of brevity that my quest was fulfilled. Let's just put it that way.

Most of the people I talk to these days who talk about having a spiritual experience in the Amazon, they're using entheogenic substances, ayahuasca or something like that. Was this similar for you?

No, no, I've never touched ayahuasca. I never even smoked a joint, uh, to this day. I mean, you know, I smoke cigars and pipes, but, you know, it's tobacco, it's not, uh, it's not weed.

So yeah, um, although down there they snort that up their nose, right, with the, with the hape, the shako? I, I think it's, it's a nicotine-based alkaloid.

In the jungle, they smoke a very, very crude cigarette called a mapacho. It's a— it's— they roll it themselves and it's just— it's very harsh and very strong. Um, but you know, there's a lot of ayahuasca and I just— I don't ever— I never want to alter my, my state of mind. I just don't— I don't like it. I don't even like to take pain pills, uh, strong pain pills. I just don't like the feeling of my mind being altered in any way And so, I've always stayed away from those kinds of substances, psychedelics and ayahuasca and those kinds of— Ben Greenfield: Yeah.

Well, I'd be curious to hear your take on that because there's obviously that guy Brian Murasku. I had him on my podcast a couple of years ago who swears that entheogenic substances were a core foundational part of early Christianity. And, a lot of people are using psychadelics or entheogens in my opinion in a very similar way to how they were used for the purposes of divination, for example, in scripture referred to as pharmakeia. And, as a part of this, and I would imagine you've probably come across this yourself, people report interacting with or seeing entities and they're often consistent entities from person to person like some kind of a purple fairy or a praying mantis or whatever. Mushinels. Yeah. Yeah, the machine elves. What's your take on that? Do you think these are actual aliens or, or angels or demons or something like that that people are experiencing?

Well, my take on this would be that there, there's, there's a field of consciousness, um, and, uh, I haven't really spent a whole lot of time developing this idea of mine, but I think there's a field of consciousness. I think that all of us are intrinsically connected to some degree. And that when you take psychedelics, you sort of tap into this internet of consciousness, let's call it. And, um, and so that's— that would explain why people experience the same sort of— they see the same sort of things, they have sometimes the same sort of experiences, both with their positive and negative trips. So if you're tapping into, again, an internet of consciousness, if we are all intrinsically connected, and not just us but other conscious entities as well, then you're dealing with a perceptual reality. You're not necessarily dealing with a tangible reality, a physical reality. Rather, you're in a perceptual— let's call it a realm, although I don't really like that word very much. Um, you— we're in, we're in a perceptual realm in which our minds are plugged in to this internet of consciousness, and, and, and that would explain why everyone— not everyone, but why there's so much similarity in people's experiences and why you can interface with different kinds of entities and, and why people receive similar messages. Why shamans, for example, can access information regarding plants, regarding medicinal plants and other things like that. Because in the same way that we access information on the internet that's available to everybody who can get online, And so there's something like that in my estimation happening. There's— we don't understand consciousness, and we are all intrinsically connected, even on— even in the material sense, um, you know, with, uh, with, uh, quantum entanglement and all of that. There's, there's something like conscious entanglement as well. So, um, and that's a gateway. It's, it's a gateway. And, and here's the, here's the reason why I think it was so why it is prohibited in the Hebrew scriptures. Because when you open yourself up, when you plug in to this, to this internet of consciousness, you are at a— you're as a human being, you're at a disadvantage. You can be— you're in a perceptual world that you're not familiar with. You are not in control at that point. And so you're susceptible to all kinds of manipulation and deception. And who knows what else. And I think it's— we don't understand it, and you know, you're playing with fire when you, when you, when you subject yourself. Now, people will say, you know, aren't there— isn't it— aren't there benefits to, for example, low-dose psilocybin for, for patients who are terminally ill with cancer or something like that, who when they take some psilocybin, assuming they have a good trip, and most people do with psilocybin that it actually abates the fear of death and it helps them to accept their terminal illness. I don't think I would be opposed to that. I think, you know, I think there's environments in which psychedelics might be useful, but I've seen some pretty dramatic things happen with people who take ayahuasca. I've seen some people get absolutely ruined. And you hear about all the good stories, but you don't hear the bad ones. And the bad ones are pretty dramatic. I mean, people— I know people who did ayahuasca and suddenly they've got a visitor. They've got something that is following them. It's a phenomenon. You might consider it something like demon possession. Where these people suddenly can't shake this presence. It's like it's attached itself to them after ayahuasca. And this is a real problem for these people. They, they go down there to get detoxed in Tarapoto, Peru, where I spent a lot of time in, in the Peruvian Amazon basin. Um, there's a place called Takiwasi, which is very— it's famous. It's, it's, it's run by, um, some French people, and, uh, it— I lived right next to it. And it's a detox center, and they use ayahuasca, and they use shamans. And, and I heard some stories from the people who've gone through the detox. Yeah, they got detoxed off of an addiction to heroin or something like that, but now, now they're dealing with what, what appears to be, uh, something, something like demon possession. And so they traded, they traded one problem for another, and you don't hear about those cases.

