Next Level 257: Everybody Sells! Joe Marcoux

People buy based on emotion and they justify it with logic. What questions can I ask? What's the template for any business that you could put together to get people without them even knowing, sharing with you within minutes.

Welcome to the Next level income show where it's our goal to take your income, your investments and your life to the next level. I'm your host, Chris Larson. If you haven't yet, get a copy of our book for free at our website, nextlevelincome.com. that's www.nextlevelincome.com. just click on the book link and I'll even send you a copy if you put your address in. On today's show, we have the sales sensei, Joe Marcoux. Joe is a sales professional dedicated to transforming individuals and businesses. He empowers teams to create buying conversations and close deals without the stigma of sales pushiness. Creator of the SOS Dojo, a live and virtual training ground where individuals practice and earn their black belt in sales. Through the dojo, Joe and his team equip entrepreneurs with the skills to navigate any objection. Joe is here to guide you on your own hero's journey. He's a creative sales masters leading countless individuals and businesses to sales success. And today he's going to share some of his tips about how you can grow your business. Joe, welcome to the show.

Fabulous to be my man. Good to see you. Looking good. By the way, the beard.

Oh, thank you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I trimmed it off here recently. My wife calls it my holiday beard because I usually grow it from like Thanksgiving to Easter. And yeah, we got Easter coming up here. So as we, as we record this. So it's. It's gone. It's gone for the season.

You look great.

Get some. Thank you. Thank you. But, yeah, it's. It's wild. When the temperature dips, I can feel. I can feel the cool air. And I remember part of the reason I, I grow it here. And man, you're up in Canada. I'm surprised you don't have a full woolly mammoth coat on.

This is again, full transparency. This is as far as I want to go. I'm. Because the genetics are what they are. I've got a lot of white going on in the beard. I've not so, like, weird.

You look great. You look young. Yeah.

Thank you. And so. And I work at it, right? So that's the debate. I do, I do I let it. Do I let it go? I mean, I go through these phases, letting it grow out. It's really white and it Ages me. And I want to stay young, man, and I want to feel young. And part. That's part of why we're alive, you know, verve and good energy.

Absolutely, absolutely. Energy is important when it comes to sales, which we're going to be talking about today. One of my favorite topics spent most of my, my, my career, really my entire career in it. And one of the things I like to say is that everybody sells. Everybody sells. And it's something that people, you know, it's. It gets a bad rap because people are like, why don't want to be like a used car salesman? And you know that old expression like you can sell ice to an Eskimo? And. And I hate that because to me, sales is really about communication and taking a product or a service and seeing if it's a good fit for somebody and communicating that. And you have an awesome business. Teaching business owners, anyone that wants to learn how to sell. You have a proven system, Joe, that we're going to go through today. But before we do, I'd love for you to share a little bit about your background with the audience.

Yeah. So I started off in this world of sales based on a passion to help people. I got quickly into this world of weights and bodybuilding as a young teen, and I got the opportunity at the age of 17 to manage an exercise equipment retail store here in my hometown of Winnipeg. By the age of 20, I got offered to buy into the store. There were just too many ladles in the soup. And I just said, you know what, Long story short, at 20, I'm going to open up my own. It was, when I think of it now, 20 years old, and over that time period, from the age of 20 to 25, it was a struggle. And what I needed to learn was how the hell do I sell? Because I changed the way that I looked at it. It was like I knew that there was an opportunity to sell higher ticket exercise equipment for people's homes. Because if you remember, Faith Popcorn was talking about, back in those days, people could afford to have their gyms at home instead of going to a gym. And there's a book that's called Boom Echo by author by the name of David K. Foot. And what he talked about was how the demographic shift of the baby boomer, which of course, if you're in business, you're in sales following that trend. These were people that could afford to buy treadmills for their homes.

Yes.

So I took full advantage of it. I still needed to learn how to sell. I knew I had a Passion for the way that exercise made me feel I needed to learn the process. So I dug deep and I got, I got knowledge and I paid for knowledge from. Give you a quick list of some of the people. Zig Ziglar.

Yeah.

