Orchid Insanity Founder Dean Hung

Greetings, folks, and welcome to episode 335 here of the Small Business show at BusinessShow. CO. I am eager to get. I like hearing from nerds and we have a nerd on the show today. And I see that with like all the pride I can muster.

Not a tech tech nerd, but a nerd. About his very unique business and the way he sells it and the products that he sells, I've wanted to had them on a long time.

We've just upset all the grammar nerds out there because you can't have something be very unique. There are no degrees of uniqueness. It is binary. It is binary. I get that pointed out to me all the time by my grammar nerd friends and I'm a grammar nerd, but that's when I screw up all the time. It is not a unique.

I'm looking forward to hearing from Dean Hung about his company and I'm also looking forward to sharing a bit of reciprocity to our listeners at the end of the show.

But what, what Shannon means by those fancy words is that we've got something to give you and we'll tell you at the end of the show what that is. So. But it really is truly something of value. So yeah, listen, and, and, and then you can do it. So perfect. Are you ready to small business, my friend?

I am ready to small business.

He is Shannon Jean. I'm Dave Hamilton and this is is episode 335 of the Small Business Show.

You know, we love getting a chance to talk to just all kinds of business owners on this show, especially ones that have carved out a really unique niche. You know, I always say the riches are in the niches. I'm sure I stole that from somebody. And today we get a chance to sit down with Dean Hung, founder of Orchid Insanity. And Dean has built this fascinating business.

I can already hear the niche. I mean, it's like, it's perfect.

Yeah, it's an awesome business selling orchid orchids online on his website, on ebay and on Etsy. And you know, the more I look at him, like, how does this work? So I'm really excited to talk with him today. Dean, thanks for coming on the Small Business Show.

A pleasure and an honor.

Yeah, we're really glad to have you here with us today. So give us some background, you know, for our listeners. Have you always been in the orchid business? Are you a plant guy? You know, share your background a bit. How you decided and also how you decided that selling online was a great idea.

That's a great question. So I got into orchids sometime around 2000, and I was still in graduate school at the time. I'm a biologist, actually, and orchids, it's kind of an obsession. It's an addiction. A very nice one. And what happened was I was buying, like, rare collector level orchids on ebay. And pretty soon I kind of amassed the collection. And in order to get more money to buy more stuff, I started selling the plants on ebay. Some stuff that I didn't want anymore. And then before I knew it, hey, I had kind of a bit of a following, and one thing led to another. So orchid insanity was a side business for a while. And one of the things that I say about it is that it's actually a hobby gone wild. It's just grown and grown, and it's been a lot of fun. I've been doing it since around 2006, mostly part time. More recently, it's occupied a lot more of my time, let's put it that way. But it is a lot of fun.

That's great.

Especially for somebody who likes to grow plants and gets into it, you know, it's not something I grew up with, but it is something that has certainly, you know, been an addiction.

Sure.

How long has orchid insanity been. How long has it been a business where you've actually been selling things?

Since 2006.

Okay.

Yeah.

All right.

So, yeah, so I met you. We were both speaking at an ebay executive conference a few years ago. And I mean, it was a really myriad different people. You know, we had the shoelace guy, the orchid guy. We had another person selling gold. I was a technology person. I really enjoyed that and met some great people there. I mean, do you think making yourself available for those types of events has helped your business and maybe even you personally.

I wish I could say the answer was yes, but I recall, you know, the questions that we received after or, you know, while we were on stage at that event.

Right.

And there were a lot of people who were, like, impressed that, oh, wow, this guy sells orchids.

Right.

And, you know, I thought, okay, we're gonna get a flood of orders. I don't think we even got one order. Yeah. From that situation. So it is what it is. I mean, in the past, what I would do is, you know, we would set up at orchid shows here in the San Francisco area.

Right.

And there used to be a big one put on by the San Francisco orchid Soc over in Fort Mason. And for a while, it was, you know, I think it might have been the biggest show in the country. Anyway. At the show, I used to pass out business cards, you know, left and right. It was a great show for walk in traffic.

Right.

