Luxury Small Business Success Story: Justluxe.com – SBS 50

Greetings folks and welcome to the Small business show at businessshow. Co. This is episode number 50, the Big Five Zero for us here on Wednesday, January 20, 2016 here in Durham, New Hampshire, I'm Dave Hamilton.

And in Lafayette, California, I am Shannon Jean. And I'm shocked that it's episode 50. That's pretty good.

Yeah, I didn't really think about it until I said it and then it was wow. Yeah, we've been doing this a while.

Yeah.

Sort of celebration, some kind of celebratory something or other. Yeah, yeah. And hey, today we are joined by a good friend of mine, Rob Guterow from JustLux.com Rob is the CEO at Just Lux. It's J U S T l u x e.com and Rob, thanks for hanging out with us today.

Thanks for the invitation and on your 50th episode.

Yeah, that's pretty special. We'd like to say we plan to have you on, on that one, but.

Never, never but mentioned last week the universe planned that for us.

That's right.

It was all.

We tried.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, we tried, we tried. So Rob, we're going to talk a little bit about today about Just Lux, what you guys do now. But I also, you know, we want to chat about your history. Rob is a long time entrepreneur, business owner, you know, startup guy and very resilient in. I've watched him over the years do many, many different things and I know it'll be, you know, great to share with our listeners today. So tell us about Just Lux. What do you guys do? What's the site do, how long you've been around? Give us a little background.

We've been around since 2004 and it's a luxury website publication, a lifestyle guide for the affluent, if you will. And we write about new and trendy products, luxury cars, yachts, fashion, travel, the things that you would expect an affluent person to want to read.

Nice.

You know, we put in, we post probably 3 to 500 articles a month to keep them, to keep the content fresh on our site. So it's, we're always busy and you know, we also do some creative work as well for some of our advertisers. So that um, you know, it's fun. We're never, never a dull moment.

So I, that's a lot of content.

Yeah, I, I have, I, I have some very specific questions about this for you because of course, you know, part of my life is publishing a website called Mac observer which we've been doing for a long time, like 1998, I guess, is when we, when we started. But. So I'm, I'm curious how you. I'm curious about a lot of things, in fact, but I'll, I'll start with your staff. So do you have full timers on your staff? Are you contracting it out, you know, per article kind of thing, on the, you know, a 1099 type of basis? How, how do you, how do you generate those 300 to 500 articles a month?

Yeah, currently we have a staff of four, basically editors that also do a little bit of writing, and then we have probably 50 freelancers that keep them busy in, you know, we have contributors, we have a community, and it's got something like 20,000 members in it. Okay, so. So that'll put another hundred or 200 pieces of articles into our site as well. Sure. So our editors stay busy. You know, two years ago I had double the staff, but lately we're, we're sort of doing a relaunch. And so we're where we're at in, you know, anticipating to have to double that staff, so.

Well, that's a good thing.

Yeah, yeah. And you know how it is to try to handle and edit and get content, fresh content into your site, so.

Yeah. Oh, no, it's, it's not easy. And it. You, you know, especially when you have so many different people writing content for you, you. You need to preserve the voice of your publication. And, and that, that's probably the hardest job for your editors.

Yeah, we're going through that right now. We just brought on board a couple, the business development guy and a new editor out of New York. We haven't been there before and they have a lot of experience and, and this is what we're working on now to make sure we maintain that voice and add a lot of quantity but quality at the same time. You know, we're trying to grow this. There's a lot of big publications out there that, you know, that are selling for millions of dollars and it'. Why, you know, we should be setting ourselves up to do the same.

Yeah.

And so we have a, you know, we have a plan in place here for the next three or four months to kind of deal with that and get us to a next level.

So. And I totally understand why you either would or wouldn't want to answer this next question, but my curiosity makes me ask it. How many page views or how many unique visitors per month are you doing on this site? I mean, you've been around almost 12 years now.

Yeah, we're doing well. We've had bigger years. You know, advertising dollars have slowed down from us, so. But when.

Welcome to the club.

Yeah, I was gonna say, you're not alone.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. 2012, we kind of said, oops, what happened to that?

It was nothing like 2001, I will tell you that. 2012, we saw the same kind of dip, but 2001, man, that was when things really kind of cratered.

So yeah, I had a travel company as well at that time. It was like we had a website and we were in the travel business and that went bye bye.

Wow, you had the double whammy then. That sucks.

