Marriage & Investing: What You Should and Should Not Do with Matt & Liz Faircloth

Welcome, ladies, to The Real Estate Investor Show, providing inspiration, strategies, and insight to empower women investors to live balanced and financially free lives. Now, here are your co-hosts, Liz and Andresa Guidelli. Welcome back, ladies.

This is Liz, and this is Andresa.

Welcome back to The Real Estate Investor Show. We have a mini SODE edition and a very special one at that. And what are we talking about, Andresa?

Well, we have a special guest and this never, ever, ever happened before. Here, here he is.

Matt Burkhardt.

Here he is on the InvestHer Show.

Yeah, there we go. This never happened before. And today we're going to talk about couples who invest together. There's a lot of ladies in our community that are investing with the hubbies, and we want to talk about the journey, Liz and Matt's journey, and how can you learn from, from their, their mistakes, should I say that, or evolution, evolution. And really, like, they're being very kind and open to share what happened to them, what is happening now to them, and where, where they're going. So this is going to be a very, very exciting episode. All right, Liz and Matt, welcome to The Real Estate Investor Show. We're so glad to have you both here.

I've heard amazing things about this podcast, especially one of the, one of the, one of the hosts especially.

Uh, do you like her?

I listen to this podcast in the hallway many, many times.

Yeah, we send you messages, Matt, through that time.

I do. I, I think different, good, bad. Yeah. And I've met women in InvestHer that have heard a lot of our stories. And I think it's great that, that we're here to have this conversation because investing with your spouse is a big part. I get asked that in my communities. I'm sure you guys do regularly. So I'm grateful that we're able to have this conversation with you today.

So let's get started. So you both have been married and investor closer to two decades, right? And I'm sure when people look at you both, I think that many of them think Wow, they got married, they got started in real estate, and it has been this wonderful linear evolution. And they seem super cool. And we are cool. And of course you guys are cool. I think because you guys are cool and because you guys have such respect to one another, people don't believe that you guys did work and that was this straight line. You guys found your role, your place in business out of the bat since the beginning, did not pivot, did not change anything because it's been perfect since the beginning. And I would've just opened up the door over here for you guys to share. So, so Liz, let's start with, with you. Share, share with me like how you guys evolved when you got started, who was doing what? When that happened.

Yeah, no, and there's been multiple pivots. I actually counted 4 major pivots. So, so let's start at the beginning. You know, when Matt and I met, we began investing together, right? 2004, we were dating, we weren't even married yet, and we bought our first property. And at that point, we had to have a lot of conversations of what we were going to do when we got married. I was just about starting a job in consulting. I really liked the work I was doing. And Matt was an engineer and really hated what he was doing. So, you know, we, we both looked at, okay, if one of us was to take this on full-time, we weren't making enough money to replace any income. It wasn't like what people do, you know, what we, what we tell people to do now. Uh, we just said, if one of us quits, you know, could, what could we do so one of us can focus on growing the business full-time? I was involved strategically and involved. I was just more on a part-time level. And then one person obviously taking care of the financial house, if you will. And we made decisions accordingly. Most people just buy their first house, the dream home, right? The single-family home with the white picket fence and what have you. And we didn't. We bought a house that I knew I could afford, basis of what I was making in my salary. If literally we made nothing from real estate and it was a dismal failure. So, that was the first kind of iteration. Second iteration, was, if you want to share what happened in 2008.

Yeah, yeah.

Years later.

