Why You Might Just Need A SHOW with Mark Kaye

Alright, welcome back to Bacon Wrapped Business. This is Brad Costanzo and I have got a fun episodle. That's right. We don't have episodes, we have epicizzles for you. Today I have got a guest named Mark K. On the show and before I bring Mark on, I want to tell you a little bit about the what and the why that we're doing and kind of the background about how I stumbled across Mark and how.

His humor is the first thing that kind of brought me in. First of all, the topic of today's episode really is how to use a show to build influence, authority and access to people that you might never have ever thought that you could get a hold of. This is one of the best benefits that I've experienced in the past three and a half years since I've been hosting Bacon Wrap Business is the access and the influence of which you hear me talk a lot about that it's given me primarily through the guests that I get to interview, but also through my listeners like yourselves. And I can't tell you how much I love hearing from every one of you. The best place I like to hear from you is obviously on the itunes reviews for selfish reasons. But in every episode you'll hear me give out my email address, which is askbradakenrapbusiness.com, where I encourage you to send me some of your most stumping business questions and things, things that are frustrating you. Whether it's you're looking to grow an aspect of your business or you're just looking to get unstuck. I may be able to give you a second opinion that will help out. But that being said, this is the show that allows me to do that. And I came across a video a few weeks ago or months ago, I want to say, and it was and I'll put a link to the video in the show notes because you've got to see it. And it's all about what every Internet marketing video looks like. Something like that. And it was hilarious. And then the video went on to make fun of all of the idiocy going on in the and the hype going on in the Internet marketing world. And then he offered to sell you absolutely nothing. Absolutely nothing. But I got on his list and after that I started to pay attention to what he was doing. And Mark K. Who was the author of the video and today's guest then shared another video that I'll also put in here entitled you are not Gary Vee. And as a fan of Gary Vee, it got my attention and I was watching what he was saying and he said, listen, you're not Gary Vee, but you don't need to be, you just need a show. And he started to talk about the differences between a show, a podcast, an interview, and quite literally his bullet copy on his sales page for his product. A thousand shows showing people how to create something just like this, maybe way better, hooked me in. I bought his product, I went through it. Even though I've got a show, I wanted to see what he's doing because I really liked his approach to things. That's how I got to meet today's guest, Mark K. So that being said, Mark, welcome to bacon wrap business.

Wow, you made me sound so much better than I actually am. I appreciate that.

Yeah, well, as I mentioned, I definitely want people to go click the links in the show notes and watch the initial videos. That got my personal attention to want to not only just invite you on the show, but even give you money.

Yeah, no, I appreciate both of those things.

So let's go into a little bit of background about before we jump into this, about yourself. Like you have a show, you're a broadcaster. Are you on the radio as well that I see?

Yeah, I've been a radio broadcaster pretty much all, you know, ever since I graduated college and realized I needed to make money. And I've done television as well, you know, for years. I've worked in several different markets. A few years ago I started filling in nationally for Herman Cain who ran for president for a while and you know, it's, you know, paid the bills, put a roof over my head, paid for my kids private school. So that was great. But a few years ago I ventured into social media more than more and more, you know, than I had before, especially Snapchat, which you know, for at the time was the big app. It was about three or four years ago.

Right.

You know, my audience on the radio is younger, we play a lot of younger music and I need to target a 22 year old female demographic. So I got on Snapchat and I played around with it and pretty soon I realized I was horrible at it. I can't draw. I wasn't really sure what I was doing, but I read an article about a couple of guys who were making serious dough on Snapchat with brand stories and with advertising. And so I'm always, I'm a capitalist first. So I was always intrigued by people who could use their cell phone and their creativity to make money. So what I did was I revamped my own Snapchat formula, and I created the first talk show on Snapchat called Talking Snap. And I got a big, huge write up in Business Insider. I started getting flown all over the country. I started doing brand deals of my own. And a few hundred thousand Snapchat followers later, I had actually kind of become a Snapchat celebrity. I who interviewed other Snapchat celebrities, and they even called me a business insider, the Jimmy Fallon of Snapchat. So that's when I really focused a lot on Internet marketing and using social media and Facebook Live and YouTube and all these things to create a show, because that's all I'd done. I took what I do for a living, which is do a talk show, and I just put it onto an app. And that's what really made me successful. And when I looked around, I realized that's what made everyone else successful too. Gary V. Being the prime example with wine Library tv. And that is something that turned him into probably the first or at least the most well known viral video star nowadays, as you pointed out in the Video Something, and I consider it paying homage to Internet marketers, not so much poking fun, although some of the trolls would say otherwise. But with the Gary Vee video, I just looked around and every time you're on Facebook, every time you see somebody vlogging, you just realize this person is trying to be Gary Vee. And they, you know, they don't need to do that. They need to do their own. The only thing they need to do that Gary Vee did was create a show. Well, let's explore that.

