Timeless Wisdom: Ultimate Issues - The Case For Marriage

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And welcome to the Ultimate Issues Hour on the Dennis Prager Show. This hour each week devoted to some great issue of life. And I figure since it is June, it is the right time to talk about what happens a lot in June, and that is people getting married. I want to make the case for marriage. You can't get much more of an ultimate issue than marriage, the basic building block of society, or at least of higher civilization as we have known it. It is under tremendous assault in the Western world, tremendous assault. The belief that one doesn't have to get married, there is no reason to, is widespread. The recent candidate for president of France, the woman who was the candidate for the presidency, the socialist candidate, she was not married to the man who she lived with and who was the father of her children. This is incredible to us in America at any rate. It's just, it made no difference. Married, not married, has kids with him, not married, doesn't matter. That's one of the areas of the assault. There are so many areas. Men who say, you know, why should I bother? I will get clobbered if there is a divorce. I may even lose my children. All of which, by the way, has some merit to it. The divorce laws are a bit perverse. I acknowledge that fact, but nevertheless, there are arguments that are made against marriage, and therefore arguments need to be made for it. Everything that we have assumed was central and unquestionable has not only become questioned, but has become overthrown. Almost every major idea from patriotism which is now regarded by much of the elite as a form of chauvinism, if not incipient fascism, to marriage, to even having children. Why bother with children? It's a polluted world, and then zero population growth is the ideal. And why bother with marriage? It's a patriarchal institution. And of course, God and religion, they just poison everything, to use the terminology of my guest of last last week, Christopher Hitchens, whom I debated about God, and you will find that debate at prageradio.com. Everything has not only been questioned, but in the Western world, in many instances, simply overthrown inside of one or two generations. The argument for marriage. There are so many arguments. There are both micro and macro. In other words, there are personal arguments why it benefits the individuals And there are arguments from a societal standpoint why it benefits society. And it is amazing to me that people don't care about those second arguments. We— remember, I believe, contrary to the general assessment of the '60s, which was of a very idealistic period of time, I regard the '60s as the age of narcissism. And so when you make an argument, when one makes an argument, well, marriage is good for society, you go against the narcissism of that period with How— what's in it for me, man? What's in it for me? And I don't see anything in it for me, so I won't do it. But there is a lot in it for society as well as for you. So that's the subject of today's Ultimate Issues Hour, and I particularly dedicate this, though not exclusively at all, but to men, because a lot of men have great qualms, although right now I must say that it is a lot of women as well. I believe that feminism, which has copied a lot of male attitudes, has taught women to in fact be quite like men and to have attitudes like men and to believe that they will gain at least as much satisfaction from macro success from a professional life as from a good personal life. You ask girls today, ask a girl in college, if you have a daughter, niece, granddaughter, at college, ask her, if you could have a spectacular marriage or a spectacular career, which would you prefer? And a generation ago, certainly prior to feminism, the question would have been regarded by the vast majority of young women as absurd. The dream was to have a wonderful man and make a good home. That was the dream. That's been the dream of women throughout history. Not all women, of course, not all women. There's no such thing as all. Generalizations by definition mean you are— mean that you are generalizing, meaning therefore of course there are exceptions. And that was a good dream for, for the female to have, finding a good man and making a home with him. It was a very good thing that at least one of the sexes had that as their, as their primary dream. And that was knocked out. Oh, you're crazy for thinking that way. No, there's much more satisfaction in being an astronaut. And I put— I choose that because it's the— it was the most glamorous profession. And then we saw that about an astronaut for whom being an astronaut, a female astronaut, for whom being a female astronaut or being an astronaut was not exactly satisfying compared to the ache for love. It gives you an idea of how powerful the mind is that it could thwart the staggeringly powerful urge in, in a woman. It's also in men, but let's talk about women for a moment. The staggeringly powerful innate brain-based urge for love. It gives you an idea of how powerful the mind is when it is incessantly bombarded with another message. It can thwart even what the primal brain wants. And so girls were taught that their primal instinct to want love more than anything else, to love and be loved, was just nonsense. What they really wanted was professional success. And if a guy came along, that's what I hear constantly from young women. Well, yeah, if the right guy comes along, but I'm preoccupied with my career. And it sounds reasonable. She's not saying she doesn't want to have the right guy, but there was very little sense of that being very important. Ironically and sadly, it does become very important to women as they reach their 40th birthday in most cases at any rate. And they have had professional success, and by golly, it doesn't really give them one-fifth of the satisfaction that feminism promised them. They were promised happiness through professional success, but somehow you can't hug a pay raise. And it's nice to have a pay raise, don't get me wrong. I've never poo-pooed the importance of financial stability. I'm not an idiot. But, and I'm not counterposing it because the truth is people who are married actually do better. So I'm obviously not anti having financial stability since marriage is better for financial stability than being alone. That's for both sexes, but especially for women. But you can't hug professional success when you get home. That's just the way it is. And you don't, you haven't built anything. And it's nice to have professional success, but what has been done to women to convince them that that is where their happiness lies, it's amazing the power of the mind to subvert the power of nature. Now sometimes it's good because happiness does come from the mind fighting the brain, but sometimes you outsmart yourself, which is what I think has happened with the feminist ideal here. As for men, well, men have an innate problem with marriage, and that is men are in fact variety-oriented in their sexual nature. And the idea that they will never be able to have another woman other than the woman that they are married to scares the living daylights out of most men. This is it. This is it. And people have to appreciate that. You can't make the world better. You can't do the right thing if you don't acknowledge what your raw materials are. And the raw material of male nature is not marriage-oriented. It is variety-oriented. So if you now have women saying that marriage is not important, well then, by golly, the guys are certainly not going to be the great force for marriage. Hey, cool! You mean you women also want variety? Oh man, this is heaven! You don't have to die and go to heaven. This is heaven. This is male nature speaking. So there's a lot working against marriage. So why get married? That's the subject of this Ultimate Issues Hour, and I will take your calls. 1-800-PRAGER-776. 1-800-PRAGER-776. And digitally, that's 877-243-7776. The Ultimate Issues Hour on The Dennis Prager Show.

