#365: The Power of Your Brand Story—Why It Matters and How to Get It Right

Welcome to the High Income Business Writing Podcast, helping you propel your writing business to a whole new level. And now, here's your host, Ed Gandia. Hey there. Welcome to another episode of the High Income Business Writing Podcast, the number one podcast for business writers and copywriters who want to earn more and less time doing work they love for better clients. With over 1.3 million downloads from listeners just like you across 101 countries, have you ever wondered what makes some businesses unforgettable while others seem to just fade out into the noise? The answer isn't just in a logo or in a tagline. It's in the story they tell. In this episode, we dive into the art of Brand Story with Jonna Lacey, who's the founder of JM Lacey Communications. And Jonna has more than 20 years of professional writing experience and over 40 years of creative storytelling. She specializes these days in helping business owners, solopreneurs, nonprofits, and authors simplify their messaging and build deeper connections through storytelling. Now, in this conversation, Jonna breaks down the difference between Brand Story and traditional branding. The biggest mistakes professionals make when telling their story, and then how solo professionals like us can leverage Brand Story to build trust, reputation, and community. Plus, she shares some practical steps to uncover your own story and even turn Brand Story into a valuable service you can offer your own clients and prospects. So I think you're going to really enjoy this one. She provides some really interesting guidance that will help you even if you end up not ever providing this kind of service to your clients. Hey, Jona, welcome. Great to talk with you today.

Oh, it's great to talk with you, Ed. I'm so happy to be here.

I'm happy that you're here, and I'm excited to dive into this topic. We haven't really addressed this before in the podcast, and I guess before we get there, I want to make sure people have a little bit of context. So why don't you tell us about your work, your business, what you focus on, what kind of clients you work with?

Sure. So my main work is training and teaching companies, businesses, and even solopreneurs and authors Brand Story. So obviously that's the topic we're going to talk about and we'll discuss why that's so important. But that's the main thing I do, and I prefer the personal touch with that. So I don't have you go to my website. There's no do it yourself workshop or training. It's really working with me personally to guide you through that process. So that's really the main thing I do. I've been a writer pretty much my entire life, so that's never changed. But I've just turned that into helping my clients with their brand story. But I also do a two day VIP writing workshop, especially for businesses who have communications teams, PR teams, and they may maybe want to brush up a bit on their business communications more. But of course I can work individually with them. So I say if there's anything you can remember as you walk away, that's what you want to remember, is that it's about you. It's about you, your personality. We'll talk a bit more about that. But it doesn't have to do exactly with what you do. And I say that exactly because what you do is related to it. You know, the products that you provide, your services, even your books, all of those things elevate your brand. But those are things that can actually change. But your brand story doesn't change because it's your identity. This is your reputation. So that's not going to change. You're basing your identity, really, it's on your values. So all of us have values, very specific ones, and those don't change. So the purpose of your brand story, the reason you want it, is because you're trying to develop trust both inside and outside your organization. And you're trying to build a connection and community with your audience. And when I say audience, that could be your consumers, it could be your readers if you're an author, it could be investors, your employees, funders if you're a nonprofit. So there's quite a few people involved in the audience. But the keys to keep in mind with your brand story is it's really the core of your business, that's the foundation. So it affects how you run your business, it affects your company culture, your products, your services, everything that ties into your business foundation. So as you could probably tell, your brand story comes first, it comes before everything else. So when it comes to your logos, your taglines, your website, your marketing, these come after your brand story. Marketing is not branding. You use your marketing to tell your story, but you have to have your story in place first. That determines the kind of marketing that you're going to do, how it's going to be done, and any design elements, which again are your logos, your website, all of those things are going to be based on the actual brand story.

Makes sense. And I like where this is going. I love that description. I'm curious, this is sounding a lot like your big why? You know, I'm thinking of Simon Happens.

