The Power of an Alcohol-Free Life with James Swanwick

You're actually better off drinking alcohol for breakfast. I did get thrown out of the Playboy Mansion. I'm not an alcoholic or anything, but I was drunk and I got kicked out. Numb that feeling with a glass of attractively packaged poison. Alcohol equals fun or relaxation. Not drinking alcohol equals I'm in a prison for goodness sake. Lighten up, will you? Not drinking is the gift. Not drinking is the reward. Drinking is the prison.

Are you really happy with your relationship with alcohol? Well, at one point I really wasn't. In fact, at way more than one point, I wasn't. And so I came across a few different individuals that were looking at things a bit differently, one of them being James Swanik. James is the founder of Swanee's, which is a blue light blocking sunglass company, but also the founder of the alcohol free lifestyle. He calls it attractively packaged poison. So we're going to dive deep today with James talking about alcohol, what we should do, how we should approach the relationship with it. He's not saying everyone in the world should stop up, but he is saying that everyone in the world should stop for a moment and just assess their relationship with alcohol. Is it empowering? Is it disempowering? For many of you who have followed the podcast for the last number of years, you'll know that I'm coming up to about four years now of no alcohol. And I used to really enjoy it. It used to be a big part of socializing and unwinding and all those things that we generally use it for. But I'll tell you what, I think I'm equally as fun now. My health is certainly a lot better. My life certainly feels like there's a lot more momentum happening. So I'm not here to challenge you to stop drinking, but I do want you to listen into this show today with James Swanick and see if there's anything that really inspires you or piques your interest. But please, for now, sit back and enjoy the show. James, a huge welcome back to the lead on purpose podcast.

James, thank you so much for having me back.

Oh, it's a pleasure. We need to have you back because what we're about to chat about hasn't actually improved a lot in the world that I look at anyway. So to get started, for the listener or the viewer that's watching right now, who's going, hey, alcohol, I'm cool with it, actually. I use it to relax, actually. It's fun. It helps me socialize. You know what, I'm in control of it. It's not in control of me. What's your message to them?

My message to them is that you are leaving hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions of dollars on the table because of that attitude and because of your experience with alcohol. And you are compromising probably your health, your relationships and your experience of life. Now, some people, not some people, let's say most people will say what you just said, you know, a version of that. Ah, it's fine, it's no big deal. I'm good. I just, I'm not, not an alcoholic or anything. I would say this, you don't need to be an alcoholic in order for alcohol to severely compromise health, wealth, love and happiness. And so I'm not here to persuade or convince people that they need to stop drinking alcohol. But I hope that I can persuade people here to explore their relationship with alcohol, to just really get dialed in to the fact that any amount of alcohol, seemingly innocent amounts of alcohol, is still enough to compromise your performance, your family and your experience of life. Now, I don't want to come across as a Debbie Downer. I don't think I am. I'm pretty fun. I'm a pretty fun guy. And everything that I coach and everything I teach and everything I speak about is designed to help people realize that an alcohol free lifestyle is so much more fun, so much more profitable and so much more pleasurable than a life with even seemingly innocent amounts of alcohol. And I think that's where people get stuck. They have this association with alcohol equals fun or relaxation and not drinking alcohol equals I'm in a prison and I'm boring and I'm dull and life sucks. Well, hopefully in our conversation I'll be able to maybe persuade people to just entertain the idea that an alcohol free lifestyle is the superior lifestyle.

I love it. We're going to challenge people's bs, their belief systems. We're going to do that today. And I know I can do it from experience in saying that. You know, I grew up in Ireland. I was drinking consistently from about 16 and got pretty heavy through 16, 17, 18, blacking out, getting lost, people not knowing where I was getting injured physically. Obviously it cost a lot. I carried on then, not at the extremes, but carried on through my 20s, started to put a bit of weight on again, spending a lot of money on it. All entertainment revolved around it. All travel revolved around. If I was 7am and it was in the Kori or the airplane business lounge, I'd be straight over to get a glass of bubbles. It's there. Why wouldn't I and I thought that was normal business and socializing was all harnessed around it. Then 2020 came and my partner said, I'm doing one year, no beer. I said, well, that sounds boring. Good luck. And I says, what does it mean? She's like, one year of no alcohol. And I was like, okay. And so I woke up the next day and I thought, I think I should do that. I have too many justifications as to why I shouldn't drink alcohol. Therefore I must give it a go for a year. And I'm coming up almost four years. And what you just described is literally exactly it. I've got an app that tracks how much I've saved on average and it's I think about $70,000. And so has my partner says $140,000. I have had way more energy. My business is 4, maybe even 5 x'd in terms of revenue. My health, my vitality, getting up early in the mornings, less reactive emotionally. The list goes on. And again, I'm not here to preach. I'm not here to tell people, stop drinking. But I'm here to share my experience too. To say, hey, it's very impactful. So James, what's your story? Did you drink at one point and why do you do what you do now?