Brian Tracy, Jeffrey Gittamer, Jim Rohn. Got an opportunity to actually work directly with Jim Rohn, which is like super cool, mind boggling. Tony Robbins, of course, Bob Proctor and many others. And so over the years I've, I've spent lots of money on mentorship as you, as if you. We've known each other in a mastermind and we pay to be there. And so. And the thing is, sales has changed since when I was in my late teens, early 20s to where it is now because people getting smarter.

Yes.

You don't want fooled. And there's still the stigma of, like you said, I don't want to be sold. And I agree. I, I don't want to be sold either. I want to choose to buy and I, that's my belief. You don't want to be sold anything. You, you want to buy stuff.

Yeah, yeah, I, I think that's true. And although I do appreciate, like, I want people to, to give me the effort so, you know, trying to sell me something, I'm like, you got to call me back. You know, you got to try. I was part of a, I won't mention the name, but I was part of a big like worldwide coaching program. And you know, they were like, well, are you going to sign up again for next year? I said, I'm not sure. And you know, I was just, I was kind of like saying, hey, like, like convince me of this.

Right?

You know, they're like, oh, your coach isn't, isn't really going to be happy to hear that. And then I never heard from them and I was like, well, I guess, I guess they don't, they don't really want the business. So you know, there is, there are sometimes I'm, I'm sensitive. I'm sensitive to really good service and really good sales and I'm also sensitive to, yeah, really, you know, really, really bad sales.

But what's the desire that was missing for you to buy?

Yeah, so for me it was during COVID full transparency and they went from in person to virtual. And I just didn't really get the same value out of it with the virtual experience. I really valued that in person is I'm going to see you next week at a, at an event, as a matter of fact. So Joe, like me, you've had you know, you've, you've had tons of sales training, you know, tons of sales mentorship, tons of sales experience. Talk about who you focus on working with now to help translate some of that knowledge to real world results.

So it's interesting because the area is in one aspect there's online businesses and online coaches. What I find now is that there's, there's an aspect for my corporate side which is growing dramatically because corporations see the value in sales training, whereas individuals think that they can do it themselves. So the corporate side for me has been great because these are people with teams and it could be brick and mortar or it could be that they're work from home and yet they still need to develop the skill set of communication, which really comes down to three Cs. You need to be able to have a level of confidence, you need to have a level of conviction, willingness to do the practice and then you need to have a willingness to understand that you're lightly lacking control. So confidence, conviction and control. So confidence is when you speak in such a way where people believe you. Conviction is coming in and doing the work and the practice and understanding tone and body language in the process so that people believe in you. There's believing you and believing in you and then the control where, which is where most people lack because they want to pitch, they're well meaning, their hearts are in the right place. Yet because they don't have control, they repel people. And so Those are the three Cs that we, the overlying effect that we work on. And so what's interesting is I've individual small business owners, solopreneurs, I've got corporations that coming in with teams and then I've got people that are saying, and this is the new era that we're delving into.

Yeah.

And you'll really, you'll really appreciate this, Chris, is that they're people that want to learn the skill and become a remote salesperson because that's the ticket. It's for them, it's their ticket to financial freedom because they've been stuck in a 9 to 5 or they're working in a job and they, they need to learn skill. Because now I got, I get business owners saying, hey Joe, who have you got in your roster? That's a black belt that. Because we've got a belt ascension model.

Yeah.

Who's a black belt that I could bring my team and that's another portion of the business. So I get people that pay me to want to learn the skill and then I'VE got people that pay me to be able to set them up with closers.

That's awesome.

Yeah, it's great.

Yeah, I love that. And, you know, I. I got interested in sales. I think kind of. I kind of fell into it. Like, I was. I. My family didn't have a lot of money when I was a kid, and I had the opportunity to sell, like. Like, it was like wrapping paper, door to door. I forget what the company was. Oh, that's great. Yeah, I go door to door, and then I was selling newspapers, and then, you know, which is kind of like you have a. You have a route that wasn't a ton of sales, but you got to go and collect money and do that.

And knock on doors.

Oh, yeah.

Were you ever nervous?

Well, do you ever feel that nervousness? You know, I can't. I don't remember being nervous at the time. I will. I will kind of walk through some of the scenarios, but. And then I did, like, lawn service. I would, you know, talk to people, and I'd be like, hey, can I mow your lawn? I've do leaves at the end of the summer, like in the fall. And, man, I charge like 300 bucks. And this was like 30, 40 years ago, you know, to. To, you know, rake and mow and do all this. And my stepdad helped me with this.

