RAWPETMEDICS FELINE FRIDAY: AGGRESSION

And there we go. So good afternoon England, Europe, and good morning America. I just wanted to say that, you know, it's not quite the same as the film, is it? But here to join us today, we're going to be talking about aggression. Hopefully you guys are wanting to know more. Please post your questions live. And here's Julianne to join me as well.

Hello, hello.

Dr. Amaya. So we're looking forward to discussing this subject with you all. So if you want to know more, please post your questions live. We will answer them. Oh, so it's been a month. How have things been, Julianne? Come on, what's— what have you been up to? How did the conference go? Come on, give us the lowdown.

Yeah, the Holistic Cat Conference was phenomenal. Absolutely amazing. Such a wonderful weekend, such great content. People have already asked me the date for next year. I'm like, people, you know, give me a chance to recover.

Yeah.

Um, I've had people volunteering as speakers. It was, it was brilliant. Two-day event all about cats, absolutely phenomenal. And it was a real honor to be able to host it, to give cats a voice, which as you all know is my, my mission, you know. And it was lovely to have such a cat-focused event, you know. There were, there was no talk of dogs, and I'm not against dogs, but it was just lovely to be all about cats. So I'm taking it.

We're not doing that. We're not doing a halfway through the year, 6 months, give cats a choice option.

No, no, no, no. It'd take the magic away if it was— if we did it like twice a year, you know. I did have some people say to me, are you doing it in person? I was like, oh my God, no. You know, I'm not organized online, let alone face to face. Like, You—

no, no, no, we cheer you on from the sidelines.

Thank you, Maya. Yeah, you, you'd be seeing my aggressive side if we were doing a face-to-face because I would be so stressed.

Oh no, no. And, and anyway, okay guys, if you want to vote for Give Cats a Choice halfway through the year, please put your comments in live and we're going to be egging her on so that we can really get this going.

And anyway, I'm working on my next project, so I'm currently working on my cat chakra book. So that is something that is now available for pre-order from the Naturally Cats website, hopefully due to be released in 2 to 3 months. So I, I can't do a conference every 6 months, I've got to do other things as well. So the next book, Aromatic Cat Book Number 1, Cat Chakras Book Number 2, working on it now. Shush now, people.

You see, it's just such a good, such a good conference. That's what it is.

Yeah, really good. Yeah. And thank you both for being speakers as well. It was beautiful. It was really, really nice.

It was a pleasure. Yeah. So Amaya, what's been your month?

Well, I've been at Propet, which is like the London vet show for Spanish people. And I've been representing RFDS there, and it was quite amazing to find two huge brands in Spain in between Royal Canin and Purina, like a huge stand in between. I was like— and the guy said, look, I'm always looking, you know, every, every now and then to see if they're throwing things at me. But the thing is that And he had like a sign that he didn't want to put that it said something about, you know, only just feed fresh or something of the sort of ditch the dried, something like that. But, you know, he said, I'm not, I don't know, I can't, I can't put it on because I'm between these brands and I don't know what to do. Shame. Yeah, that was, but, you know, it took a lot of courage for them to be there. And it was really nice to see how The raw industry is growing and, you know, vets, well, they're still thinking, not all of them are in favor, but, you know, the thing is that we are getting there and it was really nice. And then here we have the summer and spring starting. And so it looks really good. And also the music business starting.

Hey, that's what we want to hear. We're going to hear a bit of outro today. I think we're going to ask Yeah, if you all behave.

Beautiful. Amazing, everyone.

Absolutely. You've got a treat coming. So guys, if you want to know more, you want to support what we do, uh, join us on, uh, Raw Pet Medics, uh, forward slash— sorry, patreon.com/rawpetmedics. Uh, you can give us some support and that allows us to do more of what we do and to sponsor people, all of the rest of it, please, you know, come in and join us on Patreon. If you want to know more cat stuff, we want— I want to hear more questions being posted on there so that we can bring more cats to that page, get these boys to stop talking about dogs all the time. So, you know, so do join us there. For today, we are going to be talking about aggression. And the angry cat. And I've put a question mark because it's not always an angry cat. So Amaya, come on, I think I'd love to hear your perspective because I deal with behavior. I think all three of us deal with behavior so much in dealing with cats, and I'd love to hear what you guys think about this. So I'm going to give Amaya the chance to go first.