Yeah, I have multiple friends who have done a lot. And, I think the only kind of, I guess, decent media that the dark side of ayahuasca or plant medicine in general has gotten is I think it was the New Yorker Magazine did a 9-part podcast series on sexual abuse and stripping the Amazon of its resources and also some of these issues with bipolar, schizophrenia, or multiple personality disorder that I think you and I might suspect could be something like an entity or a demonic possession or something like that that a lot of these people come out of those experiences with. And, I have multiple friends who have had to go through an exorcism-like experience after coming back from something like ayahuasca. And, I don't think that kind of like your reference to psilocybin when used in the proper context, I don't necessarily think that that makes those plants or those plant combinations evil, I think they're just being used in a way that perhaps God, if you're a creationist or a Christian, perhaps didn't intend their use. I've used low-dose psilocybin before to crush through a creative writing day. I think it's fantastic for something like that as is an ergo-like fungus such as LSD in very small doses for a workout or even something like hapeh or low, low-dose ayahuasca for hunting to increase sensory perception, which From my understanding, it was originally used or at least partially used as hunting medicine in many of those cultures. And so, I think there's a time and a place to use these. But even, I mean, I'm even to the point where with something like, say, a psilocybin dose, which I wouldn't consider trauma therapy or end-of-life therapy for something like cancer to be low dose, I think it's more like a heroic dose of psilocybin that's used in a lot of the research on that. And I know I'm biased. Coming from a Christian background. But, I think that even in those cases, there should be a better attempt to come before God to implement the spiritual disciplines in your own life and to engage in things like meditation and prayer and community and worship before you turn to psilocybin to release something like past trauma.

Yeah. You're talking about low dosing on psilocybin. You don't have the agency of a or to meet, let's call it the mediation of a medicine man or a witch doctor, which changes the game because I had some acquaintances of mine were curanderos, were Peruvian witch doctors, Andean witch doctors, let's say. And I asked them during the ayahuasca session, what is it that you're doing? —because I've witnessed ayahuasca sessions, I've never done it myself, but I've watched them— and obviously the medicine men are playing different, the curanderos are playing their different instruments and chanting and so forth. And their job, according to these guys who are curanderos, who do do ayahuasca sessions with people regularly, and in fact one of these guys was quite famous, he said that, 'Well, our Our job is kind of twofold. One, we lead people on this journey into this experience. We lead them through this journey. We make sure they're okay. But also, we are inviting the guides. We're inviting the spirit guides, the spirits of the jungle and of the ancient spirits to come and interact with these people. And then he proceeded to describe what this looks like. And so they would invoke these different entities during the ceremony. And he says that we actually witnessed the entities, and so do the people sometimes who are having the experience, the ayahuasca experience, who are under the influence of the brew. These entities actually, because they're usually sitting in a circle, the entities enter the circle and they go up to each person and they look at them in the face, each one, they examine them. And, when they find one that is suitable for whatever it is that they're looking for, they go into that person. And, this is what they described to me. This is what the curanderos described to me, the shamans. And so, there's this added component, which is the mediation of a shaman which changes the purpose, the direction, the intention of what you're doing. And, if you're taking a low-dose psilocybin to deal with depression or something, your intention isn't to make contact with entities and you're not doing it through the mediation of a shaman, which I think that totally changes the environment. Yeah, I agree.

I would say that the use of those substances is like a a nootropic or even for therapeutical purposes is, as you've just alluded to, far different than their use for something like divination or say possession. So, yeah, I think the use and the intention kind of lies behind the effects, good or bad. By the way, that field of consciousness, that universal field of consciousness that you referred to, obviously some people with some of these drugs we're talking about are able to tap into with a lot better efficiency. Is that related to the Akashic Record that I've heard some people talking about, this idea that the entire history of humankind is somehow stored in this other dimension and accessible and able to be tapped into by witches or sorcerers or shamans or folks of that nature?

It may be. I think there is something to be said for the collective memory and experience of mankind that even genetically, I think there's probably some genetic memories that we carry from our ancestors. We certainly carry genetic components of our ancestors. Biologically, we bear the same— some of the markers of our ancestors. And so, it wouldn't surprise me that our consciousness is somehow affected by that as well. And that there may be, you know, you may be able to access memories, you may be able to access information through this field of consciousness Um, but again, human beings are, are, in terms of our intelligence, in terms of our ability to navigate these waters, um, we're infants and we're always going to be at a disadvantage when encountering other entities who are much, who are much more, um, let's say efficient and practiced, experienced at dealing with us than we are at dealing with them. We're always going to be at a disadvantage.

Yeah, I think I have actually written something like that before in an article I wrote about plant medicine a couple of years ago. Who are you to think lying in your New York City loft with your shaman recently certified shaman friend that you're going to enter into some spiritual portal and be able to withstand effing around with entities who have been playing with human beings' brains and minds and bodies for about the past 10,000 years or whatever. That's an arrogant assumption, a dangerous one. In my opinion. Precisely right. You've obviously kind of alluded to the idea that you believe in entities or in this other spiritual world. I mean, correct me if I'm wrong. I get that impression from reading your book as well. But for illustrative purposes, that incident that both of us alluded to about the Peruvian miners, do you think that that's a situation where these are aliens or entities that these people were seeing?

