Free Your Breath and Your Body Follows – ‘Yoga Rebel’ Tara Stiles with Dave Asprey : 814

Bulletproof Radio, a state of high performance.

You're listening to Bulletproof Radio with Dave Asprey. Today is the first time I'm doing this with a live virtual studio audience. So we have a lot of people who are watching me record this live.

They are all members of the Upgrade.

Collective, which is something you may have heard about. This is a group, a community, where I'm teaching all of my books and all of my work over the course of a year. And part of the benefit of being in this exclusive group is the ability to dial in and see the shows live as they're recorded. And for the first time ever, you are going to hear a couple questions from the audience at the end of the show. So I'm asking all the questions I want to ask, but other people interested in the bulletproof lifestyle get to do that. And we've got people in the audience here from Colorado Springs getting ready to be buried in a snowpocalypse. The is going to make Texas look like it's not the largest state in the Union after the snow comes. Just saying. So from now on, you are going to experience on Bulletproof Radio not just the questions I prepare ahead of time with all the research, but stuff that I might not have thought to ask. So people are actually in the Upgrade Collective typing questions during the show into the window. I'm watching them on video, they're watching me, and they're watching our guest today, who, by the way, is Tara Stiles. And it's going to be a lot of fun. So this is a new format, and if you want to check out ourupgradecollective.com and learn all this stuff so you don't have to read 3,000 blog posts, listen to 800 or so episodes and read seven books, I've got your back now, Tara. You've been on my guest wish list for quite a while, so I'm really happy you joined me today. People call you the Yoga Rebel by the New York Times, which makes you cool because. Because anyone who's a rebel is probably cool. And you run Strala Yoga. Did I say that right?

Yeah, it's perfect.

All right, so it has a little. Is it an umlaut? A little circle above the A. What does that mean?

Well, you know, it's one of those happy coincidences, I suppose. I found out a few years into the studio. A Swedish journalist came and interviewed me first for the newspaper in Sweden and said, it's so cool that you chose the word. And she's pronounced it strola. And I said, what the heck are you talking about? And she said, well, don't you know, this is the word that means to radiate light, to emit rays, to shine brightly and to smile broadly. So I just figured you did that on purpose because that's what your yoga feels like for you. And I said, oh, yeah, of course I did it on purpose, but in Sweden I was honest with her that I didn't, but I thought it was a great, you know, coincidence. And in Swedish, the circle goes above the A. So when we were doing our next, you know, round of flyers printing at that time, we just added a little circle. And then, you know, instead of doing the fancy thing with figuring out a logo with an ad agency and everything, I just said, let's just keep the circle and do typewriter font and, you know, call it a day. So it's been simple but easy.

Well, my wife is Swedish. I was married in Stockholm, so I vibe with that, even though I don't speak a word of Swedish, except I could say jette bra, which means very good. It's good for telling your kids that. Now, apparently it worked because Harvard and New York University are places you've lectured about leadership and you came out with a book that actually pushed some good buttons for me called Clean Mind, Clean Body. And that's what I want to talk with you about because so much of nutrition is like, well, you're going to have abs, but it seems like if you want to do the spiritual work of yoga, but. But you don't have energy in your body, it doesn't work very well. Is that the vibe there? And if so, how did you come to that?

Yeah, it's totally the vibe and it's what I admired about you for so long. I remember at all of the Mind bodygreen conferences trying to just stand next to you a little closer because you always had all this energy. And I know obviously you research and figure out how to have the optimal energy, but with yoga, I always like to share yoga in a way where you have to move in a way that feels good for you and then you can figure out the other things that are good for you as well. People can find their way to you once they feel good, but a lot of times with yoga it can be so dogmatic and so student, teacher, messed up relationship that the student just depletes their energy and forces their body into these strange positions. And then, you know, just to be simple about it, messes up their life and messes up their energy. So which is the opposite of what yoga is supposed to do for you. So I. I wanted to go back to the mindset of, you know, getting rid of this, you know, superficial mindset of pose based, which, you know, ironically, yoga can become very superficial. Even though when they're preaching spirituality, you're still trying to do this extreme pose, which is kind of silly in a way. So getting in the right mindset so you can pay attention to what's going on mentally, physically, spiritually, everything, and then just move forward from there. So it really addressed the mental state, the spiritual state, of course, food. But getting into those things later, once you have the right mindset.

So you start with mindset and then realize you move to food. When you get to mindset, though, one of the things that yoga and all meditation is about is about getting control of your ego, at least awareness of it and then control of it. But you're the personal yoga instructor for, oh, Deepak Chopra. Vanity Fair says you're the coolest yoga instructor ever. How did you keep that from going to your head?

I mean, I don't know if I have, but I just feel like I never wanted to teach yoga. I thought I would dance and have this whole different life. And the reason why I started sharing yoga was because I saw all the problems. I think that's why so many of us in wellness that stay in it for so long, we got sucked in. Nobody, you know, in the 70s and 80s grew up and said, I want to be a wellness leader. You know, there just wasn't that industry. But I started learning about yoga in my early teens through my dance program. And my second thought was, why doesn't everybody do this? So I started going around to the institutions that existed and started very quickly learning, okay, yeah, there's a lot of people doing it, but there's a lot of people not. And the people that I was talking to that weren't. Were not doing it because they felt intimidated or they had a bad experience. All of these misconceptions that are actually true. So I just started, in my own way, kind of standing up for yoga and saying, I'm not a guru. You can do this. It's just like learning anything. You learn it. You need a teacher to show you, but the teacher isn't all that and a bag of whatever. So I think that having that mindset of, yeah, I know yoga enough to show you how to do it, But I also know that yoga isn't saying, I'm awesome and you're not. And that's sort of the formula right there. So even when I met Deepak and he said, you know, we started doing some projects together, and then he asked me, you know, on one of his projects, will you come over and be my yoga teacher? And I just started laughing at him. I said, you know, Deepak, like, you know everything about yoga. And he said, yeah, I know, but you're the only one that I've met so far that will take me through yoga and not try to teach me about yoga. And I said, well, yeah, of course. So I think that's how we got along. You know, I'd go over to his home and do yoga with him and his wife and help him feel better and then just leave, you know, and then that would be it. And. And it would be on him. And, you know, for me, that was always my experience of yoga. And any teacher that tried to say, oh, no, no, I did that for you. I'm the guru. You know, that's sort of what. What I was calling out the whole time and still continue to. Because that's just. It doesn't work if you have that kind of dynamic. So I think by default then I started getting these labels of the rebel and the cool one or whatever, but it was really just like, hey, yeah, I can show you this, but you're cool, you've got the right stuff, but let me show you how to organize your body and do the moves and whatever. But if somebody's going to come to me and be a little unbalanced after that and say, oh, you did this for me. That doesn't feel good for me. That feels unbalanced. So just like everything else. No, no, you did that for yourself. I showed you some things. I can show you some more. But ultimately it's working because you're doing it. So to me, that's just how it works. If I started to get a strange idea of myself, it wouldn't work anymore for me or for anybody else.

