#279: How To WIN When They Say You Won’t, With Daphne Jones CEO & Founder Of The Board Curators & Fortune 50 Technology & Business Leader

The key part that stops us sometimes is when we get bad news, we get emotional or we may cry. And I say think of what a business does when they lose market share. What do they do when a business wants to expand, like open up another branch or another go another region? What do they do when an app has a bug in it? What does the developers do? They use tools to get them from where they are to where they want to be.

Come on this journey with me each week when you join me, you're going to chase down our goals, overcome adversity and set you up for a better tomorrow.

I'm ready for my close up.

Hi and welcome back. I'm so excited for you to meet our guest today, Daphne Jones. She's got over 30 years of experience in general management and executive level roles at Get Ready for IT, IBM, Johnson & Johnson, Hudson Hospira, GE, but began her career as a secretary. At GE, she served as SVP for Future of Work, SVP and CIO for Product Engineering, imaging and ultrasound, and a Senior Executive and CIO for Global Services, all of which composed a 13 billion with a B segment of GE Healthcare. Jones serves on the board of directors for AMN Healthcare, Barnes Group and Masonite International Corp. And is the recipient of numerous domestic and international awards. She recently started a company that teaches leaders how to prepare to serve on board. Daphne, thank you so much for being here today.

Hey, you're my new best friend.

Hi.

We happen to live right down the street from each other. Crazy. What a small world.

Yeah, we need to go to that park that they just built, you know, right there on fifth.

Yes. It's beautiful. It's so nice. All right, Daphne, let's get right into it. Because the fact that you started out as a secretary and have achieved so much massive success, my first question to you is at some point there had to be a pivotal moment where you're seeing yourself at this level of secretary and support staff. What was it that changed for you in your mind that allowed you to think that you could go for more than that?

Sure, great question. But I do want to make sure that folks know, here's how I became a secretary. Limits and labels were placed on me. I asked my high school counselor, it's time for me to go to get ready for college. What do I need to do to get ready? He says, daphne, black girls like you don't go to college. They become secretaries. And I can send you to a secretarial. We call it college. It was only two weeks. And then you can learn how to be a secretary. And then we'll place you, or they'll place you into an organization. And so they did. I did that. And they placed me into Women Women's Day magazine. And it's funny, Heather, Women's Day magazine is a women's magazine, but it was run by all men, so all white men sitting in their offices. And then a couple of us secretaries, some were black, some were white, that sat out there outside of our principal's office. And so I was lousy. That was the turning point was, you know, he dictated some things to me. I knew how to do shorthand, and I typed really, really well. But I just. It just wasn't good. I didn't do a really good job. He was always yelling at me. The snide comments that they made, the jokes that they were making about the women was just really hard. And I said, you know what? I don't know what they do, but I feel like I can do what he's doing if I just go to college. So I don't think I should be a secretary anymore. I should have a secretary. Yeah, that's it. And I decided that even though that I went to college, got three years a bachelor's degree, got my MBA in one year. And I realized at that point that the audio didn't match the video. You know what? The audio of what my counselor was saying didn't match what I actually did, the movie that I was living. And I found that I could shape my own narrative and call my own plays when I found that I could go to college and win, as he said, that I would not be able to do.

You never found it or you didn't think to yourself. Because I know I've been told many times when I was in corporate America that I could only reach a certain level of success and not to fool myself. And I struggled a lot with that imposter syndrome when I would try to start pushing beyond it. And then, you know, I'd have the negative self talk, like, wait a minute, who do you think you are? Everyone's told you can't do that. Did you have that same type of situation when you pushed yourself to go into college, or did you just leap and never look back?

