#110: Tanya Brody on Losing Her Day Job and Starting a Freelance Business from Scratch

Welcome to the High Income Business Writing Podcast, helping you propel your writing business to a whole new level. And now, here's your host, Ed Gandia. Hey there. Thank you for joining me for episode 110 of the High Income Business Writing Podcast. My name is Ed Gandia and this is the podcast for business writers and copywriters who want to take their writing businesses to the six figure level or the part time equivalent. As a quick reminder, you can find detailed show notes to this episode by going to b2b launcher.com episode110 so if you have a day job right now, I'm curious. What if you were to walk into work today and you lost your job, you got downsized, you got laid off, and here you are driving home, trying to figure out, you know, I am a writer, I'm a copywriter. I've been thinking about doing this. Maybe I've been doing it on the side. Should I go ahead and officially launch my freelance business? Should I go all out here or should I look for another job? What would you do now? Would you use this as an opportunity to go ahead and double down, or would you play it safe? Would you get another job and keep doing what you're doing? There's really no right or wrong answer here, so that's not a trick question, but this is exactly what happened to Tanya Brody a few months ago. So Tanya has been a copywriter for several years, but until recently, she was traditionally employed as a copywriter. She wasn't a freelancer. So typically when we have guests on the show who are writers or copywriters, they are freelancers who are not traditionally employed. But that's not the case with Tanya. She had been working. She had worked for a couple of companies and her day job was a copywriter. And in today's episode, she explains how she got started as a copywriter, why she decided to work for someone else instead of go the freelance route, why she chose the solopath when she found herself without a job unexpectedly, and what she's learned so far from her freelance journey. This is a very interesting conversation, a little different from what we typically have here in terms of stories from the field. I think you're really going to enjoy this one. So here it is, my conversation with copywriter Tanya Brody. Enjoy. Hey, Tanya, it's so great to be talking with you again.

Yeah, it's great to talk to you too, Ed. Thanks very much for having me on here.

I'm glad you agreed to come on. I can't wait to learn more about what you're doing in your story. And before we get to that though, I always ask my guests to just share a little bit about themselves in terms of today, at least today, the work that you do, the kind of clients that you like to work with, where you live, that sort of thing.

Okay, sure. Well, a lot of the clients that I'm working with are small businesses. They are either people who are just starting up or, you know, they're what you refer to as like the mom and pop shop, you know, so they're, they're just, you know, folks who are just, they're just doing their thing out there in the world. You know, I, sure, I do work with some, a few larger companies, but the majority of the folks that I work with are, you know, solopreneurs or, you know, like maybe five, six employees. Not huge. And I kind of like that space partially because it means I'm always dealing with the owner. I am talking to the, you know, yeah, there's the person, that person right there who I can say, okay, is this what you want? And they can say yes or no. As opposed to having to go through several layers of people to get an answer, which just takes a lot of time. And then the other thing is I just enjoy helping people grow. Really enjoy being able to say, okay, have you thought about this? Alright, have you done this for your marketing yet? You know, I like being able to help people. So I, you know, right now that's sort of my sweet spot. I imagine that'll change. But you know, I really, I really do enjoy that. And a lot of what I do is lead generation. You know, obviously I do the full conversion cycle, so lead generation to sales. But you know, I, I'm good at getting people in the door, so I have a lot of fun with that too.

So. And that's a great group for that too. Because small businesses, if anyone needs that kind of help, right, it's gonna be the small businesses.

Yeah, they're the ones looking for customers. They're the ones like, how do I get people in the door? How do I get people to pay attention to whatever it is that I'm doing? So, and it's a lot of fun and you know, you get to, they're usually more willing to be creative than, you know, say a large corporation, because large corporations have their thing and they've been doing it for years, whereas smaller businesses are like, yeah, you know, let's try that. That's probably a really good idea. So it gives me a little bit more flexibility in what I get to do, to help promote them, which is also really nice.

Now, is there any kind of pattern in terms of the actual companies you work with, the businesses you work with, or their industries and the types of products and services they provide?

