Ep 244: How to Become a “Consciouspreneur” with Gavin McHale

Your brain is a problem solving machine. Yes. It's literally what it does. Most of the time we give it crappy problem solved.

Welcome to the Next Level Income show where it's our goal to take your income, your investments and your life to the next level. I'm your host, Chris Larsen. If you haven't yet, get a copy of our book for free at our website, nextlevelincome.com. that's www.nextlevelincome.com. just click on the book link and I'll even send you a copy if you put your address in. On today's episode, we have Gavin McHale. My friend Gavin is a world class mindset and performance coach and he's the author of the new book ConsciousPreneur. What to do when the hard Work Stops Working with a background as a high level hockey player, Gavin knows what it takes to perform under pressure and has channeled that drive into helping entrepreneurs create success without burnout. Drawing from personal stories and proven strategies, his work inspires others to break free from the grind, redefine their relationship with money, and design a life that aligns with their values. I love this book. I read it on a recent trip back from California where Gavin gave me a signed copy. And in today's episode, he's going to share some of his secrets that you can find in the book as well as where you can get your copy. Gavin, welcome to the show.

Thank you, my friend. So excited to be here.

Yeah, I'm excited to have you here too. Welcome back. We had you on at the end of 2023 with your money mindset. And look, if you're listening and you haven't checked that out yet, go Back to episode 182, check out Gavin's money mindset. It's something I've used personally myself and it's one of the reasons I wanted to have you back on Gavin, because mindset is so important and I think, you know, a lot of people discount how important it is, but we've had multiple people on to talk about mindset, the importance of it in business and money. But I learned about it a lot like you did in sports. And not only did you learn about it, did you teach it, but you were kind enough to give me your new book before it even came out. These were like hot off the press. I read it on the way back from seeing you out there in California and now the audience can get it. So before we get started, what's the best way for the audience to get it?

Yeah, best way is through Amazon or wherever you want to buy your books online. But type in, type in clintuspreneur book and you'll find it on there. I know Chris is going to drop the show notes and then we'll get it right there. Got a school group going and all those things to really help people as we'll hopefully talk, really dive in and actually do the work in this book.

Yeah, no, and that's what I love about it. So we're going to go through not only some of the things that you share in the book, Gavin, but also the structure, which is quite unique in terms of a book, which is one of the things I love. But for those that didn't catch it the last time you were on the podcast, share a little bit about, you know, how you got here and also what you've been up to with your family. I got to meet your beautiful son who's about five months old as we release this podcast. And such an exciting, exciting part of your life here.

Yeah, man. Yeah. To most recently, yeah. October 4th, 2024, we welcomed a little boy named Henry Max into the world. And that has been, you know, you're a father to, to two sons. It's just, you know, having kids is just the greatest adventure I think that will ever go on. You know, you learn a ton. It's so hard, it's so fun. It's so rewarding, like the, the entire spectrum of emotions. So that's been, I mean, that's been really, you know, not a couple hours ago I was put getting a burp out of him and putting him down for his nap, you know, and now here we are. Because that's the cool part about working from home too. I get to do that day and support my wife, which is awesome. But yeah, how did I get here? I mean, it's been an interesting road. As you in the book, I said to a lot of people, even five, six years ago, so, you know, 2018ish. I would have laughed my own face if I had known what I was, what I was coaching right now. You know, like, this is garbage. This is woo woo. This is stupid. You don't need that. Get tactics. Give me the sales stuff. And that, I think came from a long time of what I had been conditioned. And also just this fear of being different from the norm. I grew up in a small city in Canada and hockey was my life. Ended up leaving that city to go play junior hockey and try and play pro. And that's when. That's when the real Mindset issues started to become exposed. But this was early 2000s, man. Like, as you know, it's like, yeah, buck up, figure it out. There was no sports psychologists or, or mental performance coaches anything. So I did my best and that was not what was required. It, it failed miserably. The, the thing like a child and getting mad at everybody else didn't seem to work. I'm not sure why, but you know, that, that kind of led me down this path of this, this negative vicious spiral as, as our friend Craig Ballantyne sometimes says, this vicious cycle of poor behaviors, poor habits to more failures and more negative behaviors and essentially ended my chances at a professional hockey career. Um, and then you fast forward, obviously didn't recognize any of this at the time. I was an 18 year old kid who knew everything, right? So fast forward 10 years and I'm trying to build an online fitness business after going to college and doing all the right things. And the same pattern started coming up. These failure, this like avoidance of failure, fear of, of making mistakes, play it safe, good enough, all those things. And that's when I luckily had a coach at the right time challenge me for the first time that know, hey, maybe take a look in the mirror and see what is probably the actual problem, which is you. And when I started doing that, slowly but surely things started to, to shift. And I think that's what's most hard about this work is that it's not. We can get breakthroughs, but like, the changes are often not quick. The changes can be seen, but we have to be very intentional about those. And that's something that we talk about in the book. And so over that time, you know, it became, it became really helpful for me in building my business, but also in becoming just a better human being. And then I just really dove in when I started to realize, like, wow, like everybody that I talk to has had these same experiences as me and they all know all the right stuff, but they're not doing it and it's not working. And that's the, you know, the subtitle of the book, which is probably my favorite part of it, is what to do when the hard work stops working.