I actually, at that moment, my mom was a Jamaican immigrant, and Jamaica was under the British rule for until 1950, maybe 62 or something like that. And so she would always say to me, daphne, you're not black, you're British. Because we were under the British rule. So that's how she looked at things. So she was always into, you can do it, be excellent. I skipped first grade, for example. And so all my life she was always pushing me to be the best and to study hard and Hardy Boys books and Nancy Drew mystery books and all those I was always reading. And so up until my counselor, I had run ins with gangs that would beat me up for racial assault and things like that. But somehow I was able to brush that off. But it wasn't until I went to IBM I was laid off, I was downsized. And it was at that moment, and IBM was my first job after college. And that was my dream job. And with the fact that they laid me off, made me say that they, whoever they is, would realize and or realize that I was really just a secretary in an IBM pinstripe suit. And I was afraid they were going to send me back. And send me back where? To being a secretary, I had to ask myself, were my achievements up to this point, were they real or was I fooling people? So after realizing that, it's really a conditioning that we have gone through. Women, minorities, we go through, it starts when we're young. And the job of the conditioning is to plant seeds of doubt, seeds of inferiority, seeds of gratefulness that somebody gave us a chance, right? So when that seeds turn into a full grown plant, it doesn't produce much fruit or the fruit is underdeveloped. And so, yeah, I did go through various bouts of that. But you realize that you have to tell yourself, just like I tell my son what they need to hear. I am great. I am creative. I have superpowers and a cultural advantage that my company has yet to uncover or appreciate. So it was a mindset like my mom started me out with, of winning. And I found that whoever has your mind has you. And so it just comes through practice and application that you realize that the audio will not always match the video. This guy who was an expert at coaching and counseling children or kids like me was wrong. So that means other people who say things about my inabilities and for me to minimize my voice and to hide my culture and to underpay me and to underdevelop me, they're also wrong. But it takes practice and surrounding yourself with people and books who will give you life, enhancing words and speak words into your spirit that continue to boast to you and lift you up.

Wow, I love that you just pointed out that that one man was wrong. And because he was wrong, it means all the rest of these people could be wrong too. That is super powerful. Daphne. And so true. You are incredibly confident. Have you always been this way your whole life?

No.

Oh, my man. I was an ugly duckling. In fact, my first name is Daphne and they called me Daffy Duck. And I think I walked kind of like slew footed or whatever, like a duck does. And so, first of all, so physical issues, you know, lack of confidence and being a woman of color. I was beat up by a gang of white boys. I've been told even in my later years that I dress too nicely or all kinds of things that have been said to me. And so it's really mind over matter. You know, I look at you driving your car. That windshield is huge, right? But your rear view mirror is really small. So I don't want to look at my past a whole lot. And it's smaller, it's receding into the background. But my windshield, my future has got to be bright. And so it's really a mindset. That's really what it amounts to. So, no, I haven't always been confident, but I've always known that I've done tough things before. I've not done some things great. I never was perfect, and I was never always awful. And so when you realize that there have been times that I've done things for the first time and it worked out well, it kind of gives you that confidence. As you mentioned, not to be cocky, but to be sure. When he told me that it was impossible to go to college, I realized that the word impossible really should become inevitable. If you can think of it, it's not impossible, then it's just a matter of time. So my vis. My purpose is not denied. It's just delayed, you know, for a moment. So you just kind of get in that mindset of talking yourself out of. Out of that funk that we might find ourselves in.

Ooh, that's so good. All right. So you were laid off from IBM, and I personally, I was fired, not laid off. But for a lot of people, they take an ego hit, a real emotional hit. When you're separated from your line of work, your paycheck, your title, how were you able to bounce back from that?

