Hayden Bowles - From High School Dropout to Millionaire Ecom Entrepreneur and Real Estate Investor by 22

Welcome back to the Casey Adams show. Today I am joined by one of my good friends, Hayden Bowles. Thank you so much for coming on the show, brother.

My pleasure, my pleasure. Thanks for having me, Casey.

Of course. So you're here, you're visiting la. This is the first podcast in the new at home studio. So welcome.

Beautiful man, beautiful studio.

Thank you so much. And I've been looking forward to this. I know, you know, you're in town, you're all over. You've been different countries this past 30 days and you're in town. We're shooting some content and we were just catching up over lunch and it's just so crazy because I don't think we've seen each other for almost two years, but we've known each other for the past five years and just to see your growth and what you've been able to build has been so incredible and excited to dive into it today. And for everyone that's watching, if you aren't familiar with Hayden, I would love for you, Hayden, to give a little bit of context about your, your journey, what you do today. Real estate, ecom, super high level. And then we'll dive into the journey.

Absolutely. Well, back to what you said about, you know, not seeing you for a while. I think there's some friends where you can go years and you pick up right where you left off.

Absolutely.

It's as if no time passed at all. So I always appreciate that about you. Yeah. My name's Hayden Bowles. Been in the e commerce industry primarily for the last five plus years. Dabbled with other things before that, but had an e commerce store take off when I was 17, built the second one, then built a YouTube channel around it. Saw that there was a pretty big gap in the marketplace in terms of education, both products for that and services. So we built the company e comm Season, which is now one of the largest training platforms for e commerce businesses. We've had almost 3,000 businesses go through that over the last five years. So it's been pretty expansive on that side of things. Building one of the largest YouTube channels for E commerce that has since snowballed into just so many incredible relationships. I mean, I probably wouldn't be sitting here, wouldn't even have met you if I never started the social media stuff.

Yeah. So.

So it's definitely gotten my foot in the doors and a lot of incredible relationships, which has been great. So grateful for that. That has since spun off into now needing a place for the cash that you make. So for me, that was Real estate. Decided to start purchasing that. Always wanted to get there. I got tangled up in the weeds pretty good with my business in terms of like being stuck in it over the years as I built it. So, you know, hiring and getting people to automate stuff was a struggle for sure. So when I built the real estate, I was like, all right, how do I set this up from day one to just be a lot like, just so that I'm more removed from it, basically. Yeah, like I like to be involved, but built that. And I won't go super in detail on it yet, but, you know, started buying properties myself, then started a real estate fund called Bulls capital. We raised $1.4 million earlier this year on the first acquisition under there. And just continuing to do everything else. Making a shift to go larger content on YouTube, which has been a lot of fun. So just building the team. We got more employees now than ever and it's been a lot of fun. So very grateful for the journey. I'm a kid from Minnesota and I'd always wanted to get out of Minnesota. So yeah, I lived in California here for a while. You were in a beautiful location.

Thank you.

Yeah. Excited to be here, man.

That's so epic. And you're 22, 23 now.

22, 22.

Same as me. When's your birthday?

March 6th.

March 6th. Epic. Well, we could go in so many different directions, man. And I know that I'm familiar with when we first met back, I think it was San Diego at the event that Kieran and I were hosting. Where did this journey begin for you? You said, you know, you're from Minnesota, you are now buying real estate, raising millions of dollars for properties, buying 48 unit buildings. 48? Yeah, 48. And you've grown so quickly. Right? It's. It's uncommon to meet a 22 year old that is buying these type of assets and has the amount of experience and learning that you have just within this short five year time frame, which is beyond impressive. And I'd love to take it back. Like, what led you to business, entrepreneurship? You're a kid from Minnesota. Where did this drive come from? You know, in your childhood, what led you to pursuing this path?

Yeah, first of all, I appreciate the kind words. I think it's just an innate drive to want to have options. That's really what it's all been for me. So, you know, whether I want to buy a car, go to Chipotle, like those are two decisions to me. And regardless of the money, like, I just want to have the Option to do those, right? If I want to leave suddenly, like, I just did, and screw it, I want to go snowboard in three different countries. Like, I've just never done that. Let's go. Like, that's important to me, and usually I don't act on it. You know, I have great impulse control when it comes to, like, buying stuff and just investing for the long term. But, you know, I like to have that mobility, the flex, the flexibility of location is very important to me. So when it comes to business, always, you know, it was mowing lawns when I was 12 and 13 and, like, started to grow that. Making money there. And then that just started funding the online stuff, so building Instagram pages that weren't based around me and doing affiliate marketing and selling ad space through that. So that then led into E Commerce, which is what I was really diving into. When we met in San Diego, I wasn't. Hadn't really taken off. I was making, you know, three grand a month when I was down there. But very shortly after, I mean, it was probably the next month or two. I mean, it just skyrocketed. I mean, we hit the first product, right? I was able to connect with a lot of great people there. And then that first store took off. And then that's what really just. It opens your eyes, you know, every time you do something new and it works, and it's just a drastic change. It opens your eyes for sure, and it just shows you, like, it reaffirms that there's an abundant amount of anything you want, you know, and you can have that abundance mindset, and anything you want, you can get. It's just gonna be difficult. It's gonna take longer than you thought. But you can get it with the right action, the right effort, the right connection. So it's just been an incredible journey, for sure.

What led you to being at that event in San Diego? Cause I know, like, we were following each other on social. Was it Kieran that invited you to really draw the connections here and to dive deep into our background and relationship? Do you remember, like, what led you to being there?

I think it was Kieran who invited me for sure. I don't know if it was before or after that. Me and I flew to his place and. And we hung out for a little while. So, yeah, I think it was definitely him. And also you inviting me there, which was. It was a fun week. So I went down there and I ended up staying for, like, two weeks. So I went up and stayed in Orange county right next to where I ended up moving to for a year. And that just really, like, it made me fall in love with California. Yeah, I saw the abundance here and the mindset and just the weather and everything. You know, all the classic stuff, so.

Absolutely. And so you were 17 and when. What was the transition? Moving from Minnesota, moving to California, like, getting out of your state. We have that very much so in common where I'm from. Virginia, small town, same people, same friends, people doing the same things. And they're not. Most of the time, they're not productive activities, and you just want to get out of a certain environment. That was a huge motivating factor for me to initially move out to Arizona, like, two months after I graduated high school. Then now I'm in California, and there's no looking back. Right. Like, there's no thought that I've ever wanted to say, hey, I cannot wait to go move back to Virginia. Right. But for you, like, what was that transition process? Because I think there's a lot of young people maybe, that are just starting their businesses today where making that jump is a first big challenge. Right. Like, as soon as you get over that, the challenges get bigger and bigger and bigger. But just making that first jump is something that I think a lot of young people have. Have a hard time with, especially if you're. It's uncommon for you or, you know, those in your family to do something so massive.