And so I think in the five or so years that I did the show, you know, how many phone calls I got from business cards, I guess. Yeah, less than 5. So I figured, well, business cards is not really a great way to promote this kind of business, even in the most enriched environment for selling orchids. I mean, it doesn't get any better than one of the top orchid shows in the world. But you pass out the business cards or people ask for them, and it just didn't go anywhere. So it was a bit of a learning experience.

Well, and I can see why you've, you know, have such a big presence on marketplaces, because they're driving customers to you then that works, right? Talk about some of the challenges of selling products that are alive. I remember what conversation we had when we first met, and you were talking about shipping delays due to weather. I mean, for those of us that have, you know, are just shipping, you know, let's say commodity items that don't have any idea what, what. What kind of challenges do you have to overcome?

Lots of challenges. You know, there are, you know, actually, can we take a quick break right here? My dog is about to walk right through. Sure. And you can just edit the size. Of course.

Yeah.

Okay. Amanda, get them out.

Sorry about that, guys. No worries. No worries. You want to ask that question again or you just want to go in and talk about.

If you want to. Go ahead and then we can. Sure.

Great.

And go ahead.

Okay, great. So tell us about some of the challenges of selling products and getting them to your customers all over the country and maybe the world that are alive. You know, I've shipped stuff everywhere, but it's, you know, it's all commodity type items. And I remember when we met a few, you know, a few years back at that ebay event, you were. One of the things you were struggling with was shipping delays due to the weather and how you could build that into your workflow on marketplaces.

Yeah. So it's a real problem because, you know, it's. Because every marketplace, we sell a lot on Amazon, we sell a lot on Etsy, we sell on ebay. Everybody has an expectation of getting their stuff fast.

Right.

And the thing is, with live plants, it's not like you just go to your warehouse or stock room and just pick stuff.

Right.

And just throw it into a, into a box and ship it.

Right.

It's not like shipping roll of masking tape or T shirts or wood carving or whatever.

Right.

These are live plants. They have to be handled a bit differently. So we build in some handling time with our shipments. The problem is during hot weather and cold weather, there are a lot of people out there who think they're going to get some plant that's going to be in perfect condition without paying for a heat pack or expedited shipping and it's just going to show up in Minnesota or Michigan or Vermont when The temperature is minus 10 outside there. I literally have many customers who think this and then when I tell them like, hey, would you like to purchase a heat pack to go with your plant? They're like, oh, I didn't even think of that.

Thank goodness you're the expert. That's right.

Well, I will say, yes, I am the expert, but there are lots of people who want to tell me how to do my job too.

Right.

I think as entrepreneurs that resonates. Perhaps that's the statement that has resonated most with any interview we've ever done done on this show, that there are lots of people that want to tell us how to do our jobs without ever knowing what it's like to do our jobs. But we carry on. That's right.

So I mean, imagine you have to do things pre sale to try to create that buffer. You try to educate them before they buy.

Yes, absolutely. And we can talk a bit more about how my listings are different from other listings out there in a bit. But the thing is, we do try to advise customers that, hey, if it's winter, you should get a heat pack or just hold off on placing your order or give us some time to wait for a good weather window. The problem is the various platforms out there. They have an expectation of their sellers to ship within X amount of time sometimes. Well, guess what? Like I'm fond of telling customers, we don't control the weather. You know, we're still working on that, but we currently are not capable of controlling the weather. Number two, we don't control the postal service either. I'm not sure which is harder, you know. You know, if I had a weather control device, well, sure. Well, I probably wouldn't be doing this.

Right.

But yeah, it's difficult, you know, because the issue is one of managing expectations. Most people, 99% of people, when they realize, oh yeah, it's pretty darn cold out there or it's too hot to ship, I can wait. Most people will think like that. There's always that 1% that still thinks that I'm going to ship a product to them expedited with a heat pack, which all costs extra money, but I'm going to do it for free.

Yeah.

And it's just like, well, sorry, we can't do that. You know, the problem is the, the, the platforms are all run by algorithms. Algorithms don't care about your excuses or your reasons or whatever. They just care, you know, Was, was, was it shipped on time or not?

