How To Leverage Publicity To Build Your Brand Without Hiring A PR Agency

How do you make business problems disappear? Wrap em in bacon for business owners, marketing execs and anyone trying to grow your business. Pump your profits and make more while doing less. Welcome to Bacon Wrapped Business with Brad Costanzo. Sizzling hot business advice guaranteed to make you fat profits. Every week our chefs will serve you proven recipes for ramping up your revenue. Now here's your host, Brad Costanzo.

All right, we are back and today you get to meet one of my favorite people in the world, Geeta Nedkarni. And I want to explain a little bit about who Gita is before I bring her on. But first of all, I met Gita when myself and my client Jesse Itzler, we did a small private event at Jesse's house up in Connecticut. And we were booking some speakers and we reached out to Gita to have her come speak at the event. And she was just such a hit and such an amazing fireball personality that I stayed in contact with her and I really wanted to get her on the show because she is a wealth of information, just an amazing woman, hysterical, makes me laugh every single time I talk to her. Think she could be a comedian in another life. But Geeta is super impressive because of what she's been able to do. She's originally from India and she inherited this, this zeal for storytelling and became a paid international writer journalist at the age of 12. And since then she's worked for CBC, which is Canadian CNN, Global TV, Reader's Digest, Montreal Gazette, Asia Pacific Broadcasting and more, producing print, tv, radio and media. She was also voted the best TV personality by the readers of the Montreal Mirror. And she has been in so many big and small media things, it's just craz. And it makes a lot of sense that now she is helping other people do this exact same thing. One of her primary businesses is called Baby Got Booked. And it's really about how to.

Get your message in front of millions of people with no press experience or contacts. And I can't think of anybody better to teach you this. So it is my great pleasure to welcome Geeta to the show.

Hi, Brad. You had me at Bacon. You said the magic word.

The magic word. That was my, that was my secret behind the naming of the show, actually. True story. Not all of my listeners know this, but the way that I came up with a concept for a show called Bacon Wrapped Business that has nothing to do with bacon is I was sharing somebody else's podcast years ago on Facebook like three and a half years ago and I was just like, that's Some bacon wrapped business advice. I've ever heard it. And I was like that stuck in my head. I was like, I'm going to use that someday.

It's so good.

I love alliteration. Almost like baby got booked. What?

Speaking my language.

Baby got booked. Bacon wrapped business. I mean, we were meant for each other here on today's show. So anyway, as I said, I've introduced you, we know each other personally. I been dying to dive into just more of the professional side of you and what you've been able to do. I mean you've got such a, a cool career where I mean, you started at 12 and you know, you really kind of mastered this whole area of media and getting exposure. And I really want to dive into some of the myths and misconceptions that people have when it comes to PR and some of the big takeaways about how people can leverage what they're doing in order to, to get more exposure. And sometimes, you know, I think one of the biggest, one of the biggest things I want to know from this conversation is that people who don't feel as though their story, their business, that thing that is, that is really media worthy, like, ah, why would the media care about this? How could I, how can I leverage this? A lot of people don't. They have a very limited view of pr, myself included. So I'd love to dive kind of.

Into that, but that's, that would, that's a great place to start. That would be where I would want to start anyway. So that's.

Well, let's jump.

Beautifully aligned.

Well, let's jump into that. So tell us.

Yeah, so possibly the number one, you'd asked me about myths and possibly the number one myth that I hear from people is they business gets really sort of personal. Right? Business is very emotional for us entrepreneurs and I get it. I mean, I'm a business owner just like you. There's so much ego in the nicest way, wrapped in, into. There's so much caring, there's so much blood, sweat and tears. We've had to go through so much to get this beast off the ground. So I can understand why there's a lot of self consciousness or doubt in there, especially at the prospect of getting your story, your brand, your fill in the blank in front of hundreds of thousands, if not millions of people overnight. It's pretty nerve wracking. And so the biggest myth that I find people have in their heads is, well, you know, when, when we see someone featured in Ink, when we see somebody with their own column in Forbes or featured on television, we immediately think, well, they have it all together. They know what they're doing. They've been doing this a bajillion years. That's why they got picked. We automatically assign them a huge amount of credibility. It's one of the biggest benefits. One off, not the only one, but one of the biggest benefits of getting that media exposure. It's that tacit endorsement that we, we sort of understand because we're like, all right, well, if the producers at Good Morning America picked this person, they're seriously legit. They know exactly what they're doing. But from growing up in morning news meetings and being the person who often made those booking decisions, I can tell you that pretty much everybody that I ever booked on any show with somebody just like you and me, we're all just people. With some of us with good stories, some of us with particularly timely angles, there were a lot of people. And I'll tell you this, and every into every journalist and producer that I interviewed when I was putting together the Baby Got Booked program, because I didn't want it to be just my opinion. I really wanted it to be what's working right now when I got on Skype and on the phone with them. We all have stories where we, you know, book an expert who looked beautiful on paper. So somebody who's been to school for the thing a bajillion years as a Ph.D. or has a doctorate and, you know, has written three books on the subject. And then you get them in front of a microphone, Brad, and you just want to rip your eyelashes out because they talk three hours and there's not one 30 second clip that you can pull in editing from it. And so the real. Here's how I would like you to reframe that, that angst that a lot of us face around. Am I ready? Is my story ready or is it media worthy? You get media when you decide that you're ready. And what that means is that you are going to make that decision that you're going to be featured on wherever it is. Once you make the decision and once you can see your name in that column, you can sort of visualize it. Brad, you know how I feel about visualizing, right? Once you can visualize it, then you're like, all right, now you just have to backwards engineer it. And a lot of us think, oh, well, my business has to have been around for 20 years and it has to be making seven and eight figures. That's not true. What the journalist cares most about is does this story in some way bring value to my audience? And what a producer or a journalist or a podcaster is looking for is something. Something that educates, entertains, or uplifts, inspires an audience.

