#004: Case Studies: How to Earn $200+ an Hour Writing Short Success Stories

Welcome to the High Income Business Writing Podcast, helping you propel your writing business to a whole new level. And now, here's your host, Ed Gandia.

Hey everyone, thanks for joining me for episode number four of the High Income Business Writing Podcast. I am your host, Ed Gandia, and this is the podcast for business writers and copywriters who want to learn how to take their writing businesses to the six figure level or, or the part time equivalent of that. In this week's episode, I'm gonna interview Casey Hibbard, a successful freelance writer who specializes in writing customer case studies, also known as customer success stories. She's also the author of the excellent book, stories that turn satisfied customers into your most powerful sales and marketing asset. In this interview, Casey explains what case studies are and how they're used by clients. She's gonna give us a primer on the basic components of case studies, including what elements you should include in order to make them more effective. And she's also going to explain why they continue to be so popular in the marketing communications arena. She also is going to talk at length about how she manages these projects and what key deliverables you should include. And we're going to get into a discussion about pricing case studies, the different types and formats you'll encounter, what makes a great case study writer, and what you should do if you have no samples but you want to start writing these pieces. So with that, let's get right to the interview. All right, Casey. So, hey, welcome to the show. It's great to have you.

Thanks, dad. Great to be here.

Super, super. So, you know, I think a lot of people listening in have heard of case studies success stories. Maybe some have written a couple before. But let's start from the beginning. Why don't you, why don't you tell us a little bit about first a little bit about yourself and the kind of clients you work with, and then a little bit about case studies and just kind of give us a basic definition of what they are and where they're used.

Okay, Definitely. So I'm a freelance writer and I specialize just in capturing customer case studies and success stories for companies really of all sizes. And that means that my clients hire me to interview their happy customers and then develop stories that they can use in their sales, marketing and PR efforts. Yeah, and most of my clients are like technology or business to business companies, like telecom firms, software companies, or like business services providers. And then the question of what, what is a case study? I like to use the term customer case study to differentiate them from Like a medical or academic case study.

Okay.

Because yeah, they're very different. Customer case studies are really stories about a specific customer's experience with a product or service that a company then uses to sell more. And they're written very much like a feature story that you'd see in a magazine.

Gotcha. Okay, so where are they used? I mean, where are companies actually using these pieces? For what purpose?

Yeah, well, so smart companies are really using them in a lot of different ways. At a minimum, they usually go on the website and then sales reps can email them to prospects. Marketing teams use them in like lead generation campaigns. I just had a client who did a series of banner ads, you know, online and that were running all over the web. And then that when someone clicked on that, it would go to the case study. It was like a teaser that would then go to the case study. You can hand them out at trade shows, you can pitch them to the media to try to get stories. You can use them to like help craft press release. Really there's just a ton of ways to use them to really leverage that investment in one document. There's a lot you can do with it from there. I also see clients using written case studies to help them prepare to create video case studies with a customer. So they're gathering all the background information to help them then conduct a video interview. So pretty, pretty versatile.

So are you seeing. Well, first of all, so just to kind of recap, these are basically success stories about how you're, in your case, your clients, customers have used their product or services to achieve some sort of result. You're really telling their story, your client's customer story, as it relates to the product they use and what they got out of it. And you're implying that in most cases these are actually written, not necessarily video.

Yeah, it's about, you know, most people are still writing them. I mean, a lot of companies are getting into video, but video is pretty expensive. So you know, companies with bigger budgets tend to do video. But you know, the surveys that are out there indicate that buyers actually prefer written because they can skim it. You know, they can like read it at their own pace versus with video. It's like the pace it is. You know, you can't skim a video very easily. So and then the search engine optimization is, you know, really great with having like keywords in a written case study. So.

Okay, okay. So in terms of the written one, what's the typical length of these pieces?

Typical length? I mean, average is two pages. I see companies Doing anywhere from like one page to four pages, you know, and that's, that's kind of the finished piece when it's laid out. But really, you know, the longer stories tend to. If it's, if it's going to four pages, like, I just did a four page one, but it has a lot of graphics as well in it to break it up. So, you know, four pages doesn't necessarily scale the same. It's not, you know, twice as much text as two pages, usually.