Well, I'm Australian. I'm Australian American in fact. And I grew up in Brisbane and I became a socially acceptable drinker in that I would have one or two drinks most nights of the week and then on weekends I would drink heavily. But I didn't get arrested, I didn't get a dui. I didn't wake up in a ditch. But I got to my mid-30s after 20 years of this socially acceptable drinking. And I looked in the mirror one morning and I thought, wow, you're just blah. And by blah, I mean I was 20 pounds overweight. I wasn't sleeping great, my business was okay. I was often irritable. So my relationship with my then girlfriend was strained.

I was eating fries and burgers when I would go out, I would have sugary treats when I was out, I was frustrated. I was feeling like something was missing. Now again, none of that was waking up in a ditch or getting arrested. I was just a socially acceptable drinker. I had a couple drinks a night, a lot more on weekends. But you do that for 20 years. 20 years, that catches up with you. And it caught up with me. And the thing that caught up to me was mediocrity. It was me squandering my potential. I was eh, my Business was okay, my friends were okay, my romantic relationship was okay, but none of them were thriving. And I identified that alcohol was the biggest culprit because the drinking of the alcohol led to a disrupted night's sleep, which led to irritability and fogginess and distraction, which led to procrastination, which led to very mediocre results in all areas of my life. I stopped drinking very suddenly March 2010. And I decided then I was going to just take a 30 day break from alcohol and see what would happen. And in 30 days, I lost 20 pounds. I slept better, I felt better, and then I thought, I'll just keep on going. So I went three months, I got to three months and I had the clarity and focus to go and audition to become a television anchor at arguably the most iconic sports television news show in the world. And that's called Sports center on espn. And I got the job and I moved out to Bristol, Connecticut, which is about two hours outside of of New York City. And I hosted SportsCenter on ESPN for two years with zero television experience. I had zero. Now I was lucky enough that I had a friend who introduced me to a producer. But I credit the clarity and the focus and the energy and the drive and the positivity that I had from being at that point only a few months alcohol free to helping me get that job and realize a lifelong dream of mine, a childhood dream, to host a TV show. And then I thought, wow, this is damn pretty good. And then I just realized that the caliber of my relationship started to improve, the depth of conversation started to improve. I started working out a little bit more, going to the gym. I started eating a little bit better.

Stopping the alcohol was the domino that knocked all the other dominoes down, which opened up a whole cascade of healthy habits. I started eating paleolithic style, which is, you know, lean meats and vegetables. I started helping my friends. I started being a more agreeable, nicer person. And I got to a year and I went back to the same place where I'd quit the year before. And I ordered what I thought would be a celebratory beer, a Bud Light. And I went to put it to my mouth to celebrate a year, you know, because I thought, oh well, I should celebrate being a year alcohol free with alcohol. And at the very last moment, just before I went to sip the beer, I thought, well, you know what? In one year I've lost 30 pounds, sleeping better. My business has exploded. My side business, that is. I got my this job hosting SportsCenter on ESPN, life feels pretty damn good. And I just thought, why am I going to put the brakes on this? So I just handed the beer back, tip to the barman. And I haven't picked up an alcoholic drink since. And then, since then I've gone on to create this organization called Alcohol Free Lifestyle. We help mostly entrepreneurs and executives in their 40s and 50s to stop drinking for at least 90 days. We help rewire their mindset around alcohol. And then at day 90, our clients can choose to either continue to be alcohol free, quit entirely if they choose, or reintroduce some level of alcohol into their life, but at a far more modest level. But in either case, the rewiring of the mindset leads to our clients having power over alcohol. Alcohol no longer has power over them.

That's so powerful. And I like to call it, I do say that I'm alcohol free. I know there's alcohol free and they're sober, but I say alcohol free. It was a decision. I was in control of that decision and I feel grateful for that. But I recall the one year mark and sat down with my partner Caroline, went to our favorite restaurant and the waiter came and said, so, would you like a drink? And we both looked at each other and we'd kind of planned to order a really nice bottle of champagne. You know, it's like we've done a year, like, let's celebrate. We both looked at each other and she nodded and I said, two Heineken zeros, please. And it was like I had no desire. It just life was so good. And when you shared that story, I was like, it's so similar. And there was a rewiring. I think the four month mark, something shifted for me, like three or four months, something radically shifted in terms of clarity, in terms of beliefs. So let's talk about the beliefs. Because my reluctance was this. When I decided to quit, it was around. It was April 2020, and I had an event a few months later where I was hosting all of my top clients. I was hosting the prime minister. We were going to be helicoptering up and landing on a mountain and drinking champagne in the snow. And I was thinking, I can't not do that. Like, I've got to do that. That's part of my tribe. And I was going to celebrate and socialize. But I sat down and thought about it for a second and thought, well, when I get there, let me figure it out. And of course the helicopter line said, any alcohol free? And so they had alcohol free bubbles champagne. Therefore, it looked like I was part of the tribe, so I got through that little moment. And then I started getting through birthdays and started getting through New Year's celebrations by going, I can still drink. I just don't need to have alcohol in it. So for the person that goes like that right now, James, that's going, no, but I've got this coming up and I'm very social. What advice do you have for them?