Educate, uplifts or inspires.

Yeah, or entertains, like if something is funny or something is timely. At the time of this recording, our Facebook feeds are flooded with hashtag MeToo. Right. A lot of this is a bit of a heavier topic, but this is something that's happening. This is a trending story. Lots and lots of people of every gender have stories about how they were sexually assaulted, assaulted or molested or in some way degraded because of their gender and. Or by somebody in power. And this is an excellent way. So if this was happening, for example, this would be a way for you to step up and become a part of that conversation. Something is already going on in the public's consciousness. Can you add something valuable to what's breaking down? So somebody in our program. So one of our members, Dana Farrant, is a. She's a former dominatrix, as a matter of fact, but she's a business. So she uses some of the techniques that she learned in the kink world to help people step into their power. And she was brought up in this very abusive sort of cult situation, like way beyond what most of us have dealt with in our lives. And she. So she's joined this conversation and said, you know, everybody's talking about being a victim. Here's how women or men or, you know, people of every gender can empower themselves to a step beyond the shame and the guilt and the ooginess of having had your boundaries crossed in that way. And also, how do you prevent that? How do you stay powerful? How do you empower the next generation? How do you empower your daughters and your sons to make sure that this doesn't happen in the future? And she's getting picked up all over the place.

That's amazing. So a couple of the things that come to my mind.

There'S. So there's two types of exposure that. Well, I mean, there's more than this, but I know these are probably on the minds of some of my listeners as well. But so there's. There's getting written about, which you've probably been written about, and there's also becoming a writer, like getting access to your own columns so that now you can write about. You can build the authority based on the things that you have to say as well as. I mean, you know, not all self. You don't want to Be self promotional when you're doing that, but it obviously helps and it grows your brand. Have you. Have you got any insights for people who are trying to. And I guess I know it all depends. Get exposure. Should they go after getting their own column somewhere first, like on an Inca entrepreneur, et cetera, or should they try to get written about first?

I would say both. And now here's the deal. Inc And Entrepreneur, they have. They're flooded with. They're getting 600 to, you know, each journalist is getting 600 to 1200 pitches a day.

Oh, man.

So, yeah, standing out in that inbox is not the easiest thing. We have templates that we've designed based on what's working, based on interviews with them. So what I bring to the table is access to these people. I write for Inc. And Entrepreneur and Huffington Post, and I can interview my colleagues and my sort of editors about what's working and what's. How to stand out in their inbox. So that's the insight that I can bring back to. To you. So what I would tell you is the best place for you to start because you want both. And. And I'll tell you why. So let. Let me back up for a second and tell you why you want both. And so everybody fixates it. You know, when I step up on stage and speak and ask people in the audience be like, well, why do you want media exposure? What do you want out of it? Everybody's hand goes up and they're like, yeah, we want exposure. We want to get in front of our ideal prospects and we want to build credibility. And then. And I'm like, yes. And. And they're like, well, sales. But they don't really know how to connect those two things. I'm like. And I'm like, s. And crowd go silent. And, you know, maybe you'll hear brand awareness beep up from the back and that's about it. And I'm like, well, let me tell you how I've used media to grow my brand, because that's just a small piece of what you get out of media. What I like to teach people is. So, for example, Jesse is an excellent example. So Jesse is a super duper, uber successful guy who's way out of my league, frankly. Right. He's never heard of me. I've heard of him. So I have a column in Inc. I have a column in Entrepreneur. So my ask. And I have a podcast. How do I get really hot guests on my podcast, people who would never know me from Adam, and why the hell Would they be on my teeny tiny podcast? Well, here's how it works. I reach out and I say, hey, I read your book. I freaking loved your book. I did this, that, and this is what your book led me to do. So something very personal that says, I genuinely care, I've genuinely consumed your material, and I'm touched by your work. Super successful people really love to hear that. Nobody ever gets tired of that, right? Especially people crave significance. So write that down somewhere. People crave significance. If you can find a way to be thankful and sort of mirror back, you know, wow, your work really touched my life. That is. That is a huge front foot in the door. So that's. That's a really good, powerful tip that I will give you to help you with anything, whether it's getting pressed, talking to a prospect, whatever. So you reach out, I reach out to Jesse and I say, man, your book almost got me killed. And that's the truth because I was listening to it on audiobook in the back of an Uber and I was laughing so hard that the guy nearly pulled us, like, nearly drove us into a tree.

Yeah.

So it was a great.

You said I almost crashed an Uber.

Yeah, I almost crashed an Uber. And I was like, that's how you.

Got his attention, Right?

Exactly. And then what I said in that was, I was like, I'd love to have you on my podcast. I talk about this sort of mental toughness all the time, and I recycle a lot of my content for my columns and ink and entrepreneurs. So now my ask is not here. Hey, you super successful guy, let me just take you out to coffee and pick your brain. And by the way, since I'm in a different city, you bring your own coffee and let's do this on Skype. That's a super lame ask. But now, not only am I able to bring him onto my podcast, or I've done these mentorship calls too, where there's no podcast interview necessarily involved, but we'll talk for 30 minutes. And the insight that I gain from that, I create a three way win. I gain insight for my company, and I get this amazing connection and relationship that I'm building with this person, whoever they may be. They get free press out of it because I take that insight, I package it into a story, and then I give it to a wider audience so that the audience benefits as well. So inc's team benefits because I'm creating content for them. The audience benefits because I've distilled that insight and brought it to them. In a useful way. And then the person gets free pr and I win. So everybody wins. I love creating wins for everybody because that's what helps grow businesses, right?

