People Get Themselves

Hello, y'all, or as they say in Pittsburgh, yinz. You know that?

You did tell me that.

Is that great?

We should start using it.

Yinz. But nobody else, anyone outside of Pittsburgh won't know. Dennis Prager and the Julie Hartman.

I thought you forgot my name for a minute.

Oh, that— it could happen.

I know. I know.

It's painful. It's painful. Has anybody yet done this? This will be a moment in your life when someone says to you, are you the Julie Hartman?

I actually had someone come up to me at the PragerU gala. I was walking to the bathroom and there was a woman behind me about 5 steps and I could sense that she was walking to the bathroom so I held the door open. She goes, "Are you Julie Hartman?" So we're getting there.

Okay. I couldn't believe it. I know, I love it. You let me know the first time you go, you get the. So I get that a lot.

I've never gotten it though.

No, no, it'll happen. But I get a big kick out of it. Somebody at a restaurant, the Dennis Prager, or on the phone, and I go, yes, my first name is the, and this is my middle name.

Why do they say the?

I mean, well, because theoretically, well, Julie Hartman has more people than Dennis Prager. There are very few Dennis Pragers around. So this is the—

you—

God, truer words have never been said. So this is the day after Christmas and the day after Hanukkah. Works out perfectly. So I have a few very important things on my mind. I don't know your reaction on any of these, so it'll be very interesting. I mean, I have your general— I have a general sense, but I have specific questions. So I'll begin with a topic I raised on my radio show and which my most recent column was about, because I'm, I'm actually somewhat obsessed with this problem of parents whose children so loathe the fact that the parent is a conservative, and God forbid a Trump supporter, that they not only have opted out of their parents' lives completely but they don't even let their parents see their grandchildren. I, I want to tell you, I, I took a vow when I first began radio that I would do everything I could not to exaggerate. Of course, not to lie, but even not to exaggerate. I believe that the number of homes in which this takes place is in the hundreds of thousands, for sure. I, I think at least half a million homes there is a child, an adult child, who will not speak to a parent and will not let the parents see their grandchildren because they're, uh, they voted for Trump or because they, they voted Republican, etc., etc. So I wrote this piece, and you've got to read the comments. I always read comments, not just to my own articles in general, how many people wrote that that is the situation in my home? I can't— I haven't seen my grandchildren in 5 years.

Is there any analog throughout history to this?

Well, there may be in history. I can't think of an American analog.

Right.

And, and so there are a few things I want to raise with you and bounce them off you. So one is My belief, and everybody should know, but I want to announce it for everyone. If you differ with me, it is a non-issue. And anyone differs with me, certainly you. Okay, I am, I am certain I may be wrong, but I, I am, then I'm certainly wrong, but, but I am certain that leftism makes you a meaner human being. Not liberalism. Liberalism makes you naive, but leftism makes you mean in the vast majority of cases because it makes you angry. So tell me what you think. Go ahead.

I have found that in my observation, the people who I know who are extremely far left are mean people, and I think it comes from a hostility and anger because baked into leftism is outrage and the worldview that everything is wrong and everything is terrible and working against you. The world's going to end because of climate change that people caused. The country is systemically racist. People cannot express their true identities because we succumb to a heteronormative culture. It just all surrounds anger. In the world of leftism, there's nothing good. There's nothing worth pointing to and saying that you're proud of something. You just have to get angry all of the time. So I would agree, it does make you meaner.

Did you see this on your college campus?

Oh yeah, oh for sure.

So amplify on that for a moment.

Well, I would observe that people would— I think that they use outrage at things going on in the world as a way to express a deeper anger that they have about other things in their life. So I notice when people get really upset about Trump, there's something, and I can't exactly pinpoint it, but it's just a vibe that I get, for lack of a better term. I can tell that they're not really angry at Donald Trump. They have a visceral feeling of feeling unsettled in their life, and Donald Trump is the socially acceptable way to take out that anger. And also, I think that people on the left, the mean and angry ones that I've seen, think that somehow being mean makes them morally superior because they're mean in the name of a good cause. So they're proud of themselves when they shout down a conservative, and they, spew vitriol at a right-winger because they're doing the morally right thing to do. Just as if you would curse a Nazi out on the street, that would be the morally right thing to do 'cause Nazis are reprehensible. In the eyes of a leftist, funneling that anger at conservatives is the morally righteous thing to do.

[Speaker:DENNIS PRAGER] So I totally agree, and that's the macro acting out, shutting down people, et cetera. But I'm thinking even micro. So I pose this question to people. Let's say you're an independent. You're not right, you're not left, okay? Or at least that's how you define yourself. Do you think your child, your adult— let's say your 18-year-old, your 25-year-old— would become a kinder, finer human being if— no, no, I'm going to give you, you know, my, my auras. Yes, this is one of my more questions. If your child became a religious Jew, a religious Protestant, a religious Catholic, or religious— I said Jew— or a religious Mormon, or a religious leftist, so to speak, in other words, a serious woke leftist, do you believe that the first four would produce the same type of human as the fifth would.

The first four being the traditional conservative religion?

Right.

No, I don't.

No, I know you don't. I'd like to ask this of people who are, as I said, independent. People— all right, we're both conservative.

Their answer may depress you.

Oh, really?

Yes.

You don't? Oh, that's fascinating. I thought it's a rhetorical question.

That's what we think, but I have assumed before that it's understood that people who are traditional or conservative or religious will be better people than those who are leftists. But I can tell you, Dennis Prager, besides conservatives, other people don't see it that way. Not even independents, at least in my—

No, no, I'm learning. I don't dispute you. I just, I find that fascinating. If push came to shove for the average American parent who is apolitical, let's say, Your, your child can be one of these 5 in terms, in terms of just honesty, kindness, respect for other people, respect for you, you're the parent. Do you think it's a toss-up, it's irrelevant which of the 5, or do you believe that the first 4 are likely to produce a finer human being?

I think they would say it's a toss-up and it depends on the person. We have an astounding amount of moral relativism in our culture now where something as obvious as this is no longer obvious.

Wow. But you know what? I'm gonna tweet that out.

Oh, I'm honored.

Oh no, I'm gonna tweet out my question to get an answer. You should be honored. Well, you should. I'll tell you how you should be honored.

