Creative Financing, Subject-To Deals & Generational Wealth with Dwan Bent-Twyford

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Good morning and welcome, wicked smart listeners. It's Chris Pru, your host again. And today I've got a guest that as I was going through my notes, I have not chatted with or had on my podcast. And then I was on her podcast since 2020, right after COVID. I'll give you the episode number so you can, uh, go ahead and check it out so we don't, uh, we're not redundant. Uh, but let's see, she was on episode number 230. We are going way back because we're on, gosh, we're past episode 500 now. So this is going to be an interesting update of where she is because when you listen to that podcast from, I think it was fall of '20, number 213, you're going to see that she's just an amazing individual. This is Dwann Bent Twyford. She's known as America's most sought-after real estate investor. And here's the tagline, Queen of Short Sales. Transformed her life from being a broke single mom to flipping over 2,000 properties. Now, that's not what she's doing now, so stay with me. And then she's, she's taught thousands of people how to get to financial freedom. She has a little bit different path within the creative umbrella, which is why I love hanging out with her. She's the nation's top expert on short sales and foreclosures, and she's authored 3 bestsellers. So here's some writer-downers, guys, besides her show: Short Sale Pre-Foreclosure Investing: How to Sell a House When It's Worth Less Than the Mortgage. And success. I can't even say it. Words are tough. Successonomics. She wrote that. She co-wrote that with Steve Forbes. She was featured on platforms like Fox and Friends, MSNBC, Colorado and Company. She also hosts. Here's the next writer down of the show I was on. I'm going to be on it again coming up here in a week or two. The most wonderful real estate podcast ever. How can you beat that name? Her name is Duan. She's currently her and her husband Bill are. taking on their boldest project yet, rehabbing an entire town. Now, I know this started back when I was chatting with her. He was just starting to travel this. We're going to dig into that here. You'll hear in a minute. Now, think about this, guys. In a still, sadly enough, in a male-dominated industry, Dwan's motto is still super strong today, and that is people before profits. Hey, Dwan. So with that as a background, welcome back to the show. We waited way too long, 4 and a half years, but welcome back.

Hi, Chris. I'm so happy to be here. And we did wait too long. I just love you so much. I feel like when I see you and I follow you and I watch your videos, I feel like I'm, I'm around you, you know?

You've been around me. I just didn't know it. That's it. Good deal. So I, bring me up to date because I know I loved our interview in, in, uh, 2020. And I, I literally, you don't know this probably, but I, we got off the interview instead of waiting for it to be published. I grabbed it and put it to the community immediately, and I said, "You got to hear this." So it was super impactful for. So I know I've said it twice in the intro, but wicked smile. This is you got to go watch this to the other one, and then this one's going to be even better. No pressure, Dawn.

Right, right. No pressure whatsoever.

Bring us up to date. So what what have you been doing on all fronts? And then we'll kind of skinny it down and peel back the onion a little bit.

Well, you know, since we did our last interview, my husband got diagnosed with a very rare. Blood disorder, and he went through a bone marrow transplant. Wow! And that was that was like a whole that was two years. It was two years. He was in the hospital. He got a bone marrow transplant. We had to live in this special housing, like like a bubble. Like literally like the boy in the bubble, and it was the craziest damn thing. I just like ah never even heard of it. But apparently it's it's rare. But the but once you Get in the group. There's so many people that have this thing. So we spent 2 full years, um, just taking care of Bill and living in the bubble. We had to, uh, have my mom move out of the house. We had to rehome the cats. We had to rehome the dogs.

Yeah.

I had to live in this special place and we had to tape off half of our house. And it was the craziest thing I've ever— it was insane. But he just had his 3-year checkup this month. And they said he's doing better than any patient they've ever had. He's completely done, fine, cured. He got bone marrow, uh, he got stem cells from a 22-year-old female who was 100% match. So he's got like all this young 25-year-old DNA now. And I'm like, okay, it's not bad. You get all that young DNA, you know, we're in our 60s. I said, I'm not minding this.

I can't believe, so I definitely didn't know that. I knew you told me you had some challenges when we tried to hook up last time, but I didn't know that. So that screams a lot though. So you guys weathered through that. Could you do anything when you were in that sort of bubble or no? Like business partners or no?