Okay, well, I have I own an aggressive cat, which it has— he has hyperesthesia that I found out later on. So the thing is that nobody wanted him. He was a black cat rescued, and somebody said, look, he's biting everyone. We cannot deal with him. And what can we do? She said, can you, I don't know, just foster him for a while? And well, he's still here after 10 years. So I think I'm not, I'm not giving him away anytime soon. But the important thing about behavior, the behavior behind aggression is that I think humans take it very personal when they get attacked by a cat. And at the same time, we feel like You know, this small creature is attacking us. So it's, we believe that cats are unpredictable, that they are going to show out of nowhere and attack you. And, you know, and we grow really scared about aggression. So one of the things that I always suggest is, you know, go through therapy because you will need that. Otherwise you're always going to have this energy that will promote aggression because Aggression comes from fear. If the cat is afraid of something, of his surroundings or of anything, the cat is going to react to it. And that's what I understood when I had this cat. This cat wasn't aggressive. He had, between other things, but he had this fear, fearful thing that he lived in the streets before being rescued. And he's been attacked. Well, he's been, I don't know how to say it, with brooms, you know, they hit him with brooms outside the streets. Yeah, bitten. Uh, he was, uh, he, he was, uh, on the, uh, on the pound, you know. He— and so he had so many experience for such a young cat because I adopted him with, uh, a year or something, uh, or something like that. And, uh, so, so many experience as a young kitten and so bad, so many bad experiences that normally, of course, the cat is going to react to its environment. And the, and that all comes through the fear thing. But after we start treating that and I understood his behavior and I, you know, I simply let him act, you know, and, and I would, instead of me trying to do something, I just simply listened and, and waited for him to be comfortable around me. What I, uh, what I noticed is that he had this rolling skin syndrome. So then after learning about fear, I learned that physical issues also, as pain, such as pain, can also cause this aggression. And the first, the, the most important thing that I want all people to understand is that, uh, I don't believe in, in, in hierarchy. It's like, like this alpha cat or this, uh, you know, he, he controls the situation, the rankings. Yeah. I, I don't want people to believe in that because even when a cat is too reactive or too strong, sometimes there is a fear emotion behind it. So we need to like try to have a more broad, broad view on, you know, its behavior, its health. And everything. And this is why we're going to talk about all during the hour.

So many behavioural things there. I could just talk about an hour just about what you just said in that first moment. But we'll try and touch on all of those aspects.

I think I'll summarize them.

And for you, Juliane, where's your sort of, you know, centre for looking at the aggressive cat? What's going on for you?

Yeah, so I agree with what Amaya said. You know, there is— aggression is a behavioral response to an emotion. And, you know, for me, like, the most important thing is that aggression isn't bad, it's not wrong. You know, I think we need to remember, with everything else we'll talk about today— Amaya said don't take it personally— it's not bad or wrong. The cat is reacting to an emotion in themselves, whether that's fear, you know, if it's a new mum cat, she wants to protect her baby, the kittens. If the cat's in pain, they're trying to tell you, don't touch me, you know. So there is always an emotional response, an emotional cause, and we shouldn't take it personally. You know, the cat is trying to tell us something. And aggression particularly, in my experience, there are different places it comes from, you know. So it's trying to understand what the cat is trying to tell you, and then you can figure out how to help them and support them. Because if you've got a cat that is fearful in their environment, so for example, they don't feel safe in their environment, you know, you would support them differently to if you had a cat that's in pain and is showing reactive signs, right? So, you know, for me, it's about understanding the emotion that is causing the aggressive behavior and knowing and trying to let go of that label that the cat is bad and the cat is wrong, because, you know, I, I truly don't believe that. And I've dealt with some severely aggressive cats. And yes, okay, there are some really, really extreme circumstances, right? But again, that cat's not bad or wrong. It's reacting because of an emotional state within. And as humans, we try to support friends and family members. You know, we may look at self-care if we're struggling with things. And we need to do the same for cats. We shouldn't be judging them and saying like, you know, that's a bad cat, because they're not. So if they're showing aggression, if they're reactive, where is it coming from? That's always my first question, like, where is it coming from? You know, have there been changes in the home? Is it feeling unsettled? Has it lost a core relationship? You know, is it grieving? Like, what is it? What's the emotion behind it all? So for me, like, when we look at the emotion whether it's pain, sadness, anger, whatever, that's the first step. And then like we said, you know, the other avenues we're going to look at, then you can go down that path and try to understand how you support them. So do you need to do pain management? Is it emotional support? Is it energetic support, you know, etc., etc.? So for me, it's, it's the emotion. Let's find out what is the cause rather than saying it's a bad cat or we need to stop them doing it. The only way you'll stop them doing it is by understanding why they're doing it.

Yeah, and, you know, Jennifer, thanks for your question. I think, you know, just, just let's come into that because this will depend upon why they're doing it. You know, there is a— is it a good or bad idea to introduce yourself to an aggressive cat by offering catnip with slow blinks? So, you know, go on, what's your interpretation? I know you love to use herbs and stuff, Julianne, so, you know, give us an impression for that.

Yeah, so I would say I think it's a great idea to introduce herbs to a reactive cat. My only concern with catnip is that some cats can go hyper with it, or on it, shall we say. So catnip wouldn't be my first herb to use, although if that's the only one you've got your hands on, then at least that's something. But I would probably try either valerian root or chamomile flowers first. So those two, in my opinion, will help to deal with the anxiety. Amaya's smiling. I assume that's because you say the same thing.

Yes, I was thinking chamomile.