Kind of all over the place there right now. They're, they're kind of all over the place. I do some B2B. I do some B2C. Honestly, I have worked with literally everything from like one person in an office somewhere to, you know, a full, a fully fledged, you know, small corporation. So it's, it is sort of all, all over there. But that's one of the nice things about doing lead generation is everybody needs it. So. And I, I have to admit I kind of enjoy it because I get to work on so many different things. You know, I, I really do. I have to admit, you know, I'm one of these people who instead of focusing on a niche is focusing on a technique. I'm focusing on the lead generation and conversion aspect as opposed to focusing on just one industry. So, you know, eventually I may work my way into an industry, but I kind of like being able to, you know, do all sorts of different things. It's. I'm enjoying it right now and we'll see where it goes. But you know, it's part of the creative process is getting to stretch your mind. So whether, you know, I'm wrapping my head around a green product or I'm wrapping my head around an info product, doesn't matter. I have a good time doing all of it. So what can I say? I like the creative aspect.

I think the whole industry thing is overblown. I think it's not so much overblown, but I think it's what most people understand as being niching or specializing or targeting that is only. It's like saying vanilla ice cream when. No, I mean, there's all kinds of dessert.

Right.

So I think it's very smart that you've decided to focus on a service specialty, if you will, or a segment of the marketing process rather than an industry. I think it's got to make sense for you. But I'd never believe that, you know, it's, it's got to be an industry. There are many different ways to slice and dice that.

Exactly.

So let's take a step back a little bit because I know we've kind of corresponded for a long time. How did you get started copywriting?

Well, it's sort of an interesting story. I. Before I was a copywriter, I was a full time touring musician and I actually traveled around the country playing in a Celtic band. And while doing that, I did all of our booking and all of our marketing and all of our press releases and all of that stuff. So really, when you look at it, that's how I got started is in, you know, in terms of the actual copywriting part. Then the band broke up. It happens. It's part of every cycle. And I was looking at, okay, what is it that I can actually do to make a living again? Because, you know, when you go from touring full time to suddenly screeching to a halt and going, okay, now I have to land somewhere, it's like, okay, what are my skills? What can I do? I write. I write well, I have a degree in writing. Even I have a degree in creative writing and theater. So I found out about this thing called International Freelancers Day. And ironically enough, I actually spent, I think, like one or two days listening to you and Steve and all of those wonderful people you brought in to do all of those different webinars. And I just was glued to my computer screen all day. I was fascinated. I had such a good time listening to that stuff. And it really helped me think about, okay, so if I'm gonna do this, this is how I need to do it as a freelancer for this particular situation. Because again, before being a musician, I'd actually been a full time freelance costumer. So I knew the freelance part of it all. But this is a different industry. So as I was looking at all of this stuff, of course ads for American writers and artists popped up because they were one of your sponsors. And I took a look at that. I'm like, copywriting, I could do that. I could totally write a letter like that. Because anyone who's seen that ad, can you write a letter like this. I went through their entire thing. I'm like, yep, I could actually do that. But you know, when you. You don't know something, you've never heard of it before, you want some verification. So, as I recall, I actually sent you an email and you were kind enough to not only email me back, but say, hey, you know what? Why don't you give me a call? And I did. And we set up a time to talk. And you were very complimentary about awai and you recommended them highly. And so, of course, I took their six figure copywriting course, and I went on to become a Circle of Success member. And I have learned so much from their courses that I did not necessarily know about marketing and sales, which has really helped. And then the fact That I had the background in creative writing has really added to what it is that I do. So I think, really, I always appreciate. Has really added to what it is that I do. So I think, really, I always appreciate and will always credit you, Ed, with getting me started in copywriting. And I really do appreciate that you were willing to take the time to talk to a total stranger and say, no, no, really, these folks are good.

Yeah. No, and I appreciate that. I remember. You know, it's funny. I actually came across your email the other day. I have this massive email archive, and when we scheduled this interview, so I forget I was searching for an email from you or to see what I had asked you or any. And I came across that. Emails, like, 2011, 2010.

It was. It was crazy.