Uh, no, I did, uh, some podcasting. Yeah, because we were, we were in, uh, just a, like a one Bedroom. I mean, really, it's really crazy when you live in like a super sterilized environment. You can't believe like how you're so unaware of germs that are literally everywhere. I mean, just, it's, it's crazy how you become super aware, but then like, I don't want to be some weird germaphobe. So, you know, it took a while to like shake that off. I mean, I wouldn't shake people's hands and, and just, you know, I didn't want people coming to my house. It was like, no, you've got— Kids, the kids had germs. Like, you cannot come and visit me. So it was very odd. So I did some podcasts and did a few webinars. Now, Bill couldn't do anything. He, he was basically in bed for 8 straight months. They give you really 5 heavy days of chemo and they kill everything in your body. And then you get the stem cells the next day. And then for 8 months, your body's just rebuilding. Making new, uh, bone marrow, making new blood cells, making everything new. And he would sleep almost all the time. So I had to wake him up, give him the medicine, clean his ports, clean all this stuff, feed him, and he just would sleep. So we weren't allowed to go anywhere except the doctor and back. So we couldn't go out. We couldn't go to a restaurant. We couldn't have a makeover. I'd have all the food delivered by Instacart and then go in the hallway and bleach it all off. I mean, it was insane. I said, we need to write a book about that because people won't believe it. It was so crazy. So we didn't like do any real estate. We were, I still had people working on my buildings in Iowa, but yeah, that was just, uh, I just needed all my focus to be on Bill.

Yeah, but you were able to, is my whole, like where my brain is going. You guys have set yourselves up. This is important for people to understand this because It's uncommon. I shouldn't say it's uncommon, but it's not uncommon to get a curveball though and not be able to do that, right? So that's super important if you want to talk to that.

I mean, 2 years with no flipping houses, no deals, no subject tos, no nothing, and no real income other than with the stuff we've organized and planned and things like that. So it was really a testament to be like, hey, We took like 2 years off of everything and we're okay.

Yeah, that's where I was going.

You know, we're okay. So yeah, 'cause, um, uh, insurance covered most of it, but it didn't cover the housing, which was really shockingly expensive. Did not cover that. And then Bill wasn't allowed to fly for 2 years. Actually, I don't even think he was allowed to fly till about 2 and a half years. And then they were like, hey, if you guys wanna go to Iowa and, you know, visit, you have to drive. And, you know, Dwan's got to pump the gas. You can't touch things. So we drove out and we spent a week or two out in Iowa, like 2 full years later.

And so that was, that's not a random one.

All of our businesses are running. Our construction guys, they were all, everyone was still doing all the things. And I just, they just reported to me, you know, instead of to Bill.

And what was the timeframe? Just so I get my head wrapped around that, from what to what roughly for that 2 years?

Um, so we went in, let's see. So it would've been March of '22. I did it for 5. So we were in March of '22. And so all that, and then '23. And then, so then, uh, in '24 would've been the first time we were able even just to drive out to Iowa. Because, you know, when you, when you have that chemo, they kill, like, they kill everything. They're trying to kill your bone marrow because the disease is like a blood disease. It's not a bone cancer. It's a blood disease, but it lives in the blood that's in your bone marrow, if that makes sense. So it's very odd. Um, but, you know, Mm-hmm. I, I think it kind of runs in his family because looking back on his mother's side, Both of his grandparents died of deep vein thrombosis and leukemia, and his mom died of a blood disorder. So it's like a, but it's a major blood disorder.

Yeah.

So yeah, so for the 2 years, um, I think after the first year I might've gone and done a speaking event. I think I might've went to Iowa one time, but then, you know, I'm coming back from an airport. I've got germs on me. So we just decided, you know, it's just not worth the risk. Like, this is not the risk. You know, my daughter came to visit and I said, listen, you got to come in the downstairs. You got to go take a shower. You got to take off all your clothes you traveled in. You got to put them all in the washing machine before you can come up these stairs. Because we are germ-free right now. I have those, you know, things that purify the air. I mean, there's 100 of them in my house.