Yeah.

So that's a completely different way of thinking about, well, what am I going to get out of a column? The column is not necessarily for you. A column is an amazing way. And by the way, you can't sell. You can't use your column in this predatory way, which I've. I have seen some people do, where it's like, oh, yeah, well, you know, pay me, buy my program or buy my thing or hire me, and I'll put you in my column. That's actually against ethical guidelines. You have to sign a release at the very beginning when you get your column to say that. You'd never do that. That is not what I'm talking about.

So where people would pay you, like a. Do a puff piece. Like, I pay you to write. To write a really nice piece about me. Yeah.

I get bitched that all week, every week, and I just delete those. Or I write back and I'd be like, I would never do that. No. Thank you.

So what are the things that really get your attention? Okay, let's just say it's not. Obviously, a great story is gonna get your attention, and a little flattery gets the door open. What are some of the more interesting pitches you've had where you're like, okay, that was pretty brilliant. Like, that was really, really good.

So great question, Brad. I want what all journalists want.

I want traffic and exposure and eyeballs. Right, right.

And bacon, of course.

But. Well, yes, traffic and exposure. But how am I going to get that? What I really want is something that's going to make my audience light up. I want to make. I want to give them something they can actually use. So if you pitch me something that's counterintuitive for a good example, a recent pitch that I received was a guy who is like, you know, everything generalist is the general is the new niche.

Dude, are you serious? Somebody pitched that? I was. I literally. It wasn't me, was it? No, I swear to God. That's crazy that you just said that, because I've been planning a podcast episode about that, but keep going. I'm so interested.

There you go. See? See? And this is obviously speaking to something that has now gonna bubble. That is going to bubble up into the entrepreneur community's consciousness, because.

Have you written that one yet?

I haven't. Which means I. You. I clearly need to quote you, and you're Gonna get into this piece. Awesome. See, there you go.

This is how it works. And part of this is also, you know, Brad and I have a relationship. So now when Brad and I have an interesting conversation, you have to remember my journalist brain is always on. My columnist brain is always on. And so I'm like, huh, I need to write two or three pieces a week these days. So. And that's my minimum. That's not counting any extra stuff that I do. So I'm like, I'm always looking for interesting stories. So that would be, you know, that would be something that I would. So now that, now that I know that I've mentioned to you, Brad, that I'm writing this piece. You mentioned, oh, my God, I could totally talk about that.

Yeah.

We'Re going to have this conversation later. But all this to say that, you know, one of the beautiful things about going to conferences when you have this kind of platform is there are a couple of different ways that I've used it. So because I write for these very high profile magazines and I have access to their editorial stuff, gives me a kind of standing, if you will. Right. So I'll have, when I get up on stage and speak, I'll have the person who's introducing me mention that I contribute to these magazines and these outlets. And I'm always looking for success stories to feature in my columns. You can, you better believe that all of those, like, the right fit people make a beeline to the back of the room at the end of that talk. So I automatically have this steady stream of leads chasing me, wanting my attention, wanting to please me. Do you see? So without me having to do anything, I'm not doing anything scuzzy. I'm not doing like, it's. They just, they want to show up on my radar. So that gives you a lot of power and it gives you a lot of leverage in any sales conversation, in any kind of relationship building. It shows you up as a serious powerful player, which I quite enjoy. So. So that's one way to do it. You can reach out, like I said, for mentorship. You can reach out. You know, every time I read a business book that blows my mind, the first thing I do is I get my assistant to you. We actually created templates now where I'll get my assistant to reach out to this owner, to this writer, sorry. And be like, you know, I used your book. I this is what happened. I employed this piece of advice, and this is what happened next. I freaking love your book. I would love to share you with My audience, can we schedule a 30 minute call?

That part is so powerful, showing the specifics, not just like, hey, I liked your book and stuff.

Yeah, exactly.

No, I love that. The, one of the strategies that I've, I've not used this, but I've heard it used and I actually like it. It would probably work on some people, but you don't have to admit if it would work on you or not. Whereas it's not necessarily giving you, it's not giving you money.

Right.

To say, hey, will you write this piece about me? But let's say I was pitching you and like, hey, you know how. What is it? General is a new niche. And then I mentioned that I've also like, if I do have a large social media following, mentioning a, that I plan on sharing it profusely with my audience as well as this is the other kind of key thing is I plan on buying, let's say I've got a $2,000 budget that I'm gonna buy paid media. Like I'm gonna buy Facebook ads and other media to this article. Right, Right. So that's one of the, as I said, like, I know that one of the big things journalists love.

That would totally work.

Right?

Let's just, let's just say it. That would totally work because, yes, the more traffic you can drive and the more traffic you can drive, that's again, a big win. If think about this, right? You're. When you approach a journalist, one of the reasons you feel kind of skeevy about it is because you're like, well, I'm asking and I'm not giving. Now when you come to the table with a proposition like that, you're giving, you're saying, hey, I bring this like, I want to play in a way that brings you value and helps you reach your goals. So let me, yeah, let me prove that I've done the research and done the thinking required to understand what your goals truly are. So first, first of all, the top goal, even before traffic is really, do I bring value to your audience? Is your audience going to love you for sharing me with them? Yes. Okay, awesome. Good. That's a given. Now we talk about traffic strategies and hell yes, I would love that big time.

