#96: How Eric Floberg Cut 86 Minutes – 3:59 to 2:33 Marathon

Every step is taking you closer to the finish line, whether you like it or not. And so it's like, it's, it's the same correlation metaphor of your trainings. You know, every day that I work towards this race, this goal is another brick stacked and another, uh, day and progression forward of me getting to that place. And it's the same exact concept. How are you going to handle the inevitable suffering in whatever way it comes and power through it in the smartest way possible. And when I finally had the humility to actually listen and do those things is when I found a huge breakthrough. There's no recipe that just because people are patting you on the back whenever you have a good workout means that you're going to hit the time goal you set for yourself. Approach each day with the mentality of this is the long game, and I'm setting myself up for doing it over years of my life, if not decades of my life.

In this episode of The Extra Mile Show, I'm joined by Eric Floberg, a father of four from Chicago who improved from a 3:59 all the way to a 2:33 in the marathon. We discuss his remarkable running progress, his approach to race day mindset, and also advice that he has for different athletes looking to implement strength training into their running routine. Before we dive in, let me tell you about something that's been a game changer for both my wife and I. From time to time, I come across athletes who have low energy. They might have unexplainable injuries or just feel something is off. When I recommend them doing a blood test, they might uncover that they have low vitamin D levels, low iron levels, or something might be off with the thyroid. These are just a few examples. There are a few different ways that you can get your blood and hormone levels tested. You can either go through your doctor, or you can use Function Health, which takes a much deeper dive. Unlike standard checkups that typically measure just 19 biomarkers, Function gives you access to over 100 advanced tests covering everything— heart, hormones, thyroid, nutrients, and more. My biological age is 8 years younger than my calendar age, so that was also nice to see. The process is comprehensive with 25 tubes plus urine samples, but it's incredibly easy with 2,000+ testing locations nationwide. If you want to try Function, go to functionhealth.com/Floris FLOURIS currently has a waitlist, but they're offering my listeners a way to skip it. Just $499 a year for a full year of testing. Know what's happening inside. Test, don't guess. Go to functionhealth.com/floris. That is F-L-O-U-R-I-S. See also the link in my description. Hope you enjoy my conversation with Eric Floberg. Eric, first of all, I want to start, uh, start out by saying you're an absolute beast, my friend. I've been following your running journey for a while now. And I'm absolutely impressed by all the running progress you have made there. So well done there, first of all.

Thanks, Floris. Appreciate it. I can, I mean, it's a core memory of you screaming at me at mile 25 in the 2023 Chicago Marathon. I saw a handful of other people and then Floris Gierman who just screamed at the top of his lungs at me in the last mile was so encouraging. And it was at this point in this last stretch of the 5K where I was looking at the—

that was special seeing you fly by.

I love, like, I rewatch my vlog and that's one of my favorite parts where you're just screaming at your absolute highest register. Like, it was so— that was so awesome.

Well, maybe we just start out over there. That was one of your most epic races where you really had to dig deep. And I was indeed standing there at mile 25 and I saw you coming up from the distance. What was going through your mind at that point in the race?

Well, yeah, I mean, I knew that training block, I was coming off of a spring where I ran 2:48 and that was the first time dipping pretty well below the 3-hour mark. And so this one, I, it was a new echelon of racing where I was, you know, really aiming to potentially take another 10 minutes off my time. And I think I was in about 2:37, 2:38 shape that day. And my friend convinced me to go out a lot hotter than I wanted to at 6 flat pace, 6 flat mile pace. And when I was really wanting—

that's what friends are for, right?

The whole, like, 2 weeks before, I'm like, I think I'll just camp around the 6:05 to 6:10 range for a long time. And he's like, well, I'm going to be there and I'm going to be dropping 6 flat, so just come with me. And I'm like, oh, and I knew I'd rather be with someone the whole time. But yeah, by mile 15, 16, I started getting adductor cramps, which I'd never gotten before. And Yeah, late into the race, that was probably the most challenging part was just grinding through that. And, uh, yeah, I mean, I was, you know, like most people at mile 25 of marathon, just seeing stars at that point, but you can hear in the video, like your scream is up here. And then my, I matched it with like a, let's go, let's go Floris. So yeah, it was, it was just one of those, like, you know, that classic little fade in the last 4 miles where it's just like a mile feels like an entire marathon in and of itself. And you just have to keep repeating those horrifically long miles. But we got it done and dipped under 2:40 for a 2:39. It was a really special day.

That was one of the most exciting races I ever witnessed, to see the world record being broken. And then seeing Sifan Hassan flying by, winning that race too. And then you following just right after that. Yeah, it was, uh, that was, that was a special weekend for sure.

So yeah, there are definitely more important stories, and we knew, we knew that Kelvin would probably do it that day. And I, I saw him like as we were in A Corral and the elites walked through, um, and I even got a clip of him walking through, which it was just insanely special moment, obviously given the circumstance of him not being with us anymore. So Yes. Yeah. You just can't— you can't write those kind of stories. They just happen, you know?

Yeah. It was one of those very, very special days. So when you are in that spot, when you are in those stages, the very last stages of a race, like, yes, you have to some extent, like, pushed already pretty hard. Then mile 20 comes around, mile 23, mile 25. When you're at that point, how do you cope with being able to push through? What goes through your mind and how How do you work through that?

I mean, it's weirdly becoming more manageable as I get more experience in the distance. It feels like I just know what to expect so much more now. And alternatively, it feels like every race there's a new problem at that point, or, and I'm trying to mitigate that this block with more strength training, which I've never consistently done ever. And just doing a lot more research. And I think a lot of people kind of falsely assume that sodium intake is the reason for calf cramps when. I think a lot of the science is indicating that it's just a lack of strength and, um, your muscle's ability to sustain the effort. And so that's why it's a lot of your, your blood is going to the central parts of your body and your internal organs and leaving those extremities and your, your body's saying, stop it. And so, um, I think during that time it's, you know, obviously in training, I'm now trying to mitigate that possibility, trying to avoid that from happening, but when inevitably manifests in some sort of way, uh, you know, mile 20 and beyond, it's more so just, okay, what can I do? What's the smartest approach of what I can do to still run as fast as I can and get to the finish line as fast as I can, even though my body's not letting me do it in the way I want to? Because it's now, it's so much more frustrating in this circumstance because you're aerobically there, you're aerobically fit enough to do it. This was my 2024 Chicago. You know, I started negative splitting from mile 18 into 22, and then I rounded the corner onto Michigan going south and just my calves just started locking up and there's just nothing I could do about it. And it's incredibly frustrating. Um, but yeah, I think the overall answer to that is like earlier on it was much more of a suffer fest of like, wow, I don't, I don't remember, I've never really experienced this kind of suffering before. Whereas now, with, you know, a dozen marathons deep, I fully expect that. And then it's a different kind of fight. And so it's more of a, a question of how are you going to handle the inevitable suffering in whatever way it comes and power through it in the smartest way possible.