Okay. And from. So from a writer standpoint, if you're looking at word count, two pages, are we talking about maybe, you know, about 800 to 1200 words or, you know, what word count was?

Yeah, yeah. It depends on, you know, how strict clients are in wanting to keep it onto, like, front and back versus going over. Like, a lot of my clients don't care anymore because it's mostly consumed on the Web. If it gets to be about 1,000 words, it's going to spill onto probably a third page. I'd probably say maybe 400 words a page in a word doc to translate to the designed page.

Gotcha.

Usually, yeah.

All right, so let's talk about. Well, I'm actually curious about one thing, because this is what you do for a living, right? You do 100% case studies.

I do.

Why do you think they continue to be so popular? Because they've been around for a long time, but it seems like customers and prospects can't get enough of case studies when they're in the process of buying something.

Yeah, I mean, there's still, you know, nothing as credible or powerful as someone else's experience. You know, I mean, and we, we do this all the time. I mean, when you're trying to decide what movie to see or, you know, restaurant to go to, you know, you're. You're looking at, like, newspaper reviews. You're talking to friends and family. I was calling references this week for babysitters. You know, you really have a much greater comfort level when you get someone else's firsthand experience. And today we're accustomed to that. On Amazon, we look at reviews before we buy something. So if I'm a business person considering spending thousands or hundreds of thousands on something, I really want to know that it's going to pay off. A case study is that I say it's the proof that you're delivering on your marketing promises, because companies make a lot of marketing promises that they'll do this or that, but companies really want to know, are you delivering on that? And that's what a case study does.

Yeah, I agree with you. It seems like a white paper can do a very good job of building the case for that particular product or service. But there comes a point when the prospect really wants to hear how this product or service has helped others achieve a result. Right. I mean, there's always that need and it's, it's somewhat subjective when you think about it. Right. Because, you know, it's, it's, it's a story and it's not, sometimes it's sloppy and it's not perfect, but it seems like that's what people want to read. They want to read somebody else's true story, right?

Exactly. Exactly. And it, you know, it is a little bit different than an unbiased review. You know, they are vendor produced, you know, so, so it is showing the positive side of the story. But I think if you've got, you know, strong facts in there, you know, you're showing, you know, what the relationship looks like, you know, how someone's using a product or service and then the results, you know, if you stick to the facts, then, you know, buyers really do believe it and it's powerful.

Now, do you think they'll continue to be popular or do you think this is kind of a dying trend because people are moving into different, other types of collateral?

You know, I really don't see case studies losing any momentum at all. I mean, I'm not seeing that happen. What is changing is the forms that they take. I think, you know, a lot of organizations are realizing that buyers want, you know, content in a lot of different formats. You know, some will read a full case study, like if it's, you know, a technical product. Some of those tech decision makers, they really want all the details, whereas a business decision maker would say, hey, just show me a PowerPoint summary, just like a one slide summary of the story so that I can get the basics. And then some like video and some don't like video. So companies are trying to account for that by creating multiple formats for their case studies. You know, most of my clients don't have, now don't have just one version of a case study. They may, you know, have a long version and then they may have a summarized version in a PowerPoint slide. So it's, it's, it's different, but I think it's a new opportunity for writers because you can say, I can not only deliver the written version, but I can give you, you know, a couple of other formats that you can use.

Oh, I like that as well. I like that. So, yeah, but. But still, the basic project, the basic written case study project is where you usually start. And then from there, it sounds like you can offer some other formats, which helps everybody.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, if a writer, you know, writes press releases, I mean, a lot of my clients, you know, they get the case study, and then they immediately turn it into a press release, just change the format a little bit, and then they release it on the wire. So you can offer this as a package to clients to say, you know, I'll give you the written case study, then I'll do a press release for you and a power, you know, one slide summary or something.

Yeah, I love that. I love that. It. Well, you know, it's your. Increase your. Your revenue there, and you're helping the client as well, giving them some ideas.

Definitely. Yeah.

All right, so let's talk a little bit about, then, the case study itself. And specifically, because I know these pieces are very formulaic, which is.

Which.