Well, aside from like the real estate crash in 2008, Liz and I had this awesome idea that she should quit her job. And we were good savers— not we, she was a good saver. And she had— and she handled our family finances and had piled up a reasonable amount of money, which was around what it would take for us to live for a year in expenses. Right. So we had this great idea that she should quit her job and join me as full-time investing in 2008. Now, mind you, any folks know in the real estate world, 2008 is when the you-know-what hit the you-know-what. And so the real estate investing world got very, very different in 2008. And so we started working together in the most tumultuous real estate economy that we've ever seen. And so it, in some ways, it was good. I'll say it wasn't like all terrible, but in a lot of ways it wasn't good. The good part was that, you know, I was able to, you know, we were able to leverage each other's strengths and, you know, have conversations and relationships. We participated in some great programs of Leadership Trenton together and stuff like that. But above all else, Andresa, the problem that Liz and I had, and I think the reason why we didn't work, is because we didn't have clear job descriptions that really spoke to what each of us should be doing in the business. And that ended up causing Liz and I to step on each other. And above all else, it also made us sometimes feel like one was the other one's boss and the other one was the other one's boss other times. And I recommend that anyone listening that's thinking about investing with their spouse, one spouse should never be the boss of the other spouse. You can never make your spouse feel less than in the business, right? I think it needs to be equals all the time. They need to be equal voice, equal say, equal roles. Um, yeah, and there's never a report to— I mean, maybe, uh, collaborate with, but that's it. And it eventually failed. We didn't— we didn't work out. Uh, and Liz can— you can tell that conversation was just a tough conversation. We got to about 2009 And the wheels started to come off. And I said, actually, emotionally, yeah, the big stack of cash we had had dwindled down. Uh, realized we needed more money. And emotionally, just, we were just drained. And, and we— and it was getting to the point where I, I knew that this arrangement was going to affect our marriage to the point where it was affecting her. Yeah, of course. And our marriage wasn't going to be there anymore. And I told Liz that if we continue down this road, we will get a divorce. We just will. And, and that doesn't mean I didn't love her anymore. I loved her extremely, as I still do.

Yeah.

But I knew that that love was not going to be big enough, and the— from the— then the pain that we were creating for ourselves was going to overcome the love we had for each other, and it was going to, to just toxicify the whole thing.

Yeah.

And the house of cards would fall apart.

And so you went back to workless.

Yes, she did.

Went back to the other one. And I want to just pause one, one moment here to say that It's so, uh, um, I want to highlight what you guys did in terms of, okay, this is not working, let's find a way that this will work, instead of, well, somebody needs to do this job here and I'm going to be keep pushing through it and start building resentment to, to one another. And, and I see this very, very often, and people say, I am not going to quote unquote go back to my W-2 because now quote unquote, I know better that I shouldn't be working. So I really commend you, Liz, for sharing this because there are different paths. And I don't think that, that people talk a lot about it. So let's go there. You went back to your previous job.

Yeah. Yeah. And the irony of it is that I love what I did and then I left on a wonderful note and had a big going away party for me. So meanwhile, you know, I got a scrapbook, I got a big going away, you know, presents. And then a couple of years later, I—

You have like a welcome back party.

I had a welcome back party, but I went—

Didn't make her give the presents back or anything.

Yeah, but I went back to my old boss. And that's where, you know, you have to continue to keep relationships strong. Big proponent of that. And I stayed in touch with my old boss, always had a good relationship with her and said, hey, What I just did didn't work out the way I thought. And do you have some room for opportunity where I can jump back in? And she did. And I was very grateful for that. So I did, from 2010 to 2013, went back to my old work and stayed involved in the business. But we really had a big pivot in the business at 2010 where we really started to raise outside funds, grow our portfolio, focus on multifamily. That's really where I think our trajectory took off, if you will. And we really started to hone in on what we were great at. And then lastly, 2013 is when I left again and I had my son, our first child, and had that conversation of what does that look like? Who's staying? Who's going to be home? Are we both working full-time in the business? Because I left my consulting work at that point and we started to develop more income from our business. You know, so that's the kind of trajectory. And, and at that point, uh, was around the time I met you, Andresa. And just full circle, right? From there, and from there, um, that's life.

We're like, oh shit, now I have two to deal with.

But I, I just want to end on, you know, as you become a new mom and you're working with your spouse, because I was— that was my only thing I started I had, I had Zach at the time and we were working as much as I could work, right? Balancing a newborn. And I started to lose myself, started to lose myself and what was important to me and my identity. And it was really hard actually. And especially you're dealing with all the different hormones and what it is to be a new mom. And you and I met and started to really talk about what we were passionate about. And that really gave me another focus. So, and at this point trajectory, right? Fast forward. My role now is, is more on a strategic level. You know, we are— I'm involved in the business, but more just high level from like a day-to-day operational perspective. I know our projects, I know what's going on. I'm part of conversations. I'm not the one making the day-to-day decisions. And I also, you know, appreciate the role I have. We have monthly meetings, like I'm involved but not day-to-day. And that works. For, for us right now. And in my, you know, my work now is more in with InvestHer and supporting all the women we're supporting. So that's the long and short of the, the, the path and the roles.