Yeah, one step at a time at that point, huh? It's, it really, really is. And It's tricky when I think a lot of people have never— you have to almost experience that a few times. What you're saying, you're seeing stars or you're seeing like some of those things. Like when I ran my very best races towards the end, it got to a point where like, yes, you've given it your absolute everything, you know, you want to like finish strong. But at some point my hearing started going like I started getting tunnel vision too, where it's like all you do is try to make yourself move forward. But very often I think sometimes people get scared of that part as well. If you're not familiar with that or you haven't been there, not saying like this is something we should celebrate. It's not that you get there that often, but it is something like, yeah, when you really like dig deep and hard, like some of these things can happen indeed in, in races.

One of my favorite things in those moments is just constantly telling myself that albeit every step is incredibly small and feels like no progress in the moment, every step is taking you closer to the finish line, whether you like it or not. And so it's like, it's, it's the same correlation metaphor of your trainings. You know, every day that I work towards this race, this goal is another brick stacked and another, uh, day and progression forward of me getting to that place. And it's the same exact concept. It's like. I don't care how distant it feels because especially when you're really bonking and maybe you're walking or something of that sort, you have to recognize in those moments it feels so far away because it is like if you're talking 5 miles on foot walking, that's a long distance to cover. But yeah, then motivating yourself to be like, well, if I'm capable of moving my body a little bit quicker, this is going to be over a little bit quicker and every single trudging step through this process will get me there faster. And yeah, just such a mind game. But it's, it's so, it's so cruel and wonderful, the marathon distance, because it's just that perfect amount that puts you on that edge most of the time.

Totally. And even when that happens, right, even when you're about to hit the wall, you're, you're, you're so close to like that edge and you think all hope is lost or like, I'm going to have to walk the next 5 or 6 miles in. You might be surprised what sometimes one gel or one shot of caffeine or something can do that you get a second wind again or a third wind and you start feeling alive and it can change the corner rather quickly again. And I think sometimes those stages are even more special at that moment when you get that second wind again. So for those listening who are not familiar with all of Eric's work, you have not one successful but two successful YouTube channels, which is like to pull that off the right way. And then being able to still run 70 to 80 miles a week and have 4 children at home that you're very actively involved in. That requires a lot of dedication, commitment, early morning runs, late evening runs. Tell me a little bit more about how you structure your day, how you're able to make all of this happen.

Yeah, I'm not— so I'm not a Type A person. I think a lot of people might be under the impression that I am. I'm actually pretty chaotic-minded person. Like Cyrus, my employee, will be the first to tell you, you know, most of the time we don't know what we're going to tackle until the day comes because we have so many stoves, so many pots on the stove. But with that, there are a lot of consistencies that remain within each of my days in a week. And it really, it really depends day to day based off of what the family is doing that day. Even circumstances like winter in Chicago right now, a huge snow day today. But I mean, a lot of, a lot of times I'm structuring now, it's, it's very different than what it was 4 years ago when I was, you know, running casually and, you know, for hobby. And now that it's so much a part of my career, I have the flexibility and I'm afforded the opportunity to be able to run in the middle of a workday. But that does mean that I have to cut into work time to do that as well. So I've been experimenting with new stuff, honestly, as of late in this block, and I was running in work hours a lot, and I really came to despise that because so much of my work would pile up and then I'd have to put out a fire and then all of a sudden I'm running at 10 PM. And that's where I recently did a little ad with BPN about dad hours and that being the case.

I love that piece, by the way. That was so well put together. I really thought it was relatable because I think there's a lot of people indeed who don't want to go on their long runs and take away from family time to that extent. And I think you explained that so well in that video right there.

I've historically really found a lot of success in early morning hours, especially when it comes to easy day running. Just getting up at 4:30, 5:00 AM and getting my hour and a half, 10 to 12 miles in super early. And it might mean I'm getting back like, you know, 30 minutes after the kids wake up and my wife being really gracious in that window. But a lot of times I'm really trying to get back by that 7 o'clock mark to meet them when they wake up and then just be a part of the whole getting ready and getting myself out the door while still entertaining them while my wife showers and giving them breakfast and that whole song and dance. Um, which is always a bit chaotic, especially with 4 children in the home. Yeah. So that's the rhythm that I've, I've found to be the best consistency for me. And days like today, uh, Wednesday is usually my hard workout days. I'll save my workout for the afternoon because a lot of times we film it for YouTube and it gives me a chance to not, um, have to hammer a workout so early, which is really hard for me to do. And then just getting up crazy early on Saturdays and getting it done on the long run. Yeah, but usually either working from home or working at my studio in Chicago downtown and being done with my workday no later than 4 or 5 so I can have evenings with the fam as well.

And I see like this time of year you're also doing some of your workouts on a treadmill, right?

Right.

How do you mentally deal with that? I understand sometimes the weather conditions are so brutal, that it probably doesn't do you much good to be running outside.

Yeah.

But do you, are you able to run pretty relaxed on a treadmill or do you find it challenging?