I have them too, but not since COVID with them.

Oh my God, it was insane. But you know, Bill and I tell people all the time, we always say that was probably the best year of our marriage because we were together. We were really only depending on each other. There was no outside forces. There were no people calling, you know, I need the roof. I need that. There was like nothing. It was just me and Bill. We were in this thing together and we worked as a team and We followed all the rules and I mean, there's a lot. I had a 300-page binder. I memorized that damn binder. And I don't know, it was just really, um, I don't know just how to say it. It was just really amazing. I just, I watched him come back from being so sick to just like, like the phoenix, just like rising up out of the ashes. And he's amazing.

That is amazing. And that just again speaks volumes. It's like crazy what you went through. Um, And I can appreciate that cuz I'm coming up on 39 years married and I'm like that, it's just, that's important. Everything for a reason. I, I know it's easy for me to say it, but everything for a reason. I always say it.

Yeah. And you know, during that time I hired the VA team cuz I'm kind of a control freak, so I really don't like to, I thought, no, I can't do all the things I need to do cuz Bill was a full-time, every 4 hours around the clock medicine. He had a triport clinic. It was just a lot. It was a lot. So I hired a VA team and I'll just use them for the next year. But then now I'm like, oh my God, I love having a VA team. I just say, do this for me, it's done. And so now I have them. And back October, November, December, January, February, I took all that time off. My dad passed away. I said, I just want to take some time off. So I just took all that time off except for the Minnesota thing where We both got sick and almost died. I took all that time off and it was really nice just to have like my VA team keeping all my things going. So I realized, uh, and I do always delegate, but I don't delegate much. I'm, I'm, uh, I'm a delegator, but I'm kind of a micromaniac.

You keep your finger on it.

And I was like, you know what? I don't need to do that. I got this team, I got them trained, I'm paying them good money. And I told Bill, I said, it was really nice to be able to take that And really just focus on health and what needed to be done and, and get him back to, you know, get him back to stuff. But he's still, he still has, and they're really odd limitations. Like he can't cut wood. And I'm like, okay, why can't he cut wood? And then the doctor's like, 'cause so we still have a list of like this many things we still can't do until the 5th year mark. So 2 more years worth. And the doctor said, listen, he goes, people don't realize, he goes, there's no piece of wood on the face of the earth that hasn't been pooped and peed on by an animal. Even though they cut it and they treat it and they make 2x4s, when the wood and the, you know, the dust, he goes, is full of mold spores. And if Bill gets a mold spore inside of him, he can't fight those off. And I was like, seriously? And he goes, no, he can't cut wood. So even, you know, and he likes to rehab, so it's hard for him. Because I, you know, someone has to, you know, cut his boards and things like we can't have fresh flowers because the bees pollinate all over the world and they bring germs and we can't travel out of the country. And so there's still a few things, but we're just like, yeah, we don't care. You're alive. I'm alive. We're healthy.

Yeah.

You went through that.

Yeah. We, our business didn't fall apart. We didn't lose everything in the world because we didn't have ourselves set up for that.

Yeah.

So now we're just rocking and rolling and we're just like, oh, Life is so good.

All right, so that's a perfect transition without me asking. So what is going on? Okay, so you're in now, you transition into the end of '24, and now here we are a year later-ish. What's going on? What's going on now?

Well, so we, you know, we are back working. Uh, you know, we bought all those buildings in that town I told you. I remember that, having that town. So a lot of that was put on hold because there were some jobs that were just too big. We needed our— we just needed things that we just So a couple of the buildings, we just boarded them up and like, you know, we're gonna just leave that. So we, we are back fully working on all of our buildings again, which is, uh, which is fun because Bill really likes that, working with his hands. I mean, for me, I'm like, no, I'm—

no. Well, and for the listeners, Dwan, I, this is an interesting transition because for the listeners, go back to the episode that I gave you a few times. Listen to that, because that's when we started. You would tell me about it, like, just got rolling. And then now here we are, and you've weathered through all this stuff and still working there, or back to working there. What do you have left there in Iowa?