But you know your subject the best. You know where you're going, you've studied it. So you can actually guide people in that. So when you know what the connection is, the trend connection to your audience, that's going to help you to shape your story as well. The third thing that your story is going to include, very important, is your authentic emotional connection. I mean, let's face it, we buy emotionally. That's just how we are. And people do business with people, and they are going to do business with you because they like you. That's the bottom line. Yeah, the skills are helpful for sure, but, you know, they really like you. So how do you relate to your audience emotionally? How are you connecting with them? And you help to connect by sharing the obstacles you've been through. Don't dwell on them. You do share them. But the most important thing you want to do is share. What are the lessons that you learned? How did you overcome these obstacles? And what are the solutions? That's what people are looking for. They need to see themselves in your story. And then the fourth is that meaningful value proposition. So here's another why. Why should people even do business with you? Why are you the right person or the organization to bring about change? How does your experience tie into your expertise? What makes you really attractive to your audience? So, as you can see, with all of these elements that you cover in your story, this is going to help you connect with the right audience that you're trying to attract. Your. Your goal here is to build trust and, and relationships, which takes time. Um, and another cool thing too, that I like to mention to people about our brand story is, is that's really a soft sell in a way, because people are getting to know you and so you're alleviating the stress of selling yourself to your prospects or consumers, which I'm going to raise my hand. I hate selling. I really hate that. It feels icky to me and I'm not good at it. I'm just not good at it. But your story does it for you. And so by the time you have a conversation with your prospect client, they should already be sold just because of that story. And this actually reminds me of just a very brief story. My husband and I, not too long ago, we were at a coffee shop, sitting outside, and I don't know why people choose to do business in public at a coffee show. It gets such a bad idea. You know, it's not confidential. I. I don't know why people do this, but there's this guy on his phone the whole time we were there and we noticed something. Both my husband and I are self employed so we noticed something interesting. 98% of the conversation was him talking and it was him selling himself and talking about all these great things that he did and all these clients he serviced. And it was funny because my husband said, you know, if somebody tried to do that to me after about 10 minutes I would do a hard stop because now I don't trust him, you know, if he has to sell himself like that. So the point of that is, you know, the conversation that you have with your prospect at that point, it's really them getting to know you and your personality. They're sold, they, they've seen your skills, they've, you know, gone to your website or maybe they were a referral from another client. So they're already sold on your skills and ability. What they want to see is they want to see your face. They want to get to kind of know your personality and see if that personality connects with the story that they've been hearing and reading. So they just want to make sure that that's true and see it in your face or hear it in your voice if you're on the phone. So but you know, that's why your brand story is so imperative and especially the why, because people are asking themselves that why should I do business with you? Why should I trust you? And you're showing them that through your story.

Two things come to mind. Not just the why, why do you do what you do, but also what do you stand for or what are you about? That's as I'm listening to what you said. It's. I, it seems like everything kind of fell into one of those two elements. Right. It, cause then I think Simon Sinek said people don't care what you do or how you do it until they understand why you do it.

Yeah.

And I think that's really powerful why you do it and what you're about.

Yeah.

Because I think those two go hand in hand. Yeah. Now you've been, A lot of the examples you've been giving have been they have a, of like personal brand, like an individual solo professional. How does this work in let's just say a mid sized company where you're not really telling the story of one individual necessarily but of the company itself. So how does that translate?

And then sometimes you are. It really depends. It obviously it depends on the size of the company. So corporations for example, they are usually going to have their big brand story.

Oh sure. But not those, but like let's say a small to mid sized business where now you're not selling this, the founder anymore. Now it's about the business itself. And let's just say, I don't know, a hundred million business, which is still considered, I think, a small business in most cases.