Yeah. I want to go back to something you said a few questions ago. I didn't want to go on a tangent then, but about, you know, you said, I grew really fast. It's uncommon for someone of this age to have done this. But I don't. I don't look at it quite as that, because it's all about who you surround yourself with. And while comparison is a thief of all joy, when people say stuff, and I agree to a certain degree. Right. But when you look at what other people have done from an inspiration perspective, like, what I have done does not seem large at all. In fact, it breeds the question of, like, why haven't I done more? Like, why didn't this scale further? So. And it's. It's all been a learning experience. I wouldn't change it for the world, but, you know, for me, it's all about who I've been surrounding myself with. So back to the friends, you know, that I love dearly back home. Yeah. You just don't spend as much time with them. You know, even when I was living there, you know, I'd go a month or two without seeing my friends that I used to see five days a week, you know. And then as for moving to California, which was the goal, I was in my parents basement working. I was trying to figure out a way to do it on that $3,000 a month income. It was wildly inconsistent. I was like, okay, I can like rent a room and like share it with like a house with eight of the people, you know, but you know, just to give transparency into the story, like by the time I moved to California, I was bringing in like 60 grand a month net. I had six figures in the bank. The business had been consistent. So from a financial perspective, there was no worry at all. Now I was a very cheap person. I was extremely frugal just because it was new. But you know, it wasn't a huge deal financially. So I think getting into that position first of all helped obviously make that decision very easy and logical. It also, I'm just glad the business took off because at that same time I was doing online school. So my second to last year of high school, I'd switched to online school. Outsourced that 65 bucks a week. So I wasn't doing any school, which.

Just 65 bucks a week. You can outsource your high school education.

The entire high school education. Yeah. Her English was a little shaky, which was actually good because she kind of messed up some stuff. So the grades were believable, you know, compared to what I previously got. Anyways, she had to leave. I flunked all the classes. Parents get the report card in the mail. Cause it's like an online school. They were never checking. And yeah, they basically said like, you have to go back to school and recomplete these classes and finish or you can't live at home. You know, you have to be a full time student. And at that point I wasn't because I dropped out. And I was like, okay, well I'm not doing that. So they're like, okay, well you have two weeks to leave. And I don't think they thought I actually would because they didn't know I was making any money. None of the banks or anything was ever run through their name, their accounts. They weren't co signers. It was my grandpa who was. So he was the one who was willing to do that because they weren't. And we're on great terms. Fantastic, fantastic relationship. But doing that was something I needed to do. I'm sure I was difficult growing up. There was a lot of headbutting and stuff. But you know, making that jump to California was Really fun. So on day 13, I was on an airplane. A few days prior, my car was on a car carrier and. Yeah, back.

And when you're going through this process, is there fear, excitement, any sort of, like, double taking a decision? Or was it just the conviction that there was no looking back, as you said? Like, what was your mind's mindset then, right when it comes to your parents? Just how old were you at the time?

17.

17. Like, what were you going through? Was there any massive challenges mentally, or is it just pure excitement and joy and, like, I'm gonna go prove this to myself and just get out there and do it? Yeah.

I mean, it was all excitement there. There wasn't fear behind it at all. Partly because of the safety net of the finances. But moving back home was never an option.

Yeah.

You know, and that actually, like, something I believe you can trick your mind into believing whatever you want. It's like when I ended up getting into the first relationship, and, like, she's like, why are you always, like, we never make time for each other. Like, you're not doing anything. We never go to dinner. And I'm like, well, if this doesn't work, I'm homeless. Like, it's just as plain as black and white. That's what it is. And who are you talking about? Like, it was just totally unrealistic. But, like, in the moment, that is what I believed. I would have died believing that. And because it just wasn't an option. Now, realistically, you got 10 friends you can go with and whatever, but, like, yeah, you know, there's a lot of stuff going on there. So, you know, it was all excitement. I was very confident of what I was doing, and I needed to leave. And I knew that leaving the house would actually create a better relationship with my family. And it has, you know, so now it's great. I'm very grateful for that.

Yeah. What was the. Speaking of your grandfather, you bought him a car. I remember you put out this piece of content that I just found so inspiring, and I'm sure that was a huge. A big moment for you. That just felt so great to do. I'd love to dive into that. What was that story? What led you to doing that and being so gracious and generous to buy your grandfather a car and, you know, what was that experience like for you?

Yeah, thank you. It was definitely an emotional one, just between me and him. You know, I did make a video about it because I wanted to show people that, like, you can do that. And it's something that you should do help those that helped you. Like, I didn't feel an obligation in a negative way to him, but I had to buy him a car because when I was 16, he went and co signed for my first LLC just so I could open a bank account and get a debit card. Because that's all I needed to start the business. I needed a way to transact. I didn't need any money. I just needed that. My parents are like, nope, you're failing school right now. This before the online school, they're like, you can do that once you're 18. And in my head I'm like, okay, well, starting a business takes time. And if I have to be a student, right, to live at home. But then I wouldn't be a student because I'm starting the business. I'd be homeless with no money. Okay. Only option here is to do that with him. So I told him, when I make my first million bucks a year, I'll buy you a car. Like his dream car. He was always a car guy. Never really had the funds to like, really go after it. So, you know, he chose his spec. It was a one of three rare limited edition in the U.S. just absolutely gorgeous. For any of my car folks out there, it was an X3 M40i, brand new BMW. It's just absolutely incredible spec. And. And he's had a lot of fun. He's traded that like five times, gotten different cars and whatnot.

So, so good.

You know, it was. It was definitely a great moment. You know, for me, it was weird at that point, at that point in my life too. Like, the money didn't have a lot of utility to me, I like not to sound like. It's not like a bragging thing, whatever. Just I wasn't spending a lot, so surplus cash had no place. Like, it's just getting added up in a bank, which is just numbers on a screen. So for me, I wasn't investing at the time. I was like, absolutely, this is the right time. Let's do it.

Yeah.

So bought him that car for his 80th birthday. And it was.

It was so cool.

Yeah.

That's incredible, man. Speaking of investing, I want to dive into real estate because, you know, and again, whatever you want to talk about in terms of numbers and all these things, I know you're open about this on your YouTube channel, so feel free to go in different directions. But you got into real estate at what time? What was the first property you bought? Why did you decide to, you know, start investing in real estate? Obviously there's many, many reasons and you've done very well in it. But what led you to investing in real estate and what was your first deal?

Yeah, the first couple of properties I bought were in a very tight time span. It was in two months or so I bought three properties, about two houses and a duplex, a little two unit that was about 1.2 million bucks to dive into numbers and logistics. Happy to share anything. I was 19, which means to get, you know, financing for any properties you need either a W2 job with history or if you're self employed, it's longer. You need two years of tax returns. So that was from when I was. People say, oh, it's impossible to get the debt. I had made good money when I was 17, so I had a tax return from there and then 18 really dragged it up so I could get financing for almost anything I wanted. And then 19 also showing cash and liquidity. So I went and got those properties. I put about a quarter million bucks down between them, got those two homes. The reason I did that was number one, I'd always wanted to get into real estate. So that's a great way to get my feet wet. In my opinion, it was little to no risk. Those properties were paying for themselves. Incredible neighborhoods. I just moved from California to Arizona, which is where I bought those properties. I knew how cheap it was. I knew where rents were going in Arizona, Arizona. And I was right. Some people are like, why are you doing this? Like you should, you know, put money into a business. I was right. I was 100 accurate for what I was trying to solve for. And like those rents that were 1900 for a house, now it's 3, 200 bucks and they're cash flowing well. And you know, like I've, I've more than doubled my money on everything I've touched and so I've done really well on those properties. But there's a whole nother avenue that people don't understand which is the taxes. So there's that whole variable where now because I'm considered a full time real estate professional, spend 750 hours a year in real estate in some regard. I can take depreciation, which is paper losses and I can carry that over to my business income. So I can reduce my tax bill by hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, which is incredible.