Well, that person has an association that alcohol equals fun and pleasure and camaraderie and not drinking alcohol equals pain and suffering and feeling like you're in a prison. So let's challenge that belief.

If George Clooney, Hollywood actor, very charming, cool. We think of him as being kind of sophisticated and cheeky and fun. He turned up to your dinner party.

And you welcome him and you go, hello, Mr. Clooney, welcome. Great to have you here. And George Clooney comes in and he's got this swagger and he's smiling. And you, as the, you know, the hospitable host is like, oh, can I get you a drink? Can I get you a beer, a wine, a champagne? And George Clooney responds, oh, no thanks, I'm alcohol free. Have you got soda water, ice at a piece of lime? Are you really, as the host, going to respond, Come on, George Clooney, what are you talking about? Have a beer for goodness sake. Lighten up, will you? No, right. You're just going to go, okay, Mr. Clooney, sure. Let me go and get you a soda water and that'll be the end of it. Right now, what was the difference there? If we had someone else other than George Clooney or we had George Clooney himself walk in and you as the host say, hey, can I get you a drink? And George Clooney or whoever it else says, she's, you know, I'd like to have a drink, but I can't. I kind of promised my wife. I'm doing this 30 day, this 90 day thing. I wish I could, but I got to cut back. I've been drinking too much.

What's the other. What's the host going to do? What's you.

They're going to fake holes in that.

Oh, they're going to be all over that. All over it. Oh, come on, you just have one. It's my birthday. But it's our anniversary. What, you're up on the mountain in New Zealand with the prime minister, you're not going to have a glass of champagne? So the point of this sliding doors scenario, I guess there's option A, there's option B. As to how you approach this is it doesn't matter what you say when anyone challenges you as to why you're not drinking alcohol, what really matters is how you say it. And the how is you're light hearted, you're fun, you're enjoying yourself being alcohol free. You don't require the alcohol to enjoy the occasion, you just get to enjoy the occasion irrespective of if there's alcohol or not. So what I would say is that most people are mistakenly believing that, that if they don't drink on top of the ski mountain with the prime minister that everyone else is going to be having fun and they're not. Whereas the reality is that the person who's alcohol free, I would submit, is probably having a better time because they're more present, they get to have more in depth conversations.

They get to have their wits about them.

They get to enjoy the experience.

And so you had a nice phrase five or so minutes ago when you said, I'm going to challenge your bs, your belief systems. I like that, it's very clever. I like what you did there. So I just invite the listener to challenge your belief systems around this. Oh, if I'm not drinking, I'm boring or I'm dull. Well, George Clooney is not boring or dull in this scenario that I put forward. And you're not thinking that he's boring and dull just because he's drinking a soda water. So again, it's just the energy you bring to this. When I go out, I just commit to having the most fun, being the most engaging, being the most charming, having a great time. I'll just give you one last anecdote before I hand back over to you, James. The Playboy Mansion. I went to the Playboy Mansion three times back when I lived in Los Angeles, California. And I went pre2010 when I was a drinker and I went post 2010 when I was a non drinker. When I went pre 2010, I went to an event there, it's probably about 2003 and there was a corporate event. It was the launch of a US cable TV network called Spike tv. Pamela Anderson was there, Limp Bizkit, the band was there, Stone Cold Steve Austin, there was a Backstreet Boy or I don't know what pop band was. Anyway, I got drunk, jumped in the grotto and I got thrown out for being excessively drunk. And I had a wonderful time, don't get me wrong, but at the same time I did, I did get thrown out of the Playboy Mansion. I went back about five years later. Oh, sorry. I'm sorry. I went back about five years after I had stopped drinking in about 2015 as an alcohol free man. And I danced on tables, I swam in the grotto, and I had a far superior time and I remembered it, I remembered every last bit of it and I savored it. So when I was drinking alcohol, I had a fun time, but I was drunk and I got kicked out. When I went alcohol free, I had a much more enjoyable time and I got to savor it. That's the difference.

That's huge. And what about the person that goes, you know what? I'm actually very anxious socially and I actually feel that alcohol is my friend in terms of it just lubricates me a little bit and I can then socialize. What's your answer to them and what's a step for them they could take other than just drinking to be less anxious socially?