And, you know, we also bought some more buildings, so we have 28 now there.

Wow.

So I think when I talked to you, I don't know, we might have been at 10 or 15 or something like that. But there was a couple of just really good deals that came along and I was like, you know what, we can buy 'em and we'll just, we'll just, you know, make sure they're winterized and we'll just let them sit. So now we have 28. So now we are like really involved in this town. But you know, it's funny, over the last 2 years, because we opened, you know, fixed up some buildings and, and people rented out spaces, like a really beautiful brewery has moved into town. And I mean, they spent $1 million on their building.

Wow.

Fixing it. I think a big 6-story building came in. They've spent $17 million making lofts. And this is all— the downtown is only 3 blocks wide and 3 blocks deep. So in this little area, and there's restaurants, there's bars like this, and the property values have already gone up over 50% just in 2 years ago in the downtown. What made you—

I probably asked you in the last episode, but what made you guys originally do that? And what's the ultimate, like, where's it headed? Because they're timeless ones here, right? The city.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They— well, yes and no. I'll tell you yes, and I'll tell you why they don't. So Bill's from Clinton, Iowa. And so like right now today, I'm in my house in Florida, and my house is in Delray Beach. So when I moved into this house I'm in right now, I paid like $170,000 for it. It would have been 25 years ago. Now these houses are worth almost $1 million. So in Delray Beach, they have Atlantic Avenue is the street that goes from the ocean to I-95. And all of it was, I mean, 70% of it was boarded up. It was kind of a slum and it was dangerous. And then a couple guys, you know, right on the railroad tracks, they opened up a little restaurant. They opened up an art gallery. They opened up like And then their friend. So just all of a sudden, like 4 little restaurants got opened. And then next thing you know, a couple more and a couple more. And then I found out they were doing like a, a city revitalization because Atlantic Avenue had almost a mile from the highway to the beach that was just trash unless you were like all the way to the Intracoastal. But that whole 10 or 15 blocks was just Trash. And it was dangerous. It was everything. Now every inch of it's built up. And now all the side roads, like 5 blocks deep, are all bars, restaurants, everything. It's called the Avenue now. And it's crazy trendy. And it is slam-packed full of people 7 days a week, all day, all night. It's like a gold mine. And Back then, like 25 years ago, I had a chance to buy a building on the avenue. I was like, oh, I don't know. I had never bought anything commercial. It's like, I don't know. It's really boarded up. It's dangerous. It's like the hood. But even though I live in the city, I live over where the lake is and not there. And I had a chance to buy a couple buildings and I was like, couldn't see the vision. Well, now I see this hustling, bustling, voted like best avenue you know, in the country and I see how busy and amazing everything is. So when we were in Clinton, Bill and I were going for high school reunions. That's how it started. So we went to his high school reunion and he's like, hey, I'm gonna show you the old downtown. And so the, it's on the Mississippi River. It's, so it's 3 blocks wide and 3 blocks deep. And the main avenue is 5th Avenue, which is where we have everything on. We have everything on, well, all over. And out here they put the Walmart out there, the casino out there, the restaurants out there, and the downtown kind of got abandoned. So after we'd gone back to 2 reunions, I said, you know, Bill, we've been coming back here for 10 years and the downtown hasn't really improved much. Half of it's boarded up. And I told him about— well, he knows about Atlantic Avenue because—

Yeah.

We've been together 25 years. And he's watched it too. I said, I don't know, why couldn't we like take like Atlantic Avenue and do that in Clinton? Like, we could do that. We have the skills, we have the knowledge. Let's, let's see what they're doing. And it turns out they have a downtown partnership alliance and everyone that owns a building pays their taxes into a special fund. And then that fund is used to do things on the downtown, put up, you know, there's a ton of grants, millions of dollars worth of grants. for facias and things to, to like bring the downtown back.

Yeah.