Right.

So. And you can just roll that forward as far as you want. There's a lot of different ways to do it. 1031s, which I have done, but then there's A third variable I want to touch on, which is kind of the unknown of having too much cash sit in, which is a real thing. And so for me, at that time, you might have seen I was buying a lot of cars. I started spending a little too much money. I was getting a little too comfortable with stuff. And it wasn't that I was like, I was never. Designer clothes. Like, you know, I'm not a design guy. Yeah, you guys have a beautiful studio here. I just. I wouldn't know how to do it.

But Shout out to Jacqueline. Yes, the design.

Beautiful. And so for me, like, I was. I was buying cars left and right. And the reason I really wanted to get rid of the cash. I bought two cars back to back, same day as an Audi I raid for like, 86 grand and another GTR for, like, however much it was.

I remember coming into your house one time, you had like, eight cars.

Yeah. I mean, we had this big house we rented, you know, guest house, big pool, 6,000 square feet. But it was. It was 5,500 bucks a month. That house was cheap. And I had a few roommates, few friends. Yeah, we had 14 cars at that house, 10 car garage. It was. It was massive. And I was buying all these cars, you know, Lamborghinis, whatever. We're making content with them. So, like, never lost money.

Yeah.

But I bought those two cars back to back, and I didn't want either of those cars particularly. Like, it wasn't like, I was like, yeah, whatever. Like, somebody showed him to me. He's a car guy. He knows good deals. They're a private party. No sales tax. Like, I knew I wasn't going to lose money, so it's kind of just placing the money. And I barely touched those cars. Like, my friends drove them more than I did. That's where I was like, we need to reevaluate here. Like, what, What. Why did I make that purchase? And that's where I dove into me. Like, my M4 was a purchase for me. The Lamborghini dream car purchase for me. A lot of the other cars just. And the one for my grandpa. But the other ones, like, didn't have a purpose. And I was like, okay, like, that's not a negative. I'm glad I experienced this. It was able to, you know, act on that impulse and now learn how to rein it back and control it. But I was like, okay, let's just restructure. Sold a few cars, stopped hanging around certain people that I viewed to have a negative influence on me. Stop hanging out as much and simply started just changing my life, you know, for the better. Just slowly readjusting things. And so it was around that time, too, where I started buying properties. At the same time, I got a little shiny ball syndrome in the business, tried to chase opportunities in that. Ended up losing almost a million bucks in three months.

Doing what?

26 different E commerce stores with some bad partners.

26 different E commerce stores?

Yeah.

You tried to launch 26 at the same time with different partners and.

Yeah, well, so I had two partners who had equity. I was the one funding everything. We had a negative run rate of about ten grand a day. One of them, at the end ended up stealing 243 grand for me. He spent it on an Amex, on Facebook ads for his own store.

Right.

And so I didn't notice because we're spending, I mean, probably 400, 300,000 a week on Facebook ads at the time. So it's like I'm seeing the transaction. The transaction looks real, but the numbers weren't adding up. Right. It's still the same, same biller.

And I want to pause you there, because I think this would be valuable for the listener or the viewer. You know, you're talking about buying all these cars. These properties are in between 17 to now, 22 within this time frame.

And.

And these are not small numbers. Right. When it comes to these young entrepreneurs watching and listening, oh, my God, I want to buy one jar. That's my goal. One day or one property, and you're spending hundreds and thousands of dollars and you to take it back. For your perspective. I think perspective is so important. You were then short, very many short years prior, making three grand a month, trying to figure it out, and living at home, failing out of high school. What. How were you able to maintain that from a. Just your mentality and what you deem as normal? And what were some of the mechanisms you've used to just grow within your area? Because sometimes people, they grow too quickly, and it can be a downfall. But you've maintained and you've grown so much. And I've known you as a friend for years. When it comes to your professionalism and how you communicate, it's just I see so much growth in you, and I know viewers maybe can't see that, but from our friendship, what were some of the things that you've done to maintain that and to just stay like who you are at your core and to balance all this, you know, new successes over the years?

Yeah, I think a big piece is perspective on it. Like, who you're hanging around is a big one. And I've had periods where there's not great people around, and that's 100% my fault. Like, they steal money from me. It was my fault.

That's crazy. You're telling these stories like, oh, I lost 240 grand. I'm like, dude, we could go on.

I mean, that was a big one, right?

Hours.

And it ripped me. Like, it was. It. It hurt for sure. But, like, I was never upset for a second during that entire period because I recognized all my fault.

Okay, People.

And I have friends, family, people like, oh, you need to sue them. And they're like, they stole money from you. Blah, blah. I'm like, sure, that happened. And there was a lawsuit out of it. Nothing transpired. You can't sue someone who doesn't have any money. But it's like, it was still my fault. I allowed that to happen. It slipped through the cracks. I didn't watch the details. And clearly there was something wrong in that partnership that led them to do that.

Yep.

Whether it was my fault during or me not analyzing them beforehand correctly, which was probably it as well. So that happened. And kind of dive into the numbers, you know, Like, I lost a bunch of money. It is what it is. Had to kind of cut off a bunch of stuff that was bleeding. Kept a few of the brands. One of those stores did about 13 million bucks over the couple years span, which is an orthopedic brand. Ankle braces, knee braces. That was a company that most people didn't know I owned. That one was with a partner. 50. 50. Partner dissolved out. Too many Facebook ad accounts kept getting shut down and stuff, which is very standard in the industry, even though we weren't doing anything wrong at all. So, yeah, there was a lot of lessons out of that. But as for, like, the whole staying grounded thing, like, I just. I see people go crazy, and I don't think money, like, really changes you a lot. It just amplifies. Which sounds so cliche. But, like, I like to have fun. I like to do stupid stuff. You know, I might have made 30,000 in a day, but I'm still maybe dicking around the go kart track later. Like, who. Who knows? It's just anything can happen, you know? And then I'm, like, walking barefoot through the park, picking oranges off the trees. And, like, because it's December and they're great. And like, what? I just. I like to do stuff, you know, And I just. I don't know. I never let it really Change me in. In a negative way. And I think a big piece is because I. I took inventory, at least for the most part, of who I was around.

Yep.

I think that's the biggest one. You know, if I was around people who bought a lot of cars. I bought a lot of cars.

Yeah, right.

If I was around people buying designer, I probably would have because it's just who you hang around. It is 100 accurate. And it's hard sometimes to, you know, to not like to take inventory of that. Oh, he's my closest friend. I can't just not hang out with him. Like, I get it. But you can just pull back a little bit.

