#201: Let Go Of Scarcity & Let In Abundance With Author & Podcast Host Cathy Heller

Every human being has a masculine and feminine energy inside of us, no matter what they identify as. So the right is the masculine and the left is the feminine. Most of the time, we're obsessed with the right, with the masculine. And the masculine is like, do, do, do, do, do. Right. Look at the anatomy. The feminine receives the masculine does. Look at making a child, for instance. They're both inextricably linked. They're both an absolute necessity. But the masculine, it's a moment. And then the feminine holds this space and receives and receives and allows and expands and expands. And that's 99% of the process of making a child. Is this feminine, Allowing, expanding, receiving. So in our world, we tend to be sort of convinced that it's about what are you doing, what are you asserting, what are you pushing, what are you right? Well, that piece is critical, but that's literally 1% of it.

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I'm ready for my close up.

Hi, and welcome back. I'm so excited for you to meet my new friend, Kathy Heller. She is a fire hose of inspiration. She's the host of the popular podcast Don't Keep youp Day Job, which has over 28 million downloads. She's been featured in Forbes, Entrepreneur Magazine, HuffPost, Inc. The list goes on and on. Her show has had the biggest names, most recently, including Tony Rob Robbins. Kathy's book Don't Keep youp Day Job was released in November 2019. It's filled with inspirational stories from the people in her community who have taken control of their own life's journey. Her book goes into the detail of how to find work you're meant to do, grow your business, and wake up to a life you love. Who doesn't want that? She's a phenomenal leader for creative entrepreneurs. She's helping people everywhere add their gift to the world. Kathy, I'm so excited to have you here today.

I'm happy to be with you. I'm just gonna say not to correct you, because I do this on my show and I'm like, oh, no. But I only mean it for the good. We actually changed the name of my podcast this year in January to just the Kathy Heller show. And everything else you said is totally accurate.

Well, I was glad I got to get the updated numbers in there jumping from 24 million to 28 million downloads, which is literally. Guys, for everyone listening right now, that is mind blowing. Like you have made it. How the heck did you get your show to be this big?

