Pushing Past Creative Blocks To Build Your Business (Live!)

Greetings, everybody. Super excited to see you all. My name is Lennon, if you haven't met me before. We're here, I think, live now on a couple different channels. I know a couple of members here are streaming, so I run a company called Stop the Starving Artist where we help artists to sell their work and grow communities that support them both financially as well as emotionally. And these folks here are amazing members of our alumni group. And it's going to be really fun because today we're talking about creative, like, being creatively stuck. What does it look like to be creatively stuck, both in your work, which is something I've been going through, and then also in your business. And. And so we don't rehearse or talk about any of this beforehand. So this is very much a candid conversation, which will be really fun. So super excited to talk about it. I'd love it if just quickly everybody went around and introduced yourself, what you do and any of that stuff. We'll start with Britt. What about you, Britt?

Hi, I'm Britt. I'm from the Netherlands. I'm a visual artist. I make jewelry inspired by history and nature, like the one I'm wearing right now. And. Yeah, I don't know what can I tell more?

No, that's perfect. That's perfect. Yeah. Nice. Succinct. I love it. Maria.

Hi, I'm Maria. I am originally from Germany, but live in the US now, and I am mainly a watercolor artist at the moment. I combine nature mindfulness into my art and I also am hosting a mindfulness podcast called Becoming Mindful with a Friend.

Just our journey into mindfulness. So everything around mindfulness.

Love it. Thank you, Maria. Susan Taylor Brown.

I'm Susan Taylor Brown. I am a fiber artist specializing in.

And absolutely obsessed with texture and how many ways I can create texture with pieces of stringy things.

Love it. Hannah and Nemo.

I'm Hannah and this is Nemo. And we make aluminum can moving mosaics like the ones you see behind me. And we are passionate about environmentalism and human rights, and we're beginning to share more about our life and our practice of slow living.

Yeah, I love that. I'm excited to hear, based on where you guys are, especially all that, like, how this all fits.

So let's start off with this question.

Who right now is in, if at all, like, any sort of. And you can answer this in the chat, too. Any sort of a creative block on. On your actual, like, the art side of things? Is anybody dealing with that currently? And if so, like, what are you coming up against a little bit? Hannah, what you got?

Yeah, usually we don't have creative blocks. Not very often. We have kind of this really singular focus, but I don't even know what it is. Yeah, whatever. You understand the concept.

Okay.

But we are right now, we had this idea to use a different kind of frame. And I know that Susan's been going through a little bit of this lately. It's not like we are blocked in, like, coming up with our art, but we have a problem that we are blocked with finding a solution for how we're going to make this piece of art fit into this new, different style frame. And so that's kind of the thing we're dealing with right now. And it just presented itself today, like this morning? Yeah, like, I thought that.

I thought we knew for. For our. The other group thing, we're going to be like, oh, this is gonna be our big win. We got a new, new product and it's gonna be amazing. Oh, and everybody didn't line up for it and. No, it didn't work out.

It didn't work.

Yeah.

We need to spend some time and, like, think of a creative solution that we weren't anticipating, needing to do.

Got it. Okay, so this is kind of a mix then.

It's all right. It's more of an obstacle than like, that. You're like, okay, I understand what we need to do.

But it looks amazing. Yeah. Let me see it.

Here's the piece that we cut it at. A strange dimension and it doesn't fit in the frame.

Yeah.

Cool.

Now we're like, well, should we just sell it unframed?

I don't know.

We'll figure it out anyway.

That's cool, though. That looks incredible.

Thank you.

Anybody else got any blocks?

Well, I sort of like Hannah said, I've been going through this thing about how to finish stuff and bought a whole bunch of experiments and really was frustrated with all of them.

And.

And I watched Lisa Hilton's series of going through her process of preparing her sculptures from start to finish, and she got to her finishing things with the little walnut pieces that she sets her sculptures on. And I had a light bulb moment that I don't have to attach my finished pieces to anything. I can make a stand and set them on the stand. So I. I have to figure out, I kind of have a way I want to do. I got to problem solve the actual stands to work with my work, whether I want to do them out of another material, if I want to keep them with fibers and fabric. There's that, and then there's the. It's more of a content block that I'm having right now. Really, really major content block on YouTube.

Got it. Yeah. Well, that totally fits, I think, with this creativity block, too. I think of all of it in the same bucket, Maria.

Yeah. So for me, I've reading some of the comments, and Nina and G, they're both talking about.

Kind of the finding time to be creative and also running a business on the other side and kind of like this creative energy management. So I kind of have that at the moment, too, but more to the point where I'm not planning on any creation at the moment, because right now I'm preparing for an art show and trying getting everything ready and getting some content out there and making content, and somehow that also same thing, like, I have not the mental capacity to do the art even. So I think it would probably be helpful.

Okay. Yeah. So what about on the business side? So I'm hearing a little bit of, like, content is like a block, and so I'll fit that on the business side. Are there other blocks that you're anybody's dealing with, Susan?

