Staying Fit With Sunshine & Blood Flow Restriction, The Superiority Of Goose Eggs, The Latest On EMF Protection, Is Vegetable Oil The Root Cause Of Most Modern Diseases?

My name is Ben Greenfield and on this episode of the Ben Greenfield Life.

Podcast we believe the mechanism for damage from emfs is because it catalyzes the release of calcium inside the cell. Because the levels of calcium outside the cell are 50,000 times higher. 50,000 times higher. So when it goes into the cell, it's a powerful signaling molecule. What does a signal cell do? It tells cells what some of the things are. It increases the release of superoxide and also nitric oxide. And those are two molecules that they get even close to each other, they instantaneous, I mean instantaneously form some this reactive nitrogen species called para oxynitrite. And that is really, really damaging, probably collectively more, far more damaging than hydroxyl free radical because hydroxyl radical only lasts about a billionth of a second. This peroxy nitrite lasts a thousand times longer, so long that it can actually migrate outside of the mitochondria, outside of that cell and go into another cell in the mitochondria and hang around that long.

Faith, family, fitness, health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking and a whole lot more. Welcome to the show.

All right folks, in today's episode, which I recorded for you on site with the great Dr. Joe Mercola down in Florida, we had a wide ranging discussion on everything from the dangers of vegetable oil to intermittent hypoxic training to how this dude's beating young bucks in arm wrestling and a whole lot more. Dr. Joe first joined me on two episodes that I'll link to in the shownotes if you go to BenGreenfieldLife.com Mercola3 that's BenGreenfieldLife.com MercOLA the number three. We had one episode on killing fat cells and fixing mitochondria and growing superfoods. We had another one on EMFs and cell phone radiation and protecting yourselves from EMF exposure. Even though we give you an updated how to on that in today's show, Dr. Mercola, he goes way back. He's a doctor of osteopathic medicine with a real holistic approach. He's a some controversial as you'll learn about in the first 10 to 15 minutes or so of today's episode. But for the longest time as a board certified family physician he practiced medicine and he's written contributions and extensive experience in patient care. He was granted fellowship status by the American College of Nutrition. He's a best selling author. He has everything from books about COVID 19 to the no grain diet to the bird flu hoax to effortless healing, a whole Bunch of different titles. He has a huge background in health, wellness, and technology. He runs the very popular website you may have come across before called Mercola.com. has multiple awards. I mean, I'm at his house and he just has plaques and awards all.

Over the wall for all of the.

Work that he's done in medicine and health and beyond. And he just tirelessly works to disseminate important health information around the world, which sometimes turns him into a lightning rod and also earns him a lot of numerous awards and honors. And he's a very interesting guy, as you're about to learn, if you've never heard him chatting before. So anyways, sit back or walk or lift or whatever it is you're doing right now and get ready for a great episode with Dr. Joseph Mercola.

All right, we did it. That was a fun little setup. Open the Komodo for folks. Joe and I decided to try and do an entire podcast with no tech crew, no videography, scheduling, just lounging on the couch with our shirts peeled off.

That's right.

This might be the first shirtless episode. Duel. Shirtless episode that I've done in quite some time.

Yeah. It reminds me, the last time I was with you personally was when we were mind share. Yeah, Arizona. Phoenix.

Yeah, somewhere.

And we went to a lunch and we just decided, okay, this is going to be a shirtless table. We started a trend.

I remember that for the vitamin D table. You've always been big on vitamin D. And by the way, I should get this out of the way before we even start. If you guys want the show notes, I'll put them@BenGreenfieldLife.com Mercola 3. That's Mercola, the number three. Because, Joe, this is the third time that I've interviewed you. We did an interview on all sorts of things. I remember we talked a little bit about vitamin D and then we had a whole interview about emf. I would love to revisit that a little bit today as it pertains to linoleic acid, particularly not to scare people away with big words too early in the show. And then today I've returned to your compound in Florida, and yes, you have quite the lifestyle down here that includes plenty of shirtlessness. And you've always been pretty big on vitamin D. I mean, you got a plaque on your wall over there by you being sunshine doctors.

Well, for this entire century. Right. So it's long before COVID 19. Actually, my. My passion about vitamin D is somewhat what precipitated some of the challenges that I have by mainstream media because since we last connected, I had the honor of being named the number one spreader of COVID misinformation 2021.

That's better than being named the number.

One spreader of COVID That's right, yeah. By. And you know, Biden and the head of the National Institutes of Health. So it was the best honor I've ever gotten.

Did you get a plaque or a trophy or.

No, I'm Wait, a master's in like a gold plated mask? Did not get that. But yeah, so partially that was precipitated by the influence I built up over a quarter century of having a website, but also my passion about vitamin D. And I actually have written my first peer reviewed article this century. Really published in Nutrients, which is a pretty high impact nutrition journal.

And this might happen to people who are watching listening to this podcast. Like if you click through to your website from say like Twitter or some other sites, it will say you're about to enter an unsafe website.

Yeah.

Disinformation or phishing, Is that.

Is that why.

Yeah, that's another mechanism.

No, that's. No, that they're doing that. They're putting these warnings up there to make the public believe that I'm an incredible, discreditable, uncredible source.

Incredible.

Incredible.

I like incredible.

That's the best way to think about it.

So when something like that happens, I'm just curious, you know, you don't have to spill all the business secrets on the podcast, but does that have a pretty big impact on site visitors, on business?

Yeah, it did. It's actually that exposure. Yeah. Yeah, it definitely helped us in many ways because we had been essentially buried for the most part in this Google algorithms and all the exposure brought my book, the truth about COVID 19 to number one. And it was my best selling book ever.

Could you actually buy that book on Amazon?

Oh, yeah, yeah, you could. They never took it off. So it was number one on USA Today, Wall Street Journal, Publishers Weekly.

I read that book when it first came out. It's fantastic. Yeah, but obviously pretty controversial.

Well, and that was two years, well over two years from now. And you know, it was highly controversial and people claim me of lying through the book, but you know, two years later, nothing's been disproven.

Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, we could obviously go down the COVID rabbit hole.

Yeah, we know we need to blue.

In the face, but go back to the vitamin D piece which got us on this thread. So was your argument that there's A specific impact of vitamin D on the immune system.

Yeah, that's my review paper. There's probably some nutrients suggested that.

By the way, the reason I asked this question is just a few days ago one of our mutual friends, Georgia Dinkoffer, he's more of a friend of yours. I probably would stop at him on a podcast yet, but he published an article showing that about 4,000, 10,000 international units a day of vitamin D was one of the best things you could do to prevent and survive GI cancer. Yes, I'm dealing with the cancer in the family right now and I immediately sent that off to my family member because that's a, it's a very cheap and readily available supplement. It's also available via the sunshine. But you, you're originally doing your research on it related to the immune system.

Well, you know, I don't do lab research but you know, basically like you investigate a. That goes and compiles information and interviews the world class experts. I've interviewed almost every world class researcher on vitamin D over the years and one of the fundamental benefits that it has is it radically reduces not just colon cancer, which is well documented for, but pretty much all types of cancers. It's very positive at preventing and treating cancers. Very similar to linoleic acid is being the exact converse in increasing the risk of every cancer. Yeah.

You walk around with your shirt off a lot. Women alone, your shirtless walk on the beach yesterday. I know you're, you're a big sunshine hunter. Would you say that's the best way to get vitamin D or do you supplement with it also?

I haven't taken a swallowed vitamin d supplement over 15 years.

Really?

Yeah. And yet my vitamin D levels are consistently over 100 nanograms per milliliter.

100.

100 without swallowing.

What's your response to the people who are like, oh, it's going to cause calcification if you have too much vitamin D? Is that, is that true myth or is there any truth behind that or why do people say that?

Well.