I, I'm, I feel like I'm one of those weird people that doesn't mind it really at all. Like I'm a, I'm a big fan of YouTube, so it's a really fun time for me to be able to catch up on people's channels and really like information. Or recently I've loved watching Outdoor Boys, which is like Alaskan survival and just like rough it through the Night, and I freaking love that channel. Um, shout out Luke. So much of my running is tied to nostalgia and art and filmmaking that I love listening to things that make me feel emotional when I'm on the treadmill. So whether it's narcissistically listening to my own videos from old series or my own race videos or the classic, like my classic favorite race videos. There was one like kind of core memory I had when you did your Berlin video and you dedicated it to your daughters and—

Sadie and Zoe, this one is for you guys. Daddy can do hard things and marathons are hard. And I know you can do hard things in your life as well.

I was quite literally crying on the treadmill, uh, listening to it. Like those kinds of experiences, I hunt for them when I'm there in that place so that my mind kind of goes to a different place and I feel motivated in a completely different way. And even outside, I'll, I'll listen to that kind of stuff while I'm out running, you know, on my trail or through my neighborhood. I really like the treadmill when it, when it comes to workouts, I really love consistency and pacing that it gives. Whereas if I go to the track alone, that is actually far more daunting to me to have to hit my own reps at a track without a pacer than to just clock it in on the treadmill because there's a really nerdy component of it too. People are always asking me like, oh, well, do you have iFit and do you program it into your treadmill so you don't have to think about it? I'm like, no, I actually love crunching all the numbers in the moment. And playing those numbers and being really dedicated to be like, okay, I'm running like today I'm running K repeats, but my treadmill's on miles and I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna try to switch it. And I know that I'm gonna have to be counting 0.62 every single time I do a rep. And that's hard when you're going hard, but it really passes the time. So I love just all those little nuances of tricking myself into enjoying it in some way.

It's so funny you're saying that because I think every runner is different, right? Whereas for me, running on a treadmill is mentally very challenging. The time just goes exceptionally slow, whereas I go on a running track and I can literally run in a flow state and I can just enjoy it. And no cars around, no distraction. I often run on the track in the dark on my own, sometimes with a headlamp, sometimes without. And it's just pure connection to nature or to self or to breathing or to anything like that. And that's— so I think indeed finding what works for you over there and I mean, yeah, that's a big one.

Yep.

I think the other thing for me is also being occasionally— I do most of my runs solo, but then occasionally just running with other friends. And then you're going on a long, long run, relative low intensity, and you're just chatting away and you don't even realize you just ran 10, 12 miles and you're just catching up with a friend type of thing.

Yeah, it's been the best recently. I've been teaming up with friends in the Chicago scene every Saturday to get a long run in. And it's— I love that component too, because I'm a really relational person. I really care about people's lives outside of running as well. So it's really cool to be able to dig deeper and chat about really meaningful things. Because I think especially as, you know, stereotypically kind of just being a guy, like, you don't really have times where with your bros, you like carve out time to do that. And so I think you can build really deep and lasting connections with people because it forces your hand into getting to know them in that way, whereas you might not otherwise. And yeah, that's something insanely special about the sport as well. Like, I would never know Clark's situation about, you know, his family or the nuances of his childhood without having those long runs. Really special.

And even sometimes a workout together, like shared suffering. There's something, there's something special. I've— when was it, about 6 months ago, I got a new ice bath, and I keep having people over at house. And it's, it's so fun to share. Like some people have never gone in the ice bath just to see like their first impressions. And then like also people who have done it a few times just to share suffering sometimes or to share challenging. It's, it's very special there too. So you have improved significantly in your running times. Like I think your first marathon was 3:50, right? Is that correct? Yeah.

Yep. Right around 3:50.

And then you brought it down to what is it now? 2:33?

2:32. Yeah, 2:33 high. Yep.

What advice would you give to your younger self? Like, looking back at all of the different race improvements, all of the different things you've learned in training, what if you could give your younger version of yourself some advice, what would that be?

There's— I'd say there's two versions of my younger self that I'd want to talk to. First was that 3:50 to 4-hour range, Eric. Who didn't prepare at all for the marathon distance. And just, I just assumed that because of my athleticism, I could shock everyone into, you know, believing that I was capable of doing it. And I was humbled, probably the most I've ever been humbled in those first two races. Uh, you know, people were gassing me up because, you know, at shorter distances, you know, I could, I could go out and run a 3-mile you know, just work out on a Tuesday at 6:30 a mile. And so people are like, oh yeah, you're gonna, you're gonna qualify for Boston, no problem. Like having no context of my inability to, to understand volume, intensity, like any of it, feeling. And so now me would say to that me, like, hey, read a book, uh, stop being so casual with this because it's going to eat you alive. And just, just like a little bit more intentionality, like follow a training plan, learn how fueling works, and respect the marathon distance. So yeah, that version of Eric. And then there's version of Eric I'd say is 2019 Eric, where I did do those things. I had a friend help me out with a training block, started to understand that I needed to fuel even though I didn't master that yet at all. And then ran a 3:10. So there was a huge gap there. So I think there's an asterisk with my progression where I made a video about it and a lot of people rightly kind of criticized like, oh, you were never really a 3:50 marathoner. You just had, you just didn't train. You didn't do it right. So once I actually did it right, I was a 3:10 marathoner. So there's that kind of disparity there where, you know, in that block I was doing at least 40 miles a week for, you know, 12 weeks and intensity and long runs and all that stuff. Um, but from that point on, I'd say from that Eric until the 2022 Eric was just failing on understanding how to fuel properly, to understand what glycogen is, to understand that I couldn't really supplement with anything other than a gel or liquid. I would try, I did the craziest things. Like I, I ate RX bars in a race. I ate Honey Stinger chews and like 5 of them. You know, like just not even close to the amount of calories, just because gels always made me nauseous. And I just, as soon as I had that in my head, I was like, okay, gels don't work for me. I have to do something else. And I, I lasted that way for 4 years until finally I was, you know, coached in 2022 when I broke 3 for the first time, uh, to just figure it out, like find something that works and find something you can stomach and train with it. So that, that phase, the progression was really slow. It was, you know, 3:10, down to 2:57 over the course of 4 years, but it was a slow understanding and humbling experience of realizing you can't last at this distance. You will be depleted by wall zone by mile 20. Um, and I felt like once I figured that out, trained well through it, learned how to fuel, I negative split my first race around a 2:57. And then from there it just kept snowballing super hard.