Which is one thing I love about them. Let's talk about the main components of a typical case study and the sequence of a typical case study.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, they are formulaic, and a lot of that is because it's a story. And there's like a typical story flow. Just about any story that you. Fiction, nonfiction, whatever, a compelling story kind of takes you through a certain process. So, you know, who is the customer or the main character? What problems or challenges or obstacles are they facing? How do they overcome them? And then what's the outcome? So, yeah, so that's the basic flow. And so what that means is you introduce who the future customer or main character is. It's a Fortune 500 company that, you know, makes these. This type of widgets. You describe, you know, what they were trying to accomplish. And then as part of the solution, it's important to include, you know, why they chose the solution, and then talk about what it looks like in their environment and then the outcome. Yeah, but I want to point out that just because, you know, there is a certain flow, it doesn't mean that you're like, your subheads have to be challenge solution results. If you see case studies out there, they're starting to be a little bit more featurey, where the subheads are descriptive, which is nice, because that allows readers to skim it and kind of glean some of the story from those subheads. Whereas if it just says challenge, they don't know, you know, they have to really read into it.

Yeah, it's a little more engaging, too. I've seen that too. When I started writing these, my subheads were I was very, very black and white. So background challenges, solution results.

Exactly.

I've gone more to a feature story type format where it's. There's an engaging title and then I go right into the story and right in. You know, in the first couple paragraphs, I introduce the main character essentially. But I want to draw the reader in and keep them engaged. And I find that feature story tends to work a little better.

Yeah, absolutely. I agree. Sometimes you may walk into a situation where your client, this is the format they have, and you can recommend that they move to a more feature format, but they may want to stick with what they have. You do the best you can. But if you do have the opportunity to recommend a format, then I definitely recommend the feature format.

That's a good point. When you engage with a client, you need to ask, is there a certain format? That's an important question before you start writing.

Yeah. You want to either fit to their format or they may say, hey, we've been using the same format forever. We're really open to something new. If you can recommend something, that's always a nice opportunity for writers to kind of, you know, bring, bring their, you know, expertise and recommend a different format.

Okay. Okay. So let's talk about the opportunity for business writers. What industries? Because I get asked this all the time. People think, oh, yeah, but you know, you write for technology. You know, I'm not interested in high tech. What other industries aside from technology? Publish case studies.

So I think business services organizations are like a great niche for that. You know, anyone that's providing like services to other businesses, like, you know, consulting services, I've done them over the years for like big consulting companies or like one person consulting companies that, you know, are going in to, you know, help a business accomplish something. So, you know, I mean, I think, you know, tech is probably number one just because they're selling something expensive and complex and they're trying to, you know, validate it and help people understand it. But business services would be like right there a close second where there's a lot of opportunity. But you don't have to, you know, really understand technology, you know, but there are a lot, I mean, really, nearly any organization can do them. Non profits, honestly should be doing more of them to tell their stories about how they are benefiting, you know, their, whoever they're serving. You know, just, I mean, mom and pop businesses, graphic designers, printers. I mean, there's, you know, just about anybody can benefit from telling Customer success stories.

I agree. And you know, I've been finding that today you can copy technology, you can copy somebody else's product, but what you can't copy is how they've helped their customers succeed. I think, I think we've come to an age where your stories are the only thing that truly makes you different in the long run. So I think I agree with you. Every company needs them because it's the one thing that's going to differentiate them.

Yeah, I love, I love that your stories are the only thing that really makes you different. Yeah. You know, what is the experience? Because, and especially with consultants, because if you read a consultant's website, you're trying to like pick a coach, like a business coach or something. I mean, they all sound the same and they all make the same promises. So what, what is really what differentiates them and what is the experience of working with them? And that's where customer story can really make a difference.

Yeah, you can explain it there much better than a webpage or a brochure.

Absolutely. Yeah.

So in terms of the fee ranges, I mean, as a business writer, how much can you charge for a case study?

They pay very well. I like to say it depends on the length and your level of experience, but probably anywhere from like 500 to $1,000 per page.

Okay.