You have to be very, very careful when you swallow vitamin D orally, oral supplementation, because there's no feedback loop going on. So. And there's a lot of the research that was published initially suggested that there was all these different, they correlated all these benefits to vitamin D. But most of your research there wasn't, it wasn't being that vitamin D level. People were taking vitamin D supplements. So almost all the elevated or vitamin D levels related to sun exposure merely. So it's, it's really served as A biomarker for sun exposure. Because there's other benefits other than ultraviolet B radiation, which only comprises about 4% of the spectrum of sunlight. And that's the specific wavelength and frequency that causes your body to convert 7 deoxycholesterol to. To vitamin D. Now, is it true.

That there are certain genetic factors that might limit that conversion from occurring? Because I've seen people like.

Sure there are.

Kashi Khan from the DNA company, he's talking about that before on my podcast about how some people might have higher need for oral supplementation.

Yeah. And if there could be more, typically with the SNPs, there's the vitamin D receptors. But there are other variables that you can do that make a big difference. One of them is vitamin K2.

Okay.

And then the other would be magnesium.

Yeah.

So a lot of people who aren't taking enough magnesium, once they add it, then their vitamin D tend to normalize.

Now, the form of vitamin D. As a matter of fact, I was just texting last time with another guy. I'm interested in having him on the show. I haven't yet. Dr. Tyler Panzner, who does a lot related to genetic snips. I think he might do a little bit of work with Joe Cohen for self decode. If I'm not mistaken, he says that there's a form of oral vitamin D.

Joe Cohen was at our table in Estermind.

That's right.

That's right.

He was also there. A cholecalciferol as an oral form that's more expensive but much more bioavailable and increases vitamin D levels within just a couple of weeks.

I think that's the other term for vitamin D. It's cholecyff.

When you supplement with it, I believe a lot of times it's a hydroxy vitamin D form. It's less bioavailable than this cholecalciferol. I could only find one company. I forget the name of it. If I could find hunt it down and put it in the show notes, I will. That actually used this whole calciferol form. The reason this is interesting for me is because according to Dr. Khan, I had my SNP that would limit vitamin D conversion from sunlight. Which makes sense because when I used to race iron, I was out in the sun sometimes eight to 10 hours a day, and I tested levels were 30 or 40. And so now I do something, you know, I think around 2000 units a day or so. And my levels are typically of the 70s to 90s.

Yeah, yeah.

The hundreds.

Yeah. I would, I would suggest a slight modification of that. In fact I was just updating in my script for me doing for my new master class in composing this which is a designed to empower people with the resources needed to survive the next coming crisis I believe which will be here at some point, not too distant future. But if.

The module was in sun exposure and then when you're seeking to optimize your vitamin D levels, if you don't have access all the time, of course you're going to need a normal supplement. But on the days that you do get out there, don't take your vitamin D supplement you're already getting from the sun. That's that you're going to overdo.

Even if you have that genetics issue.

With your version.

I'm not convinced of that because you're getting pretty high level. The 2000 is not the normal dose for oral. For oral desusation for most people it's usually closer to 8,000 adult requires or.

For some people, I know some functional medicine docs who will prescribe like a vitamin D bomb, like 50,000 units of intramost.

Not recommended at all. Not recommended, yeah.

Why don't you recommend an approach like that?

Well, because that you're inferring or implied it's a parental intramuscular injection and the only way that's done is typically through vitamin T2 which is, you know, a plant based version, not as healthy. Michael Hollock, who is probably the premier vitamin researcher, is fond of it. Most of the others are not.

Is there anything to be said for that strategy? Some people use, especially plant based diet enthusiasts to put mushrooms out in the sunlight to harvest. Yeah, concentrate vitamin D and mushrooms.

It doesn't. Concentrate actually converts it. It converts.

Yes, but it doesn't make vitamin D3. Humans make vitamin D3, animals make vitamin D3. When you irradiate lanolin, which is the primary, almost exclusive.

Raw material used to create vitamin D supplements.

You mean lanolin from sheeps?

Yes. Okay. That's how they create vitamin D. They irradiate lanolin with UVB. So it can be that creates vitamin D3. When you make it from.

Mushrooms, you create vitamin D2 which is I think called ergocociferol.

But yeah, if you take ergocociferol or D2 you can still elevate your D level somewhat though. Right.

There is some benefit to it because there's a cross reactivity in the receptors for sure. But it's not as good as D3. It really isn't. It's fast and inferior.

I grew pink oyster mushrooms all last year. I had little rye blocks out in the forest and I grow them and I take them to put them out in the picnic table off the patio, leave them out in the sun all day. They're like vegan bacon, basically. Yeah.

Yeah.

So. So the, The. The crisis that you just referred to, I don't want to necessarily allow you to drop that and leave it behind. Are you talking about an economic crisis or something else?

Well, very similar to what we have with COVID It's so much worse. Lockdown suppression, personal freedoms loss, you know, just tyrannical oppression by the government authority, authoritarian control over loss of personal freedoms.

Would there be a trigger for that? Like another pandemic or something like that?

Yeah, there's going to be some ostensible trigger or, you know, it could be a false flag like what they did with 9 11, but something will trigger it. Could be losing the grid. Could be another clearly infectious pandemic. That is high on the likelihood. But you know, they've. They've kind of really. I mean, this was just a trial run, you know, I mean, they've been getting worse and worse. Every. Every two or three years they've launched you to make it. You know, they try their tricks and they've gotten more sophisticated and smarter with time.

Of course. Yeah.

So it's no surprise.

I mean, like, I feel like I'm a little bit more of a prepper on paper than you are out of forest and you're building a farm in Idaho with water systems and off grid and everything. You're on the beach in Florida.

So I have not showed you everything.

I haven't seen the bunker. But I gotta ask you, like neonatal. You're doing an entire master class. I think you said it was 50 plus modules and hours and hours of content. But, you know, without. Without having to do the entire masterclass right here on the podcast. Are there a few key things that you think people should do to prepare for something like this?

Yeah, what we just talked about. Exposure to the sun rather than swelling, vitamin D supplements, because there's so many other benefits, you know, that being exposed to sun would be two primary ones. Would it increases the production of melatonin not in your pineal gland, but in the subcellular spaces in your mitochondria where it's absolutely needed. Because that's where most all the reactive oxygen species are generated in energy production called bright light. Suppressed melatonin.

In the pineal gland. Okay. Not in the subcellular mitochondrial space in the Mitochondria and that's where you need melatonin.

So if you have elevated levels of melatonin.

This is my Russell Ryder, who's the primary researcher.

Yeah, yeah. He knows a lot about mitochondria is if sunlight is elevating mitochondrial.

Melatonin during the day, there would not be a sleepiness inducing effect and it would instead just allow for the anti inflammatory effect of melatonin on the cell membrane.

More antioxidant than anti inflammatory. Yes, that's what happens. Yeah. This is why, even if you can't get that, because many people are unable to get sun exposure in the winter and most everywhere in the United States, then you can do. There's other strategies because it's the near infrared frequency that generates that. So you can do a near infrared not far because far won't cause that. That to occur.

If it's one of those saunas that's a combination near infrared and far infrared. Do you think that people do, sir? Because some people say that the angle of the photons from the far infrared will negate some of the effects of the near infrared. How much there is?

I don't think so. I think I've not seen literature to support that. I suspect there would be a benefit if you had a. Sufficient reaches, sufficient threshold of infrared exposure.

Yeah. Okay. Now some people would hear you say, well, there's going to be a crisis to get out in the sun. Like it sounds kind of silly. So the reasoning behind that would be.

To prepare your immune system to better your overall resilience. Health resilience. Because if you're not healthy, look what happened if you weren't healthy in Covid.

Yeah.

A lot of people died. So the healthier you are, the more you'll be able to be resilient. So I think that's probably one of the most foundational things is to get sun exposure. And it's virtually been eliminated from our consciousness in the culture. And actually the exact converse has been embedded in it because almost all the dermatologists are warning people that the sun causes cancer. Well, you know what, Ben?

Yeah. It just got published that the title of the book is get the F out of the Sun.

Yeah.