Well, that's a good question. I ask myself that question a lot. People ask me that. In fact, I also teach a podcasting program which we're going to be running again soon because I love podcasting. I guess I'll answer the question by saying intimacy is currency. And podcasting is different than YouTube. It's different than reading a blog. It's different in so many ways. There's 169 million videos on YouTube. There's 2 million podcasts. Okay? And when people listen to podcasts, they listen intently, right? If you are watching a YouTube video, maybe if you could keep somebody's attention for four minutes, that's like incredible because people are sort of multitasking and they're looking around, but podcast listeners are self selecting content that they want to really, they want to do a deep dive. And so most podcast listeners, the behavior patterns and the data show that they listen to the whole episode. So I didn't know that going in, but I know that now. What I did know going in is that the Talmud says that words from the heart speak to the heart. And I think that I fully have always done this in my life. Like, there is no. Esther Hicks says there is no amount of action that can compensate for energy, right? 98% of the world really is energy. This isn't like woo woo. This is like an atom, right? Like, we're all made of atoms. Is. It's actually 99% energy and it's less than 1% physical. In fact, even the physical part of an atom, the kind of physicality it is, is more like a liquid. So I don't even know how much physicality is involved. But anyway, there is this like unified field, right? That's Einstein's theory, right? There's a unified field. And so people talk about the law of attraction and all that stuff. The word Kabbalah means to receive. So my rabbi would say it's not really the law of attraction, it's the law of reception. So I have always known that. It's kind of like if you change your energy, the vibrational signature you're putting in the world, your life is completely different, right? Like, our life is a combination of how we think and how we feel. And then how we think and how we feel determines what you're going to do. It determines your behavior. What also happens, though, is that when we think a thought, we don't just think a thought. Every thought that we think has a chemical that comes with it in the brain. So certain thoughts, they make you happy. You get literally this internal pharmacy drip of oxytocin when you think something that makes you happy. Gratitude, joy, compassion, excitement, enthusiasm. When we think things that make us feel stressed or gloom and dooms type things, we immediately get a hit of cortisol in the brain. Then the body actually becomes addicted to it. Cortisol has been proven to be more addictive than nicotine. So people are addicted to suffering. People are literally addicted to it. Then your, your, your cells actually develop receptor sites for things that you're addicted to. Sugar. So the more, the more you have, the more you need it. And then there's a dependency, there's a chemical dependency, just like we would have on any, any chemical. So if by 3 o' clock you've been actually excited about this new guy you're dating, or your body's going to be like really in need of that cortisol, you're probably going to start to think some like, shame, self doubt because your body is obsessed, right? This is how it works. So this is why I'm like super into science and I'm super into spirituality. And I love where they come together. I studied mindfulness at UCLA for two years. They have a mindful awareness research center and I studied there and I was just blown away. And then I studied in Jerusalem for two years studying mysticism and Kabbalah and I've been on the Search and we've had 600 guests on my show. And I've interviewed Deepak Chopra, Marianne Williamson, Tony Robbins, Dr. Phil, Barbara Corcoran, I mean, like Howard Schultz, and then like all these other amazing people like you and so many of my incredible, inspiring, empowered female friends. But the point is, it's all the same thing. Like, it is all the same thing. It is about. We are directing the movie of our life. We are casting it, we're directing it, right? So it has a huge effect. If I said to somebody, do you think that you're in control of what happens to you? Most people are. Their first reaction is no. So then I say, okay, well, do you think that your personality has an impact on your life? Maybe a little bit. I said, well, let's look at your personality. Your personality is a combination of how you think and how you feel, because that determines what you do. If somebody thinks a certain way and feels a certain way and then does a certain behavior, what would you say that is? Oh, maybe they're in a mood, right? But if they continue to do this, that's what we say, like, oh, that's just how that person is. So your life is equal to the thoughts that you think. You get that, right? So it's all about us. Like, we have been given the power. God's not like over there, like, whatever the word God is. That's like an interesting word. But I mean, in The Torah, there's 80 words for God. So it's like Eskimos have 70 words for snow. You don't just say it's snowing. They're like, what does that mean? It's always snowing. What kind of snow? Is it sleet? Is it sledge? Whatever the words are, right? Is it powder? Is it. So that word is an interesting word. But the point is, whatever that unified field is of consciousness, it's inside of everybody. So we are in control of writing this movie because we've been given this ability to connect with that. So that's how my show has become what it is. And that's how anybody's anything has become what it is. It's like, no one's coming to save us. Nobody ever came to save anyone. No one's coming. No one. But it's inside of us. And so when your frequency, like a radio is tuned to a certain station, you'll hear certain kinds of music. If you turn the radio three degrees to the left or right, you'll hear different music. So what are we receiving? We're receiving whatever we're tuned to. Does that make sense?

This is mind blowing to me because.

You know, this is so funny.

So often I'll have people on the show and they're experts in different things, and I'm always curious and interested to learn what you're talking about right now. Like, this is what I'm on the doorstep of, where you've already moved into the house. So to me, it is. I'm just learning about all the stuff that you're talking about. When you just shared that quote, I believe you said, Esther Hicks, something around, you know, being the hardest worker is never going to compare to the energy that you hold with something.

Something like that. Action can never compensate for energy. Yeah.

In my mind, when I heard that, that's how I built all the success that I've had in my past life. In corporate America, it was 100% built around hard work, outwork, everybody.

I know you remember when I had you on my show and I kept being like, this is so cool, because you talked about being at that sort of Venn diagram of having been all in on the action, but now, having realized that so much of the alignment piece, like, really, it sort of creates these ripple effects, like an atom bomb of. That's what people don't get. Because in Kabbalah, the right and the left represent different aspects of gender, right? And we all have. Every human being has a masculine and feminine energy inside of us. That's the beauty of. Right? That's like it exists in everyone, no matter what they identify as. So the right is the masculine and the left is the feminine. Okay, that's just like, what it says. And different traditions have, like, chakras, right? And it's fascinating how they all actually overlap, right? It's like the seven chakras is identical to the sphere oat, which is in the cabal. It's just amazing because these people didn't have conference calls. So how did they come up with the same information, right? It's like there's some truth that just. We all keep coming back to whether you were living in India or you were living in Jerusalem. It's like we got to the same answer without getting on zoom and asking if we. So it's really cool. The point is, most of the. Most of the time, we're obsessed with the right, with the masculine. And the masculine is like, do, do, do, do, do, right? Look at the anatomy. The feminine receives, the masculine does. But if you look at that, right? Look at making a child, for instance. First of all, you need both. Like, it doesn't happen, right? So they're both. They're both inextricably linked. They're both an absolute necessity. But the masculine is like. It's a moment, right? And then the feminine holds this space and receives and receives and allows and allows and expands and expands and expands. And that's 99% of the process of making a child. Is this feminine allowing, expanding, receiving. So in our world, we tend to be sort of convinced that it's about, what are you doing? What are you asserting? What are you pushing? What are you, right? Well, that piece is critical. But that's literally, if you look at what I just said of creation, that's creating life, right? That's probably a good model. That's like 1% of it, but an important 1%. It's kind of like when my daughters are making slime, there are certain ingredients that even if they just need a tiny bit of the activator or whatever they use, even though it's a tiny bit, it's critical. If they don't have it, they don't make slime. They just make mush, but it's like 1% of the process. But it's important.