Yeah, I love that. What to do when the hard, hard work stops working. Yeah. And that's, I think. Sorry, you were finishing?

No, I was just gonna. That's the rub. I mean, we all sit here and get told our entire lives how hard we have to work and how important it is to work hard to get what you want. But what do you do when that Stuff's working.

Yeah. And that's. I think that's the thing. Like, it's not either or. It's both. You have to have the mindset and you have to take massive action, as Tony Robbins says. I've said that numerous times on this podcast. And, you know, you just mentioned, you know, your coach kind of brought it to your attention at one point. You were. You were fortunate enough. And I think a lot of people listening will say, oh, yeah, I remember that. You know, I remember when I had that revelation. For me, it came as a junior site when I was about 18, racing my bike, and I was reading about mindset and visualization from a performance coach that wrote. Wrote the book that I was. I was given. And I was like, oh, yeah, like, who. Who doesn't, as an athlete, visualize their success? And then a lot of people know the story about Michael Phelps where his goggles filled up with water. And he said, oh, I've done that so many times, not only in the pool, but also in my own head. I knew exactly how many strokes to take. I didn't even need to see anything because I knew about it. And now we know there's science around the fact that what we. The. The body doesn't discern stress that we perceive in our mind versus we actually perceive and how that happens. And then the second part for me, kind of that. That second part where you. You realize that hard work has gotten you to where you want. For me, I was a very successful sales rep, and I've been offered the opportunity to interview for a manager role. And then two years later that that opportunity came back around. Actually, I didn't want it the first time that I raised my hand. And my VP that I worked under, he. He said, yeah, I don't think you're ready for this, Chris. And I was like, f you. I was like, what do you mean I'm not ready? I was like, I was ready two years ago. Now I'm not ready. But he was right. And what he said to me was, Chris, he goes, listen. He actually said, let's sit down. I want to. I want to help you. I want to help. Help you prepare for this. And he actually worked with me for two years and helped me for that next step. But what he said to me, Gavin, and this is what really jives with what you said. He said, chris, I wish I had a hundred reps like you. He said, the problem is I don't, and you never will either, as a manager. He said, you have to know how to work with all different people. And you have to understand that you have to have these other skills that happen. And it caused me to reflect and develop some different skills and understand where other people were coming from and realize that, you know, that that hammer and nail aspect, you know, didn't, didn't always work as it did and especially when you get to those really, really high levels. Now, Gavin, you said something, you said, hey, you know, my coach introduced this to me. But then you said that prevented you from hitting, hitting the pro level. I know, you know, I don't want to take away from people buying the book to kind of read the story, but you know what, you know, what was the next phase for you after your coach said that? What happened after that?