I knew Sean would die.

Okay. no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'll tell you why you should be honored. I would not have tweeted it out if you didn't raise it as a question.

I have to admit, when you said, I'm gonna tweet that, I thought, what did I say?

Oh, I was like, what did I say?

That was good?

I wasn't clear about the that. No, I. I would like to tweet the question out to the public.

Get rid of that. No, it's a very.

If your child would be a religious one of these four or a leftist, not liberal but left, what would you— what do you think would make a finer human being, or do you think it's a toss-up?

People don't think values matter anymore. They think circumstances matter more than values, and depending on the depending on the person mentality too.

So I think you've alluded to this in the past. So you, you were never a leftist, but no, I think you wouldn't have. You wouldn't have said 4 years ago you were conservative or 3 years ago.

Definitely not.

So now that you do, do you think you're a better person?

Oh my gosh, of course. I did a show on, on my, my own show, Timeless, which, by the way, it's so cute. I got an email from a listener the other day who said, Julie, I love your show, Priceless.

Oh, oh, listen.

Isn't that so great?

This is part of the joy of being a public person.

Oh my God, she made me double over laughing.

You know how often I have been introduced as the author of Happiness Is a Serious Business?

Really?

Oh, more than serious problem.

Wow. Yes. Why do you think that is?

Oh, or even better, when I first began lecturing and I only had my Jewish book out, The Nine Questions People Ask About Judaism, Almost no one got it right. They got the number wrong. They said Jews ask about Judaism. People ask. So it's just inevitable. Anyway, so go ahead.

So she, just to say one other thing, when she said the priceless thing, I wrote back to her and I said, oh my gosh, it's so funny, my show's called Timeless, but you made me laugh. And she wrote back and she was so embarrassed.

I know. And I want her to know. They're mortified, I know.

It's so funny to us. But we're not mortified.

No, not at all.

I'm gonna announce it on my show that I'm taping later today. Anyway. I did a show in the first 5 episodes, I believe, where I talked about how conservatism outside of its political dimension has made me a better person. Obviously, conservatism in the main is a political point of view, and I do believe that my— the way that I vote now and my political positions make me a better person because I feel that I'm supporting America. But even just outside of politics, Conservatism in religion demands something of you. It requires you to look inside yourself first instead of blaming other people for issues. And to reorient my thinking and my life that way has been profound. And also, what I love about conservatism is that it forces you to identify what it is that you want to conserve. In the case of the political dimension, we want to conserved the principles of the American founding. But I just think that's such a great endeavor in life, or a great pursuit, I should say, to figure out what it is in your life that you want, what your values are, and then conserve them and try to abide by them. Instead of, in a leftist realm of life, you kind of just go willy-nilly and you can progress and change as you go along. I don't think that that makes you a stronger, more principled person. So that's a way of saying yes.

So it's a very important question because people on the left claim, or beyond claim, they're certain they're better people than people on the right.

If you're certain you're a better person, this is sort of like that answer you gave of, you know who's lying? It's the people who are suppressing the truth or suppressing speech, I should say, yes. I love it. You know who's lying? The people who are suppressing the truth. Another edit out, Sean.

That's what we call a tautology.

That's what we call a, I've been taping shows every day and I'm exhausted moment. That has to go down in Dennis and Julie history. That was so stupid. Anyway, just as you say that the people who are lying are the ones who are suppressing speech, I say that you should probably be skeptical of the people who think that they're really good people. I'm not necessarily saying you're a bad person if you think you're a good person, but every fine human being I know doesn't say all the time what a fine human being they are.

They criticize themselves. This is one of these precious moments where we might have a difference.

Oh no, here we go. Let me get out my boxing gloves.

Yes.

Are you a senior living off of your retirement savings just to get by? Is high inflation and poorly performing markets depleting your retirement accounts? What if you didn't have to struggle to pay bills, mortgage, property taxes, and insurance ever again? Contact Andrew Del Rey and Todd Avakian at AndrewAndTodd.com. Get cash by tapping into the equity in your home tax-free and eliminate your monthly mortgage payment forever with a reverse mortgage. You maintain ownership of your home and pay the loan back when you don't live there anymore. You keep your retirement money working for you. Get cash from the equity in your home, maintain ownership and the equity growth, and never pay another mortgage payment again. Go to AndrewAndTodd.com, fill out the short form online, and see if a reverse mortgage is the right solution for you. Call 888-888-1172, that's 888-888-1172, or go online to AndrewAndTodd.com, that's AndrewAndTodd.com.

My experience has been, first of all, bad people think they're good and good people think they're good. So whether you think you're good or not generally doesn't have much of an impact on whether you're good, because so many bad people, so many people who've done bad think they're good. But I, I don't have a problem with good— I have a problem with good people not thinking they're good. I want them to have a realistic view of themselves. And I also want them to have some reward for their goodness.

I should amend my statement. It's not that in my eyes good people think that they're bad, but it's that good people don't think that they are the best thing since sliced bread the way that leftists do morally. Leftists think that they can never err morally.

Well, they think— this is how I would refine it. I think I'm right, they think they're right, so that's even. However, I don't think I have a right to suppress them. That's where their arrogance comes in and their evil.

Well, also, they don't think they have to improve themselves. When has a leftist ever said, I could have done that better, or I made a mistake, my care— I have a faulty character? Uh, well, yeah, no, that I need to remedy.

Yeah, the wrestling with yourself is a conservative.

Yes.

Well, I've always said, I'm sure you've heard me say this, that big difference between religious and secular education— in, in religious Christian or Jewish education, you are taught that you are your biggest problem, and in secular education, you're taught that America is your biggest problem. Or society or your parents, but something outside of you. But that's probably the single biggest problem of all. So I'm narrowing down our issue because it's an important one. Both sides think they're, they're good generally, and that's okay. But they, they don't— they believe that they don't have to wrestle with themselves. Yes, we do.

That's a big difference.

That's a very big difference.

It—

when I spoke at the TPUSA gigantic thing that Charlie Kirk put on in Phoenix just this past week, so I spoke to like 8,000 mostly students, and I decided to talk about personal issues, how to be a better person. So I thought, first of all, I didn't mention this from there, but I thought And how many left-wing enterprises or conventions does a speaker get up and speak, "Let me talk to you about how to be a finer human being"?