It's literally just about how, you know this, this idea that a lot of health freaks have championed that sunscreen is full of carcinogens and that the impact of sunscreen is more deleterious than exposure to sunlight is something that is leading down. Leading a lot of people down the road. Getting skin cancer from sun exposure. Is there, is there Anything to be said for dangerous potential of sunlight when it comes to excess radiation like uva?

Well, sure, there's no question that you never want to get sunburned. That would be foolish. But you really need to explore the fundamental reasons why sun exposure would cause cancer. Why would it trigger cancer? It's because of the other most important strategy which we alluded to earlier, which is linoleic acid, which is ostensibly an essential fat. And I can make it stronger.

Explain that to people. Linoleic acid is. And by the way, it's different because there's. There's also alpha linolenic acid, which is like less of a polyunsaturated.

No, no, no.

It's actually more.

It's more polyunsaturated, but it's omega 3.

I mean, at least, at least little lack has two double bonds. I think maybe linolenic has two double bonds. It probably has two.

I think alpha linoleic has. Has more double bonds than linoleic acid, I believe.

Yeah. Most of the Omega 3 is typically less damaging.

Ala is less of a problem than linoleic acid.

Well, ostensibly they, they state it because it's omega 3 of a linoleic.

Yeah.

Whereas linoleic, which is 80% of the omega 6 fats. When you're talking about omega 6 fats, you're almost always referring to linoleic acid.

Okay.

So. But it's an excess of this in the right quantities, the quantities that were essentially in every human on this planet prior to the Civil War.

You will not get skin cancer if you had that level of linoleic acid in the tissue.

Low levels of linoleic acid.

Yeah, like 2%. The average person today is 12%.

Can you measure that?

Yeah. You can? Absolutely.

Really? Is that, what is it called, the omega quant or the omega.

Well, it will give you a barometer. It's not so much. You have to do like a fatty acid profile.

Okay.

But the optimal way would be a tissue fat biopsy, which isn't that hard. Better than muscle biopsy.

So.

So let's say people aren't going to get the biopsy. I guess the biggest elephant in the room here is when you use a term like linoleic acid and the fact that high concentrations of it would increase the possibility for damage in response to sun exposure. What would be some of the primary sources of linoleic acid in the modern American diet?

Well, the primary one is processed foods and, you know, two.

I think it was like 2/3 of the calories in America. The American consumers are from processed foods. So in the primary culprit, there is, of course, industrial processed seed oils, which started around the American Civil War.

Okay.

And they didn't.

That's why you said the Civil War, because that's when seed oil processing began to increase.

Okay, absolutely. And it didn't become popular until the 20th century. What was it about the Civil War.

That caused that to happen?

No, just industrialization.

Okay.

And we developed a technology to do it. We didn't previously. Never had it.

Yeah.

And in the 19th century, 99% of the fat that we consumed. 99% came from animal sources. No linoleic acids.

Really?

Yes. And today about 70%. Maybe. Maybe it's either. It's been a while since I looked at that. It's either 70 to 90% of the fat that Americans consume is from seed oils.

Wow.

Totally flipped.

Wow. Now, now, prior to that flip, what about some of these oils? I don't know if. If these would have a certain concentration of linoleic acid, like extra virgin olive oil. Yeah, well, those are minor ones.

That's typically the question that most people have. It's because.

You know, they're ostensibly viewed as healthy oils. Mediterranean diet and such.

If you had a healthy variety and the range is, like, from 3 to 20% of olive oil can be linoleic acid. The lower the better. Of course, 3% is pretty darn safe. The problem with it has been. And this is also what I'm saying for olive oil is also true for avocado oil, is that 80 to 90%. 80 to 90 of the commercial oils, avocado and olive are adulterated.

I've heard that before.

Olive Oil Hunter, He. He exposed that on my podcast. I was shocked.

Yeah. No, no, well, he may. I'm sure he did expose it, but it was exposed many, many years ago.

Yeah.

I mean, 60 Minutes.

Yeah, 60 Minutes was saying that well.

Over 10 hours caught a little bit similar.

Yeah. Almost identical to us. Yeah.

So.

And the issue is, is that almost everyone. We're probably the rare anomaly enough that we're just being surplus, but we're both very low in little egg acid.

Yeah.

We've known about this and consciously avoided it.

Yeah.

So.

But for me, at least nine years. Yeah. It's been ruthlessly eliminated from my diet.

Yeah. So that. And why is it so important? Because these, see, those are getting better in cell membranes, and they. They don't. They have a very low turnover rate.

They're not preferentially oxidized as fuel at all. They are stored in your tissue where Saturated. That would be burned much quicker than a poofa polyunsaturated fat.

Yeah. So.

It takes if you're really really diligent and hyper excessive compulsive, but avoiding them. You can lower it to almost to normal levels in about three years. That's about the earliest. Otherwise it's close.

That long? If you've been following its standard processed food diet, yes. Okay.

And it could be longer. I think five years would probably be safer for most people. Maybe in six or seven.

What is it about the combination of that and sunlight that would make sunlight more dangerous?

Well.

It essentially sores serves as the primary source of oxidative stress in your body.

Okay.

Because of these highly perishable. These bonds are highly susceptible to oxidative damage. Just one lake acid is two simple double bonds. When it's exposed to free radicals in your body which are normal. They're normal signaling molecules typically generated mitochondria, things like superoxide dismutase and even nitric oxide.

You know, hydrogen peroxide, hydroxyl, free radicals. They damage those double bonds and they convert it to something called oxlam, which is an oxidative linoleic acid metabolite.

Would you call them oxylan Oxlam Oxlam.

Oh, oxidative linoleic acid metabolite.

Which are primarily.

Yeah, they're primarily reactive aldehydes. Things like Malad 4 hydroxymonol glyoxyl.

These are a lot of the things that some functional medicine docs will test you for. Yeah, they need to do a detox.

Yeah. And what is the almost exclusive source of these guys? The helic acid.

Really?

Yeah, exactly. And you know people are worried about ages, advanced lactation end products. But the primary source of ages are linoleic acid metabolites.

Really 23 most people say apart from the combination of sugar with a heated protein.

And most people.

People would be wrong.

I mean I could show you this. The study's been out for 20 years. Yeah. It's not. It's linoleic acid. So I, I'm sort of dancing around that. To answer your original question is why is it contributing to cancer? So these oxlands are the primary reason. It's not because they increase inflammation. There are a lot of people who, who suggest to avoid eating the omega 6s because they increase inflammation. Inflammation because. Because linoleic acids, the next metabolites converts to arachidonic acid, which is a precursor for many pro inflammatory like postenoids and prostaglandins. But that's not the mechanism. The Mechanism is, increases oxygens and these, these oxidations go through the roof and essentially destroys your mitochondrial prematurely because there's specific fats in your mitochondrial inner membrane, like cardiolipin, which I'm sure you've heard of.

Yeah.

Responsible for forming this real, that curve within the mitochondria.

And that's not the membrane or on the cell. No, no, it's the membrane around the mitochondrial.

Yeah, the inner mitochondria.

Right, right.

And vast majority of the fat in there because of the perversion of her diet, is cardiolipid.

So the, the dietary intake of your fat can influence the type of fats that are on your inner mitochondrial membrane. 100% directly impact inner mitochondrial membrane composition.

Yeah. Now I told you I wrote this review paper on vitamin D for nutrients. Well, I just had another review paper published just this year, just a, like two months ago. It was a narrative review of linoleic acid damages. And one of the, they had pretty aggressive reviewers at this. They had four of the peer reviewers and one of them was just gave me the argument that linoleic acid has to be healthy because it's in breast milk.

Yeah.

So I, I obliterated and destroyed his argument because I found, I went back and found a study published in 1950 where they fed.

This group of people who had like 5% of the women had no. 5% of the content of breast milk in these women in the 1950s was, was linoleic acid, which is much below what it is today, closer to 15% because of the women's diet increase. I mean that was 75 years ago. So what they did in the experiment, they gave pure soybean oil or something, just almost pure linoleic acid, and they doubled it within two weeks.