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Remember the action is critical, but it's like 1% of the process. 99% of it is, what did we say before? The allowing, the receiving, the expansion. Think about women, you know, as an example, who date the same kind of guy over and over and over again. There's just a way she's drawing that to her, right? Think about women who have this incredible amount of class and grace. Let's use the royal family, for instance, like Meghan Markle and Kate Middleton. There's nothing about them, at least in what we all see, that's assertive in terms of you will recognize me and blah blah, blah, blah, blah. And look what I had to do. It's kind of the exact opposite. It's like so back in the pocket of like, this is just. What is that? Everybody is like, oh, let me get the door for you. Oh, thank you so much. Right, so there's a way in which. When I first moved to Los Angeles, I was 23, I wanted to get a record deal, and that's a whole fun journey. I did get a record deal. I was signed to Interscope. I got dropped from Interscope, I got signed to Atlantic, I got dropped from Atlantic. I wound up writing music for TV shows and films for 10 years like Pretty Little Liars and Criminal Minds and Switched at birth and McDonald's commercials. And I made a career out of that and that was what I thought was gonna be like it for me. And I had a couple, my two first daughters at the time, and then I wound up actually continuing to follow the breadcrumbs and my whole world opened up so much more than I ever thought. And I started a podcast and wrote books and all that stuff. But when I was first in la, I didn't have a trust fund. My parents are divorced, my mom was a single mom. We lived in an apartment growing up with very, very little slept in the living room and had to work a couple jobs just to kind of have enough money to pay for lunch and school, you know, that kind of a thing. No big deal. But like, it wasn't a silver spoon kind of a life. And when I was in la, I got my, you know, whatever job I could get to pay my bills and I had my roommate and everything. And I would take $200. That's a lot of money for me when I was 24 years old and I would take $200 and I would spend it to go to the Peninsula and go to the spa at this beautiful five star hotel in Beverly Hills. And I knew that if you bought this massage, you had access to the spa for as long as you wanted. So I was like, you know what? That's such a great way to spend the day because I'll go get a massage and then I'll spend an hour, like in the steam room. And then afterwards I'll go in the sauna and I'll use those lavender icy towels with the eucalyptus. And my friends would say to me, you should be careful. Like, that's so much money. You can't really afford that. And I would say, like, I can't afford not to do that. That day would give me so much. The way I would expand, the way I would feel, the way I would start to allow more of what's possible to seep in. The way I would start to align with the amount of things that would happen afterwards were just giant. And it's always been that way. Like, you always go first, right? We go first, we cosign scarcity or possibility. And so I was always like, I would go first when it came to abundance. When I started my podcast, like, I didn't think, what's going to be the roi? How fast are people going to listen? It was just like, I'm doing this, end of story. So it will be. And then, yeah, for every 16 people in the beginning I asked to be on, there will only be one person who said yes. But it didn't matter. And it was the same thing with writing music. When I got dropped from the label, I had a day job for a couple of years and I thought, oh, this is what I have to do because my dream didn't work out and I have to be practical and get a job. But I was so unhappy. And finally one day I was looking at myself in the elevator doors and I saw myself wearing high heels and like a double breasted pantsuit. I just started to cry because I was like, you came out here with this like, authentic, alive spirit and now you're like, you don't even recognize yourself. I quit and I didn't have anything to fall back on. And now I don't tell people that they should quit. I say, hey, use your job as your investor and build the bridge and let's work together to figure out what you're going to do instead of scrolling your phone because everyone's on their phone at least six to 10 hours, at least a week, not 40. I was like, let's use those hours to build your side hustle. And then in like three to six, nine months, you'll quit your job. And people, they do, and they're very successful that way. I didn't know That I didn't have a coach. So I just quit. But I had to, because I knew I was. I didn't have any other possibility. It wasn't clear. And I was like, I gotta get out of here. And when I did, I started looking around and I was like, who says that I can't do music just because I didn't actually get to tour