Yeah, yeah. Well, we, we switched it up real quick. We got into computers and, and that saved the day. Smart. Yeah. So yeah, I was going to say, you know, you get your traffic from marketing as well. It's not just all organic, you know, so. But currently we' about 800,000 unique level a month and you know, we do two and a half to three page views.

Yeah.

So we can support the advertiser, you know, I mean, because you know how it is based on banners and. But we're changing that up too. I mean it's all content, native content now and we're doing sponsored in creating content hubs for brands now. You know, mini microsites. We've always done those but now it's changed to more content and native content. So we're not writing about the brand. You're writing about things that people would read about and then the brand makes sense to have their sponsored advertisement placement and. Right. You know, where they're, where they're reading the content.

Sure.

So that's the direction that we're going now.

So you talked about.

I was. Well, I mean I can, I can probably keep Rob busy for about three hours here as we chit chat as publishers. But there is one more question and then, and then maybe we'll come back to more these. But. But I'm curious. So you mostly monetize and I get it that you're transitioning from, you know, banners as kind of the, the bread and butter to more sponsorships and like you said, microsites. How much on your banner business? How much of it are you selling direct on your. Do you have your own sales force and if so, are you selling it direct or are you just kind of leaving it open to the various marketplaces like a Google Adsense or you know, a tribal fusion or those types of things.

And you know, you're. We used to, when we first started, really starting to be a business, you Know, we started this in 2004, I'd say 2006, 2007, when we hired a rep firm that really turned things around for us. And so, you know, that's when we started to get these brand advertisers and the microsites and stuff like that that came to us and that we had to support with traffic, etc. So now we still have that same rep firm.

But which refer is it? Yeah, I run a rep firm, so, you know, I'm curious about this stuff. So this is good.

Yeah, it's called RGM Group.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it was sold in 2012 and with it went the top sales guy. And so since that time we, you know, our, you know, big thing now is, is we now have to get a local sales group, our own sales group, and do more of that. But we're also trying to work with them too, because of the. The landscape has changed the way things are for advertisers in content, native content and stuff like that, they have to change. And, and so they're starting to bring us more of that and underst. Their salespeople are understanding what has to be sold out there. It's not a banner business anymore and they can't compete with it either.

Right.

Like you said, there's just so many other companies that all they do is supply the banner impressions to websites.

Yeah. No, and you're, you're smart to work with a rep firm, and I'm not here to pitch you on ours because you need one that's in the right niche for your content. And RJM is absolutely, or at least is, and certainly was, and probably still is the right firm. And so it, you know, I always tell publishers when they start getting frustrated, like, oh, this isn't working. You've got to work. You know, it's a partnership with your rep firm. And it sounds like you're, you're right on board with that, which is great.

Well, Dave will talk about your rep firm after the call. Yeah.

Some other time. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not convinced Stars is the right one for you, but maybe it is. That's right.

Yeah. Never know. You never know.

So let me jump back and let's talk about the business in general. You made a comment. You know, you started in 2004 and 2006, 2007 was when you started to really feel like you had a real viable business. Is that.

Yep, that's right.

Okay, so what, what were those, you know, along the way? So those first couple of years what, you know, what was leading you along the way till you said, okay, we gotta eventually hire a rep firm to get us out there. And, you know, did you have benchmarks that you were meeting or. You know, I know there's so many people out there building, trying to build companies, whether it's a publishing, you know, platform like you have or something else that are looking for, okay, when do I. When does it really turn on?

Yeah, we were, we were really doing classifieds and, you know, trying to, to reach out to a brand or a yacht company or whatever that was. I see we're writing small product articles and stuff like that and trying to support it with classified ads on the, on the, on the side or however you could present, you know, a list to, to make some money on it. And so, you know, it was going to be hard to grow that and there was no future there. So I brought one of my brothers on board and we started to develop more on the writing side and just more of a publication and, and found the rep firm. You know, he was in. His niche was luxury and he was like waiting for us. It was like a dream come true for, for both companies. And, you know, he was super aggressive and I wish I would have restricted him as far as what he could bring to the table at times because, you know, your servers get blown out when you have to create too much traffic to support a whole lot of banners, you know.

Sure.

Have you ever had that issue, Dave?

Oh, yeah, well, yeah, yeah, you need a good geek on staff or in the organization to manage that stuff. Yeah, yeah. In fact, that's how our rep firm got started. Because it. 17 years ago, you couldn't call. You didn't. There was no such thing as cloud hosting or scalability or, you know, I mean, that was. These were terms nobody understood. So. Yeah, we've experienced it. Yeah, it happens for sure.

Yeah.