Doesn't happen.

Exactly.

They externalize everything.

That's right. A finer human being has a smaller carbon imprint.

Yes.

Okay, that's how it's defined. So—

Fights racism.

I said to them, yeah, exactly, which is true. I fight racism. I think that's important for a good person to do. The problem is the racism in America is from the left, right? That's the problem. But because they believe in black dormitories and black graduations, we don't. They believe in dropping standards for blacks, we don't. So the, the, this line, I was very touched, got an applause, big applause when I spoke about this, that we are taught to wrestle with our natures. And I said something to the effect, on the left, they're wonderful and America stinks. But my belief, our belief is America is wonderful. My nature stinks. And they applauded vociferously, which is a good sign.

I love it in speeches. Not that I have spoken very often, but when moments like that happen, it's very affirming to you as a speaker.

Right, you can't— yeah, all right. Although I have the view of that that I have of the lights lighting up for a talk show host. You can't— you have to be confident that what you have to say is important and not wait for applause. I only mentioned that because I was taken aback that something so critical of them and myself would get an applause. It was a good sign. I, I wasn't heartened for me as I was for the, for the point that I made that, that you can you imagine saying that at an ACLU convention? Well, first of all, nobody who says it would be invited, but if, if somebody did, they'd be booed.

You know, I'm thinking now about why that garnered such a reaction, and I have two stipulations. The first is that it's so refreshing to hear someone say that, and it's so antithetical to the messages that we're getting, not just in schools, but from our leaders, from the TV shows and movies that we consume. So I think that's one component. Another component that, again, I'm just kind of devising now is, and it's actually kind of shocking to me that I'm even saying this because I tend to be a pessimist as opposed to an optimist. But I do think there is a part of human nature that likes this idea of that we are flawed and we can improve ourselves. I don't know why we're drawn to that idea, but sometimes when people say that to me—

I'm drawn to the idea because it's true.

Well, it's true, but also, again, I know I say this all the time, I think that is one of the most empowering things.

Because we can change ourselves.

Because we can change ourselves. As I say, when I end my show every single day, we can mold ourselves like clay. The decisions we make, the way that we think, our actions, we can shape ourselves into the human beings that we want to be by constantly improving those things. I love that. I think that is one of the coolest messages in life. So maybe that's why it got such a reaction because people—

Oh, that's interesting.

People wanna feel that hope that they can change.

I thought it got that reaction because they resonated to the point, or with the point.

Oh, well, yeah.

Which if true was such a credit to them and how different they are from left-wing students who would find that an obnoxious idea. It's America that stinks, not me.

So what do you think about the hypothesis that I put forward a few minutes ago where I said that the reason why leftists are so angry is that they have, they're really angry at other things in their own lives and they use they take it out on Trump or on conservatives or on climate change.

So, okay, so I have had one of my famous $64,000 questions. Does the angry and bitter and mean, is that, are they more likely to be drawn to leftism or does leftism make you bitter, angry, and mean? And my answer is both.

Both, for sure, yes. Oh yeah.

Now look, what are you going to be bitter, angry, and mean about if you're conservative? You, you probably have a religion which, which somewhat subdues the bitter, angry, and the mean. You're, you're a big believer in the, the great American values. You think you live in a good country, or what until very recently was the best country. Now I don't know what the best country is. I'm— I can't believe I'm saying this.

I know. God, I was thinking that the other day.

It never occurred to me that I would ever say I don't know what the best country is. The damage the left has done in such a speedy amount of time, short period of time, is astonishing. Anyway, so back to my, my, my— I have a few points about this in light of the season that we're in. So my original one was how mean your child must be to not allow you to see your grandchildren because he or she is a leftist and you're a rightist. Uh, so here, so let me do a, a, like part 12 or whatever part we're up to. As honest, and you are honest, but dig deep to be as honest as possible on this. Can you imagine a conservative adult child not allowing his or her parent to see the grandchildren because the parent is a leftist?

I'm not going to say it never happens.

But do you know of any?

No.

Okay. No, I, no, I don't know of any.

And I can't imagine it either.

I can't.

It's It's inconceivable.

It's exactly— it's, it really is inconceivable. And if it did happen, every one of us would say, what are you, an a-hole?

Right.

What the hell's wrong with you? Your parents are leftists. Amala Ekwinobi, her, her mother is, is a far leftist activist, and she shows her such respect. That's a perfect example.

It is a perfect example. No, I can't, I can't imagine it with a conservative because we're values-based, not politics-based. The left is politics-based, not value-based. It's inverted.

That's right. That's exactly right. So I just wanted to make that clear. The amount of cruelty— I mean, to not speak to your parent is cruel. To not allow them to see your grand— is It's pure cruelty. And there's no, there's no other word for it. And to do it based on, on just on you don't agree with them on the issues.

Mm-hmm. And you know, I mean, look, this is one extreme and unfortunately it is so common nowadays to see people truly like breaking ties with their family members permanently because of politics. But there are also gradations of that that aren't as severe. And I've even experienced in my own family, Thankfully, I don't not speak to someone because of their politics, or rather, they don't— no one has cut me out because I'm conservative. But I have had relationships damaged and diminished as a result of my public work, where at the dinner table, if certain relatives are in town and come over, we cannot talk about my job ever. We won't even bring it up. We certainly can't talk about the news or politics. And that, again, that's not as severe as cutting the cord, but in a way it is because your relationship is just a shadow of what it once was. And it's really sad because I want to hear their arguments. I want to be able to talk about the big issues in life, even if I think they're dead wrong.

[Speaker:DENNIS_PRAGER] You and I and virtually every conservative knows all their arguments because, as I always say, we read them, watch them and study under them. They don't read us, they don't watch us, and they don't study under us.

It's crazy how few people at Harvard knew, like, Jordan Peterson, for instance.

That is a giveaway beyond—

they don't know their names.

No. Or Tom Sowell.

No. Oh, oh my gosh. I would bring up Tom Sowell to people and they would look at me like, who are you talking about?

That's right. Exactly. It is fascinating. I would love to do a multiple choice on who the average Harvard student heard of.

You did a really great quiz. I think it was like a year and a half ago. Are you a liberal or a leftist?