Yeah, so it's, it's funny, like. So actually my wife was, my wife is reading the book now and she said, those of you that haven't read it, will. Will. She said, have you like looked up this, this coach McTaggart? And that was actually his name for those of you listening. And I said, I haven't. She said, you should look him up and you should send him a be. Because like, that was a really cool. I, I said, I can still picture. I can still picture. I can still everything about that scene in that moment. So that coach, in that moment, as an 18 year old hockey player who is in the midst of a terrible stretch of hockey and just a tough time in my life, it's funny how I remember it now, in the moment, completely dismissed it. It was like, yeah, that's great, you know, thanks for that. But I think the higher level, best version of me knew that there was something there and that's why I kept it there. But in the moment, I didn't, I didn't think that I needed to change my behavior. Behavior was perfect because I was 18 years old. It was a coach when I was, you know, 10 years later a business coach who, who I think maybe reminded me of that and, and kind of had that recommendation. That's where I really, that's where I really found the change. And honestly, like I, I did, I still fought it. You know, I don't, I don't know if other people have this experience. How many times we need to be punched in the face by something and view again, who haven't read the book. I was punched in the face quite literally and still didn't. And still didn't get it.

There's a little fortune those watching know that just looking at the screen, y.

This crooked little thing, I wouldn't there's.

No chance I would say that to your face. For those of you watching, you don't realize that Gavin's, you know, more than half a foot taller than me here. So. Yeah, well, especially that hair.

If you saw my fights, you, you wouldn't be too worried about saying it in, in person. But. Yeah, so, so, you know, I, we often need to be reminded of these things. And, you know, there's that great saying that when the, you know, when the student is ready, the teacher will appear. And unfortunately, the teacher appeared multiple times for me in, in the form of, of the world and life showing me things, but also in the form of, of coaches and people trying to show me things, and I didn't recognize it. And finally, you know, after 10, 10 years on from not making pro, I did recognize it. And, and I'm, you know, that's when I started to pull on some of the threads of what are the stories that I'm telling myself that I'm, that I'm, you know, you had said when you got the opportunity to go to manager, like, these are so ingrained in us that we don't even think to question them. Like, we're like, what are you, what are you talking about? Those are the ones that we need to dig out. Those are the ones that we need to find because that's where, that's where the magic lies in terms of the breakthroughs.

Yeah, no, absolutely. And, you know, part of the problem, Gavin, I think, is for those of us that have achieved success of any level, you know, that could be. You could be, you know, Little League or it could be, you know, college athletes or collegiate level sports, or it could be, you know, success in the business world or whatever it may be. But those skills that got you there, you say you rely on those. You lean back on those and say, wait a minute, like, this is what got me here. So you lean harder into that, not realizing that sometimes you, that can actually be preventing you from, from doing that. And again, I mentioned at the beginning, you know, first off, I love how you weave in your personal story throughout the book. I think it's, I think it's fantastic. You got some great quotes in here throughout it that really, really kind of punctuate some of the messages. But then the other thing that, that I found really cool, Gavin, is that. And I read a lot of books digitally and I make notes and I highlight things, but, you know, since you gave me a hard copy, it was very, very wonderful to read on the plane. But you have something really cool. You actually have, it's, it's almost like a workbook built in. So you have, you have space where you can write in. You even have little QR codes where you can get access to videos and training. Talk about, talk about what the audience can, why you did that and what the audience can use these for.

Yeah, well, I think I say it early in the book. Part of it makes the book thicker so I look cooler. It looks like I have a bigger book. No, no, I'm just kidding. Really. I think one of the issues with any type of uncomfortable work that we're asked to do is we need to lower the barriers as just humanly possible to doing these things. Right.

Yeah, that's a great point.

And I think what I recognize was if I was reading this book four or five years ago when I most needed it, I would have been like, oh, that's a great concept. And whoa, I've had this cool breakthrough. Maybe I would have dog eared and maybe I even would have like written something in the, you know, in the margins, like just a little note or something.

Yeah.

But I wouldn't have actually done the work which, you know, as, you know, requires us asking some, some questions of ourselves and kind of truly flushing out these answers that only can come when you really put pen to paper and really take a minute to like, let's see what happens here if I just start writing. So I wanted to offer the space for people just like in real time, because I don't know about you, but oftentimes I'll be reading a book and like, even if it's like a throwaway line in the book, but something is that like triggers something. And I'm like, whoa, that's a, that's a big recognition. And you just hope and pray that you're gonna have something nearby that you like, write on or your phone to like, you know, put in the notes or whatever and then you hope you can find it. Now it's, it's right there, right? It's, it's right there. It's in there. And, you know, the places where you're being asked to ask the most difficult questions of yourself and really bring up some, you know, things that we're probably learning deep underneath the surface, there's an opportunity to get it right away. That was the big reason for that.