So as all of you know, for the last, what, several years, I've been talking about the classroom, building up the classes, building up the classes. That was going to be an another path in my business, and I still want to do that. But suddenly it dawned on me. I mean, I know it's going to take time away from the other stuff, but it's also, do I want to put my energy into being known as a teacher or as an artist? Because are the people that are going to come take my classes, Those are going to be other artsy people. Those are not necessarily people that are going to be buying my art and how to balance or merge or whether it's even an issue. And that's kind of where I've been at the last few weeks.

Yeah, I know that. That feeling of, like, yeah, what to do, what to do with this thing, where to go next. And I know you had kind of a vision and then heard a couple things that sort of flipped that a little bit.

And it really is, though, the question of, you know, can you be both an artist and a teacher and treat them both with the respect and the energy that they need, or do you go down one path? And I know Hannah had brought this up in a recent meeting where she was talking more about, you know, maybe doing workshops and stuff, and we sort of steered her a different direction. And that kind of stuck in my brain and been thinking, you know, there's nothing wrong with teaching, and I enjoy teaching. I know I'm good at teaching, but I don't know that that's going to. I have limited energy. Yeah. Somebody said, was it G that said energy management? It's like, it's hard to balance and still. And my work takes a long time.

Yeah.

So I don't know. So that's kind of where I'm at.

Okay. Anybody else?

Yeah, I kind of have that. Had the same thought, kind of more on the side with Hannah and Nemo there, where I. I don't really necessarily want to do teaching, but I. It definitely has crossed my mind, especially, you know, when you get into those moments where you're like, can I. Can I even be an artist? You know, is it even sustainable without teaching nowadays?

But is being a teacher being an artist? I mean, that. It's an identity thing. And maybe I'm talking labels in a way that I shouldn't be talking labels, but it is something I'm thinking about. It's two different paths. And, you know, teachers are fabulous, and, you know, hopefully many of us have had wonderful teachers, but they aren't always the artists that are selling and that are showing and things. And I'm wondering if my energy should be better put into doing open studios, submitting to shows, and getting myself more out there in that arena.

Yeah. So same question to everyone in the chat. So we got a couple dozen people here. What. What do you guys think? Are there any. Any blocks that you guys are having around your creative business? Like, because I noticed in the chat we only had a couple people that were feeling blocked, it seemed, with the creativity side, but I tend to see more in the business side. I saw Nina say here, like, getting more online traffic. They do well at shows and in person, but very few online sales.

Which I totally get that. Hi, Birdie. Hi, everybody. Okay, so let us know in the chat what you're feeling. So let's. Let's start then with.

This sort of content block that seems to be, I think, common.

I know Maria mentioned that Susan mentioned that Brit has taken a couple weeks off of social media, so she's probably in a place of, like.

I don't know, maybe that would be helpful. But.

Let'S. Let's just talk about that as a whole. What's got you blocked? What makes you feel like, well, I don't have perfectionism. Okay. Yeah, perfectionism. That's a great word. Okay, what about it? Why. What are you wanting to Happen definitely.

When I haven't posted for a couple of weeks, for instance. Now the first things I'm going to make.

I want to. I want to do them right. I want to start right. But yeah, you just have to put something out there to start again. But it's. That threshold of perfectionism can stop me from posting anything at all for weeks and weeks.

Yeah. Especially when I've found too like, like you said, when you take a couple of weeks off or you take some time away, you. I don't know what it is, but it does build a pressure that.

Yeah.

Is so silly, you know, that we, we, we self inflict this like, thing. It's like, well, now I gotta live up to something. Well, you know, like why? What I don't understand, you know, like what the difference is. But it's so fascinating around content. Is it similar.

Oh, you're muted, dear.

There.

Sorry. The dog was going crazy. It's a little weird for me because I feel like I have different blocks on different platforms. So Instagram audience, I feel like, you know, they want to see the pretty things. And like I said, my work takes a long time and I'm just showing. Okay, can you even see that? I created another 500 stitches over here.

YouTube. I feel like I've sort of lost my identity over there. I'm not sure what. Because again, if I'm just going to sit and stitch and what am I going to talk about? And I don't want to do just demos over there or if I'm stitching. Is that a demo? And so I'm probably overthinking. I'm probably overthinking. I'm not thinking perfectionist anymore. It's just I stop and don't turn on the camera because I feel like I'm doing the same thing every day. And if I spend more energy trying to come up with more angles on it, they flop. The things that I put the more energy in, it feels like they flop.

I don't know if any of that makes any sense.

Yeah, like I had somebody in a call recently say something similar that like they, they feel as though when they create.

When they take a lot of time on something, it doesn't get the legs that they want it to. And then, you know, when they spend less time, that's the stuff that gets put out there or that like gets surfaced. Is that what you're saying?

It kind of kills the forward momentum when you spend a lot of time. And like I was trying to showcase some art and I've Done a couple videos showcasing recent completed pieces, you know, and I was really proud of the way they came out. And I thought, okay, they're going to. They're definitely going to get some traction, and they didn't on YouTube. But then I have to then turn back and blame myself. If I'm not putting out anything other than live streams every week, I'm not going to get the exposure on YouTube. So then it's back to my fault. So then I just feel like, okay, I'm. I don't have the energy to do it all, and then I just want to quit. I mean, it's this cycle.