What are the next steps from there? And I love that breakdown between the two, actually, in the first version and the second version. And I think that's spot on. I think that so many people underestimate the marathon distance. They get their ass handed to them a few times and then they realize, all right, you got to respect this distance. I hear a lot of people right away like, I want to run a marathon and I want to qualify for Boston. I want to run this. And I'm like, where I was like, just get to the finish line healthy, alive, and well, and like, just like get to experience what mile 20 or 32K in a marathon feels like. Good luck. And so there's that part. But then once you broke the 3 hours, you were still able to continuously shave off time and bring that down further. And you also started working with Jeff Cunningham, um, your coach. And I've seen quite a bit of an increase in your overall training volume. What were some of the changes that you started making once you started working with Jeff?

Sorry, I have a little one who's making an appearance. You want to say hi? No worries.

This is the beauty of homeschooling kids. Hello. Hello. Hi.

Oh, now everyone wants to come in. Okay. Okay. Um, yeah, well, I think the nuance was I, I, after 2:57, I realized that more volume was going to be a ticket to more success. And so I, I was self-coached from my 2:57 to the 2:39. Um, and I realized I, I probably got too aggressive when I ran 2:48 that next spring. I mean, there was a lot of it worked obviously, but I really dove into Fitzinger's Advanced Marathoning and, and kind of used that as my running Bible and did the more advanced tier of peaking out at 87 miles on one week. It was probably a little risky, like didn't necessarily think— looking back at it, I'm like, ah, probably should have ramped that up a bit slower. Um, but found success in it and that did a variation of that probably between the lower tier and middle tier in the 60-mile-a-week to get to my 239. Working under Jeff has taught me so much more about consistency and, and the slow game. He constantly coins the phrase, it's better to be consistently good than occasionally great. And once I heard him say that, which was a while ago on Nick Bare's podcast, It echoed really true. And then finally working with him, understanding that my, my easy days have to just be extremely easy because the volume game is about not stressing the body too much, um, when you're getting upwards of 70, 80 miles a week, so that the intensity of your midweek workouts and your long run workouts can be the best they can be. Um, and really understanding that rhythm of like that cyclical, like high intensity in the middle of the week and then bring it way down while this huge volume of base building is, is being built the entire time and keeping expectations in the right place. He's, uh, he's not one to shy away from telling you that your goals are to Uh, too high and mighty and be like, yeah, you're not there yet. And you know, when I'm training with someone like my friend Clark, who's kind of just always a step ahead of me, we'll be on the same training series to the same race. Like we were last year going to Boston and we are right now going to McCurdy. And Jeff always just has him like just a little bit more volume, just a little bit more intensity, just a little bit faster on reps. And it's all— I'm always like, oh, like, why, why don't you give me that many reps? Why don't you give it, you know? And then I have to fight myself and realize, like, I'm not there. I'm running my own race, running my own times. And he's really good about, about letting us know, like, that, that is where you are. You need to be okay with that. So it's been really special to work with him in that way. And he's just a— he's just such a funny person. I just put up my story the other day or yesterday. One of my favorite quotes from him is was like, you don't always have to have rainbows and glitter shooting out your ears and butt. Like, it's, it's just kind of like, just consistently show up and see what happens. And the beauty of that is incredible. Yeah, that's my story.

I literally pulled that quote up because I thought that was so funny when I saw that on your IG last night. I was like, yeah, he seems like a character, man.

And it's so cool that he's, he's so passionate about coaching. He's so passionate about that stuff, um, being consistent. And yet he's perfectly okay with being a goofball as well. And that's totally my vibe. Um, I love not taking it too seriously, uh, so much of the time. And then when it matters, really being competitive with myself and taking it very seriously.

Well, I like the part also where he tells you, you might not be there yet with this goal,, but at least it all depends on the timeline, right? Meaning like, all right, you might be there in 6 months from now or in 3 months from now. It's just being patient with that whole process, which, which is spot on. So good. What was it like for you? Like, I see you getting into more strength training now, and I also know that you run with Nick Bare for his nutrition company, BPN Nutrition, and you're using their gels right now. I see you're hanging out with Nick sometimes. What is it like for you to start integrating more strength training, and how has that affected your running?

I'm honestly just so new to it because I avoided it for so long. I think it was the adaptation I was always really scared of approaching because I knew so little about it. Like, I lifted in high school for football, and that was a much different kind of lifting. You know, we were— oh my goodness, we were lifting you know, 3 days a week, and it was much more for intensity. Hold on one second. I'm getting shot.

Eric just got shot with a ball or a bow and arrow at his face. This is freaking amazing. This is the beauty of like real life happening. Two dads over here, so I can absolutely relate.

That was, uh, he got a gift from Mark Rober, his, uh, the, uh, Crunch Labs. So it was, he like constructed it, the bow and arrow, and it's like a, a 3-chamber ball bow and arrow, and I just got rocked by it.

I rocked in the face. Yeah, well, uh, that will always— kids can always humble you, man. They will always put you back to, uh, to real life happening.

So good.

Where were we? I think strength training.

Yes.

Some of the things that you like. Yeah. Yeah. Well, let me ask you this, actually. You are relatively new to strength training. Yeah. There's quite some people listening to this who might also be intimidated with strength training. Right. And so what advice do you have for people looking to implement some consistency in strength training in their overall routine?