No, I think it's, it's great. And again, you know, I, I take notes, I put it in. I've got a, a kind of a second brain, as I call it, that I use my, my notion software for, But I oftentimes when I'm reading, I, I stop and I, I interrupt myself and do that. And I think this is, it's a great tool especially for, for things like this because when you, when you're looking a little bit deeper, as you were saying, with respect to kind of your mindset, it's, it's really important. And then one of the coolest things I was going back through, I did a Tony Robbins course on, on CD with my now wife back in 2005. And I, I had a journal and kind of a workbook that I did and man, I never looked at it, Gavin. I put it away in a drawer somewhere. It was neat because it was with like my training journals from cycling and everything. And I'd have little, that's cool. Little notes in there and what I ate for the day and the training I did, you know, my heart rate, all these things back, back to when I was like a teenager and I pull this, this journal out and you know, Tony Robbins is a big mindset guy as well. You know, visualize your future. It's one of the first things we do with our coaching clients. We do a three year vision so people can get really clear on where they want to go. And I was about 25, 27 years old at the time and for some reason I wrote down, I'm not a big car guy, but I wrote down when I'm 40, I wanted to have a BMW M5. And it wasn't one of those things that was like really that important to me at the time. And it didn't really stick with me, but it was one of the things I wrote down. And I moved into this house and I was 40 years old the year before. And sure enough, in my garage when I pulled that journal out after we moved and I was unpacking that box, I opened it and it said BMW M5. And in my garage was parked to BMW M5. And I was like, that's wild. You know, and maybe it was just a coincidence, but then I went down through all the other stuff and what I found was all those things that I had gotten clear on, got my mindset clear on, had come true to a large degree within there. And I've seen it time and time again with my coaching clients. Those that are successful are those that not only have the right vision but also have the right mindset. What have you seen working with your coaching clients with respect to that?

Well, first of all, I say like that is, I mean that I've seen this happen so many times where people will, you know, pull out some notes or a vision board or whatever from years and decades ago, and they just start crying because they're like, oh, my gosh, everything came true.

Yeah.

Right. And. And. And it's almost like you. Or you forgot about it, but your subconscious didn't.

Yeah.

And absolutely. This is. This is the power of that type of work and the exact type of work we do in the book. Unfortunately, this is also the power of the flip side, which is these programs are running in the background. Like, if you grew up, let's say, for example, grew up poor, or you grew up not even poor, but with a poor money mindset, as I did. I grew up middle class. My parents were great. A poor money mindset.

Yeah.

That program is now running in the background without me doing anything. That's my default programming.

Yep.

And therefore, no. How hard I try and how many goals I set. You know, the. The. The non Tony Robbins goal setting, the kind of, like, flaky goal of I want to make a million dollars or all these things, I'll never be able to get there, or it will be incredibly difficult, which will make it harder to get there because of my default programming that I don't even know running. And the beauty of the work that you clearly did with Tony Robbins and the work that I hope to do with a lot of people in this book is you're shifting the entire default software in your brain to start working when you're not even thinking about it.

Yes.

And that's where, you know, you mentioned, is it a coincidence? And it's like, I call them synchronicities or, you know, quote unquote coincidences or these little. These little winks from God or from the universe that say you're moving in the right direction. This is the evidence that you need to keep going, because that's. That's where the magic is. Even though you, you know, it's kind of like this thing. So, you know, you ask, what is the. What have I seen with my clients? What I've seen is when we are very clear on where we want to go. And, And a lot of people go, oh, yeah, okay, thanks, man. Yeah, I'm gonna get clear on that. No, I mean, like, like, you need to be asking your brain really specific questions. Like, a lot of people are like, yeah, I want to make more money. I want to make a million dollars. Yeah. But, like, okay, if you say, I want to make a million dollars in 2025, that's great. Awesome. I hope you do. But if you don't specify more like actually get really clear on that you are going to, then your, your, your patterning is going to start fighting you because let's say you made 200 grand in 2024. That million is super scary. And it's going to start biting back and it's gonna be like, you can't do that. You, there's too many clients. You don't have the systems, you know, you don't have the team that's too stressful. You never, you know, you can't handle that amount of money. You'll just blow it. And you're going to fight yourself on it. But if you get super specific and you say like, I want to make $1 million in 2025 and I want to work less than 30 hours a week and I want to have less than three team members and I want to have all the systems dialed in and I want to take a six week vacation in December. Now, just so people know, your brain is a problem solving machine.