Yeah. Okay, so more energy equals less reach. So let's. Let's talk about that.

But because this. This feels like a common frustration that people have.

There's two. There's two sides.

There's two sides to that, right? Like, well, the. My wild backyard. Like, I agree, like, it could be audience. Audience mismatch, but it very well may not as well. You know.

What I think about here.

First and foremost, because to me.

What I want to see people from this level do is take action, right? Not necessarily, like, try to analyze it. Because sometimes the analyzation of the mismatch isn't necessarily going to move you forward. Right.

Because then you're like, well, then what if I'm doing this wrong? And what if I'm doing that wrong and we get back to this perfectionism idea. So where I think is a healthy place to start is like, what do you. And I'm going to ask this of you too, Brit. Like, what do you want to see happen on. In your social media stuff when you. When you're doing social media? How do you want it to feel when you show up for you, not. Not them first for you?

I want to feel a connection. I want to feel like there's someone there that I'm talking to and not just a blank Internet space. And yeah, I want. I want a connection. I want to have conversations with people. Want to spark something.

Okay, what about you, Susan?

Yeah, I want to feel the connection. And I do feel like I feel the connection. I think I'm feeling it more on Instagram than I am on YouTube. Like I said, the different platforms are responding differently to me. However, I know in YouTube's, in my weekly lives, I mean, I've got community. I've got an awesome community. So I know I've got that audience there. They're not the ones, though.

It comes back to the two paths. So what I want is more connection and let's be honest. I want to drive them to my website for whatever I'm doing there, whether it's selling art, whether it's selling a workshop, whether it's signing up for newsletter, whatever. I mean, isn't that what we all want is we want to drive the people, we want to connect with them and drive them to the next level?

Yeah. What does that give you when you. When you do that?

Besides financial compensation, which. Okay, let's be honest. That is part of it.

Yeah. I'm writing it down.

There's validation. There's validation that we're doing the right things to draw the right people to us. And that's kind of where I feel like I'm missing. I feel like I'm drawing the right people on Instagram, but not on YouTube. So I need to really rethink that strategy.

I guess.

Mostly it's validation that, you know, that I'm being seen and heard so that I can help them be seen and heard.

Got it. Okay. Yes.

Okay. Connection. Always feel seen. Connection and engagement.

My ADHD mind is all over the place. Yeah. People pleasing. Yep. Sandy, what would you like to see from your stuff online?

Yeah. High level, level connection. Great. Yeah. So this is fantastic because.

I. I love to start here. What do we want? Because what's missing, Right. Like, that's such an important part with any block is just understanding first, like, what's actually missing. Because, yeah, to your point, you know, finances are a part of that. But what I'm hearing from everybody is this sense of connection. Right. And we talk a lot about growth and what it looks like a lot of people see views as growth. I don't ever start with views as growth. I look at it as the first things you start to see are comments, dms, things that somebody saying to you, thank you for this, like, I really needed this. Right. That's that connection point. And what I love about starting there is twofold. It means you've hit on something that really matters to them, and it's a topic that is like, well, then this is something I like to talk about as well. And it's something that connects to your people. Right. So, Brett, that's the first thing I would ask you is, like, what are the things that you would like to connect with them on? And starting with just by making a list of that, you know, like, what are these things? And I know you've talked about your, like, history.

The importance of our history and our cultures and things like that. Is there anything else that would be beneficial as far as like connection for you?

Like in subjects, you mean?

Sure, yeah.

Yeah. Hard to say my mind like that, but.

Yeah.

A sense of belonging, a sense of a kind of clan, like you fit in.

So what do you belong to? What does this clan belong to? What do you guys.

We like, we, we like things like Celtic cultures, the Viking age. Get high interest for things like that. We probably go to festivals, alternative festivals. We probably like to dress up accordingly. And I think my people, the people that I want to talk to are very much like me and feel at home at places like that.

Okay, so the follow up question to that, and we'll start, we'll start with you, Brett, and then we'll move over is how much are you talking about those things?

More and more.

Okay.

When I, when I'm more active, when I, when I make more content, I try to post about it, but I notice when I'm a bit blocked, then I tend to just show work or show.

A work in progress video or that tends to go to the background a bit.

Yeah. Okay, so Hannah, Nemo, Maria, are there things that you guys. And Susan too, that you guys have done in these positions where that block is there? But you're like, I want to reach out to my community. What are some easy lifts that you guys have done that have sort of gotten you back into connecting with your people?

I've definitely put kind of the shallow end questions out there if I'm not, not really in the mood to lay it out, lay everything on the line and to talk about.

The more, I guess, the issues. Yeah. Sensitive things.

If I just make it a little bit lighter, a little bit more fun by saying something like, you know, what are you working on today? Or maybe have a this or that scenario. Like you like hot dogs or hamburgers better?

Chocolate or peanut butter?

Yeah, just little silly things like that to sort of just get people talking and then.

Or clicking the thing, you know, and.