Oh, okay. So they artificially elevated levels of linoleic acid in the breast milk in the study.

Yeah, because it's just a reflection, you know. His argument was, was totally invalid because that would mean that, oh, DDT's in the breast methods. Okay. Yeah, no, no, it just accumulates whatever your body's feeding. It's the same thing with cardiolipin, your mitochondria. And I've actually had a dialogue with some.

High level Canadian clinician who is, believes that this isn't true and that because the common belief within conventional science is that 80% of the fatty acids in cardiolipin is, are linoleic acid, they think that's healthy.

Isn't that true?

To 80.

That is. They say 80 to 90%. Yeah. And, and I don't dispute now is.

That because 80 to 90 is supposed to be or currently 80 to 90 based on the modern American diet.

Right. Because we've been doing this for over 100 years.

You can find somebody 100 years ago. There are some their mitochondrial membrane. It wouldn't have such high levels of.

If there's a measure your lives, yours, yours or mine, it's not going to be a time.

I wish I could get another measurement done. Yeah, you got to get a biopsy.

Yeah. I'm not sure the methodology.

Fatty acid concentration. But it's a research. I mean not something you can do a quest or lab.

But surely if you were to get that omega index score, which is far more common and available and you were to have a high omega 6 index to omega 3, it would be a pretty decent clue.

Well, it's not so much. I would disagree. It's not so much the ratio. You really need the absolute value. So there are other tests. I mean you could do a fatty acid profile through Quest or LabCorp. There are other companies that provide pretty powerful data like Nutrival. Nutrival will give you that data too.

Okay. Yeah. Nutrival or the metabolome, which is the test by genomic diagnostics. It's very similar to the Nutrival. Yeah, yeah. So what would you do if you were out at a Brazilian steakhouse or the whole food salad bar or you actually consumed linoleic acid?

Because it's not like.

I mean, unless you're extremely cautious, you're going to be able to completely avoid it. Is there something you can consume or do afterwards?

Yeah, there are foods. You know, ultimately comes down to the food selection that you're having. And typically animal foods would be a virus. Not all animals.

What if you eat linoleic acid? Like is there. Because I've heard James D. Nicholantonio talk about glycine or spirulina. I've heard other people talk about.

Well, ectomate charcoal would be one way because that's going to bind everything and help you excrete it. But assuming you want it assimilated, the best thing to do would be take vitamin E. And I think almost every.

Vitamin E. E, yeah.

Interesting. It's a very potent inhibitor of peroxidation of the fatty acids.

Any specific form of vitamin E?

Yes. Yeah, there's a most 80 to 90% of vitamin E is pure junk and it probably could make you worse.

Is that because. And I had a conversation with Dr. Barry Tan.

Yeah.

Designs for health about this. He was championing the idea of a variety of mixed tocopherols he said might be a natter plant was an example.

Something.

Yeah. He likes a nado. And I haven't carefully examined it. But the general principles are first of all you want to be the natural isomers. So you don't want synthetic and almost all of them are synthetic. And how do you know synthetic? It'll, there's, there's two isomers, the deck, the right and the left, the D and L. And the only isomer you want is a dextro D. So the D isomer, if it says DL, you know it's synthetic.

Throw it away.

Yeah. Okay, so that's one. And then it should, shouldn't say acetate after it's because that's another synthetic. So D alpha tocopherol acetate. Classic. You know, you go into almost any drugstore, that's what'll happen. You just do not want that.

Are there certain dietary sources more readily available than a not?

Yeah, this is great question. I mean the best dietary sources are seed nuts and seed oils. It's like nature kind of put it in there.

Yeah.

You know, so it's really hard to get. You almost have to take a supplement and you don't need a supplement for it the rest of your life. Once your seed levels oils are down like your Ellie, like both of us, you may not need vitamin E at all. And just the stuff you're going to get, normal foods is fine. But if you have, if you're like 99.99% of the population, you're going to really want it.

I'm sure people are now wondering about your diet. And I mean we just had what for breakfast? Rice and oatmeal with some egg yolks and some berries. Interesting, because I feel like if I would have had breakfast with you like maybe five years ago, you were pretty low carbohydrate.

So tell me what's changed with your diet? Because that was a pretty good breakfast.

We had this morning.

We didn't have water.

Well, it's sort of an extension of my.

Appreciation, deep fundamental appreciation of the dangers of linoleic acid. I definitely want to go back to some of the other issues of the cancer because there's some stats, I got this very mind blowing but this deep appreciation of the dangers of linoleic acid. Then I, then I started wondering, well, who understood this a long time ago. And it turns out Ray Pete. Ray Pete was one of the main biologists. Yeah. Was warning about this 1980s. 1980s. And I had Known of his work since about the 1980s and absolutely discounted it because it was so bizarre, so weird. I thought he was a flaky knucklehead biologist, didn't know what he was talking about. But then I said if he knew about linoleic acid, there's got to be this guy, he's got to have something up his sleeve. And I started looking at him and examining what he was talking about and it blew my mind. And I greatly regret that. I just understood his brilliance, literally. He's an iconic classic legend in my view. And understanding his mitochondrial function, how to optimize it. And we would need three to four hours to go into that. So we don't have the time to do that. But just take it for granted this is going to be part of the things of the course.

Is that just brilliant? He, he can help people understand how to optimize biological. Biological function and it's not with beta oxidation advancement mitochondria. I was wrong.

Totally right.

The ideal one is glucose and the best source of food.

You mean consuming adequate amounts of glucose?

Well, glucose is a fuel. You can get it from different ways. Ideally you want to get it where bound. The glucose is bound to fructose, you know as a disaccharide as you talk.

About like honeys and fruits.

Absolutely, yeah. Honey grapefruits, which is key. But anyway that goes in and optimizing that. So that, that's how I became aware of this. And interesting that just give you a brief history one because I, I, I integrated his, his approach earlier this year. I was pretty healthy. I mean pretty healthy for the most part. So once I did it, I was having about 150 grams of carbs like you. But I upped it to about 4 to 500. Now I'm not suggesting everyone needs to be 4 or 500. You have to have a high level of activity. You have to have. You can't have insulin resistance. If you do, it'll be this app.

That's what I understand is part of the Ray Peat approach is high energy flux meaning marrying adequate carbohydrate intake. Even as high as what you're saying, you're working yourself up to that 400, 500 grams with activities that would increase glucose transporters doing some walking or staying physically active or getting sunlight or engaging in lifestyle activities that would be the opposite of not eating many carbohydrates, being cold, hungry and libido and slightly inactive.

And low testosterone.

Yeah, and low testosterone which I had to deal with when I was following.

Almost everyone does is classic. And that's. It's just an absolute perfect classic illustration of the fact that inadequate cellular energy to make this the testosterone. The answer is not testosterone replacement. The answer is to fix the problem. So anyway, I did this. My I. I dropped 10 pounds in weight. My body fat went from 15, down 12.

You tripled your carbs and you dropped.

Yeah.

That amount of weight. Wow.

And that was. Went from 15 to. To 12 done by the inline. I think it's the inline body measurement.

Which I think is the best in body.

In body. That's what it is in body. But it's. It's almost identical. Dexa with none of the radiation.

Yeah.

So if you, if you want to really know what your body about is, I would do the in body for sure. And that was. So those went from 15. That was 15 a year before and then 12 shortly after that. My HSCRP, high sensitivity C reactive protein. I couldn't get it down below 0.8, which is still healthy.

Marker of inflammation.

Yeah. So at down 0.18.

Yeah.

But fasting blood sugar went down 10 points. 10 points.

Wow. Wow. Why do you think that is? That's paradoxical that your blood glucose would have decreased when you tripled your carbohydrate.

Intake because.

Your blood sugar is not necessarily related to the amount of carbs you're reading. I mean it is related, but it has to do with the metabolic.

Are you talking about the potential for a hypercortisolic response?

Yeah, when you don't have enough cortisol.

Causing a paradoxical rise in glycogenolysis and an increase in blood glucose because you're high cortisol due to lack of.