Well, if we think about this field of consciousness as an internet of consciousness, you and I are accessing the internet right now, but we're not inside of the internet. We are physical beings simply using this technology to interface. So it could be that there are physical beings on the Earth and off the Earth who are accessing this field of information, this internet of consciousness, who are not physically inside of it. It's just like you and I are in different locations accessing this technology interfacing. They're interfacing with us, but that doesn't mean that they're there. That doesn't necessarily mean that they themselves are there. It could be biological beings simply interfacing with their minds. And, and not actually like some sort of a spiritual entity. So, but that doesn't discount, I don't discount the notion of a disembodied entity. Obviously, I believe in demon possession and that those are specifically disembodied beings. But those disembodied beings, the condition of their disembodiment is a curse. It's not natural. It's unnatural for them. And it's, it's a situation that they very much would like to resolve. It's a torturous state of affairs for them, a condition that is intolerable. And so, I would say we're probably dealing with entities that are actually physical biological beings interfacing with us, let's say telepathically through this internet of consciousness.

So, it sounds to me like what I'm hearing is that in the case, and I don't know a lot about what happened recently in Peru, you could probably explain it better than I could, but are you saying that there's the potential here that whatever these villagers were having to deal with were spiritual entities that had taken on the form of some known physical shell or physical body that they were able to access on Earth, like a human being or an animal or something like that?

No, I would say that if indeed these villagers were encountering extraterrestrials, in their words, then what we're dealing with are specifically material entities. Physical beings. I don't think that this is a, some sort of a supernatural experience. I think it was— it's very much a physical experience. I think what we're— what we would be looking at in this case is entities who are in possession of exceedingly advanced technology.

So what's the origin of these physical beings?

Like, where do they come from?

There's, there's no way to know for sure, but, um, I guess, like, where, where would you say? Because I think you, you talk about this a little bit in your book Birthright about the potential for these be like entities from a whole different, you know, like, like these lords of a different realm that are now present on, on Earth or something like that?

Yes, you could have entities that are— you can have entities that are indigenous to planet Earth, that are primordial indigenous creatures. That may be Bigfoot, by the way, a hominid, an ancient hominid that's, that's, that's been here forever, or at least as long as mankind, if not longer. You can have that. That's one One possibility. Then you can have entities that came here at some time from elsewhere. These would be extraterrestrial beings who arrived to Earth at some time in the past and who've taken up habitation here, who've inhabited the Earth, probably under the Earth, under the oceans, and who have been interacting with us ever since they've been here. That would certainly— you would, quote unquote, fallen angels would fall into that category for sure. But they might also be, they might also have been here before us. And then you have the possibility of entities that are actively visiting the Earth. So again, in an extraterrestrial capacity, they're coming here and doing whatever they're doing, but they're not from here and they don't live here. Although I would say that if there's an extraterrestrial faction visiting the Earth, they probably have bases here as well. So, just like we would do if we were visiting Mars, we would establish a base, an outpost. So, at the very least, these beings would have outposts here. But then you also have in the mix, you do have entities that are disembodied demons, specifically, that are in the equation, but not necessarily related to these extraterrestrial entities. And in my book, Birthright, one of the first things I do is establish the fact that the biblical narrative presumes the existence of extraterrestrials. Unequivocally, it absolutely presumes the existence of ETs because, because these beings that the Bible ambiguously designates as angels preexist mankind very clearly. So they preexist us. They shouted, the sons of God, the B'nai Elohim, shouted for joy when the foundations of the earth were laid. So, these beings, the sons of God, i.e., the angels, preexist mankind. That makes them extraterrestrial because they even preexist the foundation of the earth. So, an extraterrestrial simply means a being, if we're talking about a sentient creature, a being whose provenance is not planet Earth. So, if you were not created or born on Earth, you are by definition extraterrestrial. Period. And angels certainly fit that description, the good and bad. And so, this angelic race who I designate in my book as the elder race because, A, they're clearly older than us, and B, they certainly constitute a race from a civilization, by the way. They have all the earmarks, all the trademarks of civilization, of an advanced extraterrestrial civilization, in fact. And I'm just reading practically through the narrative, the biblical narrative. And if you read it practically and you don't try and, you know, you don't put on your supernatural spectacles or something like that, you just read it as if you would read anything else, then these are logical deductions. And so, you have in play this angelic race who I call the elder race. When you talk about extraterrestrials, who are certainly flying around in our airspace in advanced aerospace vehicles, they're navigating the skies over planet Earth in advanced technology, you would have, at least to some degree, the elder race would be involved in this activity, good and bad. I think the bad guys are confined to the earth to some extent. That doesn't mean that they have to stay on earth, but this is where they were and where they have been for a long time. And the good guys would be being dispatched from somewhere else and coming here for various reasons, the kind of reasons that we read about in the Old Testament, for example, and in the New Testament. So, it's difficult for Christians to make the transition from paranormal thought to practical thought when thinking about these things. But, when you do make that transition, your paradigm, you can comfortably accommodate extraterrestrials into your paradigm without losing your faith. And, that to me seems to be very important, especially in this day and age.

