What is the Best Age to Start a Business?

There's no such thing as a billion dollar idea. There's no such thing as a million dollar idea. There are good ideas, there are great ideas, there are bad ideas. And we all, every day see instances of every one of those types of ideas succeed because someone has decided to execute and make it happen. Business Brain The Entrepreneur's Podcast Episode 401 for Wednesday, 10-12-20 Greetings, folks and welcome to Business Brain, the Entrepreneur's Podcast, the show where we are identifying how we can use our business brain in not just business, but everyday life. Sponsors for this episode includes shopify.comsbs where you can go to get your 14 day trial and full access to Shopify's entire suite of features. We'll dig into that in more depth a little bit later. For now, here in Durham, New Hampshire, I'm Dave Hamilton.

And here in Lafayette, California, I am Shannon Jean. Happy to be here today and happy to have those awesome sponsors.

Yeah, man. Yeah.

Love me some Shopify.

Same. Yeah, they make life easy. It's crazy.

They really do. They really do. So how are you doing out there?

Good. It's Q4. It's a different Q4 than we've had.

I was going to ask you about that.

Yeah.

Compared to. Because you're, you might be. Your advertising business is some kind of indicator, right?

Yeah.

Companies are thinking how they're thinking it.

Is and you know, the economy is, is not what it was for the last couple of years. And I mean that in a lot of different ways. I mean, obviously, you know, for the past two Q4's basically been in the midst of some version of pandemic lockdown. Right. You know, different. Different last year than 2020. Obviously. 2020 was radically different than anything I've ever known in my life. And for our business, it was gangbusters, you know, because people were locked down. And so the whole idea of online anything saw a huge bump up. Now that, you know, the flip side to that of course was mostly propped up though. Right, but mostly propped up. Yeah, well, propped up. Not, not artificially. But the money had to go somewhere and it wasn't going to. You know, vacations and eating out and, you know, all of the. And the whole performing arts business, you know, was basically shut down almost entirely. Right. You know, so like the entertainment business, all of that stuff was just, you know, gone. I don't need to go through that. But, but the flip side to that meant that, that, you know, there was tons of money coming into this, relatively speaking. And so I like this Q4. It's hard to say, but I. What I want to say is it feels like a more normal Q4.

Okay.

But, you know, when things are gangbusters, that feels normal pretty quickly. You know, when things are up, you can get used to that and treat it as though it is the new standard. When things are down, you're like, oh, we gotta fix this and change it to get it back up again. Right. So it's interesting seeing how things are just a little softer right now. And then on top of that, the overall economy is down. And so that would normally affect our Q4 too. And so it's hard for me to say, you know, what percentages of things are softer this Q4 than they have been the last two. Like, that's just the reality of it. Why? I think there's a lot of reasons, as there always are. Right. We're no longer in lockdowns, certainly not the way we were. I know some people are still locking down, but by and large people are not. And then, you know, the economy is softer as well. So everything sort of contributes to that. It's interesting. Yeah, yeah. Things are still, it's still Q4. Things are still good. It's not, but it's not like, I think at this point last year we were basically sold out until January, and right now that's not the case. I mean, it's. It sold like I, I would sort of normally expect it to be. And things are like evolving throughout the quarter.

Yeah, it's. It is interesting.

Yeah.

I find in our, my businesses too, there's definitely something happening. Some things are, you know, some things are down, other things are up. And I, I'm, I'm curious to see how it, how it all shakes out because it's definitely some different things happening than the year past couple of years.

Yeah. Yeah. I'm curious to hear from all of you, what are you seeing? Because this is a helpful conversation for me to have. Just simply you and me talking about this. And hopefully it's helpful for you folks listening. If you're seeing the same thing. If you're not seeing the same thing, though, if you're seeing it much worse than the, you know, than the past, well, then that's, that would be an interesting thing to talk about. If you're seeing it much better than the past, then that would be an interesting thing to talk about. So I'd like to hear from you all feedback at BusinessBrain Show. Right? Because, like, yeah, it is good to.