Man, I, I, I heard Liz mentioning about this, uh, terminology that she talks about, like being a cheerleader, right? Instead of when, when you guys have conversations about DeRosa and, and different things, like what you need from her to be instead of like nitpicking, or, or, you know, when, when Debbie's Liz brain comes up and you're like, wah wah, right? So, so when you look at what, what, what did not work and what is working now, if you could like highlight so, so the, the folks that are listening here really understand like how her stepping out actually helped you guys tremendously from a, from emotional perspective, from like not being in the business, because many people feel that they have to be in it. So her stepping back actually helped.

Well, it is, but right, okay, it's so interesting perspective, right? And the story that Liz told is a good story, but I have a different perspective on that same About right. And it's like every— I feel like sometimes Liz and I are living the same life, although it's like it's what they said in Landmark, right? Like what I think, whatever she thinks, and then what happened, right? Um, and everything she said is true, right? But there's also my perspective of this, that, um, and I'll say this, every time there— every time there's been major change in DeRosa, 100% it came from Liz, right? Uh, she put Rich Dad Poor Dad in my hand, right? She introduced me to our very first investor. And as she saw that we were raising more and more investors, she said, "Somebody needs to keep these financials straight and run investor relations and be that point person and help people, you know, you wire the money here, Mr. and Mrs. Investor." Right? To be that point of contact for them as things were moving forward and somebody needed to write the newsletter and all that kind of stuff. Guess what? She did that.

Right.

Once we had— when we had our son in between the gap, there was a time period that I remember very, very clearly between 2013 and around, I want to say, '16 or so, '17.

Yeah, that was that.

In those couple of years that we had our son and she was able to put in like 10, 15 hours a week towards something while she was also launching the juggernaut of the Real Estate InvestHer show. She was also helping me with investor relations, and that helped me really hunker down and focus on really taking care of the people that gave us money, being the custodian for people that had given us money, and develop a protocol around it so that when she had stepped out of it, as she said, which was true, there was a clear role and delineation and job description. Liz, helped me hire the right person to replace herself. And that hire was a phenomenal hire, and that was really a big catalyst for our company to go more and more professional and more and more focused on investor values and taking care of our people and transparency and all that, which was a foundation that she built before she stepped down. So if I reverse engineer the company, there's been many, many times, there are foundations of this company, the DeRosa Group, and mine and Liz's investing philosophy, philosophy. There are foundations that we are built upon that she was involved in and helped architect and then stepped out of.

Wonderful. So now we're talking about roles, many, many different roles that one, a couple, can, can have, right? And I, I want to touch base, and we— Liz and I had this conversation flying to Arizona, and she brilliantly said people did not have those conversations in 1950s because the roles were assumed, right? Women could not own a property, a bank account, or a credit card back then. Now we are having conversations. We are the first generation to have those type of conversations with a spouse. And this is really like the new, new, new new roads. So let's, let's dig into, into that, because I believe many couples that are married and navigating building their real estate business, they know something is off, but they're trying to avoid that conversation. They don't want to, you know, mess up the, the, the marriage, or don't want other person to feel some way, shape, or form. But why, why having those like heart-to-heart alignment conversations are so important now?