Yeah. And, beyond Christian historical writings or the Bible, isn't there a lot of other literature including ancient Indian texts that have reports of some kind of advanced technology, particularly advanced flying technology, that humankind has, has kind of experienced a lot in the past beyond just like the recent surge of what appears to be increased activity reported by the Air Force or some of these sightings in Peru.

Yeah, the Indian epics talk about vimanas, which are flying machines, and, and they describe them in great detail, and they even describe the engine. It's a mercury engine. That operates by rotating mercury. And this, again, it's described in great detail. These vehicles apparently can hover in place, they can fly at great speeds, they can— they discharge what appears to be missiles or lasers. And again, it's these vehicles are written about in the Indian epics in the context of historical fact. These are not necessarily taken as myths by the Indians. Rather, this is history to them. So, there is indication, there are some indication that there might have been some kind of advanced aerospace vehicles on Earth in the distant past that were, that were, um, that let's say human beings were encountering or perhaps even manufacturing.

Yeah, those Indian writings, those are like thousands of years old. And so if this technology has been around for that long, do you think that we've actually inherited some of this technological know-how that we now have, or at some point even you know, for example, pre-flood, or, you know, back to the ancient megaliths or something like that, had inherited such technology?

Yeah, the Ramayana and the Mahabharata, these are the two main documents that we read about these advanced flying machines called vimana. But also within this epic, and this is an antediluvian epic, Um, what's that mean, antediluvian? Antediluvian simply means before the flood. So pre-flood, before the great cataclysm, um, and of which all major cultures talk about. They all discuss this great cataclysm.

That's not just like Sunday school, that's like all over the world.

Oh no, no, no, this is ubiquitous around the world. Yeah. And most of these cultures specifically talk about a flood, but it's described variously all over the earth with these primary— every primary culture on the planet. Has a cataclysm myth. And so, not only were these— not only do these Vimana, rather these Indian epics talk about Vimana flying craft, they also discuss in great detail this conflict, this massive war that occurred. And the war involved not just human beings, but it was also the gods. So, you had the gods with their various armies, human armies and other creatures involved, and they were, they were involved, they were engaged in this, this epic conflict, this war. And that notion that there was a great war, this incredible war in which advanced technology was deployed followed by a cataclysm that destroyed the Earth and annihilated every faction involved in this war. That story is also duplicated all over the Earth. We're all familiar with the story of Atlantis, for example, and everyone knows that Atlantis was destroyed in a cataclysm. Okay, but a lot of people don't realize that before Atlantis was destroyed in a cataclysm, it was engaged in war. There was a— it was expanding its empire. And Atlantis was, you know, according to the myth and according to Plato, Atlantis was founded by Poseidon, by the god Poseidon, who copulated with a human woman named Cleito. She conceived and gave birth to 5 sets of twins. And they were, according to some other sources, these were giants. The kings of Atlantis were giants. So there are 10 kings of Atlantis, and they ruled over 7 islands and 3 continents. And these kings of Atlantis, these demigods, ended up going to war with the other nations. And Plato says specifically with Athens, and Athens, which was founded by the goddess Athena, and the Athenians were the only military force able to withstand Atlantis. And so there was this epic conflict that was underway, but it was interrupted by a global cataclysm, which not only destroyed Atlantis, but also Athens. It destroyed the whole world. And obviously, this syncs with the biblical account. So, you find this, the myth, this cataclysm mythos all over the earth, and it usually involves floods, earthquakes. It discusses some sort of a global conflict, or at least a conflict in which the gods or the offspring of the gods are involved, and the annihilation of almost all life on Earth as a consequence of both the conflict and then the cataclysm.

Hmm. Well, I mean, like, if you had a dad who was a pastor, and I grew up, you know, going to the average evangelical, you know, Sunday school, You hear about this antediluvian period, this pre-flood period, and you basically hear this story that people were really bad and then God flooded the Earth because people were really bad and he had to kind of cleanse the Earth. And, it brings to mind maybe people stealing with each other and maybe some big orgies and some murder and anarchy or whatever, but it sounds to me like you're suggesting that it goes a little bit deeper than just people walking around doing bad things to each other.

