Zoe McAlpine - from CEO to Coach and Consultant - Accelerator Member Profile

Welcome to the Business of Executive Coaching podcast. I'm Ellie Scarfe and I am extremely fortunate to have the wonderful Zoe McAlpine here with me today. Zoe is a coach, a consultant, an all round, top notch human being and before I go on too much. Welcome Zoe.

Thank you very, very lovely to be here.

Zoe, I, rather than introducing you with too, too much of the detail I know about you because I do know quite a lot about you, I, I wondered if you would be willing to give us a bit of an introduction and start with telling us a little bit about your corporate to coach story. What brings you to this career?

Sure.

Diving right in here, by the way.

Diving right in. I have the privilege of saying you bring me here, Ellie. This is our former relationship when I was CEO of a big four purpose organization here in Western Australia and was lucky enough to have you on our board of directors. And the exposure to executive coaching and what it could do for people is what, what led me here. Prior to that role, I had a couple of different executive roles in large charities that were Australia wide, which I was very, very passionate about. But a little difficult to find executive roles in charity here in wa. Most of them are based on the east coast. And then before that, a very long time ago, I trained as an accountant and landed very far from there. Over the years, mostly I think the thing I love most is the idea of what makes people tick, how do we get them, you know, really genuinely flourishing in their work so that they're both doing great work, but that it also results in great things for the organizations or the businesses that they're working for. So I think it's a, it's a bit of a hand in hand thing. And through, you know, more than 20 years leading people, I've always focused my professional development on anything in the people space. So I remember back, what AM I now, 42? So when I was 18, 24 years ago, I was luckily lucky enough to be on a management development program with the organization I was working for. And every module of this program that ran over a year was one day, except for one module which was two days. And that module was coaching and developing people for superior performance and business success. Oh wow. And it only took me a recent reflection to go hang on. I have been coaching for a long time and you certainly always told me that, that I've been a coach for a long time. I just did the formal certification later, but as I reflect, I realize I've been doing this for a very long time. And that was the module that I loved.

Yeah.

And I also really respected that they put two days into that, whereas they put one day into every tactical or mechanical part of the business module.

They were. They were probably a little ahead of their time. Not to age us or anything like that, but it wasn't the norm that coaching wasn't really the way that we taught about. Taught in terms of management and leadership at the time.

No, no, certainly not. It was a. You know, I look back on that development as a really formative time. My career, as I do probably two other roles, and I'm incredibly grateful because I was very young to be on that program, but I had leaders who had faith in me. And so that was. Was a real privilege and something I'm very grateful for because it did set me on my path of how do we get the best out of people? So this idea of. Of no longer, you know, looking for what's bad or what needs development or what's what needs critiquing and going. Actually, let's start with looking at what's being done really well and how do we play the strengths and. And get more of that great work where people feel a great sense of satisfaction and they're passionate about what they're doing as well as, you know, delivering great things for the business. I do look back on that and think that started my journey while I was the CEO of this WA organization I absolutely loved. I was. I was mad passionate about their mission. I loved the team and I loved the work. But I also had two young children who I love more than anything in the world and spent a lot of my time being guilty if I was at the office and being guilty if I was at home. I felt torn in both directions. I also was at the point where I'd been there for almost a decade. We'd been through two strategies. It was a community health organization and we'd been through Covid. It was time to pass the baton on, but I didn't want to do more of the same. And thanks to having always focused my PD on on people stuff, I had already done my level one coaching accreditation and that start my level two. So. So those things coincided with when I finished up there and slowly started building the business, which was about two and a half years ago now.

Incredible. And like, I think you speak to a pretty common, common experience of coaches, which is this thread of knowing that you are always passionate about the people and about the development, your own and others, and that you find joy in these things that might not have been the most common things. To find enjoyable throughout your career. And it was always people and it was always development and it was always, you know, leading, perhaps in a, in a slightly different way. And it sounds like that was it for you.