You know, so like a two page or like a one pager is going to be, you know, like maybe. Yeah, 500. Exactly. 500 or 1,000. A two pager is probably going to not necessarily scale exactly evenly, maybe like 1500. And you know, it just, it kind of depends on the organization. Smaller companies, you know, don't always have the budget for, for that. The larger organizations do. So I think, you know, when you're just getting started, you kind of, you know, you get your feet wet, maybe make a little bit less, but then you build over time to where you're able to charge higher. You know, I have seen, you know, case studies pay up to 4,000 bucks.

Oh, wow.

So yeah, with larger companies. But I do find it's a really good payoff for the time spent. For example, if I'm charging 1,500 for a two page case study, it really only takes me maybe seven or eight hours total, which is really impressive hourly payout there. And that includes the interviews, the writing, and usually kind of, you know, the edits and managing the approval process. So. And it gets better over time. As you get more experience, you get faster.

Yeah, I found that when I work, I like work long term with clients because As I do more case studies for them, I find that, you know, I can write them a lot faster. So the first one might take me 10 hours, but, you know, after two or three of them, I agree with you. I average about seven, eight hours. And, man, I tell you what, for the same fee.

Right, exactly.

So my internal hourly rate goes way up.

Right, right. And, you know. And you want to be. And I'm sure, you know, you probably recommend this as well, flat rates, because then, you know, the faster you are, the more money you make for your time.

Yeah. So quote, unquote, fixed fees instead of hourly. And I agree, because especially in a lot of people I found who are really good case study writers are journalists. And I think journalists have a really hard time. If you quote it, as a journalist, what you're gonna make on this, first of all, you're not gonna have the confidence to do it. I wouldn't have the confidence to say, listen, yeah, $250 an hour. So there's that. Plus I don't know of a client who will say, okay, that sounds about right. So you can actually make two, three hundred dollars an hour, but you're not going to do it if you quote hourly.

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Because, you know, they're not expecting to pay, like, law firm fees for, you know, writing necessarily.

So. Yeah, that's. That's between us, you know, like.

Exactly.

They don't need to know our little secret.

Right. Yeah, exactly.

And, you know, at the end of the day, I mean, it's. I say secret, but really what they want is a great quality product. Right. And, you know, for a fee, that seems reason.

Absolutely. Yeah.

And so, yeah, I mean, it sounds like you could really make a really good living. Because even though. Even though, let's say, $1,000 or $1,500 may not sound like much, I mean, do you find that with a, you know, large enough client, you could write a couple of these a month?

Oh, yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I have, you know, in ranges, I have clients that do, like, one a quarter, and I have clients that do two or three a month. So, you know, ideally, you just kind of, you know, you have a diverse client base where, you know, people are just kind of. They're regularly coming to you, and. Yeah. And it really starts to pay off. And you can probably do, you know, depending on the length, you can do several a week. It's kind of nice. I may have, you know, a couple of one pagers and then a long one, you know, each week. And so it Adds up.

Yeah.

Pretty good.

So basically you're saying you can make a pretty good living just writing case studies, right?

Yeah, yeah, definitely. You know, a lot of letter writers don't want, you know, to just write case studies, but, you know, you can. You can do well just writing case studies. It can take a little bit of time to build the niche, you know, and I certainly didn't switch overnight to say, okay, you know, hang my shingle up and say, you know, I'm just doing case studies today. It was a process of, you know, continuing to write, you know, brochures and web copy and all that, and over time, it became 100% case studies.

Gotcha. You just found that you really enjoyed them and you wanted to do more of it.

Exactly. Yeah.

Okay, so maybe if you could give us really quick a kind of a. A basic idea of what your workflow is like when you're approaching these projects. So, like, what happens first, what typically happens second and so forth, just to kind of give people who've never written one an idea of what they can expect.

Okay. Yeah. So what I recommend before you ever start an actual case study project featuring a happy customer, is to really do your homework on your clients. And that means that. And I've seen this make a big difference. Makes a big difference in my confidence level and my client's confidence level in moving ahead with me. I really study the products and services, and I charge a fee for that.

So that's a separate fee?

Yeah, it's a separate fee, and I don't make it too high because I don't want it to be prohibitive, but I charge some so that everybody takes it seriously. So that when I say I'd like to talk to a product manager or I'd want somebody to give me a demo that they're like, okay, we're paying for this. We need to really educate her on our products and services.