Yes, and this, by the way, was the Hebrew perspective. Ancient Hebrew cosmology very much included the narrative that I just unfolded, and it's found in the Book of Enoch primarily. And this is what, by the way, not only did the ancient Hebrews, but also during the time of Christ, they were all very much aware of what I call the Enochian tale. In fact, Christ alludes to it, and he uses a title, 'Son of Man,' that's not found as a proper title in the Old Testament. But it is featured extensively in the Book of Enoch, in these particular messianic prophecies pertaining to him. And so, the ancient Hebrew perspective, which is where we should be deriving our perspective as Christians, if we're going to talk about the pre-flood world, but most churches don't because they're simply not well-versed in Hebrew cosmology. And, and from the ancient Hebrew cosmological perspective, they believe that there is this particular incident that occurred in which the sons of God, they specifically, this hierarchy called the Watchers, this, this group of entities called the Watchers, descended to the earth in the days of Jared. So, this is in a pre-flood context. And they, they saw that the daughters of men were beautiful, were comely. This is, of course, recorded in Genesis 6. But Genesis 6 is merely alluding to a story that everyone already was familiar with, and that probably came specifically from the Book of Enoch. And so, these watchers, having seen the daughters of men, observed them that they were comely. They lusted after them. They desired to copulate with them and to produce offspring with them. So, they descended to the earth on the summit of Mount Hermon, They bound themselves by an oath of mutual imprecations, because they knew what they were about to do was a grave transgression. And then they descended into the plains around Hermon, and they chose wives from the daughters of men. I think it was a transaction with the fathers of these women, that they would give, they would teach mankind they would give mankind knowledge and help them in creating technologies from this knowledge. And in exchange, men would give their daughters' hands in marriage. They would authorize their daughters to marry them. So, there was this Faustian bargain that was struck. And then these Watchers, they copulated with their wives, the wives conceived and gave birth to giants. And then the giants began to devour mankind and the technology, the knowledge of the Watchers was causing all manner of havoc to be unleashed on Earth. And also their offspring were exceedingly evil, the giants. And the empire fractionated, what I call the Empire of the Gods, and there was this this great conflict, and this was part of their judgment. And I'm really just encapsulating the story here. So, there's this great conflict between the offspring of the Watchers, these giants who were likely the kings of these disparate nations that they created. And they went to battle, and they almost annihilated each other in this great war. And then came the ultimate judgment, the flood of Noah. So, obviously, we're tracking almost, we're paralleling the Indian epics, and also so many other stories, even Atlantis here. And this, by the way, this is how the ancient Hebrews viewed the pre-flood world. This is not some invention. This is exactly how they viewed the ancient, the antediluvian world. And so, the fact that evangelical Christians and pastors don't discuss it isn't because it's extra biblical. It's because they're simply not informed of Hebrew cosmology.

Yeah, and it is a little bit overwhelming when you start to think about it. It's interesting, these technologies that you refer to, and I think you have a film. And even though I read most of the book Birthright, where you get into the deep literary and historical context of what you're just talking about regarding the Hebrew historical understanding of these events on the Plains of Lebanon and these fallen angels, but many other historical texts as well. But, you also have this film, I think it's called "The Technology of the Fallen." So, I know you've looked into this. What kind of technologies are we talking about that you think traded hands here?

Yeah, I did a film series with a guy named Steve Quayle. We made 3 films called "True Legends," And in regard to the technology, the way that I view the Antediluvian Age is, generally speaking, the level of technological development of mankind was probably something like the Bronze Age or the Iron Age. But in the midst of this Iron Age, let's say, civilization, you had these extraterrestrial entities who were on the Earth and their hybrid offspring. And these guys were in possession of advanced technology and superior knowledge. And so, the general masses of humanity were not, you know, building flying machines. Rather, the gods and their offspring were building these things and using them to control mankind and to build their various factions, their various kingdoms. That's why I call it the empire of the gods. And the Book of Enoch, by the way, describes 200 watchers. And there were 200 watchers who descended in the days of Jared. So, it wasn't just a few, it was 200. And these 200 watchers created their own kingdoms on Earth. And this is exactly what Plato says, by the way, that the gods— the story of Atlantis begins with the gods apportioning the Earth. Among themselves. In other words, all the gods, all these Greek gods, are dividing the earth among themselves, and their intention is to create their own kingdoms. And so, when you think about all of the kingdoms of these gods collectively, you're looking at an empire of the gods. And they were, you know, friendly in the beginning, but they ended up having conflict and going to war, ultimately. And so, I think that there was superior knowledge on earth to some extent in the antediluvian world, knowledge that the human race probably wasn't supposed to have yet and caused all kinds of calamity for mankind. And also technology. So if you're going to have these extraterrestrial advanced, extraterrestrial entities called the Watchers who are coming from somewhere else, coming to the Earth, they're coming with their technology and with their knowledge. So they're introducing into this Iron Age civilization, they're introducing technology that far surpasses anything we have today, let's say. Certainly in regard to their advanced aerospace vehicles and their weaponry and so forth. So you would have a Bronze or Iron Age civilization influenced by extraterrestrial knowledge and technology. And what I like to liken it to is the movie Stargate. I don't know if you remember the movie Stargate with Kurt Russell back in the '90s.

I never saw it, no. No, I never saw it.

Yeah, so in the movie Stargate, they they go through this Stargate and then they find themselves on another planet. And this planet is populated by like a Bronze Age Egyptian civilization. And you have all the Egyptian motifs. And these people are worshiping this god, Ra. And Ra happens to be an extraterrestrial. And the pyramid is actually— this pyramid that he lives in is actually a— you find out it's a spaceship. And the Bronze Age civilization is just living like a Bronze Age civilization. They're not themselves in possession of advanced technology, but Ra and his minions do have advanced technology. So, they're governing, they're ruling over this civilization, this Bronze Age civilization with technology, and the people, of course, think that these are the powers of the gods and so forth. So, we might have had something like that happening. In the antediluvian world. And in fact, I would wager to guess that that's exactly what was happening in the antediluvian world. We had entities in possession of advanced technology. And indeed, you know, when you talk about from a biblical context, when you talk about quote-unquote fallen angels, and I say quote-unquote because fallen angel is a contrivance. It's not— that term doesn't appear anywhere in biblical or extra-biblical text. Just— it's a contrivance. Really, the way to describe these entities, these fallen angels, is insurgent sons of God, or rebellious, disobedient sons of God who have committed an act of insurrection and turned against the kingdom of heaven. So, they're the enemies of God. But they look just like the good guys. The bad guys and the good guys, there's no reason to think that they look any different. So, quote-unquote, fallen angels aren't these hideous, grotesque beings with horns and, you know, pitchforks and wings. No, rather they look just like their— just like the other members of their race, i.e., this angelic race, the elder race. They would look very much like us. In fact, we look like them. So, they would look, you know, very human-like and be quite beautiful. More so than mankind, although they are exceedingly insidious and wicked.