Hear and it is good to. I mean, you can get a Sense of. Is it like I always point to myself, what am I doing wrong? You know, sales are going down or things aren't as. As busy as they are. But like for me, so I. One of my companies is, you know, I sell on marketplace, all these different kinds of marketplaces. Right. Ebay, Poshmark, Tracy. Different kinds. Well, I tell you what, what I see the. One of the benefits of selling across different marketplaces is when they all slow down at the same time. You know, it's not just you. Right, right. It's a market. And even the kind of interest level the, you know, ebay has, you can add things to your watch list and when that happens, well, the sellers get an alert and you can send offers and do different things. It's kind of like you get. If you added something to your shopping cart and left it in there and the. The merchant gets an alert when that happens.

Yeah.

So they can market to you. And I see the same thing. The other interesting thing is two of the major marketplaces that I do business with and that were, you know, gangbusters in growth and everything else just sold themselves.

Ah.

To international companies. Tradesy sold themselves to a European country called a company called Vestier, and Poshmark sold themselves to a South Korean company called Navarre. And you know, Poshmark sold itself for half of its IPO price.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, so they're having a hard time making any money in their kind of, I guess, social commerce, fashion business and stuff. So they're partnering with other established companies that are. That are picking them up and that just tells me they're struggling just like we are the people selling on their platforms.

Fascinating. Yeah, it makes a lot of sense to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But yeah, I would love to hear other. Other folks and also just because when certain areas of the market or the economy go down, others often go up. So it would be great to hear from you. Feedback at. Let's see, can I say it. Businessbrain show. I got it.

Hey, you ever go to like comedy nights, like open mic nights? The thing I love about that is that they make it possible for anyone to step up and try standup. The thing I love about our sponsor Shopify is how it's the all in one commerce platform that makes it simple for anyone to step up and start, run and grow a successful business. Shopify makes it simple to sell to anyone from anywhere. Whether your thing is like vintage teas or recipes for ghee, Start selling with Shopify and join the platform, simplifying commerce for many millions of your favorite businesses worldwide. Shannon and I, we've used Shopify in the past. It works fantastic because they just know what they're doing. You create your online store and yourvibe discover new customers and grow the following that keeps those customers coming back. Shopify has all the sales channels sorted. So your business keeps growing from an in person POS system to an all in one e commerce platform. Even across social media platforms like TikTok, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter 24. 7 support free libraries full of educational content. Shopify's got you. And you can try Shopify for free and start selling anywhere. Sign up for a free trial@shopify.com SBS. Go to shopify.com SBS to start selling online today. Shopify.com SBS and our thanks to Shopify for sponsoring this episode. Hey Shannon, I got a question for you.

Yes, sir?

Am I too old to start a business?

No, Dave, you're not.

Good news. That's it.

Very, very good news. Yeah, I want to talk about this today because I've been thinking a lot about it. Maybe because I'm older now, but it happens.

That's a byproduct of the whole linear time thing that we've agreed to. Yeah, that's right.

And I think there's a, a common, you know, it's, I, it's a misconception that we're going to talk about today, but it's that it's easier to start a business and you have more of a chance to be successful if you're younger and actually that's not true. And the, if you look at research that the best entrepreneurs tend to be middle aged. Now I don't know what that means number actually is, but one of the things that stuck out is like a 50 year old founder is almost two and a half times more likely to start a successful business than a 30 year old and even higher than a 20 year old founder, which surprised me. It was interesting. And we'll link this study in the show notes at Businessbrain show for you to read. And that's what we're going to talk about today.

Yeah, I found this really interesting but as I started reading it, it made a lot of sense to me because it's like, okay, well chances are in this example that 50 year old founder has made some mistakes. A lot more of them than that 30 year old founder. Right. It's sort of a byproduct of time. Right. And you learn a, I mean I think there's a lot of things that come with this. You learn from the mistakes. Right. But some of the specific things that you learn are how to prioritize the important things in the business, how not to get caught up in the sort of, the not important things, maybe the ego related things. Right. You get that out of your system and you learn to just be really pragmatic. I certainly find myself more pragmatic and, and to be fair, I find myself frustrated when I'm dealing with people who aren't being pragmatic. So I still have some things to work on, but you know, it's just like, oh no, let's not do that, let's just do this.

It's interesting. And a couple things that really stood out to me as I read this study too was that really I need to shift as thinking about age as a feature, not a barrier.

Ooh, I like that. Yeah, yeah.

And one of the biggest things that, what really hit me is I was, I was really happy to see is why do entrepreneurs get better with age? And one of the biggest ones is that as we get older, we value execution over ideas. Right?