Clean.

Yeah, yeah. And then I sold Cutco knives. So I got.

Okay.

Cutco knives in college.

Sales training, there's.

Oh, yeah, great sales training. And I just. I have a little sticker with my smiley face as you. You know, you brought some great energy. As we started the podcast here today, Joe, I remember, you know, popped into my head. But I'll tell you what, man, I'll Never forget in 2015, when I made my first call to an investor before we even had our first real estate syndication, I was so nervous. I was like, well, I was like. And I just remember standing there like, okay, I gotta, like, you know, you know, get. Get calmed down. And I spent 18 years in medical device and pharmaceutical sales as well.

That's right.

I've done. I've done literally thousands of sales calls over. Over the years. So, yeah, you know, from time to time, I, you know, I think back, I'm like, yeah, I had some nerves here and there when it came. When it came to different things.

What's interesting, I got to ask Chris, is that you're. Because I love this. With all the variety of things that you've sold, you notice. Do you notice a common theme in terms of Says. Because a lot of people would say sales is an art form, and I'm going to cry bs. It's not art. It's. It's a process.

Process, sure. Yeah.

Once you nail the process, then you can turn it into your own and you authenticate it. That's when the art form takes place. You've got to put in the reps. So my question to you is, what were the things that even from your, your apping paper sales to medical sales to real estate and real estate investment, life insurance. Right. So what were the things that. That are the common denominator in terms of the process that you noticed?

Yeah. So going back, like my early, quote, unquote, early sales career, you know, the wrapping paper, it was just like a young kid.

Sure.

Basically, like, have mercy on me, you know. Yeah. At 15, I raised money for our cycling team, which is. Is big. Like you're really selling something with respect to that. But early on, I would focus on the presentation, like, the mechanics of it. And I would get really, like, I was, I was good at like, regurgitating a presentation, hearing something and then. And then repeating it.

Right.

I could hear a presentation, like one time and repeat it. So it was very. That was, that was a skill that I had. But as I moved on in my career, Joe, what I found was you had to kind of throw out all that and you had to reverse the process. And what I mean by that is I would walk into surgeon's office offices and they'd be like, hey, what do you have to show me? They wanted to see the presentation. And you know what? I would, you know what? I would always bring nothing.

Nothing.

I'd bring nothing. And I'd sit down with them and I'd say, Joe, Dr. Marcou, tell me about your practice. Tell me about what, what, what is your. Why, what you really care about? And that's what I wanted to find out. Like what, like what is holding your practice back? What is your biggest pain point? And at that point, then I could say, okay, here is a solution that we have to that. And it wasn't a widget. You know, I think that's the. I think people's perception of sales is, hey, go, go tell somebody why they should buy a widget. But what I learned was sales is really finding out what is somebody's why. What is that? What are their pain points? What are they trying to accomplish? And do you have something that can help. Help them accomplish that and translate to.

Them so you've got it. And, and to take it to the next level.

Yeah. Little love it.

Little segue there. And you got to make it too. Right.

So absolutely. Yeah.

Where, where you started and where you are now. This is what I've picked up. This is what the. I hope the listener and viewer are picking up on this. What you do so well is. And this is where separates. There's good, there's, first of all there's rookie and there's. And there's good and then there's great. So the rookie person goes in and sells the widget. They just talk about the widget and they present. So you're. It's features. It's all features. Features. Then what you, if you go back and listen to what you said, you, you then got good and you sold outcomes based on the benefits.

Outcomes.

The greats sell the feeling. So what will it feel like when this outcome happens? So using your first question to the doc, for example, Dr. Marcou in this context was tell me about your practice. So then it's explain to me. There's an acronym that we like to use in the dojo called ted. Tell me. Explain to me. Describe me. So T E D. You can use it in any order you want.

Yeah.