And you don't think they're like lizard people or dragons or serpents or stuff like that, like some people say?

No, although I don't discount the notion that lizard people do exist. And maybe these are also like the Bigfoot creature, primordial sentient creatures that have existed on Earth since time immemorial. So, that's a possibility. I don't necessarily subscribe to that, but it's certainly within the realm of possibility, because going back to the ancient Indians, they also reference these beings called the Nagas. And you find this reference all over the Earth, as well. The Nagas are like a serpentine race of humanoids that are very ancient and have been interacting with mankind for a long time. So, you have this sort of panoply of characters that show up in the mythos of many different cultures. Like, for example, giants. Giants are ubiquitous. The serpent people are almost ubiquitous. The sons of God, these angelic race that looks like us, but more beautiful than us, they're also nearly ubiquitous in the legends of these— Yeah. Primary cultures all around the world.

And maybe similar to what you were alluding to before, I mean, maybe their original physical form, you know, a different realm or whatever, was lizard-like or serpent-like or reptile-like, but they were able to take on the physical form of a more recognizable earthly entity or something like that, you know, like a weird lizard creature inhabiting a human body.

Well, I was going to say, you know, you have to keep in mind that there's advanced technology also in play. So, we'll be able to probably— Maybe in 100 years we'll be able to create holographic projections, even change our own appearance holographically. You're not necessarily changing your biology, you're just projecting an appearance that is a projection. So, that's also in play. You could have holographic technology all over the place. And, that could be in play also in that incident in Peru. You could have holographic projections that appear to be physical things when in fact they're not. We'll be there, as I said, probably in about 100 years.

Well, that actually makes me think because obviously, you see like, I don't know, Graham Hancock, or even think you traveled to, if I'm not mistaken, the high Andean plain in Peru and Bolivia, to look at the archaeological evidence of some of these technologies, but do you think they could potentially, I don't know if this is a conspiracy theory or what, but they could potentially exist in their more complete or less ruined form in places like, I don't know, the Vatican or something like that?

Possibly. Yeah, possibly. I think the Vatican knows. I have a saying in tagline in one of those films that I did with, uh, Steve Quayle, the Vatican knows all the secrets. And that, and that appears to be true. The Vatican, the, the Vatican intelligence agency, which our intelligence agencies refer to as the Entity— the reason why they call it the Entity is because it is so vast, it is almost all-knowing. It is, it is much— it is, it permeates much deeper than any of our intelligence agencies, and all over the world, because it's— the Vatican is one of the oldest institutions on Earth. So their intelligence agency is the best on the planet. Obviously, the Church of Rome has been operating for a very long time, for centuries, and has been intricately involved in almost every single Western nation, if not all, every Western nation, and even some other nations around the world in the East, for example, that the Vatican has had counselors. And in fact, the Jesuits, that's one of the reasons why the Jesuit order was formulated. The primary reason why the Jesuit order was formulated was to combat Protestantism, but also to infiltrate nations The Jesuits were the most highly educated agents of Rome. And so they served in the councils of kings all over the world, even in the East, because they were so highly educated. And so imagine that going on for hundreds of years. That's why the Vatican's intelligence agency is so well equipped and, and so well-versed in the affairs of, of so many nations around the world, and especially as it pertains to, let's say, ancient secrets. The Vatican archive is immense. Uh, off the top of my head, I cannot remember how large it is. I think it's like, uh, it's over a mile long or something. It's absolutely immense. And I'm talking about the one, the secret one under the ground. It's not secret in the sense that nobody knows about it. It's secret in the sense that It's almost impossible to get access to it. And it's full of manuscripts, very ancient manuscripts and artifacts. And so, I think that were the archives of the Vatican to be opened, it would demand a rewriting of history to some extent.

Man, I think that's bigger than the Smithsonian. Kind of explains why the best gelato in the world you can find outside the walls of the Vatican. I've been to. They've got all the ancient technology secrets to the best gelato.

That's right, they've got secrets to the best gelato.

Yeah, man, have you ever been there to the Vatican or tried to get access to some of these hidden chambers?

Multiple times.

Yeah, that'd be interesting. Yeah, I was asking if you've ever like tried to get access to any hidden chambers or if that's even a reality.

It's very difficult to get clearance to go into the archives. Some people have, but you— but only, only in certain areas. They they don't let you just peruse the archives. They give you access to particular segments of the archives at a time. But my God, that would be— I mean, really, it wouldn't do me or you much good, because most of what they have in there is written in Latin and Greek and Hebrew and Aramaic and who knows what else. So, we would be mostly interested in looking at the artifacts. Does the Vatican, for example, have the bones of giants? I would say unequivocally, they have the bones of giants. And I don't mean some random femur or something. I think they have full skeletons of giants, you know, 15-foot giants.