Yeah. Cool. So along the way, so you're, you know, you're getting started, and I know you have a long history of businesses and we always ask people, okay, go back to where, you know, this transition between, you know, working for somebody else versus starting on your own. You know, what got you into that startup mode where you thought, okay, let's start some. And I know you've done a varied, you know, wide variation of, of entities. What was the, the impetus for you to go out on your own and get started and want to do your own thing?

Well, for me, it was just. It just happened. You know, it was just survival. You know, I just, I wound up at the. At the right place and things went wrong there. But I saw an opportunity, and I walk through the door and every adventure runs its course, but you have to see the next opportunity that presents and be able to walk through that door and do it. And for some reason, I've always just, you know, had the guts to do it. And, you know, it wasn't based on, oh, let's research this and get all this analytics and, you know, does it make sense? It just, you know, you just have to. You just have an idea and a thought and a Women of prayer, you know.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Well, I really like that comment you made where you said, things have a life cycle, they run their course. Because I think that that's really a very common thing. And you do always have to be thinking about what is the next thing we're moving into, as maybe parts of your business migrate away or stop, and then you have other things or a new business altogether. And I've seen you do that kind of over and over and over again, you know, looking for opportunities and when one falls off, you know, move on to the next one. And I think the key is, you know, resilience. And can you talk to, you know, all of us that have been in business have had really tough times. Hopefully we have good times as well. You know, what keeps you moving when it looks like everything's imploding around you and you're the guy that has it all on your shoulders besides, you know, besides having a drink.

Yeah, let's see. Not sleeping at night. Yeah, that's right. Dreading Monday morning. Actually, it is just the people, you know, really, you know, there's not a lot in the publication business. There's not necessarily a lot of profit in it, and it has its ups and downs. So, you know, I have people that. That started here in 2004, still here, you know, in, you know, this. The story I tell is, you know, how I got my writers was, one was a bartender at the Palms and the other was a wait. And, you know, so they came and they were journalists with degrees, and so they came working for me. And, you know, that's really how we started into the, you know, building more content and all that kind of stuff and then finding a little bit more experienced people and. But it's really, I don't know, it's just I like to come to work and there's, you know, I used to work at home and it. It gets lonely and, you know, so, you know, you're thankful that you can still create a paycheck for them every day and are every week. And it is a lot of pressure and you just, you just have to be built to deal with it.

Yeah, that's great. That's a great, you know, motivation in good times and in bad times. Right. Thinking about the people you've created, this team, I mean, small businesses, it's almost like a family. I mean, spend often more times with these folks that work for you than you do at home. Right?

Yeah. And you, you know, it's like when you feel like giving up, you know, you, you, you, you just, you don't you say, you know what? I'm going to make this thing work the way it should work. And that, you know, we're. And after the, after the little dive in 2012 with, with the revenue and all that kind of stuff and you tighten your belt a little bit and, and you know, then, you know, so this is, it ran its course and now we're doing, we've just relaunched the website. It's brand new, it's modern. You know, everything is big images and, you know, everything that you see now on the Internet is mobile friendly. It's, you know, we're doing all those things for social promotion and just we're going to make one big shot at it and one more and, you know, and we have a. I have a goal now. I don't think that I've ever really had set a goal and said I want to achieve this and this is where I want to be and this is my dream. And, you know, so even at this later stage in my life, I still have that and I'm really primed and excited and look at, look at me, I'm talking to you. And I've never done this before. I'm the guy behind the scenes, you know. Yeah. So this is a step out for me.

That's good.

Well, and, and maybe part of your, your new content picture is a podcast someday, right at the website.

Yeah.

You know, there you go. I mean, that, that's growing as well. And so, yeah, everything is open and it's just, how do you, you know, everybody has ways that they promote this, their business in this world today. It is crazy. I don't understand half of it. I mean, it's so much out there. So podcasts, I. For you.

That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That's, that's great. So, you know, we always, we always talk about stories here and, you know, good things happen or bad things happen. And one of the things that we always ask folks that, come on Is, you know, what's the best mistake you've ever made? Whether it was with just Lux or another, you know, company that you've ran. What mistake? That you can look back now and kind of shake your head. And what taught you the most?

I would, you know, as. As good as it was, it was. It was hiring the rep firm because. Because it, you know, we had to deal with issues, big issues. You know, we were working with major brands and we could not fail. And we got into actually doing the creative work for them and working with their agencies. And so we had to build a creative side of this business where, you know, our eye had to meet their eye and match their eye. And so we had to be really good creative house fast. And so that was a good. And I still, we still do that today. And that's really where my expertise is in the creative side and where I have fun, you know. And we do. We do a lot of business for outside. For outside work on the creative side. And so that. That's the fun part of it as well. And it keeps us going, actually.