Yeah.

You know, and it's still your fault. If you're around the people buying cars and you buy cars, it's on you.

Yeah.

You know, so.

Yeah. And that goes with anything for sure. And I'm guessing nowadays you're spending a lot of time with people buying real estate.

That is accurate. That is.

Okay.

Yeah. So I'm paying actually a lot of money now to be in groups and to get into rooms, to get access to people and people like, oh, you're paying for your friends. I'm like, you could view it as that, but, like, if the barrier to entry is five grand to get into a room and it's quality people in the room, I'm gonna spend the five grand every time.

Yeah.

It's just. It is what it is. People can say scam or shout this. Like, it's not. I've been in the rooms. I've been in crappy rooms that I paid for too. And that's why I actually don't. I've never been to any quality e commerce event, like, ever. Like, and that's why I stopped attending cheap tickets.

Anyone can go. The quality control is not there.

It's leading with your chest. Can we do 600,000? Like, shut up, dude. That's like. It's just not that cool. So, you know, it's. I like people where they're just open. There's no leading with your chest. It's not an ego thing. It's like, how can we help grow, learn together? It's like, I've, like, I've been in some great real estate rooms. I've been in some bad ones, too.

Yeah.

Like, I have a great group that I found is a few hundred of us. It's not cheap. It's not expensive, though, for what it is. Like, I wouldn't have started my fund, wouldn't have bought the deal. I raised money from inside that group too, like pays for itself very quickly, you know. And I've been able to add value to a lot of people in a lot of ways. So which is just, that's the goal.

That's awesome. If you were to, you know, take a step back and get started in real estate today, right, Someone like myself that, who's not in real estate right now or someone watching that wants to get into it, what's your advice? Right, you had a lot of liquidity where you could deploy your own capital to deals that, that works for you and that's a very great spot to be in. But if you were just based on what you've learned so far, if you were to go try to buy some different properties, commercial whatever it may be that you recommend in the answer here, where, where did you start and what have you learned? Right, like you're 22, of course, like I've had dozens of like very successful real estate entrepreneurs on this show. But hearing it from your perspective of being someone that's 22, that's already raising, you know, $1.4 million, buying a 48 unit, like you're learning and you're so hands on right now that I think the perspective is, is very valuable, especially to young people looking to get into this space. And it's just coming from a different lens versus someone that got in real estate when they're 30 after 10 years of being, being a Realtor and then they finally had some cash to deploy. Like, what have you learned? What have been some of the, the most exciting parts, the most stressful and daunting parts. And what would you do if you were to get started today?

Yeah, I mean having your own money makes the entire process easier. Right? Because it's just very simple. If not, there is plenty of money out there for real estate. Like you could have no money and raise whatever you want. Like one of my good friends, Tim Bratz, he owns about 4800 apartments. He's actually a partner on the deal that we did and he put money into it too, which is a good deal. And I put money into one of his deals as well. But he's just a good friend of mine. He has raised over a hundred million dollars, bought half a billion worth of real estate in the last five years. Five years. He's only put in 130 grand of his own money. You're kidding. Yeah. And so like the way you're able to do it with zero is you just need to position it in some sort. Like there needs to be value for the investor. I invest in other people's deals. I don't even know if you know that. I invest as a limited partner in other people's real estate syndications. I vet the deal, sure. I'm also vet the person. But like that's something I do. If there's an advantage for me to do that, I'm glad to do it. It doesn't need to be in my own deal and you can raise money from someone. So if I was to start, you know, I bought houses. I don't like houses. I don't buy them anymore. From a rental perspective. I don't flip, I don't wholesale. I'm not trying to buy a new job, you know, for me, I'm long term only and I'd rather I don't do Airbnb. As great as it is. I have friends, one that lives here in Irvine that makes hundreds of thousands a month. Great. I love that. And I love the guy. Not for me, you know. So if I was to get started again, I would need to find a way to have an edge in some way. What I mean by that is either you have access to the money, like maybe you just know a ton of rich folks. Great, I'll give you a piece of my deal because you go raise the money for me, you're a partner on it in some way. That's value. Another thing could be, you know, a ton of property owners or you have a cold calling team from Columbia, which is a great one to speak good English, who reaches out to every property owner in a certain type of class and then you get all these leads for off market properties.

Great.

That's another point of value. I'll cut you in on the deal. So finding a way to get started and learn it and get involved is a huge thing. And if you're actually going to go raise money and you have no real track record, maybe you take the smallest little piece that's not worth your time financially, but it is to build the experience and the connections. You know, if you have a really good deal, right. And you're like, hey, I'll give you, you know, 95% of like whatever it is just something absurd. Right. And you'll do all the work, you know, Y. It's still like for me, I probably, I wouldn't even invest into that person. It's just too much of a risk because they're new.

Yeah.

The answer is no for me. But there are people that would say yes.

Yeah.

You know, Totally. So it just depends on the deal, you need to find an angle, a point of value, something.

Yeah.

So that's why I would start and I started gravitating towards apartments. I'll probably buy or build storage. That's, that's probably going to be the next thing later. But really dove deep into the apartments because I bought those two houses in the duplex. Duplex did better.

Cool.

Buy another. Cool. Buy a fourplex. Buy another fourplex. Buy a three plex. Buy a six unit. Sweet. Let's buy 48. Now I'm on a 45. Like, you know, just so. Yeah, it's been fun.

When you, when you think about like your buddy raised 100 million, $500 million with real estate he's bought over five years. Do you have any specific goals in mind? Because we were talking about this at lunch today. You said, you know, these, these chapters in life, like prior to like five years ago, you were just getting into this whole world of E Comm. Business and you're, you're entering this new chapter of your life. What do you think the next. Not what do you think, like what do you expect and what do you look forward to over the next five years when it comes to real estate in terms of, you know, current market, where you want to be? Just. I'd love to ideate with you and just hear your thinking process because, you know, a lot of times on social media, right, people watch your content, they see your videos and they see like what you're up to now. But that wasn't something that you just one day thought of and the next day you did. Like you, you had a process, you were thinking long term as you are. So what do you think for the next five years? Like where do you want to be, what type of real estate? And just how do you think about that overall?

Yeah, I mean, I think it's a constant journey of learning, of learning about yourself. Right. It could be about your emotions, which are something I talked about. Happy to talk about that, you know, and learning your craft, your business, whatever it is. Like there's a new company I'm starting that's great to spin off of other stuff I've done, but like working on new projects, I'm very careful of new stuff that I start. As for the real estate specifically, there'd be absolutely no reason to not grow that substantially over the next five years. People could say whatever they want about a downturn, but like the property we bought, like the one I'm trying to buy right now, I cherry pick stuff and I'm very selective because I'm looking for some advantage, some key advantage. On the last building, debt was super expensive, interest rates were soaring. Everybody's freaking out about properties. Great. I went in, I bought the LLC that owns the property. I assumed their current loan, 3.6%. There's an edge, right? I went and I found an edge on the new one that we're doing. There's an edge, two edges. So it's like just finding a way to like cherry pick it. So I definitely think scaling the multifamily apartment side of things, I definitely think the storage unit stuff is gonna be fun. Who knows what will come with that? I haven't done a deal, but continuing to buy the stuff, I know, like, I know apartments extremely well. I can buy a lot of that for sure. So it's just continuing to grow that. Grow the investor base, raise money. I want to be sending a lot of money to a lot of people. I think the cool part is there's a lot of entrepreneurs and I'm sure you know a ton of them who are great operators, they're good in their business, they make a ton of money, but they have no idea how to invest. That was me and it actually screwed me up because I had too much money. And then I was focused on like cars and random crap. And then that takes. It's just like it just. It was a distraction.