Yeah. Yeah, so my preference would be chamomile, valerian root, because those will help with the, again, with the physiological response to reduce anxiety, which can cause aggression. Whereas with catnip, some cats can get an excitable response from it. So when you've got the, when you look at their, you know, their nervous system and everything, all the everything that's running around their body, I would choose either of those. And absolutely with the slow blinks, I love that because that's another dimension where you're bringing in a behavioural response from you to the cat. So if we've got an aggressive cat, we're likely to be like really big-eyed and really nervous and really kind of robotic with like, oh my God, are they going to touch me? You know, we're all kind of heightened, right? You're stressed, intense. So, and the cat will feel that energy but also read that from your behavior. So if you can do those beautiful slow blinks, which I know Amaya does a great version because she did it on a live with me once, then, then, you know, I would always, always recommend it. Slow blinks, we call them eye kisses in our house. Do them as much as you can. You know, I do it all the time with my boys and they're not particularly aggressive. But yes, bring in the slow blinks, bring in the herbs.

Jennifer, even slow breathing.

Yeah, yeah. Actually, that's good.

Your breath rate. Sorry, Amaya. I'm too— yeah, I'd love to because that— there is another thing, guys. Yeah, I want to give you guys the science behind that for a moment. Did you realize Darwin, uh, looked at this back in the 1800s and actually published a paper on the fact that the development of the mammalian brain allowed mammals across species to recognize emotions in other species. Okay, just by— so you could effectively, uh, and capture an animal and bring a naive person in, and they could actually recognize what emotion that animal was feeling at that point in time. And people sort of like bunkered it. But actually they could also— it's a cross-species, so dogs can do it to cats, cats can do it to dogs, you know, rabbits even, you know, what's going on with prey, all of that interpretation. Really, really interesting. And what happens to this is that interaction, not just then that recognition, but actually through the vagus nerve, how that actually will calm the body if you can pass those on. So you can actually use that to manipulate, not in a natural way, the animal before you. So really, really good science behind all of this. Polyvagal theory, I've talked about it before, but it's in there, but it actually works both ways. So there is this physical disease. So this is the second point I wanted to raise, is if there is physical disease, even if it's something you might not realize, but disturbance in gut flora, that can actually— the vagus is a two-way street and actually will send signals through from those bacteria back up to the brain of that patient. And if they are particularly upset in their gut or they have inflammatory conditions, that can lead to aberrant behavior. Okay. And this is another piece of science. If you look back to the turn of the century, around the 1900s, was being talked about as the one of the root causes of schizophrenia in people is actually the gut disturbance that they were having, the poor diet and choices that they were making. And there was lots to talk about as to why the influence of gut flora could actually influence the mental states of patients. And this happens with our pets too. So poor dietary choices can influence how they're acting within the home. Am I— I'll throw the ball to you.

And another thing, when I got my training in Tellington Touch and a little bit of Feldenkrais as well, you know, breathing also, when you control a little bit of your breathing or you're conscious aware about it, your movements also shift and you can be more flexible. And instead of like Juliane said, going like, smell, you know, just, I'm so scared. You can, there is always a saying that you have, if you want to move your head, hand, then start in your shoulder, like, you know, just offering yourself in a bit more flexible way. So that movement, it's, it's aligned with your breathing, uh, pattern. So at the same time, if you, if you control those things, and if you, uh, if you want to approach this aggressive cat, you have to really be aware of your own body. Yeah. And it's a really good exercise for yourself as well.

Absolutely. And Brendan, you said about the gut, you know, the gut biome connection. And obviously, you know, we are raw pet medics, like diet needs to be addressed if you're dealing with an aggressive cat, because if you are feeding kibble, dry food, you know, the poor quality, some even sometimes even poor quality wet, the sugars in them, you know, that's all going to contribute to, like you said, not bad, but, you know, a diminished gut biome, which will affect their behavioral responses, you know. And I was talking to a client the other week and she's about how her younger cat is constantly going at the other one. They've tried all different toys and etc., etc. And I said, what are you feeding? Unfortunately, it was dry food. And I said, you know, you consider the fact that you're giving a younger cat like he's giving a child Haribo, you know, you're feeding them that. So they're going to have these spikes and then crashes and the behavior is going to be unpredictable. And that comes in with aggression. Right. So, you know, and that's not to say— say again?

Other sweets are available.

Yeah.

Yeah. That's not to say that, like, if you are raw feeding, you're not going to have an aggressive cat because there are obviously other causes But, you know, as Raw Pet Medics, Feedline Fridays, you know, we'd be remiss if we didn't mention the fact that, you know, what you're feeding will also impact their physical body in terms of, you know, their health, nutrition, but then their behavior as well.

And also stress is also stuck here. So chewing raw meaty bones actually can also have an effect, affect the brain and change those patterns of aggression. I had several cats that once you introduced them to raw meaty bones, they were releasing that anxiety or that emotion behind it, like with a raw meaty bone, and also helps the teeth and the gums. So it's a win-win.