I think it's really first and foremost about keeping it very simple, very approachable, very attainable. Lightweight, bodyweight, single leg, you know, just— we're not, we're not deadlifting 500 pounds here. Like, this is— that's not the intimidation you need to have. You don't need to be thinking that you need to put up 2:25 on bench and be a monster. And that, um, that gap between, you know, my, my teammates on the BPN team who are like that hybrid type, they're doing all that. And so, you know, if I find myself in a scenario where I'm at athlete week and we're all at a gym, I'm like, I don't, I don't know what I'm doing. But what's great about people who are so experienced is they, they know enough to have enough humility if you approach them to do it in a way that's not going to be condescending. And so it's really about reaching out to those people. Funny enough, Cyrus, my employee, is literally doing a bodybuilding build right now and doing a show in June and is a, a freakish gym rat. He's in, you know, 6 to 7 days a week, every week. So he really helped me structure my plan for this series, not, um, allowing for it to be overwhelming for me with peaking out at a max of 3 days a week, which I've really only been hitting 2 and keeping it really consistent, the same 5 to 6 workouts, 2 days a week, where for me, it's just very, it's very similar to when you first start running, you know, do, do what's attainable for you. If you need to run 3 days a week and have 4 rest days and cross-train and stuff, that's totally okay. And so for me in this phase, I know it's been a missing link for a while. And as I age up and start to feel like some pains in different ways, but even more so, it's about like that, that calf cramping and that adductor cramping. I'm like, oh, I know that that will change if I get in the gym more often, if I find myself strong enough. To be equipped for those moments. And one thing that really stuck with me, Nick was racing right alongside me in a lot of CIM when he ran his 2:39. And he was— I saw the media crew like come up on the side of me and I was like, oh, what's up guys? And I'm like, where's Nick? And I looked back and he's right behind me. And that's the, I mean, the most intimidating thing you've ever seen. It's just like a 195-pound brick wall. Cut to shreds running right at you. And, uh, I'm like, how do you feel? And he— all he said was, I feel strong. And I'm like, well, you look strong.

Um, he's a beast, man. Gee, like, he— yeah, he's definitely fast. And, and he keeps improving as well, even at that size that he is at.

So yeah, he's, he's insane. Um, but it just stuck with me because it I don't know if I've ever, I don't know if I would've ever described any of my feelings ever in a marathon race as I feel strong. Like I might say I feel capable, I feel fast, I feel like it's my day, a good day, but I've never thought like I feel strong right now. And that, that really kind of planted a seed of, well, I wanna, I do wanna be there. So it ultimately, you know, if you want it, you're gonna— it's another quote that Nick has, like, if you, if you want that thing, you're gonna make time to do it. And so it's just a matter of, okay, well, if it intimidates you, then baby steps into it. And that's where I'm at right now. And hopefully I'll progress into more intensity as time goes on.

And I think what you said earlier, like 2, 3 days a week and just doing it on a consistent basis, that, that seems to be more manageable and doable. I see it too many times where people are thinking like it's either all or nothing and it's like 5 days 6 days a week where it's like, no, just do that on a consistent basis for the next 3 months, 4 months and see what's actually happening. Like you might be surprised. And I think that intimidation, you will overcome that eventually. Like even if you go into the gym and at the beginning you don't know exactly what you're doing, but surrounding yourself with some other people who do or might be able to show you or like you hire a personal trainer who shows you how to use the equipment, right? After a while, once you get that positive momentum again and you actually notice how good it can feel too, I think a lot of people might not even realize how good it can feel.

So the other weird component about all of it is I'm broadcasting it to the internet, you know, so as you open yourself up for so much criticism. And I felt really confident starting my running channel because I felt like I was finally at a tipping point where I, I knew what I was doing and seeing the success I had been wanting for years. And so then to go into something that's really intimidating for myself, where I don't know a whole lot about it. That's pretty brutal, um, to, to expose yourself in that way. But I've learned in the same exact way to find comfort in doing that and having no expectation of people taking me as if I'm a voice of authority on this specific topic, but actually welcoming critique. And it's really cool, like, I think some of my initial feeling whenever I see this, you know, some— here's some unsolicited advice. If someone starts that way, I'm always like, oh, what are they gonna say? But so often people are like gently just being like, hey, like one came in today, hey, I think you'd get a whole lot more out of your reps if you just slowed down a bit. And so just small things like that where if with humility I can take those comments and receive them and be like, oh, this is actually community and they want to help me and this is really awesome. To try these new things and then just slowly adapt. Because I'm already seeing huge changes just in the small workouts I'm doing with how I'm making these minute small changes to make it more efficient for myself, to not get as much lower back pain, to increase efficiency and range of motion. Like, all— and so I find myself becoming more fluent in the language of the gym. And, you know, it's the same exact thing, and there's so many correlations to the running.

Totally. The slowing down part is That was Ryan Hall, American marathon record holder, who then went full strength beast horse. Seriously, he said a similar thing where he's like, yeah, if you want to improve your strength training, just slow it down and really be intentional about it. There's too many people just rushing through it and just counting reps versus actually do it do it with intention. And sometimes you may need many less reps to get the same kind of effect or workout. Yeah. Earlier you were talking about running quite a bit of your runs with Jeff at a very low intensity. How do you determine intensity? I think you're running with a heart rate monitor, correct?

Yeah. Yeah.

How do you go— how do you go about it? Yeah.

So, um, I think I can't remember the exact context, but I think it was the same, uh, podcast conversation he had with Nick where he talked about consistently good over occasionally great. Um, I forgot what he was referencing, but the phrase of keeping something, um, as your guide, but not your governor is really what I look at heart rate as for myself. And I care more about easy days feeling easy. And this is what I coach for the athletes that are in our coaching group. Is we prescribe easy days as well, but we never indicate if an easy day is a recovery day or a zone 1 versus zone 2, but rather, uh, what is easy for you that day? Because I think there is so much nuance relative to all the variables that happen in your week. If you had to move your workout day to another day, and then all of a sudden what was supposed to be your recovery easy is supposed to be your zone 2 easy. You have to figure that out as an athlete on your own, and that's a very personal thing. So last spring when I was building for Boston, I was in a phase where my body just felt— it just felt great. Like, I was— every day I didn't have any aches and pains. The weather was great throughout all last winter. It was never— I mean, there's a few times where it was frigid, but not often that it was frigid. So I'm typically running in 30-degree weather, 40-degree weather. And easy for me was 7:15 pace that whole block. I look back and I'm like, maybe I could have benefited from slowing down and even recovering more. But at the intensity that I'm at now with the volume that I'm doing, the strength and conditioning that I'm doing, the paces that I'm doing in my workouts, I'm— and aging up, like all those factors I know it's perfectly fine to be rolling at 8:30 mile pace on my easy days and just being comfortable with that because there's no extra stimulus happening with going any faster during that time. You know, as I said, that foundational building piece of volume aerobically helping me, uh, in those moments. Sure, it takes more time and that can be frustrating, but really that's the only caveat that, um, is difficult about the difference. And what I'm doing there is then allowing me to, like yesterday was a perfect example for me. I had 12 easy in the morning and I felt like death, like the worst, the worst I have felt. It looks the worst I have felt this block. It was snowing, it was pitch black. I was, I was in the pain cave. And it's so hard in those moments because you're thinking, how the heck am I going to go into tomorrow and do a workout if I'm feeling like this on my easy day?. And so I just, again, just 1 mile at a time. Take it easy. Super easy if that means slowing down, which I did. Got through it. Still felt like crap the next few hours, but I got to the evening yesterday and I'm like, what? I've— how do I feel fresh right now? Like, I don't, you know, I intentionally the day before took a salt bath and had the compression boots and was really like like, let's really try to recover. And you just go through these cycles where I'm feeling my body adapt then, like I overcame that threshold of cumulative fatigue. And my body's ready to go for the workout today. But if I had just given up in the middle of that 12 easy, I wouldn't have got the volume I needed. I may not have felt as fresh as I did last night. We don't— I don't know. But it's just that trusting the process. It's like, you could— your mind just plays so many games with you on like, oh, that's not going to be possible in the near future. And if you just trust that you can get there and whatever you have on that given day, you give your best effort. Like, trusting that process is ultimately what has allowed me to continue to every single marathon these days PR. Um, so that reinforcement is really special. And understanding, like, no matter what your head is telling you, just keep showing up and do the work.