Then that kind of like motivates more stuff. So that would help get me out of a, a rut if I'm feeling that way, which I kind of am right now. So it's probably something I need to try again. Because it does. It is effective because it makes you realize that some people that are following our audience, they don't need the heavy stuff all the time. As a matter of fact, they probably would prefer not. Like they, they want to know who you are. They want to know who, what you stand for for sure. But I think.

If, if we at least focus on that stuff too much, then it becomes A little bit depressing in a way. And so we also are known for our quirky, fun stuff. And. And a lot of people are there for that as well. So if we kind of keep things light, then we kind of end up going that direction in the long run and we just cycle. We have, you know, weeks or even months where we're.

Just for lack of ideas or just. Just keep it light all the time and it acts.

Just throwing cans. Yeah.

It ends up being more fun. It's more fun for everybody. We realize that people, you know, because followers. Audience comes and goes, and you get this. You hit a point where you're attracting people with all this fun stuff, but they don't really know beyond that, you know, so then you kind of have to dip back into.

You know, our mission and stuff like that. So I think that I would say, like, for us at least, it's okay to just follow those cycles. And when we begin to feel a little bit like we're being too serious or too heavy or maybe we're tired of it or we just don't know what to post, that's a good time to just. Just make it easy.

Yeah.

Yeah, I would.

I would follow suit with that too. I. I've done things like, just really simple things like, you know, go post some pictures of flowers that I saw somewhere or something. You know, something very simple where it's not like.

The deep stuff, but it also still connects because you're still gonna find people that have kind of like similar aesthetic or interest.

Or just share other posts or reels that like, speak to you with like a little comment or something like that. Because that also lets people know who you are and what you stand for without you having to make a video.

Yeah.

You know, and for me, that helps as well. Just to repost in my stories on Instagram. I have never tried. I think TikTok has stories as well. I'm such a noob on TikTok. But.

Just reposting with, as Maria said, just a little sentence or look at this. Look, look at this artist. If you like me, follow them as well. Sharing other work helps people get to know you a little bit better.

Yeah, 1,000%. So I love all this. There's a few things I want to, like, bring up to. To sort of circle back to and. And draw some lines here. One being I loved, you know, the. The goal here for everybody is connection. Right. Feeling like they're sparking something, feeling seen and heard, you know, and what do we know is that to feel seen and Heard. We have to make someone feel seen and heard. Right? Like, that's. That's especially online, you know, because our goal as, like.

For lack of better terms, leadership, you know, like, people coming to follow your journey as an artist. Like, you know, our goal is to.

Is to be there and that community is supportive, but we're not necessarily reaching to them for support. So it's like, how can I find support in them by supporting them? I don't know if that makes sense, but it's like, you know, service mentality. How do we serve them? And that'll. Because one of the main things that I remember a business mentor saying was, like, if you're trying to solve your problems, like, go solve your people's problems.

Right? There's something to that phrase that. That hit me right in the gut because I was like, oh, that's really it. That's everything. You know, if we're thinking about connecting and building community and all those things, it's like, hey, if you're having problems, like making that happen, then go solve their problems and that community will be built. Right? You build that trust and that connection through that. And from deeper to lighter. I love these lighter elements of. In your case, Brit, like, what would be the opposite? Because, I don't know, the culture. What would be the opposite of a Viking.

Princess is in ball gowns? I don't know.

Okay. Yeah. So, yeah, asking your people, like, which. Which would you prefer?

Which would you prefer to marry a Viking or a prince? Right? Like, what would be your. What would be your thing? You know, something like that.

So just looking at those things that. Those elements of your. Of who you are as an artist and what you fall into. I love the versus stuff. I think that's great. That draws, like, these really fun lines, you know, what's your favorite festivals? What's the wildest costume that you've dressed up in and show a picture of you and something, you know, really elaborate like, that could be a really fun and easy lift to draw that connection.

Yeah, I think things like that would be really. Would be really fun. And then I loved what Hannah said sort of in passing, but she said, you know, they often will have to, like, dip back into their mission. And sometimes when I find myself waning in, like, wanting to go out and be on online, it's either two things. One, I've burnt myself out, right? I'm doing it all in. In that spirit of, like.

Doing, you know, like just doing for the sake of doing. And that will burn you out, guaranteed, you know, and then the other side of it is like, if I'm feeling that weight, it's usually because I've lost touch with what I'm actually trying to do, you know, because the sales are part of it. But what's underneath that? What's the mission? What's the purpose as an artist that can be a great, a great thing to kind of lean back into. I'm sort of saying this for everybody that's maybe feeling this, you know, so Artful Corner says, I feel like I don't want to lead, I want to make friends.

Yeah, I mean, you know, you hear me say this like, you don't have to be an influencer, but you do have to have influence. If you're trying to build a business of some sort, right? So you're trying to lead them somewhere, even if it's to your stuff, does that mean, you know, so don't think of leadership as you gotta be like some presidential candidate. It's just like, what are your qualities as a leader? What are you trying to help us? Like, you know, what do you. What when you help people in your regular life, that's leading, right? What are those little things that you love to connect with people on in their day to day? That can be a great place to start. So what do you guys hear from sort of those ideas that I just kind of spit out there, all those little things.