So it's. And it's tell me how it feels, not what you think. So the experts will go and feel based questions because people buy based on emotion and they justify it with logic. So you need both. It's just that once you dig into those questions, like what questions can I ask what's the template for any business that you could put together to get people without them even knowing sharing with you within minutes of the way that they feel about a specific outcome that you could or could not depending on what the solution is that you have to offer, could present them. And if you can't provide them the good feeling, that's okay. And here's the thing. If you have a, what I call a buying conversation or you're in a sales call, the sales cycle with some people is longer.

Sure.

Based on the price of the goods. So sometimes it's that's a thousand bucks. Do that on a, on a, you know, 15 minute call. If you're doing an eight figure deal.

Yeah.

This is going to take a while because people get, have to get to know you, really like you and trust you.

Yeah.

And the, the aspect in sales that needs to be understood is what do I need to do to be able to get that intangible like factor.

Yeah.

And so go back to rookies or not so good salespeople do it Based on features, you're getting to the outcome. You sell the feeling. Even if it's one call and it's like at the end of that call, somebody feels good, they'll give you the next call. So think of that group that was going virtual that you talked about. You didn't feel good. There was no need for another call. Had they said, hey, you know what, Chris, we know you're busy, we're gonna. And you're, they made you feel good about the experience that you had so far in this experience. And now if the if question, if by going virtual we were still able to connect with you with the right people, where you could still feel over this time of COVID still feel alignment with this community, would that interest you?

Yeah.

They didn't go there with you. Where they went was, your coach is going to feel bad with I'm out, there's no next call.

Yeah, yeah, that's a good point. They took the opposite tact, which was, which was, which was interesting. Yeah, I was, I was on the fence. It was easy, it was easy for, for me to do that. And yeah, you're right. I mean we, you know, we want, we. Like you said, people buy on emotion. They justify it, you know, with logic, with, with, with that. Yeah, and that's, that's, that's the importance of giving that information and kind of the logical progression of, of that sort of thing. And yeah, I mean, I mean, you know, talking about knives, Joe, you know, you're talking about selling like a couple hundred dollar set of knives or you know, sure, 20 bucks or wrapping paper. You know, it took us like 18 months, you know, on average to convert a surgeon in the medical device field. Share a little bit about, you know, some, you know, you mentioned like that thousand dollar sale, like some more simple type sales versus more complex and how you work with your clients to adjust to those sorts of scenarios.

There's still, there's still a process in all of it. So with anything, first and foremost in our world, this is part of a formula that I show people to, to do is the formula is called the 7 11. For formula, you doing this right now, this half hour that you and I are spending, if it's compelling enough, people are going to watch it and they're going to listen to it. That becomes part of our 7, the 711 4.

Okay.

We'll need to consume 7 hours of content over 11 different instances over 4 different locations. So a location could be a live event, they could see you speak at an event, or they could Hear you on a podcast or they social media, different platforms. So there's seven hours again you can have 100 hours of content out there. If your content sucks, then you're not get right. Nobody's going to listen to it. Nobody's going to watch. Your content's got to be good, it's got to be, you know, purposeful, valuable, shareable. Once you got your seven eleven, four, then it's okay. Book a call. That's the right. That's the point where if you got a live an in person business, a brick and mortar business, people don't just go oh wow, look at that song walk in anymore. They now they, they do their research.

And so chat GPT. Tell me.

Yeah, so they open. Opening the door is sometimes the hardest part. It's the heaviest thing that people need to lift.

Yeah.

Then you need to instantly build rapport. So keep in mind they got, they've gotten to know you, Chris. There's people that they, they've been watching you for hours and hours and then when they finally meet you, they already have a sense that they know you. You don't know them at all. So you've got to get to know them. Right. So it's, it doesn't matter if it's $1,000 or if it's $100 million. It's how to win friends and influence people all over again. Be interesting.

Carnegie. Yeah.

Right. So go back to. Because we're standing, you and I are standing on the shoulders of giants. So what are the, what is, what is the essence of that great book? Be interested.

Yeah.

What questions can I ask to find out? You said it. Tell me a little bit about my, your practice, you know and then what we recommend is whether it's a thousand bucks or a hundred million. Do some work before work. There's process here. Who are you going to meet with if they're booking an appointment? Do a little bit of work, do some background. It's social media, it's there. It's. You're not a stalker, you're actually doing a little bit of work, right?

Yeah, absolutely.