Yeah. And you build in, like you mentioned, building in more handling time. Are each of these different platforms that you're selling on? They. Do they allow you more flexibility that way now?

Yeah, they do. I mean, you can just build in your different amounts of handling time for each of these platforms.

Right.

But sometimes the handling time, there's still a blizzard. Or as you might have recalled earlier this winter, this past winter, FedEx was out in Memphis. Issues like that, they have a ripple effect throughout everything. And it's hard sometimes to explain to customers who are now so trained by Amazon's fabulous shipping service, their shipping times, that things will show up real fast. And that's just not the way it works with plants. Not if you want to get them in good condition.

That makes sense.

We don't want to ship something that's just going to freeze and it arrives and it's dead. That doesn't help anybody. But again, we try to manage these expectations by putting plenty of information about this, you know, or getting in contact with the customer, you know, to let them know, like, hey, we really can't ship this now because it's just too cold where you are, you know, dead, etc. But unfortunately, you know, there's always some fraction of people, some small fraction of people who don't understand or don't get the message, you know, they don't read the email or it never arrives or whatever, you know, so every winter it's a challenge. And that's across all platforms. Yeah.

That's great. So I want to talk about Etsy a little bit. I don't know anything about that platform. I mean, I know what it does. I know they just made a huge purchase and bought another marketplace called depop. When I talked to you, we touched base a couple months ago, you said, oh, yeah, I started selling on Etsy as well. And I think you started that right around when Covid hit, or maybe a little sooner. But when I went and looked, I was like, man, you've shipped like 10,000 orders. How's Etsy different? Or is it different than Selling at other marketplaces like ebay.

Great question. So we started in February 2019 on Etsy. Prior to that, we'd been selling on ebay on Amazon for many years. And then I figured, well, okay, let's try this Etsy thing, see what happens. You know, Etsy is very easy to use. It's very well organized. It's slick, you know, and I mean that in a good way. Right?

Yeah.

It's easy to use, easy to do everything, and it's fast. So, you know, the thing is, what you can tell is, like, how long does it take to generate a mailing label on Etsy versus, say, on ebay?

Right.

You know, it's a lot faster. I mean, ebay. Okay. And Amazon's, you know, Amazon's good, Etsy's fast. It's just very smooth. It's as if they've learned from everybody else's mistakes.

Right.

And, you know, continue to. They continue to try to improve on things.

Right.

That's great. And I think, at least, you know, for now, we've reached a good, steady state where things work. They feel very solid, at least from my perspective. I understand how it works. I don't expect weird things like, gee, what's going on now? Or they're doing yet another facelift on site.

What?

Yeah, it feels very solid.

Well, perhaps more than any other platform, Etsy is built for the individual creator primarily.

Right.

You know, ebay certainly targets that, but they've got a wider variety of people, including folks that just, like, find an extra iPhone around that want to sell it.

Right.

But Etsy is targeting those creators, so I think maybe that helps them focus on their main customer.

Right.

You know, or one of their main groups of customers. That's really interesting.

Yeah, I think that's. I think there's a lot of validity to that. Absolutely. Yeah. You know, but like I say, they do a very good job. I've been very happy with Etsy, and they do a very good job. And it's just not much of a hassle, you know, compared to other experiences that I've had in the past.

That's good to hear. And hopefully listeners listening will. If they haven't, like, like you, Shannon, maybe Etsy is a good platform for what you're doing there with. With Shannon's Closet, at least. Maybe worth checking out now, especially since.

They bought Depop, which is.

Right.

Secondhand type of marketplace. So there's definitely some options.