Yeah.

And we, and we talk about that on the show for years, all the.

Time, till we're blue in the face. Yeah.

Yes. Action over ideas. Right. And I.

Okay, great.

You gotta have a good idea. But when you look to see who succeeds and what businesses work, it's the people that have figured out that taking action is the critical part. Execution is everything. And older entrepreneurs, I think, value that more than a younger person that says, oh, I've got a great idea. We're just going to power through it and, and make this idea work. That, that does happen sometime.

But sure.

Well, there's the outliers.

Yeah, you're right. It's. We've always said, or at least on since we've been doing this show, which to be fair has only been seven and a half years. So I was in my would. Late, late, early 40s. I don't know, my, my early mid-40s when we started the show. And you know, but, but even by that point I had learned and I've keep learning and this show has helped me sort of reinforce that lesson for myself and hopefully for all of you that you know, that if, well, what do I like to say? If you want an idea to be worth $100, write it on $100 bill. You don't need a billion dollar idea. There's, there's. I don't want to say there's no such thing as a bill. Actually, I'm going to say it and then prove Me wrong feedback at Businessbrain show. There's no such thing as a billion dollar idea. There's no such thing as a million dollar idea. There are good ideas, there are great ideas, there are bad ideas. And we all, every day see instances of every one of those types of ideas succeed because someone has decided to execute and make it happen. And, you know, I think that's. What did Otis Redding say, right? Actions speak louder than words. And I'm a man of great experience. I thought he was talking about something completely different, but obviously he was setting us up here and using his business brain. I don't know what he was using it for, actually. I have some ideas, but, you know, Otis was using his business brain there, so.

Yeah, yeah, it's good. And, you know, looking back, as I read this, I could see myself in a lot of these things about youth, you know, and there's pros and cons and different things, but almost every benefit that they listed from a young person, I could think of. Well, you know, yeah, but this, you know, about an older person, you know, that one of the things that stuck out to me also was they talk about energy. You know, you might have more energy in your youth to focus on, you know, starting a new business. And I think just as we get older, we just have to come up with ways to combat that, whether it's getting more exercise or focusing or, I don't know, maybe you have to go to bed earlier and you can't, you know, work until 2am Like I used to do. But I think there's ways to offset all of these, you know, quote cons of getting older when starting a company.

Yeah, I like this. Yeah, you've assembled a good list of some of the pros and cons of both being young and being old. And I like that we're going through some of this because, you know, not only might you have more energy when you're young, but you have more time. You know, you always hear, often hear people who get older saying, you know, your greatest resource is time because it's the one thing that is like, finitely limited. You only get so much of it, so be careful where you spend it when you're young. You don't really think that way. And that can be a benefit. Right. You know, where you just say, okay, well, I don't have any kids. I live alone. I can work for 72 hours on this thing and then I'll sleep and nobody cares. I mean, people might care about you, but you're not impacting the Lives, you don't have people that you are responsible to, that you are caring for. And so that can be. Not having those time obligations can be a really good thing.

It can. And I think that you also have typically fewer encumbrances. Right. You maybe you haven't start, like to your point, you haven't started a family yet.

Right.

You know, so you're not spending a lot of time, you know, taking care of that family or kids that grow up in sports and this and school and all this kind of stuff. That, that is awesome. And it's a huge. It's a great part of life too, that you want to be able to take advantage of. But you tend to have more time to focus on your business because those things maybe haven't hit you yet. I think if you're in your late 20s or 30s, you're in the thick of it. That's the most challenging time because as you get old, you know, we're going to talk about getting older in a little bit. But those times, you really have to learn to balance your, you know.

Yeah. My 30s were the hardest time for me to be an entrepreneur, I think because, because of that struggle to balance and I failed a lot at it. Well, my business did not thrive because of it. I, I do not. I, I want to retract the phrase that I failed. I don't think it was a failure. I got to spend time with my kids as they were growing up and I got to do a lot of things with them that were really, truly once in a lifetime experiences. Right. You know, each kid is only a given age once. And to be able to be a part of that, like, I cherish those times and I am thankful that I had built something that allowed me the flexibility to do that now. It meant that I was sacrificing spending time with the business because everything is a balance and a trade off. And it meant that I wasn't growing my businesses as much as I could have. And I don't know if I should have or not. I don't really like that one, but. Yeah, yeah. But yes, that's a tough balance. And I probably, if I had it to do over again, I probably would do it differently. However, I would still make sure to spend time the time that I had with my family. I would just be more efficient and more focused on the actions that I would have taken when I had time for the business. I probably would have balanced my time exactly the same. I just would have treated the business differently. And that comes with wisdom. So, yeah.