I see. Yeah. Well, that's great. And is. Are you currently running just one business right now or do you have multiple. Your hands in different. Different pots, if you will?

Well, it's. My other business is still going, but it's a family business.

Good.

So, you know, it makes it easy to trust who you're leaving in charge over there. And it allows me to focus on what I'm doing here with JustLocks. And it's good for them, too, because I don't have to be around them all the time. And I think they. They kind of love that. So it works good for both of us.

That's great. That's good. And so, you know, as business owners, you know, when we talk about here all the time, you know, cash is king. And it's a great, you know, rubric for measuring some of your. Some types of success. But everyone has their own different definition of it. You know, how do you measure success? What's the artic you've come up with? Maybe beyond that.

You know, I kind of feel like I've, you know, just. We've already talked about it, you know, just. It's just the people coming in every week and knowing that they're here and they stay with me. And I guess they. They must like me because I don't pay them. You know, some of them can obviously find more somewhere else, but I think they're comfortable with it and that's good. But we try to make it fun and keep it relaxed. It's nice to have, you know, you say, you know, cash is king. Well, it's not necessarily king here. We want it to be. And we've had. We've had those good years, but to me, it's just the success of just being able to come in and, you know, like, we just moved one of our offices and attached it to our main office here. So it's just doing things like that that make everything run better.

That's great. I think, you know, that's a huge part of it, is that, that, you know, like we said, like I mentioned that kind of family feeling and building a team and coming in every day and seeing that, I think that's a huge reward. And I would totally agree with you that that's definitely a measurement of, of your success, for sure.

And. And to your point, I mean, it's the way to keep employees around because no matter how much you pay someone, there's always someone that can pay them more, maybe doing a slightly different job, whatever, you know, whatever that is. But yeah, you, you. I mean, that's. That's how we run our shops here. Is. Is it. We're family. Do you do anything, you know, to that end you do like company, I don't know, retreats or events or anything to sort of, you know, regularly cement that idea of family outside of the workplace?

Yeah, not as much as we should. Yeah. The last couple of years, we. We would, you know, every September we'd have the picnic and, you know, of course, Christmas and Thanksgiving and things like that, but we haven't the last couple years. But, you know, we. We do things internally. We do potlucks and things like that on a regular basis, you know, so everybody can get together and bring their food and chit chat and have a beer, you know.

Yeah. Not to not. Yeah, yeah. Socialize over something other than that, which you. You're gonna do in the morning.

Yeah. Right. Yeah.

That's good. I like that. Hey, so you talk. When I asked you a question about multiple businesses, you talked a little bit about your. Your other, you know, family business. Can we talk about that for a minute?

Sure.

I promise I'll tell those guys not to listen. Yeah, you can say what you like.

So I'm sure that'll work.

Yeah.

Especially if you tell them specifically what not to listen to. So it's the 24 minute mark here, Shannon. That's right.

Okay, perfect. So what do you do? What's that company as G4 Design House.

And, you know, it's sort of, you know, we, we love, we had a membership thing there and we grew that into more of a design house where we were building websites for small business owners. And we put a little different niche on it as far as we allow somebody to. We'll build somebody's website on monthly payments stretched out over a two year period so they're not having to come up with 5, $10,000 for a website. You know, it works well. We get, we just do, you know, minimum marketing through search engines or whatnot. And we convert very well as far as, you know, on leads. So we've gotten like, we've built 350 websites in the last two years.

That's great.

Wow. Yeah. And now we're getting into, you know, the SEO, the marketing side of it for the customers. And so we used to use an outside person on the SEO, but we had somebody come in and house and train us on how to, to do the proper SEO work, because it changes all the time. So anyway, so those, those are things that we've learned over two or three years too. Just because that was a new business. Just like me starting just Lux, without a publisher or somebody that, you know, knew the business. It's like, you know, crazy. Why would you do that? But, you know, that's what we do.

Yeah, that's great. Well, it seems like it's taking your skill set that you guys have developed over time and then just expanding and doing different things with it.

Expanding, yes. It's all, it's all very similar. Right. And you go through the two years and then you tighten things up and, you know, just like, you know, yesterday, we come up with a list of things. Okay, here's fees that we're gonna have to charge to make this a profitable business. So you just, you're always learning. You got it. You got to regroup and get organized now.