Yeah, for sure. For sure. Hey, I want to take a minute and talk about our sponsor for this episode. And that is Custom Comet. Custom Comet is a company out of Portland, Oregon here that makes. I say here. I'm not in Portland at the moment, although I visit there quite a bit because my son goes to school out there. But Custom Comet makes custom merch and promotional products. Think you've heard us. If you've listened to recent episodes, you've heard us talk about their air fresheners. And their air fresheners are very cool. That's definitely their most popular product because they're one of the only companies that create custom shapes for every order so that the air freshener is shaped like for example, your logo or your artwork. Most Companies have like 10 stock shapes. They'll do custom shapes. They also have over 70 cents, 17 string colors. And they really know how to make these things so that they're like, they've got a good, like crisp feel to them and they smell good for a really long time. But air fresheners aren't the only things that Custom Comet makes. They make coasters. I went to their website and was checking them out@custom comet.com of course they've got like these great looking coasters that of course you can customize with whatever you want. They've also got coffee sleeves. Right. These folks are thinking like this is a smart thing to give people. Like definitely go to custom comet.com, check out what they've got. Custom Comet, they are a team of graphic designers. That's the company was founded by artists and graphic designers. So they can really help you take what you've got and turn it into something really special. Also mention that you heard about custom comment here on the small business show and they'll give you 5% off your first order. So go check it out@custom comet.com. let Custom Comet help your brand create a unique and memorable promotional product. And our thanks to Custom Comet for sponsoring this episode. All right, Shannon, you want to take us to the next thing here?

Yeah, absolutely. So Dean, I'm a plant person. I love plants. I love working with them. It seems like such a calm, this really nice, peaceful environment. But I imagine, or maybe I'm wrong, that's from the outside. Is it different on the inside owning a business and you have to do all these things like we talk about on the show all the time that it's. Are you still have that great environment or is it really stressful, you know, like running our business?

No, it's not stressful.

That's great.

You know, it's not stressful which is, you know, part of the reason that I do it, right, it's like not in corporate America with all kinds of crazy and oftentimes silly demands on your time and attention.

Right.

The stressful part is dealing with, you know, irate customers or disciplined customers.

Right.

And, you know, that's just par for the course in any type of startup or entrepreneurial type of venture.

Right.

When it's like, it's you, you're the guy answering the questions, right? As opposed to, you know, a department that does this, per se. So I would say, yeah, it's, it's. It is very. It's fascinating work because I'm always learning about new plants, which I like. But at the same time, the business is, you know, fairly humming in the sense that the procedures are well worked out.

Right.

And they work. They're not that complicated. The difficult part really is managing customer expectations. Because the thing is, you know, if I only had to deal with, like, sophisticated collectors of orchids, right? We're all speaking the same language. It's not a problem. People know what to expect. They know that, yes, stuff's not in bloom, blah, blah, blah, right. They know what to do. But when you're dealing with, you know, newbies, right, you know, they're telling you, they're giving me advice on how to grow stuff because what they. What they received was contrary to their expectations. Because their expectations are so narrow.

Right.

They don't know what they're looking at.

Right.

Or what stuff is supposed to look like.

Yeah. And I noticed on your website at, you know, Orchid Insanity, you've got some blog posts about, you know, things that are on the Internet that are maybe not correct and, you know, managing, again, trying to educate them and manage expectations.

We talk a lot on the show about leveraging what we Star Trek fans call the Scotty Principle, which is, you know, under promise and over deliver, which is, you know, that concept of managing customer expectations in a. In a way that's going to be positive, to surprise and delight them. Are you able to do that effectively with, as you call them, orchid newbies?

Yeah, absolutely. So I'll give you, you know, one trick of the trade on, in what we do, like the photos that we show of the plants themselves on our listings, Right. You know, they're good photos, but they don't show the best plants. It's always, you know, a representative, kind of mediocre plant.

Right.

So when a customer buys it and they get something that's bigger or better than what it looks like in the picture, right. They are, you know, generally pleased Right. That's one thing we.

It's really smart. No, I don't want to lose sight of this here. For anybody listening, like, what a brilliant thing. How many times have you gone, you know, ordered takeout from a restaurant and you see the picture of the dish on online and then you get it and it's like, you know, I mean, it tastes good, but it doesn't look like what I thought it would look like. Like truly like undersell a little bit and surprise and delight. I never thought about using website photos to undersell what people are going to get when they, when it, when they open the box. That's brilliant.

Well, you have to, you have to keep in mind though, that, you know, we're dealing with living things and there's obviously a lot of variability. Now if you're taking, you know, I don't know if you're selling, you know, rolls of tape, there's not, you know, I don't know that this kind of advice. No, no, but I'm sure it'll help somebody out.