It's, it's a, it's a fine line though, isn't it? Whereas, like, I, I understand pushing through, and I understand that part of sometimes having, like, being very tired of fatigue or any of those kind of things, a lot of work projects going on, or sometimes real life happening with the kids at home or whatever. Yet sometimes also an absolute rest day might be the very best thing for you to avoid getting sick, or for you to avoid— like, you know what I mean? So it— I always have this double, double feeling of like understanding upping the mileage, but at the other hand, sometimes also like if you get sick, you're out for 5 days, you know what I mean?

It's a yin and yang, and I think a case study that's so fascinating right now. I had heard about him multiple times, but I've been diving into all of his videos. It's Jake Baraclaw of Ran to Japan. I don't know if you've seen his, his channel. No, I haven't. Oh, you have to check it out. Um, so he currently has a PR of 2:17, and he moved, he moved to Japan to train like the Japanese, and he's, he's a Brit And he's been doing about 140 miles a week indefinitely. Wow. Just crazy mileage. And he just did the 3-week out from Tokyo workout where you do 42K in a workout. And the way the splits go, I don't know how they, um, specifically go. The indicator is at the 40K mark of this workout, it's supposed to indicate what your marathon time is. Is, and he's at a 2:09 according to that. And he ended up running a 2:16 in the workout at 42K. And so I look at someone like, and he jokes about like, his catchphrase is train harder, not smarter. And he's very like, he's, he's, he's very satirical and very funny. Um, and he full well, he full well knows all the risk involved in training the way he does. And I always look at someone like that and I don't really think that's ever possible for me, at least in this phase of life with kids to get up really over 100, say 110 miles, maybe eventually around the 100-mile threshold. Um, but I always see it as fascinating with someone like that where they progressively over time have built to that standard. And then the way they deal with little aches and pains is just, he shuffles at like 10-minute mile pace. Um, and, and sees a lot of that as forms of recovery. And so it's, it's most definitely not one of those scenarios where you look at it and you're like, I need to do that in order to succeed, but I find it so fascinating. And then there's someone like, um, I forget his last name, Brady, uh, he just ran Brady Homer, I believe his name is, just ran a, uh, 2:26 in Indy and had a massive breakthrough with a former PR of, I think, 2:38. And he trains like 40 to 50 miles a week and cross-trains 2 to 3 times, and he really only runs 3 to 4 days a week. So yeah, it's just so fascinating. But both, both are insanely intentional. Um, so ultimately you have to figure out what works for you. For me specifically, um, I thrive in the consistency of, of not missing as much as I can. And then I know I know enough these days where if I need to take a rest day, I will take a rest day. And it pains me emotionally to do so. Um, but I will, like, I got massively sick with the flu, uh, you know, a month and a half ago and took an entire week off and it killed me to have to do that because I had a challenge for myself to get on 3,000 miles for the year. But, you know, it was like, do I risk this for the next block? And the answer was no.

You know?

Yeah.

Let's, let's transition for a minute about your, you getting into running coaching. How was like, first of all, what made you decide to wanna start coaching people in running? And like, what are some of the things that you've learned throughout that process? Because that's, that's been on the other side of the table, which is really exciting as well.

Yeah. I, so I haven't really shared too much about it in the public-facing sense, and that'll change this year because I didn't really want to, I didn't really want to be like, oh, I'm a coach now, check it out, when, you know, we only have a few months of experience already with the group that we had. The reason I felt confident enough to do so is because I've had a solid 7 years of learning through a whole lot of trial and error and finding a lot of success in what consistencies, um, provide success in the sport. So that in combination with my teaching background— I have a bachelor's in special education, so I was in a formal classroom throughout all of college and 3 years of my professional career as a young adult. And also the, the compilation of— I did a lot of teaching on the, the photography and filmmaking side of, of the internet on my other channel as well, and coaching and workshops. And so I feel very comfortable being in sort of that leadership position. But ultimately what I realized was in my own training, I didn't really find a breakthrough until I started having enough humility to trust on the knowledge and expertise of other people. And it wasn't that, um, the first coach I worked with was some crazy elite person, um, but he understood the very simple building blocks of volume and intensity the right way. And feeling the right way. And there's always this, um, I've come across, like, you know, having so many friends in the creative world and attempting YouTube, and a lot of, uh, imposter syndrome and people feeling like they're not capable of stepping into that kind of leadership position. But I don't know who told me once upon a time, was like, if you have the con— if you have enough confidence and understanding that you have the answers that some people need and you are maybe a step or two ahead of them or a year or two ahead of them, there's nothing that should be holding you back from allowing them to take the risk on you and see if it works.

And so— I like that.