And it's okay. It's okay. Then it's what questions can I ask where I can find a common bond? And it's not about being cheesy, it's about being authentic. So for you, you, you mentioned cycling. I used to be in the cycling industry. So I could ask you, you know, how many bikes have you got in the stable?

Yeah, I noticed that. I keep it down to three now. I used to have eight yeah.

So, right. So now this is. And what's interesting is with your social media, it's not just Chris the investor guy, the real estate. It's. You get to know Chris, the guy who rides a bike. What kind of bike does he ride? Some of the challenges, challenging rides that he's been on. And because now I've gotten to know you as Chris, I'm more likely to connect with you. Sure.

Yeah.

The old school funnels don't work anymore.

Yeah.

Google's proven this.

Yeah, I've noticed that. And that's why I want to. I want to touch on that. But yeah, I. Something popped in my head. You were talking about a stalker. I remembered one of my wife's friends, she said, she said, oh, this guy was so charming. He found my car and, you know, he put a note on it in the parking garage. And I said, you know, Aaron, I said, the only difference between that dude and a stalker is that you're attracted to.

Well, you know, what, what's. There's something to be said about. This is part of sales.

Yes. Yeah.

Part of sales is actually having the right energy, being attractive.

Yeah. Just like that Saturday Night Live ski with Tom Brady, how not to get a sexual harassment lawsuit. Be attractive.

Be attractive, dude. If you're, if you, if you do. If you look at the. Part of the work before the work is.

Yeah.

And we practice this in our mastermind. Right. What time are you going to bed? Are you eating right? Are you drinking plenty of water?

Yeah.

Are you get, like, Are you getting enough sleep? Are you surrounding yourself by the people and conditions that you want to produce? Yeah, because that. Those are repetitions that you're putting it better.

Yes.

Like just. What we do is we practice live, where we get people to say certain things, overcome objections, prevent objections. What questions can you ask to be able to get people to feel compelled? And they don't know why. Like, there's some intelligence agency stuff that we do within the dojo that could be used maliciously. We use it for good.

Yeah.

This is why we're very selective about who we bring into the program. Because if it was just for everybody, like it's. There's a dark side to this logo, right?

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.

We want people to. Again, because that's where sales gets the bad rap. And those people that understand neuro linguistics, who understand body language and how to program, like, if you use it negatively, you can. This is where, if you learn these steps, you learn these things, then you can know when it's happening to you. And it happens out there a lot.

Yeah, no, very. Yeah, that's a great. That's a great point. And you know, again, you see that in industries with a lot of money, like Med Device had a lot of that. You'd see. You'd see just bad things happening, bad relationships, people taking advantage of different situations. And, you know, it's a lot, you know, you hear this stuff in the dating world, too. And, you know, sales, I think, is a lot like dating. You know, it's. It's okay. You know, when I used to tell my reps, you know, mostly the males this, you know, but, you know, it's like, hey, it's okay. You go on a date with a woman, she knows you're interested. I tell my, My, My son, He just turned 15. He's. I'm like, hey, you're going to ask her out? He's like, oh, no, no. Like, dude, she want. She's talking to you. She wants you to ask her out.

Yeah.

You know, and that's. That's a piece of it. Like, there's two sides to it. If somebody's talking to you, they want to get information, they want to engage, have their questions answered and do that, you know, but there's. So it's okay to do your job as a salesperson, but it's not okay to take advantage of people and do.

That and having that level of confidence, coming back to that. Right. What do you do to be able to feel confident? Your right son is 15. So, you know, when you're getting into the dating world, for the most part, that experience, even as people who have been married for a very long time, there, there are aspects to sales that if we want to be able to achieve a certain outcome so that we feel good talking about making love to our wives in this context, there's a sale that needs to happen. And again, I'm not being methodical here that we have to be asking questions, we have to be giving of our listening, and we have to lead with empathy. There's ease of sales, which are energy, enthusiasm, and empathy. Because it ain't about anyone else other than your guests. It ain't about you.