the world, like Rihanna or Taylor Swift? Like, there must be something here, because I got so close. So I started to ask a different question. If you ask a new question, you'll get different answers. And I was like, is there any other way for me to do music? And I started to Google, how do other people do this? And I saw there were artists doing this thing called licensing their songs. And I was like, what does it mean to license your song? And why is Dawson's Creek and One Tree Hill and Grey's Anatomy? Why are they using all these indie artists like Ingrid Michaelson? And why are they using all these people? Christina Perry's song was licensed to? So you think you could dance. And the next night, she had 200,000 downloads of this song, and she was a waitress. I was like, oh, my God. I never even thought of it. So I was like, that's what I'm gonna do. And I started to reach out to all of these people at Netflix, NBC, Paramount, and I was nervous. I felt crazy. Of course I did. I was like, I don't even know who I'm asking for. I don't know what I'm. But I was like, so you'll be uncomfortable. So what? And I was. And then I learned, okay, that doesn't get you past the front desk. Ask it a different way. And then I learned, oh, the name of the person who chooses the music is called a music supervisor. So then when I would call a network or I would call a movie studio or I would call an ad agency because they have them too, I would say, can I talk to the music supervisor? Then I got smarter, and I would look up who the name of the music supervisor is. I would Google Deutsch Advertising or ABC Family Music, and I'll be like, oh, can I speak to so and so? And then I got better at having the conversations. And my point is, like, my friends would be like, that's insane. You should have an agent. Aren't there people who do that? And I said, look, no agent is going to wake up and think about me as much as I'm going to think about me, so I'm going to do it. What's the difference? I can figure it out. And I wound up figuring out that it's about having empathy and asking people questions and not saying, let me pitch you and be impressive. It's like, no, let me make a relationship with you. Oh, hey, Scott. At Leo. I'm making this up. Leo Burnett, Chicago. I know you're doing McDonald's. I saw your last ad. I love that song by Spencer Ludwig. How do you like living in Chicago? P.S. oh, you like it? What's your favorite pizza place? Me. Me too. I've actually been there. Oh, do you like uno's East? Blah, blah, blah. By the way, are you working on anything new? And if you are, what's the storyline? Oh, you know, it's a McDonald's ad about best friends. We're going to need something that's like, Edward Sharp and Magnetic Zeros meets blah, blah, blah. And I would be like, you know what? What if I wrote you something and I'll send it to you? And he'd be like, cool. Yeah. I don't have any guarantees, but go for it. I'd be like, cool, I'll reach out. I'll reach out when it's done. Then I would go to a producer in LA and I would say, hey, I can't pay you for this track up front, but I just spoke to this guy who works on Blah, blah, blah. And is it worth your time to, like, give me studio time with you two hours in the evening when you're done with whatever you're doing, and I'll cut you in on the back end? And it's like, be resourceful. Like, your greatest resource is not any resources. Your resourcefulness. But do you see, Heather, what I mean, like, it was always like a fait accompli. It was like, I'm doing this. It's like, I'm doing this. We'll figure it out. It's not landing on the moon. And even that we figured out how to do. So then it would work out. And then sometimes it would work out in the sense that the guy at the ad agency or NBC or Netflix would say, you know what? That song doesn't work. But let me tell you this, there's something else we're doing. Would you write a song about Home or Sisters or Brand New Day? I'd be like, yeah. So then I would get in the pipeline because I wasn't, again, looking for the roi. It's like, I need it to work out. And why didn't I was. This is the energy, right? I was always in this energy of, like, this is so fun. I'm anticipating how cool this is going to be. And I wound up making about 400 grand a year writing music for film and TV and sitting over there on my shelf. I could grab them right now. But I was featured in Billboard and Variety. Not like a blurb in Billboard magazine. Like, they did a full page spread with a picture of me. Like, who is this girl making this money without a label, without an agent? Then the same thing happened in Variety magazine, full page. My cousin was at the newsstand in New York City, and he's like, is this real? Like, there's a full page spread on you. And I was like. I actually said to the editor, Billboard when we sat down to do the interview, I'm like, is this really newsworthy? And he's like, kathy, note to self. Like, don't ask me, you know, because