Do you have a yoga teacher?

Yeah, lots. Not like one where I'm like, oh, yes, my teacher. I think that that's ridiculous. I think there's a lot of great teachers out there that, you know, I've learned from growing up. Most of them weren't the famous ones that had the systems. And then, you know, you could see why 20 years later, they're going to end up in jail because they're doing things that don't make sense from the beginning.

It happens a lot.

It happens a lot because of that imbalance of the I have the power, and you Don't. So I think the ones I always gravitated toward were just, you know, some person in a room with a few people doing something because it helped them feel better. And, you know, I learned a lot from those people, and those people continue to exist, you know, kind of everywhere in all fields. But, yeah, so many teachers, for sure.

I'm relatively advanced in my yoga practice, and I'm certainly not a yoga teacher by a long shot. I've stepped in a couple times in the past, but I find it always works better if I have a yoga teacher with me. Just because there's something about saying, well, do this now versus you deciding to do this now. Like, if someone else decides, you don't have to decide. So that I'll call it spiritual laziness that I'm very happy to own. Where I'd like my spirituality to be as quick and effective as possible without extra friction. How does that jive with this concept of alignment that runs throughout your book? Am I unaligned because I want a teacher to sit there and be like, yeah, now do forward fold. Instead of me deciding to do forward fold?

No, I think that's great. I mean, to me, even before yoga, I feel like I learned a lot of that through movement and through dance and through sequencing. So I would go to you to learn how to optimize, how to feel better for all of these things. I wouldn't think, well, I'm lazy, because I want Dave to tell me how to make my coffee. Right. Dave knows because Dave spends all this time figuring it out. So I think with yoga, it's sort of sequencing is a big deal, and the order that you put the movements definitely makes you feel a certain way. So if you decided to do a forward Ben just for you, it could be, oh, because you remembered that move. But if somebody knew you a little bit better and said, oh, it might help you release and feel better and open up a little bit, be more introspective. And now is a good time to go into that. I think that it's great to have a teacher to kind of take you through a structure that would work for you. It's like having somebody make you a meal. They're like, oh, you look dehydrated. Let me make you a really hydrating meal or something comforting or something warm. So I think. I think that's great to outsource the delivery of that kind of feeling, for sure.

All right. Something warm. Now, when you said that, something healing, I'm like, you must be talking about bacon. You Actually talk in the book, though, change the way you eat through the lens of Ayurveda is a part of the book. Talk to me about your perspective on food for this mental alignment, spiritual alignment that you're talking about in the book. What are the principles?

Oh, gosh. Well, you know, I think when I first started being interested in yoga, you know, yoga, there's yoga, there's Ayurveda, there's, you know, there's 10 things, and they're all really dogmatic and really hard to understand, sort of by design. And so I kind of threw Ayurveda away for a while and just learned how to eat healthier, you know, through your work and through, you know, a lot of the wellness leaders, just like, eating cleaner, things like that, sort of all the common sense things. And then, you know, I started asking some more questions that I thought would get me thrown out of, you know, ever asking an Ayurveda person a question again, which was, do you have to cook Indian food in order to do Ayurveda? And many of the Ayurvedic experts out there all told me no. And I said, well, why aren't you telling people this? Because Ayurvedic people think if you're, you know, an American from, you know, the Midwest or Canada, you have to either go to the Indian section and learn all these things and culturally appropriate and just, it's not working. It's not healthy. So, you know, what I kind of went back and relearned was basically how to use the rhythm of the day, how to use foods that I have, whether it's a local farmer market or from my family recipe, how to warm my mood or simple ways, how to bring my energy up or calm myself down through the foods that work for me. Instead of following a dogmatic recipe of curries, for example, I'm never going to make a curry from scratch, but I'm going to make a vegetarian soup or a chicken soup or something like that. So, you know, I think, I think Ayurveda, a lot like yoga, has a long way to go to becoming more accessible because it comes from India. But the principles are universal. And I think that's kind of what I'm trying to broach with the subject here of more living in line with, with your energy and trying to harness your energy and have more of it when you need more of it and see how that relates to food in the simplest ways possible.

Eating so that you feel good after you eat is a core principle of mine as well. And certainly I might use a lot of ghee in my recipes, which all of my followers in India are like, yeah, that's amazing. You guys can finally spell ghee, which is really cool. And there's a lot of value there. And like you said, if it doesn't work, you're not feeling good. You don't have to do it. But part of knowing whether it feels good is what you write about in your book. You talk about inner listening and a sense of ease. How do people actually develop inner listening? This was one of my most challenging areas, probably in my 20s, maybe my early 30s. What's the trick to turning that on?