That's awesome. I think that's great. All right, let me hit you with one of our favorites. If you could go back when you were just getting started and just in, it could be your current business or something else, what critical piece of information, maybe just when you're getting started in the business world and your first company, if you could go back now and talk to that young guy that's hustling and working 80 hours a week, what would you tell yourself? Based on what you know now, other than not to do it, what would you, what would you tell yourself?

Well, because I get into businesses that I don't necessarily always have full knowledge of, I would to make sure that I find that person and make that person part, you know, of those businesses and of that growth. And when I have found and had that person, whether it's the rep, company or whatever, to help drive that business and to be the voice of that, I would always try to find that person because I can work the trenches, you know, and I think that we would have succeeded a little bit quicker on some of the things that we've done in the past. And now I kind of am applying that for the, for us here, so. And company as well. Finding somebody that knows how to go out and pitch an agency on a high end website that might cost a hundred thousand dollars, you know, they spend those kinds of money and, but we need, we need that person with experience, so we are looking for that as well.

Experience in a Rolodex, right?

Yes, exactly. That's exactly what it is.

Yeah.

Bring the money and guess what, you can reap the reward.

That's right. Yeah. Well, you know, I found the same thing and being a trenches guy, as you said, you're probably a perfectionist. Right. And you know what to do to execute. But like you, I found that it's good to get involved in businesses that I don't know things about because then I'm less tempted to micromanage the process. Know, like you said, bring somebody in that knows what to do and trust them to do it and that can be a valuable thing. Yeah.

And then the next valuable thing is patience, you know, how do you do that? Yeah, you want it done?

Let me know when you figure, Let me know when you figure that out.

I know. You know, especially when you're building a website. I mean like we were building this website over the last four or five months here, you know, and, and I have to wait for developers and programmers and take deep breaths and say, okay, I want to be here. You know, this is where we should be after two months and you know, that kind of stuff. So yeah, it takes patience and, and.

You know, it's not easy.

Yeah, yeah, I've been, lately I've been using, you know, talking to a few other guys that own companies and I really come to the realization that as a business owner, you often need to be delusional. You know, you, you really need to create your own reality and, and then you kind of pull everybody, you know, like, like you said, you're in the trenches, you're, you're building the reality right there and bringing in all these people and you know, it sounds like you've done that over and over.

Yeah, because you're. You're the one that on Sunday night that's sitting there trying to go to sleep and going, okay, we can do this. This is. We can do this. Right? Yeah. It's like. Because you get. It's hard when you're relying on a rep company or somebody else to bring in the funds. Right. And you're not doing it yourself. So there. There comes back to patience. But at the same time, you know that you're going to present something and get it so presentable that nobody can say no to it. And so that's your delusion. But, yeah, it's fun. I like it.

You know, that's great. That's. That's the best part, that you still enjoy it, you know, and that's the key to everything. When you start not having a good time, you got to change something up and, you know, do something else.

Yeah, well, you know, I've given it. Let's go another three years. Okay. Yeah. And, yeah, you know, I think that we'll get to where we have to be with just Lux and. And the company as well. And, you know, I want to stick around doing something I like. You know, nobody's going to retire.

Oh, yeah, that's boring. Nobody wants to do that.

I can't imagine what that would be like.

Yeah.

I mean, don't get me wrong, there are moments where I catch myself imagining what that would be like. But. But I don't actually want that. Yeah, yeah.

I'll just take a vacation and you come back and then you come back.

That's it. Yeah, exactly. You're like, oh, yeah, I'm done with that. Let's go. Yeah, exactly.

Got it.

Well, great.

Well, you know, Dave, unless you have any other questions, you know, I've really enjoyed having you on today, Rob. I know our listeners are gonna, you know, will enjoy hearing your story and.

Well, at least the family members.

Yeah, yeah, that's right.

Yeah.

And like I said, I commend your resilience to me. That's the, you know, the message over and over and over again is, you know, people that aren't in business for themselves or haven't had that experience often look at small business owners, oh, what's he doing now? Type thing. And, you know, it's like, well, man, that's exciting what you're doing now. That's new. And, you know, you're not doing the same old thing. And so that's awesome. It's a great story. We've enjoyed having you on Sounds to.

Me like you guys are doing the same. Thank you for inviting me.

Thanks, Rob. And you're absolutely right. Yeah. Thanks, Rob. Thanks, Everybody, for listening. FeedbackusinessShow Co is where you can send in your questions to us. We can pass them along to Rob. Rob, where can people find you? Or maybe JustLux.com is the right place.

JustLux.com is perfect.

Perfect.

Great.

Thanks so much for joining us. We'll see you next time.