My book is sort of built on these steps of, you know, envision, design, iterate and transform. And the first thing I did was I had my family around me. I had my sister who was with me in Atlanta, Georgia, where I was working, and I had a son. And I was going through divorce at that time, too. Heather was. So I said, how do I. How am I going to be able to get custody of my son when I don't have a job. It was, it was really tough. But my sister was with me and you know, we are Christians and a lot of prayer and supplication and with Thanksgiving at the same time allowed me to be able to get through that. And I said, this boy who. How old was Jared? Eight years old, maybe seven. He's depending on me. And so it's like when you have somebody depending on you, you know how that is, depending on you for everything. I said, I can't quit, I got to keep going. And you know, I've skipped grades in college, I've done well before. This is a setback. And they say, my friend Willie Dally says that a setback is a setup for a comeback. And so I had to look at that and say, this is just a setup for how I'm going to come back. And I did. And so I ended up moving from Atlanta, moving to Newark, New Jersey where I joined with Public Service Electric and Gas, pseg, it's the utility in New Jersey. I was there for a short time but. But it was a time that changed a lot of my life because from there somebody at Johnson and Johnson discovered me. And then from there I just went on. So you just don't look at that loss as a loss. You look at it as a lesson and you say, well, what did I learn from that? I'm too young. And you know, even though I started getting cuter as I got older, wasn't cute earlier, I said I'm too cute, I'm too young to give up. And so I said I gotta keep moving and this baby is depending on me to win.

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Okay, so you mentioned your new book when when they say you won't break through barriers and keep leveling up your success. And you also mentioned the four step edit methodology. Can you talk a little bit more about that method?

So I have a couple of concepts about it that first of all, we are like products. We are like a product or a service that can have a new version of itself continually. It should never stay stagnant or dormant. And you think about a product. What do we have in common with products? Well one we have a market. Whether you're A hedge fund manager or a cfo. There are people that you serve and support. Products provide solutions. Services provide solutions. Products have value. I am valuable. I have a price. And I heard you talk about a $300,000 talking gig that somebody was doing. They have a price, right? So products have a price, products have competition. And so there's somebody that's always looking to unseat you, right, and take your spot. And products get feedback from the market. And so. And finally, products have to remain relevant and so they don't become obsolete or don't get moved down to a lower shelf in the grocery store. And so one of the things that I do with my edit process and edit actually means change, right? The word edit, but it is also the four letters that says I need to find a way to have an ongoing cycle of success. I believe that my book and the edit process is an antidote, a self administered antidote to the poisons that are hurting our careers, right? And so the things that cause us to lose our mind in our careers is that we don't envision where it is that we want to go. We don't have the right type of mindset. I talk in the book about a growth mindset versus a fixed mindset. A mindset that doesn't believe in impossible but leaves in inevitable. A mindset that does not ask for permission to prosper. So we get into the mindset because if once you have that mindset, my book provides the rest of the tool sets that you can then use as a product, as a business would use, and then you have that skill set for life that you can use over and over again as an antidote. So first it's the envision, that's the E. The D is when you design. So now I know what I want to do. I get into what we call beaumos and nos bodacious object. I think sometimes we may not succeed as we could because we just got too many things going on. Everything's urgent and not enough things are important, but we do those urgent things. So I kind of have you sit down and say, what are my bodacious objectives? The most important one or two. And so you design a plan. We get into okrs, objectives and key results just like a business does. We don't take our situation personally, even though it's happening personally to us. We use business like tools and methodologies to be able to look at our situation and manage through it. So you design your plan of action. You look at your, what I call the five Fs which are when I was going through my career at IBM, I only focused on one F and that was furthering my career. But then there is your fitness, your faith, your finances and your family. And so we talk about how you look at those other foundational things. So make sure that when you create your plan of action, you've made a plan that takes into account all of the things that you care about, not just your career. And then once you have your plan, then the third step is you iterate. You go into the market, you work your plan and then you get feedback. You see it was working or it's not working. When it's working, you keep on going. That's what we call perseverance. But when you find that your plan is not quite perfect, you then you go back to your plan and redesign it and you pivot a little bit. You never quit because your goal is still your goal, right? So you then you just, you iterate, you go back to the your design and you make it better. So we use the agile methodology, because I'm a former techie developer programmer, we use the agile methodology that allows you to get real time feedback from the market and then you adjust your plan ever so slightly or ever so largely in order for you to make it. And then once you've done, whether it's a micro change or a macro change, you transform and you sit with that change. You learn the job, you learn the thing, you transform it and then you then go look for what your next win is going to be. And so that's edit, envision, design, iterate and transform.