Oh, my gosh. I think I didn't really figure out how to speak about this until I started learning more about the language of Tai Chi, which is kind of the language of all of this stuff, the slowing down, which is also what we learn. If you ever learned anything growing up, like dance or piano or anything classical, you have to do it slow before you can do it fast. So in nature, this idea of, you know, slowing down, noticing how you feel and then listening to how you feel and then responding to how you feel. So it's sort of, you know, this getting more sensitized to what's going on with you before you start to do all of the things you know. I'm sure you've met loads of people in your work and that are doing kind of the right things, but they're not working because they're stressed and their bodies can't handle what's happening. So really, this slowing down, noticing what's going on with you, bothering to actually pay attention to yourself. And even with yoga, a lot of people can do yoga and just kind of rush through it and do the things, but they're not really paying attention. And, you know, from my perspective, you're doing yourself a huge disservice because you're right there, and you're the main ingredient in all of this stuff. So if you can slow down, you can do things as fast as you want. But if you're moving easily with awareness in every direction, you can. You're moving efficiently. And it gets me thinking about how we're all trying to do better with the environment and being more efficient and all of these things, but with our own bodies, we're still forcing, pushing and struggling and trying to break on through and be rigid in this way. And you can get pretty far with that, but you can't really reach your own potential. And, you know, I take a lot of comfort in, oh, I didn't make this up. Like, I can open up a book of Tai Chi or I can study with a Tai Chi master. And they say the same things, you know, so it's really moving slow enough so you can notice what's happening. Allowing your breath to move your body, I think is amazing. You know, a lot of people just lift their arms and bring them back down and do the move instead of waiting for your inhale to carry yourself up. And then, holy cow, you're moving like a bird, you know, which is incredible. And we miss out all of our potential and how easily we can move when we ignore our breath body connection as well.

If you could recommend the most important breath for people to learn who are listening to the show right now, there's all kinds of yogic breathing and pranayama, closing nostrils. I mean, you know, all that stuff. You have to pick one that you think people should learn. What would it be?

Yeah, I don't even know if this is a thing called, you know, codified in a thing. But I think, you know, to soften first, you know, there's this great principle of softness. And if you just allow yourself to be movable, bendable in your joints first, but then an emotional softness, relaxing a little bit, then all of a sudden, your breath starts to move your body naturally, your breath gets bigger, more full. For me, it feels like I'm opening a door for myself instead of banging my head against the do. So that natural, deep breath that simply exists when you're aware enough to slow down and soften. And then all of a sudden, it feels, you know, like the Tai Chi ball. You're a big globe expanding in all directions and softening and releasing. And, you know, I think all of the yogic breathings are great for different things if you want to manipulate or control or build heat or calm down or focus. But really that. That just act of softening, you know, sort of before anything happens, soften and then notice your big breath, just. You don't even have to breathe deeper. It just is there. You just get out of the way, which I think is so, you know, mind blowing, at least for me.

So there's a. There's a switch that you can throw in your body, and it is like the soften switch. And it's not one that I was at all familiar with when I was a young entrepreneur. And people would say, soften. I'm like, what do you mean, soften? Like, I already am, right? So eventually, probably through the practice of yoga and maybe some other personal dev stuff, I Finally figured it out. So I automatically, as you say this, you know, I go to take a deep breath right before, like a half a second before there's a thing. I don't know, I'd feel it from like my throat down to my gut where it softens. And then you take the breath versus just taking the breath without softening. But you have to have muscle awareness. And my first three years of yoga was like, oh my God, I can't believe I have a muscle there because I've never, I never learned how to address the muscle. Like, you know, you don't have a neurological connection, just that weird thing that's behind your scapula or whatever. And so I went through this weird kind of neurological growth process of, you know, understanding, wow, there's all this addressable tissue and muscle and things, and all of a sudden I could do poses I couldn't do before. But I think it, it actually changes your brain when you do it. How long does it normally take when someone starts doing a regular yoga practice before they finally realize, oh, I do have muscles there that I can use. Oh, and I have my softening switch. Is this like a six month thing? Was I just a slow learner? Does it take.

I'm suspicious that, I mean, I think, of course everyone's different, but you know, just the people I've seen over the years, as soon as they decide to do what you're talking about, it happens really fast. So you notice a change in feeling, of course, right away, and then, you know, your body catches up pretty quickly. But I think you could be doing yoga for years and nothing happens if you don't do what you're talking about right now because you're just doing the poses. And you could be trying really hard and have all of this great dedication, but, you know, you're still just wearing yourself out at the end of the day and exhausting yourself. But you know, I, I kind of feel like when, when people do what you're talking about, it happens pretty quickly.

Okay, so I was just a slow learner is what you're saying. That's all right. Now if, if someone's developed that softening thing and they do a breath, any kind of breath work, it does feel different for sure. And as you're working on a physical pose with Breathing Incorporated, it's easier. That at least I believe so. Which is why I've been a fan of yoga for a long time. I can say when I first decided I was going to go to a yoga class, this was a while back probably 16 years ago or something. And there weren't a lot of guys who did yoga, and most of them had dreadlocks. So I was like, what do you do? I kind of googled around and just went to a local yoga studio and my wife, who wasn't my wife then, she was my girlfriend, and she was living in Sweden still. And she said, I recommend you find a really attractive yoga teacher. And I'm like, why would you do that? And she said, so you'll go to yoga? And I was like, okay, that seems like good advice. And it worked. And I went there and there was two guys, One of them was a Stanford law professor and me, for the most part. And, like a class full of women in yoga pants. And it seemed like it was a very More of a feminine discipline, to be perfectly honest. Have you seen a shift over the past decade where it's a little bit more gender neutral, where there's a lot more men doing yoga? Or is it still more women than men?

I mean, I think overall, in general, I don't have the statistics, but I would assume from the amount of yoga pants that these companies sell, more women than men. Yoga pants. That probably makes sense. More women. But I think also it depends on how. How the teacher is leading. You know, I've always been a fan of, I think, because I started teaching yoga pretty young, and the people that would come to my class, I would assume are way smarter than me. Way more life experience I don't have. I'm not going to read them a Rumi poem at the beginning of the class or, like, tell them about my ideas of the day. I'm just going to get right to it and do the yoga. And I think because I led like that, we had, you know, pretty much from the beginning, 50, 50 guys and girls. So a lot of times people would come and say, where are the girls? There's all these guys here. But I think a lot more people are leading yoga in a way, in many different ways, because there's so many different styles now. And of course, everybody now knows about the benefits, so you can find a teacher that feels comfortable for you. But I think maybe a lot of guys weren't coming back 10, 20 years ago because of that. You know, the big talk at the beginning and the talking about your feelings. You know, it was very obvious to me, I would go to a class and for 20 minutes, you're still listening to the speech. And, you know, often it's wonderful and beautiful, but, you know, that doesn't tend to Be the male mind of, I've got an hour to do something, I want to go and, you know, do it. So. But I think that's changing quite a bit.