Meaning you could theoretically do like a genomic reconstruction with that type of data of like a fallen angel or a Nephilim. Oh, yes. Or at least be a Nephilim-human being combination.

That's a very good point. And I'll bet that's been done. Well, that's interesting because the Vatican—

because I'm to a certain extent involved in the anti-aging longevity and age hacking industry, and obviously, there tends to be some overlap between that and transhumanism. And the Vatican actually hosted the last huge anti-aging transhumanism longevity-enhancing event. And it kind of makes me wonder if there's actually some research or some great interest there going on based on this technology in terms of potential for, you know, decreased human mortality or even immortality or something like that?

Oh, I wouldn't doubt it. I wouldn't doubt it. I think that transhumanism is a fundamental part of the new religion which is coming, which I write about in my book. And I think that that new religion is going to be— it's going to be— what's the word I'm looking for here? It's going to be ushered in and guided by the Church of Rome. Or at least the Church of Rome is going to have a significant role in crafting the doctrine of this new religion. And this new religion is— I coined a phrase in my book called apotheotheism, and I believe that describes the new religion. Apotheo comes from the word— it derives from the word apotheosis, and apotheosis means the glorification or deification of man. So, man becoming a god. And theism, obviously, is the belief in the gods. And so, when you combine apotheosis with theism, and you get apotheotheism, what you're describing is a scenario in which a religion in which the existence of the gods is embraced, and man himself is attempting to become like the gods. That is apotheotheism. It's an It is the belief that the gods exist and we shall become like them. Hmm.

Yeah. I mean, I'm no conspiracy theorist and I embrace science and technology, but when I look at the surge in divination and possession involved with the increasing kind of necromancy that previously would've been the realm of priests and is now available to the common people with artificial intelligence, genetic engineering, transhumanism, and, you know, a lot of these technologies seeming to arise at the same time, this idea of humans being at the verge, perhaps to a greater extent than we have in history, of achieving some kind of superhuman-like state seems like it could be a reality.

Oh yes, there's no question about it. And, um, we're going to advance quite a bit in the next decade, next decades, in regard to in regard to genetics, robotics, artificial intelligence, and nanotechnology specifically, but also a host of other technologies that are associated with those. But we are— we— the, the technology is being developed exponentially. We hear a lot about artificial intelligence because it's sort of the, the— it's the sexiest, uh, technology being developed right now. And it's very practical. It's the most practical right now because we don't all have access to genetic modification, but we can all play with artificial intelligence. We can all go on ChatGPT and use it to write a report or something like that, or go on to Midjourney and create amazing images through using artificial intelligence in a matter of 30 seconds. So, but that's, but so that's sort of, like I said, that's sort of like the sexy technology that's apparent to everyone out in the open. But what's happening under the under the radar is you have nanotechnology being developed under the radar and you have genetic technologies being developed under the radar, which are going to come together. So, technologists call this age that we're currently living in, they call it the hybrid age. And the reason why they call it the hybrid age is because all of these various technological streams have been developing independently: genetics, robotics, artificial intelligence, nanotechnology, domain to name a few. But, right now, something very interesting is happening. These technologies are converging. So, you can imagine these streams converging into a river, and this convergence, they're coming together. So, you're going to be able to combine artificial intelligence with nanotechnology, with genetic modification, with robotics, right? Which includes cybernetics. When you combine these technologies together, What you have effectively is the power to literally remake our biology in whatever image we see fit. So, we will literally be able to redesign human biology and indeed, not only redesign human biology, but supersede to evolve ourselves into something other than human beings is what I'm trying to say. To to become post-human. We will have the power to manipulate the next step in our directed evolution and create something other than a human being, a post-human that is no longer, can no longer really be described as human.

Yeah. And, if you believe that human beings are inherently good, I don't think that's that scary of a notion. It's kind of cool, actually. But, if you look at what was likely going on back when the Nephilim or these fallen angels who bred with humankind were ruling the world in terms of the sectoring of the Earth and human beings serving as servants and slaves to them all the way down to the German attempts in the '40s to develop a superhuman race, you don't see things working out very well when one certain sector of humanity gets extreme power in terms of the amount of love and empathy extended towards the fellow human beings who might be under their influence, under their power.

No, and the problem here is we're also setting the stage for complete technocratic control over society. We're giving technocrats the tools with which to absolutely control every facet of human existence, and that, that's really, uh, there's no way to avoid that. That's going to happen at some point. But I think in this day and age, we need to ask two fundamental questions before we launch ourselves into this post-human, what I view as a post-human apocalypse. Okay. And that is, number one, what does it mean to be human? What does it mean to be a human being? Is there something intrinsically important about being human? And number two, Should we preserve our humanity? Is there something intrinsically important about preserving our humanity? So what does it mean to be human? And based on the conclusion we draw, should we be concerned about preserving our humanity? Are there reasons to be concerned about losing the genetic trademarks that make us human? And I make the case in my book, that's why it's called Birthright, By the way, because there's a birthright associated with us being human and it's dominion of the earth. So, so there are consequences to abandoning the trademarks, the genetic trademarks of Adam and transitioning into something that is post-Adam, post-human. There are very, um, there are very consequential theological principles at work here. As it pertains to those two questions: what does it mean to be human, and is our humanity worth preserving? And so, this is something, by the way, that these two questions have— these questions have not had to have been— had to be contemplated by previous generations. We're the first generation that has to actually ask these questions: what does it mean to be human, and is our humanity worth preserving? No one else has had to contemplate this because they didn't have the technological tools to remake human biology. But we do, or at least we will in the coming decades.