Well, that's that. That's what Georgia Dinko helped me understand is that yes, you know, there's not a excursion to glucose levels. You have a very steady glucose level when you're low curve low carburetor. It does it because your body wants to stay alive. If you go into low blood sugar levels, you will die.

The same reason that someone who's even eating a low carbo diet, which would have extremely high blood glucose level after workout or after a sauna or after a cold plunge. Because there's a transient rise of glucose in response to stress. With those activities, you tend to see long term blood glucose stabilization. Because the impact of those activities. Well, the stabilization, stress.

The stabilization is only due to the secretion of cortisol and other stress hormones like.

Glycogen.

But what I'm saying is consistent. Carbohydrate depletion would cause the body still need to Glucagon would still need to cause an elevation in blood glucose due to the stress that that elevation of blood glucose has to come from the liver and for muscle and eventually muscle fiber break.

Well, it's the other way around. It actually comes from the lip, from the liver is a processing. It's the amino acids are sacrificially extracted from your muscles, your bone, these really important tissues, and they're shuttled to the liver in a process called gluconeogenesis to create blood sugar.

What do you say to people who say, well, why not just increase dietary protein.

Could do that. But it's a very expensive way to do it. And there's some side effects because you create a lot of extra ammonia and that is really hard on your kidneys. And many people are suffering with kidney challenges.

Yeah.

So you, you. There's the ideal amount of protein for miners in and you certainly have your insights on it. But it's about.07 grams per pound of body weight.

Yeah.

0.0.55 is the minimum.

Yeah.

Above 0.8 grams per pound. Grams per pound. You tend to see a lot of diminishing returns unless you're extremely higher weightlifting in the bodybuilding. Some bodybuilders will still build and assimilate at 1.2 grams per pound plus. That's pretty rare. Yeah, that's a rare part of the population.

And that, you know, there's a. There's a downside.

So 0.7, that's a. That's a good approximation. So. So based on that, I do want to get back to linoleic acid and cancer, by the way. But I'm just curious, what's a typical day of eating look like for you besides the rice and goose eggs and the blueberries and the watermelon we have for breakfast?

Well, and the eggs, the egg yolks that we have are from the chickens or the geese that I raise and they're fed very special diets.

Geese.

The geese, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

I mean, why geese?

Oh, well, we initially got it because we wanted them to eat the weeds. They, they eat a lot less food than chickens because they mostly eat the grass.

Is the egg profile similar as far?

No, the egg profile is much, radically improved. Yeah. Because they don't eat typical feed. They eat mostly. They're mostly vegetarian. So the, the result their linoleic acid is much lower.

Linoleic acid in their eggs.

Some of the. This is why chickens and, and Pigs are not really great foods to eat. They are ideally, but they're monogastric animals. They only have one stomach and as a result they're just like us. And. And any linoleic acid that they're given tends to accumulate in their tissues. So almost. I don't care if it's organic free range chickens or pigs. They're almost all given. Given grains which are loaded with linoleic acid. They're very, very high.

Sometimes.

Absolutely. It's very unusual. I mean there are some. You can. If you raise them yourself, you can avoid it, but it'll surprise a lot of people here. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway.

What I normally have, I'll typically I. I love ripe fruit. It's probably the majority of my carbohydrates is ripe fruit. So I'll start the day with it depends if I'm a. It's a rest day or it's a sauna day. So I'll do three, four, maybe even more four pounds of cut watermelon. Not the rind and.

Right.

Is because more important to you than say the resist starch.

For you.

It's because of that blend of glucose and fructose.

Right.

Okay.

So that's what I do.

And I've. I've had some kidney damage as a result of mercury, you know, in proper mercury extraction done 30 years ago. So I scoundrels for this. So I cannot go high. I have mine. I really rarely go over 105 grams.

Of protein a day. Day. Okay.

So I. I still have some. Lamb would be my primary meat, but I only have like 3 ounces of lamb. That's it.

Yeah.

Relatively small amount, but. So my protein comes from other sources primarily.

But still because what do you weigh?

Approximately 180.

Okay. So you're not too far below 0.7 grams per pound protein at 105 grams.

Yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

Yeah. Because I'm a big believer of you and I'm. You know, this is the first time you've been to my place, but I'm so impressed with your exercise routine and it's. It's radically modified by things. We don't have time to talk about it. But believe me, I will acknowledge you in the course because it's. You're such a classic illustration of implementing what I believe is. And I've been passionate about exercise as you have been since 1968. Yeah.

You were part of the big marathoning craze.

Yes. When I had most of it wrong. And I'm gradually evolving and refining my progress. My. My Perception of that. And you radically helped in that area with respect to. Because it's all about movement, it really is all about motor. You've got to kneel in. You are not a muscle. A bodybuilding muscle head, which a lot of people are. Because if you do excessive.

Yeah.

If you do excessive resistance training, you will die prematurely. Yeah, you. It's great stuff, which it's small doses.

Not to rat the hole too much, but that's part of that J curve, that James.

Yeah, reverse J curve.

Yeah, reverse J curve. Meaning that not only do you reach a lot of diminishing returns when you get to about 180 minutes of high to moderate intensity cardiovascular exercise, but the law of diminishing returns for what would be considered like intense heavy weightlifting is even lower than that.

Much lower. Yeah. Anything over an hour a week could be problem. And I saw you work out today and maybe you did about five to 10 minutes, maybe not even that, and maybe zero because you really, I mean you were working out, but you're working on that intensely.

What I do is I'll do a few lifts, but then I do mobility. Yeah, it's almost all really get down off to the ground, little foam rolling. So even though I'm sometimes in the gym for an hour or two, I typically might reach 20 minutes or so of actual weight training during that time when I'm home.

It's just that ars, your weight training isn't that intense. It's not like you're pushing.

You'Re out in the pain kit.

I think it's better for the joints also. If I go heavy, it's not heavy. It's either blood flow restriction bands to trick the muscles and they're thinking they're lifting a heavy weight or a moderate weight lifted super slow, which I think carries with it much, much more longevity.

You really have to dial in great respect for what you've been able to the knowledge and practical skill set you put together over your lifespan.

So it's.

Congratulations.

Well, that's right. I mean, that's my jail.

I know, I know.

My degree was.

Yeah, but so, so back to the, the diet. You've got things like the goose eggs. You have the rice, the oatmeal, the berries, the ripe fruit. What about like organ meats, meat, things like that?

Oh yeah, yeah. You don't need much. I mean maybe have 10 grams Oregon meat a day, you know, small amount.

And then I have raw milk for sure. And I have a lot of, I have a lot of white rice, basmati, white Rice because it's.

Why rice versus like sweet potatoes or yams or purple potatoes.

You could use potatoes. You have to be somewhat careful. I'm not, I don't. If I do, I have to. I'm not, I'm not about potato paste, but I was having red potatoes, small red potatoes, not russet potatoes. But you have to be really careful and cook them incredibly well. I pressure cook mine because there's the starch that can form and we don't have the enzyme capacity to digest those starches easily. So it passes through our small intestine into largest and forms as fuel for the. The bacteria you're calling.

I mean, if you're consuming tubers without doing something like pressure cooking.

Yeah. Well, even. I mean I wouldn't know if I'd have any tuber other than. Right. Than potatoes.

And then. Yeah.

And then they have to consider the oxalate issue too. So. But, but if you're pressure cooking them, you know, oxygen, water, solid.

That's my understanding. Give her the oxalates. You can decrease a lot of lectin and get rid of any type of problematic starch by pressure you're cooking. Yeah, I think that's the best way.

To cook a tuber.

Yeah.

So you do that and then, then you, you can actually. Your body can absorb the fuel rather than bacteria. The danger of bacteria doing it is that they're. They the gram negative specifically they can produce something called lipopy saccharide and LPS for short, which is another term for endotoxin, which increases serotonin, which is a whole. The rab hole we can go down. But bad news. So I wanted to switch back to the linoleic acid because it is in my view, aside from sun exposure and, and movement which are, I mean, it's hard to prioritize them to also they're fundamentally foundation.