One of the other things that was going through my mind when I started my yoga practice was like, I have no skills, I'm going to look dumb. And part of that comes because I had been a 300 pound guy, maybe without the physical giftedness, even though I wasn't particularly heavy at the time I started yoga, but I still had some of that. And then you try to do crow pose. I've fallen on my face in front of a room full of people at least a hundred times. Like literally you're trying to do it and you just face plan and there's just no way around it. And now I don't do that anymore. So it does, it does get you over a fear of looking dumb in front of people, I would say pretty effectively. So anyone, if you're listening to this and you think, I've never been to yoga class, I have some weight to lose or whatever, I would say give it a shot because, well, there is a sense of community there and community is really important. But there's also just this idea of watching other people do things that are as ludicrous as you are. And then it just becomes more of a fun thing versus a yoga competition, which is, on its face, kind of a funny idea. What's your favorite pose? You have one yoga pose that is your absolute favorite. And I know they come in a series. I know there's all sorts of asterisks you'll put after this, but you gotta pick one, like what one brings you the most joy.

Oh my gosh. Oh, yeah. I think I like crow pose, to be honest, because it feels for me like a bit of a hip opener and back opener and a place to kind of hang around and explore a little bit. Feel a little silly. And yeah, I love what you said about that. You can make fun of yourself a little bit, but if you're in a room of 20 people, everybody looks ridiculous, Everybody's focusing on themselves. But yeah, I think I really like crow pose because it's a little bit of that energy. I can gain some energy from using a little bit of strength, but also test myself to make sure I'm not forcing myself. So I come out of balance in a way. So I think it's kind of a. It's a good one stop shop situation for sure.

Okay, so crow it is. All right, all you guys on Upgrade Collective, I Want you to do a crow pose right now. Okay. Don't do that unless you won't get injured. I could do one now on my desk, but then my desk would probably break, so we won't do that either. What's the best pose for people who are sitting looking at Zoom all day long?

Oh, gosh. I think just crawling down to the ground and sitting on the ground for a bit and then crawling up to stand. I think especially in yoga, you know, it can be so easy to forget about how you're moving sort of all the time and just sit down. And now I'm doing yoga and now I'm doing Zoom, and now I'm doing the kitchen and now I'm doing Zoom again. So I think really looking at how you're moving all the time, so even if you're at your Zoom desk and you're crawling down to the ground to sit and breathe for just a few moments, to open up your hips and whatever, I think it's even more important how you get down to the ground from your chair and how you get back up than, than the actual pose. That's also important to do from an anti aging perspective.

The ability to get up off the floor is one of the most important measures of whether you're going to live a long time. So that, that's something that a lot of people don't pay attention to. If you want to be fancy, I suppose a Turkish get up, which is very similar to some yoga poses, but you can do it with a kettlebell if you want to, is a way to, to do that. So basically get down and what butterfly pose or cat pose or something on the ground and something like that or.

Yeah, I mean, I love that you said the getting up and down. I mean, I think especially for sitting at your desk a long time. And also just basic coordination that goes out the window as you age. Getting down on the ground, maybe on all fours, rolling around a little bit, some cat, cow, but not being really rigid about it, actually noticing what part of you needs a little attention. And not just physically, but understanding that a little physical tightness in your hip or your back may have an emotional component too. And that's okay. That wasn't something that, you know, I learned growing up that it was just like, your body's good, you're good, you know, you're healthy and strong. So, you know, realizing that your emotions may be talking to as well and that might be important to listen to. So just that getting down a little bit of rolling around in some Cat, cow, crawling back up to stand, maybe even a few times, just standing up and standing down in the easiest way you can and you know you can feel better pretty quickly.

Okay, I love that. So getting up and down off the floor, it doesn't have to be a fancy yoga pose when you do it. That's really accessible and it jives with my understanding of mechanics and all of that. I have known quite a few yoga teachers who sometimes you're teaching seven classes a day, you're doing a lot of exercise when you do that, and they get undernourished. How big of a problem is that in the yoga industry?

Well, honestly, I think any fitness, especially yoga, I think yoga can be a hiding place for people who have problems with their eating, for sure. And we've seen that a lot with people coming into the studio and we've had several moments where we've had to talk to people, find people's family, that kind of a thing. But also just really making it about feeling better, noticing how you feel. Instead of no pain, no gain, kind of calorie burning mentality, you can do whatever movement you want. You can do them in a way that's nourishing for yourself, where you are noticing your body's cues. And maybe if you clinically have a problem and need to go somewhere, then that's a different story. But bringing somebody that's within a healthy range of balance back into, okay, now I'm hungry, I'm going to go eat something instead of, I feel inadequate because I didn't do that pose correctly. So I'm going to go and work on that a little bit longer Now. I think is a huge opportunity for lots of yoga teachers to shift how they're teaching, making it less about the pose as a goal and more about, well, how do you feel, what's going on and how is this a continuation of everything else in your life? Not yoga for the sake of, you know, yoga's sake.

Is the air you're breathing making you sick? Just because you don't see mold doesn't mean it isn't there. My friend Jason Earle has been on a mission for over two decades to help people understand the hidden role of indoor air in their health. He's one of the world's leading experts on mold and indoor air quality. And he created the Got Mold Test Kit to make professional grade air testing simple and accessible. It uses cutting edge air sampling tech that top inspectors trust, and it's engineered for you at a fraction of the cost. It takes just minutes to get Samples using the patented Biovac air sampling pump. Then you send them, prepaid to one of the most prestigious microbiology labs in the world. No guesswork, no paperwork and no hidden fees. You get fast results, intuitive reports and great support. And since you keep the pump, you can retest anytime for less. It even comes with a lifetime warranty. Mold may be invisible, but its impact isn't. This kit helps you understand your environment so you can take action for your health. Go to gotmold.com and use code DAVE10 to save 10% and see what's in your air. Because the best biohackers don't guess, they test.