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Now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom.

This is the Ultimate Issues Hour on the Dennis Prager Show, the hour each week devoted— or at least this is absolutely devoted. I have some ultimate issues on other hours, but this one is devoted to some great issue. And this one, given that we're in June and there are so many weddings, I want to answer the question: why get married? Because as I summarized earlier, there is such a huge and organized either apathy or opposition— the apathy is even worse— to marriage. Why bother? You don't need to. You stay together. If one day you both decide not to, then you don't have messy divorce proceedings. Who needs it? It's just a piece of paper. I always get a kick out of the, it's only a piece of paper. Whenever a guy says that, it's usually the guy says that to a woman he's been with for 6 years. Well, honey, I love you, and it's just a piece of paper. I have a good answer for you women. Well, honey, if it's only a piece of paper, why do you oppose it? And I'd like some guy to answer that one. If it's only— it can't be only a piece of paper. You wouldn't be so opposed to it if it's just a piece of paper. And then people argue, well, you know, there's a whatever percentage chance that you'll get divorced. Yes, that's right. There is. There's a percentage chance that you'll have a crash in an auto. It doesn't argue against driving. I know about divorce, and it's a very, very painful thing, and life has pain, but it is still better to marry. So, you know, people say, well, look, this guy makes the case for marriage and he's divorced. So what? On the contrary, I have more credibility because I so believe in it, even though I've gone through it and it is painful. Of course, of course it's a better thing. Of course. First of all, you grow up. Now I know growing up is not a big value for a lot of people. It isn't. It just isn't. In fact, staying a child is a big value. Not only is growing up not a big one, not growing up is often a big one. I want to stay a kid. I want to dress like a kid. I want to talk like a kid. I want to look like a kid. So it's not a very powerful argument except if you do want to grow up. And that to me is a very powerful argument for marriage. Now, does that mean that every human being who has remained single has not grown up? No, it doesn't. Does that mean that every human being who has married has grown up? Well, every human— I'll ask you this on the second part. Any one of you who has married, you tell me if you are not wiser and more mature, at least those two, uh, since you got married. I've never met anybody I don't know anybody who has denied that they were more aware of life, that they were more mature, that they were more a lot of things as a result of getting married, even if the marriage was not a good one. Now, if your task in life is not to fully grow up, and I'm talking emotionally, psychologically, obviously there are very good people who have remained single. You could still be kind to the world and a wonderful uncle and a wonderful aunt. I recognize that fact. And do a lot of good for the world, but the fact is that with regard to yourself and your emotional development, what is available in marriage is not available not getting married. It's just not available. So that's, that's a big one. People always speak about companionship, and I will talk about that, but frankly, growing up is a big one, at least to me. Secondly, it is, there is, and this I made the point when my two older kids got married last year, and I, and I did a number of shows on this, you immediately have a different relationship with your child's spouse than your child's live-in. Of course you do. It changes from my son's girlfriend or significant other or partner or whatever term you wish to use to my daughter-in-law or my son-in-law in the case of the man who married my daughter. He is my son-in-law. His family is now part of my family. They are not merely my daughter's boyfriend's family. These are huge differences. Huge. Now, the stakes are greater and the chance for pain is also greater. That's right. So you have a choice in life. Do you wish to avoid pain or you want to live life fully? Those are your choices. If you want to live life fully, then you take risks for pain. That is the way it works. That's the way in which the world has been made. 1-800-PRAGER-776. You are listening to the Dennis Prager Show, the Ultimate Issues Hour. And let's go to Susie in Los Angeles. Susie, Dennis Prager, thank you for calling. Hello, Susie.