It was a long time ago. So a couple of notes, just so people understand, this is not a commercial for Ed Gandia or for Awai. This is like, you know, this is your.

Your.

Your story.

This is my actual story. Yes.

Yes. And then the other thing I would mention, too, is. And I'm glad we connected. It's funny because over the years, like, those requests have accelerated and I can't talk to everybody. I can't respond to everyone personally. But there's a beautiful saying out there. I forget who said it. I would love to give them credit. Do for some what you wish you could do for many. So every once in a while, I'll feel compelled to just respond to somebody personally or hop on the phone with them. And I think even then it was just maybe. I don't know, it's something I saw in your note or whatever. I said, let's just talk. So that wasn't. I couldn't remember. That was your first exposure then to copywriting was when you came across International Freelancers Day, the online conference.

Well, certainly as something that I could do full time as a living, obviously I had been doing it because I'd done it for myself, but, you know, I was like, oh, you didn't know.

That'S what it was. Yes. You didn't know that, like, you could actually get paid for it.

There's like a whole industry out here of people who do that. That's so cool.

Yes. You know what? You're not the only one I was doing that. I've come across quite a few people who said, wow, I've been doing this in my job. I didn't know you could get paid for it.

Yeah. And even more, it's like, I don't have to have a master's degree or an MBA to do this. Really? That's fabulous. Because, honestly, that had been my thought was, oh, I'm gonna have to go back to school to learn a whole new trade. And I didn't really want to. I wanted to be able to start up something right away. And the great thing about the AWAI course was it was something I could get through quickly and easily and go, all right, I sort of know what I'm doing now.

Yeah.

And, you know, and it gave me a foundation to build on, and that helped lot.

So tell me about what you did with it. Because you needed to work quickly, right. You're suddenly out of a job. You don't have the gig anymore with the band. You're educating yourself, but you need to generate an income. So how did you do that?

Well, the interesting thing was I ended up answering a request from a recruiter online looking for copywriters in Minneapolis. I'm like, I'm a copywriter in Minneapolis. He's like, great. And he said, what do you know about the law? And I said, I just went through a divorce. Does that count? And he said, well, yeah, that's good. I mean, but, you know, like, the real basics of law. I'm like, yeah. He said, wonderful. There's a firm in your area that does lawyer marketing. I'm going to see, and they're looking for copywriters. I'm going to see if we can get you in there. I said, that sounds great. So I ended up going to this company, and I worked there for about three and a half years. And what I did was I wrote website content for lawyers. And everything that I learned from my, you know, from the copywriting course helped me there immensely. And, in fact, I think it actually made my copy better for the lawyers, because lawyers think that everyone wants to be impressed by the law. But you and I and everyone listening to this cop, this podcast know that no, Anyone who's looking at a lawyer's website is looking for help. They want to know that the lawyer knows the law. They don't want to know anything about the law. They want their problem solved. So I think I probably actually did better by my clients in taking that tack than, you know, having any of them go, no, you need to be writing this. It's like, I would explain this to them, and several of them would say, oh, no, you're right. All right. No, let's do it your way. And we'd end up with a blend somewhere in the middle, which was fine, you know? And I think a Lot of them actually probably got more clients because of that.

And that is so cool that you're able to immediately apply what you had learned because you kind of went this is not the typical path, right? You were able to go straight from educating yourself to sendly. Were you an employee to begin with?

I was contractor, but they hired me after about five months. So then I had a full time job doing honestly something I love, I love writing every single day, you know, whatever I'm writing about. Even when I was writing car accident page after car accident page, which I did a lot, I loved being able to write every day. So I cannot say how, how was that I got that lucky that I was able to find a job fairly quickly in the industry that I had chosen.

So I'm curious because you've had quite a few years working as a copywriter, but as an employee, not as a freelancer. So I'm going to ask you some questions about your experience as a freelancer. But I'm curious what you found are the biggest pros and cons of doing this as an employee full time as opposed to on your own.