I'm thinking back to my yoga teacher, Kenny Graham back in California years ago. He was one of those teaching a lot of classes guys and he decided to go vegan and he's like, Dave, I'm so tired, I have brain fog. I don't know what's going on. I'm like, let me show you butter. He started adding more calories, eating some grass fed stuff and his energy just bounced back. And I heard from him a few weeks ago. He's got three kids and still teaching yoga, going strong and still eating a variety of high energy foods to support being a yoga teacher. And we talked about a little bit, he just said if I hadn't learned how to eat to support my teaching, I wouldn't be able to teach still. And I've definitely seen that among some people or sometimes you just need more calories and it's okay. What's your oldest student, who's the oldest person you've taught yoga to?

Oh my gosh. Well, she was a really became a good friend of mine. Her name is Tao Prashan Lynch. She's a very amazing yoga teacher. She lived to be 103, but I met her when she was at the young age of 92. So we became friends for a long time and she could do everything. I mean her, she sustained herself with her, you know, her feeling about life. You know, she had more energy than hardly anybody that I met. And you know, it was hard to tell where it was coming from besides this inner spirit. We went to LA to do this DVD project years ago and we were staying at this hotel and she called my room at midnight asking me to go down to the bar and hang out, you know, like a 25 year old would do. And I thought there's something that you're doing that's right. No, we should go to bed and get up in the morning for this, you know, important thing. That we're doing. We want to look rested and respect everybody's time. But, you know, I think. I think, you know, when people get older and they have the sense of energy, it was really useful for me to hang around her and just notice that she appreciated everything. She connected with everybody. She always asked somebody how they were doing, and she was showing, you know, the doorman at the hotel yoga pose to do that would help him feel better. And I thought, there's some kind of secret there that's helping her sustain herself in a very real way, which was kind of unbelievable almost.

One of the things that I learned a lot from is I look at people who are substantially older than I am, and I ask, what are you doing? The people who look way younger than they should have more energy than they should being compared to what normally we expect with aging. And when you find people doing yoga for 20, 30, 40 years, they have different outcomes like their. Their connectedness, their sense of relaxation, their freedom of movement, their youthfulness, the energy in their eyes. It's different. And people like Margaret Paul, who was just on the show, who's 81, has been intermittent fasting and exercising, but intermittent fasting for 59 years before it was called intermittent fasting. It's. It's like they're in a different universe than most of us who haven't done that. And I always wonder, you know, people ask me, you know, can I start? You know, I'm 60 or I'm 70 or I'm 80, you know, should I start yoga? Should I start changing my food and things like that. Is there. Is there a time? No, yoga is not going to do that much for you. Or is this something that you can pick up even if you're retired?

I think, yeah, whenever. Whenever you have that pull, I think, is the time. You know, I love the saying, if you can breathe, you can do yoga. And especially if you're interested in doing it, then to follow that intuition, you know, whether you're young or old or somewhere in between or have a problem or have any, you know, limitations or whatever it is. You know, there's a girl who actually. She's an instructor that I'm friends with, and she come to the studio all the time, and she had her foot amputated from cancer, and nobody actually knew that she didn't have a foot because no one really looks down. And she moved really well, and she didn't have a foot. She couldn't balance on the one side, but she did everything in a way that worked for her. And, you know, I just. I think of her so often and I think of, you know, so many people that I've met that aren't, you know, normal, like, you know, can touch your toes and do everything, that are still doing all these things because they believe in themselves. Or maybe somebody, you know, told them that they could and then they believed that person. But, you know, I think, you know, the more, the more we can encourage everybody that this is for you. You can do this. This is about feeling better. If you make feeling better your goal, then it's all good. You're gonna feel better. Yeah. She revealed to me she went to several yoga studios. This isn't to put anybody. Other studios down. But she said a lot of teachers were concerned about her situation and would bring out a chair or bring out things to kind of call her out. And she didn't want that. She wanted to be treated like everybody else. Some people want a. Just wanted to be left alone. We said, yeah, obviously, we'll leave you alone. We'll treat you like everybody else, because you are. And she became one of my really good friends, and she can do everything, and it's amazing. And nobody even knows of her difference, which is incredible.

It's really cool. Amy Purdy was on recently, who lost both of her legs. And I mean, just the mindset that comes with that is incredible because it's that, you know, I'm absolutely still here, still doing what I want to do. It feels like for me, in my own yoga practice, just my evolution, that there's something that happens because of the physical practice of yoga that directly affects that mindset of, yeah, I can do that. I've got this. Whether you want to call it resilience or some other kind of energy, do you know why there's that physical body to mental body connection?

Oh, gosh. I mean, you probably could explain this so much more for me. It feels like the experience of becoming yourself and realizing that you're connected to everything. I mean, it's sort of the, you know, I. To me, it feels like taking your jacket off and just getting comfortable. It's like, oh, I'm here now. Before, I was worried about, you know, the job or the bills or the things or the. All of the stuff that's actually ridiculous that we know is. But once you have that mind body connection and that kind of yoga connection, you know, it's corny to say, but you feel connected to the universe. You feel like you're more confident in your place in it. You feel like it's okay. For you to go after, you know, the directions that you're interested, you just feel better in your own situation. I think that does bring a lot of natural confidence in this way, you know, that, you know, you can't get to from a spreadsheet or you can't get to from, you know, a kind of inside out feeling of confidence. But there's something beautiful there, definitely in, you know, actually Rudy Tanzi I met, he's a neuroscience person. He's been on the show Friends with Deepak Chopra. Yeah, Dr. Rudy Tanzi. And he's been really nice to us and said a lot of nice things about us. And I think because, you know, with Strala, we're really focused on moving in a way that feels better. And, you know, he says, well, from a neurological perspective, I don't understand all of these things from his perspective, but it feels the same. You're creating better energy around you, so the people around you feel better when you feel better. It's sort of like, you know, a radius, force field, whatever it is. And I shy away from talking about that so much because people go off on their angel theories and I just don't want to feed into anything that's not actually true. But there is this realness to you feel better, you're going to walk into the grocery store and the checkup person is going to have a better day because you're in a better mood. Not just because you decided to or something great happened to you, but you feel more grounded in your being and therefore the people around you automatically radiate that same feeling.