Look, the only reason that we're wanting to drink in that scenario is that we're feeling uncomfortable with ourselves. And why are we going to numb that pain, numb that feeling with a glass of attractively packaged poison, which is only going to increase those same feelings that you're trying to avoid, right? So it's this perpetual vicious cycle where we drink because we think it's relieving us of stress and anxiety. And yet what it's actually doing is creating more stress and anxiety. So a lot of people stop, have a glass of wine or a couple of glasses of wine or a beer at the end of the day, go, just need a couple of drinks to relax. Well, what you're actually doing is, is that you're essentially pouring gasoline on a fire. And what you're doing is that you're putting the body to work, try and process the toxins that you've just digested. It's now going to compromise your sleep quality, which is going to leave you feeling irritable and foggy and distracted the next day. And because you don't want to feel irritable and foggy and distracted the next day, you end up consuming something to try and relieve you from that irritability and that fogginess and that distraction, which at the end of a long day, guess what is alcohol, right? And we're stuck in this cycle. Look, whether you're introverted or extroverted, irrespective of that, irrespective of whether you feel confident, comfortable in social situations, or you feel a little bit awkward.

We do not need a glass of attractively packaged poison to support us through whatever we're feeling. We just get to feel whatever we're feeling. So how do you resolve someone who's introverted not being so introverted? I mean, that's a conversation for an introversion and extroversion expert, I would submit. Right. There's a lot more things that are going on there. The point I'm trying to make is that you do not need the glass of alcohol to relax. You just get to relax. And there are 1 million different ways that you can do that that don't involve digesting a product that is going to increase your social awkwardness over time.

That's right. And when you look at the old wives tales of actually a little dram will help you sleep well, and we've heard that for years, but now the science is pretty clear and very obvious that actually sleep and alcohol, they don't support each other in a positive way at all.

Look, it may be true that having a little bit of alcohol helps you to fall asleep, that might be true. However, the quality of your sleep will be so compromised as a result that it absolutely makes no sense to do so. Now I have clients, CEOs, multimillion dollar business owners, peak performers, a two time Oscar winner, an Olympian.

You know, like peak performers who are really wanting optimal performance and they tend to track their health, their sleep metrics. I'm sorry, by wearing an OURA ring. And I'm wearing an OURA ring now. I see you're wearing one as well, James.

Yeah. Yes, I love it.

Yes. Now they were tracking their sleep before they stopped drinking.

And then they came into our 90 day stop drinking process.

And they tracked their sleep. And what was fascinating is that after about seven to ten days after they stopped drinking, you can just see this sea of blue. And if you know, if you use an OURA ring, you'll know what I'm talking about. When I refer to sea of blue, it's basically tracking your REM sleep, your deep sleep, your restlessness through the night, your latency as to, you know, how quickly it takes you to fall asleep, the duration of sleep. And if you're doing particularly well in all those metrics, then it just shows up as a blue line. Now what's interesting is that when I've looked at clients OURA ring results.

Pre joining us, when they've shared them with me, you know, when they've shared them with me during the process, it's a sea of red. And the red color means sleep is terrible. Horrendous needs some work. Then when they stop drinking alcohol, it's a sea of blue, right? So don't even take my word for it. Just track your own body and you will see that any amount of alcohol will lead to a sea of red. Removing alcohol will increase the likelihood of a sea of blue. In terms of aura results is what I'm referring to. And I'll just say this last thing in relation to sleep. I own a sleep company, it's called Swanic Sleep. We produce blue light blocking glasses which have got these orange lenses in it. You wear it close to bed bedtime, so it blocks out the artificial light, helps you sleep better. I can tell you this as it relates to alcohol. You're actually better off drinking alcohol for breakfast than you are anywhere close to bedtime. Because at least if you have alcohol for breakfast, your body will then have 16 hours to go to work breaking down the toxins of the alcohol to get you into a position where you can then fall asleep at nighttime and have a good night's sleep. The challenge is when you drink alcohol anywhere close to bedtime, you're essentially clocking your body in for a night's work. You're essentially putting your body to work at a time when your body does not want to go to work. Your body wants to rest. But as soon as you drink that alcohol that you think is relieving you of stress or anxiety or helping you to fall asleep, as soon as you drink that, you're putting your body into eight hours of work at a time when your body wants to rest. And that's why most people wake up tired, irritable and sluggish.

Yeah, no, 100%. I felt that way for years. Between the age of, say, 16 and what would that be? 33 or something like that? I had terrible sleep, but in fact I thought alcohol would help me improve that. But when you look, I guess at lifespan, you look at the quality of life as well that we live. Sleep has a massive impact on it, Huge impact. So if we can do anything to improve our sleep, whether that's reducing alcohol or better exercise, meditation, then we know that's going to support a better life. A better quality of life. Right.