Yeah.

So just get rid of your money, kick it down for the long term. Like I'm. I used to really like the car. Like, I'm still kind of impressed by cars and whatever, but it's like I'm not impressed by a vehicle. Anybody can buy a car. It's not hard to get a Lamborghini. Oh, a quarter million dollars. You don't even need a quarter million to buy the car now. Like, I don't finance cars, but like you can get into cars for not a lot, you know, so there's creative ways to do that. So for me, I'm looking at like, what do you invest in and what's your long term stuff? What do you have going on? What are you building? What does your team look like? You know, so for me, that, that's where the next five years is. Learning more about myself, really dialing in my health. That's been a big focus last year and a half, which has been a great journey to learn and yeah, just continuing to run the companies, I hope making more money. I think I section my life into seasons. Five years was the last season. I think this next one is. And I've already been in it for a few months now. Is no longer really caring about cash collected on a monthly basis, which is really weird. Now, I'm not talking about the real estate, but the businesses. Like, I don't need to take a distribution.

Mm.

I'm good. Like, not long term good, but like, I like, let the business do its thing.

Yeah.

We've been spending so much money on new people and building out the team, and that's what's important to me.

Understanding the next five years, the last, I think almost two years you've lived in Puerto Rico. Well, how long has it been exactly?

It's been a little over two years.

A little over two years.

About two years, yeah.

And I remember when you first made this move, it was just like, A, that's epic. But B, like the tax programs. I would love to dive into it. You don't meet a lot of people that actively go through this. I'd love to hear maybe some of the stats, like how many people are actually a part of this program. But one. Why did you move to Puerto Rico? To how has the experience been? And of course, just about the tax program and why you're there I think is super important and people can learn a lot from.

Yeah. Yes. I live in Puerto Rico. The reason I moved there was solely taxes, specifically for the reason of keeping more margin that I'm making in my business for the purpose of investing long term. It's not just to have more cash, you know, numbers on the screen. So that's the thing, is to. To be able to basically buy more assets. And it's been a fantastic experience. Beautiful place. There's a lot of tax havens around the world. Puerto Rico is the only quality option for a US Resident who wants to maintain their citizenship. That's it. So that's the reason I moved there. Otherwise I probably would have selected a different location. My friends in the UK and over in Europe, they have many more options. Great. A lot of them go to Dubai. Right. So, yeah, lived in Puerto Rico. Continuing that forward. No end in sight. No. No hard date. So rolling with the punches as they come. And I still maintain a second home here in the States and doing a lot of traveling. So yeah, it's been a fun experience. As for the number that you asked about, nobody knows the exact number of expats on the island. There's different programs, Act 20, 22, 60, 168, and all this stuff, but there's probably about five to ten thousand on an island of three and a half million. So wow. It's not big.

What was when you first moved there? I guess the tax perspective. I'd love to just hear like day to day life. The transition from living in Arizona with friends, with, you know, in. In an environment that you know and love. What was that transition like for you when it comes to running the business, being in a completely different environment and just tucked away in Puerto Rico?

Yeah, it was quiet. You know, the very deep tropical stuff is not my environment. I like the mountains, I like to snowboard, I jump out of airplanes. I go do. I shoot guns in the des. I drive fast cars. None of that happens in Puerto Rico, you know, so it's like I'm on the golf course, like hanging out with 55 year old dudes.

You've been getting into golfing though, right? Dude, we gotta go. I see you killing it. I'm like, okay, we gotta make it happen.

I grew up messing around. We'd sneak onto the golf course nearby and just play the same holes over and over. But yeah, so getting back into that's been a lot of fun. But it's very quiet, you know, it's. It's very quiet thing to do when, when I'm out in Puerto Rico. So I don't do a lot. I mean day to day life is work, have a couple of meals, I hit the gym every day and then I go back to work. Like I don't do anything on the weekends. Maybe we go golf with a couple buddies or get together. But it's, it's very frequently like once a month or twice a month at best. You get out. Like I don't do a lot. I need to do better of getting out of the house. But I've also never been in Puerto Rico for more than five weeks straight in two years. So I just.

You're sectioned off, you. You get to, you get to live and actually pop around.

Very.

Yeah.

I mean it felt like a vacation for the first couple months.

Yeah.

Like any tropical destination. But it's not like California. It's is very different. You know, I moved there from Arizona. But it's. It's an interesting lifestyle. It's. It's dangerous. It's a dangerous place. For sure it is.

Have you had any encounters?

No, but I don't know how graphic we can get on here. But my, I mean one of the, one of the ones top of mind after the hurricane just hit, which I was there for.

Wow.

My friends who live not far from me, they actually live directly across the street from my barbershop Beautiful multimillion dollar place, right? It's a nice area. And they got held up at gunpoint at 11 at night. He knows guns, I know guns. Automatic weapon, right? Illegal. Anyways, they get held up there. He's like, dude, I'm walking my dog, it's 11 and I have my phone on me here. You want my phone? Like, take my phone. The guy didn't even take his phone. He was all pissed, holding a gun to his neck. Two guys and two of my friends. And anyways, like, what the hell? Like they, you know, kind of freak out, go to walk in their house, like, call the police and whatnot. And like, you know, lock their gate and stuff.

But they followed them in.

No, no, no, no. The people then they were just walking along the street and those two guys left 60 seconds later. You can see the police report. It's actually public information if you search it up. Exactly one minute later, from 7920 at night to 9:21pm was when the gunshots were reported. They opened fire with an automatic weapon on a woman and her boyfriend who were walking down the street who probably refused to give their wallet. That woman turned out to be an FBI agent with her DEA agent boyfriend on vacation.

Wow.

Immediately turned into a federal case. Big thing. That's just Puerto Rico, man. And like, there's danger everywhere. But like, you can look at the crime rates there. It's simple statistics. Like, it's not the safest place. It's definitely out of place for that to happen. This area, I think it's crazy. The hurricane pushed people to do something, but like, there was still blood on the street when I went to get my haircut. Like, that woman got shot where I parked my car, like I've parked in that exact. Where her body was.

Wow.

And I actually don't think she died anyways. Like, you can go look it up. Puerto Rico shooting federal.

Wow, that's crazy.

Yeah. So it's, you know, one of many instances.

Yeah.

You know, like, there's a lot of people there that send me death threats just because I'm public about my stuff and like talk about it like, you know, so you never know.

You gotta be careful, brother.

You never know.

You talked about health. I think that as, as entrepreneurs, you know, we were talking about. I ran my first marathon last weekend. I, I, very much so.