Yeah, I think I would have delegated more.

Yeah.

So that I could have felt less pressure while I was away from my businesses, with my family, which I loved. And it was great. And, you know, Cub Scouts and this, Girl Scouts and all these things that we did was. It was just terrific. But there was always this, you know, pull to get back and work more. And I think now, looking back, I could have easily offloaded. Well, maybe not easily, but I could have offloaded those things and not had that pull so much. One of the things I would recognize, too, when you're younger, if you really screw up, you have fewer assets to lose if things really go south. Right. And we love mistakes on this show. In fact, we wrote a book about it. And it's an important way. It's tuition, as you learn, but you are putting things at risk. And typically, you're personally guaranteeing things. So when you're young, you just have less to lose.

That's interesting. I'm not sure I didn't experience that as much. Even in retrospect, I don't think I experienced that because I was always focused on, I need to make sure I have enough so that I don't have to go to work for somebody else. I was petrified of that. Right. And so because of that, I think I felt more risk averse in that sense. I mean, well, the phrase desperation probably communicates the right feeling of this, though. I don't know that that's actually the right term. But the idea of being like, okay, well, if I screw this up, I might have to go to work for somebody else, as opposed to, I've made a little bit, I've got some in the bank. I can afford to screw up a little because I've got Runway, personal Runway. Maybe not business Runway, but I've got personal Runway, too. Screw this up, wrap it up, try again. And so I'm finding myself less averse to risk as I get older, as opposed to more. And. And maybe it's. Maybe it's because I wasn't thinking about things the right way.

Not the right way, just in a different way.

In a different way. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly.

One of the things I do think, when you. You're younger, I think you do have fewer biases about the way things. And I'm quoting here, the way things are done. Like, oh, this is the way you do things. Because as you.

Yeah.

As you build businesses and have some success and so, you know, some that don't do, well, whatever you do, kind of formulate this formula, if you will, of how things get done. And those biases impact you. I mean, for good and bad, you have that experience. But when you're young, you're just like, well, I. You don't know. You don't know what you don't know. And so you can just start and just set things up and just go and. And kind of fill in the blanks as you. As you move forward. And I do think that can be a real benefit to getting started if you'll take that leap, you know, step off the edge of the cliff and then, you know, scramble your way to the bottom without getting killed.

Yeah, no, it's true. It's true. Yeah. We get biased. We think we're right. Normal. More. Yeah, yeah, it's true. Yeah. There's a phrase, beginner's mind, in the Buddhist circles, and I've always liked that. I mean, there is benefit to wisdom, don't get me wrong. And we're going to talk about some of those benefits in a little bit here. But. But it is not good to just assume that what you have learned is the only right way to do things. Right. You know, and. And approaching things with that beginner's mind. I don't know. It can be.

Yeah, it's good.

It's. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And then lastly, the one I have on my pro, the pros of youth is that, you know, that concept of you can throw everything you own into your car. In my case, like, I was at a pickup truck, so I was, okay, I'm unencumbered as long as everything I have fits in my truck. And so you just have a lower cost of living to support, so you can dump. You don't need to make as much money to support a family, a house, all these kinds of things. You can just crash on the couch, and that can give you lots of flexibility and Runway, like you said, to experiment. And like, when I was young and we started Mac Rescue, we didn't make any money for like a year, but my wife had a good job and worked at a law firm, so I was able to just, you know, okay, we're going to live off this, and I could focus on that. And then after a year, it was that, hey, let's take out 500 bucks a month. And then slowly, you know, you increase and build a. You know, build a company and build your life. But being able to dump every single penny back into the business was hugely beneficial.

Yeah. Oh, for sure. That can be. Yeah, that. That can be great. And even. Yeah, Yeah, I was going to say even if you don't have income coming from, you know, your partner or a different source, just having that, that lower cost of, of living in general can be, it can be the difference between a business succeeding and failing. Right? Yeah.