One of the things that I learned through focusing on physical movement and yoga is that I just decided that your intelligence is distributed throughout your body. In fact, much of your decision making, I believe, happens inside your cells, everywhere through the mitochondria. And I don't think I would have arrived at that had I not written a book on mitochondrial biology in the brain, but also had the experience of turning on all of the stuff that comes from a physical movement practice. And you realize, wow, there's stuff going on down there that has information in it. And that's why I don't have one of those necklaces where I'm going to, you know, cut off my head and freeze it when I die in case it makes me immortal. Because, like, I don't think that would work because you would lose a lot of the body intelligence if you did it. If you had a free coupon to get your head cut off when you die, would you take it Cryonics?

No, I'm on team you with that. Yeah, the whole thing is important, maybe even the center. I mean, that's why I think East Asian arts are so interesting. Talking about the gut, how we talk about it, but in shiatsu, it's called the hara. You move from your center. In tai chi, this is where it all is. The samurais, if they're killing themselves for honor, they slice their gut open. You know, that's where everything is. And the mind kind of follows that and, you know, in that kind of thinking, which, you know, makes a lot of sense to me, for sure. Maybe you could freeze the belly center.

Yeah, I love it. I'm freezing my gut brain, but not my head brain. I didn't really need that one. That's funny. My chronic friends are really angry now. They're all pissed that I'm not signed up. And I'm like, guys, I think you'd have to have a whole body. And even then, probably not how I'm.

Gonna do in a group rate.

I love it. Now, Joanne Cope from the Upgrade Collective is asking that in Strala Yoga, you talk about smooth movements, how important it is when you move from one position to another. They do it really smoothly. Why is that so important?

Oh, gosh, everything. I mean, it's kind of a shame to think about. I mean, we can talk about yoga, but everything else is, this is important, but this isn't important. And this is important, but this isn't important. And if you think about living a life like that, it sounds exhausting to me anyway, of I'm going to do this and I'm not going to put my energy here. This person is important and this person is not as valuable. And it's very. Kind of makes me feel like learning to drive a stick shift car. So, you know, one of the principles of moving well in general is moving in harmony with yourself. And I think what Dave was talking about so well, of, you know, getting everything together all at the same time and how that leads to this feeling of, you know, basic awesomeness and confidence and everything, you know, that doesn't come with just doing a pose and kind of fixing your alignment in the pose and then forgetting about it and then repeating that you may have a little blip of I feel really aligned and connected, but you're losing it and it's harder to get it back, and you're kind of tuning out and tuning in all the time. So, you know, whatever your style of yoga that you're doing, you know, you really can pay More attention to the transitions and how you're moving in and out of things, you know, and then. And then all of a sudden, your yoga practice becomes all the time. It doesn't begin and end when you, you know, bring your palms together or walk in and out of the space or walk in and out of the grocery store. It's. It's how you're moving, you know, sort of all the time. And yoga becomes this luxurious moment where you're moving in and out of these beautiful forms that are going to do these great things for you even better. But, you know, for me, focusing on the transitions is everything. Everything is a transition to something else. And then your something else always becomes better. You know, everybody great always says something like, wherever you go, there you are. Be here now, all of those things. But we're not really practicing it unless we're trying to move our best in harmony with more of the time.

So you're developing mindfulness between the poses that you then carry forward after you've done with your class. Okay.

Yeah, exactly. So from my perspective, if I'm leading a yoga class, it begins way before I sit at the front of the room and start. It's, you know, maybe when I wake up that morning and how I'm thinking about it, how I'm moving to the studio, you know, how I'm moving through the space, talking to people, you know, what's going on, how I get down to the ground in the beginning. Am I distracted? Am I, you know, looking at my phone and then popping right down? Or am I actually moving in a way that is good for me and good for the people around me? So, you know, there's so much to focus on and, you know, so much that we can all improve our whole life if we really focus on moving ourselves better from our center, moving in harmony with ourselves. And it doesn't need to be heady or scary. It's literally just noticing where you have tension, noticing where you're moving a little disconnected, and seeing if you can improve that, make it a little bit better, have the movement come from your center, shake it off a little bit if you're a little, you know, frazzled or disconnected or moving disjointed in a way, and then just, you know, go from there.

That makes a lot of sense. And it leads me to a question. You certainly have the. What you've developed with Strala Yoga, which is awesome. And I. I really like the smooth transition idea. When you say, oh, I want to find a yoga teacher, and you look around you see things like iyengar yoga, vinyasa yoga, flow yoga, Ashtanga yoga. How is a yoga newbie supposed to sort through all those to figure out what's best? Can you walk me through what those actually mean? I know, but I think you probably know better.

Well, I think it's really hard. I mean, before 20 years ago, when we were walking into yoga studios, there wasn't a. There was three things, maybe, and they'd been there for 30 years, and some benefactor bought somebody a building, and it was strange. So there was that or there was nothing. And now there's a million different variations. But I think you don't have to be so precious about it. If you go to a restaurant or if you prepare a food and you don't like it, you just don't eat it, again, you go to a different. If you got food poisoning, you don't go back. So I think a lot of times with yoga, people have this strange. You get wrapped up into the expectation of yourself, of it. And you go to, say, an Iyengara class and you felt really rigid, or the teacher made you feel a certain way, and. And then you go back because you feel like you should, or you feel guilty about something. I think because there's so many choices now. Go to something. If you love it, great. Go back. Just like a restaurant. If you go to something, you didn't like it, ask your friends what they like, then go to that thing. So I think also community, like you mentioned before, is so important if you have a few friends that are practicing, not even yoga, but practicing mindfulness or taking better care of themselves, I think it's a great place to start, maybe with who they're looking at for a leader in that space and kind of look around from there. And you don't need to be so chaotic about shopping in a kind of flippant way. But if something doesn't rub you the right way, don't go back. Just look around, just like you would treat everything else.

I had that experience early on with Ashtanga, which my wife Lana really likes. And, like, this is prison yoga. Like, you have to always do the same things in the right order at the same time. And, like, doesn't work for me. Like, I wanted to bend over for longer, and then I was, like, always catching up. But I know a lot of people love it, so I like the idea of kind of shopping around, but you got to find one where you feel like you're getting. Getting a feeling when you're done that you Got exercise and sweat if that's what you wanted. Or you got the relaxation and stretching if that's what you wanted. Or maybe all the above. A question from Paula in the Upgrade Collective. She wants to know, she says she loves yoga, Nidra, and wants to know if it really helps with sleep quality or if all yoga improves sleep. That's a really important question. Yoga and sleep. Walk me through what I need to know.