So our original thought was like we would buy 1 or 2 buildings and just kind of help, you know, because it's a really cute— and you could just tell it used to be so cute. And, you know, like where you live too, they have to have all those little towns or streets where they just built them back up and they're so bustling and there's just shopping and little mini meccas. So that was the goal, was to buy 2 or 3 buildings, And kind of just help. But we got, we happened to get 3, uh, right on the main drag on the corner. That's, which is the actual pinnacle of the downtown. And we put in an antique mall, put in a coffee shop, put in a clothing boutique. People started shopping and shopping. Well, then this lady called and said, hey, you bought so-and-so's building. I've, I'm 78. I've got 3 buildings. My husband has been passed away. I'd like to move. to Florida, would you buy my buildings?

Hmm.

And we're like, if you'll owner finance them. And then she did. Well, then another woman called a few months later and says, hey, I heard you bought Carolyn's buildings. I also want to move to Florida. I've got 2 buildings and my husband has also been deceased for a while. I would like to move to Florida. Will you buy my buildings? And we're like, if you'll owner finance them. And then the bank called and said, hey, we've got 2 buildings we took in foreclosure. Do you want those? And we were like, no. And they kept calling. I was like, no, listen, seriously, we don't. And then Bill says, if you'll owner finance 100%, we'll take them. So then we had more.

All right, but you did them all owner financing. I just, I want to highlight that so the listeners don't gloss over that.

Except the first one, which we only paid $35,000 for, for, uh, 40,000-square-foot building. That's beautiful.

Yeah.

So then, then like, so, so then, then people were like, hey, I heard. And we were like, if you'll owner fi— so we got everyone to agree to owner financing. So then here's what, here's where the, the crossover happened, Chris. So when you own a building, like, like you, your building, uh, is a vote. So everyone votes on What to do downtown to like bring people to the downtown.

Yeah.

And so every parcel is a vote. So like one of our buildings is, it's like on a block, so it's like 6 parcels. So it's like 6 votes for that building. So we start going to all these meetings and we'd be like, hey, listen, I watch Hallmark. We should do Christmas in July. We should do Oktoberfest. We should do Winterfest. That's what all these small towns do to get people to come downtown. And then people were like, oh, because they own one building and nothing against them, but they're smaller-minded. They live in a tiny town. They don't think outside of their building.

Yeah.

And I was like, we need to do this and this. And I got voted down for like 15 things in a row that were good ideas. They go, well, we tried them and this costs money and who's going to run it? And I'm like, but there's literally a person on the team of the Partnership Alliance that will run everything. So then I called it. So listen, how many of— how many buildings do I have to have? How many parcels do I need to control the vote?

Nice.

And that's where we ended up with 28.

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So now we're like, okay, here's what's happening. And so one of the things is every Thursday in the summer, they block it off. They have all the guys that have the classic cars and have a little car show. They have the food booths or, you know, the carts. And they had music. Well, they were doing it for 4 weeks. Well, now they're doing it for 10. But now last summer they were getting 2,000 people every Thursday coming downtown. And when they started 5 years ago, like 300 people would come down, but that's because there was places to eat and places to drink and places for music and it's shopping and it's bustling. So now the last summer, almost every Thursday there was 1,800 to 2,000 people in that little downtown area. Like, wow.

Wow.

We didn't know how great the downtown was. So it's like, people have to know. So we just, we just pulled a gangster move and bought some more stuff just to control the vote. I'm like, I've invested millions of dollars. I want this town to be like booming, and it's not gonna happen if I have to work at everybody else's pace.

So is there, for the, I'm thinking the listener going in their head, Okay, how could I do that? So is there a nugget you could give them for seeking these types of things out? You're embedded there and you stumbled upon it, kind of, but you had the knowledge to do it. Any thoughts for them? Then I'm going to ask you about Sub2 a little bit too.

Well, so the main thing is, you know, having gone to that city, I was never exposed to it before. I saw pictures and all how it was, and it had a JCPenney, And it had a Sears and it was open late on Mondays and Thursdays and like just so busy. And there's lots of little towns all around the country that have just, you know, people have moved on to the fancier or whatever, but these little downtowns and you turn them into little antique malls and this and that, they, they really, they, they'll come back around. So first it was, they made, they designated it an opportunity zone.

Yeah.