Depending on the company you work for, of course, the bureaucracy. There were, you know, in the immediate, there were several situations in which, you know, the client who had hired the company that I was working for had very firm opinions about what should be on their website and I was not allowed to challenge them. I was not allowed to say, okay, you know, I would have to say something along the lines of like, we can do this for you, but you need to be aware that your results will not be as good. I was not allowed to say that's a really bad idea. So, you know, some of it is dealing with, you know, the company policies. Some of it is, you know, if you want to make a change in the way your company does something and you work for like a major corporation, which I did, this was a smaller division of a major international corporation. I refer to it as turning a mega freighter. It's not that it can't be done, but it is incredibly slow. You have to go through at least five different layers of management to get anyone to listen to you. And you know, half the time they're like, yeah, that's a great idea. And it then gets lost somewhere in committee. And you know, or half the time they go, oh no, we tried that years ago and it didn't work. So they're not willing to try it again. So, you know, you do, you do kind of come up against a lot of things that you know you really want to change because you know it's better for the company as well as for your clients, or because you know you're going to help your fellow employees or whatever it is, and the corporation will be like, no, sorry. So that was always a big frustration for me, partially again, because I'm a creative person and I think out of the box. But I think also you don't get a lot of choice in what you write when you're working for an employer. Because I've worked for a few different employers now as a copywriter, when you're working for one company, you're pretty much dedicated to what that company writes about. Obviously, you have some flexibility in there, depending on what that is. But if your company sells widgets that go spraying, you write about widgets that go spraying.

Yeah.

So, you know, you get very, very focused on whatever it is that you're doing, and you certainly become an expert in widgets that go spraying. But if you want about. Want to write about widgets that go wee, you, you can't do that. So, you know, I find it limiting in terms of the subject matter. So again, that's part of why I kind of like working for myself is I get to choose my clients and get a variety.

Are there any big advantages now that you've seen both sides to working for an employer?

The obvious one is the regular paycheck and the benefits.

Yeah.

You know, I mean it. And obviously the. If you want to go on vacation or you get sick, someone else is there to do the work. Because as I'm sure everyone who has worked for themselves knows, if you aren't there to do the work, the work doesn't get done. But, you know, I think that there's also really something to be said for not working in a vacuum. I love working for myself, but, for instance, I'm part of a mastermind group because I like being able to bounce ideas off of other people. Working in an environment where you're working with other people, you have that chance to say, okay, so what do you guys think about this? You know, or read this for me. Does it read well? Does it make sense to you? And there's really something to be said for being able to collaborate with other people. And honestly, you know, those of us who work from our houses, there's something to be said for being able to see other people on a regular basis. So, you know, it's. Obviously, every choice has its pros and cons. I did very much enjoy working for other companies when I was doing It. But you know, I have to admit, I'm pretty happy with where I am right now.

So let's talk a little bit about that. You had an unexpected change a few months ago that basically forced you to look at the freelance path. So tell us what happened as much as you feel comfortable with and.

What.

Your reaction was maybe when it first happened.

Well, the company that I was working for had to do some restructuring. And when I found out that it was my last day at that company, I was shocked. I mean, like, you know, the full on body, I don't quite realize this is happening shock that you get when you get weird bad news like that. And so, you know, and honestly, I spent like a couple of days dealing with the shock. And I think I even remember looking at my resume and just being petulant and going, I don't want to update my resume. I don't want to do any of this. This is really making me angry. But of course that passed and I did in fact update my resume. And I started looking at other jobs out there and I looked at them and I'm like, this isn't what I want to do. I mean, yes, I want to keep copywriting, but I don't think I really want to work for someone specific. I really think it's time for me to freelance. Because honestly, before I had worked for the company that I ended up getting laid off for, I was ready to go freelance. I had, you know, I was like, okay, it's time to make this change. And I had started working towards that. Then this other company came up with this job and I was like, oh, that's exactly what I want to be doing. That's like, I could learn so much and that would be such a cool company. And okay, I'm going to apply because I can't turn down a job. I've never applied. You don't get a lot of choice in what you write when you're working for an employer. Because I've worked for a few different employers now as a copywriter, when you're working for one company, you're pretty much dedicated to what that company writes about. Obviously you have some flexibility in there, depending on what that is. But if your company sells widgets that go spraying, you write about widgets that go spraying. So, you know, you get very, very focused on whatever it is that you're doing. And you certainly become an expert in widgets that go spraying. But if you want to write about widgets that go wee, you can't do that. So, you know I find it limiting in terms of the subject matter. So again, that's part of why I kind of like working for myself as I get to choose my clients and get a variety.