That's a really good thought process around it. Because sure, someone could be an expert, that's just— they're 10 steps ahead of everybody else. And if I want to be 10 steps ahead of the athletes I eventually coach 10 years from now, I will have to take those first few baby steps as well. And however that looks for whoever it is, is what it is. And there's different ways that I've kind of— uh, that's the best way to put it— um, hedged my bets against that, in that my coaching group has an open-door policy. It's like, if this is not working for you for any reason, you can just drop. It's totally fine. Um, And just making people feel comfortable, like more than anything, yes, this is going to be a place that's going to teach you discipline and how to actually train the, you know, relatively correct way. But it's going to be a place that's going to motivate you in a way that you haven't felt before because there's this massively dedicated group of people that are constantly pushing you forward. And it's so much more community-based than just me me enforcing that and reinforcing it because it's something I never really intended on. But you know, our Strava group is just everyone every day encouraging each other on every workout. And it's like, that just is organically happening. And these people are forming bonds with each other and, and recognizing consistencies in their own training and pushing each other on outside of myself. But it never would have been possible had I not been willing to overcome that bit of imposter syndrome to allow for that to occur. And so there's just a whole lot of beauty in that. And then every time someone in the group races, we're— our whole platform's on Patreon and we have a group chat in the Patreon and it's just everybody lighting up the chat, you know, wishing them good luck. And like, we're all live tracking them during their race and everyone's like giving updates in the group chat and. Like, oh, you know, 40K split was blah blah blah, he's going to do it, you know. So it's just really special.

That's awesome, man.

That's awesome.

What are some of the common mistakes that you have seen athletes make that you train or other recreational athletes that you have been a part of?

Really, the biggest glaring one is thinking just because I'm a part of this, means that I should have success when the work actually has to be done still. There's no recipe that just because people are patting you on the back whenever you have a good workout means that you're going to hit the time goal you set for yourself. And so, yeah, the difficult side of that as well is, and I have been saying it in the group a lot recently, is like, I don't like being bad cop, but I have to be bad cop sometimes because I'm here to hold you accountable to the goals you're setting for yourself. I can't force you to do these things, but you're investing your time and money into this, and I want you to see the benefit you desire out of it as well. So that makes me have to be the bad cop sometimes. Um, and so to answer your earlier question, I think that's a huge learning curve for me with, with the coaching is getting out of my comfort zone sometimes and having to step in and be like, hey, you got, you got to do the work, you know, let's, let's do this together. And more than even just saying it is, uh, multiple people in the group have said it, that I'm, I'm modeling it as well and constantly modeling it with my, my own training and saying like, there's no excuses here. Like, look at, look at what I'm doing. You can do it as well.

Let's do it together. Yeah, recently there was a podcast guest, Andy Wheatcroft, and he spoke about something in very similar terms where he said, have an honest look at all of the different things you're doing. And is it really that you're putting in the miles? Are you really going to bed in time? Are you like just looking at every, every stone and are you really putting in the effort there? And sometimes we just let ourselves off too easy there too, or we think we're putting in the work, but we're actually not. Maybe the running component, but maybe some of these other things things are slacking. So what role does failure play in your growth as a runner? I'm, I'm very curious to hear that because you have definitely experienced sometimes putting out goals publicly and sometimes those goals have been reached. Sometimes those goals have not been reached. But like, what lessons have some of these toughest races or some of these failures actually taught you?

I love that question. It is, I think arguably the most important aspect of racing in the way we do is embracing it, is understanding that it is part of it. And I think a lot of people find themselves in the euphoric phase that I felt and feeling like it's never going to end, where I went from— I wasn't satisfied with any of my times that were over 3 hours, even though I was decreasing my times during that time. You know, I went 3:10, 3:05, 3:03, 3:11 in there, and I was never satisfied with those because that was failure in a different way. I always came off of those races sitting on my couch post-race feeling like I'm not giving enough of myself and allowing that to fuel me into better practices moving forward. Just thinking like, I know I have the potential to get there, I felt really frustrated that I couldn't do it on my own willpower, and that was an incredibly humbling experience to then go, all right, I have to do the research. I have to lean on other people's understanding. I have to dig into the knowledge and wisdom of people who are ahead of me. And when I finally had the humility to actually listen and do those things is when I found a huge breakthrough in getting to 257 and beyond. From that point Um, but then to your point, you know, I went 2:57, 2:48, 2:39, and then I set the Boston goal at 2:35. And last year Boston was a very hot day and a lot of people didn't have their day. And I still felt like I had a great race, but I still didn't hit that time goal. I still didn't get under that 2:35. I ran a 2:38 and relative, it was a great race and I PR'd by nearly a whole minute, but it was a new kind of failure. And one that I experienced again in Chicago this past fall, where I set it at 2:32 and I ran a 2:33. Um, and I'm just now riding that edge where my new goal is a 2:30 or below a 2:30. And who knows? Um, but in those, I kept saying in those races that I'm probably going to be pretty upset if I don't hit this time goal because previously I was able to set the goal, do the work, make the time, celebrate. And what I was able to post online was a big celebration, and it's reinforced by a lot of pats on the back. And I'm not gonna lie, like, that's a very euphoric feeling. To feel that, to put that out into the world and have a whole lot of people congratulate you in doing so. And there's a very real component of not meeting that and then reading stuff that's said online about you, or, you know, you're falling off, or you're not as committed, or whatever, you know. And you can allow that to really mess you up emotionally and psychologically. And that's a very real thing that I, I deal with, or anyone deals with who makes their goals so public. But it was a whole year last year of me understanding that I need to tune out that stuff, that I've put limits on myself of not reading certain forums, of not engaging with trolls, and really understanding that I felt like I was going to be so upset if I didn't make these times. And I found myself both in Boston and Chicago at the finish line feeling the same kind of euphoria because I did still PR and I ran as hard as I possibly could given the circumstances I was dealt that day. And you just can't be upset with that. It's like, I gave it everything. I didn't walk off the course. I put in all of the work. How can I be upset with myself? And so it's, it's another like beautiful story in that, sure, the time wasn't made, but I did what I could to try to get to that point, and it was really close, and that's okay that I didn't make it. And that doesn't change the fact that I'm going to keep trying to progress and keep setting really hard goals that I might not get. But if I keep aiming in that little bit of distance that I'm not capable of hitting necessarily, I'm still— it's the whole concept of shoot for the moon, land in the stars, you know, like that. I have it at 2:30, but if I run a 2:31, like, I can't be mad. That's another 2 minutes off my PR. Like, if we're chasing times, that's great.