Okay, so, all right, so here's an example that you might too. And of course you can Google all of this too. But one company that I look at is RXBar. For any that might be familiar with their products, they're fairly new company within the last few years. But it's really interesting to see how they took their history and also from their, and created this incredible brand story and how that morphed into just a really interesting slogan which I don't have in front of me right now. But they represent really healthy eating. So they talk about how they started these two guys and how it's grown from there. So even a small business, I mean, you can approach it from the aspect of the founder or you know, from the CEO, you know, it depends on how big they've gotten. But at that point you learn with your brand story, you know, your vision and your mission for the company don't change. Maybe what you do and the way you do things will change depending on where we are in the stream of time. But the actual vision and mission, those are the things that don't change. And so it's interesting to see, especially businesses who have been around for decades, how much that has stayed the same and everything that they do is incorporated into that. So it might start out with, I think, you know, honestly, I think every company does start out with the founder. I mean, you look at the Walt Disney company, I mean, that's a massive company. And you talk about the epitome of storytelling, but it's really the humble beginnings of Walt Disney and what his vision was, the mistakes that he made and even after he died, the mistakes the company made. But where are they today? And it's kind of interesting that because I've looked at their story also is their original vision and mission haven't changed. But it's interesting to see how they've changed as a company over the years to fulfill that vision and mission. So I, you know, I think even as a small company or solopreneur, your brand story really doesn't change. There are a few alterations. But how you started, why it started, it might be that, you know, I'm into healthy products, healthy eating and things like that. So those are a lot of companies I pay attention to. And it's very interesting to see how they started. You know, maybe the founder had some sort of disease or ailment and she could not find the right products and they were making her sick. So she designed that, so she built that. So those are things that are okay. Because then from there you're saying, and today, now the company does, you know, X billion dollars from this. But that story is what you're trying to focus on with the brand. Story is the heart, you know, why all of this started in the first place. What was the heart of it? What was it? Why did they have to fulfill a need? What was the need and how did they fulfill it? And how do you, as a consumer or as another business, Most writers do B2B. How do you fit into that? And you are trying to connect with your story too. Other businesses will see your values and what you stand for. And if they share those with you, then they know they're going to be a good fit for working with you.

Yeah, that resonates. I see what you're saying now that, you know, it could be a, you.

Know, a billion dollars, how they've changed as a company over the years to fulfill that vision and mission. So I, you know, I think even as a small company or solopreneur, your brand story really doesn't change. There are a few alterations. But how you started, why it started, it might be that, you know, I'm into healthy products, healthy eating and things like that. So those are a lot of companies I pay attention to. And it's very interesting to see how they started. You know, maybe the founder had some sort of disease or ailment and she could not find the right products and they were making her sick. So she designed that, so she built that. So those are things that are okay. Because then from there you're saying, and today, now the company does, you know, X billion dollars from this. But that story is what you're trying to focus on with the brand. Story is the heart, you know, why all of this started in the first place. What was the heart of it? What was it? Why did they have to fulfill a need? What was the need and how did they fulfill it? And how do you, as a consumer or as another business, Most writers do B2B. How do you fit into that? And you are trying to connect with your story too. Other businesses will see your values and what you stand for. And if they share those with you, then they know they're going to be a good fit for working with you.

Yeah, that resonates. I see what you're saying now that, you know, it could be a, you know, a billion dollar company, but the vision remains the same. The founding principles, why we do what we do. And I've heard the story many times, right. The mom who, you know, now has a kid with, you know, some condition where he has to eat certain things, but she couldn't find it, so she had to make it. And she wondered, why isn't anyone making something like this? And. Right. And people really connect with that, by the way, I think you can multiply that a bunch of times like that story is not taken because every story is new, authentic and individual unique. So what I'm hearing is even if that person sold the company at one point, as long as that company remains true to its founding principles and their big why it's really that story that people connect with. And it's got to be something beyond just making money, you know, So I don't think people are going to connect very much with. So, you know, this mom, she just wanted to really make a lot of money to retire early. Right? Like that.

That's me all.

Yeah, right. But people don't connect with that, so.

No, they don't.

I get it. All right, so let's talk about positioning and where positioning fits into brand story. Is it something that happens later? We don't have to take a deep dive there. But I just want to make sure that I understand where these things fall within the range of brand story and branding and all that.