Are there any big advantages now that you've seen both sides to working for an employer?

The obvious one is the regular paycheck and the benefits. Yeah, you know, I mean it. And obviously the. If you want to go on vacation or you get sick, someone else is there to do the work. Because as I'm sure everyone who has worked for themselves knows, if you aren't there to do the work, the work doesn't get done. But you know, I think that there's also really something to be said for not working in a vacuum. I love working for myself, but for instance, I'm part of a mastermind group because I like being able to bounce ideas off of other people. Working in an environment where you're working with other people, you have that chance to say, okay, so what do you guys think about this? You know, or read this for me, does it read well? Does it make sense to you? And there's really something to be said for being able an environment where you're working with other people, you have that chance to say, okay, so what do you guys think about this? You know, or read this for me, does it read well? Does it make sense to you? And there's really something to be said for being able to collaborate with other people. And honestly, you know, those of us who work from our houses collaborate with other people. And honestly, you know, those of us who work from our houses, there's something to be said for being able to see other people on a regular basis. So, you know, it's obviously every choice has its pros and cons. I did very much enjoy working for other companies when I was doing it. But you know, I have to admit I'm pretty happy with where I am right now.

So let's talk a little bit about that. You had an unexpected change a few months ago that basically forced you to look at the freelance path. So tell us, tell me, tell us what happened as much as you feel comfortable with and what your reaction was maybe when it first happened.

Well, the company that I was working for had to do some restructuring and when I found out that it was my last day at that company, I was shocked. I mean, like, you know, the full on body, I don't quite realize this is happening shock that you get when you get weird bad news like that. And so, you know, and honestly I spent like a couple of Days, dealing with the shock. And I think I even remember looking at my resume and just being petulant and going, I don't want to update my resume. I don't want to do any of this. This is really making me angry. But, of course, that passed, and I did, in fact, update my resume. And there's something to be said for being able to see other people on a regular basis. So I started looking at other jobs out there, and I. I looked at them. Oh, you know, it's. Obviously, every choice has its pros and cons. And I'm like, this isn't what I want to do. I mean, yes, I want to keep copywriting, but I don't think I really want to work for someone specific. I really think it's time for me to freelance. Because, honestly, I did very much enjoy working for. For other companies before. I had worked for the company that I ended up getting laid off for. I was ready to go freelance. I was doing it. But, you know, I have to admit, I'm pretty happy with where I am right now. I had, you know, I was like, okay, it's time to make this change. And I had started working towards that, and then this other company came up with this job, and I was like, oh, that's exactly what I want to be doing. That's like, I could learn so much, and that would be such a cool company. And, okay, I'm gonna apply, and. Because I can't turn down a job I've never applied for, and of course I got the job. So I was like, you know what? I was gonna go freelance before this. I think it's time. So I looked around, and I'm like, okay, what? You know, who do I have in my back pocket, as it were, that I can start with? So I started contacting some of those people, and they're like, yeah, actually, I've got a couple of projects. And then the company that I had been working for, I'd been writing for their blog, so my name was out there, and I had a couple of people who'd read my blog contact me and go, hey, I really like what I read on that blog. Are you taking clients? And I'm like, as a matter of fact, I am. So, you know, it's interesting, and it is sort of a situation where sometimes copywriting jobs fall out of the sky, and sometimes they are hard to scare up for love or money. But, you know, it is sort of a cycle, and you get used to it when you are freelancing. But all of these Things have just started falling into place at the right time. And I keep, you know, every time I look at this and go, have I made the right decision? I'm like, yes, I have totally made the right decision. Things are happening. I am, I am.