Sleep is everything. It's not even like the secret to a great life. It's like the strategy to a great life. Because if we're sleeping poorly, it affects everything. I think you mentioned before you had a client who's a pro athlete. I mean, we have clients who are NFL stars over in the us.

Some English premier league teams, Manchester United and Tottenham Hotspur, they wear our Swannies blue light blocking glasses from our sleep company, Swanik Sleep, because those players and their sports science departments at those clubs, Manchester United and Tottenham, they know that if their athletes are sleeping well, that that's going to show up on better performance on the pitch or on the field. The New Orleans Saints, where our blue blocking glasses, the New York Knicks, the famous basketball team. Again, there's so much science out now that sleep is the, sorry, I was about to say the biggest component. Let's just say that sleep is one of the biggest components to peak performance. Whether you are a CEO, you're an entrepreneur, whether you're a pro athlete, whether it be track or basketball or English Premier league soccer, football, whether you play for the All Blacks in New Zealand, Sleep is so vital to repairing the muscles, to restoring the hormonal balance, to giving you clarity and focus to be able to make great strategic decisions in your business. So anything that compromises sleep is obviously going to compromise the performance of your respective careers. And so if you're drinking even seemingly innocent amounts of alcohol in the hours before you go to sleep, you are compromising your performance the following day. No question.

Yeah, there's no doubt about it. In fact, James, here's. I started to weigh things up. I'm a big pros and cons guy. If I'm going to make a decision, let's really weigh it up. So I started weighing it up. I went, okay, let's say I just have one hangover a week, just one a week where I'm just not myself. Bit bit off. Well, there's 52 days a year. That's two months of James being subpar. And I thought to be a subpar dad for two months a year, to be a subpar coach, to be a subpar speaker, a subpar partner, a subpar human, like, that's not really attractive. And then I went, well, usually it's a couple of days a week where I'm feeling a little bit foggy in the morning. So there's four months, four months of being hungover. When I started to look at it like that, I said, this is non negotiable. The biggest thing for me that I honestly find hard was beer pressure, the old peer pressure, the social side of it, it's so cool. Why would you not do it? And when I stopped doing it, I was a bit shocked. As I looked with a more clear lens, I could see how much alcohol was in every advert, in every movie and it was in so Many places. Big example that's been all over New Zealand recently. Taylor Swift, she's at the super bowl. She gets the drink and she scolds it. And look, I think Taylor's wonderful. I think she's so creative, she's amazing. But she's a role model. She's a role model to multi millions, if not maybe billions of young people and not so young people. And that one action there, I thought, you've got to have fun. Yes, I get it. You're young, you're at the super bowl, you've got to have fun. But actually, what does that message send? Because she's all about brand. And to me, that's a direct reflection of what her brand is about. So I'm starting to see it everywhere. James, what's your thoughts on how we're almost subconsciously programmed to drink?

Well, it's cultural conditioning. And it started when you were a little boy or a little girl, when your parents, if they were drinking at the dinner table, would say, oh, no, no, little James, little Sally, no, no, you can't drink now. You can drink when you're older. And so now what that messaging is to a five or six or seven year old child is, oh, okay, alcohol is something that the grownups get to do. One day I'll get to drink this attractively packaged poison. Okay, that's where it starts. That's where it begins. And then of course, we grow up and we go into, get into our teens and we still see our parents drinking and. No, no, no, you can drink when you're 15 or 16. All right, I'll give you a little bit. Almost like it's this rite of passage. And then of course, we get into high school and we finish high school and we go and celebrate the end of high school. And what's everyone doing? Getting drunk, Drinking excessively. And everyone's smiling as they do it. Yeah, we're drinking, we're getting that. I call them smiling assassins. Smiling assassins are the waiters and the waitresses who greet you at the restaurant. Hello, James. Hello, sir. Hello, ma'. Am. Great to have you with us. Can I get you started with a cocktail? Can I get you started with the wine? With a wine. Here's the wine list. What could I get you to start? Can you just start it with some drinks? And they're smiling at you. And so this association, right, this subliminal or this unconscious association is this attractively bottle. This attractively packaged bottle of poison equals pleasure.

Because they're smiling, right? And then you go to the bus say, hey, should we have a couple of drinks? Yeah. Hey, how you doing? Nice to see. And they were smiling as we're drinking this poison. Then we see billboards.

Of celebrities flogging their tequila brand like aviation gin from Ryan Reynolds. I mentioned George Clooney before he and Randy Gerber had a billion dollar brand of tequila. The Rock. Dwayne Johnson is peddling his tequila.

Now, look, those celebrities, they do a lot of good in the world. They really do. But I think they've fallen short in this aspect because they are essentially promoting something that absolutely compromises people. That's another conversation.