Right. Oh yeah, I did 32 questions.

We should redo that, you know, because we talk on this program, I think last time, like, do people know Pol Pot? We should, we should like draft up a quiz and try to coerce people my age into taking it. They probably wouldn't because they would know they would be exposed, but we should give it out to parents and say, you need to make sure your kid knows this by the time they're 18.

More of your formerly fellow students at Harvard, I believe, would know the the slave woman that Thomas Jefferson had kids with than would know Pol Pot.

It's such an apt example. It's true. It's true. People know more about the history of slavery and indigenous migration than they know about Mohammad Mosaddegh in Iran, who was overthrown in 1953.

Oh, well, please. Okay, that's really getting into the abstract. How about Gulag?

Yeah, no, they wouldn't be able to say that.

Where 20 to 40 million people were slaughtered. How many Ukrainians did the Soviets starve to death deliberately?

They wouldn't know that it even happened.

They wouldn't know what you're talking about.

They wouldn't know what you're talking about. And frankly, I didn't know that that happened until I encountered you.

That's sad.

It is sad. So I'm not trying to wag my finger. You know, sometimes I speak about this as enthusiastically as I do because I was once that person.

Well, that's why it's very powerful for you to speak about this.

I'd like to introduce you to Monorail, America's investment app that takes you from where you are to where you want to be. Monorail is an investment and savings app that is made for patriots by patriots. It doesn't matter whether you're an Apple fan or if you prefer Android, Monorail is available in both environments and online at monorail.com. Monorail is safer for users with bank-level encryption and biometrics. Your money is protected with Monorail through the Securities Investor Protection Corporation and the FDIC. No matter how you engage with Monorail, you're getting the security and safety that you need, whether you're adding funds to your investment account, looking to buy a stock, or putting money aside for future purchases. With Monorail, you can put your money where it matters and utilize the economic power that built this country. Don't go somewhere else to trade stocks. Monorail gives you the freedom to purchase whole or fractional shares in companies that you believe in. It only takes 5 minutes to download the app and to set Join the pro-America money movement. Join Monorail.

So again, I just want to summarize this point because it's so important. Their meanness overwhelms our meanness. I mean, there's no comparison. And this is the proof. You can't see your grandchildren because you voted for Trump. We would never do— but just for the record, because this comes as a shock to people on the left, I promise you, I loathe Joe Biden as much as you loathe Donald Trump. And I have better reason. Yes, Trump did not damage the country. Whatever you think of the man as an individual, which is another subject for another time— how do we assess people? This, it's a very complex and important subject. But that Trump is a fascist, so why was fascism not implemented for 4 years when he was in power? What are you talking about?

You made that point. I thought it was excellent recently. Maybe it was on The Young Turks or something where you said there was no diminution of liberty under Trump. Yes, but there has been a significant amount under Biden. I have used that many times in arguments. Well, another thing is, you know, Donald Trump and his policy positions would have been completely mainstream for a conservative in the '70s. But, but Joe Biden and his policies would have been outrageous. For Democrats even just half a century ago.

To have a guy in drag speak at the White House. This is so, so this is what the person on the left says, oh, I don't want my kids to have a model in Donald Trump, but you do want your kids to have a model in a drag queen.

I know. And also you need to, you need to figure out what your options are and what to prioritize. So if I have Trump who is personally, you know, reprehensible or loud and angry and doesn't have any manners, all of these things that are true, but he's a great president, I would rather take him as my president over someone who is at least on the surface mannered but is an awful president. Because I'm voting for a president, I'm not voting for a parent, I'm not voting for a teacher or a role model, I'm voting for someone to run our country. I don't understand how people can't I see that difference.

Well, I, the whole time when people say Trump is this, Trump is that, so I'm just curious, when, if you, God forbid, had serious cancer, would you choose your oncologist based on how fine a human being he was or how fine a surgeon he was? Mm-hmm.

Well, I say, I say to people a lot, I go, let me ask you a question. Would you rather have Trump teach your kids about sex ed or Biden? Would you rather have Trump preside over your court case or Biden? Would you? And I put it in different scenarios because then they can see the policy implications of these presidents as opposed to their temperament.

One would hope. But I really, I always try to drive the point home on the most important things in your life, or in certainly in the public's life, but even in your life, You need an oncologist. So Oncologist A is good.

You went to one the other day.

I did?

Yes. Isn't that the eye doctor?

Oncologist is a cancer doctor.

Sean's laughing again. Oh, God.

That's, that's a boo-boo.

That's a really, really big boo-boo. Okay. I want to die now. We're definitely editing that out.

No, we're not. No, it's priceless.

No, it's actually so bad. It's so bad.

Okay, you can't know everything, and thank God you didn't. You don't know what an oncologist is.

Well, wait, I'm sorry, what's the eye doctor called?

Ophthalmologist or optometrist.

I'm just gonna shut up. I am not gonna respond.

I want you all to know, Julie—

I am not saying anything.

I'm looking at the camera. Julie is horrified right now.

I'm horrified.

She is. So I just want you to know, in front— it is— in front of 1,000 people when I was the head of this institute in my late 20s, big institute, uh, and I, I, I was reading something and I read a word and I said 'oree' and 500 people shout out 'arai.' Oh no. So I haven't forgotten it, do you understand? Yes, it's like this.

No, it's true, it's true.

Oh, whenever I hear, I But as you, as I, as you said, I said to myself, it's good for you, Dennis. Okay.

It's good for me. Yes, you got it.

All right. So oncologist is cancer doc. So do you, you have terrible cancer, you're a loved, a loved one does. You have two choices. One is a fine doctor, a fine oncologist who is known for his decency. He has never been unfaithful to his wife. The other oncologist is known as sort of a magician as an oncologist. Sort of a genius when it comes to cancer, but is a pretty reprehensible guy, is known as a womanizer even though he's married. So which one would you take? Why is it any different for my country, especially if my country has cancer, which it does now?

Stage 4.

That may be true.

So with these people, who don't allow their kids to see their grandparents. I, I often wonder, when are you going to wake up and realize?

Oh, that's a great question.

Rotten decision.

So yes, so I wonder that too.

When is the guilt going to kick in? Is it when your parents die?

Yeah.

Is it?

Or when you die?

Yes.