So let's talk a little bit about that. You had an unexpected change a few months ago that basically forced you to look at the freelance path. So tell us, tell us what happened as much as you feel comfortable with and what your reaction was maybe when it first happened.

Well, the company that I was working for had to do some restructuring. And when I found out that it was my last day at that company, I was shocked. I mean, like, you know, the full on body, I don't quite realize this is happening shock that you get when you get weird bad news like that. And so, you know, and honestly, I spent like a couple of days dealing with the shock. And I think I even remember looking at my resume just being petulant and going, I don't want to update my resume. I don't want to do any of this. This is really making me angry. But of course that passed and I did in fact update my resume. And I started looking at other jobs out there and I looked at them and I'm like, this isn't what I want to do. I mean, yes, I want to keep copywriting, but I don't think I really want to work for someone specific. I really think it's time for me to freelance. Because honestly, before I had worked for the company that I ended up getting laid off for. I was ready to go freelance. I had, you know, I was like, okay, it's time to make this change. And I had started working towards that. And then this other company came up with this job and I was like, oh, that's exactly what I want to be doing. That's like, I could learn so much and that would be such a cool company. And okay, I'm going to apply and Because I can't turn down a job I've never applied for, and of course I got the job. So I was like, you know what, I was gonna go freelance before this. I think it's time. So I looked around and I'm like, okay, what? You know, who do I have in my back pocket, as it were, that I can start with? So I started contacting some of those people and they're like, yeah, actually I've got a couple of projects. Then the company that I had been working for, I'd been writing for their blog, so my name was out There. And I had a couple of people who'd read my blog contact me and go, hey, I really like what I read on that blog. Are you taking clients? And I'm like, as a matter of fact, I am. So, you know, it's interesting and it is sort of a situation where sometimes copywriting jobs fall out of the sky and sometimes they are hard to scare up for love or money. But, you know, it is sort of a cycle and you get used to it when you are freelancing. But I, all of these things have just started falling into place at the right time. And I keep, you know, every time I look at this and go, have I made the right decision? I'm like, yes, I have totally made the right decision. Things are happening. I am, I am getting work. So obviously I am good enough to be able to get the work. You know, the next trick, of course, in any copywriter's evolution is to make sure that the work is steady. So. But it is, it's really been an interesting adventure and I really, really enjoyed it. And yeah, it was hard and it was scary, but now that I've made the plunge, it's totally worth it.

So a couple follow up questions on that.

Sure.

And first, congratulations for having the courage to do this because I tell you, it's got to be difficult when you have a steady paycheck. Even though you decided before that you wanted to try this, it's still a leap of faith.

It is, it is always a leap of faith. And I think that it's, it's something you really have to be prepared for. And, you know, I was very lucky that the company that laid me off gave me a decent severance package, so I had the cushion, you know, so that, that helps a lot.

But the anxiety is still there because.

You'Re thinking, oh my God, Exactly. It's like, ah, I've had my website up for 10 minutes and no one has responded.

You know, well, so, so I'm curious about two things that you mentioned. One was you said you reached out to your network, which I think is very, very smart, because obviously that, that paid off. I'm curious though about the people who contacted you because they read your book. How did they know that you were now on your own?

I don't think many of them did. I think that some of them were just hoping I was going to take on some freelance work.

Ah, okay.

Yeah. And you know, in a couple of situations, I, you know, I, they were actually. There was a couple of folks who actually contacted me before I had left that company and I had taken on a little bit of freelance work for them. So I was able to go back to them and say, so just so you know, I have a lot more time now. And that was easy because suddenly they had more projects.

Yeah. And what about the people who hadn't contacted you before? When you're reaching out to people in your network, was it a very similar message? A hey, I want to let you know I'm out on my own if I can help you with anything, that kind of thing?

Yeah, exactly. And, you know, there were. There are always people who would be like, I'm putting you on my list. As soon as we have something, you know, I will contact you. And of course, those are the people that you send that casual email to every once in a while. Hey, just checking in. But there's also, you know, the people who are like, I have a project that I need done in the next month. Send me a proposal. So, of course, you know, those are the ones that you want. But it's always worth being on both lists because you know you're going to need work down the road, too.