Oh, gosh. Well, I think, you know, this is not trying to be a cop out, but everything come back, comes back to mindset. So, you know, you could be taking the most relaxing yoga class in the world, but if you're not allowing yourself to be there, you're not going to get the benefit. I mean, it's the same with, you know, gut health and all the things you explained so well. If you're stressed and you take that green juice, it's really not going to do the great things that it could if you're taking better care of yourself and relax. So, you know, I think, you know, as Westerners, we're so used to this, I'm going to do this and then this is going to happen. But we forget that we're also the main ingredient in that thing that we're doing. So it's not just, you know, yellow and blue make green. It's sort of, you know, yellow and blue and you're a part of that too. So it's going to make this unique color that's that that has to do with you. So I think if, you know, if something's helping you sleep better, then that's great if you need help sleeping better. But I don't think it's so, you know, push this and this happens. But if you have a good mindset and you have this, this, you know, way of being in yourself, that's I'm going to take care of myself. I'm going to go into this and notice what's going on with myself. So I'm becoming more sensitized. Then great things are going to happen, whether it's better sleep or allowing your body to work for you in a better way.

What percentage of the classes you teach is pranayama and people doing ujjayi breaths and things like that versus talking versus moving.

Oh gosh. Well, you know, most of it is breath based movement. You know, there's a few classes we do, you know, the beginning of the week to sit down and breathe more and more, focus on meditation and mindfulness in the beginning of the class. But then we kind of Just get to it and move. But we're also moving in a gentle way, even when things are really challenging. So I think, you know, I think we get away with doing a lot more with less effort and less tension, and we don't need so much time just, you know, relaxing and restoring. Although that's wonderful, too. But I think I definitely teach more on the moving gently, continuously, and see what. See what we can do with it. See what can happen.

Okay, I like that. All right. Goat yoga. Yay or nay?

I think whatever makes you happy, you know, I mean, it's better than, you know, shooting up heroin or something like that.

All right, got it. So goat yoga, better than heroin. I've got you on that one. Maybe I'll write the blog post why goat Yoga is better than Heroin.

Yeah, that's good. It's a catchy title. You know.

By the way, this is the first time a yoga teacher has referred to heroin, so that's at least in my life. So that's a first. Thank you. What about hot yoga?

Here, to keep it interesting.

You did it. What do you think about.

I think it's a little bit of a. Yeah, I think it's a little. I mean, it is like, you know, you're so great at explaining this as well. Like, it's one of these hacks, you know, it's a biohack for yourself. You know, you can't do as much if you're depleting yourself than you could if you weren't. So, you know, if you take a lot of these hot yoga classes in a normal environment, you're not going to feel very. Like very much is happening with you. So really, it's this big trick that it's really hot in here. I can barely see anything. I'm getting dizzy. I'm not allowed to drink water because the teacher's in jail and he made up this weird thing. And, you know, it's a system of control, you know, but that said, you know, if you want to be warm and move, it helps you a little bit better. But, you know, it's a slippery slope of tricking yourself into thinking that you're doing this hard thing when really you're just depleting yourself and then trying to survive. So after you're done with a car accident, of course you feel euphoric because you've survived a car accident. But that's how a lot of people describe after a hot yoga class, you've survived something, so you get that endorphin rush, but you're not getting that maybe more holistic yoga sustainable approach of I did something great for myself and I can keep that going in a way. So I think, you know, maybe hot yoga is, you know, the sort of hack of the moment that's continuing beyond the guy who inventing it, going to jail. Which I have no idea why people continue things after the founder goes to jail, but they do.

So you're saying that hot yoga is worse than heroin?

It might be the same. You know that was actually a question.

From dawn in that grade collective.

But it's like, yeah, like maybe some cocaine, like it's one of those big night out partyings. It's for those adrenaline junkies. You know, there's the cocaine and then the ketamine when they're coming down and then you know, they're in the, yeah, the whole thing.

I once worked at a startup, one of the health tracking companies way back in the day with a guy who set up Bikram's first two studios. And man, some of the stories I heard, I could see how he ended up in jail. It was pretty, it was pretty out there. This is all secondhand stuff. I don't, you know, I've never met the guy but, but yeah, what I heard wasn't complimentary, we'll just put it that way. So yeah, my concern with hot yoga is that with the amount of humidity in the room like that, there aren't dehumidifiers afterwards. I've never been to a hot yoga facility that didn't have a mold problem. So that's an issue. Like you need to be in a clean space if you're going to be breathing that much. And even a lot of yoga studios, even without that have mold issues because you know, people go in there, they sweat and then they turn off the lights, shut the doors and everyone goes home and then it sits there when it's humid and warm and unair conditioned. So higher quality studios make you feel good. You walk into a room to do yoga and relax and be connected. If the air is full of toxins, it's not going to work. So that's something that I, I've been to a few studios where I walk in and go, I'm not doing yoga here and I walk out. So there's a quality issue and certainly that's something you've managed in your facilities. They're all super clean now I would, oh yeah.

I mean you gotta keep it going.

Yeah. And I've worked a lot on solving the mold problem. One of my companies called Homebiotic does that with a probiotic, you spray around. But I would just encourage any yoga facility, anyone who's running one who's listening, look at a dehumidifier that you run for a while after class. It'll make your facility last longer and your people will be happier. And it's not terribly expensive to do that. Otherwise, the long term things are a massively expensive remodel. And right now there's no yoga studio on, at least in, in North America that isn't struggling because they're saying, oh, yeah, you can open with four students. And you're like, you can't open with that. That's. That's a losing money worse than having the doors closed situation. So I'm hoping that we get yoga back soon or in parks or something like that. Where do you see the world of yoga 50 years from now? What's it gonna look like?