Yeah, I love that. Energy, enthusiasm, and empathy. You know, Joe, you were talking about, you know, the old school funnel. Right. Doesn't really work anymore. Share a little bit about. I want to. I got a couple of questions around this, but what's the difference between marketing and sales? Because when I was in sales with companies, we'd have the marketing, you know, side of things, and they you know, it was, it was secondary in terms of budget, but it was very important because without the marketing, it was hard to have the right tools in place for sales. Now some things you don't really need a lot of marketing. You don't need a lot of tools. It's very, it's very simple. Maybe just a conversation, but how do you see marketing with sales?

Marketing now is a question of exposure.

So the exposure, 7, 11, 4 is part of that.

Yeah. So what's the exposure and where do you. Where is your ideal client? Where do they. Where, where are they? So are they on Instagram? Then follow the methods of what that platform would expect you to do. And then you still need to be brave enough to not just be only that one thing. Because now the old school funnel, like literally a year ago, was get in the funnel, provide a lead magnet, exchange an email address and. Or an email address and phone number. So now people know if I'm going to give my email address, they're going to give one of multiple email addresses. People don't just have one email anymore, number one. Number two is they can still opt out immediately. They can subscribe the second that they get so people can get out. So the exposure in all of this is that now we need to be able to allow people to explore and evaluate not only the brand and the features of what we do, they want to explore and evaluate the people. Because AI, which I love, AI and all the tools they provide the missing piece for many of us in business right now, again, we're. The missing piece is AI. It's. And this is what we practice is human interaction.

Yes.

The skill set of communication, of using this voice box, of using your body language. Like, what eye do I look at when I'm speaking to someone live and in person. Some people, like, they're, they're shifty or they don't realize that they're giving off like these weird vibes. 55 of the way we communicate, Chris, is body language.

Yeah.

And you ever meet somebody.

55.

55.

55. Just so everybody.

38 is tone.

Yeah.

So people are always asking me, hey, Joe, I need to do to be able to overcome this objection. Like, what do I say? It's like, I can give you all the scripts in the world.

Yeah.

That's 7% of the challenge.

Right.

93 is your tone and body language.

Wow.

So having exposure from a marketing perspective, you need to be literally exposed yourself and not be afraid of having a video that's only going to get five views. Let's say you're only getting a thousand views on your videos. Or in some cases, like, I get videos that are like 200, 300 views. That's it. That's it. That's it. If I'm afraid to post a video that, oh, man, this might suck and I might get five, if that fear stops me from doing that from my marketing perspective, it's that same fear that will stop me from getting a 5 million viewer video.

Video. That's right. That's right.

You've got to put stuff out there and just no different than practicing the live role play of sales. You have to embrace suck. It's not going to be easy.

Yep. Just like any. Yeah, just like anything. That's. That's one of the reasons I love sports. I'm trying, you know, both my boys are actively involved. It's. And I was sharing this with a coaching client yesterday, Joe. He said, actually, his name's Joe as well. He said, goes, you know, I just don't love. I don't love what I do. And he's like, is. Is that okay? He's like, I'm good at it. And he's like, but I don't, like, love it. Love it, you know? And I said, I said, yeah. But I said, joe, you played sports. I said, did you love every practice? He said, well, no. I said, did you love every game? He said, no. I said, but did you love the result you got in the games that mattered because of the work you put in?

Yeah, right.

And he's like, yeah. And I said, I said, look, if you go to work three out of five days a week and you don't hate it, I was like, you're doing pretty good. I said, there's going to be some tough days that lead to those really good days. And I said, just like a good athlete. I'm a cyclist, man. You lose like 99% of the races you enter. Talk about learning how to lose and get rejected. I mean, you know, it's just like anything, you got a flat tire, you got, you know, not enough water, you got the wrong, you know, you bonk out, man. Oh, yeah, I know. It's crazy. It's absolutely crazy. The wrong, you know. You know, you know, Rod, you get the wrong, you know, clothing choice. It's crazy, right? Yeah. So you know that, you know, learning to push through, like you said, embracing the suck and doing that, I think is super important. Before we wrap up, you mentioned AI.

Yeah.

You know, I love being in industries that I can supplement but is not Going to disintermediate. That's not going to totally wipe off the map. You know how I'm working on an AI version of Chris to go out there and do all this stuff for me. But how do you see AI positively affecting and negatively infecting sales going forward?

Yeah, and that's interesting. It's negatively infecting is what I heard. I don't know if that's what you said.