it makes. Why would you want me to say? And I was like, you're right, you're right, you're right. But I was just kind of doing my own thing. And then, oh, my God, I saw the next possibility and next possibility. And I wound up, long story short, being featured on like six or seven music podcasts. I never thought I'd have a podcast. And people who had music podcasts would say, let's talk about the business of music and how you did it and blah, blah, blah. And then one of the girls, there were so many emails that would come in from artists saying, I heard your interview. Oh, my God, can you coach me? And I was like, no, no, I don't coach. What are you talking about? Like, I don't do anything like that. And this is 2016. And one of the girls wrote me an email and she's like, you should start an online class because there's so many songwriters around. And I was like, what's an online class? What are you talking about? And she's like, yeah, people do this stuff online. I'm like, I don't even have an Instagram account. I don't even have a Twitter. I'm not on my. I never was an online person. I said, you know what? I was pregnant with my third daughter. I was like, what do I have to lose? I guess I could teach an online class to songwriters. I didn't have a podcast yet. Still didn't have an Instagram, no email list. And I just decided, okay. And so I did a webinar, but it wasn't a webinar. Like, I didn't make a slideshow. I don't know how to make a slideshow. So was it a webinar? I don't know. I was live for an hour. And it was the first time I had ever even used the software. It was like a Google Hangouts or. I don't even know what I used. But I figured it out was nothing fancy. There was no funnel. And for three weeks leading up to it, I posted it in different songwriting groups. Like, hey, I'm gonna do this thing. And you can tell from the way I wrote it, like, there was no cool, polished. Like, it was just like, I'm doing this. People didn't even know who I was. It was like, okay, come to it. And we did this Google Hangouts webinar. I guess you could call it that. I was pregnant. I was just myself. And at the end of it, I was like, I'm going to teach a class. It's $1,000. I didn't know what I was doing. I was like, we'll figure it out together. I'll answer your questions. Maybe I'll bring in some music supervisors here and there to answer questions for you, what they look for. And 147 people signed up that night. And I got off and I was like, this is crazy. Like, yes, I was already making $400,000 a year. Something like that. We had already bought our first cute Spanish style house in la and we were able to afford the kids to go to a good school. But that was crazy. I was like, 147 grand. I was on for an hour. That's crazy. And now I'm just going to talk to these people once a week. And I loved it. And then three months, four months later, one of our students, Amy, she said to me, this has to be a podcast. I was like, what does that even look like? Like, I don't listen to any pod. I think I've been on a few. She's like, just start one. And so I said, okay, I'm so busy now. I have three kids. The youngest one was like a month old. And I was like, well, no time like the present. I'm not going to get any less busy. I have three little kids under five and I have a career. So I said, fine, I'll start a podcast. I was like, I'm just going to do it. It wasn't like, I'll do it until I have a thousand down. It was just, I'll just do it. And it started, the podcast. And as the podcast was growing, I was like, I'm not going to be doing music much. Longer, I could just feel like, this is what I came for. This is really what I like to do. I loved it. I didn't care if I was interviewing someone early on who just owned their own bakery. I didn't care if I was interviewed, because in the beginning, it wasn't famous people. I just loved that. Here's what I started with, and here's where I landed, and I get to do something I love. And I'm making 10,000 croissants a month. And I can't believe, like, I went from dropping out of high school to doing this or whatever people said. And then it just. It really grew. And the reason the downloads moved from what you first said is because we get about a million downloads a month now. That's how much it grew. And, yeah, I've gotten to meet. I've interviewed Rob Lowe and Matthew McConaughey and the Property Brothers and Harry Connick Jr. Like, I've interviewed all these guys that, like, I've had a crush on my whole. It's so awesome. And not to mention Deepak and Marianne Williamson. And tomorrow I'm interviewing Ben Rector, who, not everybody knows him, but he's a songwriter that I just love. My kids are so excited. So I love doing the podcast. The podcast turned my business from, you know, with the class, my first class for songwriters. I think we did make a million dollars the first year. But the podcast has turned my business into multi, multi millions. Like, it's about to be eight figures.