Well, so I, I, I'm so angry at people who do this to their parents, and not all of them do. Most it's on politics, but many for other reasons, and which are no more valid. I mean, you know, if you're beaten by your, your parent, they're thugs and they, they nearly drowned you, okay, but that's very rare, right? Okay, so I, I think always in terms of justice, and there is no justice ultimately in this world, but I, I'd like to increase the amount. Do I wish that their children do to them what they did to their parents? I'm haunted by this question.

I am too, and it's really hard.

Yes, but part of me hopes that their children do that to them and, and that they, they die miserable for what they did to their parents. These, these, these parents did nothing wrong. Nothing. They only loved their child, and they get kicked in the teeth by the scum leftist that their child is. Not every child who's a leftist is scummy, but every leftist who does this is, and vast numbers of them do. And I'll tell you another thing what drives me crazy is, so I talked to them, so who is this, your son or daughter? It's my son. It's you, it's— I don't know if it's— I think it's more often the daughter, but it's often sons. But here's the kicker that I'm pointing to is, so What's with the daughter-in-law? Doesn't she want to unite her husband with her parents? No, no, no, no, no, she's more left than he is. This is the common reaction. There was a time when you assumed that one of the roles of your son-in-law, daughter-in-law was to help their, their spouse reconnect with their parents. That's a beautiful role that a spouse should, should play. And they do the opposite.

We don't think—

don't talk to that Trump supporter.

We don't think in terms of roles or obligations.

Oh, obligations is a conservative word.

It is. So what you just said fascinated me because it's something that I grapple with too. Do you believe in karma? I know that you may wish karma upon those.

I don't, but I do. Karma in this life or afterlife?

Oh, I believe in an afterlife, but I do.

No, no, no, no. Karma is, is resurrection. In other words, it's a cycle. You, you come back. Reincarnation. Karma is reincarnation.

I thought they were separate. I mean, obviously I would defer to you, but—

No, no, no. So the afterlife is not— is—

Well, karma informs your reincarnation, but, but karma and reincarnation are separate.

Nothing—

I mean karma in, in the sense of—

Karma is you get what you deserve.

Yes, I, I mean that in this lifetime.

Yeah, but in this lifetime— oh, you don't?

Okay, fine.

But all right, so in, in this lifetime, there are people who have a karma-like consequence. What goes around comes around. Yes, that's true. But most people who've done really— if so, I haven't— I have an interesting thought for you on this. In this life evil is rarely punished. Foolishness is punished.

God, that is true. See, that's the Dennis Prager truth bomb.

It's a truth bomb.

So elaborate. So can you give some examples?

People, people very rarely, unless you're caught by the police and jailed and punished, most bad things— these people who won't let their parents see their grandchildren because they voted for Trump are probably not going to get punished in this lifetime. It's too evil to get punished unless the child does it to them too, which, uh, which I think— I hope they do. But, uh, but foolish decisions, they are punished in this life.

That is a really, really good point.

Yeah, well, that's one of those points I came up with a lot of points earlier in life, but this one is purely the function of, of of having lived longer.

Really?

Yeah, 'cause I realized, oh my God, that's what gets punished, foolishness.

My dad has this excellent saying. He's been telling it to me since I was 5 years old. People get themselves.

Yeah, that's right.

I do, I agree with you that, I mean, there isn't nearly enough justice in this world or—

Oh, it's very depressing.

It is very depressing, but I do think that there is more justice than we think there is. But you have to look for it in unconventional ways. If I think about someone who's probably a leftist, a very mean person, and they get a good job or they have a great boyfriend or girlfriend or their life seems to be good, sometimes you wonder, well, why? Why does it seem like this person is getting rewarded? but I believe, for instance, using the mean person as an example, that person will just have a wretched life living in their own body. Because when you're a mean person, I don't think it's possible for you to be truly happy.

Oh, I agree with that.

And so his, his or her punishment—

That's why getting happier is one of the roots to being a better human being. That's why I consider it a moral obligation. We owe it to the world because we can inflict our bad moods on people, but we also owe it to the world because happier people are better people, right? Every happiness hour I open up, the happy make the world better, the unhappy make it worse. Yes, it's just a fact. Happiness is a moral issue.

You just have to look for that karma in different ways, where sometimes you want it to be as overt as, you know, someone loses their job or their children will do to you. But using the example of the, the parents who won't let the kids see the grandparents, maybe It won't be as overt as their kids one day not speaking to them, but maybe the guilt that they will live with when they are older will be unbearable.

I wonder. Unfortunately, this is a very important statement, if I'm allowed to say that. It's not important because I'm saying it. It's important and therefore I'm saying it. Big difference. The conscience is not that powerful because bad people sleep well.

I feel like it's a useless statement, but that is so difficult for me to understand.

Because your conscience is powerful.

Yes.

Because you're bothered.

I'm bothered by it.

If you hung up prematurely I did hang up prematurely.

We were on the phone last night, dear viewers, and we were saying goodbye, and I, I hung up a few seconds early.

By the way, I totally identify with you, but I didn't want you to think I was rushing off like, oh, I'm done with this guy, adiós. It's not a worry. I got a, I got a big kick out of that, that it showed what you're like and how developed your conscience is. I do think of that all the time about what is the order of the hang up.

I know it's, it's a little awkward.

Well, and everybody has to hang up first, right? You can't go 1, 2, 3, and then you both hang up. But I wasn't even aware of it, but I'm just pointing it out. You have an extremely developed conscience, so you can't imagine what having a conscience that is useless is like. Most people, their conscience is useless. I'm sorry. And I'm not saying that to be self-congratulatory, and I'm not doing it to congratulate you. I'm just making a comment. It's so— I just, I just want people to understand when people say, oh, I don't need God, I answer to my conscience. I know I need a vomit bag. What are you? What are you, an idiot?

Who?

What bad person doesn't answer to his conscience?

By the way, this is a little bit off topic, but welcome to Dennis and Julie. We're always going off of exit ramps and it's great. I want to talk on my show sometime soon about my religious journey, thanks to The Rational Bible, and why I think that people my age should take this seriously. And this thought just hit me like a lightning bolt, and I want to share it with you and get your reaction, that as much as people say nowadays that they're secular or atheist or don't believe in God, Almost every single person, when they're in moments where they feel like they may die or when they're in danger, you know, let's say you're driving—

there were no atheists in foxholes. Did you ever hear that phrase?