Right. So if you're young, enjoy it while you have it.

Hey, are you interested in growing your e commerce store or starting one? Then you should be listening to the award winning top e commerce podcast, E Commerce Master Plan. Host and author of the best selling book E Commerce Marketing, Chloe Thomas has been in the e commerce industry for nearly 20 years, helping E commerce entrepreneurs, entrepreneurs like you to grow your business. Every week on the show, Chloe interviews a different e commerce brand to explore how they're achieving their success. From startups to eight figure brands, there's always something to learn. Listen now on your favorite podcast app, just search E Commerce Master plan. With over 400 interviews to choose from, it can be hard to work out what to listen to first. So go to ecmp.info businessbrain. We'll link that in our show notes and that's where you can get Chloe's personal recommendation on the best episode for you to start with, just go to ecmp for ecommercemasterplan.info businessbrain. Our thanks to the E Commerce Master Plan podcast for doing this swap with us. Thanks, Chloe. Hey, you know, a guy named Ray Kroc was 59 when he purchased a business that would become his biggest success. I think you know who Ray Kroc was, right? Right, Shannon do. Yeah, I do, yeah. He bought a business called McDonald's.

That's right.

And I was going to say he did pretty well with that, but I think so, you know, he, because, because that business did exist. He is not the founder of McDonald's. It was effectively a fast food company. But he bought it after having had lots of moderate successes and, and spectacular failures and he brew it to, I mean, you know, to say that McDonald's is a massive brand is, is a massive understatement. Right. But he gets credited with being the founder of McDonald's even though he's not, you know, because he's the founder of what we see today. So.

Yeah. In its current form.

Yeah.

And, yeah. And, and one, you know, brought the people together that flipped the script and realized that we're really a real estate company, not a hamburger company. Yeah, you know that, that was, it was, it was brilliant.

Brilliant.

Great book to read, Founder. By the way, the Ray Kroc story.

Okay.

Very, very Good.

Yeah. And Michael Keaton did a great job. He did with the movie, too. That. Yeah, yeah.

So love that.

Yeah.

Real quick, I want to talk about cons of youth, and then I want to. I want to jump into the.

Okay.

Older. Older entrepreneurs, but, you know, one of the biggest ones. And I'll say it like an old man, you don't know what the hell you're doing. You know, it's an. It's an experience.

Beginner's mind isn't always the best thing. It's sometimes, but, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You spend a lot of time reinventing the wheel, figuring stuff out and, you know, maybe trying to do everything yourself, you know, instead of. Instead of, you know, getting other people and I feel.

Seen you tip. Yeah.

And you have a smaller network to, you know, reach out to. Right. Because you're just kind of getting going and that. That can really impact you as well. And you don't have as many, you know, resources to tap into. And speaking of resources, maybe you don't have access to capital or you haven't met a good attorney yet. You know, we talk about these people all the time, accountants, all these folks that as you get older, you kind of can tap into as you need them because they know who you are and you've used them before. And one of the things that I hate this, that it kind of. You get it held against you when you're young, because I certainly had it held against me, is lack of proven success. Right. Is trying to get things going and having, you know, people that you need to get things done looking at you like, well, this, you know, this person's never done anything before. Why should we trust that they're going to get done? Lack of credibility, I guess you could call it.

Yeah, yeah. Well, and I mean, these are, you know, you. We're couching these at the moment is as the cons of youth, but really they're the pros of age, of being older. Right. You know, all of these things sort of factor in together. So I like to look at, you know, it's just how I. My brain works. I like to look at the positives as opposed to the negatives. Right. But like, the. The smaller network. Well, I mean, the way I look at it is, as you. It's not that you have a small network when you're young. It's that as you age and as you march through your business life using your business brain, you gain a wider network and more resources. Right. You build up that capital. And not just capital of Cash, but capital of people and capital of experiences and all of those things factor into your ability to start that business. Like Ray Kroc did when he was 59.

Right.

I mean, he was selling milkshake mixers or something. Right. And not doing all that well with it. So at least not at that point in time. So. Yeah, yeah, that's true.