Something occurred to me when you were speaking in reply to the Artful Corner, wanting to make friends.

Something that I've noticed that I think could be useful, but I'm not really sure. So maybe you guys have some thoughts about it, especially on Instagram. I. I've made friends with people I've never met before, kind of like you guys on Instagram, that I would feel are sort of like peers. So accounts that are similar in size.

That are putting themselves out there, whether they be artists or some other small business there, have gotten fairly good. They're kind of like, we're at the same level, I guess, pretty, pretty good at getting their message across.

I have a lot of private conversations through the DMs with these accounts, and a lot of times, not all the time, but some. Sometimes we share each other's stuff and we're sort of on each other's radar. And I'm not to say that I want to work the algorithm, but I have noticed that when I have more conversations behind the scenes with these other friends with these types of accounts.

That it kind of benefits. Like, more people see my posts after that. And I Think that if you're thinking in terms of, like, wanting to make friends.

That if you start putting yourself out there, that you're. You're gonna start to notice these other people that are sort of doing similar stuff as you and start talking to them and start commiserating with them about what it's like to be a content creator or a small business owner and just the different types of problems that occur that you might not want to directly speak to your audience about. And I think that's been, like, a little perk that I didn't realize would happen when we started to go down this direction of being content creators and sharing so much. And so that's kind of nice to have that, you know, small set of other people out there kind of doing the same thing as much like you guys. You guys are definitely in that. But there's also some other people that I've met and befriended and. And it's been really nice to see the, you know, get their point of view on things. Like when Instagram started.

Selling the verified check mark, that was a big thing. You know, we're all kind of talking about it behind the scenes, and some people subscribed and. And some people didn't, and, you know, kind of seeing what the effect was and stuff like that. So I think that that's. That's kind of a nice perk, like I said. So.

Yeah.

I feel like there's a lot of things going on, you know, like, where you could be the person who's selling stuff and the person who's providing useful information, and then you're also making friends.

Yep.

Along the way that you're not trying to sell stuff to at all. So they're just there. They're people, you know, who are doing things.

That's right. Yeah. It all sort of, like.

In a weird way, you know, when you. And. And that's why we put so much emphasis on, like, your belief systems and your. Your story and. And these elements that make you a human being, because that's, like, what's interesting to us, and that's what builds the trust and the connection, and that's what creates, you know, this idea of, like, friendships and things, you know, I'm so grateful we had our last. I'm not grateful that we had our last, but we had our last design your creative career today. And I just thought, like, I just had a moment of gratitude. Cause I was like, these are all people that I love hanging out with. Like, how cool is that that, you know, we've connected with Those people in that way. And it's. It's not by accident, you know, like, that's also, like, the neatest part is that it's very much by design that it's worked that way.

So I want to. Oh, I love this idea of dual lives. I know Susan does those as well. Her and Maria, I think, have done a couple dual lives.

This one kind of.

Super fun. So I think that's a great opportunity to kind of get used to being in front of people. If you're feeling a little, you know, quite quirky about it or, you know, a little. A little uncertain to a little. A little fearful, you couldn't always go my way. Look at your hands and not your face.

Oh, you're working.

Yeah, yeah. Like, aim the camera at your hands working, and. Yeah, and then you can read the top of your phone and answer questions. Yeah, yeah, That's a great way. Great way to do.

I have a. Another comment to what you said before, Lennon, about you know, dipping back into your mission and, you know, getting the buy and.

And I think what came to my mind is, you know, if you have a. Create a block around creating content.

Dipping back into that is actually really good because I think that brings back some of the excitement of why you're doing this. You get to do this. So you're getting into this mindset of, hey, I get to do this. I get to put this out there, and I get to share this with people, and I get to connect with people. You know, people will get to see me in my beliefs, and, you know, they will react to it, and then we get this connection. So it's kind of more of a.

Kind of hyping yourself up to making the content, because a lot of times it's like, overwhelmed with just having to create content that creates the block. Right? Because you're like, okay, I have to find the caption, I have to write the caption, I have to record the video, and I have to edit it and all this stuff, and it's. So. Yeah, but, you know, if you go back to why you're doing this and, you know, where you. What you're getting out of it or what someone else is getting out of it, this connection, you know, having that in mind. I think it also helps you be more excited for the work because it's. It's gonna be work. Like, there's no. There's obviously no silver bullet of, oh, your content is just gonna happen. That would be nice if you could just think of it, and it would.

Be there but maybe in three years, you know?

Sounds very black mirror ish.

Yeah, well, the world looks a little black mirror ish to me right now.

No, I agree with that, Maria. I think it's. It's so important to remind ourselves of that. And a lot of times I'll even find, like, every time I go back and look at my why, I'm, like, it goes a level deeper. It's like, oh, it's shifted a little bit. You know, that can be really neat. So I want to talk about this thing that Susan mentioned, which is like, the things we put a lot of energy into, and they don't reach who we want it to reach. You know, like, and then when we just sort of half ass something and that seems to work, like.