Certainly, certainly. And I love the notion when we think about people of involving them in the way we so seeking feedback of their experience, understanding what makes them buzz each day when they think of coming to work, what makes you jump out of bed and get excited about coming to work and how do we dial up more of that and, and then watching the results, you know, you seek people's feedback and then you deliver back to them and you, you help them enjoy their work and grow in their work and progress through their career. And there is just such joy in that. Yeah, I have a real business brain. I, you know, I do. My second professional love after people is what makes businesses work, how do we grow businesses, how do we start them? But when you combine those two passions, that's where the real great work happens and that's where real results happen. And I, I don't think you can do it without bringing the people along with you.

Absolutely. And you know, having worked with you in, in various capacities. So for, you know, to, to let people know. Zoe is a member of the corporate to coach accelerator and we work together. When her organization was a client of mine and I was on the board of, of this organization and you know, I had the privilege of seeing Zoe CEO and, and leading in a way that I think is, is extraordinary and also quite uncommon in her, her people focus and her strength focus and her real passion for team and the importance of team over and above, you know, any individual leader. So I, you know, I can really, I can really reflect that back as well. So Zoe, you made the move into coaching and consulting. Can you tell us a little bit about what your business entails now?

It's so interesting, Ellie. You know, I've been privileged to be a member of the corporate coach accelerator and prior to that, the Impact Coach Collective. Yeah, first iteration. Yep. From the early days. And I think the thing I noticed for me and for lots of the other participants is that we land so far from where we thought we might be. If that makes sense. Yes. And I went into this wanting to really do purist coaching as many clients as I could. And with the encouragement of the collective, I have found my capability in other areas of consulting, business strategy, business strategizing, and certainly, I guess the biggest coaching adjacent offer for me, facilitation. Yes. And now it's really probably 50, 50 individual coaching clients and facilitation work. And funnily enough, the facilitation work is bringing me as much joy as the coaching because I'm having a hand in the change. I'm having a growth. I was lucky enough a couple of weeks ago to facilitate a workshop for an organization that already has something like 95% engagement. Wow. Working with leaders who don't believe in being complacent, who believe in, you know, if there's always room for improvement, how do we move the needle for the team and with the team. Yeah. So the, the offering has certainly shifted. I've had the privilege of working with clients I could never have dreamed of. Major authorities here in Australia, major corporates, as well as some, you know, startup small businesses. Leadership is lonely. Right. And if leadership is lonely, then starting your own business is even lonelier. Walking alongside those people who are starting their brand new businesses and need accountability, support and need ideas and I guess, you know, to stray a bit from purist coaching. Need advice.

Yes.

Has been just such a privilege and a joy. I mean, I feel like they sound like buzzwords. I must have said them about five times since we started talking, but it, it really is. Yeah.

No, get it. And what I, what I think is really interesting from your story, that is in fact a common theme with a lot of people working in coaching businesses, is that what we thought our offers were going to be when we start is really not necessarily what they'll be at the end. And I think the lessons in that are multiple. I think one is hold your expectations lightly because things will shift, but also be open to the possibility that it's going to be better than you could have imagined it would be. When you explore these different parts of you. And is that what you've experienced?

Absolutely. I think that second point you made is so infinitely true. Better. And if you keep your mind open and you hold your offering lightly, you end up with opportunities that you couldn't have dreamed of. Yeah. And I think as well we forget what we're capable of. Yeah. You know, it's, it's 20 years since I really had my brain in the accounting headspace, regardless of the fact that's my degree. But I now actually do some work in the finance space. Yeah. With some clients. And that blows my mind. It's not, it's not my core, you know, it's not, it's not my first love. And it probably takes a little bit more of my energy rather than giving me energy.

Yes.

That space. Whereas to work in the leadership space and the team growth and development space just energizes me no end. But actually I'm, I'm astounded by what I'm capable of. Because when you are in that hustle mode of startup, you, you're obviously tempted to take on work that might not be your core. Yes. And so that's been a really interesting learning for me.

I love that. And actually I like a message of pragmatism as well. And I think a lot of, you know, business coaches might have some messaging out there, which is you just do only the one thing that you want to do with only the people that you want to do it. And on the one hand I'm like, yeah, you go, you do that. But the other part of me is deeply, deeply practical, which is that when we are building businesses, we sometimes can't be picky.