So for the people that don't know what that means, as long as you own it for 10 years, if you sell it, there's no taxes on capital gains. If we sell everything in 10 years and we make $20 million, we made $20 million. Um, there's also grants, like so many grants, like murals on the sides of buildings. Um, they'll redo, if you wanna redo the outside of your building, they have all these grants. They'll pay for all this stuff. You pay 10% and they'll pay the rest. So if anyone's like, hey, I wouldn't mind owning a little building in a small town like that, just drive around, look at some of those small towns, the ones that look like they've gone downhill. If they just call like the city, the building department and say, is there any kind of a rejuvenation thing happening in this city? And if it is, you know, like we've had other investors now also buy buildings. in the downtown. So as people are coming in, I mean, it's, it's 100% different because we didn't go there for 2 years. And when we went back, we were shocked at how much different and really what had been happening. And like the big boom that took place, it was like, wow, that's unbelievable. And there's still more to do. Oh, really?

You created it.

It was really long-term. Like we're passing all these buildings on to our kids and then to our grandkids. So we're creating generational wealth. And once those little towns get back and they're trendy, they stay like that forever.

Yeah, that's awesome. Congrats on that with everything else you had going on.

Yeah, I know. It's like we had all that stuff happening and I was just like, I told Russ, listen, we should probably close these stores down. We're not going to be here for— and like, no, we've got good managers. We're just going to keep rocking. So we just kept going. We had one guy that worked on a few buildings, not as much as we wanted to because we just, We just couldn't have the money for all of it and also focusing on what was happening with Bill. But now that we're back, it's just, it's really, it's something, you know, it's really something. And it's not anything I ever would've thought of. I just wanted to own like a building or 2, but that'd be fun. But now I'm like so invested, you know? Yeah.

You, you gotta be doing other towns next. So do you even tinker with other deals anymore? Your flips, your sub-2s? Because the last episode we hammered sub-2s and that's, it was interesting. So do you even touch anymore? Do you want to or need to?

No, we do. We do. So when Bill was going through all that treatment, when it was, when I was able to kind of go out a little bit, me and my daughter went door knock. We went door knocking around Denver. We were closing, we closed a deal every couple of weeks for for the whole summer, like $39,000 a pop. So I was like, yeah, you know, I haven't door knocked in a while. Let's go do a little door knocking. We went out and did some door knocking and we still do a little rehabbing. And the, a couple of the buildings were behind on payments. So we brought up the back payments and had them deed them to us. So a couple of the buildings were 100% owner financing. A couple of them were subject tos. And a couple were financed by the bank. So in that little area, we have a little bit of wholesaling, subject to, rehabbing, and restoration all going on at the same time.

Just in that, you're talking about Denver?

No, in Clinton.

In Clinton still. Okay. Got it. Got it.

Got it. East Denver. Bill and I were in Denver going through all that thing. My daughter's like, hey, I wanna, you know, I'm ready to get into it. I said, hey, pick me up at the hotel and we'll go door knocking. So we spent the summer and we closed all kinds of deals. And I was like, oh, I forgot how much fun wholesaling is.

So you were just door knocking and having conversations with people?

Yep. Just in Denver, going around, you know, printing out all the foreclosures, going around, knocking on doors of the people in foreclosure and saying, hey, you know, we're here to help you. And, you know, these are the things you could do. You could do a loan mod. Yeah, you can do a forbearance agreement. You can do a subject to, you can do this, this, this, this, this. And we closed the first deal. We closed in 8 days. We made $39,000. And I was like, hey, I have not door knocked like in a while. So I was like so excited. Like 10 days later, I had this giant paycheck, which of course I had to split with my daughter, but it was all good. And we did a couple deals and they took a couple subject tos. My daughter and her partner, they took on a couple of subject tos. I mean, no, I don't, I don't, I don't want them in Denver because I just wanna, I wanna keep my eyes focused, like where we're at right now.

Yeah.

And, um, yeah, so, so in, but in downtown there was a few, there was a couple, we brought up some back payments from someone and they deeded their building. And now my son and daughter, they have between them probably 15 rentals and Probably half of those they took subject to.

Nice.

And this summer, Ayla and her boyfriend are going to be April, May, June, July, August. And they're going to go like around Clinton into the, the house, you know, where the houses, the neighborhoods in Davenport and around that whole area. And they're going to try and get as many subject tos as they can get this summer. So.