And so many people will say, well, you know, they've come from a feral background, you know, they're feral cats. Let's talk about that in a moment. And therefore I've just got to let them be angry. I've got to let them have that frustration. And actually, there are good reasons to try and help address that so they could become more settled, because actually, that, as Amaya said, has a physiological effect. You know, the constipation levels will be much higher in those aggressive cats where they've got excessive sympathetic drive. You know, there's parasympathetics, normal functional things that slow the heart, that actually give them longevity, that actually improve gut function is going to be interfered with. So you need to reduce that sympathetic drive in order to actually give them a healthier, longer, happier life. So there are reasons to do that. So let's talk about ferals for a moment. So the number of people that will adopt from shelters, they may— and we'll talk about whether they are truly wildcats or, you know, they're ferals, as in they've been let go to do their own thing in nature, and they've effectively— a litter of kittens has been born, they're adopting. What's your take-home message to those people that are adopting in those circumstances? Julianne, I know you put your hand in the air straight away. You get to go first.

Yay!

My patience would be patience. You know, it, it could be a bit of a road, a bit of a bumpy road. Like, they've, they've got to learn to trust, and that doesn't happen overnight. You know, Leo was feral for the first 18 months of his life. He was then captured by the rescue centre. Him and the litter were going to be rehomed on a farm. He actually seemed curious about humans. One girl worked with him for 3 months every day at the shelter, and then we brought him home. He isn't particularly a physically cuddly cat, you know. As if there's a knock at the door, even here's a car stop outside our house, he runs straight outside because outside is his safe space. So, you know, I would have said like for him he's not necessarily aggressive, he's just reactive. But again, it's part of honoring that about the cat, you know. If you've got previously feral cats, they're different to ex-strays. If a stray, like you said, Brendan, like, you know, if someone unfortunately has a cat and dumps it outside that are going to be potentially reactive. But if you've got like a truly feral cat, you know, just have patience. And as Jennifer mentioned, you know, getting some herbs down, your body language, your interactions. And then from a behavioral perspective, it's about short interactions. You know, that's how you're more likely to build trust. So rather than thinking, I don't know, you've brought your cat home from the rescue center and you know that they're aggressive, like go in there for an hour at a time. No, no, no. You know that they're coping mechanism will be short. So your interactions with them, you need to be short, in my opinion, in my behavioral experience, short and frequent to maintain their exposure to a human, to a change of circumstance, and, you know, giving them time to sort of decompress in between to find that balance in their physical body again. And it's about reading their boundaries, reading their body language. So When we first brought Leo home, he was sat in the corner of the window and I wanted to go up and give him cuddles and, you know, just face plant his tummy. Like, you gotta be joking. The look on his face was like, uh, don't you ever come near me, woman. Like, ever. And so I—

yeah, that's a TikTok video in itself.

I, I would sit on the floor with him, right, and not actually try to interact. So if you've got an aggressive cat, that would be one of my first behavioral tips, is to be present with them but not actually interacting with them, because they need to know that you're safe. They need to know that you're not someone that's going to come in to stroke them or come in to touch them or want anything from them. So how can you be around them? You know, I worked at a rescue briefly a few years ago and there was a feral litter, mum and her kittens, and I just sat outside the pen reading to them just so that, you know, they could get used to human voices, right? So start off small, start off simple, and wherever you think you should start, I would take it 2 steps before that because as humans, you know, we think we know the right way, we think we can read them, but I would always caution people if you're dealing with a particularly aggressive cat to just actually take a step or 2 back again slow interactions and don't ask anything from them. Just, just be patient and be present and see if you can build trust from there. Yeah.

And, and for you, Amaia, have you had the feral feeling?

The feral feeling is really complicated here in Spain because sometimes we don't have the chance for them to go outside or maybe, you know, decompress outside. So usually what you find First of all, you find that most of the people that adopt or have or foster feral cats, they are too intense. And even though you try to tell them that, you know, they need some space, that they are overstimulated with anything, right? Because for them, as you mentioned, the safe space is outside. So everything that it's locked or trapped, it feels like a cage in a way. It doesn't matter how big it is. And, uh, and it's really difficult here to handle. And, uh, what, what it is done here is usually just leave them, let them be, and outside, so they control, uh, colonies outside. And, and that's it. Because it is really difficult to actually, uh, try to reeducate, let's say, or maybe make them adapt to an indoor lifestyle. And the other thing is that I completely agree with you in the sense that we need to control our energy, how we present ourselves to cats, that being feral or not. But the other experience that I had is that most people think they know what to do And if you have that feeling, your energy is already bad. Yeah. What I would recommend is to actually feel like you don't know anything and you're presenting yourself in the best possible way. And let's see what happens, right? And try to enhance this instinctive play, play the games, you know, try to play with them, try to use herbs, try to keep your distance and feel like you are overstimulated. You know, when you're just trying to put yourself into their shoes and say, okay, everything stimulates me. And this is also for many other things, but especially for ferals, just keep in mind that and, uh, and do the best you can. That's what I can say. Yeah.

Brendan, what about, what about you? Sorry, go on, you'd like to say something?