No, absolutely. So I will say brand story and positioning are the same thing. There isn't a difference. And if I understand you correctly, positioning is about establishing your brand's identity and your value proposition. And of course, we just talked about meaningful value proposition as well. So your story is about your identity and why you're an authority in what you do. It tells your audience really why they can trust you. And as you position yourself where your audience is, and that's going to help you build on your reputation, it's truly amazing how much your brand story can help you establish credibility and place you or position you in a way that the right consumers or the right clients are going to be drawn to you. So I will mention this, that what good brand storytelling is really about. Just a few things to keep in mind. If you tell the story right, you are setting expectations, you're clarifying your message, you're highlighting your vision and emphasizing your motives. You're showing your audience that you're interested in solving their problem or multiple problems. You're motivating your audience to support you. You're taking them on a journey by focusing on something meaningful to them, and you're building relationships. So that's what you're trying to do with your brand story.

That resonates then. I do agree, positioning, when done right, shares so much of the elements you. You talked about. Because the way I define it is really the perception you want to create in the marketplace. Right? And everything you talked about is about perception. Let's talk about common misconceptions. When you talk, especially with clients or prospects, you know, when you talk to them about this, what are some of the common misconceptions that you hear so interesting?

And you're right that when I talk to people, and even, sad to say, webinars, because I do attend other webinars and workshops on this topic, I like to keep up on it, and I walk away shaking my head. There is so much miscommunication out there about that and even a lot of things that I've had to learn. So first and foremost, one of the things that I'll mention is there's a difference actually between story versus storytelling. And of course, all of us as writers, I think we get that. We know that there's the story itself, but storytelling is the act of telling your story. So you do want to differentiate between the two. It is not, and I mentioned this at the outset, really. But your brand story is not marketing, okay? It isn't you putting up your website or designing this logo or posting on your social media all the pretty fonts and colors and saying, hey, that's my brand. That is not. That's the makeup that a woman puts on herself. That's the example, I guess I can come up with. You know, the woman's already there, and you're just making it pretty. So marketing is designed to make your brand story stand out, but the brand story comes first. It also is not a sales pitch. I think I talked about that earlier. But because it's such a soft or warm sell, you don't need to keep pitching yourself, which is really nice. It also isn't your products. It isn't your services, your programs, or your books. That is something that really is a challenge in working with clients because they are attached to those things. Or even as writers and, you know, speaking for myself, too, it's like, well, these are the products I have, or these are the things that I do. And your mindset is, well, I need to focus on these things and telling the story on those. And that's not your brand story. And the reason is, and I think I mentioned this earlier, those things can change. So if you're an author, for example, you write a book, well, maybe you're going to write more books, you know, so you can't place your brand on that or your logo. You know, you can't create this logo design based on maybe one of your products. Well, then the product changes or over time. I mean, I've been in business since 2008. Things have changed over the years and so I can't place my hopes and, you know, everything elements on the things that I do because those have changed. So you have to focus more on the brand story itself. So the brand story again is the core, it's the foundation. So it affects everything you do. I mean it, this is your reputation and everything that you do, you know, your books, your products, your services, all of that stuff should elevate that reputation. It affects your company culture, the employees you hire, your operations, how you run your business, and of course the products and the services that you provide. So it's more than simply when you build your brand story, it's more than a simple interview with the CEO and then, okay, I'm going to create a story from that. This is something that takes weeks to months of research, digging, understanding the purpose of the company, what their future goals are, their standard operating procedures. And if they're a larger company, they have a lot it builds. And when you build a story too, it involves a lot more people. You're talking leadership, C suite executives, stakeholders, employees and other people. These are even in small businesses too. I mean, depending on the size of your business, it's different. With solopreneurs, there's a lot of things that wouldn't necessarily count for you. But if you have a business and you have employees, you know, that is something that's going to take a lot more time. So it's not something as, as you can tell that can be accomplished overnight. This was a very huge, labor intensive process. But I will say from personal experience, it's worth the effort. So you want to make sure that your foundation, just like building a house, right? Have the foundation first and then you add the framework and then you add all of the decorations and the paint and all the, you know, stuff that I like to do. Right. But none of that's going to hold up if the foundation isn't there. So the same thing with your brand story, that is your foundation. So that has to be in place. And if you have a client that Maybe they have a brand story, but now they're looking for a rebrand. They need to make some changes, then that's an opportunity too, where you can spend time with them. And all that effort is certainly going to be well spent on that.