But this whole belief system that alcohol equals fun and pleasure, like I said, it started when we were five or six. It increased as we got into our teens. It really got momentum. Post school, US college fraternities. You mentioned rugby before the All Blacks. I mean, I used to play rugby for Los Angeles Rugby Club when I first moved to the US and if I was, quote unquote, lucky enough to win the man of the Match award, the reward was I had to chug or skull, you know, a rugby boot of beer while people were yelling out, chug, chug, chug, chug, chug. Or skull. Skull. Skull. Skull. Again, reinforcing this idea that alcohol equals camaraderie. You see it in rugby circles all over. Look, rugby is amazing. I played rugby for 20 years. The camaraderie that's created in rugby is second to none of the but this ridiculous, preposterous notion that at the end of the game you have to consume beer with the opposition and smile and like, blah, blah, blah, blah. Why can't you just hang out with the opposition and tell some stories while drinking alcohol? Free alternatives. This obsession. This has got to be a couple of beers. Oh, let's have a couple of beers, mate. We went into battle together, but everything's all right. Let's drink this, drink this night of mediocrity, shall we? Let's go out and have a few nights of crap sleep and some regrets. Tomorrow morning show. I mean, you see it all the time. I mean, I don't know if you follow the nrl, which is the National Rugby League over in Australia, but there's so many problems with their pro athletes going out after games, drinking excessively, getting arrested and, you know, scandals all over the place. I mean, it's so avoidable. It's so avoidable.

Anyway, that's a leadership challenge, I think as well. This is top down. You know, I look at Taylor Swift, it's top down. I look at The Dwayne the Rock Johnson. It's top down. We need leaders in our societies, in our teams, in our families, to be able to tout a different narrative. A few seasons ago, I had a professional athlete call me up the day after their end of year celebrations. And he was crying. And I said, is everything okay? I'd never heard him cry in my life. He went, no, this is about 2pm in the day. I was like, you sound a little bit off. He's like, yeah, I'm not feeling good today. I was like, well, what's up? He had a massive night last night. I was like, oh, okay. How can I help? He says, well, we were playing a bit of a game and one of the players dared me to say something and I said it. I said, okay, what's the issue? He says, well, it happened to be the N word. I said, okay, we've got a different conversation. I was like, what on earth made you feel like you should say that? Well, it was a bit of a game. I says, regardless, are you racist? He went, no, not at all. And he started telling me all his friends and family and background. I said, okay, so why did you say it? He went, I was drunk. I said, okay, so is that an excuse? Does that validate things and everything's okay? Well, no, but hopefully people understand. I was just drunk. I was like, mate, you've got to realize still come out of your mouth. It was still a decision whether you were drunk or not. People heard it. And I'm sure there'll be some conversations that need to be had. I think you should drive those conversations as soon as possible when you're sober. So he's a great guy on and off the field. I had a lot of respect for him, and when that happened, it underlined for me, wow, do I respect him because he doesn't respect his own body and doesn't respect his own mindset and is willing to throw away an incredible career and tarnish friendships and tarnish this culture of this team that he was a part of. Really made me question things. And I don't think he's done with alcohol yet. But at some point he's going to have to face it and go, is it worth it? Have you came across situations like that in your experience?

I mean, I get a lot of clients, very successful financially. They run businesses, you know, very successful leaders in their community in the sense that they're perceived as leaders in the community. But they have this thing called.

What'S the phrase? Imposter syndrome, where on the outside people think that they've got everything together and that they're amazing and people look up to them because they've got this thriving business and on the outside they've got this great wife or husband and his children, family. But on the inside they're drinking excessively and they know it's causing them problems. I had a gentleman called Steve Wilt, he won't mind me referencing his name because he's gone on our podcast, the Alcohol Free Lifestyle Podcast, and shared his story. 58 year old, lives from Akron, Ohio in the US works for a company that does retirement plans, very successful, plays tennis, plays golf, raises money for charity.

Seemingly a beacon of his, you know, of his community. But he had this secret and the secret was, is that he was drinking half to a bottle of wine most nights, which is again, isn't enough to get drunk really for many people, might be for a woman who's carrying a bit less body weight, less so for a man. But he was drinking that and he wasn't sleeping great and he was irritable and frustrated and on a couple of occasions he'd had work functions where he had staff over to his home or he had gone to a work function and he drank excessively and made an ass of himself and would wake up in the morning going, oh no, what have I done? And he'd have to go and make apologies. Now this wasn't a consistent thing like happening every week that we might associate with an alcoholic or someone who's got a problem, but it was happening enough that this was a real big problem.