Yeah. And it's like, well, you're going to, you're actually, if it's a good article and you're going to, you're actually going to budget to promote it, that's, that's doubly huge. And you're probably going to get some, you know, some priority on that and on the flip side, for my listeners who want to try this, if you've, like, if, let's say Gita was doing a profile, let's say you're doing a profile on me, for instance, and I say I'm going to run traffic to it. Well, obviously the benefit of that is it's a, it's an article on, let's just say it's ink and it's about all this stuff. So it's going to, it's gonna help me out by. Right. By giving more exposure and people are gonna see that. So it's branding, it's brand recognition. Now, one of the more ninja strategies that actually a former, a former guest on the show, Andrew o' Brien shared with me is he says what he'll do, what he advises his clients to do is like, let's say you've got about five different articles out there on big media pieces is buy ads to one, but use, you know, you can use sniply S, N, I, P, L, Y. And you can drop a retargeting, a Facebook retargeting cookie on there. So let's just say I send everybody to the profile that you did on me, and then everybody who clicked on that ad, I've retargeted and it's gonna be a lot less. But. Right. But then I'm going to send another piece that was written on me about an entrepreneur to another article, but I'm only going to set, I'm only going to show it to those people who clicked on the first one. And pretty soon, these people are going to see 2, 3, 4, 5 articles in their newsfeed written about Brad Costanzo. And it's like, wow, this guy's like all over the, he's all over the interwebs.

That's, that's what we hear all the time, is like, my God, you're everywhere. I went on maternity leave and I basically disappeared for ten and a half months, and all I heard was, oh, my God, how do you do it? You're superwoman. You're everywhere. And I'm like, I'm just lying in bed cuddling the baby. Like, I'm not anywhere. But all this stuff was constantly being re. It was also being pushed out by inc's team and entrepreneurs team. They recycle the content. They push it out on their social. They're constantly sharing it. Podcasts are being released that we had recorded months ago, et cetera, et cetera. I'll tell you just a case study that we had the Guy got some Scott Oldford who does a lot of. Yeah, there you go. So Legion. He does a lot of lead gen and he's one of our members. And he did exactly what you're talking about, which is he was featured in Entrepreneur and he ran ads to it and he closed in the first hour after he shared it with his email list. He closed $100,000 client. You gotta be kidding. Just like, just like that. I'm not joking. And the guy said to him, he was like, look, the reason I felt confident was because I can see that you're legit.

Mm.

And it all came from that. So we've had people really, really up level the perception of their brand. Think about how you feel when you, you know, think about this. You're checking somebody out that you want to buy from. You're like, is this person everything that they claim they are? Because anybody can write anything on their own website. So you Google them, right? You Google them and what do you find? If you were to find articles by Forbes and Inc. And Entrepreneur and Huffington Post and all these, you know, Good Morning America and all these places, talking about them in a positive way, that's going to make you feel really comfortable to hand over your credit card.

You're absolutely right. Now on this one, and I'm familiar with, I think this is probably the one because I remember seeing this of Scott's, because the title most likely of this one was this 25 year old found success when he started helping others succeed.

That's the one. Right.

So the interesting thing about this, now, granted, it does dive into his piece, but it's a profile piece, right?

So it's not about a concept.

Profile pieces, I would think are either the hardest or the easiest to get, depending on who you are in your profile. And they're some of the most useful to get as well. So if I wanted, for instance, somebody to write about how cool Brad Costanzo is and do a profile on there, what are some of the pieces of advice for getting attention there? Like, well, why would you want to write about me?

Well, so the very first piece of advice I'd give you is make sure that where you're pitching does profiles.

Sure.

Right. And make sure that the person that you're pitching does profiles. Yes, exactly. Because there are people who may just not do that sort of thing. And I know that the new guidelines with Entrepreneur, hilariously enough, they're really shying away from doing single person profiles unless that person is like a Sarah Blakely or a Richard Branson or somebody like that. So they're wanting to do sort of multi person profiles where really the focus is on some kind of how to.

Some kind of topic, not the person. Well, I know that and that's why I ask, you know, are there, are.

There, because are there specific ways? I'll tell you, I'll tell you how you could get that done. So first of all, don't be worried about sharing the profile with somebody. So for example, if I was writing this piece about general is the new niche, for example, you'd be, you'd be sharing the profile, if you will, with Jeff Shaw, which is the person that pitched me. And there's nothing wrong with that. You can both leverage the heck out of that. There's plenty of room at the top. Your, you know, your energies will be different, your offerings will be different, different pieces will resonate for different people. There's nothing wrong with that. If you wanted a straight up profile, the best advice that I can give you is you have to have, you have to have advice or sort of takeaway that is very, very clickable. And I say clickable and not clickbaity. This is actually something I heard from my editor at Inc. Who hates the word clickbait because.

It insinuates bait and switch. Exactly right.

Clickbait is not necessarily a bad thing. It's just clickbait and switches.