Yeah, from a point of view of I've been in these circumstances where we've had strays brought in, feral kittens. You know, I fostered a couple, and I think it's— when it's a kitten situation, it's slightly different to bringing in an adult cat. Okay, I absolutely agree. You know, taking time— and this is why even with pet cats, you know, for the feline-friendly clinics that are out there, you know, ISFM ones, there's about, you know, giving you a room, giving them space and time to get used to that room, you know, opening their box, not reaching in, you know, giving them a chance to associate what's happening in the room before the vet reaches in and does an examination. So all of that sort of thing comes, and you can do that at home by, you know, giving them space in the room, you going in, doing something, a task, but not interacting with them, you know, giving them the fact that you're present but not poking the bear, so to speak. So I think that's important. For kittens, a really important aspect that I said to you guys earlier is that recognizing that actually it's natural for cats to develop a sense of play. And many people will see it as aggression and blame it on aggression because they're feral kittens. But actually, there's a natural process to them developing that they're going to pounce, play, you know, act as prey, hunt others, you know, imprint upon you. And you'll often find the one that's imprinted upon will be the one that they will direct this so-called aggression. There's going to be a lot of that today, I think, going on. And it's not true aggression, it's really, you know, acting it out to try and work out how that interaction will work, you know, what's going to be the response. And, you know, interestingly, we have exactly the same situation that Kelly's put on here with Harry, who we adopted more recently. He was a stray, came in as a kitten, and fortunately all the nurses got used to him, you know, all of that side of things. He's been going out on a harness because there's he rode nearby, and it's just sort of like getting that— he's wanted to go out more and more with the spring coming, and he managed to slip his harness. Well, you know, uh, the nurse's response was, oh my God, Brendan's going to kill me if I lose Harry. So they dropped to the floor to try and capture him, and obviously, you know, him in an embrace, cuddle. Well, his response was, oh my God, you know, like a total, you know, everything, claws, teeth, a lot, you know. Um, I did say our area outside is fenced off quite spectacularly, okay? And it would have taken quite a bit. And if she'd have just let him loose, he'd probably been absolutely fine. Um, but you know, that there is that, you know, if you suddenly decide that you're going to control a cat who's in flat-out aggression by gripping them tighter, um, whoa, just be prepared, you know, slash marks, teeth marks, the lot, okay? So please don't just jump and drop on them, um, unless it's an absolute drop and roll. Drop and roll.

Oh my word, I have an experience with some clients. I had, I had an experience with some clients about this. They, you know, the cat got loose and, and and they were calling me, oh, what do I do? What do I do? I said, don't go after him. You'll never catch him. I mean, that's not possible. So if you already develop a relationship with them, so just sit down, wait, just put the carrier over there, put some food, put some treats, and just sit and wait. Kind of an hour and a half later, you know, the cat just simply went back. And that's it. He found, you know, he wasn't— he didn't came before because, uh, there were dogs around, so he was, he was hiding. But once, once it was all clear, uh, the cat just simply came back.

Yeah.

So sometimes we need to be patient. Sometimes we need to, you know, simply align ourselves and not jump on, on top of the cat.

And very much, you know, it's just understanding. So coming back to that, look, Some cats will do that, you know, two swipes at each other, do a little bit of a sort of like face-off. You know, it's almost like, right, okay, this is where we're at. This is how I feel today. You know, we're either going to play at it or we're going to be serious. And, you know, that's prerogatives of communication. And there's others which will then take going back to the kittens where they're play fighting. So they run across the room as if they're hunting you down and latch to the back of your ankle or they'll climb up your leg and sort of latch onto your hand because it was the thing that was moving. Or, you know, you'll be sat on the sofa and, you know, just sort of like turning the pages of a magazine or a book, and all of a sudden you'll have a cat launch over your shoulder onto the book to grab the stuff that's moving. That's sort of naturally playful. Okay, again, here we go. But people will see it as aggression, especially, but often those cats, as they bite your thumb or bite your hand, they're not actually truly sinking through. They'll just grip on, okay, and then release and grip on. Now, if you don't manage that to some degree, then yes, as they get older, that can be left to become, you know, almost accentuated for them to get a reaction. And I think that's a really important thing to be aware of. We see this with people that actually befriend squirrels and things like that, that gray squirrels are notorious for not understanding the boundaries when you befriend them. And so people will think, oh, it's really cute. They're really inquisitive. They come into the house, they eat the nuts, you know, all the rest of it. And before they know it, they've got this rogue squirrel in the neighborhood that's actually launching themselves at people and biting ears and heads and all the rest of it. So it's a a cautionary note, you know, just be careful how you do that interaction, okay? Sometimes it's good to just keep them at arm's length, as you know, we were talking about where they do a quick couple of swipes and that says, yeah, and I'll swipe you back. And, you know, just be careful you don't overstep the mark because there is a possibility of retaliation, you know, in that sense. Well, I'm not saying that you're going to swipe your cat across the the thing, but it's just a case of, you know, don't start just waggling your finger and encouraging excessively.