He came to us, we walked him through our process, we rewired his mindset, and on about day 60, 65, he said the penny dropped for him and he just, he just knew he was never going to drink again. He all of a sudden realized what alcohol was, which was a massive fraud, which is complete nonsense that we've been lied to about for our entire life, that cultural conditioning has supported, has absolutely no benefit whatsoever. And he has been alcohol free since he's coming up, I think two years now. And in that time his relation, he says, I don't want to speak for him, but he says, and he said all this publicly on the podcast. His relationship with his wife has improved, his relationship with his kids has improved. He's now a leader, a bigger leader in his company. And this is a company that's got like 20,000 staff across the U.S. right? This is not a small little mom and dad little dinky operation. This is like a big US Corporation. And you know, he just woke up one day after, you know, going 60, 65 days in this process and just gone. You know what, I realize it now, it's just a scam. And now he's just feeling great and he's firing cylinders and he, and he feels amazing. And I. He was invited to speak on stage at this company's annual event. There weren't 20,000 people at this event. I think there were 2,000. So he was there at this 2,000 strong event because the company held him up as a leader. And on stage in front of 2,000 people, he revealed that a lot of his success had been because he'd chosen to be alcohol free.

That's courage, that's incredible. That to me, that's leadership. And I guess the thing I want to highlight here is that if you choose to be alcohol free, it doesn't mean that you choose to say no to all your friends and all your clients who enjoy alcohol. I still spend a lot of time around people who drink alcohol. I just tend to cut it off in terms of I'm probably going to be making sure I'm leaving around 8:30, 9:00 clock before it gets messy. I don't want to be there for that. So it's not you shutting everything down. You might have to spend a little less time with some people and create a new tribe. But is that your experience as well?

Again, people mistakenly believe that they're going to be boring or dull or that they have to end all of their relationships if they stop drinking. Now, what is true? Anecdotally, because I've coached thousands of people over the years and certainly from my own experience as well, what is true is that you can tend to start to gravitate towards a different group of friends, friends or acquaintances. And that different group may be more health conscious, conversations may have more depth. To them, it might be like a tennis club or a golf club, where alcohol is now no longer a necessity to create camaraderie. Where it's, you know, maybe a handful of the people are drinking, but most of them are not. So that's true. I know for me, I used to hang out with my friend Zach and my friend Tom and we used to go to this bar on Santa Monica Booth Boulevard in California where I used to live. We used to. The bar was called the Jones Bar, very famous bar, the Rat Pack. Used to hang out there, you know, decades earlier. And we'd go there on a Tuesday night or a Thursday night, have a few drinks. I'd have a One or two glasses of red wine, a gin and tonic did that for a couple of years. When I stopped drinking alcohol, I went back, but infrequently and I drank soda water, ice and a piece of lime. I just didn't enjoy the conversation as much as I did when I was drinking. But I was enjoying this new feeling of clarity and focus. And what corresponded with that time was me going up to the LA Fitness on Hollywood Boulevard and joining the gym and just lifting a few weights for the first time in years. I started training for a half marathon. Someone then invited me to a party. I was shocked. I went to this party and no one was drinking alcohol. They were talking about what I thought was weird things at the time like cacao ceremonies and, and you know, like gluten free foods and stuff. I'm like, what? And it seemed a bit weird at the time. But then with time, as I've increasingly become more comfortable with that, I would say 80% of my existing friendship circle.

Either don't drink or don't need alcohol.

To have a conversation. And we have a wonderful time. I go out to dinner, hardly anyone if anyone's drinking. We go on morning hikes, we go wakeboarding together.

We go to football games, we don't drink any alcohol at the football games. And life is just, it's just amazing. So it's, look, I can still hang out with my friends who drink. I just tend to naturally gravitate towards people who don't or it's not a, not a necessity. And those people tend to gravitate towards me.

Amazing. And for someone who's listening right now going, you know what, okay, I'm going to give it a crack. 90 days or 30 days. What are three tips or tactics you could share with them that could help them actually get started?

Well, look, just first of all, I just say a warning over these 30 day challenges. Okay? So look, if you decide to do 30 days, I think that's great that you are dipping your toe in the water. However, what you could be doing is starting these 30 days like you're about to set forth into a prison. And what do all prisoners want to do? They want to break free of prison. Which is why all these people who do dry January and sober October and dry January, they complete it. But what do they do on day 30 and day 31? They go and drink, of course. And they're like, ah, yeah, can celebrate. I did 30 days without alcohol. As if the 30 days without alcohol was the pain and the suffering and now the drinking of the alcohol is the relief. Ah, good, back to normal. It's the other way around. It's the other way around. Not drinking is the gift. Not drinking is the reward. Drinking is the prison.