Exactly. So what we want is something super clickable, something that's a little bit counterintuitive, something that says, okay, well you know what? You've been following all this business advice that everybody's been giving you and it's not working for you. Well, here's why. That is the kind of thing that gets a lot of clicks. So then if you can back that up with information that is genuinely useful, that is genuinely valuable, then hell yes, you can get feature. And it won't be a hard sell because when the editor looks at it, they'll be like, yeah, okay, I can see why you're bending the rules on this one. I'm down with this because it really is genuinely different. If you can back that up with science based research, if you can back that up with a study or something that's objective, that isn't just your opinion, that is extremely useful also. So one of the things that I teach my students to do is to set up Google alerts for studies, statistics, things like that that come out related to that topic. Because that's a great way to pitch a story, that, and create a timely, newsworthy hook. Because what you do, everything that you do is 365 days a year. 366. And a leap year. Right, we get that. But. But why? You have to always answer. Whenever you pitch and send a pitch to a journalist, you have to answer the number one question on their mind, which is, why are we talking about this right now?

Yeah, timeliness.

Timeliness is so, so crucial. So if you can tie it in with something that's already going down. So I have a bunch of different ways that. That, you know, you answer this question.

But the question really is, why now? And most people, the mistake that they make is they say, oh, but I have a book coming out now. I have.

That's all about them.

Yes. I have a new product that I'm launching. We opened a second location, and that's not a story. Not for a journalist. It's the center of your universe, I grant you. Absolutely. But that's not sexy to an audience. What's sexy to an audience is, well, if everybody's going back to work right now, if everybody's coming off of summer vacation, if everybody's making New Year's resolutions, all of these seasonal pieces, those are what's on a public screen. What. What's on the public's consciousness right now. If you can hook your message and make it useful to them immediately, then you can actually capitalize. It actually makes for a really good sales technique as well, because you can capitalize on an urgency that already exists.

Yes, yes. Tying into new events, tying into trends and things that are going on in the culture. And, you know, there's a whole. There's a whole art. There's a whole art to that of tying in something totally unrelated. Like, potentially, I am. I don't have an example for this, but, like, one of the hottest things in pop culture right now is all the Harvey Weinstein sex assault allegations.

Yeah, absolutely.

But there's so many different directions you can go with that, because you can go with.

You know, not just the obvious. It's like, I'm a big believer in lateral thinking. So what's the bigger story there? What is. You know, it's. It's like a lot right now. One of the big trends is people are standing up and finally coming out of the woodwork to. To say, me too. Hey, this happened to me. This happened to me.

And it's not just women.

It's not just women. It's men. And there's people supporting each other. And it also goes to show about.

You know, keeping quiet when you, you know, keeping quiet about stuff when you think that your career's at risk. And there's all these little things. You can look at the subtext of things that are happening in the news.

Absolutely. I mean, this is a conversation. So here's how I would teach my students. So we do group coaching calls once a month. And this is what we would do, is we would take something big that's going down, and we'd be like, all right, everybody on the call. And I make it a point to get to know my students. Everybody on the call. I'd be like, all right, you. This is. This is the angle you're going to pitch. Here's. You know, everybody brings their own angle, and then I can help them rejig it. So, for example, if there was somebody who's a parenting expert, we talk about, all right, how do you capitalize on me, too? That's going on right now, this Harvey Weinstein thing. Well, you're going to teach your kids what consent really means. Right. So you're teaching your kids not just not to be a victim, but also not to be a perpetrator. So which means that you don't force your kid to get on Santa's lap for a photograph. You don't force your kid to hug the aunt with the mustache. You don't force your kid to do anything that doesn't feel right to their personal integrity.

Yes.

You can't just turn it on and off. Like, so that's a really interesting conversation to have. If you're a leadership speaker, then you talk about how women being sexually assaulted at work is a men's leadership issue. This is a really important. Like, this is just based on the number of women who have come. Like, it's freaking every woman I know, including me. Like, every woman has a story. I don't know one single person who doesn't have a story. When you think about that, it's obvious that it's not just some small, random group of dudes doing this. It's like, a lot of men. Like, maybe all men or something. I don't know. So that makes it a very, very interesting conversation to say, well, what's the men's side of the. Me, too. What if we talk about men coming out to say I'm sorry? Like, I. Me too. I did something bad and I'm sorry. And I'm taking full responsibility for my part in this, whether it was actually doing something actively or standing by while something was being done.

Absolutely.

Or enabling it. So there's a lot of different ways to do that. You can talk about it from an empowerment point of view, like Dana does, where she talks about, you know, how can women gain back their power. We have another woman in our group who deals with jade eggs and women's sexuality. And she was a rape victim. Like she was actually raped. And she talks about how she gained back her sexual sovereignty after doing that and all of her process for that. So there's just a whole bunch of different ways that this can go that don't have to do with sex specifically, that don't have to do with assault. This is a power issue.

Yeah, well, one that came to mind as well is that it the concept that it takes a lifetime to create a reputation and it takes a moment to destroy it. So Harvey Weinstein, his entire career since he started, like, I don't know, in the 60s or 70s or whenever he started, you know, he's been building up. He's got all these great movies and he was a mogul in Hollywood and nobody except the insiders knew that he was a dirtbag. And then within just one moment, one person, because of multiple moments that he did this, he ruined his entire reputation. And it kind of, you can, you can go to show that this happens everywhere in business as a brand, as anything else, depending on what direction you want to take. So big believer in that lateral thinking and then how you can tie that in. So if I was going to do a pitch like that's not something that, you know, I'm just using this as an example. If I wanted to pitch that to somebody like yourself to another writer.

Well, you do brand management, right, Brad? So since you do brand management, this would be an excellent. A couple of ways that you could spin this particular topic would be you talk about what do you do, what do you do as a brand when you realize that somebody key on your team has been a Harvey Weinstein.

