#201: How to Capitalize on the ‘Original Research’ Trend in Content Marketing

Welcome to the High Income Business Writing Podcast, helping you propel your writing business to a whole new level. And now, here's your host, Ed Gandia. Hey there. Welcome to the High Income Business Writing Podcast. I am your host, Ed Gandia, and this is the podcast for business writers and copywriters who want to earn more and less time doing work they love for better clients. You can find detailed show notes for this episode@b2b launcher.com episode 201. Those notes always include a summary of our discussion as well as links to resources mentioned during the show. So I am very, very excited about today's episode because we're touching on an idea that, when implemented well, has the potential to boost your income significantly. It can also help position you as a higher value professional in the eyes of your clients and prospects. And this kind of work can be a lot of fun and it can help add some great variety to your work. So what's this all about? This is all about helping your clients do original research and publish insightful and valuable content based on that research. My guest is Sarah Griesenbach and she has been doing this kind of work for a while now, and not only has she found it interesting and fun, but she's also been able to drum up quite a bit of work with this concept. In this interview, she explains what this trend is all about, why it's becoming so popular, what clients can do with their original research, how you can pitch it to prospects and clients, and how you can grow your business with these offerings even if you're not a research expert or extremely proficient in research methodologies. This is really, really cool stuff. I urge you to give it a listen. I think you're going to walk away with some great ideas here. Hope you enjoy it. Sarah, welcome back to the show. Great to have you here.

Hello. I'm really excited to be here. You seem to connect the best people on the Internet, so it's always a surprising honor to get to be here.

Oh, thank you so much. Thank you so much. Well, I'm excited about today's topic because a little different and this is something that I don't think a lot of writers are thinking about. In fact, I know I wasn't when you approached me with this idea, something you've been doing, and so I was really, really intrigued. We're going to get to it here in a minute, but why don't you start by giving us a little bit of background, a little bit about Sarah. So what do you do? What kind of clients you work with? Just Give us a little bit of background there.

Sure. So my main work, I run B2B Content Studio, where I'm writing white papers, articles, and webinars for mostly hr, marketing, marketing and technology companies.

Gotcha. And how long have you been doing that?

About six years, I think since 2013. So I might be starting my seventh year, which is just crazy to think about. Wow.

It's flown, hasn't it?

Yeah. Yeah. Two kids, a business. Never a dull moment, then a lot of change. Yeah.

Here we are. I'm surprised I was able to get you in here to talk to me today. If you need something done, give it to a busy person, right?

Yeah, I think so. I think it's very underrated how much kids improve your productivity. I think you're actually the first person who told me that in the Facebook group because usually the message is about how little time you have and how things kind of aren't going to be very good for a couple years. But it's definitely improved my focus when I can work.

I can't tell you how many people I work with, who the kids are out of the house. They got all the time in the world to do this, and they still can't find the time to do some of the things they know they need to do. So it's Parkinson's Law. Right. The work will expand to the time available. You've seen that you can become, you know, a lot. But of course, be nice to have a little bit more. But it sounds like you've gotten really good at using what you do have.

Yeah, I hope. And our goal, actually, we're hoping to bring my husband home in the new year so I could go a little bit more full time and hopefully I would keep the focus without letting the time expand. The time that it takes to do things, though.

Okay, awesome. Well, hey, I'm really happy that you guys are doing that. It sounds like it's going to be a win, win, win there.

And.

Yeah. Excited. We may have to talk again about what that experience was like. Once you have a few months, it's going to be messy. I'm sure there'll be drama and ups and downs, but exciting stuff. Let's talk about this. Let's talk about this whole idea of original research. I know you've been writing about this, talking about this, this idea of using original research as a source of marketing content, but let's really start at the very beginning. Why don't you tell us, first of all, more about what this is all about and then what clients can do with that kind of original research where get value from that or how they can get value.

Sure. So I think the main point I wanted to get across is just that you don't have to be A or have a scientific background to do this. Like most things in B2B, I just kind of fell into this when a client at an agency assigned it to me. And I had loved writing tests as a teacher, so I thought, why not just try to do that and poll an audience? So it's really the basic steps of this breakout into developing a survey, polling an audience, and then writing about those results. And it's not too different from what we already do when we're in the process of writing a white paper or an article.

Okay, so when we're talking about original research, you're talking about working with a client to create a survey that they're going to send out to their prospects and customers, gather data and then create content based on the answers that came back.