Yeah, it's a little bit murky. It's like, you know, where do you cross the line from ceramic hip implants that allow somebody to go out and, you know, play baseball with their grandkids to, you know, how do you kind of decide if Neuralink is appropriate, if that's appropriate, or Back to the ayahuasca thing, yeah, you're tweaking some dials in your brain, but what about when you have a cup of coffee or chew a piece of nicotine gum? I mean, there's a lot of murkiness when it comes down to the definition of what is human or what puts humans in a state in which their faculties or their spirit is compromised. Honestly, that's just why I pray for wisdom every day because I know we're entering into a kind of crazy next few decades. And, there are some unanswered questions that I just— I just go to God every day and ask for wisdom and protection, you know?

Right. And our kids are really going to be dealing with this more than us. And more than that, our grandkids. And so, yeah, it is a good question. And it's a question that I can't answer. Where's the line between human and non-human? I think right now the kind of technologies we're playing with, you know, we're not— we're only seeing the very beginning of where this is going. Neuralink, you know, in, in— I would say in about 10 years from now, Many human beings will be perusing the internet with their brains. They will not be using their fingers. They will be using their brains. They will literally be thinking the internet. In the same way that we go on to Midjourney, for those who've played with Midjourney, the AI that, the Discord version of AI that you can produce whatever images that you can come up with in terms of the prompts. So on Midjourney and on all of these artificial intelligence platforms that produce images, you have to go in and you have to prompt the artificial intelligence. You have to prompt the AI. So you have to tell it, for example, I did the other day just to show my kids Ninja Turtle playing a guitar, and it just created these amazing images in 30 seconds, which just absolutely amazing. It would have taken an artist a week to make one of these. Yeah. And, and so we're going in with our fingers and we're prompting it. We're typing out, you know, Ninja Turtle playing guitar. Well, in 10 years you won't type anything, you'll just think it, and it'll be instantaneous. And the artificial intelligence will be so fast that you will think Ninja Turtle playing guitar, and as soon as you formulate the thought, the image will appear. That's where we're headed.

Yeah, it's pretty crazy. There's no question. Weird eyes and weird eyes and 6 fingers because the computer still kind of eff things up. But it's— yeah, it's kind of eerie. Very good. Kind of cool but kind of eerie, you know. It's my— yeah, my sons and I, we have a new game design company, or maybe making card games and board games, we've actually found for some of the illustrations a little bit of AI here and there to add something or visualize something before we draw it ourselves on the draw pad has come in handy. But yeah, I think some of this stuff is stuff that people need to know about and be aware of. And dude, we're running short of time, but I mean, you have this book Birthright and then you have these 3 films, The Technology of the Fallen, The Unholy Sea, The Holocaust of the Giants. You have this vast repository of videos on YouTube and elsewhere. I'm actually pretty happy and grateful I'm able to introduce some of your stuff to my audience and the people listening in because it's pretty cool stuff. I really like that book Birthright. So, if people are listening in, I'm going to link to all this stuff at BenGreenfieldLife.com/Birthright, which is again the name of Tim's book. And Tim, you got any other crazy adventures planned just before I let you go?

Yeah, I'm going to Guatemala, I'm going to Costa Rica, I'm doing an event in Costa Rica. I'm always going places, investigating things. Um, I've got literary— other literary projects in the works, film projects. I'm leaving tomorrow actually to go on a film— to film for a week in Missouri, um, content related to giants, by the way. Wow. Uh, and so I'm always running all over the place. People can track with me on YouTube. I've got my Birthright lecture series on YouTube. That's sort of a primer to the book. That's where I'm on Twitter. I'm on, I'm on, um, I'm on Twitter. I'm on, um, what's it called, Instagram. And I've got a website, timothyalbino.com. And I'm always doing something. And I do have, like, for example, we— I'm doing an event in Costa Rica in February. And, and, um, so I'm always doing stuff like that if, if people are ever interested in anything like that. I just got done doing a public expedition to Peru. Um, we had a fantastic time. We visited the megaliths. And so, um, you can track with me on social media on— or sign up for my mailing list on my website if you're ever interested in joining one of those expeditions. Cool.

I'll talk to you offline. I'll be in Costa Rica in February, actually, so I'll get more information on that. And in the meantime, Giants in Missouri, you heard it here first. So check it out at bengreenfieldlife.com/birthright. Look up Tim. You can even go on one of his ventures with him as you just heard.

So, Tim, thanks so much, man. Hey, thank you, Ben. Anytime. It was fun.

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