Yeah, I mean, and you, when you and I are talking, right, the assumption is that, you know, you know, women in a sense, in that household, in a traditional sense, is going to take care of everything in the personal, from a personal perspective, and, you know, work, and now create some generational wealth on the side. So there's a lot there, you know, and the stress and the burnout is high. I I think the conversations are a must. They're not even nice to have. They're an absolute must. If you are going to work, if you're going to have a successful marriage, quite honestly, just let's put investing on the side. To have that conversation of like, what does our personal life look like? Who's doing what? I mean, we all bring in not just the generational element, but we also bring in what we saw our parents doing. So, you know, if we had, if we had parents, a single, single parent or two parents, what they did, and how that impacts us. So, you know, even for us, I would say over the years, you know, we, there wasn't a— we did talk about who was running the household, we had that conversation, who was staying home with the, with, with our, our, our, our, our first kid, our first kid, and then the second one, it was not assumed I was going to, I was working full-time, if you remember. So the assumption was, what are we doing here? Or, you know, what's that look like, right? And so we talked about it and we had a very, you know, we had a really honest conversation around the roles. And I think that set us up for success. And I'll say though, as your relationship evolves and the family dynamics evolve and children evolve, the items in the personal household increases. So if you are taking on new, growing a business and growing a family and, and, and, and you can't keep doing what you're doing when you first got married. You do this, I do this. So I have to say a quick story. Andresa and I were talking, which we always do, a year ago, and I was sharing a little bit about our household and things I was doing. And I was doing a lot. And Andresa was like, Liz, Liz, you know, have you made a list with Matt recently where you're really delineating your roles? And it was her suggestion, her coaching. I said, no, I'm probably doing 90% of everything. And I have a willing and able partner. But that was a new evolution. Our kids were getting older. I was taking more, growing InvestHer with you. It just was a lot. So we did. I came home, I made the list of like, what, 25 roles in the household, not even the business, in the household. And we went over every single one of them and said, who is owning what in this household? And, um, that is such a difference.

Who's taking the trash out? I mean, seriously, it was, it was down to like the granular, like who's responsible for interaction between our household and our schools that our kids go to, uh, everything. Who's, who's cooking dinner? Who's buying the food for that goes into the refrigerator? That kind of thing.

I even have it. We have a rule when you're home with the kids and I'm on a webinar, I have a call, or I'm doing something professional professionally, who is the parent on duty, the POD, who's the parent on duty. So the parent is on duty with the kids, then they are in charge of putting their phone down and not being on a work call. Because if he's on a work call and I'm doing a work call, well then who's giving attention to our children? And that's not the kind of parents we want to be. So the, the bottom line here is to really, really list out everything that happens in your household before you even talk about roles in the business. Because if you don't have your personal household in order, it's going to affect the business. It's going to affect how you play off each other.

Yeah.

So I want to highlight what you're saying right now because people sometimes do the reverse. They do the business but they don't do the, the household. Yeah.

First, and then maybe the resentment of one doing more than the other gets pulled into the business. Now they're doing— now that same spouse is doing things in the business that they really should be outsourcing, that they— that it was just assumed they were going to do. You know, why would any role in a business be assumed a feminine role or a masculine role? That's just ridiculous. Uh, so yeah, it has to be discussed.

That's a good point. It was like, I, you know, the— what spouse one is going to do it, spouse two is going to do it, or we're going to outsource it. And there was examples of, you know, cutting the grass, right? And that was like, okay, we're gonna outsource that. Uh, neither one of us get joy from it. The— our, our time is worth more, but somebody's in charge.

He is in charge of, of hiring the, the landscaper. And if I see the, the leaves out and I see something that doesn't work, I hear all about it. I'm like, hey Matt, are you talking to so-and-so? Because I'm not gonna go now text this guy. That's unless he needs help and he says, hey, I need some support here, I need some help here. Great, I'll help you, but I'm not going to just step in and micromanage it because then that's not delineation.

And I just text him and say, hey, my wife said Matt, so you took over dinner, right?

I know you're a great cook. Thank God.

Thank you.

Not that you're not a good cook, Liz, but we know, right, where we stand on that.

I make really good meatballs.

Sitting here, Liz makes good meatballs, people. That's about it, right? So, so, Matt, how, how did you feel about it? Because you also get joy out of cooking. So what you're saying to me is that it's just not like, oh, I to do this because I get, you know, so it's option one, who gets it based on, on the skill set, the joy out of it, or outsource. So is that the, the quick way to find out who's gonna own it?

Yeah, well, I mean, like, listen, it's like I, I just can't wait to cook dinner every day because that's the high— that's the best point of my day. But I do enjoy it more than she does. I'm better at it than she is.

Love you.

Um, but, uh, but I also know that it is my contribution that I can easily take on. For my family. And so for a lot of reasons, it's become just something that I do, that I'm in charge for the most part, like 90% of the time.

And meal prep, grocery shopping, you own all of that.