Gotcha. Do you mind sharing the range of what you would charge for that, or what do you think is reasonable?

I mean, usually around 300 for one major product line. If a company's got gobs of product lines, you know, I may, you know, break it up and say, okay, we're going to start with one product line, and then, you know, maybe each subsequent one is not quite as much because they're all kind of similar. You know what I mean? So you just kind of have to base it on what the company wants you to write about.

Yeah. Oh, I like that for a couple reasons. One, like you said, they'll take You a little more seriously and the time more seriously. And also because they might be a little price sensitive on the case study itself. So, you know, that way you can leave that at kind of a fee that seems standard, but then you're not adding it to it, you're taking it away and making a separate thing, right?

Yeah, yeah, it's a one, you know, I just call it a one time investment that will help me, you know, ask better questions and write better case studies. And as part of that ramp up fee, I create the interview question. So I create like a standard set of interview questions. And I'll mention it's not just about learning the products and services, but also really exploring with my client what their marketing goals and messaging is so that I know what they want to get in their case studies. They'll tell me like, okay, if we create the ideal case study, it should have these key messages in it and just, you know, kind of exploring, you know, from a marketing perspective. So that's kind of how the foundation for how I start out with a client and then from there it's, it's a set process. My clients, you know, bring me a happy customer, say, you know, this customer's ready to go, and I ask that they pre qualify the customer because it's, you know, it's their customer. And ideally they're leveraging their own relationships with that customer to ask. Because if I go in and say, hey, would you want to be featured? They don't know who I am yet. They don't have a relationship with me. That's usually where I begin. Once they've got a customer that's willing and able, then I take it from there. I reach out and I usually do background interviews with someone at my client company.

Okay.

To get, you know, so I go into the customer interview knowing as much as I can ahead of time and I can kind of, you know, focus my questions. And then, and then I reach out to the customer and schedule interviews and they're all over the phone. I mean, I've done probably 700 case studies and maybe five of the interviews were ever in person. Person.

Oh, wow.

Yeah, so it's a great, it's really great for working virtually because.

Yeah, go ahead and did you say, did you do the interview just yourself with their customer or is there somebody else involved?

It depends. I have clients who like to be involved. You know, perhaps it's a PR manager and they're also planning on doing some PR outreach. And so they want to be involved, they want to get to Know the customer and also hear the story. I have other clients that are just like, here's the contact info. Run with it and just send me the draft when you have it. So I really let my client decide that. Sometimes there are a lot of people on a call, sometimes more than I would like. Maybe my client has a partner that was involved.

But you're the one asking the questions, though. Even in those scenarios, I usually am. Okay.

Yeah, yeah.

Which is good.

Yeah, exactly. Because as the writer, you. You kind of need to control what information you're gathering.

Yeah. Okay, so then after that you go ahead and what's your next step? Do you kind of go and put together an outline or do you go straight to a draft?

Yeah, usually I go straight to a draft. If I have any questions after the interview, like, they told me this and that and what do you want me to focus on, the angle? Sometimes I may go back to my client, but usually I just dive right into the draft and then deliver it to my marketing contact first so they take a look at it and give it their blessing from their perspective. And then I usually am managing the review and approval with the customer as well.

Oh, okay.

Yeah. A lot of my clients really like that because then they're not relaying edits to me like third party. It's like the edits come directly back to me and I make them so that what I'm giving my client is the approved SO story. Yeah, not all my clients do, but it's kind of a valuable thing that a lot of marketing people just appreciate.

Yeah, no, I can see that. I can see that. That's a great idea. I actually don't do that, so I may need to change my process.

Yeah, I mean, it's up to you. You don't have to, but it is kind of another way to, to be full service. And like I said, some will take it and some will leave it.

Now what happens, Casey, if you had that initial call with your client to kind of get an idea of how you're going to focus the story, but then during the interview, some really neat points came up that could change some of that. Before you go into draft, do you have a conversation with a client to say, hey, listen, I know we said we're going to go with this angle, but I'm seeing something a lot more powerful here.

Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I do.

And you get their, their buy in or approval before you start writing, Right?