Thank you. Incredible.

I, I, I take my health seriously. And over the years it's becoming more and more important. You know, as time goes on, you realize like, at the end of the day it is Such a key pillar of everything in life from your, your mental clarity, from your performance to just everything.

Yes.

And for me, that sort of fell into this whole new world of different wearables and things that I use for enhancement purposes. Like I have the Oura ring. As, as you know, over here at my, my spot, I got the cold plunge that will hit after this fancy digital watch. Yeah, the Apple watch. And I like these things because it optimizes data and I can see patterns over a period of time that just give me insight that I love. For you. I'd love to hear just what does health mean to you? How do you take care of yourself? You're balancing businesses and traveling and all these different things. How do you dedicate the time? And I think most importantly with that time, how has it impacted your life versus working and making a lot of money when you, let's say, weren't taking care of yourself the way you think you should?

There's a lot of periods when you're building a business where you can't sleep. Like, there's absolutely, like there just won't be an opportunity for you to grab five hours of sleep. Like, there's just something that needs to be done and that is what. And like, I want to preface it with like, end. That's okay. That's like the end part to that statement. Like, oh, but I have to sleep. No, you don't. You're fine. So it's like you're going to especially go through that when you're building something. Um, and I think that's okay. Um, so for me, I was definitely unhealthy with sleep. I built some bad habits, um, you know, screens in the room, that sort of thing. Uh, for me it starts with sleep. I think that's huge. I wore an aura ring for two years. Still have one. I'm just tracking that more so, so I can see my outlier data, what affects me the most. So for me, I'm a big no screens before bed. You know, I just don't want to be looking at a screen. I think you're an idiot if the last thing you look at in the day light wise is artificial light from a phone. Not good. And if you're going to do that flux or blue light or night shift on your device with blue light blocking glasses, I have those laying around all over the place. That's big for me. Same thing waking up, same thing. Now I usually get right to work. I don't do coffee. I'm not doing some like jumungi Prayer in the morning and, like, meditating and getting in a cold plunge, which I love. Cold plunge. Yeah. I'm not knocking that. I love it. And we're going to rip one right after this, 100%. I'm big on that. I don't have one. I should buy one. But it starts for me there. Just like a little bit of time at night, a little bit in the morning. You know, taking the time to eat right is. Is probably the second pillar for me. And then just consistently being in the gym, like, I think it goes back to who you're around. Like, it's still your fault if you're not in the gym, but, like, if you're around people that aren't in the gym, you're probably not going to go to the gym. Yeah, it's great to have a friend to go to the gym with, which I usually don't have. But like, that. That's a nice one. But I'm in the gym every day in Puerto Rico. I'll do probably 291 days in the gym this year. I can show you my tracking for it. But, like, I like the data. Yeah, I like the consistency. So I never really tracked anything except finances, you know, and so the last two years, I can show you all the data from sleep to finances, exactly how much money I spend personally, which I never used to track, track the business. I can show you all that data. I can also, you know, go from, like, a fitness perspective, my weight throughout that time. So it's been good. I had like an extra 15 to 20 pounds of just crap on me. So got rid of that pretty quick and have been maintained, maintaining it about 195 to 200 pounds for the last two years.

I love that when you say optimizing tracking. We all have different ways to gather that data. I'd love to hear some of your strategies to maintain and optimize and just track your life. Because I think I listen to a podcast called Build with Rob by Rob Yck, and he talks about just how he optimizes his time.

Very optimized.

Dude, I don't know if you ever. I. I'll send you an episode. You should check it out.

So good.

And I'm just fascinated how he does it. And I'd love to hear just your perspective of that because it's not easy to build those habits, especially if it's not something that you've done or you've been around people that have tracked it to that degree.

I'm definitely not tracking it. Each moment like that, you know, for me, it's like, let's start with the macro and then move micro. So, you know, like with a workout, when I'm stretching in the gym for a minute or two, or like walking up the stairs from the locker room after I throw my stuff in, I'm in my phone notes, not on an app, not on a spreadsheet. And I have phone notes where I can go through. And I just write down what I'm doing that day. Like, I already know before. Like, is it a pole? Is it legs?

Whatever.

I just. I go through it. I have a checklist for each day at the gym, like, whatever. And I just do my workouts and I track that. And if I ever leave, like, sometimes you don't finish your full workout, like, you're just a little bitch and you don't feel it, like 100%. I write down was a little bitch today or whatever. Like, you know, you just do something or, you know, got a phone call, had to leave, work thing, like, whatever it is. So, you know, I just track that so I can see it. I'm a very simple guy. I really like to avoid devices. Might sound really counter intuitive, but, like, I'm a notebook guy. I use notebooks for years. I don't put a to do list in an app. Whatever it is physical, it is on paper. I have my notebook with me. And as my friends who used to live with me know, I would literally rather drive my own car through the front of my house and everything goes up in flames than with my notebook. Like, if you spill, like, you will die. I will probably injure you.

Yeah.

If someone like, you know, intentionally, like, joking, but, like, yeah, like, you know, it's just like, that's something I take very seriously, you know, like, if I'm on a plane, like, I will turn back around if I forget.

Wow.

That, like, it's just. It never gets forgotten.

Yeah. You know, that's awesome.

So, yeah, it's important to me to track that for sure.

Very cool. You know, 2022 is coming to an end. What has been the biggest lesson you've learned this year? Whether that's real estate, starting a fund. I feel like this year was a big year for you and a lot of different business ventures and just learning a lot. What has this year been like for you or big lesson that you'd sort of pull out from the year so far?

It's funny you ask it this time mid December, because I'm actually kind of doing my reflection for the year and I Actually did a lot of this last night at the hotel. This year for me was, was a lot of like, if I had to put one word on it, I would.

Say.

Not quite adapting. I'm just, I'm reshaping, I'm reshaping a lot of things. I changed my content entirely. Split like split second thing. Like just complete 180 on that from YouTube. Change around the business structure. For me it was, it was a year of just building a better infrastructure. That's really all it is to support long term growth. I was speaking with you about this at lunch. If I, what I did the last five years to get the result, I wouldn't trade for the world. But I would not do that same result for the next five years to get the same thing. Like I wouldn't do the same input to get the same output. That's not worth it for me. So something has to change. So that's where restructuring. What are we going to do? What's the next step? What skills can I learn? What were my deficiencies? Like what, what can I get better at? You know. And so for me that's just been a constant game of like reinventing myself, which I have not done. I have not done a lot of career wise in terms of that. You know, the real estate, new stuff. I always, I always feel like I'm behind. Like I, I constantly feel like I need to be doing more and I think that's like, it's a blessing and a curse, you know.

Yeah.

But I think I've gotten past the point where like it eats me up and like I can't like. Yeah, I'm very, very happy, you know, like I love what I do. I'm able to lean more now into my relationships. Like whether it's friends, family, whatever. Like that's important to me, you know, and I never used to put time on that. So it's a game of learning that. It's definitely a game of learning.