Right.

And you might be lucky enough not to have to worry about income, but if you do, I think it is really helpful to have a few tools in your toolkit, particularly if they're tools that people want to pay for. And, and what we want is, we want those to be coaching adjacent so that the trajectory is towards the blend of work that you most passionately want to do. And I, and I love that. I think it's a. Yeah. Practical and aspirational 100%.

And I think there's a difference between what we market and all the things we can do.

Yes.

You know, I haven't mentioned in complex organizations where it's incredibly difficult to articulate one thing that we do. But you can't bombard the market with so many messages that no one's clear on what you do.

No.

So, you know, we, you and I both know how much I dread posting on LinkedIn and other platforms. We know how much I hold my breath every time I push the button in case someone finds me out or calls me out wrong or all those things. But some really helpful learnings that have come from the accelerator for me are that you can't market everything.

No.

And those adjacent offers often come through referrals or I've had a client as a coaching client and then I'm able to add on with adjacent offers.

Yes.

So I don't necessarily market that. I market really quite core as a coaching facilitator. Yeah. All of the consulting work that I do where I've been able to add equal value in different ways, you know, that that kind of sits alongside or behind it, but it might not be the, you know, the one or the two things that I Market day to day if that makes sense.

Does. And so just to be contrary, do you have a set of ideal clients or people that you, you know, add value to most in the work that you do? Because I feel like there are definitely people who would be very drawn to your background but I can see that you would also add value to quite a broad range of clients which has been your experience. How are you thinking about ideal clients?

Love that you're being contrary with me.

I can't help myself.

It's really challenging when we say who are my ideal clients. To be honest, it comes back to my passion and I say well people because if I look at the range that I work with, they're so varied. Like I say, they're the small business startup.

Yeah.

All the way through to big corporates. And it's such, it's such a joy to work with all of them in different ways. If I do think about my a group offer that I've started up that's going gangbusters which is called the Monday Business Mastermind. I. I'm looking to support people who may not be in a position to have one to one executive coaching and or who may find themselves lonely as leaders or in that startup phase but still need a connection point either once a month or once a week to set themselves up for the week for success. Now that ideal client is absolutely probably more the small to medium either startup or general manager or own business type. Yeah. Of person who you know, perhaps doesn't have a full executive team because they're not at that size. Businesses that don't have a head of marketing, ahead of finance, ahead of operations and ahead of administration as well as the CEO or general manager. When you have that kind of crew you've got a great rumble group to go through anything. You know, it's like your internal advisory board. But when you don't have that to be able to have someone external to bounce those things off is incredibly helpful. So that's kind of how I liken that group. And that's probably not for the big corporate CEO estate manager. No, not that group. So ideal client, they're certainly a bit more niche.

Well and I can see why you're perfect for that client because you've got this, you've got this set of experiences that mean you've had experience, exposure to all of these aspects of business through your experience and having to be in a fairly large for purpose organization but still having to be pretty scrappy with your funding which meant you're operating high level but you're having to wear so many hats and those are pretty amazing skills and exposures for that group of people who need this.

Yeah. Look, I appreciate that, Ellie. You're always incredibly complimentary. And I also agree. You know, I, I often say anyone that can lead in a for purpose or charity organization is probably more equipped because they, you know, we're dealing with an extra layer of often, you know, being expected to, to run like a corporate business but on the smell of an oily rag. And we're also usually dealing with three sets of stakeholders rather than two sets of stakeholders. You know, it's, it's not business and customer. It's business, customer and the people who fund the business, but they're not the customer often. Yeah. So we're dealing with a triangle rather than a linear relationship. I find that, you know, if you, if you can do that well, then you're probably well set up to be able to run your own business or to, to run it, a direct corporate kind of organization. Because you, you become very resourceful and very resilient at the same time.

Yeah. And in terms of the, the coaching and the facilitation work you do, what sort of organizations have been drawn to, to you and to your work in, in that field? Because I know they're pretty. Some big players there.