Exactly. And I think you'd asked how this benefits our clients and this is just such a newly. I don't know, it's almost like we're reintroduced to how popular it is because it's really not a new format so much as it's a new application of it to make editorial content and thought leadership content. So it's stepping back from customer research and focus groups, which are very traditional and have been around for decades, and bringing it more to content marketing and saying, you know, if we know that 74% of B2B customers are reading research and help letting it influence their decision making, why not have the brand making that research and giving them information that they're interested in. That's where I think so many more companies are getting on board with original research because they see that it really has an impact on the people they're trying to reach with their marketing.

Maybe as a way to make this come alive a little bit for listeners. Why don't you give us some examples of where you've seen this work? Well, maybe you can start with the original engagement you had with a client, approach you with this idea and see if you could help them.

Sure. Well, I think research is really everywhere. So even as a white paper writer and an article writer, you know, the best examples of that always start with research that's relevant to the person who's reading. So it's really just a process of kind of turning around and becoming that resource for other people and for your own work. So for the agency client, they just kind of expanded this as an offering that they do because they have several million readers for their blog that are all C level. So when they started to think about how they could optimize that audience and deliver more value to their clients, they came to that decision that, you know, why not give our clients access to their prospective customers through that survey method? And I think that's where it really started for them. For other just examples kind of around the industry, I was thinking we could include the links in the show notes, but we've seen them a lot like Andy Crestadena's annual blogging survey and Content Marketing Institute's State of B2B Marketing Report. Those are things that go out each year. So you start to be able to see a benchmark of this data as it's changing over the years.

Yeah, I know. Michael Stelzner, Social Media examiner, also does kind of a State of the Industry like Social Media Annual Report. Right. That's all based on research, original research that he derives from his own audience by pulling. Serving his audience.

Yeah. And that's a great example of how many different ways this can really work for people, because I think it's so reusable as far as almost every data point could turn into its own article, its own infographic or a webinar. It's really great for getting links if you haven't gated that content, because so many people are going to be curious if you set it up right, so many people are going to be curious about the results that you're going to see a lot more traffic and interest in what you're doing. And I think the examples we just said are great examples of that.

So the idea here is your clients, they're already creating marketing content, thought leadership content. This is just another way to create that content, is, hey, let's do our own survey. Let's gather information and then let's analyze, disseminate, synthesize that information in a way that is going to captivate our audience as something that's going to really sound attractive to them. Are there differences or different flavors of this? In terms of some of the examples we just talked about is you're surveying your own mailing list or your own audience versus going, what if your client doesn't really have much of an audience? So where do they go? I don't want to get too much into the weeds, but I'm curious as to where. What is the process behind this?

Sure. So when we think about the basic steps we've got developing that survey, and then number two is polling the audience and so I've only done about 10 of these projects myself. There are experts out there like Michelle Lynn and Claire McDermott at Mantis Research who have really made this the focus of their work. So they have some great resources about learning how to do this. But one of the best suggestions for securing an audience is, is surveymonkey audience. So for a fee, you know, 500 or $1,000, they can connect you to people based on the demographics you're hoping to find. And I found for the independent survey I did, that was definitely the smoothest way to get that done. But I also tried, you know, Twitter, LinkedIn and Facebook advertisements. Really, anything that's going to help you reach your target audience and get them to click through and give, you know, take the survey.

Got it. Okay. So there are different. Even if you don't, your client doesn't have an audience or ways to find who could fill out the survey. Qualified people, not just warm bodies.

Exactly.

What about your knowledge in this area? How proficient do you need to be in research methodologies to do this well enough so that the results can stand up to outside scrutiny and it doesn't feel like it's something you just kind of made up and, you know, has no bearing.

Definitely. I think writers, business writers especially, come into this with a lot of skills they might not know about already. Because I think if you apply the same standards and logic that you do to a technical white paper, I think you can do a really competent job of creating a survey that's going to get really good results. So there's always more information you could get around, test writing basics and things like that to improve the quality of the questions you're asking. But I think the general mindset of a business writer already has this capability built in, in my opinion.

Got it. And what about you said you've done about 10 of these already. I know you mentioned some resources earlier, but for someone who's interested in this idea, where can they learn a little bit more about. There's a whole science behind writing these questions and organizing them. How do you position the answers? In what order? What types of. Types of questions they should be? What types of choices can you, you know, what resources have you found to be really helpful when looking to get better in this area?