Hi.

Hi. How old are you, Susie?

30.

30. Thank you for calling. Go ahead.

Well, here in LA, marriage is under attack because when you get married and you're happy, then after a year or two, the husband is noticing about Hugh Hefner, and then his friends tell him, oh, everybody wants to be like Hugh Hefner and have a lot of women, and oh, he's so happy. But is he really happy? And then you get cable and you get the package and then you discover Playboy Channel is on that and your husband is glued to watching those nude women in sex acts with women and in disgusting scenes. So marriage is really under attack.

Well, there are two separate issues here. The envy of the Hugh Hefner and the guy glued to the Playboy Channel. Are you speaking about from your own experience?

Lots of women here in LA have that problem of my girlfriends, uh, of, of their husband in effect wanting to live a Hefner-like existence. Yes.

Yeah. Well, this is why I, I, I— oh, thank you for calling. I need to comment on that. This is why I have said to you, as important as I consider so much of what I've done on, on, on tape— I have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of lectures on tape. My, my 4 tapes on male sexual Nature may be the most important thing I ever did to help men understand themselves and women to understand their men. Because there's so much denial about male sexual nature on the part of both sexes, and it has to be maturely acknowledged, and then we have to bring in what works and value systems. And I beg you, I do this about nothing else I've ever done, I beg you to get them. Go to DennisPrager.com and, uh, or call 800-225-8584. 800-225-8584. My 4 tapes on this, and our CDs or downloads, however it's gotten. I feel bad because it sounds like an ad. Okay, I got that out. Uh, the, the, this, yes, Hugh Hefner is what male nature would live like if it had nothing to stop it. Not society, not values, etc. That is correct. Hugh Hefner is profoundly empty. Empty. Is he happy? In some ways, undoubtedly. I'll continue with that in a moment on The Dennis Prager Show.

This episode of Timeless Wisdom system. We'll continue right after this.

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Now back to more of Dennis Prager's timeless wisdom.

You're listening to The Dennis Prager Show, the Ultimate Issues Hour. This one is The Case for a Marriage, and it's June, and I figured this is a perfect time to do so. A lot of marriages taking place and a lot of marriages not taking place if we follow the data, especially in the Western world. And the last woman, a 30-year-old woman from Los Angeles, called in and then about how she says so many of her, uh, male acquaintances, uh, want to live a Hugh Hefner life, especially she feels in Los Angeles. And indeed, that is— it is absolutely worth, uh, dealing with. I don't have the time now because of the larger subject of marriage, but I— but, uh, That issue has to be dealt with. I said that at the very beginning. Women have their own reasons now, given to them by feminism, and now internalized about, oh well, it's not that important. I need to be professionally successful. If I find a guy that's nice, but it's not critical, and so on. And men have their own nature to fight, because male nature is variety-oriented. So men, you have a real choice. Do you want to be led around by your, by your testes or by your mind? That is, that is very simple, guys. That's your choice. If you, if you wish to live a life and at the end of your life be able to say that you slept with, uh, with 800 women and this will be meaningful to you, then do it. That's all. But please understand You will not look back at your life and say, wow, this was terrific, compared to a man who can look back at his life and have made a home and a life with a woman and hopefully with children and with a community of people and with friends as well. Now, yes, there's plenty of divorce. I know that. Obviously, I'm one of them. And it's tragic, and it's absolutely tragic when it happens. So therefore what? What is the choice? To live that Hefnerian life? It is utterly, utterly shallow. A Viagra-based life. Wow. Now I am happy. Look, it's possible to be happy on some level if happiness is available with such shallowness. That you have never in effect left high school or college, then fine. And you should be avoided by women. And if women wish to give themselves to you, then fine. Then they deserve the life that they have chosen. But I believe in any definition of happiness that is beyond having an orgasm, you have a far deeper happiness available to you through commitment to somebody, to building something. I've always thought ever since I'm a kid, but I acknowledge I was born mature. I mean, you know, there are kids like that. I take no credit for it. I just was born thinking about these things. And I remember as a kid thinking, what will I want to say about my life before, as I'm ready to die? What will I want to say about it? And I certainly had my time of what they say, sowing wild oats. And I realized after a certain number of years, this is— this could go on forever. And what do I have to show for it? What exactly? 1-800-PRAGER-776 is the number. 1-800-PRAGER-776. And Houston, Texas. Ryan. Hello, Ryan. Dennis Prager.