Yeah, you don't have to prioritize.

Every day I stack earthing and grounding sunlight, some form of weight bearing, hot cold water, minerals and some type of movement and mobility. That's like a typical day for me if I can check off those boxes.

Well, you're doing another one. You're doing another one. And you done it for the last nine years. So you don't even recall it. But you're avoiding lilac acid.

Yeah.

So what, what are the. This is astonishing information.

And I kind of knew of it, but I didn't compile it into a table until after I wrote my paper. But as I was preparing presentations, I said, oh my gosh, this Is. This is crazy. So the.

Amount of obesity in the 1800s was about 1%. So per 100,000, he had about a thousand people.

1%.

Yeah.

That's not because obesity was less reported. It was less existent.

Didn't exist. I mean, but it still was there. Because not all obesity is connected to linoleic acid. There's a lot of things that can cause it, because Even in the 19th century, they had obesity 1%. Today we have like 40% on our way to 50.

And are you referring to America primarily.

Well, industrialized countries in the West.

Okay, yeah.

So we've got an increase from 1% to 40% of 40x in that time frame.

Then you go to diabetes.

So we didn't have that many diabetics. It was like, it was a lot less than a thousand. It was like, you know, type 2 diabetes, not type 1. Type 1 is an autoimmune disease.

And again, this was not necessarily because less knowledge of the condition existed. There were less diagnosed cases or there were underreported cases.

Yeah.

This is pretty ironclad. They actually have less diabetes and have less obesity.

Yeah. And now you can make a strong argument. I mean, you're not formal, legally classified, classified as diabetics, but either diabetes or prediabetes, which I consider a fasting blood sugar, anything over three digits.

Okay.

You know, that's 30 of the country.

Anything over three digits?

Yeah, 100 or more.

Oh, okay. I got, I got what you're saying. Okay. Anything over you. You don't mean immediate post cranial.

No, no, no, I said fasting.

Yes.

Okay. And there's, you know, there is no danger to have a blood sugar130 for.

Reasons I just stated earlier. Don't test it right after you exercise or freak out. And take your fast. And glucose is way higher than it should be. Do it fasted and relax.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. So. So it's 30%. And it was like, it was.

It's gone up like 50x. No, wait, not 50x. I think it's 500x. I, I should have looked at the. The table.

Wait, what's gone 500?

Diabetes.

Okay.

Yeah. And the treatment for diabetes is not glucose restriction. It isn't. Now you can control it with a low carb diet. That doesn't mean you're curing it at all. You know what the fundamental reason for almost all diabetes is?

I mean, I'm gonna guess if you're gonna say the elephant is the brutalic acid.

It's little egg acid, but explain that. Why Is that because it ruins the ability in the mitochondria to allow glucose to be out to metabolize. So if you can't metabolize it, then words are gonna go, it's gonna be shuttled out into the, this into the cytosol, the cell and it's going to go into glycolysis.

Yeah.

And you're going to increase lactate. It just messes things up. And basically that is the Warburg metabolism. Otto Warburg was a guy that got one PhD in his cancer leaks now.

Keep going.

Yeah. He's commonly attributed that sugar is a fuel of cancer. And he never, never said that. And his work does not show that, that it isn't the fuel of cancer at all. It uses it. But it's, it's the, it's the distorted metabolism. What is the war gravel is when your mitochondria is unable to burn glucose.

Despite the fact that there's plenty of oxygen and it goes into glycolysis. Now when you and I put on the.

Normally if your mitochondria had blood glucose, there was oxygen available, would be able to metabolize that glucose glucose to produce ATP.

Right.

Normally in a healthy normal state.

Yeah. Assuming you have an overfed on glucose or you're been sedentary for a long time. But if we were to sprint or put the Katsu bands on and do some go to, you know.

Then you are creating an oxygen deficit. There isn't enough oxygen to burn glucose. So that is not the war breaker that because you're going to create lactate, but that's what your body's designed to do. That is a rescue mechanism. That's, that, that's healthy.

Right.

But, but if you're doing that when there's plenty of oxygen, you've got problem. That's cancer metabolism.

Yeah.

So that, so is that because the.

Cancer will thrive not necessarily in the presence of high glucose, but because it will thrive in an anaerobic high acidic state?

No, it's more fundamental than that. It's actually getting back to the creation of energy within the, within the mitochondria. So if it's shunted and you have to rely on beta oxidation, you're going to. These processes are going to create ultimately more oxidative damage. They do that through a mechanism that we don't have time to discuss. And virtually no one watching this understands it does it through the creation of reductive stress, which why mechanisms. I think me and I talked to this yesterday. Some of the mechanisms of methyl blue and ozone are related to reducing that reductive stress.

Right?

Yeah. So that's how they work. But linoleic acid is the exact opposite. It causes reductive stress, and that's one of the reasons that mitochondria gets damaged and dies prematurely. You know, it's all about the mitochondria.

No, if you're not to steel, man, your argument. What's the number one argument against what you're saying regarding linoleic acid? Because surely you've gotten some pushback.

There really is no hard hardcore I there. I mean, other than the delusional concepts like it's in breast mode, so it must be healthy. You know, it's just. They just. It's just an ignorance of the basic science of it, you know, I mean, that is the fundamental component of Pete's work is low linoleic acid. It's. Many people who teach it don't really. I mean, they mentioned it, all of them mentioned it, but they don't necessarily emphasize as much as I think they should.

If you were to look at something like epidemiological data, or that's what I'm trying to do, work in the blue zones or something like that, if you were to investigate those diets, would you find consistently lower amounts of linoleic acid, do you think?

Absolutely, yeah. Absolutely, yeah. And the studies have been done. Chris Kenobi, who's a ophthalmologist by training, has essentially quit his practice and turned into investigative journalists on this. And he's done great review of the world literature and 25 countries. He's examined and done, done gathered statistics and made the graphs and everything. And I've kind of compiled that and put it into something even simpler. So one of. One of the most astonishing pieces of information that I shared with you yesterday in our walk is that the incidence of heart disease in the United States was essentially unknown in the 19th century. The first reported heart attack in the United states was in 1912. 1912.

Essentially it was like maybe a handful of people had heart disease in the 19th century. So we go from that to the point that we have over a quarter million people today in the United States dying every year, dying from heart attacks.

That is like millions of times increase.

Can you attribute that to one specific factor, though? I mean, economic status means access to hyperpolid foods in a more sedentary lifestyle due to the advent of technology and possibly more stress. And there's got to be a cluster of factors that would result in that. Surely you can't say all of it.

Is Related to Lynwood, clearly not all of it. There's no question emfs and everything too, are also contributing. But in my view, I don't. There's no other explanation for it. I mean, what else can cause it.

To India. Yeah.

Because I had to be very careful in India. This was three years ago. I'd have to ask every time for the chef to come out and ask them to prepare my meal in olive oil or in ghee or butter. And the reason for that is, prior to going to India, because I had to give a lot of talks over health. And I noted that the increase in chronic disease, particularly diabetes, in India did not correlate at all to an increase in average percentage of carbohydrate or sugary. Exactly. And instead skyrocketed it as soon as vegetable oil was introduced as a substitute oil for the common oils that are used there. So I get what you're saying.

Yeah, that's.

I think it's still multifactorial, but. But I've seen some of the data on the increase in vegetable oil consumption, the direct rising product.

That's exactly what it is. And Chris. Chris Kenobi has really done an excellent job of documenting that. And now that I'm thinking about it, and you mentioned that probably the biggest argument against this would be the people saying that it's. No, it's all the carbohydrates.

Yeah.

It's all the carbs. And if you go to certain countries, like really large countries, like country like China, one of the biggest countries in the world, and the amount of sugar is actually decreased.

Yeah.

Decreased. And viscerals went up and disease went up. Just following almost.

Maybe you're at least making some friends now with the corn and grain lobbyists.

Well, no, no. Corn and grain are full of seeds. Yeah, That's. That's the primary source.