Yeah, I, I put all the— I, I do all the food shopping. I do all the, all the food shopping and all the, uh, meal prep. And, uh, and, you know, like, if I can't be home for dinner, sometimes I'll like, I'll make a Crock-Pot. I'll make it for her and just, okay, listen, put this on this temperature. You know, if I've got the time to do that. Or I'll just tell her, hey, listen, I defrosted some chicken, your broccoli, make this. So, um, if I'm owning it, I don't always have to do it, uh, but you think of it.

I do. It's the thinking.

So let's break that down because I don't think we are used to talk about it, use this language. And I think it's so important, ladies, that— and all the spouse that are listening— to have a common language, right? So what Liz and Matt are talking about is the word owning it. So can we break down what owning is? Because a lot of women, we are the thinkers of it, right? And that's how all the owning starts, is not just doing it, as Matt's saying, but the thinking of it. So, so can we break down what owning something— let's use the, the, the dinner as an example, right?

Yeah.

So when we went down that list, right, we listed out the 30 roles or 10 roles in the, in the household, things in the household, then you start to say, okay, what does that role look like and what's, what's included in that role? So, so, you know, meal prep or, or groceries includes meal prep, you know. So we were very defined, we defined it just like you would in a job description in a company, right? And so once you have the role and you are very clear on what those duties are in that role, Then you say, okay, who's gonna own that? Who is going to be responsible for that happening? You can be responsible for something happening and not doing all of, of the items in it.

Mm-hmm.

Meaning I'm responsible for making sure all the outside landscaping happens. That doesn't mean that he's the one out there doing all the work, but he's making sure it's happening. So owning it is about owning the responsibility of that really coming to completion, if you will.

Can I give you a good summary? Andresa Guidelli, owning to me means being responsible for the result, right?

Yeah.

So in whatever means that result gets produced, that could mean I go hire somebody, that could mean that I do it myself, that could mean that I empower Liz with all the resources she needs to make sure that this is easy for her to achieve the result. And that result is healthy food in ours and our children's stomachs. That's it. That's the result, you know, and at least 3 times a day, and for our daughter, 9 times a day. So there, it's, it's, it's just about in whatever means that I achieve that result, that's— I'm responsible for it.

And the thinking of it, you and I talk a lot, Andresa, right, about the thinking. It doesn't mean you have to have all the ideas because sometimes you're someone who may need some support around an idea. It's not that complex, but still, maybe there's a special meal that he's making. For my dad. It's not like he can't talk to me about like, hey, I'm going to make salmon for your dad because he loves fish. You know, I'm like, well, actually, you know, we should do like— so we're collaborative. Owning doesn't mean you do things by yourself either. Sure, you own it, you're responsible for it, you enroll who you need to enroll, you get the support you need to get, but you are the one that is at the helm of making sure it gets checked off.

Not necessarily cooking it. You can order it if you have a webinar, if you're speaking at some— listen, I own it, it's gonna arrive. Not necessarily you do it, but you get it, you get the result.

Yeah, if I'm in charge of dinner, then I'm probably the one that's going to implement that order and say, hey, what do you want? What do you want, kids? What do you want? Because I own it.

If I could just say, rules of communication in this is very important. So in other words, say the one spouse, he owns dinner, he owns— you know, last night, I'll give you a perfect example. Last night, his friend came over, they're making wine, they go downstairs. Now it's 5 o'clock, right? I'm now downstairs I don't see anything going on for dinner. And I'm like, oh, what's the plan for dinner? Like, so when you are owning something, you have to actually communicate that to your spouse or your, your family. Because if you're going to need support, it's frustrating, right? It was frustrating. Like, hey, what do we— that frustrates me when I have to ask, what are we doing for dinner? It's 5 o'clock, right? Because now everyone's starting to get hungry. I'm just standing there in the kitchen kind of twiddling my thumbs. I don't want to overstep But I also don't want to, you know, so I had a plan.

I know, I know. But the plan was for you to make it, and then you did, and it was great. But I had all the ingredients. I had all the ingredients.

You had all the preps.

Yeah, I did.

But the communication has to be there because the other, the other person might not know. And that, that's where ongoing communication to, if you know, to get these roles done is critical.