Hey, how's it going?

Okay, thank you.

Yeah, I just wanted to—

and how old are you? In this case, ages are significant to me. How old are you?

I'm 25 years old.

Okay, go ahead.

Um, and I've been married for 2 years. I got married a year and a half after I graduated from college. And right, uh, I, uh, actually it was interesting, interesting experience for me because I, uh, I did a few research fellowships in college, so I had a pretty close relationship with a handful of professors and went back and met with them because I wanted to talk to them about what, you know, what was going on in my life and everything. And I was telling them I was going to get married, and these professors were just adamant, adamant that I was making a huge mistake.

Now wait, wait, now wait, a huge mistake because of your age or because of getting married?

Because of getting married. Um, the specific— one professor in particular was just in general was like, you know, thought that marriage was all of those things that you've already said, a patriarchal institution, etc., etc. Very academic.

And were these male and female, male and female professors?

Uh, both female professors actually.

Yeah, well, that's— look, the university, which is, which is the, the most confused place in America as an institution, uh, that's where you would have— it's the only place where you would have women systematically arguing against marriage. And I'm sure they're just unbelievably happy women, those two women. I'm certain of it. We'll be back in a moment. You're listening to the Dennis Prager Show, the Ultimate Issues Hour. Hi everybody, Ultimate Issues Hour, the third hour of my Tuesday show. And it's June, and I figured the ultimate issue is the case for marriage. You want to grow? There is nothing, there is no profession that will enable you to grow the way marriage does. And then again, parenthood, by the way. And really, folks, you have a choice to make. And I'm speaking especially to those of you on the younger side who debate this whole issue and who have put, in effect, all of your future eggs in the profession basket. Do you want to live life safe, or do you want to live life deeply? That is one of the questions you will have to answer. I know that I have always wanted to have all of life with its pain, with its joy. This has always been important to me. But if you want safety, if you want, if you want to guarantee less hurt, then I guess don't get married. That's a guarantee. And then you can die saying Well, I experience less pain than others. Wow, that's really something. Now, but if you want to grow, if you want the intensity of life's experience, if you want to march through life with somebody at your side— doesn't mean it's guaranteed, of course not. Obviously, given the divorce rates, and there are a lot of people who are not divorced who are certainly unhappy in their marriages, that's a given. That's true. So? So what? Therefore what? And to you guys who want to live the Hafnerian existence, uh, you, you speak to the guys. You speak to the guys who do and tell me that they, uh, they have a, a deep, rich, wonderful life. They're fun. Yeah, they have fun. I don't know how much fun, frankly, to be perfectly honest with you. I don't know how much fun. You know, when you do, uh, what you guys, when you get involved with a woman, and especially if you sleep with her, uh, for most women, at least those, uh, those over college age, there is, uh, there is usually a desire, unless the woman has really squelched her nature, there was usually a desire for something more with that man. And unless you are prepared to absolutely ignore their, uh, their calls and ignore them, uh, afterwards then, uh, there is, there is a— it's not exactly the most pleasant way to lead a life. All righty, uh, let's go to, uh, more of your calls. 1-800-PRAGER-776. And we go to Dallas and Mark. Hello, Mark. Dennis Prager.

Hello, Dennis. How are you?

Good, thanks.

Um, my question is, you know, from a Jewish perspective, polygamy, polygamy was allowed in the medieval period, in Sephardic communities, it wasn't outlawed or prohibited. It was just a question of marriage contracts being modified so that the husband wouldn't take more than one wife. Why do we today look at it as morally wrong, uh, in terms of having more than one wife?