Well, I always start with Michelle Lynn and Claire McDernut for Mantis Research. They were on the team that pioneered the Content Marketing Institute's state of marketing resources. But on their site they have a free download. That's how to publish original research just has great foundational pieces of kind of learning about the topic. And then Content Marketing Institute also has really great archives around different ideas for how to turn the research into other formats and just different things to think about when you start a research project. I think both of those have been very helpful.

Those sound great. I mean, I know I have created all kinds of surveys in the past, but frankly I've just kind of made it up. I haven't really looked into how do I create the best survey that more people will actually fill out and will give me the I need to give you all kinds of possibilities in terms of worthwhile content. Usually it's after the fact, after I send that, oh, I should have asked this other thing, you know, maybe a little preparation.

I can see that. I think you're probably relying on just excellent instincts you have from sales and just being able to interview people for content. But test writing does get into some different. It's just a different art because you're really approaching someone cold and hoping to get really deep insights from someone who doesn't have a lot of buy in or engagement with what you're sending because to them it's just a survey that they've happened across. So I definitely think there's an art to, you know, maybe starting out with more basic questions to get someone engaged and warmed up and then kind of moving into deeper questions or combining questions in a way that helps people think through their answer. It just gets really interesting the deeper you get into it.

What are you seeing out there? It sounds like this is really catching on in terms of your prospects and clients. But what's the advantage of this kind of content or content you produce using this data and insights as opposed to resources that are already out there?

I think it comes down to one of my favorite concepts in marketing right now is just content saturation. So there is, you know, the estimate changes every day, but more than 2 million blog posts are published every day. So the idea of competing with that and coming up with interesting and new things to say can just be really overwhelming no matter what your client's industry is. So to me, the biggest advantage of this kind of research is just that you are guaranteed to have something unique and interesting and original because you're the one who found the audience and you're the one who brainstormed the questions. It's just very unlikely that anybody else is going to have access to that kind of data because you're the one who made it. So I think that lets you cut the noise a little bit, especially within your ecosystem of competitors because you're going to be the only one who has the information.

Yeah, I can clearly see that makes sense. Let's talk a little bit about how you could start offering this to your clients as a service. So what are some steps that writers can take if they're interested in pursuing this, to start moving in this direction? You know, how do you pitch it? How do you get started? Who do you pitch it to?

Sure. The best success I've had is as an upsell or an add on. So maybe right after a project or as you're brainstorming a new project or a white paper, if you take the time to point out maybe competitors are doing research or if there's a study on the topic, but it doesn't on what you think your client would be the most interested in. Simply saying original research is a brand new thing. And that thing we could take on if you were ever interested in that. A sentence that simple as how I landed my first, you know, non agency client where it was just a client of mine. We had done blog posts in the past, we started to talk about white papers and realized, you know, they don't have anything unique like this in their kind of repertoire of resources, so why not go for it? And so it worked out and they were really excited.

So basically bring it up when their head's already there. You know, they're already working on something as opposed to, you know, just out of the blue. Hey, have you thought about this?

Mm. And I think, you know, don't underestimate how much your clients are reading about these trends and kind of wondering, you know, how could I do this? I wouldn't even know where to start because they're more worried about some other metrics or different things going on in their job. So if you can come in and have some of that expertise of this is what the project process will look like, this is what we'll be able to do with the results. Doesn't that sound kind of interesting? I think it takes the pressure off them to be the champion behind the project and lets you really run with it. And that's been just very valuable for the people I've worked with.

So one is just to bring it up as an idea. Any other thoughts in terms of, you know, kind of getting this out there and being able to get a proof of concept and get started?

Definitely. So one thing I did that was very helpful was I just plugged into PicMonkey or any kind of simple graphic design tool, and I created a project roadmap that just explained that process of number one, develop the survey and improve the survey. Number two, identify a panel or audience to pull. And then number three, create a white paper or webinar or whatever those results will be. And having something visual was really helpful for your client to get a team and say this is what the process will look like and this is what we're getting out of it. And I think that was really helpful in, you know, just being able to move forward with the project.

When did you use that in your process? This illustration, is that something you kind of posted in social media or when you're pitching clients individually, you would include this as part of the conversation that you started with them. How did that work?