Nice. I love it.

Listen, you don't need to borrow the money. Just get you some subject tos and you'll be good to go. So yeah, my son's got, I think, 12 or 13 rentals and I think 3 or 4 of them, he just made up the back payments and the people moved out.

I, this is awesome for everybody to hear cuz they, I think people, I don't know, make it more complicated, I guess, than it, than it needs to be. Cuz you're just nonchalantly kind of passing through this after going through all the stuff you went through.

It's crazy. And you know, it was funny because when I went door knocking, I had not like actually Talk to homeowners face to face, like to that level, like 20 doors in a day. And then I was like, wow, it's funny how it all just comes back. And a lot of people are like, oh, I don't think I could do that, just talking to strangers. I was like, it felt so easy and comfortable for me because I'd just done it for 35 years. My daughter just turned 36, so forever. And we got deals and one guy was in bankruptcy and we helped him and Another woman had, you know, put an addition on her house instead of making her mortgage payments because she'd done that during COVID There's all these different situations. It's like, you know, people still, at the end of the day, there's always foreclosure no matter what the market's doing.

I agree.

The reasons most people get into foreclosure are like a divorce or a death or an illness or a job loss. And those things happen whether the market's good or bad. It doesn't make any difference. We're getting out of the worst market in the world and those things are still happening. People are still losing houses. So I think, Chris, people focus too much on what's the market doing and not realizing the reason those things are public record. The foreclosures are public record, divorce is public record, probate public record, people that haven't paid real estate taxes is public record because it happens every day regardless of the market.

There's your nugget, everyone. Yeah. Don't, don't stress over this. It's not, you're not, it's not brain science, right?

Yeah. And people are like, oh, the market, I don't know, Trump, da da da. It's like, it doesn't matter. The reasons for 90% of the foreclosures are the same every day, 7 days a week, you know, 24/7 around the world. They have never changed in the last 100 years. The reasons for it is because something in the person's life changed. Doesn't matter about the market. So when people are like, oh, deals are hard, or I don't know about deals, or houses aren't moving. Yeah, houses below market, they're always moving. You know that.

I love it. No, I love it. I couldn't— I'm your biggest cheerleader on this front. This is awesome. I don't want to forget to let you tell them how to reach you too, Dwann, because we'll get gabbing. How can they reach you? Anything you want to share? I don't care. Social media, websites, whatever you need.

Yeah. So my podcast which you're going to be on tomorrow, is called The Most Dwonderful Real Estate Podcast Ever. So I took Dwan and wonderful and made a new word.

I hope you trademarked it.

Yeah, I did. I have all— yes, I have all my stuff. I went through and with my attorney over the last couple months and made sure all my trademarks were good on short sales and things I had and added some more into Into the mix, so so it's D W A N Duan D E R F U L Duanerful.com. And on my website, I have a little real estate quiz, and people can take it's like ten questions. This is super fun quiz, but it kind of tells people like where they are. At the end, it'll say, "Hey, this is where you're at. Here's what you need. Here's your risk factor," and kind of maybe help people realize that they are ready. To become an investor. They don't need anything to be right. You just have to be ready. Awesome.

Love it, love it, love it. We'll put it all in the show notes too. Um, Dwana, I could go another hour. Is there anything that I didn't hit that you'd like to share today? And then to our earlier conversation off the air, we gotta have you back because there's a lot we could unpack.

Yes, there is a lot we can unpack. You know, I just think that, um, yeah, having gone through what Bill and I went through and And I hear people giving all these excuses. I can't do this again. Right? The market, the president, just, uh, I'm just like, people, for the love of God, just set your mind and go and do what you need to do. You can do anything. Nothing else matters. Just take the next step. And people, as you know, are like, well, I'm scared about this. I'm scared about that. And you know, what if this happens? That happens. It's like, listen, what if the world blows up tomorrow?

Like, you should I say it all the time. Yeah, they go, what if, what if, what if? I don't know, what if there's a tornado tomorrow and your house goes? Like, you could what-if yourself to death.