This year for people that don't have the certainty. Because that's one of the things that I've struggled with as I'm learning about this power that we all have, that I was not aware of, existed. I just did not know. And so becoming aware is like, step one, right? Like, okay, this is a thing. But now, how do you develop that certainty when it was something that you didn't even believe before?

Oh, well, I love that you're using this word, because it's the actual opposite of that. So the ego, the way that Freud and every psychologist who studied the way that humans are constructed, the way that we understand who we are, we have an ego, and we have our sort of our higher self, our consciousness. So let's just look at that for a second. So when a person would be sitting under a tree or talking to their boyfriend or eating yummy sushi, there's the part of you that's eating the sushi, and then there's a part of you that's aware, like, oh, my God, this is so good. That's your consciousness having an experience of your experience. It's like a, it's the drone shot, right? It's the part of you that can kind of step outside of a moment and go, so grateful. Look at this moment. Look, my parents are here. They're not arguing. Oh my God, we're all here. This is so beautiful. That's your consciousness, right?

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It's a fictionalized thing that gets created by the brains wanting to protect us. When a deer hears gunshots, they go into fight or flight. Their heart races, the pupils dilate, the blood rushes to the extremities. They're in their ego. They're all ego. They want to protect and then they find a place. Hopefully they get to safety and they can do the studies to see when those gunshots have been gone for 15 minutes, the deer goes right back into flow state. They're not in that revved up place. Their heart rate isn't right. The ego. What's so Interesting and really terrible for us is bad news, but we can fix it for humans is we actually live in that fight or flight most of the time. Well, when you're in that fight or flight place, you get bought into the illusion there's scarcity and you need certainty and you need to kind of get to safety all the time. When there's no tiger in the living room, everything's really fine. Like, 99% of the time, it's really okay. It's better than okay. It's amazing. It's a gift. It's awesome. So the brain has 70,000, let's say, thoughts a day, and most of them repeat. That's an automatic software program that's been running for, like, 30 years. Like, as long as I'm. Since I'm eight years old. It's the same program every day. That's all ego made up. That's all made up by my ego. It's like, oh, my God, what's she gonna say? So that's where we have to sort of go. Only my ego really wants certainty, because why? Certainty is a way to protect ourselves. I didn't have any certainty. That's why everything good happens, because that's the magic, right? When Michelangelo is playing with color, the reason something magical happens is because he steps beyond that edge of needing certainty, right? Like, the amazing discoveries are beyond the horizon. That's the reward for letting go. When Tom Petty comes up with a song he can't get there from ego, like, oh, my God. And I'm so nervous, I had to write a hit, and how's it gonna happen? And da, da, da. Like, you're not tapped in when you close your eyes and you can just breathe a little bit and get out of your mind spinning. There's always a part of us that's connected to the infinite, oneself. It's like Marianne Williamson said to me the other day, if you were to look at the ocean, you can see that every wave is connected, that there's no way to, like, separate one wave from another. And there's certainly no way to separate the wave from the ocean itself. They're all connected. And that's how we are. We're all connected to this infinite oneness, this infinite fluid energy, right? And when we connect to that, we get the. And we go, oh, my God. When we close our eyes and we take a few deep breaths, we're like, yeah, there is, like, this well being outside of. And Deepak Chopra says it this way. Like, if you say to yourself, I am Kathy Heller Your mind will give you a lot of evidence and a lot of images that make up what that means. But if you just say I am just like, hmm, what's that? So the I am part of all of us, that's what's abundant, whole, infinite, amazing. That part of us doesn't need any certainty. We're totally at peace. That's part of us is full love and compassion for ourselves, for every other being. That would be ridiculous to think that part of us needs certainty. We're fine. In fact, we're very happy there. We just don't live in the I am most of the time. So I've been practicing meditation for years and that's why I was saying, like, I love that place. I don't really want to get too certain because certainty is what I can predict and what I can predict is only what I've already experienced. And I want something that's amazing and beyond.

Right.

What do we all want? A transcendent wow kind of experience? Well, the wow comes from, oh my gosh, just all of a sudden this thing happens, like. Yeah, because you went beyond what your ego could be certain of or predict. That's where all the magic lives. Nobody really wants certainty. Right. We want this unbelievable, mystical, incredible experience which comes from this feeling that. See, we don't create from lack. We can't and we don't. People talk about manifesting like we don't manifest what we want. Never. We manifest what we are. We don't create what we want, we create what we are. We don't get what we want, we get what we are. So when we are the I am, when we are connected to the part of us that's creative, that's whole, that's open hearted, that's loving, that's enthusiastic, that's passionate, that's full, so full, so full heart, so amazed, so beyond blown away by this moment. We get everything because we are, we're a match for it. Abundance is a match for more abundance. You can't be in scarcity and say, I really want wholeness, but it's outside of me. That's not true. Right, so that's. How does that make sense?