There's some big players which has been, you know, really both rewarding, a lot of fun. Yeah. You know, work with some big teams and to work with organizations that have resources. Right. I'm also continuing to work with an early childhood education center that is ahead of its time in terms of leadership development. You know, that's an industry where leaders are usually placed into their roles because they've been fantastic on the floor caring for the children, but not necessarily always equipped with all of the skills and the toolkit to manage. Yeah. Whereas this organization sees that. And so I'm having the, the privilege of working with their leadership team to develop their leadership muscle and skills. And that's been just amazing. Grow and I hope that, that they can be a leader to search and reapply that to all centers across the state. I am working with a couple of small business startups, which is again, really fun, but also you become a real trusted advisor and that's a really, really big honor. Yeah. Starting a business is scary. Yes. The person that, that my clients call and just say, oh, you know, I feel like this is all going to fall over or, you know, I'm really worried. And to be able to walk alongside them through that and help Them figure out what their options are and how they want to proceed is really wonderful. Also working with some fantastic senior executive leaders in both state and national roles who are ready for the next step. You know, they're ready to be CEO. And to help them develop their confidence in that is truly amazing. These people have got it all within themselves. I'm not really doing a whole lot, but yeah, to be there for them is great. In terms of who picks me, I think it's, you know, we say that purist coaching, it doesn't matter what your background is. My experience is that it really does matter. The people that select me to be their executive coach or select me to facilitate workshops or planning or feedback from their teams are people who look at my background and go look, that matches what we do in some way.

Yeah, yeah. So you're. You understand the complexity of what we're dealing with here or you have insights into our context that, that others might not have.

Yeah, yeah. So whether it's. And that's where I tend to find the work that I'm winning is in the space of culture transformation, because I've been through and the transformations. It's in the space of positive psychology in the workplace because I'm a massive advocate for it and quite passionate about its results. It's in the space of strategic planning and development for organizations that want to grow because I've grown organizations, or it's in the face of small business startup because I've started my own business and have been involved in other startups. Yeah, that makes sense.

It does. And so, you know, you. In terms, if we lean into that idea of, of growing a business, you know, what have, what have you learned about yourself through the process of growing your own business? Because I think we know when we do our coach training that we go through, you know, deeply personal development journey. And I think the same thing happens when we start a business. And I'm wondering what your experience has been.

What's my experience? It can be incredibly scary at times. I think if it wasn't scary in those first couple of years, it'd be weird.

I think, yes.

Fear is of itself, usually motivating. I've found ways to make sure it's no longer paralyzing because that's not helping to anyone. Yeah, it can be incredibly rewarding. Flexibility doesn't mean less hours. And I, I don't think I ever thought it would mean less hours. And I appreciate the flexibility, but, you know, certainly I do as many hours as I did when I was a CEO. And the learning about which of those hours generate revenue and which don't. Yes. Interesting as well. When we analyze business, I have learned, I have learned, but not yet mastered to work faster and just implement, get it into the market and perfect when it's out there. I have also learned, like I said earlier, that your clients come from the places you never thought of. My, my biggest mantra in life has always been just put your best foot forward at every turn will be okay. Yes. That has probably grown to just put your best foot forward at every turn and things will succeed.

Yeah, I love that. I love that. And being, being in a position where you are ready to do that.

Right.

So it doesn't rely on just in the moment, you know, coming up with something, but having done the work, and I know you have done the work around getting clear on, on what you do and how you operate and knowing your, I guess, your perspectives on coaching and development and people. And I think that means that when you're in having those conversations, you're very compelling. So I can imagine that your best foot forward is a very good foot.

So very lovely.

All true.

So.

Ups and downs. Totally, totally get that. Tell us about some of the challenges. I think you've touched on it, but what have you found the most challenging about. About being in business as a coach?

Look, I think especially with executive coaching and with facilitation, income is lumpy.

Yes.

And it's not necessarily connected to when you have to do the work. Yes. But you can invoice, especially if you have, you know, you pay in advance or you sell coaching packages. Six or 12 months, you may have a fantastic month of income where you're not actually doing much work.