But for things where there's a little bit of. Or a lot of a fudge factor, not going for the absolute best. What a smart move.

Yeah. And that's why I wanted you to come on the show, Dean, so you could talk about these, just these kinds of issues that, you know, guys like us that are, that are just move, maybe moving the same thing out every single day. And, and yours, it's much more subjective. So managing that expectation, I think is.

Let me give you another secret to my success, so to speak, at least in this field, which is our listings. If you look at our listings on Amazon or ebay or Etsy or website, for the most part, they're very well written. They go into a lot of detail. And the thing is, they're funny sometimes, they're informative, they're educational. And so the idea that I've always tried to shoot for is you remember on Seinfeld there was the guy that the character Elaine worked for, Right. This guy named J. Peter put out this catalog.

Right.

So you guys probably remember, you know, from taking flights around the country, there used to be a magazine called Skymall. Yep.

Right.

And there's another similar thing called like Homacher Schlemmer or something like that. And they sell like the most bizarre and interesting things, right? You know, like air conditioned doghouse or, you know, one of these, you know, hats that you can put a drink in with a sippy straw. All this weird stuff.

Right.

But what I found most interesting about, you know, these kinds of catalog businesses.

Right.

Was the marketing copy that went into each quirky product.

Right.

The copy was, you know, it's fantastic. It's brilliant. It's like a work of art. I mean, I wish I could meet some of these writers because it's great. And that's what I try to capture in a lot of our listings, is that kind of feel where whomever is reading this. Because on the web, what have you got? You don't have me selling to you one on one. You've got what, pictures and you've got a description.

Yeah. I love this. Let me read one sentence here from this. I don't know if I can pronounce it right. Dark lady slipper orchid. Here it says if all the lady orchid. Let me start again. If all the lady slipper orchid species were students in a high school and I can't pronounce this, Fefylidium wardii would not be one of the popular kids.

Yeah. You know, I try to relate things to, you know, experiences that we've all had.

Right.

Or I mean, it's just like you can. You can find some theme, and you need to riff off of that theme. And part of it is just to keep the buyer's attention long enough to check your stuff out. Because if you go on any other orchid website or any other orchid listing, what do they say? They say this orchid is from Ecuador, 1500 meters altitude, cool growing. And that's it. That's all you've got.

You got your personality in there, too, which I think is great.

Usually the pictures are very bad. And I'm sure you guys know this, especially you, Shannon, from your experience on ebay. I mean, there are plenty of people who sell who don't bother to take a good picture. They don't bother for it to be in focus. It's just terrible. The quality is so bad. And when you've only got half a second to make an impression, you want the impression to be a good one.

Right.

And then when you draw that customer in to read the listing, there's a big difference between a listing that's got stuff to say versus something that's got very little to say.

Right.

And what I'm trying to do here is I'm trying to create a mindset in the customer base out there that, oh, they care about their plants, they love their products, they're having fun. Yeah. You know.

Right.

Yeah. And I can tell you're having a good time as you describe it as well. So we constantly preach about Action here on the show. You know, taking action when you want to get yourself going to achieve what you want with your business, whether you're just getting started or you want to make changes. Is there an action item, something you can share with our listeners that has made the difference in, you know, your business being successful?

Yeah, I think one thing that I, you know, that is kind of a theme of what we've just been talking about is that you have to genuinely care. You know, there are plenty of people out there selling just whatever, but they don't really care about what they're selling.

Right.

When you can convey your sincerity and your own interest, your own, shall we say, obsession or insanity about, you know, whatever it is you're selling, you're going to, you're going to draw some people in because they want to share that too.

Right.

And, you know, I mean, people who are enthusiastic, they draw a crowd.

Yeah. That's great.

What are you enthusiastic about? Why are you so enthusiastic? Why do you like this? Maybe I'll like it too.

Right.

And that's the kind of thing that I would try to convey. And if you're trying to get into a business like this, it's a good step, I think, to take to come across as being very excited about your product. Enthusiastic.