And you know, we talked about time of being a positive for a younger person. But actually once you get through this certain window, this, let's call it this 20 year window with kids and everything else I can speak to, this is once your kids move out and are starting getting their lives going, all of a sudden you have a bunch more time on your hands and that's a real asset that you can put into starting a business as you get older.

I started noticing that even when my kids were in college where the summers I had a really hard time being productive. And then as soon as September started it was like, oh yeah, my time is mine again. I can do all these things again. Not that I, I didn't enjoy the time that I would spend with my family, but just as a byproduct of them being around in that household dynamic, I just had less time. It's fascinating. Yeah. How quickly that can evolve. And I'm noticing it now because we're sort of having an extended summer with the way our kids lives are happening. But I'm interested to see my daughters moving actually out of the country next week. So I'm curious to see if, if that changes things. I'm sure it will. I'm just curious to see how it will change things. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But if you're in the middle of those that, you know, if, if your kids are what, you know, whatever age and you're just, you know, you're, you're fully engrossed in that experience, which I highly recommend you, you should be to enjoy it and get them launched and build those deep connections with your family. You know, rest assured it will change and you will have more time again. It is another phase of your life and that's a great time to start, start a new company.

It really is. And maybe one, if it makes sense to do it maybe one with your spouse or your partner or whatever, you know.

Yeah.

Like that, that can be a good, a good empty nest activity too. And, and you know, one that might fund your retirement, who knows? Right. So that's right.

That's exactly right. One of the things that, you know, we talked about assets and you're young, you don't really have many to put at risk. But on the flip side, as you get older, it reminds me. And I. And I don't remember the name of this movie, but it was. I think it was Kathy Bates or something. But some. Some young person swooped in and stole a parking spot and. And, you know, older Kathy Bates is sitting there, and these two young girls jump out and kind of laugh at her, and she just rams her car into them and pushes them out of the way, and they look shocked. And she's like. She gets out of the car and says, hey, comes with age. More better insurance, you know, and so you're smarter at protecting the assets you have.

Right.

And you know how to. Okay, I got to cover myself here. You know, my vacation rental homes are each LLCs, so they're a little bit more protected, different, you know, more insurance to cover me for this, a bigger umbrella policy in case something goes wrong.

I definitely own more insurance now than I did when I was a kid or younger, you know, whatever, in my 20s and all that. Like, I've learned the value of that peace of mind, which is an interesting thing.

Yeah, Yeah. I think you have to, I guess. Yeah, I think it's important.

Yeah, I do. Well, it gives me the freedom to just, like, operate and know, okay, there's a little bit of a safety net there. If something screws up, I can protect that and march forward. It's good. Yes. Yeah. Yep.

I. I agree. You know, and then you also, I think as you get older, hopefully you've had more experience in leadership and what it takes to be a good leader. Hopefully you've listened to, you know, 401 episodes of, you know, Business Brain previously, aka the Small Business show, aka the DBA podcast.

Remember, I think for the first few episodes, we were. The DBA podcast. Yeah. People thought we were writing about database administration, so we had to change that to talking about dba. So.

Yeah, well, that's what you used to do in the old days, right? You file a DBA.

Yeah.

Now you do an LLC.

Yeah. I guess you can still file DBAs. And in fact, I was thinking of filing a DBA for one of my LLCs, so. How about that? Wow. Well, actually, I was thinking of filing a DBA for one of my C Corps. The Mac Observer, Inc. Is a company I still own. We sold an asset out of that at the beginning of the year, that asset being MacObserver.com, and actually many assets that sort of encompassed what it is to publish MacObserver.com, but the asset, MacGeek Gab, stayed inside the company and I could go and change the corporate name and all of that stuff. I don't really know that I need to. It doesn't really matter what the company's called. In fact, the company that you and I operate this show under is called Deals on the Web llc. Doesn't really matter, you know. And so I was thinking of filing a DBA for the Mac Observer Inc. For MacGeek Gab, just to sort of get that name out there in a way that if I needed to, I could, you know, put it on stuff. Like there are some entities that say, oh no, you need to have a DBA or a company company name on something. And so I was thinking about that. I don't know, it probably doesn't matter.