Oh, gosh. I mean. Well, I'm thinking about. My hope is people use it as another tool to feel better, to connect. And, you know, I know for myself, it just comes down to feeling better. And when I feel better, I do better in all areas of, you know, my life. So I think, you know, we're going through this very superficial time with yoga. I think it was odd and strange and from another land. And then it became a business and then it became, you know, kind of glossy poses. But. But people are really, really wanting to feel better. I mean, this is this wellness world, this humongous industry, and we're all craving to feel better and to connect. So, you know, my, my hope is that, you know, we move away from the gurus who did bad things and we get back to a practice that can help us feel better. And people can teach that in all kinds of different ways. You know, people connect with. Right now, everybody's an avatar. So I always say, if you don't like my avatar, there's someone else out there. I'm happy to recommend you. Some people that aren't going to harm you even through a video or the Internet, they're not going to make you feel bad about yourself. But I think it's a wonderful tool to help people get through life and thrive and feel better. And I think we all want that now. And yoga is obviously something that everybody knows what it is. Everybody knows the word. You know, it wasn't even so much 20 years ago. So I think, you know, it's a really simple tool that people can do to feel better. And, you know, I think it's going in that Direction. I hope it's going in that direction.

I have a final question for you in the interview. I've interviewed Deepak Chopra and spent a bit of time with him. And he's, he's got clean energy, he's very authentic. He didn't go down the dark guru path. Right. You clearly haven't. From my interactions with you and just your reputation, just the way you, you hold your space. What is your advice for all of the other yoga gurus who may end up in jail? How do they avoid that path?

You have to have common sense. You know, I think there's so many. I mean, the problem right now that no one's really talking about is we have, you know, it's kind of like a lot of the problems going on in the world. There's a whole group of millions of yoga teachers that have trained with these people that have done bad things. So the problem is also it's not just the person who's bad. It's how you're teaching. Are you pushing your students around just because that's a force of habit because your teacher told you to do that? What's the system that you learned? And even if your guru goes to jail and you say, okay, my guru went to jail, but I'm going to still teach the same thing, that's also a problem because you've learned this thing that's led to the bad things. So, you know, I think there's, you know, just for everybody looking at how you're doing the things that you're doing, and you know, Deepak, you know, has three really great questions that I think are amazing. Who am I? What do I want? How can I serve and what am I grateful for? And I think if you love something, if yoga has helped you and, and you want to help somebody else through it, that that should be enough. And if you're trying to, you know, gain weird things or you have to have a self reflection practice and why are you doing this and where is it going and what are you feeding? And if you're feeding any weird imbalance in yourself, you know, it's going to lead to not great places. It's not going to feel good for you. Eventually, even if you get some degree of success, you're going to be miserable in that success as well. So, you know, I think it comes down to, you know, people get into yoga because they want to feel better and people sometimes stay in it because they've gained some power over other people. And that kind of feels good. You know, people like to be in these weird relationships with each other. And it's just not healthy, I think, having friends that call you out on your. On how you're doing and how you're talking. You know, I think if you have a class and you speak to the people in your class, just like you would speak to your family or your boss or your. Somebody at the grocery store, you know, checking how you're interacting with people, it should be the same. It shouldn't be like, you know, we kind of joke in yoga. There's this, oh, hey, how you doing? What's going on? And then the yoga class starts and, hello, now I know so much more than you, and that's exhausting for the team teacher. So I think it's, you know, realizing that maybe you've been fooled for a long time by your teachers. We all have. And then having enough confidence in yourself to say, you know, I'm worth it. I want to help people. So I want to reflect and constantly improve. And I mean, I'm from a small town. Like, I know that I have to improve because I'm from nowhere. I knew nobody. So improving is my path forward. I think that's just such a. A great habit to have is, you know, that's why I've always loved your work. You're figuring out how to improve yourself and help everybody, and it's just such a normal thing that gets lost all the time in yoga and people just stop improving and then start spewing. And then it just gets strange.

There's a certain point where the student is meant to become the master, but if the master is taught the wrong stuff and the student didn't do their own work, then you can replicate mistakes. Mistakes. And I, I'm totally with you there. So sounds like doing your own thinking and creating a world where people, people can use yoga as a tool in the future, I think is. Is important and anyone can start doing it now. And I think your. Your book is actually really cool because you talk about yoga, but it's not a yoga textbook. There's plenty of those and there's all sorts of YouTube videos, and you have a bunch of courses that are actually really good. But the idea of talking about that unification that the alignment that comes when you're lining up your intent and your inner world, you're lining up your nutrition and whatever practice you have so that they all work together. There is efficiency, there's synergy in thinking about it like that. So I think you did a good job of explaining what is naturally a very kind of a fluffy subject. I mean, you can find studies or something if you want to. But really, how do you measure alignment? You can do it, you know, with lasers, if you're talking physical alignment. But is your mind and your heart and your. Your body all alignment? We haven't quantified that yet, so writing a book of that is a difficult thing to do. But I think you did a good job and thank you for writing it and thank you for being a guest on the show.

Oh my gosh, you're the best. I was so excited to talk to you and see you. So thank you so much. You're so great to me. Thank you. I really appreciate it.

You're welcome. And congrats on Strala Yoga and keep pushing through the pandemic. We will have classes full of people who are perfectly safe very soon now. Yes, if you guys like today's episode. Well, if you liked it, you might want to read Tara's book. If so, pick up a book and do what you always do when you read a book or listen to a podcast. You leave a review. Because that's pretty much the same as tipping your barista. So if it was worth your time to read the book, then let her know. Because all authors appreciate that. Certainly I do as well. Have a beautiful day.

A Human Upgrade Formerly Bulletproof Radio was created and is hosted by Dave Asprey. The information contained in this podcast is provided for informational purposes only and is not intended for the purposes of diagnosing, treating, curing, or preventing any disease. Before using any products referenced on the podcast, consult with your healthcare provider carefully, read all labels, and heed all directions and cautions that accompany the products. Information found or received through the podcast should not be used in place of of a consultation or advice from a healthcare provider. If you suspect you have a medical problem or should you have any healthcare questions, please promptly call or see your healthcare provider. This podcast, including Dave Asprey and the producers, disclaim responsibility for any possible adverse effects from the use of information contained herein. Opinions of guests are their own and this podcast does not endorse or accept responsibility for statements made by guests. This podcast does not make any representations or warranties about guest qualifications or credibility. This podcast may contain paid endorsements and advertisements for products or services. Individuals on this podcast may have a direct or indirect financial interest in products or services referred to herein. This podcast is owned by Bulletproof Media.