No, I haven't. That's the phrase that when you are in your most vulnerable, terrified moment, every single person starts praying, even the avowed secular atheist will start praying. If that isn't proof that we all to an extent do believe in God and certainly need God, then I don't know what is.

Well, I actually have an ambivalent reaction to that because I don't see God as a celestial butler.

I love it. I love that line. It's one of my favorites.

Oh, really?

I think about it all. I think about it honestly, like when I'm praying and I'm asking for things, right?

Well, I almost never ask for things.

I say, I'm so sorry, God, I hope I'm not treating you as a celestial butler.

Well, that's beautiful.

I say that. Sorry, go on.

It's, uh, I've asked God twice for things.

Twice?

Yeah, in my life.

Do you literally— are you like saying it as a joke, or do you—

No, no, I know, I know, and I know the two times. Yes.

Are you willing to share the two times?

Yeah, I guess so. So one is silly. And one is very serious. So I'll tell you as soon as you tell everybody about Lear Capital.

You're not the only one who's lost money this year. With the current economic volatility, we've all got to find a way to protect our finances in retirement. Did you know that you can add physical gold and silver into your IRA or 401(k)? You should consider adding Lear Capital to your retirement as we are all looking for stable investments. If you want to learn more, call Lear Capital today and ask about the Lear Advantage IRA. You can transfer or roll over your old 401k or IRA into a gold tax-free and penalty-free account. And to sweeten the deal, Lear is offering free shipping on every purchase and up to $15,000 in bonus silver to every qualified client. Call for details at 1-800-260-5075. You can get a free precious metals investor guide and work with the top-rated precious metals company on Consumer Affairs with a near-perfect rating on Trustpilot. Lear Capital is the gold standard in precious metals investing and has over $3 billion in trusted transactions with over 650,000 happy customers in the 25 years they've been in business. So again, call 1-800-260-5075 to get your free kit. See how gold has performed during periods of inflation, government debt, interest rate hikes, economic crashes, and even wars. And you will see that gold has often been that financial bedrock asset in portfolios. And what I really love most about Lear Capital is that it is an American-owned company proud to do business with those who share our conservative values. So write this number down and give them a call today. 1-800-260-5075. That's 1-800-260-5075. 1-800-260-5075. And if you don't wanna call, you can go online to Lear Capital. That's spelled L-E-A-R, learcapital.com.

All right. So the first time, mm-hmm, I was about 9 or even 8 years old. And we went to synagogue every week, and the rabbi in one of his sermons said, if you ever really, really want something from God, say, 'Anah Hashem, Hoshiana.' And it's from the Psalms. So, 'Oh God, please, please help me.' All right, you know, I'm giving a just a generic translation. So I thought, wow, that's cool. Shortly thereafter, my parents were out of the house and I was probably throwing a ball, I don't know what, in the house. I broke their most expensive item in the house. Oh no, a specially made big vase from Italy.

Oh no, Dennis. Yes, I've been there. So worst feeling in the world.

I actually went— is two-story house— I went upstairs, hid in the bathroom, locked the door, and kept saying, 'Anah Hashem.' Oh, that's so cute.

Wait, how old were you again?

About 8 years old. Oh, and my parents came home and they saw the broken vase and just asked how it happened. Oh my God, nothing happened. So I thought, there you go, whoa, I should do that again. But I didn't do it again.

That's very interesting to me.

Very. Well, I, um, I'm— I don't know, I was going to use the word trapped, but I love it, so I can't say trapped. But I am trapped by reason. That's why my Bible thing is called The Rational Bible. That's why it's meant so much to you, because I only use reason. Fast forward about 50 years, more than 50 years. From the age of 8. And I, on, on Rosh Hashanah and Yom Kippur, there were only 2 times a year, generally speaking, where a Jew bows down all the way to the ground.

Yes, when I went to—

so you saw my service? Yes. And I make a big deal. I'd say, I know you've never done this because these are not Orthodox Jews generally. And I make the case on how powerful that is to do. And it's very powerful to me to bow down to God that deeply twice a year, Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur, the high holy days of the Jewish calendar. So I— there was a personal family issue, and I just said, God, I, I really don't know what else to do, so I need your help. And by golly, like with the vase, it completely— it— well, I don't know if it helped. I can't say God did it. I can't say God did it with the vase, right? I'm only telling you the two times in my life I asked God for something, the something materialized. I don't know if God did it, and I— and how could I know? You know, he didn't tell me. But I just— for the record, I don't like asking God for things. I, I am infinitely more interested in what God wants from me than what I want— that— than what I want from God.

So if you don't mind me asking, when you pray, what are you saying?

Are you asking? Okay, you're at— you're asking the bad guy because I don't get into prayer much, and Jewish prayer is very different from Christian prayer because it's all set out. I mean, there are set prayers in Christianity, of course, but certainly among Protestants, there's a lot of prayer that's just spontaneous. And by the way, I find it very moving. I'm with Christians a great deal, as you know, and I actually have been asked often to, to lead a prayer before a meal, for example, and I love doing it for Christians or with Christians. Jewish prayer is all set down. It's all, it's all already in the prayer book, and it's all in the plural.

God, can I just tell you my quick reaction? That seems so much easier. Sometimes I, I feel wracked with guilt because when I do spontaneous prayer, I don't think I'm saying the right thing, or I'm not being grateful enough, or I feel like I'm doing it wrong. So it must be so nice to just have it.