Yeah.

This is not my first book.

Back. Back to why the geese that eat the plants are going to be healthier than the chickens or pigs.

Right. Yeah. My first book in 2004, almost 20 years ago, was A no Brain Diet, which I wasn't thrilled with the title of that book, but it actually is good and I tend to agree with it, except for the anomaly would be things like white rice, not brown rice, because brown rice has a lot of lily gases hull. And you could do oatmeal if you're careful, but you know, gluten is not your friend and most of them are sprayed with glyphosate, so you've got to be careful. I mean, I don't think virtually anyone should be eating wheat.

Yeah, you briefly mentioned emf. Yeah, I was telling you that there might be a correlation because I'm just thinking here about the radiative effect of sunlight and the, the consequences of high linoleic acid consumption and sunlight exposure. Drives me nuts when I walk through the average, like, resort and everybody's sitting around eating french fries and chicken. Ladies, my gosh, this is the worst time to be doing that. Preferably do it indoors, out of the sun. But when it comes to EMF or, you know, electromagnetic radiation or non AVMF, dirty electricity, etc. Would you have an increased susceptibility to the damages that if you have high linoleic acid consumption?

Well, there's no study that shows that, but George Dinka was a mentor of mine, has explained really clearly previously that people who have low linoleic acid diets have much less risk of dying from exposure to high doses of ionizing radiation, like from a nuclear blast.

But, but like an ems, like a WI FI router. That's not ionizing radiation.

It's not, but they're real similar, in fact. So what happens? What we believe the mechanism for damage from emfs is because it catalyzes the release of calcium inside the cell, because the levels of calcium outside the cell are 50,000 times higher. 50,000 times higher. So when it goes into the cell, it's a powerful signaling molecule. What does a signal cell do? It tells cells what some of the things are. It increases the release of superoxide and also nitric oxide. And those are two molecules that they get even close to each other. They instantaneous, I mean, instantaneously form some, this reactive nitrogen species called peroxynitrite. And that is really, really damaging, probably collectively more, far more damaging than hydroxyl free radical, because hydroxyl radical only lasts about a billionth of a second. This peroxy nitrite lasts a thousand times longer. So long that it can actually migrate outside of the mitochondria, outside of that cell. Cell, and go into another cell in the mitochondria, hang around that long. So as a result, the longer it stays around, it hangs around it because it's, it's almost as damaging as hydroxyl. But hydroxyl is more damaging, but it lasts a thousand times longer.

Yeah. So anyway, there's calcium influx into the cell. So how would linoleic acid cause an increase in that already present calcium influx into the cell?

Well, that's how emf, we think, does it. And there's Pretty strong evidence for that. It turns out that linoleic acid has the same molecular action that's it causes calcium to go into the cells. Not only does it create the ox mask, it causes. And I didn't put this in my paper either, but because I didn't. Didn't make the dot, didn't connect the dots. You know, life is busy. You just forget to do something. This is an important component, is that, that's another way that linoleic acid contributes to increasing cancer, is that through this calcium. Calcium influx. But the other thing that's almost in many ways very similar because it has a. I think the same number of double bonds is estrogen. Estrogen is not your friend. It is not a postmenopausal woman's friend. This is dangerous. Dangerous molecule.

You mean excess estrogen.

No. I mean, yeah, no, you do. There's almost virtually no indication to be taking an estrogen cell.

Right. But if your body is naturally producing.

Yeah, yeah, you need some. You need some. Yeah.

And why is that?

It's because it's. This calcium influx is one, but it's one of the primary contributors for cancer, no question. Excess estrogen. And that not only do we get it from supplements and Ms. Well intentioned but misinformed physicians prescribing it, but. But we get it from xenoestrogen.

Xenoestrogen, phytoestrogens.

How much of it is the excess estrogen versus the progesterone to estrogen imbalance like low levels?

Well, that's a big part of it. You're unquestionable. Now we talked earlier about the major danger of low carbs is because your body to release cortisol and cortisol to shred your muscle protein. Well, guess what? One of the most effective cortisol blockers.

Are the most effective progesterone. Progesterone.

Yeah.

Yeah. It just annoys even a lot of guys. And there's an entire book written about this. I forget the doctor. It's a real book about anxiety, progesterone, sometimes trans children who have ADD and ADHD. But Dr. Chris Shea actually is who turned me onto this that day, said hey, stressed out at the end of the day, a little anxious, you know, having trouble turning the brain off. Just put a little progesterone like on the inside of the forearm and almost immediately feel this drop in anxiety.

Yeah, you could. Typically we're looking for longer term solutions so that you have to be really careful about because that will work short term, but long term it's not A good idea. You want to. It has to be absorbed connected with a long chain fat.

Okay.

To get absorbed. Because if you just swabble progesterone, which you can't really do, you can buy pregnenolin powder, you can buy DHA powder, you can't buy progesterone powder.

I've just always recommended 3% transdermal progesterone.

I don't think it's a good idea long term because there were.

I used.

Because I did that. The guy who recommended it initially was John Lee.

Yeah.

Who passed away John lee.

And then Dr. Michael somebody wrote the anxiety book and he's another guy.

Yeah. But yeah, it should be in a long chain fat and ideally administered orally. Or you could do it it sub transmucosally through its post story or either vaginal or rectal. But there are there. I can give you the link to a company that I really like that I think would. Does a really good job of it.

And oral progesterone.

Oral progesterone. Yeah. Yeah. Because you got. You know, I wouldn't do transderma. I would. I mean it's okay for a while. But I neglected to mention is that when I was using my practice it worked almost for every one of the first few months. But then, you know, three, six months it started. You know, you felt this tolerance, technical access to it.

Yeah, I've heard there's a little bit of attack of lact.

And again like I would use it very infrequently just.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But for a woman. And I would make a strong argument for many men, especially low carvers, that, that, that that progesterone could be a real benefit to them to increasing their testosterone level.

Yeah. And I'm pretty chill as this. You saw me on the intermittent hypoxic yesterday. Oh my gosh. You impressed? Yeah, yeah. I know that's kind of, kind of geeked out exercise stuff for people, but tell people about that intermittent hypoxic. Just, just briefly explain what that is.

Well.

We have a device that can generate. It's a medical grade device. So it produces really pure clean oxygen. The oxygen level in the air that we breathe, about 20%. This device can dial that back down to as low as 9%, which is kind of dangerous. But it has. It's also attached to a pulse oximeter. A medical grade pulse oximeter, not the money buy for $25. Cost like 20 times that. And it accurately measures your PO2 levels so it can monitor to see what your blood oxygen Concentration is. And if you can get it down to the low 80s and keep it there, that's a really powerful stimulus to produce.

Not all the time.

No, no, no.

I mean short term.

Short term. Yeah, yeah. You know, with this device, it essentially gives you pulses of. In our case, it's about 15% oxygen concentration, which is not much different than room air, which is 20%. But then you do that for seven minutes. Or you can change the time, but. But essentially, you know, five to seven minutes, maybe 10. And then you go for two minutes, you pop into hyperoxia where you get oxygen concentration like 30, room air or higher, like 34, like we got. And then, you know, it just generates all these intriguing hormonal and metabolic benefits, especially if you're doing it with a. A mask on. And because you're getting this administered through.

An oxygen mask and you're just sitting in the chair, even though you told me beforehand, you're like, this is going to feel like Wim Hof breath work. And I was like, yeah. So I sat there for the first 10 minutes or so, didn't notice a lot. And then gradually my fingers began to tingle. I feel that slight oxygen hunger when it dropped. And then you get that rush of oxygen when it comes back in. Just like you're doing breath work. But this machine's doing it all kind of for you. Because I was laid back on an eye mask and like new calm and in this deep meditative state would almost get trance, like every time it dropped the oxygen. And it's called. The actual title for this would be iht. Right. Intermittent Hypoxia Training.

Right.

And this unit that you use, are you able to share the brand?