I think I probably slipped. But yeah, I meant impacting. But yeah.

So the AI is definitely going to be helpful in the sense of creating bought for. Automated responses in. It's already happening.

Yeah.

Automated responses for setting or helping you create content and giving you ideas. It's getting to a point now. For example, Arnold Schwarzenegger has a podcast that is out there that he's monetized and he's actually never been on it.

Yeah. It just takes his feature. Yeah.

All his stuff. Yeah. All it's a. He's never been on it and it's being watched and. Or it's being listened to. So incredible. Yeah. I mean there's a difference that in that world of celebrity, that's one thing.

Yeah.

So the, the challenge is. Yes, there's going to be a. I think AI is going to make. Make people feel uncomfortable because there's a. There's a level of distrust. So.

Great point.

There's. There's going to be a necessity and already we're seeing it. There's a recession in again. Hi. The human interaction. And there's a. There's a. A complete demographic, in fact, that. Because they have a lack in the skill set of communication.

Yeah.

I'll give you an example. There's people that when you meet them, they always ask their name when you. You meet them. Because it's in the form of a question. It's like. And listen to the difference. These are subtle things that make a huge difference to the outcome. And so this is atomic habits. They ask their name. Hi, I'm Joe Marcou. As opposed to hi, I'm Joe Marcou. What has more authority? Just that downward inflection.

I thought that's because you were a Canadian. I just didn't even think of it.

So.

Yeah.

So. So.

And.

And it. Even. And yet regional.

There.

There are aspects of this. If you're in the. In United. In the United States or Canada and, And. Or even in the uk when you're speaking to someone, your infl. Will make a huge difference. How you look, how you present yourself will make a huge difference. AI. Yeah. You can have a texting conversation. It'll save you time, help you create content. When it comes down to it, you and I next week when we see each other, AI is not going to have an effective win. Give you a hug or I, I give you a high five. Right. Like, yeah, that will ne. I can tell you in the world of high ticket, it's going to be a while before I'm going to trust AI enough before I'm just click a button and spend 10 million bucks. This is all about relationships, sales on the lower ticket stuff. AI is going to take over. There's no. And even still I deal with some retailers, Chris, and even with some of these retailers that are selling products that they're competing against online, like they're competing against Amazon and they're winning because of the relationships that they're like, these are 30 to 100 items in the store and people keep coming back for a refill and refill. And it's because they have a relationship and it's the experience that this person's having. So that's what AI won't have, like critical thinking skills and emotional connection alignment. AI won't. Won't get it. At least not in the near future. And I'm going to say within the next, next five years. Don't see it.

No, I love that. And I, I think that's true that, you know, you can take all these tools, you can use them to enhance your business, enhance the process.

Absolutely.

And do that.

Be foolish not to.

Absolutely, absolutely. But you can seize on, as you said, this recession in. Hi. And Joe, you're doing that with your business. So for listeners that want to take advantage, you got some awesome resources that we're going down here in the. In the show notes. If you're watching on YouTube, clink down. Click down below. Check out the show notes. If you're listening to this on podcast, Joe, what's the best way for the audience to get in touch with you?

Right now? I'm going to encourage people to check out on Instagram @sosdojo. If you want to get a hold of me, go to Osdojo. That's I'm really working on my Instagram account and so I want people to see not just what I do, also who I am and what I stand for. Go to Instagram. You'll be able to check me out there.

Beautiful. Joe, this has been a blast, man. I could talk about this all day long.

And we scratched the surface.

Yeah, I know. We only scratch the surface. And if you're listening, please check out Joe's website, sosdojo.com check him out at SOS Dojo on Instagram. Everybody sells Use Joe and the and the Dojo to help you get better. Joe, thanks so much for being on today.

It's an honor my friend. I'll see you next week.

Can't wait. Hey Chris, here again. I hope you found this episode valuable. Now I have one more thing to give to you. We have a page for my coaching clients where you can get a free copy of my book as well as much more from previous guests on the show. Just check out nextlevelincome.com coaching to get a free copy of my book, audiobook and much more. I'll send you a copy of my book and cover all the shipping costs as a thank you for listening to the podcast. Also, please like share and take just 90 seconds to give us a rating on Apple Podcasts.