Well, you mentioned solopreneurs. Let's talk a little bit about that and the application of brand story to a solopreneur. So, for example, I guess somebody might be asking themselves, well, listen, I'm doing this because I thought that this would give me more freedom and make a little bit more money, and I thought it'd be more fun. So that's kind of the extent of it. I don't know what to tell you about my story here, my purpose beyond making money. So have you noticed if for businesses, especially for solopreneurs, where what they do seems very transactional, if this is a bigger challenge.

Yeah, you know what? And I understand that. I really do. Like I said, I've been in business since 2008, and I'm not trying to, you know, to hype myself up. I don't mean to sound snooty with this, but I am talented, I am skilled. I'm interested in a lot of things. And so for a long time, I felt like I was banging my head against the wall because I'm so skilled. I don't know what to do with it, you know, so that was kind of my issue. And you're right, I became transactional. I was like, well, I can do anything. Well, most of the writers can. I mean, you know, face it, we can. We can do just about anything. The question is, what do we want to do? Why do we want to do it? And so it wasn't until I had to pull myself back and I started researching and I started putting all this together. That's where brand story came out of when I started to reshape my business. And it was so eye opening at the end. And I. I will say this. My marketing and all of the things that I'm doing that have come out of it and even what I do to offer people so much easier, it took a long time because I did it myself. And it was a massive process. I didn't know, you know, I just didn't have the resources like that I put together for my clients. I didn't have any of that. I had to do it on my own. So this is what I would recommend for solopreneurs that are kind of going through this because we are competing with everyone. Let's just face it, everybody is our competition the noise that's out there, right? And you know what I mean by noise. So you know, that is our competition. So the first thing is, keep in mind, we can't fight it. It is what it is. So relax. And when you're thinking of brand story, the first thing that you want to realize is that it helps you or it helps show you as authentic and trustworthy because anyone can say anything. So, for example, on LinkedIn, right, we see a lot of people that, oh, they have these grandiose titles, they kind of inflate themselves. And I've done this and that, and these are all my clients. Well, you know what, good for them. But your story, you being you is a lot more relatable and people connect better with that. You are showing them through your story that you're human. And you're also telling them that, well, I've been through X, you understand them, but here's what you've learned and these are the solutions. So that's what people need to hear. It's a slow build with connection, but those are the people who are going to be loyal to you. So that's really the first thing that I would recommend for that. The second thing related is remember that you are unique, so your competitor might do the same services as you. Like I said earlier, right, we're all writers. We can do just about anything. Sure. I can do a white paper, I can do a newsletter. There are a lot of people out there who also do brand stories for their clients. I get it. However, the difference is they're not going to do it the way that you do it. They're not you. So your story is about who you are. And no one can duplicate that. You know, no one can duplicate your personality. So that's what you need to make sure shines. And the third thing is recognize that you already have the skills, right? You're a writer, you can do white papers, you can do newsletters, you know, podcasts, you know, you can do all of that stuff, right? You're already there. It's all over your website. People know that. What they want to know is who are they spending time with for the next six months or longer. They want to know your personality. And so that, again, is where you need to shine. Don't worry about selling your skills. Just shine with yourself. So the key is shape your own brand story first. You know, understand before you do anything else. Especially. And maybe like myself, I've been in business for a long time, and so this was only a couple years ago that I realized something's wrong or something's missing or I don't know. And that was the thing. I had this big question mark. So you need to understand first and foremost who you are before you try to tell anyone else. Your story, when you have that put together, is going to guide you in the right direction of what really drives you, what you're passionate about, and what you really want to do. And I'm often surprised by what story reveals about us and where our passions lie. So when you put your story together, there are things about you that you might discover that you didn't know were there and even how to effectively market that. So you have to put your own brand story together first, and then that's going to help you understand, oh, this is what I want to do, or this is how I want to do it.

