In this YouTube interview, host Dennis Prager speaks with former Connecticut high‑school track star Selina Soule and attorney Kristen Waggoner of the Alliance Defending Freedom. The conversation centers on the fairness issue of biological males competing in women’s track events, citing two transgender athletes in Connecticut who, after transitioning, have won multiple state titles and set records, displacing cisgender female athletes. Selina describes the support she has received from teammates, parents, and other athletes, as well as the hate she endures on social media, and emphasizes her call for restored fairness in all women’s sports. Kristen updates on the ongoing Connecticut lawsuit challenging the state’s transgender‑inclusion policy, noting a pending motion to dismiss, a judge’s refusal to recuse despite alleged bias, and the prospect of Supreme Court review. The interview also touches on scientific studies—such as a 2019 Swedish hormone‑suppression study and a New England Journal of Medicine article—debunking the claim that lowered testosterone levels equalize performance. Broader context is provided about similar cases nationwide, including a college‑athlete case in Idaho before the Ninth Circuit. The dialogue includes lighter moments about locker‑room logistics and Selina’s personal background, underscoring the intersection of athletics, law, and cultural debate.
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She has, she and others, but she specifically has lost the ability to win at track because she has to. She was a champion in Connecticut and she now has to race against biological males who consider themselves females. We are not knocking their ability to consider themselves females. That is not the issue. The issue is so obviously one of fairness. Why can a biological male— if a biological male can race against the biological female, why are there biological female teams? Might be the end of it, in fact. Anyway, Selina, I want to salute your courage and your athleticism. Welcome to my show.
Thank you. Thank you for having us.
And Kristen, it's good to be with you again and the great work that ADF does. So what is the state of your lawsuit, either of you, against the state of Connecticut?
Well, the lawsuit is in the trial court now before a judge, and we expect that the judge will rule on a motion to dismiss, and it will continue through, up through the court system. And our expectation is ultimately the U.S. Supreme Court's going to need to decide this issue.
Have you seen the article in the New England Journal of Medicine?
I don't know that I— I'm not sure which one you're referring to.
Oh, that's fine.
Just tell me a little bit more about it. There are a number of articles on the topic.
Oh, there are? I didn't know. I just saw the latest, and it's further deterioration of the New England Journal of Medicine into a political magazine. The argument is, and I'd like either of you to respond on this too, The argument is that lower testosterone levels should suffice to enable biological males to race against females.
Well, I would say that's junk science because there are plenty of other studies, including a 2019 Swedish study, that says males actually maintained or even, even increased in strength after a year of suppression. And we actually saw this in C.C. Tefler's performance times in Division II where, uh, CeCe's times actually improved in track and field events after a year of hormones and competing from a man and then transitioning to a woman. So I think there are plenty of studies that would contradict that.
Selina, how do the other girls on your track team react to this?
I've gotten a lot of support, especially in person. I've had not only my team, my former high school teammates but also just other athletes at meets and even parents come up to me and thank me for my speaking out. So most of the feedback that I've gotten has been in support of me, which is very encouraging.
Tell everybody how these two transgender females fared when they raced against biological men.
When they were— Go ahead. Selena. When one of them always competed as a female, but one did compete as a male for 3 seasons and then 2 weeks later switched to competing for the girls team, and prior to that time of being on the girls team, that athlete could not qualify for even the boys conference championships in the state of Connecticut.
But Dennis, they've won 15 women's state championship titles since they switched over, and 17 new individual meet records have been set by these men who are competing against the girls and causing girls to lose state championships and opportunities and college scouting experiences as well.
What takes— oh, actually, before I go to the locker room issue, Uh, which is not my fundamental issue, it's a curiosity, but, uh, if I met these two, Selena, with not knowing anything, would I feel that I was with two women or two girls?
In our case, it's not— we're not taught— we're not focusing on just these two athletes. We are focusing on the whole whole concept of biological males competing against females, and all we're asking for is fairness to be returned to not only track and field but all women's sports.
Is it going beyond these two? Has this phenomenon increased?
In the state of Connecticut, there were only these two athletes, and they graduated this past year with me, but there are dozens of other cases in all sports, not only in the U.S. but even across the world and at different professional levels. So it's not only an isolated incident.
How do you like your video?
I thought it came out very well.
Well, you did a very— you really did a good job. Are you headed to college?
Yes, I am in college.
I see. And, and Are you aware— well, I guess there have been no sports events, so you don't know if this issue will arise at your college, right?
Yes, we still— we did not have a fall season, and we still are waiting to hear about a winter and a spring season.
I feel bad asking this, but have you received any hate?
I have received a lot of hate, but all of that hate has been through social media. So I don't pay attention to it. I just focus on the positive feedback and the fact that I know what I'm doing is right, and that regardless of what comments come my way, I know that no matter what, fairness needs to be restored to all women's sports.
Can you explain to me why you're so mature?
I think that this going through this process has certainly made me into more of a mature person than most my age.
Well, it's a very mature answer, as it happens. I was going to ask, and this is a curiosity question, I have no agenda, did, did your track team dress up in a locker room prior to a competition?
We never had locker rooms that the athletes would use during meets. Because we would come— most of our meets were with 10, 15 schools, so there wasn't a way for anyone to be in a locker room. So I— we would just kind of all, you know, get on the bus or get on the van and all show up to the meet.
So already dressed up to race?
Yeah.
Gotcha. So it's obviously the question would be moot. So back to Kristin, this is now at a trial judge. And, uh, is it just going to be one of these things that if it's a Democratic-appointed judge or a Republican-appointed judge and that's the end of the issue? What do you think?
We're concerned. Uh, we filed in Selena's case a motion to recuse the current judge because of some statements that would— he was requiring us to refer to, uh, these individuals or not refer to them as biological males and suggesting that science would dictate that, which is incorrect and we believe shows bias. Unfortunately, he declined to recuse himself, and so he will be deciding this case. And we're hopeful that we'll be able to convince him otherwise, but if not, the case will go up on appeal. And, you know, Dennis, many of the cases we may lose at the lower courts, but it's a long game that we're playing here. And you may not be aware, there's a second case involving college athletes in Idaho in this issue as well. As well, and that's at the Ninth Circuit too. But Selina started this, and the courage that she had in standing up for all female athletes is tremendous.
Selina, are your parents, uh, do they have your back?
Yes, my parents have fully supported me the entire time, and it was actually my mother who started, um, speaking up before I did. And then after I lost out qualifying for the 2019 Indoor New England Championships is when I started going public with this. My parents have always supported me, and they're very proud of what I've, what I've become and what I've done.
You have siblings?
No, I'm an only child.
Oh, how interesting. For whatever reason, did you grow up in a more secular or more religious home?
I don't think that really matters. It's just that my parents, you know, always taught me—
Well, I'll tell you why I asked. You don't have to answer, believe me. I asked because I don't know if the secular world produces courage. I have an agenda. That's my agenda. So you don't have to respond, but I want you to know why I asked. My assumption is that people who have courage to buck the totalitarian herd are overwhelmingly people from religious backgrounds. But that's the reason I asked, and you certainly don't have to respond. Anyway, we all salute you. Please go and watch her video. Kristen, God bless the ADF, and God bless you, Selina, secular or religious.