Yeah, we've talked about that with kittens. I mean, we talked about the kitten RPM that we did, you know, appropriate toys, appropriate behaviors and things. You know, your hand is not a plaything with the kitten, you know, and if you start off using it, that's what they will think is the way forward. And, you know, you're saying there, Brenda, about when they come to bite you and things I would argue, like, you know, you've got your air quotes, it's not aggression, it's play. And that is a natural thing for cats to do. So it's not wrong, it's not bad. The cat is trying to play. That's the only way that they know how, you know.

And the same— oh, sorry.

No, go on.

Okay, the same goes for hissing or, you know, sometimes hissing. Yeah, they're communicating that you are maybe being too too close, or maybe you're imposing, or— and it's a way of communication. It's not, oh my cat— I heard this so many times. My cat is so bad. He's hissing all the time. He's growling. And maybe you're being too intense, right? Or the thing is that it's a way— it's the way they communicate. And sometimes you see that communication between them, like, stop it. Instead of brothers and sisters going, hey, stop it, you, whatever. And they go like, and that's it. So, you know, many people get worried about the verbal communication that felines have, and that's also some other— that's another thing that we should talk about when we think the cat is being aggressive.

I agree, I agree. I'm just gonna just say that, like, multi-cat homes, right? So one of the most common things people come to me for, aggression in multi-cat homes, right? Whether that's 2, 3, or more. And from my perspective, you know, from the behavioral part of me and the emotional part of me, again, I come back to like, every cat is unique. So, you know, you have a duty as a guardian to look at the needs of the cats that you have. You know, I get so— I'm going to be a bit like Connie here— I get so angry when people are like, oh, you know, I just leave my cats to get on with it. I'm like, well, that's not really going to help, is it? You know, if you don't like the way that they're reacting and you're getting frustrated because they're hissing and fighting and you're just like, oh, they'll get on with it, you know, they'll sort it out. Like, that's not gonna happen, you know. If you want to have a better relationship for your cats, you've got to put some goddamn work in, you know. We're the guardians, we're the humans, we have to help. And, and that may vary in the way that we do it, but aggression in a multi-cat home, you don't look at what the cat needs, you know. My baby Max, he is, he is full of beans, full of energy, and actually he, he needs a lot of contact. When he comes in the house, he goes straight to your legs, right? You know where he is because you feel him or you can see him, right? He's either next to you or he's in front of you, whereas Leo's like a shadow cat. I very rarely see him, you know, it's like he wants to be invisible as much as possible. Put those two together, that's not necessarily a great combination. So I've got to look at how can I support them. So maybe Max needs extra play, Leo needs a bit more, like Amaya said, a bit more space. And actually, as Jennifer mentioned, the slow blinks from a distance, you know. So if you've got aggression in a multi-cat home, whose needs aren't being met? And I asked that question because who is it that's being aggressive? As Amaya said, who's hissing? Who's trying to play? So who's not actually being aggressive but who's trying to play, you know? And then who is cowering in the corner and who is going and going and going for that other cat? Because again, that's in my opinion not always aggression. It's about instigating play and communication and engagement and releasing energy and get, you know, stopping them being bored. So what do you have to do? You know, whose needs can you meet more, which will then reduce the aggression? Sorry, bit of a rant, but just—

No, no, that was amazing.

Yeah, I will always say to people, look, you know, the minimalist home, the home that is super tidy with nowhere to hide for that speck of dust, is the worst case for multi-cat households for aggression. Okay, if there's nowhere to hide, okay, that nowhere to get away to, nowhere to elevate yourself to, nowhere to, you know, find a dark corner, you know, hide under the beds, whatever, that's really bad for cats, okay, especially when you start introducing new ones into the home. So, you know, think about that. There's some great books out there. I mean, one of the ones I used to talk about 20 years ago was Vicky Hall's The Cat Confidential, and I think she also brought out The Cat Detective. There was a couple of— one was more practical, but actually how to reorganize your home a little bit to create— it's really fine for me because I'm a bloke and I just make a mess, but for many people, you've got to actually think about the furniture you've got, how you can make those hidey-holes, all of those sort of areas to hide away, you know, get away from the dog in the house, get away from the children in the house, decompress, be able to, you know, just have, you know, enough litter trays in the house that you've not— you know, it's always one more than the number of cats you've got is what they quote as the best way to think about litter trays. You know, all of that's whether the litter trays are covered or not, whereabouts in the house they are. I want to touch on pheromones for a moment, okay, because I think a lot of people have probably seen the pheromone, the classic one for— I don't know whether you can see that— which is Feliway, which is all about their territory and creating a sort of sense of ease within the home. But actually, when you start to introduce more than one cat, there are— used to be called FeliFriends, but they've— we used to use it as a spray in the practice to create a pheromone smell on your hands and things like that. So that cats wouldn't be so aggressive. So some people interestingly seem to give off an odor which will heighten cats more than others. And they literally, if they go anywhere near a cat, the cat's on super alert. And then there's other people that will seem to release a different set of odors which seems to settle cats. Well, pretty much this is the smell-free pheromones that we're talking about that are given off And they actually have interactions across species to some degree. This is why Conor's favourite story is all about spraying Bormate on certain chairs within the waiting room and watching where people sit down. But anyway, that's his favourite story. Ask when you see him next. But from the— so what they've done is they've actually subdivided all of these pheromones that cats give off and effectively synthesized some of these. So the next one that's, that's now out there is where you've got multi-cat households, and it's now called Infeliway Friends. Okay, and this is the one which is about— so it's now a plugin. So if you have cats which are fighting a lot, if they are in the household, you can actually plug that in and it actually reduces the tension within the room. Now, I would also say getting cats to recognize other pheromones is really useful for avoidance. Most cats want to avoid fights. So actually, you can actually get a J-cloth, a cloth that's disposable. Okay. Wet it, squeeze it out, rub it on their cheeks, on their flanks, okay, rub it around doors, mix that across to the other cat so that you're transferring those scents between the cats within your household. Or when it's needed for cats that are outside the household, you know, literally just planting those with a peg, tent peg, out in the garden at the various points around can be really useful for pushing out the borders of that territory but actually reducing conflict. So that's my pheromone speech, guys. Any other favorite tips as we're coming towards the end for trying to avert or reduce aggression? Amaya, you first, and then Julie can do all the herbs she likes.