Yes.

And then you may have 11 months where you're delivering and not bringing in much income. So I think that's important. And you need to leave enough space to do all the delivery. You can't just keep selling.

Yes.

Saying no is tricky. Yes. I've found that hard because I hold myself to high standards. I want to serve, anyone wants to service. But b, also, I've got the realities of life. You know, little kids, mortgage. My husband's in his own business too. So that has been a big change for us, both of those who are incredibly corporate pre Covid and really by necessity we've shifted in this direction, but also out of desire to go. And so shifting our expectations, I think has been huge. The best advice someone gave me long before I went out on my own was as soon as you can set a salary and just pay that from your business?

Yeah.

This idea of taking the good months when they come and, and then breaking out in the bad months, if that makes sense.

Excellent advice. I highly recommend it.

Yeah. And even if you increase your base salary as things get better. Yes. Do you know what your fortnightly or monthly expectations are when you, when you. Regardless of your pay cycles? Whereas you know, I think if you have a fantastic month selling 12 months worth of work and assume every month will be like that. Yeah, it's a lot of trouble. Quite quick.

Amazing. One of the other things I want to dive into that you mentioned was, was challenging when you started out was this. I think you said that you hate posting on LinkedIn or something like that. But, but to me it's sort of that visibility piece that showing up in a, in a different way or in a way that is a little bit contradictory to who we want to be as coaches, which is very other oriented and suddenly we're sort of expecting ourselves to, to, to show up as an expert or as a, you know, as a person that we want people to view as a thought leader or, or someone up there. Tell us about how you have, you know, gotten comfortable with it.

It's interesting. It's an ongoing dance, I would say. I don't think there and I'm not as consistent as I want to be. I need lots of coaching and lots of poking and holding to account. But I'm certainly better than I was and I hope to be better than I am now tomorrow and going forward. Getting comfortable, I'm still not. And I think anyone that expects to just get comfortable, you know, they're probably trying to get to a destination that doesn't exist. I think it's more about just understanding that it's part of business development. Yeah, it just, I love that.

So, so my question might have been flawed. Not how did you get comfortable, but how do you do what you need to do anyway?

Well, actually I'm not good at it every week and that is something I have to watch. You know, when I have busy delivery of coaching and facilitation, I get slack on the posting. But then that creates more of the ups and downs with the income, you know. So how do I do it? I think it's incredibly important to say things that we believe in and not to play a part. And that certainly helped me. That makes sense. If I'm trying to be someone I'm not, that's not helpful and not comfortable. Yeah, I think just seeing the results and going, you know what it is like I said, it is part of bd. It's got to be. But also getting feedback from people I had. One of my very early clients was someone I have known in my former industry for probably 15 years. And she literally sent me a post saying, sent me a message saying, your posts bring sunshine to my day. And it's reminded me we need to catch up.

That's so beautiful.

And we had coffee and almost two years on, I continue to work with her and her team. Amazing remembering those things.

Yeah.

Someone saying, oh, loved your post. It really spoke to me. And something you've told me is remembering that anyone that doesn't like my posts are not my people.

Yes.

And you know, as a human, if you looked at my, I don't know, my Hogan profile or my disc or my via strengths or whatever, you'll see that I'm a people pleaser and that I don't like to upset people and I don't like to spot controversy. So that has been something I've had to cut through and go, it's okay, not everyone will like me. So that's, that's been interesting. Great advice from you and other strategists. As I was starting up to, to pick one thing and focus on that and then, you know, and how to set up my content pillars and all of that is very helpful. But the reactions from people are probably the most helpful and the business. Yes.

And I often think about that. And one of the things that, that I find helps me to continue giving this advice to people about showing up and, you know, just being consistent is that it works. And you know, it's really annoying, I think, for some people because like, God, if it didn't work, then I could stop doing it. But it, but it does. And, and so, you know, I feel, I feel okay being the, the LinkedIn bully.