Exactly. You know, because I mean, you can try to make it fit into your clients kind of little box Sometimes, but ultimately it's. The story is what it is. So. Yeah. And, you know, occasionally this doesn't happen very often, but occasionally, you know, the story that comes out is, like, not at all what they, you know, expected or. And sometimes it's a good thing, and sometimes it's a bad thing. So, yeah, you know, so just close collaboration with your. With your clients is good, and they really appreciate you saying, you know, this is what I heard. What direction do you want to go?

Okay. Okay. So. And so you handle revisions, and you're basically submitting. Submitting a Word document. You're not doing any design or anything like that.

I don't. I occasionally coordinate design for clients if they don't have a designer. But most of my clients have a designer that, you know, does the rest of their stuff, and they want everything to look consistent.

Okay, all right, so let's switch to going back to kind of like, writers who are thinking about doing this, and, you know, what should they think about and what should they consider in terms of. Well, first of all, the demand itself. Do you find that a lot of marketers really struggle to find a good case study writer?

I do, honestly, because it's a specific type of writing. It is more of like a journalism style. So just like any other special form of copywriting, like writing web copy, you just kind of need to know, like, how to write a case study, you know, how to structure it and what questions to ask and that kind of thing. But I think it's something pretty easy, I mean, for, you know, if you're a freelance writer writing other things, it's just a matter of, you know, learning to write in a specific way, you know, But I think there just aren't enough case study writers out there that have really, you know, learned to do that. And then the interviewing is another thing, you know, just learning how to ask, you know, how to create a questionnaire that's going to drive the information that's the most compelling, you know, but that's also something that can be easily learned as well.

Well, this all points to one type of writer specifically. I'd say journalists. I've always thought this is a great opportunity for journalists who are looking for work.

Yeah, absolutely. It is. Journalists, I mean, especially. Yeah, business journalists, they can. They can crank something out really fast. They're accustomed to interviewing. They know how to quote people. Yeah, definitely. That was my background, actually, was journalism.

Oh, okay. Okay.

Kind of why I embraced the case study format.

So if this sounds really interesting to me, but I have zero case Study samples. You know, you kind of get into that chicken and egg scenario, right? How do you get started?

Yeah, that's super common. You know, the first thing I ask is, do you have any friends, family, you know, former employers or co workers that are in businesses that may need to tell customer success stories? Because if you really start, you know, looking around and talking to the people that you already know, chances are you're to going to find somebody that says, hey, like we could really use that, you know, just a small business because you got, you have to get started somewhere. So, you know, tell everybody, you know that you, you know, you're looking to get into case studies and you may need to educate them a little bit about what they are, you know, you may call them customer success stories because not everybody understands what case study means. And if you have to do, do the first one for free or for cheap just to get something in your portfolio, sure, yeah, that's what I recommend. And then you build from there. But yeah, it's, you know, or a non profit. I mean, that's another great opportunity is if you're, you know, you know, of a nonprofit that, you know, maybe, you know, has served your family or that you are familiar with in your community, reach out to them because they, you know, they're hungry for marketing, writing or they all need to tell their stories.

That's a great idea. And by the way, I found that with, you know, you say, yeah, but I don't want it, you know, non profits. I want to go into the business sector. But you know, tell me if you agree. I find that the key thing is showing prospective clients that you can tell a story, a computer story.

Right.

And not so much. Oh yeah, but this is not in our industry.

Right, exactly. Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, I rarely run into companies that are super hung up about, you know. Oh, you don't have samples from our industry. Exactly, you know.

Yeah.

And I think, you know, it's about kind of educating clients to say, you know, I'm a writer, it's my job to like learn about your business quickly and be able to write about it. I think most of them are satisfied with that answer.

Yeah, I agree. I agree. I think marketers understand that especially. So you wrote a book. And it's a book that I recommend. Everyone who asks me about case studies, tell us about it, where people can find it, because it's excellent.

Casey, thanks a lot. I really appreciate that. Yeah, the book, stories that Sell, it's on creating, managing and using customer stories. And I brought my Experience. But I also went out and really found a lot of organizations that are doing case studies. Well, not just the writing, but kind of how they approach their customers and manage the process. It's written for businesses and writers as well. And I think that's important for. For writers to kind of understand, you know, the broader context of, you know, okay, you know, first of all, the client needs to, you know, find customers that will agree. And then there's, you know, approval and permission, you know, so there's aspects to case studies that are different from writing a brochure that'll kind of. That writers need to know about. So. And that also makes you more valuable to your clients to be able to. To understand that whole process and how you fit in as a writer and add value.