Yeah, yeah. Because you know, all the other people that it's not even just Harvey's reputation. You ruined the entire. Everybody who worked for them.

That's right. And you know, we've had things like that happen here in Canada as well. So. So that would be one way to go. And this could be. And this, you know, you could monetize that off the back end. So for me, one of the things that I'm that makes me different from a lot of other people who teach PR is I'm a business owner. And also I'm not a PR professional. I never have been. I don't have a done for you program. I don't do that because I don't believe in it. What I want to help people do is tell their stories in powerful ways, understand the mechanism of storytelling for business building. And I always ask the question is, what's the business on the back end of this media that you want to create? Because otherwise it's just woke. Right, exactly. So. So, you know, Brad, in your situation, you could easily create, potentially if you wanted to, a program, you know, a talk, a training, whatever that is on around brand management.

With within boundaries. So brands within boundaries or boundaries around brands. We love the alliteration, but you know what I mean? Like, so something like that talking about, or how do you recover from something like this?

How do you set protocols in place to avoid something like this? What processes could you have in place where a whistleblower would feel safe stepping forward? What does a leader do in that situation? And how do you. Is there recovery from a mistake? Because if we don't have that. See, I think that's a very juicy conversation. Right. Nobody is going to come forward if we. The more muck and tar and feathers we throw at Harvey Weinstein, and I'm not saying he doesn't deserve it, by the way, just so we're clear, I'm just saying the more we tar and feather him and burn him at the stake, the less likely we are to see people voluntarily step forward and take responsibility. Because everybody's in the streets with bitchforks now. So I think it's a really juicy and interesting conversation to say, well, how can we enable men to come clean and break the cycle that they themselves might feel trapped in their perpetrators because of what. What leads them to be perpetrators?

What's the bigger conversation?

Yes.

Yeah, I love that. And this is all, this is all great ways to really kind of.

You have a meaningful conversation. Right. And it's also about that. It's like we. This is not just some stupid PR technique that's like, oh, yay, let me get a logo for my website. This is like, how do we create genuine social change? How do we create genuine connections where you really do become a thought leader because you're actually leading thought.

Absolutely. Now.

Zooming in tactically, are there any. Are there any tools, any resources that you really like? And whether it's researching these people, reaching out to them? I know there's a lot of tools that I've either used or have access to, like just reach out IO and there's, you know, a handful of others. What do you do when you're kind of starting to research? Who do I go to? Because it can be really daunting to go, okay, there's a million writers out there. Where do I start?

Right? So one of the things that we do.

Let me start with the sort of shorter list perhaps of, of things that I don't necessarily recommend. So a lot of PR professionals out there I know will charge you whatever, 300, 1500 bucks to write you a press release. That's a one time thing. It's boring as crap. Do not send a press release. It's like, it's just how to bore journalists to tears, right? So they'll charge you that money and then what they'll do is they'll charge you an extra bump to put it on PR Newswire or PR Newsweb or one of these press release distribution, distribution channels. And what that does. And I really don't think that this is a good use of your money or time. And, and I know this because I actually did it just to see what would happen. I was curious to know. I used one of these services because I was like, I want to see. I'm really good at writing pitches. So I wrote a really good pitch. I put it out on PR Newswire. It cost me like 1500 bucks plus 300 bucks, so like almost two grand. And here's what happened. Here's how it works. It gets picked up. So PR Newswire and PR Web are hooked up to a bot on the back end of most news affiliate sites. So like your ABC affiliate in your local market will have this hidden page on the back end of it that is like an RSS feed. I know, I'm getting technical here. It's basically like, it's like you think of your Facebook feed where it's just press releases, right? There's no curation done. It's not like someone chose those press releases for a reason. No story was written about this. Nobody got interviewed. There's no pictures. It's none of those things. It's just a freaking feed of press releases. And what a lot of these PR agencies do is they say, well, now that your press release appeared on the back end of abc, where no one read it, not clients, not journalists, not anybody. Let me ask you this. How many of you read a press release on ABC today? No one. No one, Right? You making buying decisions by doing that? No. Hell no. So here's the deal. So, so then those PR agencies will say, well, dude, we got you featured. Now you can legitimately use that logo on all your your About Me page.

Yeah, can. But you know, if you get caught doing that you get caught doing that by somebody who's actually starting to research, search you, it automatically you just lose a lot of credentials. In fact, I'm gonna be talking to somebody today who has been faking his credentials. I'm not going to go into the details, but yeah, I started to reach out to him and looking at a bunch of stuff and I realized that there's a whole bunch of fake crap like that out there and it just lost all my, all my respect.

Exactly. And also, I mean, even if no one goes that deep into digging you up, which I mean, and if they do, then you're really in trouble because people talk and people are in every group that you're in, so good luck with that. But you can't monetize it because it's very different. When we talk about, we have a whole module on monetizing your media. So getting the media is only one piece of it. Right. It's like 80% of everybody you want to reach wasn't watching or listening or, or reading the day that you got featured. So how do you take that piece and turn it into cash flow over and over and over, over the course of many years? So we've made 34 plus thousand dollars from a piece that I wrote for Entrepreneur in 2015 because we have it as part of a follow up system to warm up leads and things like that. So the reason that, that a piece like that would work is because it's a genuine piece of press that actually gives value, that tells a story. Because what that does, the way we use it anyway, is we warm up our prospects. So when somebody out of the blue who's never heard of me or is researching me is in the research phase, but they're googling me and trying to see if I'm legit, then we have a whole process by which we're like, hey, you know, check me out, see if my style resonates for you. See if you like what I'm saying. And then by the time if and when we get on a phone call, they're 80% sold.