I love that. Yeah.

And, you know, a believer, right? Yeah, sure.

What I'm hearing here is really interesting. You're in. And I use this word to describe myself too, and I use this word as a term of affection, is, you know, you're a nerd about orchids.

Right.

Which is great. You kind of, in order to start a business, that's really helpful. I'm not going to say you need that, but it's really helpful to be a nerd about the thing that you are doing. What? That was clear from, like, moment one of, of our chat here. What's now become clear is that you're a nerd about your business too. Like, you, you just, you spend time thinking about it when you wouldn't normally have to be. I mean, you're, you know, you're being inspired by Jay Peterman. Like, what a, what an awesome thing to be inspired by to create your customer experience. But the fact that that's something you, you care about to tie in that last point, is it like, this is part of why you're successful. The other part is that you're a nerd about orchids and you understand that, and that's also important. But, but these two things I think are the key to. One is the key to getting going. The other is the key to lasting. And I really, that whatever people out there, whatever the rest of us can do to become passionate about serving our customers and finding ways for us to have fun while serving our customers is the key. Yeah, that's great, man.

We always like to wrap up. We talk, you know, we also talk about mistakes a lot on the show. We wrote a guide and we're actually going to make an announcement here after this interview about that being available to our listeners. Those mistakes teach us so much. Is there a mistake you could share with our listeners? Something that you remember? And it's like, wow, man, it really helped me with my business.

Yeah. Well, coming back to Etsy, I think one of the mistakes that I made was I thought after having done a lot of business on Amazon and on ebay, that I thought, well, I understand how it's going to be done on Etsy, too. I didn't, you know, not. I wasn't way off.

Right.

But, you know, the thing is, the mistake that I made was assuming that everyone's policies were going to be the same. And they generally are to a degree. But it's the fine points, right?

Sure.

It's the fine points that make that can make or break a business sometimes.

Right.

And there were some fine points with how Etsy, you know, with certain of their policies that I didn't quite realize I took a bit for granted given my extensive experience on Amazon and on ebay. Well, Etsy didn't roll that way and that was a bit of a learning experience. And so I would say before getting on any kind of new platform, you really need to understand the ins and outs. Good advice. And one other thing I would throw in about just getting on Etsy is, you know, there are plenty of other people trying to sell orchids on Etsy, you know, plenty. And I, you know, I kind of wonder, gee, how did I get to be, I think, the top orchid seller on Etsy so quickly? Hopefully some of the above that we've or the previous stuff that we've talked about contributed to that. But I think one thing that, you know, I'm honing in on is that when I started off on Etsy, I'd already had basically a full shop. It just needed to be converted to Etsy's format. So I looked around on Etsy and I've seen people trying to sell one thing here or one thing there. I think it's very difficult to get traction when you start off with just a handful of items. If you want to get started on Etsy. It's best, I think, to come in with a relatively full catalog stuff and make sure that it's priced properly, because there are other shops on etsy with more SKUs, more stock keeping units than I've got. They have no sales, and I'm thinking, well, maybe they've just overpriced or something. But it's sort of the big get bigger. I mean, it's a snowball kind of effect, and you want to be able to start snowballing right after you get on Etsy rather than just kind of throw up a bunch of stuff and then just wait and hope things rolling maybe by selling for a bit less or. Not sure exactly. But I do know that once you start getting traction with the search engine on Etsy, then things become a lot easier.

That's great. So what's next for you, Dean, in Orchid and Sandia? Are you pushing to grow more? Are you happy where things are, looking at other platforms?

What's your plan? Absolutely. I think we're definitely growing and there's still plenty of room to grow. The great thing about the plant world is there's plenty of plants out there. The thing is, it's interesting because the millennial generation has just kind of woken up to the fact that there are a lot of fascinating plants out in the world.

Right.

And the question is, how do you grow them?

Yeah, Right.

And so what we're focusing on now is our website and putting up great information about plants and about growing plants and how to grow plants and expanding our product lines. You know, not just orchids. I mean, there's succulents, there's carnivorous plants, there's, you know, just all kinds of stuff out there that's interesting and fascinating. And once you've got it dialed in, I mean, growing is not that hard once you know what to do. It's.