What do you find? Like, why do you make the things that take you more time to make, Susan? What. What's. What's the reason for that? Why are you putting more effort into certain things?

I think because there's a certain feeling that I want to evoke from the people that are seeing it. It's like I want to take them down a little path and tell them a little story. And I'm, you know, like a lot of creators, the editing process is not my most favorite part, you know, but it's something I understand. It's a tool that I need to be good at. So when I get an idea for how to present something, I think, okay, I can tell this little story. I can, you know, and I've learned from the last one how to make it even better. And, yeah, I just, I want to take them on a particular journey. And I, you know, it's like when I get the. The sound bites to happen at just the right, you know, beats, and I feel like it's got an emotional impact. I was like, oh, this is awesome. I make my husband come out and, you know, watch it. It's like, it's only two minutes, really. You can watch it. And, you know, it's like it all feels like it all comes together and it's. I get nice feedback, but it's just. And I know probably part of it is if that's the kind of stuff that's going out on Instagram or on YouTube, it's a. It's a, you know, it's another battle. It's another algorithm battle. Whereas the other day, you know, I just posted, I was making a mess in my studio, trying to clean things up, and I just literally did a, you know, 20 second video. Here's my mess. And here's what I'm working on, which is something that I seem to do every few months, and that's gotten tons of engagement because everybody can relate to that.

Mm.

Hmm. Okay.

So people. Go ahead. Go ahead.

Well, I wanted to, because I kind of felt like I sounded rather mercenary. You know, I was saying, you know, trying to drive people to the money, you know, and saying, but we are all in business and making money. But honestly, it does come back to the service mentality that you and I. I remember when I first started working with you, I had the hardest time. I still sometimes struggle with it, but had the hardest time connecting a service mentality with making art and getting my message out there. And I do agree with you that that's the mentality that we need to maintain.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay, so I. I want to flip this right a little bit.

Just talk a little bit about this. So. So what you said is you want to evoke a feeling. You don't necessarily love the editing process, but you end up, like, putting a lot of extra time and effort into it. And then you have this moment where you're really excited about it and then it flops. And then you're like, oh, shit. Well, this sucks. And then you go and make a little thing about cleaning, and everybody's like, well, I can relate to that. That seems really normal. And then that gets way more views or whatever.

Yeah.

Okay, so.

What'S. When you make this other one that you're trying to evoke a feeling? What. What. What does that piece look like? What are you typically talking about?

Trusting myself in the process. Trusting that I know the art that I am creating.

Doing it for the joy of process, not for trying to.

Drive, you know, drive a sale. It's mostly just to remind people that, you know, I want them to create whatever it is that they want to create. If it's decorating a cake, you know, that's a creative avenue. I want them to create because it brings them joy to create and then to share it because it's scary to share it. And when you share it, then it's out there in the world and it's out there forever. But you might inspire somebody else to be brave too.

Yeah. Okay. Sounds like great advice. Maybe you should listen to that.

Thank you, Lori. She's one of my tribe. That message gets across to me.

It's so true, though, Lennon. We always have the best advice for each other. But, you know, it's like, okay, I should really do what I'm saying.

Well, can I give a quick shout out I see so many people that are here from my group and thank you guys for showing up. I really appreciate you.

Yes. Susan has the, the best like people.

I have an awesome community. I have an awesome.

You do. You really do. Yeah. So I want to say like, you know.

Because here's the thing about editing, because I agree. You know, here's the thing about editing anything to create something we love, right?

That's the part that becomes like we're being so thoughtful when we edit. We're being so thoughtful to like and thinking so much of, you know, like, okay, I'm going into this thing of like really trying to craft something that's to me that's the difference. You know, when you get into an editing state, you're trying to craft something that's interesting, you know. And then when that doesn't necessarily hit the nail on the head, it's like it almost feels like you did it all for not. You know, it's like, okay, well why did I put all that effort into it? And this goes back to your thing that you just said, which is like, what's the pros part of the process that you, that you find joy in? You know. And this is where I come back to.

Because you know, the. My wild backyard. He says like something about editing. It was up here basically, like that's when the story can come together, which is true, right? Like for many of us, the editing is what creates the opportunity to find that story. But also it can be incredibly frustrating when we're in that stage of how do I figure out what I need to edit or what needs to get cut or what should go wherever when we're putting that level of it means something. The views mean something. That's where it all of a sudden starts to fall. And so for any of you that are like putting a bunch of time and effort into something, my motto is, and some people will stand against me on this, get, just get better at saying your message without an edit. If you can get really good at speaking your message without editing, like your self editing.

Then you're going like the edit can be. Can only go better, right? And that's, that's a process. That's why I like short form video as a building block. Because you, if you can learn to say something really well in 30, 60 seconds, you know, then your, your extended version of that, that's really. It can be really valuable.

Exactly that. G. And this. I haven't talked about this really much, but I. As part of my artist's way journey, I Started writing some stand up material, which is really weird for me, by the way, because I'm not.

Don't say anything about.