Yeah. So one of the things that. And this is actually what caused me to reach out to you is the fact that you've been chronicling all this. So you have a blog, and you've been writing about your experience since you went solo, which was. Tell me again, what was your official start?

Four months since I started writing the blog, and I probably started doing the freelance stuff about a month before that. So really, about five months.

So you've been out five months on your own. And I'm curious about a couple of things. First of all, I think it's a great idea, but I'm curious what made you decide to be so transparent about your journey as a new freelancer.

Well, a couple of things. First of all, it was a way to make me be accountable for making sure I was doing some of this stuff. You know, if I had to write about it because I knew people were going to read it because people were interested, that meant that I was actually going to do the stuff, which was good, because there are a lot of steps to starting a new business. And the other part of it was the people who are starting new businesses are the people I want to get as clients. So if they see that, A, I understand what they're doing, what they're going through, and B, they recognize that I'm writing in their space, you know, because not just copywriters read my blog. Lots of people read My blog, people who are starting their own businesses, they're like, yeah, I'm just starting this up in, you know, woodworking or whatever. Those are the people that I want as my clients and those are the people I want to recommend beyond to other folks. So it was partially a marketing strategy and partially a. Alright, Tanya, you actually have to do this strategy. And it's also really good fodder for a blog because I don't know about you, Ed, but if you are writing a blog for your business, coming up with topics can be one of the hardest things in the world. Even though I try really hard to keep an editorial calendar and I try really hard to come up with a list of things to write about, I sit down and I look at that list, I'm like, none of this appeals to me. So, you know, knowing I have something I can write about once a month that is legitimate, you know, sort of really helps me to keep finding those ideas so that people are interested in what I have to write about.

I think it's very smart. It's, you know, it reminds me what you're doing reminds me of. So Alex Bloomberg, who used to be with, I believe it was this American life. Life, yes. So he started the startup podcast and I only listen to season one, but season one was actually real time, almost him starting this business, this podcasting business. So every week you'd hear like, what he's going through and the challenges and the doubts and the fears and the struggles and the wins and like all the good and bad. But man, he laid it all out there very transparent, which can be very scary.

It is. But I think the other part of the other side of that is that people need to realize that it's not just them.

Yeah.

You know, anyone. Because when you start your own business, you are out there on your own and you feel like you are out in the middle of an ocean in a boat and hopefully you have a paddle. But the fact of the matter is, even though you can't see them, there are a whole bunch of other people out there in those boats, hopefully having a paddle and they're trying to go in the same general direction as you. So the fact that, you know, anyone, myself, Alex, whoever is willing to go, okay, here's what my reality is. Like, I think not only gives confidence to other people trying to do this, but, you know, we can all commiserate and help each other, which is really nice because, you know, occasionally I get comments on my blog of, hey, have you tried this yet? Hey, have you thought about this yet. And it's like, thank you, I haven't. That's exactly what I needed. So, you know, it's. We may be a loosely knit community, but we are a community of entrepreneurs. And it's, it's. You can't expect it to be all, you know, champagne and roses because as much as we'd all love it to be, it isn't. It is actually your job. And so it's nice to see and to be able to talk about the reality part as well as the really fun parts.

So what have you found to be some of the biggest lessons that you've learned since you went out on your own five months ago?