Very cool. That makes me happy to hear because it's like there's ups and there's downs. Right. And you have to sometimes keep. You got to take your foot off the gas on something, whether that's family relationships, sleep to get the result that you really want and you're a byproduct of doing that. Right. So very cool to hear. I want to talk about social media. Right. You've built an incredible audience on social over the years. Even though you say you want to stay away from your devices. What has content, social media provided in your life and Is it something that you see yourself doing long term or just how do you think about it overall?

Yeah, I think social media is a very double edged sword type of deal. I think I learn a lot through helping teach. Now I don't teach stuff that I'm not an expert on. Like the only thing I've ever sold in terms of like public product access for anybody to buy was E commerce because that's the only thing I was a true expert on. I might at some point have some paid real estate thing because now I'm getting to the point where I would consider myself, you know, more in the expert level because I've gone through every point of the process, done one flip, done one wholesale deal, done the 1031 exchange. I've used title companies, bought an attorney based states. Like I've gone through a lot of the points of the process, raising money, my own money. So I've done that. And so now I could teach that because I have the information on it. So you know, for me I think real, excuse me, social media is a great tool but it can definitely get you stuck in a rut. You find something that works and people just replicate. Right. But then it doesn't. You're not reinventing yourself.

Yeah.

You're not continuing to evolve. And I think people get stuck with their content which, you know, it's just social media, but it is a business at the end of the day and if you treat it like that, I think you'll get the result that it should bring. So yeah, I mean for me, I try not to be on my phone, but we have, you know, a team that posts about 45 times a day currently across all platforms, a lot of different pages and we're just building out that team. So for me it's about how can I automate, how can I spend less time on my device. I'm cool being in front of a camera, I don't mind that. But it doesn't take a lot of time.

Yeah.

So it's very minimal. I think social media is an interesting world. It's just, it's, it's allowed me to meet a lot of people.

Yep.

You know, and building an audience is fun. Even going through the experience where people turn on you publicly is fun. Somebody says something, I mean it's like it goes back to the whole like, you know, like we've all heard about it a dozen times. Like a woman claims someone raped them. Right. And it turns out it's not true. Like it gets proven wrong and she admits it regardless of what happens then his life is ruined. Like, that's serious damage. Like, people get, like, kicked out of Harvard. They lose school, and you can never go back. Like, it actually. It ruins you.

Yeah.

You know, and I still think you can reinvent yourself and come out of that. But, like, it. It's bad. So people can say whatever they want. I've had that happen to me as well. I think it's an easy target. Anybody with eyeballs.

Yeah. So absolutely. Do you. Would you ever let that get to you if people were saying something like, how do you deal with that? Do you take it and try to say, huh, I wonder why. Try to have a conversation. I know, you know, I've been people. If you are putting yourself out there, like, I've gotten so many different things here or there, and I sometimes question the person, I have a conversation with them and, like, just. And sometimes it's good. And they're like, oh, my God, you can fix their perspective just by, like, a simple voice note.

Yeah.

Or. Or it's like the complete opposite.

I just. I'm simple, Casey. I don't give a fuck what that person thinks. Like, I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna take the time to send someone a voice note. You're like, no, I'm sorry. But, like, so I never leaned into it, never talked about it, never addressed anything public. And I think that was the right move.

Absolutely.

Because people can call you out. So, like, when I was getting exposed and called out on social media and stuff, the two people that were doing that were privately messaging me, asking for money to make it stop. So that's what we call blackmail in this world. It's like, you know, so there's nothing you can do. You know, you're leaning to defend yourself, but they can seriously impact your business. And then people get mad at you thinking that it's true, and then they go hack and take down your social media. That's what happened to me. Like, seriously impacting the business that is now costing me over. Over a million dollars in lost income from that. It happens, you know, But I still don't view it as a negative.

Yeah.

And as for letting it get to me, I think a lot of my friends, they'll tell you this. Like, nothing seems to faze me. I just take everything from, like, a logic perspective. So it's probably a good thing that it happened. You know, it allows you to learn a new experience and, like, you know, go through and develop a new skill. But I don't. I rarely see something as A down. It's all an opportunity. Everything's an opportunity.

Absolutely. So, and I think that brings up a point I want to bring up. You talked about earlier, this idea of over the years you've put on full throttle logic and emotional. You've pulled back when it comes to decision making and now you've maybe tried to add more emotional side of things. How do you think about that from logic, emotion, whether that's business, in your personal life, how have you maintained that over the years, good or bad? And what have you learned from just going full throttle in that logic category?

Yeah. Most people in the business world never make money and never build the company they want or the team because they can't balance the logic versus emotion and that, that, that they haven't worked out that muscle. And I struggled with it too. So I was like, you know what? I'm just gonna remove emotion. It takes time to do that. But like, I.

How do you, how does one, how does one remove emotion? As we are emotional creatures at the core.

First thing I did was isolate myself for three months. Like what we talked about. I know friends in 500 miles didn't talk to anybody except for when I was ordering food. Like that gets to you.

Yeah.

You know, and so learning how to like and then having a simple reward system. I was actually just telling someone close to me about this the other day. I had a rubber band around my wrist for a long time. And whenever I would like, you know, do something that I would consider like emotional based, I snap that thing. Blood marks, like, whatever. But that's how you learn. It's just a simple, like pro and con. Like if I lose my phone or keys, like maybe I'm not going to wherever I'm going if it's fun or I'm not going to like, I'm not doing something. Like, I don't lose stuff. I'm not a sloppy person. Like, I am very, because I've just trained myself in that sense. And so from an emotional perspective, I looked at it with emotion and logic and I was like, in business the logic is going to bring you further in terms of result. Simple as that. There's going to be a lot of negatives that come if you're only logical. But I said that will still outweigh it from the business sense to get to where I want to go currently.

Yeah.

And so I just started removing that. And then now I realize I kind of need to relearn some of those skills and find a way to work out that muscle and bring it back, especially in a relationship, like, it hurts that a lot like going the logic versus, like, you know, more logic than emotion. Oh, dude, it crushes. I mean, good luck having a relationship.

Yeah.

Very difficult, you know. And so it's something for me where I just, I just leaned into the logic. I only listened to stuff that, you know, aligned with that. I only read stuff that aligned with that and it worked. It worked for the problem I was trying to solve for. But season two now in my life the next three to five years be a little different, you know. So I'm excited to go through those challenges to relearn some of those skills for sure.

That's exciting. Couple more questions before we wrap up here. Thinking about where you are today at 22. What would, like, what would you tell yourself at 17? The Hayden that's, you know, about to get kicked out of his house, he's moving to California. He's figuring out what you know. You had cash on hand, as you said earlier. But even prior to that, like, what would you tell your younger self based on what you've learned and the journey you've been on? Because it has been a very short period of time in the grand scheme of things, but you've experienced so much and you've had your successes, which sometimes most of the time takes people decades and you've been able to do in a very, very short period of time and you've learned a lot. What would you tell your younger self and why?