Is like a. It is like that for me because I'm having the same fear as what you're talking about, Susan, that I'm going to spend all this time crafting something and then nobody will laugh at it. Right. And so what was it worth for me? And so I'm having to come to this place of like, what is it worth? What is. What am I gaining, you know, in, in that process, what is a part? And maybe that's a good question to ask you, Susan, like in the process of editing, which is what, from what I hear, not something you do as often. Mostly it's like live streams and other things. So what is the benefit of that process for you?

I will say that the last few videos that I have really worked at editing and combining my music with my message, I have learned something each time about timing, about looking for the. I mean, so much of it is because, you know, I'm. That's just not my arena. I haven't played, you know, so I am very much, you know, a basic editor and I'm using a basic system because I don't want to complicate my life anymore. I used to use a more complicated editor and I decided, no, I need to simplify things. So I think each. And I do give myself credit. I mean, each time I'll finish it, even if it flops. It's like, I don't care that it flopped. I. I'll go back and rewatch videos that I've done because I'm so proud of the way the whole thing came together. So that makes me feel good, that gives me confidence, and I carry that forward into the next thing I do.

I love that. And I think that that's what we have to, to kind of come back to on those moments where something flops. It's like, okay, what were my wins in this? What's to be learned? What's the data that I can collect here.

And, and not be afraid of it as like. Because in a business sense, for instance, we're about to experiment with ads for the first time. So grungy girl, what's considered a flop? That's up to you. Like, I. My flop is probably different from your flop. It's probably different from Hannah and Nemo's, you know, so that's a pretty personal question. I know people that are like, I got a thousand views, you know, and I'm like, okay, so, you know, the thing. The thing for me that. That I've been thinking about is, like, we're going to experiment with ads.

And.

I.

I haven't told this story a ton. I spent $10,000 the last time we tried to do ads. It's a lot of money, y', all, especially for me. Like, I am like, oh, my gosh. So. And I did it because I had professionals help me, and they essentially neglected to tell me how bad. I mean, this was, what, three years ago or something? They essentially neglected to tell me how bad my landing page and my. All my, like, stuff was. Like, my messaging was horrible, and.

They just didn't tell me. And I was like, we could. I'd probably still be spending money with them if they would have told me that, you know, and we figured it out. And so.

I'm stepping into that with the same mentality that you're talking about, Susan, which is like this thing of, if I put all this time and effort and money into this thing and it flops, is it worth it? And I'm having to remind myself that, yes, it's worth it, because.

That'S the next level of my process. That's the next element that I need to master. And so then we all just kind of have to ask ourselves that question, like, is this really what I want to do or not?

Yeah.

And there's no wrong answer to that. What I say to everybody is the pace at which you grow will be different for everybody. Right. And there are certain elements that will help you grow faster, for sure, become a better storyteller. You know, do those things have great messaging, all that stuff that's going to help you grow, but the rate at which you do that will be different from someone else, and your zone of genius will be different from someone else. And I mean, I. As we've been watching a ton of artists recently on YouTube, specifically, man, I'm telling you, some of them, they don't do anything exciting in the edit and it. And it just crushes, you know, because we just connect with them as people, and they're just so natural in that. So, yeah. What do you hear from all that, Susan, if anything?

Well, I think you're. Several things. One, we can't play the compare game, and we always need to remind ourselves, or at least I always need to remind myself of that. Don't play the compare game, because nobody ever wins, and you're always going to be disappointed. And, yeah, what's right for one person is not going to be right for another person. And TikTok is not for me. And I admire the people that are doing it. I don't like to go on there to watch anything. So even though I experimented with it, I quickly learned it wasn't an avenue for me. But the last few years of working with you have really helped me hone in on myself as an artist and as a mostly fearless communicator. And so I feel confident that I understand my people and my tribe and my message and I need to just. And I don't like certain forms of content, so. So it's like I don't need to try and make those, you know, if really funny things is really effective for other people, that's great. But I've been told since I was four years old I'm too serious. I'm not going to be making funny stuff. It's going to flop because it's not me. It's not authentic, you know, so, yeah, there just. It's just more confidence every day with everything I try. But if I don't try, I'm not going to grow.

Yeah, yeah. And I, I want to. I want to. Just, Just for me, this is my, my. I can't speak for everybody here, but my fairy treasure says, I think we have to remember we only have so much control over people seeing our videos. That YouTube controls our videos. Reach. Yes. And. Right. I'm very much a believer that that is true. And also we have more control than we give ourselves credit for because there's a difference. And I'm not. Not pointing the finger saying this is the statement, but there's a difference in.

Trying to become a better communicator because it will help. It just truly will. I've seen it too many times versus, like. Well, it's not really my, you know, it's not really my fault. I think we have to have some ownership over that and that helps me personally just stay sane. It's like, okay, you know, I can fix this. I'm not fighting an algorithm. So when in our community we don't even. We don't even talk about the algorithm. Like, you'll hear. We don't even talk about it, you know, because why, like, what's the point? That's how I feel anyway.

So.

Yeah, so that I, I think that that's just kind of where I, I sit on that personally. So I've seen some people talk about this idea of, like, my message. I don't really know what that is. Sandy said that I'm actually doing a workshop on this stuff in like 20 minutes.