That's all I want to say. And I'll give one more thing in that what's great about me owning a thing and then Liz owning something else, right? Um, the, the great part about that is I know that I don't have to— that, that thing is now owned by her, and it can become less into my brain cells have to think about that, that thing that she's owning anymore, because I know that I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna own what I'm gonna own. She's gonna own what she's gonna own. And what a lot of times I've seen happen in our family before we had these agreements, um, is that there's just this Understanding, again, the story that I thought she was gonna make dinner, or I thought, I thought he was gonna get the kids up, or I thought she was gonna do the laundry, or I thought she was gonna cut the grass or find a landscaper.

And then something happened.

Yeah, and resentment happens because you're breaking the agreement I had in my head on who was going to do that, right? And so you violated this mental agreement that I never spoke out loud, you know? Right? Um, yeah, so that's how a lot of this, you know, so you need to speak the agreements out loud, get on the same page. And then, uh, and then it actually empowers me. This is actually, Andresa, a lesson I have to think about. Because if I know if I have to think about not the 30 things on the list but the 15 that I take on, my brain cells are more dedicated towards what needs to, needs to happen on my plate versus, versus her. It actually creates a lot of peace for me.

100%. I heard this— it's funny you're mentioning that because yesterday I heard about this term unspoken contract. When people say when they're getting resent— resentment towards the other person and they explode and they say, well, I did A, B, C, D, E, and you cannot do X, Y, and Z. What it's all about. So that is actually an unspoken agreement that in our head, in the person's head, right, they had that if they did those ABC, that somebody else was supposed to do X, Y, and Z, and that never happens. One thing that, that you guys recently introduced me to is the, the 4 entities, which is Liz is an entity on her own and she needs to work on— Liz needs to work on— same thing with Matt, different. And then there's a third entity that is the marriage, the relationship between Matt and Liz, and the fourth is the business relationship. And I think many people just put it all in one bucket and then we're all together. We don't even have a separate Facebook account. We're like Matt and Liz, as if it is just one and everybody needs to work on, on, on different things. And I've seen it. We, we've done work together separate. Um, one thing that you said again in the air, Liz, is that And I, it was brilliant to me. You said when one individual is working on, on their stuff and the other one is also committed to work on their stuff, automatically the relationship evolved. So the third entity will involved and, and then you can all synchronize with, with the business as well. But it always, always start with the, the individual. So I wanted to throw the ball to you guys here. Let's— can we break that down a little bit, how that has been working for, for you guys? Matt, want to start with that?

Yeah, well, I, and I wrote a few notes down while you were talking because you really got my wheels turning actually just now. And by the way, guys, this conversation of working with your spouse is a constantly evolving conversation that Liz and I have out loud, and that we've talked about having more like an InvestHerCon and potentially in a book one day and those kinds of things, right? And so, my brain's always thinking about ways to better this conversation. So, the 4 entities, here's something I just wrote down, right? The 4 entities, as you said, spouse 1, spouse 2, the relationship, the business, right? I think there should be a spoken agreement, not an assumed agreement each week, a spoken agreement between the spouses about what we're going to do to grow all 4 of those things. And that might mean Matt's personal growth and Liz creating the space and the support and the reminders maybe that Matt has to do things to make himself a better, stronger person physically, mentally, spiritually, whatever my growth mechanisms are. Same thing for her, right? And we needed to— and we needed to do something that week to build a relationship. Could be date night. We like to read this, um, we get up before the kids do and read this book called The Five Love Languages, uh, devotional. You know, sometimes we're going dates, uh, sometimes we just snuggle up and watch a show together, whatever. Sometimes we just— we'll just sit on the couch with a glass of wine and talk. Those are my favorite dates, is home date with a glass of wine and talk about the two of us, right? Those are really feeding and growing the relationship, right? And then what are we doing to feed and grow the business as well that week?

Based on the roles that you have in that business, right?

Correct. Yeah. As long as we all four entities are growing and as long as we have agreements, spoken agreements on what each of us are doing to support the growth of those four things, we're going in a direction that feels good, is going to hit our financial goals, it's going to keep us happily married, in a great thriving growing relationship, and it's going to keep us both thriving and growing people that are in this 4-thing circle as well.

Yeah, I love that.

That sounds very healthy.