I'm sure for most religious Jews it is. My vehicle to God is studying Torah. That's why I'm writing my Torah commentary. I am much more interested in what God has to say to me than what I have to say to God. That's one of my ways of putting it. I'm idiosyncratic in that way. Most religious Jews— not all, but most religious Jews— are perfectly comfortable with the prayer book and its prayers. And they're very beautiful, by the way. They truly are beautiful. But as I tell people, Macbeth is a great play, but if I read it every day, I don't know how how long it would take for me to get a little bored with it. So, and anyway, so I, I don't tend to ask God for much. Also, I have this feeling— this, this, this is— I'm really opening up here, but this is, this is what's in me. Vast numbers of people at least as worthy as I of having their prayers answered prayed and didn't have their prayers answered. I mean, I think immediately, just as in a Jewish context, the 6 million Jews, most of them prayed and got gassed and worse, tortured, watched their children suffer, their parents suffer. So I I just, I'm not into petitionary prayer much, and, and it, I don't advocate it to others. I'm just saying that you asked me, so I'm, you know, and I think, why should he answer me and not, not Joe Blow over there, you know? So anyway, it's, it's not my, it's It's not my vehicle to God. I want to move topics to something else in, in light of the holiday season. It's, it's lighter. We've really hit some heavy-duty stuff here. So I did on my radio show my annual 'There is nothing wrong if you have Christmas to have Santa claws in your Christmas.

The fact that you even have to do an hour on that.

Bless you. I mean, isn't it amazing?

I don't— I don't understand that at all. Have you always had to do an hour in your 40 years?

Yes.

That's fascinating.

Yes. It's not new where people would say, oh, you can't lie to your children. And it's such an overstatement of what you're doing with your kid. If you take them to Disneyland, you say, well, that character's not real. That character is not real. If the tooth fairy leaves them a dollar for their tooth. Oh, there's really no tooth fairy. We're not going to leave you any money for your tooth. I, I, I— so I made up a phrase today spontaneously you'll love about the people. I've had calls like this. I'm sorry, Dennis, I don't agree with you, which I love that people feel free to say they don't agree with me. And so they would say something like, oh well, I grew up, my parents told me there was a Santa Claus. Then I got older, I realized there's no Santa Claus, and I figured, oh, If there's no Santa Claus, there's also no God. What? I know, I know. Okay, please. So, so sorry that I feel like, you know, it was sort of traumatic when I realized my parents had lied to me all these years. So I coined the phrase today: PTSD, post-traumatic Santa disorder.

Oh my God. If that person says that their biggest trauma in life is finding out that Santa—

well, they wouldn't claim it's their biggest, but if they would even use the term Yes, exactly.

So I think I've mentioned it before on this program. I'm sure I have. But this summer I read Orthodoxy by G.K. Chesterton. And in one of the chapters of the book— by the way, I know I publicize my email address at the end of every show, but I want to publicize it right now specifically for the G.K. Chesterton fans, because I want you all to email me at julie@julie-harmon.com so I can talk to people about Orthodoxy, because you haven't read Orthodoxy. Anyway, there's one chapter that's called The Ethics of Elfland, and Chesterton talks about how important fairy tales are for people to have a sense of awe and imagination about the world. And that made me think about when I was little. I mean, the most extraordinary feeling I've ever had in my life to this day was growing up and thinking about Santa Claus. I mean, the thrill on Christmas morning of thinking that Santa came down your chimney and ate cookies and gave you these presents, I mean, it's just, it fills you with a sense of joyfulness that is just indescribable. And I feel so grateful that I had that as a kid. And I've been reflecting on why it is so important, and I think it's because believing in Santa Claus or believing in the Easter Bunny or the Tooth Fairy, it teaches you at a young age how to have hope and optimism about things. And those are difficult emotions to teach someone that young. You can teach a 5-year-old how to have manners. You can teach a 5-year-old how to read. There are certain things that you can teach, but it's a lot harder to go, hey, have hope. Have optimism. And that's why the role of a Santa Claus, I think, is so important, because it's a way for you to learn those deep emotions without having them shoved down your throat. MyPillow is excited to bring you their biggest bedding sale ever, and just in time for Christmas. For a limited time, get the Giza Dream bed sheets for as low as $29.98, a set of pillowcases for only $9.98, and rejuvenate your bed with a MyPillow mattress topper for as low as $99.99. They also have blankets in a of sizes, colors, and styles. They even have blankets for your pets. Get duvets, quilts, down comforters, body pillows, bolster pillows, and so much more, all with the biggest discounts of the year happening now. They are also extending their money-back guarantee for Christmas until March 1st, 2023, making them the perfect gifts for your friends, your family, and everyone you know. So go to mypillow.com and use the promo code Hartman, or call 1-800-566-6745, and you'll get huge discounts on on all MyPillow bedding products, including the Giza Dream bedsheets, for as low as $29.98. And get all your shopping done now while quantities last.

All right. Look, I didn't have it because I was in a Jewish home, so I didn't. But I loved it. I thought it was great that there was a Santa.

You did believe that there was a Santa?

No, no.

But did you believe in the Tooth Fairy?

I don't. I don't think my parents did the Tooth Fairy thing.

So did you have any— Look, did you have any fun?

No, I'm kidding.

Did you know any of these characters who you believe?

Well, you're— I have a very idiosyncratic upbringing because my parents didn't read fairy tales to me. I'll answer you about me in a moment, but I just want to tell you, you gave me another answer for these people. So I should ask them, do you read any fairy tales to your kid? Most parents do. So let's say Pinocchio. Do you tell your kid immediately, right, you know, there really was no Pinocchio? Aren't you fool— why aren't you lying to them, reading to them about a character who never existed?

So why do you think there's a double standard?

Double standard? Oh, why is there? Because it's It's— it contacts religion and people are super sensitive. But I just want to say, so when you asked me, did I have any of these figures in my life? It's an interesting question. And the closest that I think of would be unknown to, to you or to any non-Jew listening. Not even all Jews know, know this, but a traditional Passover seder You fill a big cup in the middle of the table with wine. It's called Kos Eliyahu, the cup of Elijah. And in Jewish tradition, Elijah will announce the coming of the Messiah. He, the prophet Elijah, will come back and announce the coming of the Messiah. So you traditionally, you hope to see Elijah who will bring the good news, with the term very familiar to Christians. Of the, of the coming of the Messiah. So we would open the door after the meal, the big meal. We would open the door for Elijah, who was all of my life invisible, clearly. And my parents would then say, hey, look, some of the wine was drunk, like the light went down a little bit. But were they lying to me? Isn't that an absurdity? Wasn't it like a joyful part of the Seder? What do you lose having Santa? I don't understand what the downside is.

And also, I mean, there is no time where Santa has been more important than now, especially because kids in schools, they're being taught these very negative, corrosive things about climate change and, you know, everything is so negative. I mean, even at a different point in our history, Santa's always necessary.