Yeah.

All I have to do is close the sale.

What is, is that a, is that a certain piece that's out there that you direct people to? I'm happy to put a link.

Sure. It's three reasons no small business should hire a PR agency.

See, that's great. Three reasons no small business should hire a PR agency. So I love the contrary.

None of those, and none of those have to do with the money. So even if you had the budget Yep. Here's why you shouldn't do it.

Love it. Love it. There's Magida right there.

There you go.

I love it. So this is a piece that has been served you very well then, huh?

It has. It has.

That's fantastic. The.

Is there. We're coming to the end of our episode. Our episizzle. Other other shows, they got episodes, we've got episodles because they so damn right.

If people want to learn more about this and they realize that, you know, especially, I mean this kind of stuff should be used by every business, but especially if you are a little cash strapped and you don't have a. The budget to go full blown paid media advertising, you want something that's arguably more effective because when people find you through news media outlets, it builds a lot more trust than just a simple ad and it can be done a lot more effectively. It just takes a little bit of time, hustle and thought into it. So where is. Do they go to babygotbooked.com to get more information on you and check out your course?

Well, we, so we have a course that's less than six hours long. So if you actually consumed all of the videos, it's less than six hours long. So the way that I liked it, yeah, because I'm just like, man, I've been in the media for 25 plus years and if I put everything that I knew into a course, it would be 40 hours long. You'd never finish it and you'd definitely never get any results because you'd never have time to implement. So. Right. So I'm like, so let's just make it really short. I tell you exactly what you I'm a less sport. I give you the least amount of.

Information you need that I feel the.

Exact same so that you can get. You have time to implement it. Call it a less pert, a less bird. That's a sound bite, baby.

So a soundbite.

That's right. And so what I like one of the biggest objections that we heard when we were designing the program is I'm not a writer like you. I don't like writing. So we did all the heavy lifting and we created templates that would take you literally. I'm not joking and not exaggerating. 15 minutes to fill. So you. I tell you exactly what to do. I give you an example of it filled out. And these are all tested. So we actually, every time one of our members gets press and it's something slightly different from what we're doing, reach out. I'll get a copy. I've done it with you, Brad. Actually, I'll reach out, I'll get a copy of something and then we'll templatize it, we'll analyze it and that's right. And then I will. So, you know, I talked to Brad and he told me about a pitch that broke all the rules for him and he still booked the guest. And I was like, I want that pitch right now.

What's funny is I just heard you. Like you said, I want that pitch right now. But I thought you said I want that bitch right now.

That was funny. My show, I can say it.

Anyone who is falling asleep is now fully awake.

No, but yeah, you're absolutely right that it was a, it was a fantastic pitch. I have to follow up with her.

And there you go. So what we do is we take what's working, we analyze it and then we turn it into a fill in the blank resource that you can use over and over and over and customize each time. And then, you know, we even have Facebook support where me, my team and several journalist buddies of mine who look in there will give you feedback in a safe space so that you can tweak everything until it's perfect and then send it out. Right. Like, it's just. That's why we have a 90 some percent success rate because everybody who actually does the work gets booked. Everyone. Because it, it's not rocket science now.

And I love the fact where you said, you know, you have one piece, like you've got a lot of pieces out there, but there's one piece that's kind of your go to piece. So even if, even if you just get on like do the work and get on one really good, get one good piece of exposure, but then don't just let that do all the work for you. You know, you've got to use that part of your, part of your media kit, part of your everything else. Let people see because it's a, it's a credibility builder. So Gita, this has been such a fun and sizzling hot episode. I really appreciate you taking the time to, to share this stuff with myself, with my audience and to my audience. I suggest that you go check out babygotbooked.com and follow Gita on social media. I'll put links to all of this stuff right there in the show. Notes and anything else you would like to like, direct these people too. Is there anything you'd like?

Well, yeah, because I reckon everyone who's listening to this show in particular probably Likes to go fast. And I'm definitely, you know, Brad and I, our minds work at bazillion miles a minute. And that's one of the reasons we bonded so quickly. So here's what I would suggest is instead of me doing the whole stupid lead magnet e book bullshit, how about I cut to the chase and I'll send you right to a webinar where I'm going to walk you through exactly what goes in a pitch. So if you've googled how to write a press release, immediately stop and go sign up for my masterclass. It's babygotbooked.com masterclass. And I'm gonna tell you exactly why a press release is such a bad idea and exactly what to do instead. Step by step with visuals so you know exactly what you're doing. I'll talk to you about, I'll share case studies with you, including the real estate. So we have a guy, Randy Thompson, who ghostwrites his realtor wife's column. It's in a teeny, tiny little real estate magazine. Like we're talking a few tens of thousands of readers, right? So you would think, oh, in order to get a lot of exposure or in order to make a lot of money, you have to get on like a huge national show. Not true. There's. This is their super niche to the right clients magazine. They've made tens of millions of dollars off of this one single column that he ghostwrites once a month for her that has turned her into a complete superstar.

Wait, you said. What does she do? She's a realtor.

She's a luxury real estate agent. Literally. Right? So. So we have case studies that, so I can prove to you why certain things work, you know, what works, why they work, et cetera. We have another person who launched a commercial gluten free, gluten free bakery from writing one pitch. And when she went to a trade show, all of the distributors were chasing her. And I'll tell you exactly how that came about. And she was brand new. She had just gotten her commercial space and she was like, wow, they were all treating me like a total celebrity. And it's because they were like, oh my God. Like, she's like, she's got her own column and Huffington Post and she's doing this and she's doing that. So it's how you leverage, how you position yourself first so that you're credible to the producer so that they pick you up in the first place. And then how do you continue to position and leverage that so it's all on there. Give me an hour of your life and I can really change your business.