So that is just right after you get permission that it could be an interesting thing to talk about in this particular situation. The client asked if I had any more details or an idea of what that process would look like. And at the time it just seemed like really natural connection to make a visual. I think it could also be really successful in just a written project proposal where, you know, maybe use a chart or different formatting to just show those different parts of the process. So barely have to be graphic if that's not your strength, but just something that shows that this is an established process that they can feel comfortable engaging in.

I like the visual aspect of it because if you kind of treat it like a process map, if you. It just. This is the kind of thing it really.

Exactly.

Right. Yeah. I love it.

Yeah. The road mapping like you've talked about.

Yeah. And it. So this is kind of a, you know, somewhere, once you've gotten someone to raise their hand, then this could be part of that conversation to get them to see the possibilities. And this is how it would potentially work. I would also think, like you said, don't underestimate the fact that a lot of clients are already thinking about this. The idea has come up. But what happens when you're. When. Because let's face it, These guys wear 15 hats. When they have so many hats they're wearing in their role, they never dig deep enough or think about it deeply enough to actually execute it. So if you can show them the potential steps, it's kind of look now I'm starting to see. I'm starting to see the light. I'm starting to see the how. And you are the one who gave them that. So you kind of become the obvious choice for working with on this.

Exactly. And I think you can bring that follow through to delivery too by making it just A really high quality result for the white paper. And to me that means including social media to promote the research or the landing page for the paper, or even calling out within the white paper you deliver, calling out different key phrases and statistics that could make a really good visual for social media or even an introduction to like a warm emailing lead for their sales team. Anything you could do to make it really obvious how practical this is going to be once it's done really helps. You know, it just makes the value jump off the page so it becomes just an obvious next step.

So when you pitch this, and I'd like to get a little bit into pitching, by the way, but when you pitch it, do you then offer or show them all the different ways they could splinter this content, these insights and all the different possibilities, or do you not get too deep into that during the pitch?

I don't get too deep into it. I do list when I'm saying, have you considered doing blank? I've seen people use this or repurpose this research a lot with blank and blank and blank. I'll throw the ideas out there just because I really believe in this as a, even a lead generation strategy. Because a really great reason to email your list of prospects is to say, hey, I have new research you're interested in. So for brands that have trouble thinking of things to email to the email list that they've been developing, this really just comes in and kind of saves the day.

Is this an engagement that you've been selling at least so far as a standalone, or do you sell different bundles and options?

I have only done it as a bundle so far. So taking that research piece and tacking it on with a white paper is a really natural fit. I've done one where it's a white paper and a webinar based on those details. Just to really give that 360 perspective of the data. I could see if you were to just do the survey, that might start to feel more customer researchy to me. But I'm sure a creative writer could make that work. If they just wanted to develop a survey and then kind of work through the results to inform content strategy, that could be a great way to branch off.

So essentially with a white paper, you mean that you'll write a white paper based on the content, based on the findings? Right. And same thing with the webinar. What do you do with the webinar? I'm curious, do you basically outline the content or do you also offer to do the slides? You know, you bring in a designer or anything like that.

So I think, again, a creative writer could definitely upsell this if they wanted. But for me personally, I just make arrangements based on the content. So I deliver the white paper content and then the brand takes it from there as far as design and getting it on their site. And then the same with the webinar. I'll create the moderator's script with that story narrative that kind of moves the speaker from point to point. And then I'll do an interview with the speaker and kind of capture what they'd like to express. But that just results in speaker notes that they can, you know, refer to as they're presenting or just use as a jumping off point.

Gotcha. Are you comfortable telling us at least, you know, even if you could just give us a range of what you've been quoting or what you would suggest writers consider quoting for an engagement like this? You know, of course, bundled. Because you talked about not just doing the research, but doing a bundle of pieces.

Sure. I think, you know, and I've been able to outline this in more detail with a guest post that's coming out on that White Paper Guys blog soon. But when I looked into some research around this, I think you can add on that developing the survey conversation at about 1,000 or $1,500 for just the work that would go into crafting a survey that would have really usable results, then that white paper can be, you know, whatever your range is as a white paper writer, but around $3,500 and up, I think, is a good starting place. And then for a white paper webinar, I'm not sure I included that in the blog post, but I would say, you know, right around the range of a white paper at 3,500 or more, because you are. The word count ends up being astronomical just with the amount of time you're spending talking with the subject matter experts. And then just that final piece you'd want to think about is polling the audience, which I think setting aside a budget of about $1,000 for SurveyMonkey audiences or some other polling agency like that, is gonna get you about 100 responses, depending on the niche of the people that you're trying to reach.