You know, I'm just getting a bully bone in you. But you're very good at encouraging it. And I think the other piece is it's not most of the time, it's not actually about direct business. It's about building ongoing cred and reminding people you exist so that when they have a need that matches what you offer, they automatically think of you.

Exactly.

It's that. Yes.

And such a good way of thinking of it.

If I could go back to pre coaching and pre owning my own business, I would have worked harder to build my own profile. People used to ask me what I would do, what I do, and I would say I work for this organization. Whereas actually I don't think I Ever once said, I'm the CEO of interesting. And I think I could have built a much bigger profile. Whereas I was so focused on the clients and the team and the work. And had I put more effort into building my profile rather than trying to almost lead from behind, it would have been good for the organization as well as for me. I don't know why I didn't think that was the right thing to do, but it certainly would have helped me when I got to startup mode, have a more known profile. Yeah. So I, you know, if anyone's thinking about making the leap and knowing that they're still six or 12 months or two years off from doing it, I would really encourage them to think about starting to build their profile now.

Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. I've been thinking a lot about this idea of power and how we sort of get comfortable with owning an identity that involves us really feeling confident in our professional credibility. And I think part of that is exploring, particularly for women, I think this is very difficult, this idea that I can be powerful in my role, I can be powerful in how I put myself out there and I'm playing with it for myself, but also I see it in people in the accelerator, which is that in some degree, that's what I'm asking you to do, and I'm suggesting that you do. Is really owning this part of you that is deeply credible and is super compelling. And.

Yeah. 100. I think that is akin to this idea of taking up space.

Yes.

Yep. Okay. To take up our fair amount of space. And, you know, if. If I could instill one thing in my daughter from. It would be take up space and enjoy it. People want to. They love you. You're a gorgeous presence. Be there.

Yes.

And I think that power piece is. Is the same, but power and ambition for women are dirty words. Yeah. And we haven't cut through that. And I think there's also a little bit of Australian tall poppy in there as well, buying the two. So if you say, okay, power and ambition are dirty words for women. And certainly Australians see anyone as, you know, who's got their shoulders back and using their power as. As a bit.

Well, what do we say? Yeah, you're full of yourself. You. You know, we need to. And for anyone who's not Australian, it's called the tall poppy syndrome, because people who are perceived as sort of standing out of the crowd, the tall poppy, need to be cut down. And that there's like a cultural norm of. Of that which, yeah, I think is. That's Very true.

It's hard because people are looking for not aspirational, as imperfect, but aspirational as in resilient and successful and able people work with, to advise them and to support them. And we are shifting business wise to a great mindset of. I don't have to do everything alone. No. I'm not here to be the subject matter expert on everything and to fix everything. As the CEO or the leader or the business owner or the manager, I am in this position to draw in all the resources that we as an organization need to get this done. And that includes executive coaches, that includes facilitators, that includes consultants, that includes strategists, which are all I can do and do. Yes. Of my experience and my training. But how will they know we're there if we don't put ourselves forward? Yes. Yeah. Reconcile. It is to put myself forward, but only in a way that is true to who I am, so that who they meet, if they select me, will be exactly who they saw show up on social media. Yeah.

Yes. Yes. So it's, it's embracing, taking up space, embracing that power, but in your way, not saying it has to be in a way that is, you know, the, the way that everyone else thinks it needs to be done.

Exactly, exactly. And because of who I am and the way I see myself in the world and the way I see people, I try to do it in a way that is not full of myself, you know, being a tall poppy. But I. I try to do it in a way that is seen as. Here's a trusted partner that can help you with some of your business challenges. Yeah.

And so what advice would you give someone who was thinking about starting their coaching business or has maybe been in business for a while, but is finding it. It difficult to. To move to the next stage?

Well, I. It's not the advice I would give, it's the advice I do give, which is to join. Join the accelerator. Thank you.

I did not pay Zoe any sort of commission for this, by the way.