He's holly jolly.

Yes.

We need a holly jolly guy to visit.

That is important because there are so few characters nowadays, and this is what I love about you. You've really done this for me. You're always so happy and optimistic. And that is a very powerful thing, 'cause there are a few people in my life who are as consistently happy and optimistic. It makes a really big impression on people. It elevates them. And to have Santa who is always that, that can be a necessary example of optimism for people who need it.

Yeah, boy, he's more necessary than ever.

He is.

I mean, the whole thing, have a holly jolly Christmas, the whole ethos of the time. And I love it. So here's an interesting, uh, question I want to know. You were not raised religious?

No.

Your parents came from Catholic backgrounds?

My mom did. My dad came from a Lutheran background.

Okay. All right. Wow, that's a funny combination. Yeah, Luther didn't like the Catholic Church, but okay. Uh, so did you have a Christmas tree?

Yes. Oh yes.

Did you have gifts that you opened in the morning?

Yes, that stopped when I was 8 or 9 when both of my sisters moved away, but for the first few years of my life, yes, we did.

Did you like it?

I loved it. I told you, it was the most joyous experience.

Did you wake up early to open them up?

I wouldn't sleep the whole night. I would run to the front of the house and look out the window and see if the sleigh landed on my roof. And my mom, my mom is the best. She would buy these cookies and she would nibble at them and like eat half of them, As if Santa was there. And then she'd spill a little milk. I know.

Cookie in every home.

And she would write a note with her left hand saying, hi, Julie, it's Santa.

Why? So that it wasn't clear? The writing wasn't clear?

Yeah.

Oh, it wasn't? Or it wasn't her writing?

To make it clear it wasn't her writing.

Because I knew her handwriting. I couldn't write a damn thing with my left hand. She's hilarious.

She did everything to make it special. My dad too. They would leave a Santa hat, like, on in the, you know, did you ever go to church on Christmas? Sometimes, yes. But we, we kind of stopped doing that.

In retrospect, do you wish you had a more religious home?

No, because I'm so happy— I think I said this last time— I'm so happy that I found it on my own and I found your work first. I wouldn't go back and change the way that I was raised. I think it worked out the way it was supposed to for me. Now, will I raise my kids religiously? Yes.

But you're not sure which religion yet.

Yeah, I'm not sure.

Right. Which is fine.

You know, my kid will be an ethical monotheist. I'll tell you that. At the very least.

I do know that. And please say kids.

Yes, I should say kids. I want— I can imagine a small baby.

It's a service to humanity for you. Yes. Well, if you speak to only children, they don't speak of great loneliness.

I sort of feel like an only child because both of my sisters moved away when I was so young.

Well, what is your— what is the age difference with your next sister?

8 years.

Right, so mine is 6. I understand that. Yeah, by the time I was in high school, I was the only kid.

You know, I got to tell you, and I know we probably have to end soon, but On this subject that we brought up earlier of children not speaking to their parents, I have really worried about when I have kids, because I know I'm going to give my best effort to raise them well, but it really is sometimes a roll of the dice.

Oh, having children is a crapshoot.

I could have, I hope I have kids who honor and appreciate me, but maybe not.

Right before our broadcast, I left the room for a few minutes, right? So in the hallway, one of the wonderful people who work at this station, one of the heads of sales, you know, said, hey, Dennis, happy Hanukkah. And I wish them a Merry Christmas. And, you know, they're wonderful, just good people. And he said, I read your column about parents whose kids won't let them meet the grandkids because of their politics. I have one of my kids is like that.

Yeah.

And, and it was— it reinforced in me too. Thank God he has 3 kids. 2 of the kids are decent. And people say to me often when they—

after—

if they meet— you've met my— you've met both of my boys?

Yes, I have.

Yeah, yeah, I have. They're good boys.

They are.

And so they'll say, oh, you know, you, you must have done a good job. And I, I say with all honesty, I hope I did a good job, but it's still a crapshoot.

Well, as you say in the Torah commentary, which I bring up so often because I adore it, even the most righteous man in the world, Noah, had a bad son. Yes, that is such an important story.

That's right. Well, and then the patriarchs, you know, it says Jacob, who was the one who was renamed Israel, he was a crappy father. He, he favored, uh, Joseph and then favored Benjamin, and it says so in the text. If you— if it's, if it's obvious you favor a child, that is a terrible thing for the other children. Terrible thing. It's part of the reason Joseph's brothers hated Joseph, because Israel or Jacob favored him. But it's just— people just need to understand it's a crapshoot what parents you get. It's a crapshoot what children you get. And you— I'll never forget, to my father's great credit, this really made an impact on me. My father was at one of my speeches, and I always introduced my parents if they were in the audience. So people were milling around my parents, and my father did not see me, but I overheard the following: "Oh, Mr. Prager, your son is really remarkable. You must have done some job as a parent." And my father looked at the guy in dead seriousness and said, sir, I'm lucky. And I was very touched because my father was not known for his modesty. But I feel that about my sons. I hope I did a good job as a parent, but I'm damn lucky. And by the way, that's why This is a good thing to leave on because it's, um, it's so helpful to parents. If your kids are great, don't take all the credit. And if your kids are not great, don't take all the blame.

I'll remember that when I'm a parent.

Yeah, well, I hope to hug your kids.

You will. I've gotta— I gotta have them soon though.

That's beautiful. Are you expecting me to die that quickly?

No, no, I just, you know, I think when anyone is over the age of 60, like, you have to be aware that things could change.

Oh no, of course, I— it's exactly right, and I'm lucky in that way too.

And I think of my parents too, not just you, you know. I think I gotta make sure—

well, that's true. Well, there are a whole host of reasons you should have kids sooner than later, but, uh Anyway, this was, uh, this was valuable. I, I, I think your case for Santa— I wish I had you on the show then on what role he played.

Still astounded that you even had to do—

oh, you have no idea how many call up.

Uh, yeah, well, be that as it may, email me at julie@julie-hartman.com if you want to talk about Santa or G.K. Chesterton, especially G.K. Chesterton. Or anything you want. I love hearing from our listeners. They're just the best.

No, and you share a lot of them with me. I love them.

Yes, even when they call my show priceless. It is priceless.

Correct.

As is this. See you next time, everyone.