Says the biologist.

Yeah, that's the key. We pointed out that you're a nerd about this stuff. Right? We all agreed.

That's right.

I'll tell you one thing, you know, if you want to grow orchids well, you want high humidity, you want to create higher humidity conditions, and your orchids will do a lot better.

That's great. That's awesome. Well, Dean, I really appreciate you coming on the show today and sharing some your background and about your business and these different marketplaces and. And where you're going. What's the best way for our listeners to connect with you and to learn more about orchid insanity?

Just go to our website, orchidinsanity.com and you can email us@orchidinsanitymail.com and we're always happy to help.

That's great. I highly recommend checking out the website. The descriptions alone are worth some enjoyable read. And it is enjoyable read, Dean. You know, keep in touch, Come back and let us know how things are from time to time. And thank you again.

All right, thanks, guys. It's been a pleasure.

All right, well, like, that was cool. Yeah, no, like the thing I always try and learn and then, like, you hear me during the interviews, sharing the things that I'm learning so that we can all learn, you know, together. But that whole idea about embracing your nerdness.

Right.

Especially if you've got it, you like, if that's what you started your business with, then, yeah, go the next step and. And be a nerd about your business.

Yeah, especially a business like that. I mean, you know, it's. I'm fascinated by his business since the first time I met him, and I've always wanted to have him come on the show and reconnected with him not, not too long ago and said, hey, you know, we need to do this. And it's. It just goes to show you can sell. Sell anything. So, you know, it's. There's opportunity out there like never before.

Oh, of course.

Whether you want to sell shoelaces or orchids or rocks or, I mean, just, you know, the sky's the limit. So I, I really enjoyed that and I'm fascinated with the Etsy concept, and I think he's done really well. He was very casual about it when he told me, oh, yeah, we started then Etsy, you know, a year and a half or so ago.

Wow.

And I went, looked, and I said, you know, Dean, first thing I was going to say is, oh, you need to. You need a profile picture here. I was ready to give him some advice.

Right.

Of course.

Like we were, like we were saying earlier, and then I looked and I said, hey, you shipped over 10,000 orders in that year or so. And he's like, oh, yeah.

It's like, that's awesome. Yeah. You know, whatever you're doing, don't worry about my advice. Profile picture.

Yeah, forget what I was gonna say. Yeah, I really enjoyed it and I appreciate him coming on.

Yeah, absolutely. Fun stuff, folks. Hey, no. Email us at Feedback Business show if you've got any information that you want to share or questions or anything like that. We love to hear from you. But, Shannon, you promised that we were going to share something here.

Yeah. And you followed through and did it so I can, you know, that's. That's perfect. Thank you for doing that.

Yeah, man.

If we are giving away our Mistakes guide Up@Business BusinessShow Co mistakes, you can go up and download a full color in vivid color PDF of the entire guide. Just enter your email. Sign up for our super useful newsletter that we send out from time to time. Remind you some of the stuff you've learned on this show. That's businessshow co Mistakes. And that goes back to our reciprocity. We, we want to give you that. We sold a ton of those up on Amazon and for our listeners that want to keep in touch, it's now free.

Yep. Cool. I'm glad we're doing that, man. BusinessShow Co mistakes. We've got a link in the show Notes. Of course, if you go to BusinessShow Co mistakes or really if you just go to BusinessShow Co and you sign up for our newsletter a you'll get a free copy of Mistakes as Shannon just said. But to bring it all around, you'll also get the show notes delivered to your email box every week so you don't have to remember to go to BusinessShow Co to see the show notes for the show that you just heard.

We've got all those. Why are the show notes so important, Dave?

Because we put all that. Well, we put the topics that we've discussed, we put the links in there, we put timestamps in there so that you can really navigate through and get the added value out of the show that we're doing while. While we produce it for you.

Awesome.

Yeah. All right, folks, that's it. Make sure to check out Custom Comet and let them know that we sent you here from the Small Business show and you get your 5% off and we'll see you next time. Keep living that charmed life.