She did not. But, you know, as recently as this week and this morning, I received an email back from someone who had been asking for advice. And I'd sent several pieces of advice about starting your own coaching business. And one of them was build your own personal board of advisors. Whether that be trusted friends and peers within your network that have the experience and the wisdom that you will need at times when you need to call on someone and. Or join a networking and learning and development cohort who are trying to do the same thing and that are from that same spirit of arising tide lifts all boats. We all hold each other up, we support each other. There are avenues to learn. There are people who have gone before you where you can get advice. There is a safe space to workshop your challenges and your ideas and that you can almost hustle together alongside each other in the progression of your business. Because there's more than enough work out there for everyone, Right? Yeah. More about finding your people. And. And the accelerator is a great way to find your people as well as get the learning and, you know, access to the things that we're all craving. The checklists, the toolkits, the education as to how to. How to build clients. Where do we look for leads? What are they? I think this notion of starting a business is all this whole idea of I want to use the skill set I have, so that's what we focus on. But we forget that there's a whole separate of set. Skill set in actually starting and running a business.

Yeah.

You know, my advice would be join the accelerator. But really what I'm saying is find what you need, you know, through that. Because don't think that by just doing the work you love doing, you're going to make money.

There's an interesting parallel, I think, too. So much of the work we do in coaching is coaching people who are going through a transition and coaching them to realize that, you know, as Marshall Goldsmith said, what got you there, what's going to get you here isn't. Didn't get you there. No, hang on. What is it?

What got you here won't get you there.

But I feel like. I feel like that's the same. The same message when we're starting our businesses, which is being a great coach is a very important part of this puzzle, but it's not enough. We have to actually step into our identity as a CEO as well.

Exactly. And being a CEO before. Before. And being an accountant before and being in other executive roles would not alone have me building a successful business either.

No.

You know, you have to learn all the things that you have to be on top of. Yep. Have to understand the implications. I mean, how many people do we know that did not know how to account for tax? Many businesses, you know, and you get those kinds of bills and they hit you between the eyes. Yeah.

I also include myself when I started my business in. In this bucket, by the way. So I'm not coming at this from a point of any form of superiority, but yes, put aside your tax.

Understand, you know, what are all the little things you need to think of. Yeah, this person that I sent the advice to the other day, I, you know, I gave a little spreadsheet in there of these are all the costs. You've got to think about those types of things and what's annual, what's monthly, what's one off as a startup. Yeah.

And what does it mean to be a supplier in an organization? And what is involved in corporate coaching as opposed to individual coaching? Like there are so many little pieces of the puzzle. You're right.

And what kind of buffer do you need at the start? And how do you deal with organizations that might have 60 day payment terms and they're bigger than you and you can't fight against that. You can't, you know, work. If you say no, it's payment terms. So how do you prepare for them? And I do believe that the job of managing a business is completely separate to the job of being an executive coach or a facilitator.

Yeah, I agree. I agree. Look, Zoe, I will, I will let you go. I could talk to you literally all day, but I want to say a huge thank you for coming and sharing your experience. I just know that what you've said is going to be very inspiring to people and. Yeah, and inspiring and relatable. I think, you know, we really, really heard that. If people want to check out what you're doing your business, where can they find you?

Best place to find me is on LinkedIn or Zoe mcalpine.com au is my website as well.

Fantastic.

They can also find me through you. Yes.

Well, I will link to all of those in the show notes. So it is amazing to have you. Zoe, thank you so much for being with us. And look, just to wrap up, if anyone is interested in experiencing what we do inside the account accelerator, I'm running a masterclass that you can sign up for. It's called Three LinkedIn Strategies to get your next three corporate clients. You can sign up at www.elliscuff.com forward/class LinkedIn. And if you think that the accelerator might be for you, just like it was for Zoe and she did give me a plug even though it was absolutely not planned. If you would like to get in before we rise, raise the prices at the end of June, do book in for an accelerator fit, call with me and I'll put that link in the show notes as well and we can just discuss, you know, how and whether the accelerator is a good fit to help you build your dream coaching business. So yeah, thanks again, Zoe. Really appreciate everything you do and everything you bring to our community inside the accelerator.

Thank you. It is a really fantastic community. Thank you. You.