Well, I mean, it's a lot. I'm going to tell you that. It's a lot for people who aren't, you know, you're, you've been living in this. So explain this to me. When did you make this switch from, you know, you explained how you grew up, which it did not sound like you were living with the same way of Being this I am, wasn't there? Do you have this one breakthrough moment in your life when it just came together for you?

When I was in college, I started out as a theater major because I write songs and sing, and I was like, oh, I guess I'll do that. And then my parents had been divorced for so long, and there was so much pain for so long. And I was like, you know, I really just want to read books that give me a sense of peace and meaning. And so a friend of mine said, you know, you can get a degree reading those books. I said, how? And she's like, just walk over to the dean in the humanities department and ask him, like, what major would let you just read psychology books, philosophy books, religion books, and you get your four year degree for it? I was like, that's amazing. What a cool idea. So I go over to the dean and he's like, there's like five ways you can get that degree. And he's like, you could. Why don't you. He's like, why don't you just be a comparative religion major? Then you can take classes in Buddhism, Judaism, Sikhism, Jainism, Christian, whatever you want. And because you need to fill out the major, you can take philosophy classes, you can take whatever you want, but we'll fill it all in. You'll take international studies stuff, you'll take some anthropology. I'm like, great. I was like, this is so much more fun than theater. I grew up doing theater. I didn't need to study that. So off I went. And that's where it started, right? I started studying while my friends were going to a bar or reading, I don't know, an advertising book. Taking a communications major. I was reading about Siddhartha. I was reading about sitting by the river. I started reading Jon Kabat Zinn. I started reading Kabbalah. I started reading and understanding and appreciating, like, the similarities between Moses and the Buddha. I started to, like, study this stuff. And then I went on a trip to Israel, which I wasn't going to go. I was like, it's far away, but I had never been. So I went and I was so blown away. I was like, oh, I'm going to come back after college. And so after college I was like, let me just go to Jerusalem for like three weeks and like, see what happens. And I stayed for three years. I stayed in Jerusalem for three years. So I was 21, 22, 23. And then I moved to LA. So I was like swimming in it. It's kind of like the equivalent of Jay Shetty. He was like, I was a monk for what was he a monk for like two years. So when I was in Jerusalem, I was so full, like learning and studying and walking these 3,000 year old cobblestone streets. I didn't have a TV, I wasn't watching movies, I didn't have a cell phone. I was like in it. So when I moved to la, I kind of had an upper hand, which was I was totally and fully present. Like I was really there and happy, like in a very genuine way. So you reach out, Everything turned to gold. Yeah. And so that's why I say to people, like. Cause I witnessed my parents suffering so much. My mom was suicidal, my parents had so much violence in my house. My dad was so anxious. He used to not only drink all the time, but he would scratch his arm till it was like raw all the time. Like so much anxiety, so much pain, so much suffering. And once I started to like live in this world of meditation and prayer and mindfulness and understanding, like the concepts of the universe and studying science and quantum physics, I was like, it really makes all problems go away. Like there's no problems. I'm serious. It's like suffering is totally optional. Pain is inevitable. But that's good too. It's like the day is going to have 12 hours of light, 12 hours of darkness. Totally designed that way. That contrast is fine. It's built into the universe. It's the getting caught in this place where we're literally not in wholeness. And so that is the work that I help people do that. And from that place, then, yeah, I love all the action stuff too. It is 2% of it. But we can totally talk about it. I geek out on it because that part is fun. And after you've done something like several times. Tony Robbins says success leaves clues. It does. And so I love teaching people. Like, you want to make your first a hundred grand totally doable? Let's do it. Let's reverse engineer how you're going to do that. But before you even start, you have to be this potent energy. You have to be aligned. You have like, what does that mean? I'm like, I'm going to start to help you. And slowly people learn. Oh, this is always a breath away. So I don't know if that helps.

But what are some of the steps for people who they're aware, they hear what you're saying, but they don't know how to immerse themselves in it. The way that you really immersed yourself in it what are some of the steps they can take?