Okay, well, the thing is that my experience with pheromones are not as good as I would love to like it to be. I had cats actually peeing on on all over the plugin. And then I had some other— well, when I worked in the animal protection services, we had like all the cats losing it in a space, like 30 cats altogether in a really huge space. And I noticed that it only affected 2 or 3 cats from the 20-something, right? So, um, I, I know it works at a certain point, a certain level, and it's good to have it, but there are 2 things that I I don't really like about pheromones. One is that I, as everything else with cats, I like them to be able to escape from it if they want to. So if you're using pheromones, I don't simply put it on the carrier and, you know, just have it there. I first try it at home with a spray. I use the spray more than the plug-in. If you put plug-in, make sure you have a room that it doesn't have, so if they want to escape from it, they can. And I do like better the Feliway Friend instead of the Classic. I didn't like their last one they have. It didn't work at all for me. It was like the worst one. But, uh, and then for me, uh, I had much better experience with two other things, which is music and with herbs. And I will let— I would— I'm gonna leave Juliane with the herbs because I, I'm sure we're gonna agree with that. But, um, on the music side There I am, I'm learning now the bioacoustics, that this is the use of nature's music sounds to treat different things, different frequencies that will help your cat to be better. Uh, it's an amazing thing, uh, to work with. And also I had really good experiences with the music for cats from David Tay, um, much better than classical music. Uh, yes, I had really good experiences, especially for the vet consultations.

If you Could you spell it out so that I can put it on for everybody?

David and T-E-I-E. Yeah. Music for Cats. And it's basically, I think he's a cellist or something like that. And he, uh, he combines classical music with, uh, with purring sounds. And on bioacoustics, the, the, the course that I'm taking right now, actually we have, 3 different purring from cats, different cats, and they treat different things. And it's amazing, amazing what the frequencies can do to calm ourselves.

Frequencies. I love it, love it, love it, love that you mentioned that, Amaya. Frequencies, like, it's the unseen, right? But it is one of the most powerful. I mean, I think it's beautiful. And I've had mixed reactions with Feliway and plugins and things. And I think, you know, at the end of the day, it's it's a synthetic, so it is going to help and massively help some cats, and some cats might not be affected. That's just like catnip— some cats it impacts, other cats it doesn't. You know, I think when people are dealing with aggression, try it. You know, you've got nothing to lose by trying. I've not had any adverse effects or reactions with, with any Feliway products, so it either helps and does a great job to support them with, with, you know, their environment or it doesn't do anything. So, you know, you've not got anything to lose. Yeah, beautiful.

Um, for clinical practices, pheromones is really good for, for clinical, uh, for veterinary practices is really good. Yeah, because that's a resource you have to, you know, cover other things.