I love the process, I love the methodology. It's simple, it's directive. And anybody can put this process into motion, correct? It doesn't matter what job they have.

Yeah, and it doesn't have to be a job if you want to be a better wife, a better mother, if you want to help your child do better in school, if you want to lose weight and get healthier, do you want to start your own company? The steps are the same and I think the key part that stops us sometimes is when we get bad news, we get emotional or we may cry. And I say think of what a business does when they lose market share. What do they do when a business wants to expand, like open up another branch or another, go another region. What do they do when an app has a bug in it? What does the developers do? They use tools to get them from where they are to where they want to be. And we use in my book things like the swot Analysis. You will look at what do I have going for me, what do I have going against me? You know, plans of action. We'll look at Johari's window. What are my blind spots? If you don't know what your blind spots are, trust me, somebody does. So it really doesn't matter what you want to do. What matters is that you want to do it and you want to look at it from what you're doing to what you want to become. And so we go from, you know, they say that we are not human doings, we're human beings. And so what is it that we as human beings want to be? Because a lot of us are just doing things today, but we need to look at what we want to become.

Wow, that's so powerful. I love that you brought up taking emotion out of it. What are some of the tips that you can give people to? Because I've seen countless meetings, even in business, where people have lost their cool, definitely reacted, not responded. You know, what are some of the strategies that people can implement so they can remove emotion from business or from, like you said, even being a better mom or wife or in their fitness.

Right, right. So one of the former chief HR officers, one of my companies, said to me, because I'm a very inclusive communicator, I just want to tell you everything right at one time, or I'll ask a lot of questions. And he said to me, daphne, you need to wait. And I said, wait? What am I waiting for? Somebody coming? What's going on? And he said, wait means why am I talking? So the first thing that we have to say is when we're in a room with other men who may be talking over us, who may be repeating what we said, we just need to just take a deep breath and wait for a moment, gather our thoughts. And then in my book, I talk about, what do you do? I think the chapter is internal politics or corporate politics or whatever. So one example is when a man says something that you just said 10 minutes ago, he seems to get a standing ovation. They're like, yeah, John, that was amazing. And so then what you say is, john, I think you articulated my point really, really well. In fact, let me make another point to add on to what I said earlier. And so you give him credit for articulating your point, but you don't give them credit for having the point in the first daggone place. But then you take it back and then you add another point on top of it. So it is solidly your point. And so there's things that you do as a woman if they want you to take notes, you know, Daphne, can you take the minutes of this? And that used to be when we had flip charts and stuff. And I said, no, I'm a lousy writer. You really don't want me. I don't say anything about, oh, because I'm a woman, you want me to. No, I just, I make it non gender specific. And then they'll learn, well, let's get somebody who's the best writer, not someone who's the best woman. And so there are just things you just have to think about as a business and not respond emotionally. When a company loses an employee, they quit their job. The company does not go banging on the door of that new company that person went to work for. They look back and they, they examine, they reflect. They say, well, what is it about our company that may have caused them to leave? They look at that as data, as information. Right? As facts. And they use that fact to then change their policy or do something with employee development or leadership development. They don't get angry, upset, or emotional, or they make it emotional, but they don't use their actions to display the emotion.

Oh, that's so good. I am so big into always respond, never react. And unfortunately, it definitely is something. It took me years to learn that. But it makes you people view you and respect you in a powerful way from coming from a place of calm. And I always think to myself too, you know, I want to be the best version of myself. What does that look like? Being thoughtful, you know, taking a moment before I have something to say to your weight method. And I love the weight method. I love how you articulated that. Thank you. Okay, you talk in the book about how can you win when you don't have any support. What are some of the ways that people can help elevate themselves or get ahead when they feel like they don't have any champions on their side?