Well, I wouldn't even use the word morally wrong, but I'll tell you why it's wrong. Uh, the— since you've cited the Bible itself, or specifically, uh, the, the the, uh, the Hebrew Bible or the Old Testament or the Torah and the, and the rest of the, uh, the Tanakh, the, the answer is every single time there is polygamy described, uh, it shows how terrible it is for one of the women. One is loved and one is hated. That is a common description of the two women. And, and there, and that's it. It doesn't work. It doesn't work. Is it economically beneficial in some cases? Probably. Does it satisfy some women who otherwise would not marry, and at least they then have a chance for a child? Yes. But in terms of the way in which ultimately, if you still want to talk Bible, which is what you did, God created one woman for Adam after saying it is not good for him to be alone. By the way, not two women. By the way, that is in itself instructive. Notice it's not Adam who said it's not good for man to be alone. Men don't realize it. They often have to be told it. It's God who makes the pronouncement, it's not good for man to be alone. It's not like Adam woke up one day and said, you know, I need a partner. God made the announcement. And And it needs to be— oh, talking about Bible, I seem to keep remembering personal things to mention to you. I resume tonight, for those of you in the Southern California area, I resume my Bible teaching at the University of Judaism. So contact the university and join me. It's 4 nights, 4 Tuesday nights, I believe it works out. And tonight is one again. It doesn't matter if you ever studied with me or not. Doesn't matter if you're religious or not religious or what your religion is, if you are religious. So that's at the University of Judaism tonight, begins the 4 Tuesday nights of this season. And let's go to Tori, a man in Mankato, Minnesota. Hello, Tori. Dennis Prager.

Hi, Dennis. Both my wife and I—

Hello.

Wow.

You know, oh, I— oh my God, I think all. Uh, oh my God, Sean, are you there?

Yeah.

Notice every line got killed, including Tori. Every— something happened to our telephone line. Every single line there, everyone was full and everyone just got knocked off. Too bad, because I really wanted to take that. I wanted to take every one of your calls. They're coming back now, but it's too bad. I don't know, how does that happen? I guess it's inevitable sometimes because it's a bank taking so many calls. Well, they're all relined. Too bad. I think that it was about an impending divorce, and I would have loved to have been able to answer you. I'm making the case for marriage on this Ultimate Issues Hour. It is so obvious to me that with all its issues, you really have to answer. These are questions. These are ultimate questions that you folks have to answer. You folks have to answer the question. Of what is it you want in the final analysis out of life. Do you want a deeper life? Do you want to grow? Or do you want to avoid pain? Do you want as easy a life as possible or as rich a life as possible? These are intellectual value-based questions you must ask yourself. And depending upon those answers, that is how you will ultimately lead your life. But I'm I'm telling you, the one thing that has always guided me is how do I want to look back at my life? Do I want to say I played it safe? And as a man, do I want to say, oh, I was with X number of women, wow, what an achievement? Back in a moment on The Dennis Prager Show.

This episode of Timeless Wisdom will continue right after this.

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Now back to more of Dennis Prager's Timeless Wisdom.

You're listening to The Dennis Prager Show. The case for marriage is what I'm making on this Ultimate Issues hour. Every week at this time I devote an hour to some ultimate issue. Case for marriage, and I will certainly return to it another time, but I thought June was a perfect time to do this. Hal in Philadelphia. Dennis Prager, thank you for calling.

Hello, Dennis, how are you?

Okay, thank you.

I, uh, the reason I called— you had, uh, I turned on the radio and you were talking about, uh, somebody sowing their wild oats as, uh, before they became monogamous. And I guess maybe you even mentioned yourself. And, uh, it's a debate I've had with friends in the past who have had that experience and claim that they wouldn't have had it any other way, that in fact they're better off for having had that experience before they settled down. And I disagree with them, but I was wondering what you thought about that.

I think that it depends very much on the individual, on the type of society in which they live. There are people in closed religious societies for whom this would not be a good idea. I also believe that the act of intercourse itself should be reserved for the person that you will marry. But if I may generalize, I think that for men— I could speak for men better than for women— to be able to say when married, you know what, I really do know what variety would be like, and I don't sit here yearning for something that I've already experienced. Could be, could be, isn't necessarily, but could be helpful.

Do you think that someone who has had that variety— and I'll acknowledge I have not, you know, married with 7 children, only one person— uh, do you think that somebody who has had that variety can honestly say that they don't continue to yearn for it? What?

No, I think that men have a yearning for it in their nature no matter what, but I believe that the fantasy world is diminished tremendously Uh, it's, it's to, to take a non-sexual arena. If one has had certain foods, uh, one doesn't wonder, what does that food taste like? There still may be a, a yearning for that food because it's yummy, but, but you don't have the additional, uh, a fantasy of, gee, what would it be like? And, and in that regard, it could. And I'm not, I'm, the issue was not advocating you. I'm trying to be as honest as I can in answering your question. And it could, it could help for those men. But as I said, I think the act itself, and I distinguish between the act of intercourse and, and, and other contact between men and women, uh, I think that should be reserved for the person that you will marry. I think there's some, some, some one thing, and that specifically, uh, should be sacrosanct. If, if, to the extent that people can do that, you want to lead a deeper life Get married. You want to lead a painless life? Don't. The Ultimate Issues Hour on the Dennis Prager Show.

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