Yeah, yeah, definitely, definitely. So yeah, I, I am, I am a fan, you know. Um, but like you said, herbs are my go-to. I mean We said at the beginning when I mentioned about the cat conference, you know, my mission is giving cats a voice and part of that is to give them a choice. So if you've got an aggressive cat, I come back to what we talked about at the beginning. It's a behavioral response to an emotional cause. So how can you support the emotion? So my recommendation, it would, is always first and foremost to put a herb garden down. So beautiful little towel or blanket and a lovely quiet space in the home. Not in the front room where everybody's busy, not in the kids' bedrooms, you know, somewhere nice and quiet, and hopefully a space that the cat feels safe in. So like a spare room, we've got one in the dining room in our house, and you know, you put down a really good pinch, and I don't mean like a pinch, I mean probably actually like half a handful, you know, this isn't like how much salt, well depending on how much salt you put in your food, it's not like a pinch type thing, you know, I'm talking, yeah, I imagine that would probably be a lot. Yeah, you want to shake it in there. Um, you know, we're like a Post-it size, you know what I mean? A good, a good bit of, a bit of dried herb down. And I only put 4 down at a time, sometimes 3. I don't put more than that down in one go. And as we said at the beginning, so my, my preferences, my first 3 would be valerian root because it's calming, it helps to support anxiety, actually helps physical pain as well. So it would be valerian root, it would be chamomile dried Chamomile flowers, um, very, very calming. Just like with humans, you have a cup of chamomile tea to soothe your nervous system, to support, you know, your anxious tummy. So definitely chamomile. And actually, my third would probably be rosebuds. So again, making sure you've got organic and not perfumed, not, you know, um, synthetic ones. So organic if possible. So the— with the rosebuds, there's two reasons for that. So one, it encourages play because they're small, you know, a lot of cats will flick them, bat them around, play with them. Some cats will kind of crunch them up, which obviously releases the properties. But for me, like, rose is really nurturing, really emotionally supportive, so it supports the heart space. So any form of aggression, in my opinion, comes from an emotional reaction. And if you've got rose down, it's going to support those emotions. It's going to help the cat to feel safe, to feel nurtured. So my preference would be valerian root, chamomile, and rose. Now, you know, you put it down, you let your cat choose. You know, you'll find some cats that will go straight to the valerian and probably start to eat it. You'll find others who might drool over the chamomile. Some might play with the rose, or you might have a cat that just sits there, and, and that's okay. You know, you give them the capacity to support their emotions with this tool. That's, that's my first port of call for supporting any cat, feral, stray, or otherwise. With aggression.

And what do you think about violet leaf?

Love it. There are other herbs, definitely, that, you know, violet leaf I think is beautiful, especially if there's been emotional trauma, to support, you know, pain in the heart. But, you know, it, it's not a common— as common as the others. So like, there— I mean, I've got a list of 20 here, and I know Brendan's gonna get on at me because we've got 9 minutes left. So I was just trying to give like the top best 3. Yeah, right, I know you're gonna say it, so I'll say it. So I, I love Violet leaf, you know, angelica root, beautiful for opening the cat up to healing. But, you know, zoopharma is a whole other topic. Yeah, I am having the mic for a good 25 minutes.

Brilliant. And I'm not even going to have time to talk about homeopathy. So there's so many choices there. So right now I think I would just come back. So for those guys who switch off their phalliway and switch it back on and the dust settles on it and glues in and then you switch it back on, creates an odor. That often is a reason why cats will go and spray on that because of the odour that it's giving off. Never switch them off. Once they're on, they're on. Just leave them going. And I absolutely agree, giving specific rooms that they can go into. You'll be amazed if cats respond to it, they'll go into the room to receive it. If they don't want it, they'll stay out of the room. It's a really good test, way of you stopping wasting loads of money. So, yeah, have a little look at that. Some of your vets might have little testers that you can use, okay? So you can work out whether it's good for your cat or not. Little sprays that they can spray on. You can take it home, put it in the cat basket. Cat basket in one corner, see if your cats go to it or not, rather than going out and spending £25+ to work out if this is going to work for you. Okay. Oh, wow, guys, that was an amazing romp through aggression and behavior. I think I hope all of the people out there have got something from today that they can take home, try, look at, use YouTube TV for cats to all of the music for cats. I really, I'm going to try that. I'm going to have a little play with that and see how you get on. Amaya, are you ready? I think we want, we so want to you to, if you guys haven't heard Amaya, What you need to do is you need to follow her on Instagram. She's got an amazing channel for her music. Okay, so all you guys can support her. Um, we're going to leave on this note. Um, we've got, uh, next, next month in April, we're going to be talking all about obesity around Easter.

Yep, 21st of April, 1 o'clock, we've got obesity and people in the comments, you can get herbs from my website Naturally Cats. I do gardens all put together, so head to the shop and you can get them from there, all organic. Right, Amaya, beautiful singing queen, over to you.

Okay, everybody else, see you guys.

Okay, I'm just gonna put a little bit of drama that if you get attacked by your cat, then don't worry, you will survive.

First I was afraid, I was petrified. Kept thinking I could never live without you by my side. But then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrong, and I grew strong, and I learned how to get along. And so you're back from outer space. I just walked in to find you here with that soul look upon your face. Could have changed that stupid lock. Should have made you leave the key. If I had known for just one second you'll be back to bother me. Go on now, go! Walk out the door! Just turn around now! 'Cause you're not welcome anymore! Weren't you the one who tried to hurt me with the bar? Do you think I've crumbled? Do you think I'll lay down and die? Oh no, no, no, I will survive. Oh, as long as I know how to love, I know I'll stay alive. I got all my life to live, I got all my love to give, and I'll survive. I will survive.

Yay!

Beautiful!

Brilliant! Well done! See you later, guys!