I can't imagine a situation where there is no support. So there is at least five different levels of support that one may have, first of all. And you may not call this support, but it's role modeling. Who do I look up to? If you go in my office here, you'll see Harriet Tubman in my office. And she is a role model for me. And in that picture, you'll see her leaning forward with one hand. She's kind of going forward. She's got a rifle under her arm and a lantern leading the way. And she was the one that did the Underground railroad to free slaves. So she's going forward. And then if you look at her other hand, you'll see her pulling people behind her. There are slaves that are behind her. And she's saying, okay, come on. She's pushing forward to new, dangerous territory because she could get shot, killed, captured, whatever, but she's also bringing people along with her. She's my role model. So then I think about her. She didn't have much power. You know, most people in the world have more power than she ever did. And so I look at her as a role model, and I say, well, what would she do? So if nothing else, you say, I have a role model. So who in your company seems to attract the most amount of success? What do they wear? How do they look? What meetings do they attend? Can I get on their calendar for half an hour? Can I find a way to read their blogs or their post or their LinkedIn profile? So even if you don't know anybody in life, which is really hard to imagine, you least look at your role model. That's number one. Number two, there are people who you can turn into your mentor, right? So you don't have support from Tom, Dick, or Harry. But then there's Jane over there, who you may not know, but you say, jane, I really appreciated how you busted out your quota. You did this, you did that. Do you mind if I spend a couple of minutes just talking to you and picking your brain? I want to learn more about how you did it. People love to talk about themselves, Heather. So get on Jane's calendar. She will tell you all that you want to know. And then be a good listener, be a good protege, be a good mentee, and listen to what she says and then do it. And then go back to her and say, jane, I tried what you do all the time, and it worked for me. Child, you got Jane for life. She will always be in your corner. They say whoever's in your circle may not be in your corner, like in a boxing ring. And Jane will be not only in your circle, she will also be in your corner because you listen to her. And then Jane may eventually become a sponsor, which is the next level up. And so there are accountability buddies. There are peers of yours. There's somebody in the organization that may not be your boss. They may be your peer. There's somebody who respects you. There's somebody who likes you, and you may work with them and have them help you by being your accountability buddy. So I do talk about that. There is somebody in your life. There's even your family, your family knows somebody, right? Your family has a neighbor or your husband or your spouse or your partner has somebody that they work with that has something in common with you. There's organizations that you can join, right? Whether it be technology organizations, finance organization, women's organization, board organizations. There's always someone who wants to help and is available to help.

I love the role model because to your point, a lot of people will say I can't find a mentor or no one's available to me or no one's offering to me, whatever it may be. But that really takes the excuses off the table. You know, when like you said, whether it be a famous person that you know you look to in history or someone you follow on social media, I mean it is, it is so attainable and available for everyone. So thank you so much for sharing that.

Heather. I'm sorry. LinkedIn is a perfect place. You don't have to know every CFO in the world, but you just search for CFOs that work in the automobile, automotive industry, that live in Georgia or whatever. The ability to find these people who don't know you is incredible. So using LinkedIn even to find the role model that is close to doing what you do, I think it's really doable. So you know, One of my quotes is hashtag find a way to win. It's not only one way, it's not only I gotta find a mentor who works in my company. It has to be male, it has to be white. They have to be this and that. Find another way to win. Find a female mentor. Find one is a different nationality. Find one who doesn't work in your company. Find a way to win. That is it. Hashtag find a way to win.

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How do people work smarter, not harder? I never have mastered this. I need this advice.