And what about, do you itemize this or do you, when you bundle it, do you just quote a fixed fee for everything?

So what I've done for independent projects is bundling. So I'll say X amount for the survey white paper and a webinar that's right in that seven to $10,000 range. But I Think as I practice this and it gets more fluent, I think that could easily climb up to that $15,000 range.

Yeah, absolutely. And I'm glad you do it that way. I see some great potential here because, see, what you've done, Sarah, is you've moved away from purely execution work and then move upstream to road mapping and planning and into strategy. This touches all three areas. So now you are no longer just a writer who can be shopped around. Now you're someone who's positioning themselves as a trusted advisor, someone who's way beyond that and it's really hard. That's a different category of professional. Those professionals don't get shopped around like the blog post writer, for instance. So kudos to you. This is really smart.

Oh, thanks. Yeah, and I've really seen that. And it could be just particular clients having different levels of experience with marketing, but I've really seen as you learn about this process and get comfortable about the value that you're delivering, it's just so much easier to take leadership in those conversations and maybe push clients to use their list in a way they might not have thought about or set a lead generation goal instead of just saying you, you know, we'll hope it works out. So it really, it seems to be a way to get a little more authority in your conversations with clients, just like you said.

It absolutely does. And actually, let me take a step back here. This feels like the kind of thing that would. It's just prime for like, warm email prospecting strategy, social media, using it as a. Because it's so different. It sounds like you've done quite a few of these already. And what I'm assuming is that in one case you got approached, but maybe a lot of the others, you've been the one doing the prospecting. So is that the case? And if so, do you agree that this is the kind of thing that really lends itself to a little bit of outreach for both cold prospects and current and dormant clients?

I think so. I think for my background personally, I've made the rookie mistake of falling in love with an agency. So my work has scaled to, you know, 50 or 60% of the work I'm doing is coming to me through those projects for research. But I've worked on maybe two independently just to put out the research. But yeah, I think it absolutely could be a way to stand out, especially if you're following the important warm emailing principles of customizing that email to the people that you're reaching out to. Because I think if you're trying to work with a company and you can show them that you see the holes in their resources right now and explain to them why research would be particularly helpful for their work, whether that's healthcare or hr. If you can make that real to them for what their customers are looking for, I think that's going to make you stand out in an email more than just a request for work or to join the team.

Yeah, I see two potential ideas right off the bat. One is instead of telling them, hey, you got this hole, you know, never call their baby ugly. Right. Say, have you thought about doing something like this? Right, that's one of them. And that would be a great warm email. It could also take a nine award email approach with current and past clients. And then I also see the possibility here to create a lead magnet. And I love your idea of a visual one page visual roadmap. That's a lead magnet and you can now use that to generate leads of people who are interested in this topic and then you can now start a conversation with them.

Absolutely. And that, you know, kicking off that conversation, there was one statistic I just really have to plug which is a content marketing institute and smart brief report from 2017 where it shows, it ranks all of the different kind of content formats that we write as writers for. Influence of content on purchasing decisions. And original research was number two at 74% of people found that that was very influential on their purchasing decisions. And that beat out run down the list, case studies, webinars, ebooks and white papers. It's just right up there at the top of the list for what people want to be reading. And if you can bring that information to a marketing manager and, and show them how to do that project that is going to get so many more of their customers interested in their product. I just, I don't know who's going to say no to that.

I think we have a window here of opportunity for at least the next couple of years where you can take this and make it one of your main offerings. I think you can build a whole business around this. But I mean, start small. This could become a decent part of your business and your income if you're smart about it. This is essentially a productized service. You can have different flavors or levels of it and it would make things so much easier because you would simplify your business in terms of your offerings adding tremendous value and you don't need that many of these projects to really start earning a great income. So I absolutely love this. Sarah. So one last Question before we sign up. You've walked down this path. You've already shared some of the mistakes you've made with us. And very natural. When you're getting into something new, you're gonna make mistakes. That's how you learn. But what are some others? And maybe we haven't talked about avoidable mistakes that writers can avoid when they start offering this as a service.