So if I'm understanding you correctly, this is not about chest beating. This is not about telling people that, oh, here are all my qualifications. Again, people don't care what you do or how you do it until they understand why you do it and what you're about. Right. So even if on the surface you think the story is kind of boring and it's no different from anybody else's, you are unique. And, you know, maybe as you start unpacking it, this is my interpretation of what you said. So tell me if I'm on the right path. It might on the surface feel very unceremonious. You just, hey, you know, maybe I got laid off. And I figured, you know, I started looking and I couldn't find anything. I said, you know what? Screw it. I'm gonna do this on my own, and I'm gonna go out there and I got skills, I got experience. But so you start peeling the layers and you realize, you know, what does that say about me? Well, it showed courage, it showed res. Showed resourcefulness. And along the way, here have been some of the obstacles that I've overcome and some of the experiences that I've had. And I took three months to travel the world two years later. And I mean, like, Right. I think even personal experiences can really showcase what you are about, because those experiences, by the way, if used correctly, can help you turned out better work for clients. Because using that example of traveling the world for three months, you are a different person when you come back. Right. So I'm not saying you have to do that. I'm just making this up as I go along, but. Right. That should all come out in your brand story as a solopreneur. And that's either going to resonate with some people or it won't. And that's okay, because what I'm hearing from you is, hey, guess what? The ones that it resonates with, like you said, they're gonna be way more sold by the time you get to a conversation than you would they would otherwise. And I think that's really powerful.

Yeah, you're attracting like minded individuals through your story because you have certain values that you're showcasing through your story. I mean, people can tell, you don't have to list your values. I mean, they can tell, you know, as they get to know you through your story. And these companies are saying, you know what that person looks like, they have the same kind of vision and they're going in the same direction. I think it'd be great to partner with this person. And so that's what you're looking for. You're trying to weed out people who just don't fit, essentially is what you're doing. And keep in mind too, because I know you said earlier your stories might be similar to other people. You know, the truth is it isn't. Because again, if the story is based on you and your experiences and your personality, okay, sure, maybe you went through the same experience as someone else, but you viewed it differently, you came out of it differently, you learned different things. So it really is unique and individual and that's what you're aiming for with your brand story.

That makes perfect sense. As we wrap up, I have one more question for you which is for somebody listening who's excited about the thought of brand story, and they want to maybe consider offering this for their own client. The first. And one of the things that I heard you say is do it for yourself first.

Yes.

Right. So absolutely on board with that. That makes perfect sense. But what are some of the simple steps they can take to maybe learn more about this and see if this is something they want to really explore and start offering to clients? Yeah.

So you are right with that. You need to put it together yourself first. And the reason too, with that is you really need to see what the process is and the things that you'd be looking for. Because like I said, it isn't just a simple interview with the CEO and you're like, okay, I'm just going to put a story together. There are so many more things involved in that. And when you put your own story together, you realize that. And if you do it on your own like I did, it's going to take you a while. And not saying you can't do that. You can certainly research that. There are some books out there I've discovered. I'm writing one now, but anyway, my editor doesn't have it yet, but I'm almost there. But my website also has tons and tons of information, free articles on brand Story. What that means, what it's about, how to go about it. But be realistic, because it takes months. This isn't something that takes, you know, is that's gonna. You're able to do overnight or, you know, of course you can get training, somebody who obviously does it for a living to help guide you through it. I mean, that's always something to consider, too. But some people, you know, it just depends on what your budget is. But the second thing, too, I'm just gonna be honest. It is very hard to find prospects who value Brand Story or even see the need themselves. As we kind of discussed earlier, there are so many misconceptions about it. So it is difficult, it's not impossible. But with that said, what I would do is I'd focus on your current clients, people that you've been working with that you've come to know. So look at their company. What is it that's missing? First of all, do they have a brand story? If not, well, there you go. If that's missing, if their marketing is all over the place and they're just, you know, spitting stuff out, that communication is askew, and so there's a problem there. Is our company culture askew also? Are there sops all over the place? Is there confusion and miscommunication internally? Can their employees. Not just employees. What about their C Suite executives? What about board members? Are they all sharing the same story of what the company is that they work for, what it's about? Or is everyone telling a different story? There's a problem there. So you can look for those missing elements and those problems to try to help them and then share with your client the points that we've already discussed of how valuable it is to have your brand story in place.