I mean, one thing that's super easy. I've just been giving this to people as a gift on Amazon. I'm not sponsored by them. I should be. But there are these two little speakers. I think it's like $175. It's called now. I think it's called like tone therapy or something. It's a meditation. And it's three minutes. It'll shut off after three minutes. It's a recording of sound bath, like a sound bowl. So you hear different sounds coming out of both speakers. You push them both at the same time, and they go off after three minutes. And everyone has three fricking minutes. It's brilliant because the way that they've designed it, the scientists who made these said that if you can just listen for three minutes, it's equivalent to a much longer meditation. I like mixing the sound with the meditation because meditation is just focusing your attention. But focusing your attention on breath, which is what most people do, that's like the black belt of meditation. It's hard. It's really hard. And the mind wanders. That's what minds do. There's nothing wrong with that. But the mind wanders. And the ego is very busy, and the ego is very used to suffering. So it goes into it all the time. But if you're listening to the bells, it's just easier for your mind to focus the attention, which within 25 seconds, you'll start to feel this. Like your nervous system will calm the hell down. And you'll start to feel this part of you. And you'll go, I like this. Like, I really like this. And your body will be like, hey, this is way more stimulating and better for you than scrolling your phone. And you will be addicted to the suffering because that's the way your biology is wired. But if you do it every day, you'll start to want to do three minutes in the night, too. You won't want to miss it because it's feels so good. So I would start there. I would also say that you can meditate without meditating. You can just be mindful. For instance, you could decide that every day between walking to your fridge and walking to the coffee maker, you're going to notice the feeling of the balls of your feet and your heels touching the floor. That's going to start to bring you into the present moment. And the more we start to be in the present moment, we feel happy, we feel peaceful. And the best, most productive thing you can do for your career is to feel happy and peaceful right now. Because when you start to feel happy and peaceful, the creative ideas, you'll be like, ooh, you know who I should text? Oh, you know what reel I should make? See the whispers, the breadcrumbs, the flow state of your amazing creative genius zone. It's all there. But when we're in doubt and constantly replaying this, who's going to listen and what? You're never going to hear the whisper of the next right action and you're not going to be aligned. So even if you did it, you'd be like, hi, guys. And you're going to feel in your live or you're going to feel in your post, there's a codependency. You're going to feel this person needs the likes. It doesn't work that way. It won't work that way. Right, so these are a few things. And now we can talk about whatever you want. But I'm so happy to talk about some of the strategic, like, steps to any of it because I literally geek out on all of this stuff. I love making millions of dollars and I see how simple it is because there's like a simple way to put something in the market and test and validate and then scale it. It's not hard. It's just that we, like, give up so easily or we don't necessarily see psychologically, like, what makes people buy. Why do they lean into things? People never buy anything. They buy feelings. So what's the feeling involved? What's the story being told? Like, we don't just. We just miss a lot of stuff, but when you actually see it, it's not hard. It really is not hard. I know it's not hard because I wasn't a straight A student and I don't have anything unique, you know, other.

Than being tapped in, which is so incredibly powerful. And just the fact that you shared this with everyone and with me, because this is right where I am on my journey. I'm so, so appreciative for the way you explained it, the steps that you gave us. And I'm writing everything down. I'm getting, I'm getting the speakers. I will be doing the meditation. I'm all in. Because for me, I know that's a difference maker. And for everyone listening right now, this is legit. Kathy is the real deal. I mean, check out her podcast, the Kathy Heller Show. Unbelievable teachings and truly start opening your mind to that. Suffering is optional. And that's just so powerful. Kathy, how can everybody find you oh, my gosh.

Come, come, come, come one, come all. The podcast is the Kathy Heller Show. You can find it wherever. You listen to podcasts, Apple, Spotify, whatever, and on Instagram. I'm Athy Heller and Kathy's with a C. And thank you for just, like such a fun, delicious conversation.

Oh, you're the best. I can't wait till I get to see you in real life and give you a hug. Thank you for all the good work you're doing for the world.

You're so welcome. Thanks for having me.

All right, guys, until next week, keep creating your confidence. I decided to change that dynamic. I couldn't be more excited for what you're gonna hear. Start learning and growing. Inevitably something will happen. No one succeeds alone.

You don't stop and look around once in a while. You could miss it.

Come on this journey with me.