Interesting.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And so the few things too that I want to highlight is this concept of action. Again, you know, when you're older, I think you, you lean into that for me to get stuff done. It's not enough just to think about it or write these great ideas down on paper. So you've, you've, you've taken it, hopefully you've internalized it, you know, by osmosis over time. And you, you can, you just get things done faster, I think. And because you're tapping into that, that reality, you know, I think it's a real important thing as you, as you age, you realize that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

The cons. So the, one of the big ones, and I wanted to ask you, Dave, is we've talked about fear on the show a lot. You know, not making fear based decisions, but also maybe using fear as a compass to point you in certain.

Sure.

Do you think fear of failure gets more intense as you age?

Oh, man, yes and no. I mean, we, we sort of some ways. Right. Yeah. I mentioned before that I am more tolerant of taking risk now, but I think maybe I need to revise that a little bit. I'm more tolerant of doing things I would not have been comfortable doing in the past. But I don't know that that's entirely because I've got a little bit of a savings and I have a safety net. Right. I mean, that's partially true, but it's also. I've had enough experience to know what is likely to succeed and what's likely to fail and those sorts of things. Or where I'm likely to succeed and fail. Which is the right way to look at things, I think. Not whether an idea is likely to succeed or Fail. But whether I am likely to succeed or fail participating in that idea, because we are our own biggest assets and worst enemies as entrepreneurs, for sure. So do I have a greater fear of failure now? I think so, if only because of my. I have a reputation now.

Yeah, that. That. That's a good point. And I have my note below. This comment is kind of your. Also your social standing.

Yeah. Oh, right. Yeah.

Your place in the community, your. Your place in your, you know, among friends and the things you've achieved. Are you willing to put.

Put it on the line again?

Put on the line again?

Yeah.

And so maybe the answer is, is, you know, tapping into these pros that we just talked about and, you know, protect. Making sure you protect yourself, surrounding yourself with a talent that you've connected with and your network of resources to protect that social standing while you go out and start something new. Yeah, but it's something to think about.

Yeah.

And I thought about it when I was laying this out, and it kind of hit me. It's like, okay, because I'm getting to the point where I'm just about ready to do something new again. And so beginning, you know, next year, I'm coming up into one of my favorite times of the year where I spend a lot of time in a duck blind. So I'll have lots of time to think about this.

Yeah.

And it's definitely time to do something new. And I don't know what that is yet, but I. I also think, wow, okay. You know, I want to be sure I do it and don't screw this up. Don't screw that. Don't put too many assets at risk. And also the fear. Do I want to hire people and run a company like that again or outsource and use contractors and that kind of stuff?

I mean, when you started Shannon's Closet, your Poshmark business, you went into that saying with a very specific set of parameters. Right. I want to be able to run this business from my phone. I want to be able to do it on my own. You know, you had all of these things and. And that obviously it was fairly successful for you, and that's a good thing. And, you know, you were able to have some fun with it and make some money and all of that good stuff. Like, great. But I wonder, was that a byproduct of the fear of failure? Right. Did you. Right. I mean, I don't. I don't. I'm not here to, like, armchair psychiatrist you or any. This is therapy. But. But, you know, like, if. If you had said, well, or I could just throw caution to the wind and hire a bunch of people and do this at scale. And I don't, I mean I don't know if that would have, if that particular business would have even worked to scale. But yeah, you know, like there is that. Oh, you know, I've done okay. I figured out how I'm going to pay for at least a good chunk of the rest of my life. Now I'm just looking for something to do with my time. Again, I don't mean to put words in your mouth, but those are easy thoughts to have and then they become self limiting in a sense they are. I don't know. This is an interesting thing to think about. I'm probably talking about you so that I don't have to think about me.

That you are. But like for me, what I realized is one of the biggest fears I have is losing the flexibility that I have now.

Right, right, right.

I did not have for like 30 years when I was working like you know, just hustling day and night and.

Yeah.

Starting, you know, one company after another and hiring all kinds of people and, and I mean I have a great time, do it, doing it and I have no regrets, but I really enjoy the flexibility that I have now. Being able to turn the business on and off was something I never had experienced before. So if I want to take two weeks off or a month off, I can really just in that business, flip a switch and I don't have to worry about it anymore.

Yes.

Maybe I don't make, maybe I don't make, you know, generate revenue. But that's not the sole reason why I started the business. I started it really to learn and I don't. This is another benefit of age, if you've had some success is I don't need the money to live.

Right.

Just like when I was young, I didn't need much money to live. Now I don't need that money to live because I.