Basically, this is a journey, a journey of exploration that starts with educating yourself, learning as much as you can about it, doing this for your own business as a solo professional, and then continuing on and starting with existing clients. I think that's a brilliant idea because you already have the relationship and the trust there, so it might be easier to open up a discussion. There's a. So you mentioned your website. Where can I send listeners who want to learn more about you, your work, maybe learn a little bit more about Brand story.

Sure. So thank you so much for asking my website. Hopefully it's easy. It's jmlacy. Com so J M L A C E Y dot com I would recommend too signing up for my newsletter writer. Authentic. I know that you're a subscriber too, and you've noticed I highlight a lot about Brand Story and how to put all that together. But what's also cool is when you sign up, you get a free download. It's a guide. 10 questions to ask yourself to find your brand story. So if you're saying, oh, I need to start my brand story, that is why I designed that guide. And of course, the website has tons of articles on it where I discuss four keys and articles on that. And then this week, of course, you and I are doing this podcast. Now. By the time it goes out, the newsletter and the article will be out. But this week I'm sharing in my newsletter and on my website the seven steps to shape your brand story narrative. This is a question I've received from many who have attended my webinars that, you know, I want a guide. I'd love to have a how to. And so I created that based on that feedback. And very quickly, very I will mention this to people too. It's one of my favorites. And I'm not getting paid to say this. I wish I was. The History Channel, they have series the Food that Built America, the Brands that Built America, How Disney Built America. If anyone has seen it or if you haven't, watch some of those programs because they are so fascinating. They share the story of how these things got started. And so as you're looking at the series, just take note of what is shared, the things that are shared. That actually moved you, why you're suddenly inspired now to buy the product, or maybe how you view the product differently. I think I mentioned these programs because there's such good examples of how to shape your story and what emotionally connects people. And so as you're looking at that, it can help you think of your own story. What are things in your story that would help people connect with you? What how they see themselves in you.

In your story, I would add to that. And by the way, I've watched some of those series. They're fantastic. I would add to that the podcast How I Built this. It's an NPR podcast and it's with founders of these many brands that we all know about, and it's fascinating to get into the story. That's an excellent recommendation, by the way, because it really does get you thinking about. Oh, I get it. I see what's really moving me here. So how can I replicate that in terms of uncovering that with clients and with my own story? Good stuff. I'll make sure to put a link in the show notes to Jonna's website, so make sure to check it out. And of course, don't be surprised, as some people say. Hey, that issue you mentioned that I missed, because I'm just now listening to this. Can you send it to me? So, you know, I'm not telling people to do that, but don't be surprised if they do.

That's okay. That's okay. Well, once you sign up for the newsletter, too, you actually have access to all the back issues, too.

Oh, okay. Perfect. Okay. That's awesome. Well, Jonna, thank you so much. This has been a wonderful conversation. I've learned so much. I got notes here on my little cheat sheet, and I know that the audience really values and appreciates all these insights, so thank you.

Oh, thank you, Ed. I appreciate it. Thanks for having me.

Well, that's it for today. I hope you enjoyed the episode. And just a quick reminder to grab your free copy of my latest book, Earn More in Less time. The proven mindset, strategies and actions to prosper as a freelance writer. You can get your free copy@b2b launcher.com or you will also find the detail show notes to this and all my other episodes. Enjoy and have a great day.