Yes.

It's literally what it does most of the time. We give it crappy problem solve.

Yeah. Garbage in, garbage out.

Exactly. And hey, you know, I had one client who came to me and he had had the best year of his life financially, gross revenue. But he was crying because he missed his daughter running her first marathon. He missed his son graduating from university. He missed all these things. And I said to him, so, you know, based on your goals, you won the game. But based on the rest of the stuff, can we agree you actually lost? He's like, yeah, I lost. I feel like I lost last year. And so we need to set these rules of the game and get super clear on the vision. When that happens then, okay, all these things are going to come. Now we can start stripping away some of the stories with all the, you know, there's a lot of tactics and strategies in the book in terms of stripping away the stories and replacing them, rewiring. Once you do that now you're working from a different foundational level and you're solving better problems. And that's, that's when people say like, I don't know what kind of woo woo magic you put on me, but you know, I got a W sitting in the, in the, you know, in the driveway.

Yeah.

And I don't, you know, that's the beauty of these kind of quantum leaps and that's what most of us are just playing the wrong game.

Well, the way I love what you just did with your Fingers, when you said quantum leaps. But the reality, it is a quantum leap because there's a. There's a quantum, quantum vibration that's occurring and there's a quantum energy that's going through the universe here. And, you know, it's. It's like electricity, right? Like, I don't. I don't have to understand exactly how electricity work. I've taken, you know, I've taken, you know, thermodynamics and all kinds of different electrical engineering courses and different things. I just can't remember exactly how it works, but it doesn't really matter. Yeah, there you go. But what I do know is when I push that switch, the light comes on. When I plug in, you know, when I put the plug in the wall, my phone charges and does that. That. That's all that matters. We don't. We don't have to understand specifically how it works, but like you said, we know that if we focus our brain on these problems, our brain will solve these problems while we're awake, while we're asleep, but also we will bring the solutions, the resources into our life that we need to solve these as well. And I think that's. That's the big thing. And I can say not only from talking to you, from using your, your meditations, Gavin, but also from reading your book. You've got the formula in here. Listening today, and you want to achieve one of those quantum leaps, click on the link below. Get Gavin's new book, ConsciousPreneur. These techniques are proven to work. And if you're wondering, why should I listen to some guy who's a washed up, you know, pseudo pro hockey player for success, take. Take a look. Take a look at this book and you'll see, because the people like Gavin that have not only achieved the success in multiple areas of their life, but also taught others to do it, have the secrets in here. Gavin, one more time, what's the best place for people to grab a copy of your new book? Here?

Yeah. Head to Amazon or on wherever you buy books and type in. Conscious Preneur book. It might try. And it might try and fix your spelling on that. So make sure the spelling is right. Conscious Preneur book. We created a word. Guys, we created a word Conscious Preneur. And you'll be able to find it and you'll be able to grab your copy and get in, get in our community and all those things, because you know nothing better than rewiring your beliefs and your brain with friends.

I love it. I love it. And thank you my friend. I appreciate you joining and sharing all your wisdom with our audience once again today.

I appreciate you having me on man. Great conversation.

Hey Chris, here again. I hope you found this episode valuable. Now I have one more thing to gift you. We have a page for my coaching clients where you can get a free copy of my book as well as much more from previous guests on the show. Just check out nextlevelincome.com coaching to get a free copy of my book, audiobook and much more. I'll send you a copy of my book and cover all the shipping costs as a thank you for listening to the podcast. Also, please like share and take just 90 seconds to give us a rating on Apple Podcasts.