I think there's been a breakdown, but there's— the breakdown happens when, uh, there's needs that aren't being met that aren't being expressed, you know. And so, meaning I don't have a day-to-day role in our business, so if I feel like we've missed one of our monthly meetings I feel very disconnected. I feel very like, hey, I could really be adding value here and I'm not being tapped. And I feel useless. I feel not needed. And I don't like that. Right? That's my story. That's what I interpret. And Matt needs something different. He runs the business every day. It's a different— right? It's a different entity. It's a different relationship, I should say. So I've expressed that and we had— we continually to talk about that. Where it comes across supportive, engaging versus—

we're not perfect, picky, we're not— what I just said sounds awesome and perfect, Andresa, but I can tell you that we don't see— perform on that level all the time. It is our aspiration to be on that every week. We're not— we don't give ourselves a 10 out of 10. It actually could be a good little fun thing to rate how we did each week. I mean, and there, there are weeks that if I had to rate how Liz and I did on feeding our 4 entities each week I probably give us a 3 out of 10. Um, there are other weeks I give us a 10 out of 10. But as Liz said, it's messy. You're on the journey together, man. And it's not something— it's— I don't know if the road of marriage is meant to be perfect. I don't think it is. I think it's meant to be a journey that you're constantly holding hands on and figuring out, hey, let's go left, let's go right, whatever. But you stay together and you constantly course correct and have spoken agreements on these things as you go.

One thing that I will tell you guys, Matt and Liz are going to be speaking together at InvestorCon on May 18th, 19th in Scottsdale, Arizona. We're going to put a link below over here. So Matt and Liz, what people can expect from your presentation?

So, well, it's a lot of what we just said right now, Andresa, and they can't— that doesn't mean that they can't come or they don't have to come because we're going to go There's a lot more. We're going to go deeper dive. There is a phenomenal exercise Liz and I use called Continue, Start, and Stop, and we don't have time to talk about it now. But if they come to InvestorCon, they will talk about Continue, Start, and Stop. And I think that Continue, Start, and Stop has kept our marriage and our business and our lives pointed in the right direction so many times. And so we're going to get into an evaluation of what spoken agreements the married couples in the room have. And we're going to talk deep dive about where, like, just let's reality check because it's fun to talk about where we want to go, but it's also even better. You know where you're at right now. You look yourself in the mirror. So we're going to be going through some exercises and looking ourselves, the audience, and ourselves, Liz and I, in the mirror about where we are specifically on the 4 entities that we talked about today.

So that, so that, right, generational wealth can happen. Yeah. And it happens on your own terms, but it really starts starts with the person, then it starts with a couple and a partnership. And so, what does that look like? And you have to talk about blind spots and certainly, how do you get realigned when you think you're aligned? And so, all that's going to be weaved through to really create that financial freedom journey and a roadmap. So, it doesn't happen overnight, but it's all part of creating the financial freedom you want. This is the work that needs to happen. You can't get there. Without the personal and obviously focusing on the business strategic goals, right, to put assets in place. But that's the technical stuff that everyone knows what to do. This is the work that really is the core. And then you can position into assets to buy to get us to our financial freedom goals. That tends to be the easier part in a lot of ways.

The foundation, right? I feel that those are the foundation. Those are the written agreements And I think that once it is around a structure, the conversations are going to come easier because the spouse, we're gonna have to look into what they're looking for separately, and then they come together. And that it's, uh, we are going to offer, um, hands-on guidance for all the attendees, uh, to do that. I can't thank you both enough. I love you both. And we are, we have been in this journey for so many years, and I cannot wait to continue doing this next to both of you. Matt, you have been a super supportive hubby for Liz and a business partner for me behind the scenes. Not many people know, um, the, the role that you have played behind investor So I really want to thank you publicly for, for that, for all the support that you have given Liz and I. Um, can't thank you enough, my friend.

You've told me I'm the only male investor. That's right, honorary member, right? Uh, yes, it's an honor. And then I'm, I am in awe every day at what you two are building, and it is, it is an honor to be the support for what— for that. And, and, you know, words of wisdom if I can, or, you know, every here and again, if y'all let me show up on the show, put on podcast and talking about what it is to be married.

You always have great ideas. I have an idea. I have an idea. I have an idea.

I do. I'm an idea machine. I have lots of them. Only a couple of them are good though.

Thank you so much both. And we can't wait to see what are you guys gonna do at InvestorCon. And at InvestorCon, we'll have a special surprise for all that.

And more surprises.

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