So, and you learn so much in the process. Yeah. Once again, that's the thing, like, much respect to you being able to put your, like, you have a following, like, people are looking at what you're doing and you publicly putting it out there. It does put another layer of pressure on there to some extent. Like, I've literally in front of before most of my races or adventures have not publicly really stated what I was going to. I had something in my mind even before I ran my first 100 miler. I was— I didn't even tell anyone. Like, the only person I knew was my running coach. And the week before, I told my wife if she could watch the kids the next week Sunday because I was going to run. Yeah, I didn't want anyone to talk me out of it. I didn't want— and so it's a complete opposite. But I have much respect for you being able to put that out there. And like, I think it does help from a— probably from a motivation standpoint to some extent as well. Like, okay, I said this is what I'm going to do publicly and now I do want to find a way to do everything I can to make that happen.

So yeah, I feel like I got really lost in the sauce in it last fall. I previously hadn't let it get to me. And I think it really showed in a lot of the videos I was making. It felt like I was trying to act a different way or be a different way. And this year I've really committed to, especially in this series that we've started for McCurdy, is just unabashedly just be myself and what I love and what I love to make, even on an artistic front. Um, I've been hard on myself and thinking I'm, you know, too emotional or too cringy or too this, that, the other. And it's been really freeing just allowing myself to even artistically express myself in that way, because I know— I mean, I see it from people who are responding to it that it's so relatable to them. Because ultimately what I'm trying to convey in these videos that I make is the feeling of what it feels like to train and race these events. And if you're anything like me, As I mentioned earlier, you know, experiencing these thoughts and feelings on these training runs where I find myself moved to tears and these emotions I never feel on a day-to-day basis, especially on race day, especially in a dark, difficult workout. If I'm listening to a song or listening to a video, that's like a core memory for myself and my, my journey of my training. If I can elicit those feelings and emotions for other people and give them that fuel as well, I know how powerful that is for me. And so I'm just just trying to give back in that way.

Yeah. And please keep doing what you're doing, man. Seriously. Like, I see the emotional component in it and you being your true authentic self. And it's, it's not easy to put videos like that out there. I think the most— the feel— the videos where you're most like almost afraid of uploading it are typically the ones that resonate most. Like what you were saying earlier, the Berlin Marathon video, right? I'm almost breaking down with a message to my family, it's like I was like not very comfortable. I was about to cut that scene out and I'm like, let's just lean into this and let's leave it in because I was truly feeling that way. Right. It's often what resonates most. Like, it's, it's interesting. So two last questions. First of all, where can people find more about you, about your, like, different channels, about your coaching?

Tell us more. Yeah. 2 YouTube channels, just my name. My main photo video one is, is just Eric Floberg. And then the running channel is Floberg Runs. And if you search up Floberg Runs on Patreon, that's where we coach. That's about it. I have a website, ericfloberg.co.

There's more information there. And as much as I love your overall running YouTube channel, seeing some of the content on your main YouTube channel that's been going on for for a longer period of time, including some of the recent films you have made. Yeah, absolutely incredible. And I will make sure the link to both of those. So keep making more videos on that channel as well.

Thanks. Um, the— oh wait, I have to pause, I have to pause because I just got a hand delivery of my Path projects. We're gonna plug you for a second here.

My kids literally just hand delivered this to This is literally unscripted and I did not plan for this package to arrive today, but Eric is literally getting a package in the mail right now. So there we go. There's quite a few people listening here that are recreational athletes looking to improve their either— like, do you have any advice for athletes looking to become a stronger, healthier, happier runner? Any thoughts you would like to share in closing here?

I've been trying to practice not answering things too quickly and to really soak things in because like ultimately there's so much nuance in everyone's lives that it, it might feel like, um, a throwaway answer to say everyone's different and what works for everybody is different. But there's a reality of that being a stereotype and why it's a stereotypical answer is that just like those two examples I mentioned earlier of Jake and Brady, 140 miles a week versus, you know, 50 miles a week and a very different approach to training, something that really resonated with me was my friend Clark before I started this new build was find what works for you and don't stray from that. And even within this block, for myself, 7, 8 years into doing this thing, I realized that the midday grind was not going to work for me and that I need to regularly, most of the time, continue to get up at 5 AM. Because that's gonna set me up for the most success. And so I guess what I would encourage people to explore is be patient in that process. It is all too often that people get into running marathons and wanna get the Boston qualifying time and wanna want all the success very quickly. And the truth is that you need to be patient in your training to probably get to that point, but even more so be patient in the process of learning what works for you, because you're only going to do that through a series of trial and error in months and years of training. And so what I love to teach is like, let's do this in a sustainable way. Let's do this in a way where you're not feeling burnt out after you race or after you get through a block and approach each day with the mentality of this is the long game and I'm setting myself up for doing it over years of my life, if not decades of my life.

Spot on. So well said, Eric. Thank you for this conversation. Really, really appreciate you. And I don't know where we're going to get a run in, but next time I'm in Chicago or next time you're in LA, let me know and we'll— of course we'll find a way to get some miles in.

Of course. Appreciate you, Floris.

Thanks for having me on. All right. Yeah, same here. Appreciate you. We'll talk more soon. Yeah, thanks for listening. What was your favorite lesson, takeaway, or quote from this episode? Please let me know below in the comments on YouTube. If you'd like to check out the sponsor of today's podcast, to really take a deep dive into your blood and hormone testing, check out functionhealth.com/florisgierman. Function currently has a waitlist, but my listeners can skip the waitlist and in there. A full year of testing is $499, and you get a lot of eye-opening insights over there. Different recommendations for health changes, lifestyle changes, fitness changes, and also nutritional changes. Know what's happening inside. Test, don't guess. Check out functionhealth.com/Floris. All right, have fun out there on your runs. We'll be back for more podcasts very soon.

Bye now.