Sure. Yeah. And I've definitely earned this experience by making all mistakes I'm about to talk about. The first that jumps out is to really take the lead or make sure you take the lead. I think marketers are very naturally self promotional. So when they see this opportunity, one of the first things they're going to want to do is ask customers how important their product is to them or ask them what they like most about their product, like that kind of customer research information. But because you're the one responsible for being able to use the outcome of these questions, it's really important to fight that and bring it back to that editorial, thematic, really content rich kind of topics. So I think just a great example of that is if you're writing for a webinar software company and they're going to pull their audience, they're going to want to ask what percentage of people use webinars. But if you're asking your own audience what percentage of them use your product, that's really not useful information. It's going to be a vanity metric of 99% of the people we ask use webinar software. But it's not helpful and it doesn't change the conversation very much. But if you're going to ask questions like how do you use webinars? Or how do you find topics for webinars? Where do you source your experts? That's the kind of information that other people want to know and they're going to share and write about and read about. So really taking the lead on that conversation and showing your client why it's important to keep things as neutral as possible, you know, because they're sponsoring the information. But that's just so important to be able to have usable information once you're done. And I think a second thing is just that, proofing and editing, proof and proof. Again, because you really do not want to send out $1,000 survey and find out later you have a duplicate question on it that you did not remove, you know, because you're just paying extra for a question that doesn't move anything along.

Oh, done that.

Yeah. And then I think for planning, I just want to share that. You know, as you're mapping out your questions, I really like to make a chart and I have the question on one side and on the other side I'm working through how you're going to be able to use the possible outcomes of the question. So if you, you know, you write a question and then on the right side of the column you could say, as a result of asking this question, we'll be able to say things like, 80% of people using a webinar software know where their guests are going to come from next year. You know, that kind of thing. So you can really visualize, you don't know what the outcomes are and it may be the opposite of what you think it'll be, but you can at least visualize how you'll be able to make content based on the answer to that question. And that's just been really helpful.

Man, that is a great tip. I never thought about doing that, especially with working with a client, because I know I can already see some clients saying, okay, we want this question. But then if you take this approach, then you could ask a follow up question to the client and say, hey, that's great. What would be the outcome? What would you want to get out of that question? And it might be that the client hasn't really thought about that. And maybe after you pose the question, they realize, you know, maybe we don't need that question. You know, there needs to be a big reason why for each question.

Yeah. And it can also help you cut out unnecessary questions. Because when you're doing a survey, you're paying per question and per person who responds to the question. So let's say if you're doing a learning and development survey and you want to find out what development strategy people are using to create lessons, you can have a question saying, do you use blank, do you use blank? And do you use blank? Or you can combine all of that into one question and just ask, what do you use? Which all those options. Exactly. And then that's going to give you, you know, a lot more usable information than just asking each question separately and then maybe having to cut one or two because of cost or different problems like that.

Well, it's not only that you're paying for it, but the more questions the survey has, the fewer people respond. So you want to exactly your survey to the minimal number of questions. So every question needs to be there on purpose. It needs to be really well thought out, having that justification for each question. I think that's a brilliant idea. So, Sarah, this is fantastic. First of all, congratulations on going down this path. Really happy to see what you'll do with this here in the coming year. And why don't you tell us a little bit more about where listeners can learn more about you and what you do?

Sure. So I've been moving or spending about 10% of my time building the B2B Writing Institute for the new year. And one of the things that we're going to do is have a course that focuses on original research. And I've been able to meet a couple of the experts in the field, like Michelle Lynn is going to be one of our guests in January or February. So I'm just really excited about helping other people see how they could be using this because it's at the end of the day, honestly, it's just so much fun to do this because I think writers are naturally curious, and this lets you really pursue your curiosity about whatever your specialty is, and it's just really satisfying.

That's fantastic. And where can people check out the B2B Writing Institute? How can they learn more about what you're doing there and the class?

Sure. So b2bwritinginstitute.com is the best place to go. That's our email list right now. And where we're. Once a week, we're gonna let everybody know how close we're getting to launching that course in January.

Wonderful. Well, hey, thanks for coming on today. Thank you for sharing your wisdom with us, Sarah and I wish you all the best.

It's my pleasure. Thank you.

The High Income Business Writing Podcast is a production of B2B business launcher. Learn more at B2B launcher.com.