You don't need to, you don't need to earn cash to live, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And so. But those things are limited. But that I appreciate you talking through this because what I realized is the biggest thing I'm fearful of is losing my flexibility. And I will continue to protect that even at the expense of. I'm not. Maybe I won't build a business that scales, but I will build something that scales to the size that works for me.

Yeah. This is interesting. I see a lot of people who go through exactly this right. Where they, you Know, do whatever it is they've done. And it can be a corporate career, too, or, you know, or you built a business, whatever, where you're just like in the thick of it, making it happen, succeeding, perhaps even succeeding wildly, and just having a wonderful, you know, outcome from all of this, potentially, you know, life changing for your family, all of these good things. But then you get to the end and you exit it, however that exit happens. But there's still time left on your personal clock. You know, people who have those events in their. In their, you know, in their 50s kind of thing, and it's like, well, you know, there's Even in their 40s, I could do more. But you have a little bit of that PTSD of man, I don't know that I could do more. Like, you start questioning, can I put myself. Do I want to put myself through that again? Yeah. And you have the talk about charmed life. You have the opportunity to choose whether or not you want to do that. And that is a privileged position that you've worked hard to attain. But it is one of those things. And I see people do that and generally take a couple of years and say, no, I'm not going to get involved in anything. I'm talking to a friend who sold his company. I think it was about two and a half years ago. He's hit the end of his contract, his employment contract with the people who bought the company. And now he's exiting that. And I was saying, oh, what's next? He's like, nothing. He's like, I need to, like, decompress for a little while now. He. That decompression may. I mean, he. I know what he made when he sold this company. So it's like the idea of needing to work doesn't. Unless, I don't know, maybe he's, you know, he's got four more mansions he needs to buy or something. But, you know, other than that, he's going to be fine. But he's like, yeah, I need to. And I heard that sort of PTSD type of thing in his voice when we were having this conversation. And it's common. But what's also common is a lot, not all, a lot of those people, after three or four years of sort of leaving it behind, realize I still got one more in me. You know, I want to do this again. That was exciting. I miss the excitement of it. And I equate this to how I felt when, you know about having kids. Because when you're having, like, especially in the early years of Having a kid, like, it's a. It's a. It's a grind, man. Like, you know, and it's a grind. And I remember when our son was born. Our daughter was two, exactly to the day. Our son was actually. They were born on the same day, two years apart. And I remember we were up that night with our son, and he was, like, crying and wanting to, you know, eat, but couldn't. And, like, it was just. It was one of those nights. And I was like, man, it's amazing. I said to my wife, really, my first reaction was, go get the video camera. We need to record this moment so that we don't forget it. Because I forgot what this was like. I had just remembered, like, all the cool parts about it. And this is how our minds work, right? We endure the pain, but we don't have memories of most pain. Some super painful events, yes, but it's more the repercussions of the pain. But that pain just. You just don't remember it. And you remember the good stuff. And so I think that's part of what happens with people who get through the. The business, you know, or whatever it is you get out of the grind. At first you're like, well, I need to get away from the grind. And then it's like, I miss the excitement of the grind. You know, the grind was really fun. That was good. And you sort of forget how grueling it can be when you're in the thick of it, and so you wind up doing it again. And that's okay. There's nothing wrong. That's a feat.

That's a feature.

That's a feature of the human brain. That's correct. Yep. Yeah. Yep, exactly.

That's why your parents always talk about what a great kid you were when you were like, really?

I beg to differ. Yeah.

Because you glossed over it. You did. You know, if. If you thought about all the. All the rough edges, maybe you wouldn't do it again. But you're, you know, you're built to procreate.

So that's it, right? Yeah, well, there's that. And. And we're built to. To push forward. It's, you know, sitting around and. And resting on our laurels is not. It's not. Certainly not in our nature when we're using our business brains, that's for sure. Yeah, that's right.

Well, it's a great topic, and we would love to hear from you, whatever age you are, and talk about the benefits, the pros and cons of starting a company at whatever age. Feedback Businessbrain show will connect you with us and we'd love to hear from you.

Absolutely. Like he said, feedbackusinessbrain Show. Make sure to check out our sponsors, shopify.com SBS and go listen to E Commerce Master plan. That's going to help you lead that charmed life. We'll see you next week.