Yeah, I'm currently using a cell gym. It's. Yeah. Okay. Just. It's probably has a different name now because in the process of changing things. So it's mostly designed for commercials because it's pretty expensive and. But it's a powerful thing. But you can. Hopefully they'll come up with home units at some point in the future. But you can, you know, to get that benefit, but you can get similar benefits. You're not going to get the IHT benefits, but just the Nucle Mac itself. Yeah. Which we like. It's kind of pricey.

I mean, you just meditate for meditation.

Yeah. Especially with some good set of earbuds.

Yeah.

But if you do use in Newcom, you only want. There's only one channel that works and that's. That works. I mean, two. You like the nap one too, but the rescue the rescue channel.

The rescue channel. Yeah.

And all the. Epstein.

I have a whole podcast about the new column I'll link to in the show notes. Yeah. BenGreenfieldLife.com Cocola the number three Mer C O L A the number three. The new column is an app that has these trance like sounds that are unlike anything I've ever heard.

Yeah, they're like 3 gigabyte 5. You're right.

You're gonna use anything. Then go to the rescue tracks and like the 50 to 70 or 120 minute rescue tracks are amazing.

Yeah. My favorites are the hundred and then the 50.

Yeah.

And I, I, it's something I do every day with. Pretty much every day. I would say five to six times a week.

Cell gym or the new column?

Why both?

Yeah, yeah. Both together in the gravity chair you have to set up. I mean that's, that's a game changer.

Yeah.

I was telling you. Dr. John Laurent shout out to our friend John. He has this thing called the shift wave chair in his office which vibrates as you breathe in and breathe out. And timing correlation to your breathing. That would be pretty amazing to.

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

Yeah. I haven't gotten those chairs. But thinking about it, you know, one thing that I thought of as you were describing, the deleterious impact of the combination of linoleic acid and emfs is ever since talking to you about your first book on the podcast emf and I still think people should go back and listen to that episode. I started anytime on an airplane or in like an Airbnb with a ton of different WI fi signals coming in pretty much anywhere besides my house, which like yours has the hardwired ethernet and low EMF and all the dirty electricity mitigation filters in it. I take magnesium, I take nad, and I take hydrogen. Those are my top three that I'll take when I'm in a high EMF environment because the magnesium seems to offset some of the calcium influx. Are selected antioxidants I, I could.

Well, any. Anything isn't really an antioxidant.

All right, well, the NAD would be more for. For kind of like the DNA repair or protection.

Yeah. So I can modify that somewhat now because I think exogenous ketones are really useful. I'm not a big fan of people going into ketosis themselves because the process of going into ketosis is stress response.

You mean ketosis without the use of exogenous ketones when fasting. You're starving yourself into this. Yes. Yeah.

Right. Or, or time restriction, eating you're fasting. So you don't really want to create ketones yourself initially, if especially metabolically healthy, but you can take exogenous ones and, and like Frank.

Yeah, that was. I mean, those would be classic examples. They can really help. And you know, ketone aid. Right. Yeah. And so that can be really useful if, if you're getting mixoneously with respect to NAD precursor. Nad. I mean, you don't want to take NAD yourself. It's very expensive and it's unnecessary. But I think the ideal one, this is one of the. My key points is niacinamide by itself. It's simple, inexpensive. You can get like year supply for $10.

Different than niacinam niacinamide.

Totally different. Well, they're both called vitamin B3. Niacin is the one that punctures your flush. Niacinamide. Nad, what is that? It searched for nicotinamide adenine denucleotide. And nicotinamide is another term for niacinamide. It's not niacin adenitine, but it's not niacinamide.

Oh, interesting.

The actual molecule of NAD is composed of niacinamide, not niacin. Yes. You can't convert niacin niacinamide, but that's another. It's not as efficient.

You can just supplement niacinamide and get.

A similar effect like 50 milligrams. 50 milligrams, you don't want to take 500. More is not better. There's a Goldilocks dose.

Yeah, yeah, I actually just tweeted about that. Especially in someone with poor methyl donors or an MTHFR deficit or high stage inflammation, high amounts of NAD can actually.

Be harmful in a situation like that. Yeah, absolutely. So, so, yeah, I, I pretty much take niacinamide regularly. I think that's one of the core things. I mean, vitamin E, most people need niacinamide at a small level, you know, two or three times a day, 50 milligrams. And that. That is the best precursor. And what you. All the lifestyle like circadian rhythm optimization, exercise, because NAAMPT is the rate of enzyme, but you have to have the fuel to, you know, once you've activated.

Fermented foods, there's a few different things that will increase.

Yeah, yeah. So that, that's really good stuff.

All right. There's a video floating around of you out there, and I want to hunt it down and put it in the show notes of you crushing a young, virile man in an arm wrestling.

Yes, indeed.

Is that Video out there?

Yes, absolutely.

Okay.

All right. So there's no. No to my editor.

Hunt it down.

Put in the show notes. Dr. Joe Mercola, arm wrestling Dr. D from Miami. What's your secret? How'd you get, how'd you get strong enough to, to beat a young buck?

Well, this, this. I hadn't been embracing Pete's work for about six months at that time. So my mitochondrial repeat. Yeah, my mitochondria were tuned. I mean, I, not only metabolically flexible, but my, I had ultimate fuel in. My mitochondrial glucose was being, being, being substituted. But, but an additional thing I was doing was the Katsu, the blood flow restriction training that I've been doing for about six years. And that, what that does is it activates type 2 fibers, specifically the endurance fibers, that you get high intensity and stuff. And you can tell if you watch the video that he kind of. Which is exactly what you expect. His, his type 1 fibers failed exactly 20, 32nd.

Like he, he had the initial. Yeah, he was pushed on you, but as soon as you this fast switch muscle pooped out, you could see that you just kept. Well, it was recruiting and recruiting.

Yeah, that's right. And my fast twitch fibers were much better trained, much better.

Which was.

That's what KATSU does.

Yeah.

And so I just.

Lactate buffering.

Yeah, that's right. Lactate buffering.

Yeah. Let's impress the video.

Yeah, that one was shown. I surprised a lot of people. It was, that was, it was really my achievement, my fitness achievement for this year. I mean, I've done a 400 pound deadlift before, 650 pound leg press, but I'm most pleased with that.

Yeah, that's impressive. We've only scratched the surface of your body of knowledge, but you've alluded to this master class a couple of times. How soon can people expect that to be out?

I'm hoping by the end of the year, you know, it's going to be really, really inexpensive.

It's like we're recording in September of two.

Yeah.

It's like we're targeting like $5 a month.

Oh, wow.

Yeah. I want this to be available to everyone.

Yeah, yeah.

And it's the, the purpose is to prepare people for what's coming with you. Because I've been doing this for 50 years and I've compiled a lot of knowledge and you know, it gets confusing because there's some of this.

I feel it's my personal responsibility to put it all together, make it clear as can be. You know, it takes me like 10 to 20 hours to make one of these modules.

Yeah.

So I'm really excited about it. It consumes almost all my heart.

I love to learn from you, man. I mean lots of people ask you who might mentors are and I can't say that I that I have a specific person who I talk to on the phone or anything like that, but you've definitely influenced me a lot. So I'm super grateful for you and grateful to be able to. Well, thank you. Down for a three feet.

Three people.

Three Pete all right, well folks, again the show notes are gonna be a Ben Greenfield Live Mercola 3, including the arm wrestling video if you want to see that. If his master class is out, I'll stick it in there as well. If that's helping out, if not in Retro later on. And thank you so much Joe for doing this. Thank you to everybody for listening in. Until next time, I'm Ben Greenfield along with Joe McCullough signing out from BenGreenfieldLife.com have an amazing week.

More than ever these days, people like you and me need a fresh, entertaining, well informed and often outside the box approach to discovering the health and happiness and hope that we all crave. So I hope I've been able to do that for you on this episode today. And if you liked it, or if you love what I'm up to, then please leave me a review on your preferred podcast listening channel, wherever that might be, and just find the Ben Greenfield life episode. Say something nice. Thanks so much. Means a lot.

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