Well, I find that hard to believe. I mean, look at you. So yeah, we've been given, you know, as I say, women have been undervalued, underpaid, lack of access to capital. You know, we get paid 80% of what men get paid and we still have to find. And African American women, black men, we are all in that similar category where we have to work twice as hard, be twice as smart, and maybe we get half as far. That's my premise. And so my strategies of looking at yourself as a product, the strategy of having the mindset of a growth mindset so that you can drive personal transformation. When you think of yourself as a product and you're focusing on being a new version of yourself, that's how you work smarter. Because now you're not spending your time. When I talked about bo, mo's and nos, BO are bodacious objectives. Mo are those moderate objectives. Yeah, they're pretty important. They're pretty urgent. They align with my future. And then there's the nos, the nos which are negligence or negligible objectives or non essential objectives. And so first of all, don't focus on those nos, focus on very few mos and focus on one or two bos, bodacious objectives that will align with, and I put a two by two matrix in the book where you can have an X axis that gets into how does this align with my vision and the Y axis that says how good will it be? Is it going to deliver a lot of value? And so I have the reader actually put their goals into those three categories. So one example of working smart is being able to work on the things that count. They say things that can count aren't always counted. And so you're doing all these different things, but they don't really matter as much. Work on those two things that matter the most. Delegate those things that might be important to somebody else. Delegate those other MOs or those NOs to somebody else so you can be focused on what's really important. So that's just one example. Don't give up. I've read Lean Startup by Eric Reeves and he talks about either you pivot or you persevere. But nowhere in the book does he talk about giving up on your goal. So you persevere if the data is working. If the data is not working, you just don't keep going after stuff that's not working. You pivot and change your hypothesis and you don't waste your time going after things that doesn't seem to be working. You pivot and change your approach a little bit and then you go back in. So I think those are two ways that I would say you can work smarter, not harder. I love them.

Who did you write the book for?

I wrote the book for women. It's funny, I asked my, my publisher, McGraw Hill, said, Daphne, who is the book for? I said, everybody. Everybody wants to win, right? And they said, well, yes, but you need to narrow it down a little bit. And so I said, okay, it's for women because we're the ones that are typically told we can't. We've been conditioned that we won't. You know, the system was not built by us and it wasn't built for us. So it's for women. And then I said, well, which way women? It's for women that tend to be a little bit more in the middle of their career and just, you know, want to know how to get to that next level. Because sometimes there's a point where you kind of rise and then you kind of plateau. You may go have a child or something happens, but your trajectory is not what it might have been or what you want it to be. So it's for women who are in mid career. And I think. And it's also African American, women of color. I have a chapter in there that's called Leading While African American. I have a whole chapter devoted to what is it like as a woman of color. And so when you're stuck and stymied, that typically is who it is. It's usually women who are in the middle careers or that are of color. But men can read this book. Men can share the learnings. There's stories in the book from all women. And I have one man in there from all women that can learn from other women what they did in order to get out of a tough situation. So it's for women, middle.

I really relate to that idea that, you know, even if early on your trajectory, what you're climbing very rapidly, and then you get to point to your point, have a child and suddenly you don't have as much time and, or, you know, drive or focus or whatever, and you kind of take a step back and suddenly a couple of years have gone by. This literally happened to me. And I realized I've just been maintaining at work instead of. I had these bodacious goals before, but I sort of just, I dialed it down a little bit, and I think that happens to a lot of people mid career. And that's one of the things that I. When people say, do you ever regret things? I think to myself, yeah, I just should have been pushing harder. You know, I didn't have to work more to your point, you could still work smarter, but, you know, I could have just been going for more, asking for more.

That's right. And you know, the five Fs are, really are a real thing. And when you're single or don't have a child, that family F is not as important. And, you know, I look at what phase of life are you in? Are you. You're in learning all you can, you're earning all you can, or you're returning all you can, can. And you have to look at what phase you're in and say of those five Fs, which are most important to me for this phase that I'm in? And then you look at that, and so now you have context. You're not just going after a goal, you're not just having a baby and then. And not thinking about the implications to your, you know, your faith or your fitness or what have you. But you look at all those five Fs, and now you call your plays. It's up to you. It's not. Life is not happening by chance. It's happening by choice. And so the five Fs, in my opinion, really helps you understand all dimensions that you are. And so that you can then decide what is it you want to be able to do and how do you want to govern having children and getting back into the, into the marketplace.