So if anybody wants to join it. Yeah, if you want to join it, it's absolutely free. But we're going to talk about the seven ways that you could potentially double your sales as an artist in the next 90 days through what we're talking about now, which is like understanding your audience, understanding your message, figuring out, like, what you have to say as a human being, not just, like, what your work is and where those two things meet.

So if you want to join, you can. There's no, I don't, I obviously don't.

Don'T mind if you don't, but there you go. That's, that's the link. If you don't want to, or if you'd like to join us. But we're doing it today and tomorrow, so.

About 90 minutes long.

So I just want to drop a little encouragement bomb to everybody watching and say that, you know, and call out, like, just working with a whole ton of creative people at this stage.

Our blocks, 90% of the time are, are, are, are based around our fears.

Right? I, I, maybe even so far as to say, like 99 of the time, like, when we are blocked, we are afraid of something. So being willing to ask the question of what am I actually afraid of? Because it ain't. You're not actually afraid of not getting views. That's not the thing you're afraid of. You're. Maybe if you're like me, you're afraid. Well, maybe I'm not. People won't actually like what I have to say. Maybe I'm not that interesting. Right. And what we try to look at is.

Where can we collect the evidence that says otherwise? Because it's there, it exists. We're just really bad at noticing it.

And so one of the exercises that we do early on in our community, I don't think we've actually done it in a while, is to go to people that you know and ask them, like, what do you bring, what do you bring to the, to the room? Like, what, what do people love about you? That's a hard question to ask. For some people, it feels really uncomfortable. But just going to a friend and saying, hey, when I show up, like, what shows up with me? How do I show up?

Try it. I dare you. Ask five people. See what they say. Ask them in person. You can't. Or call them. You can't send it in a text or an email, but ask them, when I show up in a room, what shows up with me? And some, somebody here is watching and saying, I don't know what that means. Okay, think about it, right? When you show up, what shows up with you? Don't let them.

Like, they'll say, well, what do you want me to say? Essentially, which really is like, well, what do you mean? That's what they're really saying is what do you want me to say? That's what they're saying. Do not answer. Repeat the question. When I show up in a room, what shows up with me and see what happens most. Every time I've done this, and I got this from my coach, Ellen Rowan, every time I've done this.

Somebody in the class cries, if not a couple people, you know? So it's. It's super interesting because what we're looking for here is patterns like, oh, more people than I thought. And this is me. I had more people say, lyndon, you're a really great leader. And I was like, what? What are you talking about? I had no idea. Lennon, you're really great at, like, facilitating. Like, you're a good listener and a facilitator of conversation. Really insane, right? And that's why I started doing this business the way that I do it, which is way more community. We do more live calls because it's like, oh, that's the thing I'm. I'm good at, so why not lean into it? And I believe we all have those things, and I think those things show up in the way we make content. Those things show up in the way we make our art. Those things show up in everything we do. And the more that we trust those instincts that we may not even see as interesting right now or we may not see as valuable, but when we trust that those exist and lean into them, something changes.

We build confidence, as Susan's talked about. Right? And that confidence goes so far, so so far. So I just don't encourage everybody to go check that out, because you. You've got something in there that's, like, really, really impressive that you may not even recognize right now. So anything anybody wants adds to that as we kind of land this plane.

Go take the free workshop. It's so worth it. You know, it's 90 minutes. Yes. But it. You are going to be empowered. Going to sit in on the next one for sure.

Awesome. Yeah, it's gonna be super fun.

Anything anybody else got?

Okay. Thank y'.

All.

Thank you, Hannah. Nemo. Thanks, Susan. Thanks, Maria. Thanks, Britt. Susan, in terms of. I haven't forgotten the fact that you've, like, talked a little bit about, like, the artist versus the teacher.

That's A big.

That.

That's a big one that I want to, like, discuss in our. In our private meeting, because I. Yeah. I want to say that I believe you, that you are naturally both. That's. That's how I feel.

And, you know, that. That feels like really.

You. You are. You are a natural giver. You know what I mean? And the way you show up, even if it's not practical stitch teaching or whatever, like, you are a teacher of how to navigate what to, like, you know, like, all these things. And so, to me, that's as much a part of your art form as the work that you make.

Period, you know?

Thank you.

Oh, I think you absolutely can be both.

Cool step in the group.

Yeah. Do it. Because I want to. Yeah. I think this is something that I definitely. Next week we can talk. Maybe talk more about. Take a couple extra minutes, but. Yeah, come hang out, y'. All. Appreciate you again. You can go to. I'll put it in the chat.

Stop the starving artist dot com.

When you sign up, you'll get an email back right away with the links and the times for today and tomorrow.

Seven steps.

Yeah, you'll get an email and then the zoom link. So, yeah, we start in 15 minutes for the. For the first one, and then the other one is tomorrow at 11:00am.

Central Time, same as Chicago, Illinois. All right, tons of love to y'.

All.

Thanks for coming and hanging out and poking the bear at some of these things. I hope that those of y' all that are hanging with us got something from it.

Cool.

Thank you.

Bye, everybody.

Bye.

Bye.