So again, if someone's like, I get this is a big step for many people, I get it feels like a big step. Oh, 30 days. I don't know if we're 30 days. What I would say is I absolutely applaud you and acknowledge you for taking that first step. And just give yourself a little bit of room that when you get to day 30, see if you're willing to go to day 40, see if you're willing to Go to day 60, see if you're willing to GO to 90 days. Just be open to that and be open to the idea that the reward and the celebration is the clarity and the focus and the great sleep that you get from being alcoh. So that would be my advice. The second thing I would say is that there's a lot of science, neuroscience that shows that it takes at least a couple months. What we've found anecdotally is it takes three months, 90 days. You seem to say that it took about three or four months before the penny dropped. And then you go, wow, this is something I really want to embrace now. That's why our signature process is called Project 90. It's 90 days because what we found is that a lot of people got to day 40, 50 or day 60 and they've got this pink cloud and the pink cloud is like, everything's great, I'm feeling great, I'm never drinking again. And then all of a sudden they get to day 60, oh, I need to drink, I've got a craving. It takes about 90 days to rewire the mindset and to give your body a break from the toxins that you've been feeding it for, in many cases, decades. Right? So yeah, go for a 30 day challenge if that's what is palatable for you. But really the gold standard in my view, would be at least 90 days. At least 90 days. And then on day 90, then you can choose. And I think that if we can get you to at least 90 days, most of the time, most people will choose to remain alcohol free because the benefits are just so noticeable and profound. That would be my best, my best advice. The other piece of advice I would suggest to people, and this has been scientifically proven as well, is that when you have a common goal with like minded people.

That'S when accountability and community camaraderie and Results are achieved. I would just invite people to limit the idea that lone wolfing it, trying to do it on your own is going to be a superior strategy than doing it in a group of like minded people. Our Project 90 process is all CEOs, entrepreneurs, physicians, investors, pro athletes, well educated, articulate, mostly in their 40s and 50s, some in their late 30s, some in their 60s. And because the clients all kind of engage with each other and they're on group kind of like coaching calls, because people can relate to one another, that keeps the accountability going. The problem I submit with things like AA is that you might be a 45 year old CEO going into an AA meeting sitting next to a 19 year old meth addict who's holding up petrol stations. How can you relate to that person? You know, like they're telling, oh my life's terrible, everything's awful. You've got no relatability. You're a well educated, articulate person, peak performer, who's just got a problem with alcohol. Right now. You don't want to be listening to a 22 year old person who's doing crystal meth and getting DUIs and ending up in prison. There's no relatability. So it's a long winded answer, long winded way of saying if you can, whatever it is, try to get into a like minded community with the same goal of not drinking for at least 90 days because that will create this beautiful built in camaraderie and accountability which increases the likelihood of success.

And that's what we want. We want success on our terms. And what I'm going to do, and I'll let the listener reviewer know, I get no royalties, kickbacks or anything like commissions. I'm going to put a link to Project 90. I'm going to put a link to your website, James. I'm also going to put a link to your social media. Look for the person that's watching or listening right now. If you think I'd like to just try 90 days, then do I encourage you? I can say as a person who loved alcohol and danced with it and partied with it, my life is so much greater now and I can put hand on heart and say it's amazing, so give it a crack. I know that James is amazing at what he does. Why? Because I've had people I know go through Project 90 and they've continued on. So James, keep up the incredible work. But I've got one last question for you if you don't mind.

Yes sir.

We fast forward many, many Years into the future, you know that it's your last day here on Earth, and a very young person, maybe it's a grandchild, comes into the room and they say, james, how can I lead my life on purpose? What would you say to them?

I would say.

Focus on doing what you want with who you want, how you want.

Do not allow other people to tell you what you want and how to do that and when to do that. In other words, be 100% responsible for your purpose, for your life, for your choices, and along the way, ensure that you make your friends and family and acquaintances and lives as enjoyable as you can.

That's beautiful, James. You know what I really love about that? There's an amazing Australian called Bronnie Ware, and she was a palliative care nurse. She wrote a book called the Top Regrets of the Dying. And she spent many, many years with people who were on their deathbeds, and she asked them, what were your regrets? The number one regret was, I regret living my life based upon doing things whilst thinking what other people thought I should be doing. Should I go to university? Oh, yeah. Mom and dad thinks I should do that. Should I buy the Range Rover because I live in the place where everyone has Range Rovers? Yeah, I should do that. Should I go down the law angle because everyone else is doing that? Yeah. Should I drink because it seems like everyone else is doing that. What you just said literally marries up with the top number one regret of the dying, according to Bronnie Ware. It's really powerful. James. Thanks for sharing it.

You're welcome. Thank you for giving me an opportunity to share it.

So great to connect. And I don't think this will be the last time. If I'm over in Colombia anytime soon, I'll be coming to say hello. And the same if you come this direction.

Oh, that'd be amazing. Thank you so much for all the good that you're putting out in the world. And thanks for having me back a second time. I feel very, very honored.

Absolute pleasure.