How often do you suggest that somebody go back and revisit that and say, okay, we, maybe we need to change which is the highest priority?

Well, so in the plan of action, if you've got two bodacious objectives, and then of course, the objectives have key results, and those key results lead to actions. You know, in order for me to get these key results, I have to act on some things, these key results. Then if I do these key results right, they become objectives. And there's a section in there that I talk about 5F impact. It's 5F impact. So whenever you create your plan of action, you intentionally put in your plan of action what you're going to do for your 5F. So, for example, if you say, I'm going to take a new job in California and your family has to move and you are now going to be working 14, 15, 17 hours a day, you have to know that your family's going to take a hit. So then in your plan of action, you say there's a 5F impact. 5F impact is my family is going to see less of me. Then what are you going to do? Either you're not going to take the job, or you're going to take the job and you want to do something for your family every Friday and Saturday and Sunday, or you're going to come home once, you know, one day a week early, there's something you're going to do so that you can make sure that your family is okay. If you're going to be working 12, 13, 14 hours a day and you don't work out anymore, and you used to. And you used to have, you know, low cholesterol and low blood pressure, and all of a sudden you're going to be eating McDonald's at your desk every day. You've got to figure out, well, my fitness is still important to me. My physical fitness or my emotional fitness, my mental fitness. And you have to put in your plan. This is going to be something that I'm going to have to make sure I focus on because I always enjoyed having a 118 over 80 blood pressure or whatever. And so it's built into the plan that you always look at your five Fs on a regular basis to check and make sure that you're doing what you said you were going to do.

Do, it's so powerful because it does change. And when we just forget it and like you said, just, you know, kind of let it take charge. We're not really creating our life. We're just kind of accepting what. Or allowing for what's ahead of us instead of directing it. So I really like this idea. It's. It's. Your book is literally like a business plan for life.

It is. I call it the Playbook. There's a playbook that I think kids have gotten from their parents that when they see a kid who looks different than them, who's a girl and not a boy, there's a playbook that I think kids have. Must have received from their parents. And then my book is the Reverse Playbook. I'm going to reverse and tell you how to go back against that playbook that's been conditioning our minds in the wrong way because we don't want to just watch our life happen to us, like you say, going past us, and we just kind of watch it happen to us. We want to call our own plays, and if we can't call the play, you know, there's. Sometimes you've got to quit your company. If the culture doesn't match what you're trying to do and if you don't like what the company is all about and what it stands for, there are times that you have to say, you know what, I'm not going to be here anymore. But you call that play on your own.

Well, you've called like you did.

Like you did.

You did that well. You too. I mean, you've called these plays. Your track record is incredible. The value that you deliver in this book is incredible. Where can everyone find your book and where can everyone find you?

Well, my website is Daphne E. Jones, so it's D A P H n e e jones.com Daphne jones.com and then you can put a slash there and then type book. So if you just want to go to the website daphnejones.com and then you'll see a thing for my book or you can just type the slash book. And you know the orders are available on Amazon. You know, you can pre order right now. The books will come out in November, but please pre order right now and you can find me and send me an email if you want to talk. If you want anything I can help you with, let me know.

Daphneejones.com win when they say you won't break through barriers and keep leveling up your success. Daphne, thank you so much for writing this book and for all the good work you're doing and giving back.

Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to see you. And girl, we gonna get together in Miami.

Oh, we are doing it. All right, people. Hang in there. Get that book. It's live November 8th. You can get it right now, pre order. And you will be so grateful that you'll be calling your own plays and going for bo dacious goals, just like Daphne and I. Until next week, keep creating your confidence. I decided to change that dynamic. I couldn't be more excited for what you're going to hear. Start learning and growing. Inevitably something will happen. No one succeeds alone.

You don't stop and look around once in a while. You could miss it.

I'm on this journey with me.