I'd say from a business perspective, a boring business is a good business. Don't take your foot off the gas when things get stable and boring and slow. Lean into that for sure. Continue scaling because that's the point of optimization that you want to be at. I'd say from a personal perspective, I don't regret how aggressive I went with the business, but I do think I could have done more to develop relationships earlier on and that was a big thing. I was mostly in an industry. So I don't ever blame the industry. It's all myself. But like, I was in an industry where to make money, I didn't need to know anybody. That is not the case with real estate. Right. So for me, I never really networked, never cared to really follow up the relationship or like learn what that's like. And I love it now. Yeah, like, you know, it's a pleasure. It's an honor to be able to do that. But I would say more relationship focus and just lean into what's boring with the business. Don't get Distracted now. I do have to give myself credit. From the distraction perspective, everybody goes to crypto and NFTs into the forex and then back here when that crashes. Now they're all back to E commerce. Still here, never left. You know, it's like from that shiny ball syndrome. I never did that. I thought that was stupid, but I could have done more. I wish I would have.

Wow, that. How do you balance that? You know, I interviewed a guy and I've been talking about him so much recently because he just, he's really inspired me. He's. His name is James Lawrence. He ran 100 Ironmans and 101 Ironmans, which is 2.4 mile swim, 104 mile bike ride, running a marathon, 26.2 miles. He ran 101 Ironmans in 101 days. And he, in my like he, he redefined what's possible from a human capability perspective and his mental toughness is out of this world. But you know, I asked him during the interview and we were talking about, this is me entering him before I ran my first marathon. And I can already tell, right, you go down this journey as someone, whether it's business or for me, in a running perspective of, you know, you run your first three miles and you feel that and you're like, wow, that felt great. And then you do five and then 10, then a half marathon, then a 15 mile run. Then you start like thinking, huh, like I'll sign up for a marathon. And then you're always in that mentality of what's next, right? Or if I set out to do a certain time, oh, I couldn't have done better. And these are the conversations, the questions that, that bring you forward and that help you progress. But it's as you said earlier, it's a double edged sword at times. And as you said, like, oh, I could have done more. One thing that he, it's cool, he checked me on it during the interview. I told him, you know, I'm excited for this marathon, but I can already feel myself getting excited about what's next. And I know that I the time that I'm gonna run, I know I one day I'm gonna wanna beat it. And he's like, whoa, before you focus on what's next, what's in front of you, like if you don't put a hundred percent of your focus in every single step on that race, like you were cutting yourself short. And this is what he said that really impacted me. The foes impacted me the most. He said, you only have one Shot to run your first marathon and that's it. Like how you're thinking about it, your focus, your intensity. So that really changed the way I ran, where my goal was a four to four and a half hour run, which turned out to be my ending pace was 3 hours and 36 minutes. So I almost shaved it by an hour just by really taking what he said to heart. And I say all of that to ask you when you think about what's next, being satisfied, but also being very unsatisfied and know that you could do more. How do you balance that in your mind? And if, you know, James were to say that to you, just how do you think about growth, doing more, understanding that the things you didn't do can also teach you something as well. Moving into the future.

Yeah, I wouldn't classify it as the word unsatisfied. I would just classify it as an opportunity to do better the next time. So that's it. And now all we can do is hope that we get another opportunity to do something different the second time. You might not get a second time right. You might never run another marathon. Who knows? Now I know what's up next for you. Iron Man. Casey out here, he's gonna crush it. No problem.

Oh, God.

One hour for the whole Iron Man. But no, I. I think it's, you know, what's next and continuing to build. Like, that's. I always am thinking about that and looking. I'm a very, you know, future planning person for sure. Sometimes to my own detriment, for sure. But I do take time to stop, smell the roses, appreciate what, what's there. Like, as you know me, I don't do no energy drinks. There's no coffee, there's no drinking, there's no vape pen. I don't want that in my house. There's no drugs, there's no whatever, no artificial anything. Like if my head hurts, there's no Advil. Like, no. And for me it's. It's created a really interesting balance of like, I'll be out walking at night, like along, you know, wherever, whatever state or country I'm in. And like, it's just, it's beautiful vibes. Sunset just happened. The trees are beautiful. I'll just be like crying. Just like walking, just like, not like, like tear the miles. Like, it's just so beautiful. I'm just in such a euphoric state of happiness.

Wow.

I've never, like, it's being able to achieve that. When I kind of thought about it, I was like, you can achieve that naturally or you can achieve it artificially, but the artificial is never as good and it can never be replicated. You know, it's like you do drugs the first time, it'll be the best or whatever. Like I imagine it's like you're always chasing that high. Like, with the organic route, you can do that every time. It's consistent, it's dependable. When you're healthy, you're healthy. Avoiding processed sugars, all that stuff, which you know about. So, you know, for me, I think people look at that and they're like, why are you so grateful? Like, you're like, it's almost annoying. Like, dude, everything is incredible.

Yeah.

Like, let's just take a moment to appreciate what I'm looking at. Casey has a cover for his cold plunge. It's not just a cold. There's literally a cover to prevent debris and sunlight from getting on it.

Yes.

That's awesome. Like, you know, so good. The fact that you pointed out about that is just awesome.

The fact that you point that out is so great.

It, you know, so like, life's amazing. There's a lot to do. I wouldn't classify it as a negative in terms of, you know, missed opportunity and whatnot. Like, it's. It's always gonna happen. You can't avoid it. Like, there's properties I should have bought that I wish I would have bought that. I saw that I could have bought.

Like, it's just absolutely.

Was it a mistake? Sure. Like, simple numbers, like, yeah, should have bought that would have made a lot of money. But, like, I also then can look at what other people say in the real estate world. And the biggest thing I hear, mistake wise, if you want to classify it as a mistake, is I should have bought more. Great. Now I know that because I heard them say it. Take that to heart. Doesn't mean buy the wrong deal, but, like, just. Just do it. If it feels. Feels right, do it.

Yeah, I love that.

Well, actually, I want to rephrase that. If it is right, do it. Has nothing to do with how you feel.

Boom. Well, this has been such a pleasure to have you on the show, brother. I know just having this conversation. We've been friends for years. We've had so many conversations like this. But the fact that now I think this is a unique time in your life in mind that coming together and doing this really means a lot to me. And before we wrap up, where's the best place people can follow you? I know, as you said earlier, putting up 45 pieces of content a day. I'm sure if they don't already follow you, they're seeing you or they will. But where is the best place for people to stay updated with your journey and just, you know, watch your content, learn more about what you do?

Yeah, I mean, my YouTube channel, you can't fake that. There's a lot of fake accounts going around these days. So my YouTube channel is just my full name, Hayden Bowles. And then my Instagram is real. R E A L Hayden. That's it. There's a lot of fake accounts. Watch out for that's on every. Every influencer ever. And anybody, they, they use fake accounts, but that's the real account. Feel free to send me a message or try to answer them all.

Sweet.

Yeah. I appreciate it. Appreciate you for doing this.

Of course.

I'm very excited for the opportunity to get in this cold plunge with you. Not only just any cold plunge. There's direct sun hitting us. You have to insert a picture or something. There's sun hitting us. Looking over the water in these boats like that is just incredible.

Yes.

I'm very excited.

Let's go make it happen. And for everyone watching, tuning in, make sure you subscribe. I'll make sure to link everything down below so you can follow Hayden and I will talk to you guys soon. Peace.

Later.