That baby God baby got book. Masterclass.

Babygodbook.com forward slash, masterclass. Exactly.

That is fantastic. One last question before we go. And this is going to reward everybody else who kind of stayed and listened and didn't just jump off. So the easiest way to. In a very crowded market where everybody wants to be like, everybody wants to have a column on some of these mags, on some of these sites, what's the easiest way to stand out and.

Get your own column, get really, really clear? So that's interesting. I think it's. The niching piece is really interesting. We have module one of the program itself. This is the reason why we created it this way. I've noticed that a lot of entrepreneurs create what they're comfortable creating, right? We, we have a lot of fear around. We're like, I know how to do this one thing and so I'm going to do this one thing. And we forget to check in with the people on the other side of the credit card whether this is the one thing that they really want to buy. So the process that we created was how to like, literally what exact questions that you can ask in a way that won't make somebody defensive and won't also make them worry about hurting your feelings, where they will tell you exactly what they're willing to pay a whole bunch of money for so that you can design what they actually want rather than what you're qualified, comfortable with. So that's my tip here. It's not an easy answer. It's not an easy solve. It requires listening. It requires you holding on to your feelings and your ego and asking questions that make you uncomfortable, but really digging into the pain points and aspirations of your ideal prospects so that you design something that really will make the little hairs on the back of their neck stand up. Because when I get up on stage and I tell people that I have templates they can fill out in 15 minutes, I know exactly what problem I've just hacked for them, Right?

But now that's. Are you saying that that's how to, like, how to get your own column? Like, where you're writing consistently?

It's the exact same process, Brad, whether you're selling a journalist, and that's what's so beautiful about this program, is that the process by which you pitch a journalist and land them is the exact same process by which you pitch and land a client. Because ultimately, what are you doing? You're Saying here is the value.

That I'm saying a client, but I'm talking about like a publisher.

Yes, yes.

Okay.

That's what I'm saying. The process by which you pitch and land a journalist or an editor or a podcaster or whatever, this media person that you want to impress and who has the keys to the kingdom, so to speak. That process is the exact same process that you're going to be using on prospects and clients in order to first land the sale and then in order to profit maximize on the back end.

Okay.

Because the process is the same thing. It's all about saying, here's what I bring. Here's the value that I've created based on the fact that I have a deep, inherent understanding of this particular audience. Like, I get what you want. I understand your problem. So in a journalist case, we have a whole thing about the psychology of journalists and what they're actually looking for. So we teach you how to. Well, how. How do you give them what they want so that they look awesome in that morning meeting when they bring up your name? Everyone's like, wow, how did you find this person? That's what you want to create, right? Because you understand what they want. That thinking process is the exact same process you're going to use to create the ideal solution when you're designing a product or program, a service for your ideal prospects. This the same thought process. Does that make sense?

It does. I just want to make sure that we're talking about, like, if I wanted to get a column on Inc. Or entrepreneur or HuffPost or something like that. So I totally get, like, the content. Like, get them to do that. But some of the more specifics, like.

For what you pitch them.

Well, no, not what. No, not what. So do they typically need to see that you've got.

Five more articles that you've done? Show them anything else? Like, is there anything? Because I get. I know a lot of people want to have those columns out there.

I'm going to make your day. You ready for this?

Yes.

Go to babygotbook.com and scroll down. And I have an actual template, the very template that landed me my column in ink that I my pitch. I turned it into a fill in the blank template. And just because that wouldn't have been enough, I actually interviewed James Ledbetter, the editor in chief, about what it takes to stand out in his inbox. I literally held him down for 30 minutes, and he tells us exactly what to do.

So I'm on your page. Where is that?

And it's all free.

Where is that?

I'm on your page, so go scroll down babygotbook.com Hang on, let me see.

If I can get become a contributor to Ink.

Voila. Boom.

Love it. So people can go check that out as well and see really what it takes.

Because I mean this ultimately it's not something that I've actually even pursued personally. Although I need to, because I do have. I do have. Yeah, I have. I am a media channel, right? I've got my. I've got my podcast, I got the media channel and I need to just start to repurpose a lot of the insights and things that I get into a column as well. And the reason I do that is because it gives me more access to influence.

Exactly.

As a result, more access and influence. So.

This is great. I'm gonna check it out as well. So all those people who stayed on it didn't just run off and close. This just got rewarded with some extra cool goodies. But there you go once more. Geeta, thank you very much for your time today and for everyone listening. Please do not hesitate to send me an email to ask bradaconwrappedbusiness.com and if you are not a subscriber to the show, if it's on itunes, click it there. And stitcher, you can click it there. If you're on Android, you can also come over to the blog@baconratbusiness.com and you can sign up for the newsletter. I am going to be making a very exclusive offer to work a little bit closer with me and solve a handful of the problems to a very small group of people. We're going to be doing a retreat with some special guests and it is only really going to go out to the people who are on my newsletter. So I do suggest you get over there or just send an email to ask bradakenratbusiness.com and just say, hey, add me to your newsletter and I will. That being said, share this on social media, tag both me and Gita and we will share it again. And yes, please give you tons of thanks. Until next time, Gita, thanks again for stopping by the show.

My pleasure.