Well, especially when you're getting started and if you're going to do it the way you said, where you're approaching, maybe friends, relatives and so forth. Right. And maybe they're not used to marketing with case studies. This will give you some really good ideas for helping them through that process. Hey, you know, I'm going to write it, but let me show you how you can actually provide. Promote this and use it.

Definitely. Definitely. There's a lot of education, especially for a company that's never done that before, to say, hey, you can use them way more than just posting on your website. You can do all these different things with them. It's a real opportunity. For example, I talked to a company yesterday that has never done case studies before, and they have no idea. Yeah. Really, how to get started. And so if you can go in and say, all right, so the first thing we need to do is we need to, you know, like, who's your, you know, who's your audience? We need. And we need to create a list of interview questions if you can kind of walk them through it. It's huge for a marketing manager to kind of take all the, you know, to answer all those questions for them about how to even get going with case studies.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'll make sure to include a link to the book in the show notes. For those of you guys who are interested, I highly recommend that it really belongs in your bookshelf if you're thinking about writing case studies or if you write case studies today. And Casey, you also have a newsletter, a free newsletter out there. Where can people learn more about that?

Yeah, if you go to my website, stories that sellguide.com right on the homepage, kind of the bottom left, there's a, A little box where it's called the tip of the month or the E. Tip of the month. You can just put your email in there and then you'll get a tip of the month related to case studies.

Awesome. Awesome. Yeah, it's good stuff. It's good stuff. So I'll make sure to include a link to that as well in the show notes. And Casey, any parting thoughts or advice before we leave?

Yeah, just that, you know, don't be daunted by case studies. It's really just storytelling. It's, you know, having a conversation with people, gathering information and then writing it up. It's. I think the term case study tends to make it sound like it's this, you know, big sort of, I don't know, technical project or something. But really it's just about storytelling. And I think it's, it's a great addition to a marketer's repertoire.

I couldn't agree more. And Casey, this has been very educational. I appreciate you spending your time with us today. Thanks for coming on the show.

Thanks so much, Ed. It was great. I'd love to talk about case studies.

Well, folks, I hope you enjoyed that interview. And if you don't currently write case studies, I hope this got you thinking about the opportunity in that market. I've written dozens of case studies myself and I can tell you these pieces are a lot of fun to write and they're very profitable once you get the hang of it. As Casey said, it's not uncommon to get $1,500 for a standard 2 page case study and only spend 7 or 8, 8 hours total on that project. That's the kind of work that can quickly propel your internal hourly rate to the $200 an hour or greater level. So all the show notes for this episode can be found by going to b2b launcher.com episode 4 so if you're listening to this in your car, at the gym or somewhere else, just know that we're going to have a summary of what we just discussed here, including all the links that we referenced. A few quick announcements before we sign off. So we're about to close enrollment to our most popular program, Warm email prospecting. This is going to be the last time I offer this program for at least another year. So if you're looking for a faster and easier way to land quality clients, make sure to check it out today before we close enrollment at midnight. Now, a lot of you are going to be listening to this after we close. You can still get on the early notification list for that program and I encourage you to do that when you go to that link I just gave you, that URL will be here on that page page when we open up enrollment again. You'll be the first to know if you enjoyed this episode. I would be very grateful if you could share it with your friends. And the easiest way to do that is just to go to b2b launcher.com love when you do that. The system will pre populate a tweet for you on Twitter, which makes sharing the podcast a lot easier. Also, I would be very grateful if you gave the show a quick rating or review on itunes. And the easiest way to do that is just to go to b2b launcher.com iTunes. You'll have to log into your itunes account once you're on that page. There's a big blue button there to do that, but this is the fastest way to get to the show on itunes. So this brings us to the end of the episode. I am your host, Ed Gandia. Thanks for listening and I hope you have an awesome day.

The High Income Business Writing Podcast is a Production of B to B business launcher. Learn more at b2b launcher.com.