Oh goodness. Well, I think probably the biggest one has been focused. You know, I need to, you know, I have like, I'm trying to get into a pattern of. Alright, I need like an hour at the beginning of my day to get all of that piddly little stuff out of the way. The answering the emails, the, you know, checking this, that and the other thing, the making sure that, you know, whatever is done, the putting out the billing, whatever. And then I just need to stop and put that aside, however much I've gotten done. And I need to sit down and focus on what I am doing for the day. And it just, you know, because that's the biggest part I think of being a business person is how was it someone said, you know, there's the working in your business, which is the piddly little stuff. Then there's the working on your business which is the business development or the actual creation of product or, you know, or service that you're putting out there. And I would much rather spend time working on my business because A, I enjoy it and B, let's face it, that's what's brings in, that's what brings in the money. Because if I can limit the in my business part, I don't have to think about it as much. I make sure it gets done but I don't let it overwhelm me. So focus has been a really, really big thing for me, being able to focus on the working on my business part. You know, and another thing is just not letting myself get distracted. It's very easy to do. There's so much information coming in. You know, my email pops up every once in a while and goes, oh, look, you have emails. Oh look, there's something shiny over there. Oh, the cat wants to come in. Yes, squirrel, exactly. And it's, it's easy to get distracted. So just learning to not Be distracted has been another big thing. And then, you know, the. Again, dealing with the actual reality of there are. There is a cycle to this. As a friend of mine once said, sometimes you eat chicken and sometimes you eat feathers. You never quite know what it's going to be, but you have to prepare for that cycle and save some of the chicken, as it were, for when you only catch feathers.

I love it. I love it. That's just great insights there. So I'm curious, what's next? What's next for you?

Well, you know, obviously, I'm working on growing this business and making it into something much more sustainable. My goal is to have, you know, know, a couple of regular clients, you know, like on either on retainer or just folks who come back to me regularly, and then, you know, to be able to work on the fun projects that pop up every once in a while. I am working on a couple of different certifications. An SEO copywriter certification. I don't know if folks know about Heather Lloyd Martin, but I'm working on her course.

Oh, yeah, I've had her on the show.

Yes, yes. And then also actually taking the LeadPages certification because they focus primarily on conversion. That's their thing. So, you know, I'm finishing up that certification because that gets me on their list of certified people as well. So one of the nice things about doing those is it. It puts me out there more. It says this person is qualified to do what it is that you need to do. So that when someone goes to, you know, leadpages or to Heather's website going, I need a. On there.

So it's a. They have one certification. It's like a LeadPages Certified Partner kind of thing.

Yeah, you're a certified conversion marketer.

Okay, gotcha.

Yeah. And so I'm finishing up that I'm working on Heather's course to get my certification there so that people recognize that I get SEO. I mean, yes, I get SEO already, but, you know, in terms of just the actual mechanics. And there is something to be said for someone giving you a stamp of approval. You know, there's something to be said for someone going, no, this person actually knows what they're talking about.

Especially those. Especially those. I think there's a lot of junk out there in terms of certifications, but, you know, those are good ones because those mean something.

Exactly. So, yeah, yeah. So I'm working on those, and hopefully that will help develop my business as well. And then really it's all about finding the fun projects and getting to learn new things and enjoying working with new clients.

That's fantastic. Well, I. This is very inspirational, Tanya. This is. I know that this is not an easy path. Again, I commend you for just giving it a go. And you, obviously, I can sense it. You're giving it everything you've got. You're enjoying yourself, you're learning, and I know you'll be successful. But at the end of the day, really, it's the person you're becoming in the process that matters most. Right. And I can tell that it's shaping you in the right way.

Thank you very much. I appreciate the vote of confidence, but.

I don't want to leave, though, without asking you. Where can people learn more about you? Where can they read your blog and just kind of follow your journey?

Well, you can find me at tanyabrodycopywriter. All1word.com and my name if hasn't been flashed up on a screen or you didn't see it in the link to this podcast. It's T as in Thomas, A, N as in Nancy, Y a B as in boy, R, O, D as in Dog, y.copywriter.com.

Yeah, we'll make sure to include that link in the show notes. So check out Tanya's website, check out her blog.

And I post what I call the 6 in 6 copywriter report once a month.

What's that about?

And that is the actual update of how I'm doing in my business. So that's the regular update. A lot of the other stuff that I post is either about developing your business, which is, of course, what I'm doing at the time, or is about things that you can do to promote your business.

Fantastic. Tanya, thanks again. I really appreciate you coming on the show.

Thank you. My pleasure. Thank you so much for having me on. The High Income Business Writing podcast is a production of B2B business launcher.

Learn more at B2B launcher.com.