Oh my God, I can't stand it. And I was like, listen, my whole world blew completely up and we kept rocking. So it's just your mindset. Just, you got to do it. You got to start. You got to keep doing it. And for subject-to's, I mean, Chris is the Foremost expert on doing them. And I'm a huge fan. I mean, I teach it. We just did an online workshop Saturday and one of the sessions was subject-to's because it's one of the easiest ways to create wealth.

Love it. Love it. I'm your big fan. Great stuff. And right back at you. That's why I love having you on the show. Great stuff. And I look forward to chatting again tomorrow. We have to make it a point to connect. I said this in '20 and do some events together, but then everything else happened to both of us. So Let's get back at it. Super cool to have you back on. I appreciate you so much. And thanks for your candor, because I know you touched a lot of people there. Thanks much.

Oh.

All right, guys, that wraps up another Wicked Smart episode. If that did not get you, your juices flowing, man, words are hard today, uh, in the creative world in general, I'm not sure what would. Now here's what I would like to offer all you guys as our Wicked Smart listeners. It might be your first show and it might be your 501st show, I don't know, but I'd like to offer you all to be able to come in my office here, roll up your sleeves with us, myself, one of the coaches, my son and partner, Nick, my son-in-law and partner, Zach, literally sit in the conference room with us. We bring about 10 or 15 people in here almost every month, and then it's cut off because we have a conference room and it's only so big. And that is called In the Trenches Bootcamp. It's free with every one of our experiences in the company. In other words, our programs. You can check it out though, just so you can see what it's all about at smartrealestatecoach.com/ittbpodcast. /ittbpodcast. Now again, it's free. You can buy a ticket there, but it's free once you're in any one of the different experience levels. So I would strongly suggest you guys, we are sitting on what, around my wife's birthday today, April 19th. Uh, as of this airing date, no, I'm not with you live. I pre-filmed this because I'd be in trouble after 39 years of being married. I got to be there for her birthday, but I strongly encourage you to get to the live one in June. That's going to be the next one. You missed the one in April that we just had a few days ago. Uh, I again strongly encourage you to do that. Now, I would be surprised, but some of you may not have, uh, books, and I don't want you to go to Amazon. I just want you to get them for free. It's my gift to you. Go to wickedsmartbooks.com. And guess what? That's not electronic. We ship those out of the office right here. Our amazing Susan Skipper, who's been with us 10 years, ships that out too. And I heard through the grapevine you might get some other goodies in there. All right, guys, until next week, go off and make it an outstanding week. It's your choice. Hey, guys, are you simply sick of juggling a dozen different software tools for your real estate business? I know I was, and I know I'm not a tech person, so it was frustrating. A subscription for this, you get a subscription for that, and they don't even work together out of the box. That's very frustrating, especially in the real estate world where your best time spent is going to be out in the field or on the phone with sellers. And now you're stuck hiring a tech guru just to make all that sync up. So let's ditch the chaos and let REI BlackBook handle everything. Automate your lead follow-up, track every deal, analyze things quickly for you, make offers all in one platform. In fact, with the Wicked Smart platform, we now have access— if you're in the Wicked Smart community, to all the other associates' properties. Can you imagine that? So you're brand new in the business perhaps, and your seller looks on your website and sees 20, 30, 40 properties, instant credibility. So you're going to get everything on REI Black Book from our custom workflows for lead generation all the way to closing. It has it covered. Try it today for just a buck. $1, guys. Visit smartrealestatecoach.com/reibb. hyphen D-D. smartrealestatecoach.com/reiboy-dog. All right. Thanks for tuning in to the Smart Real Estate Coach Podcast. If you got value from today's episode, guys, be sure to subscribe so you never miss a future episode. It literally takes one nugget to access some of the things we're doing. And when you're talking the amount of the size, rather, the paydays, it's an opportunity cost that you can't let go. So don't miss an episode. And for goodness' sake, share it with someone who needs to hear it. If you're ready to find your best path for getting started on your real estate investing journey in general, head over to smartrealestatecoach.com/getstarted. We're going to help you take the guesswork out of your next steps. See you in the next episode.