I just want to stop you right there, because there can be a difference for people who don't really understand, because like you mentioned, there's a lot of people trying to be Gary Vee. So let's dive a little deeper there. Like, where do you. What do you see people doing? And they're trying to be Gary Vee, but they're missing the point of what made Gary Vee Gary Vee.

Well, when you look just esthetically at a lot of people's vlogs, you know, the New York scenery, the jump cuts, the dark music, you know, the Uber rides, talking to the camera in the airport, wearing hoodies, cussing all the time, that kind of stuff. And, you know, and it's, I get it, it's a formula and it works. And you're supposed to emulate formulas that work, but you're also supposed to infuse your own personality and not just try to be somebody else. You Know, you see a lot of it, too, with Tai Lopez, people trying to be Grant Cardone, all the big names that pay a lot of money for Facebook ads.

Yes.

The thing with Gary Vee, though, is people are right to want to have a show. People are right to say, I've got a message. I've got to deliver it every day, build a huge audience, and then make a lot of money. That is 100% accurate. What you don't want to do is try to be the character that somebody else is, because you are already your own best character.

No. Okay. Yeah. It makes perfect sense. And it's. And where I see a lot of people kind of stumbling up there is they want to emulate the people that are doing what they want to do. But then, you know, there's a difference between copying and imitating and using the essence of what they're doing to kind of break that down and say, okay, it's not that I have to be exactly like this person, but I kind of use the framework that they've set out and explain the diff. Because in the. On the sales page, for instance, and in your messaging, you. You talk about.

For God's sakes, no more like, please God, no more podcasts. You don't need another podcast. You don't need another vlog. But then you're. And you don't, you know, you definitely don't want to do another Facebook Live either. So you're saying, don't do all this stuff, but then you're showing people kind of how to do it, but you're, you know, under the framework of a show. So how do you really. How do you really delineate between a show versus, like, a podcast, a vlog, a Facebook Live series, et cetera? What is. What should people really think about when they understand the differences?

Yeah. And that's something that a lot of people, you know, they write to me and they go, I really don't understand what you're talking about. But, you know, it goes back to one of my very first radio jobs. I got hired in Washington, D.C. to do a morning show. And I was in the studio, and I. The morning show ends at 10am and then another DJ comes in to take over. And there was. The regular DJ was out. I think she called in six. So this other guy who I knew came in, and he was like, hey, how you doing? I go, oh, great. Good to see you. And our boss was hanging out, too. The guy who was in charge of the radio station, the program director. And we were all Just kind of shooting the breeze. And I said, I go, by the way, what are you doing here? And he said, oh, I'm here to do the next shift. And my boss who overheard that just kind of stopped and said, wait a minute, What. What did you just say? And he goes, I'm here to do the next shift. And my boss went ballistic. He just freaked out on the guy. And he was like, you are. This is not a factory. You are not paid to do a shift. You're not clocking in, you're not clocking out. We don't. You're not creating toasters here. What you're doing is you're going on the radio and millions of people are listening to you, and they are having crappy days and they're stuck in traffic. And your job is to entertain them, to put a smile on their face, to make them forget their worries. Your job is to get their attention long enough to. To keep them from changing the station and going somewhere else where they're gonna get the entertainment that you're supposed to be providing. He said, you are not paid to do a shift. You are supposed to do a show for the next four hours. Your job is to put on a show. And then he stormed out. And I was sweating and panicky, and he wasn't even yelling at me. But I always remembered that. And I think the other guy did too, by the way. That was the last time I ever saw that guy at the radio station. But I, you know, and that stuck with me. And every time I go into a studio, I go, my job is not to talk on the radio. Radio is a device to deliver a message. The message needs to be poignant and exciting and emotionally charged, and it needs to connect with people on a deep, subconscious level. And it needs to get them to do something, whether it's keep listening or opt in or buy a product. And the only way you're going to do that is if you put on a show. And it can be a podcast, a live stream, a video. Those are delivery systems. You know, it's like saying a podcast is like saying, I'm writing you a letter. Okay, Is it going to be black ink on white paper, or is it going to be a 14 page color laminated flyer with a coupon attached to it? That's the difference, I think, between, you know, a podcast, a live stream, a video, and a show?

That, yeah, that makes perfect sense. So when you started to build your show outside of radio, you started on Snapchat, right?

That's right.

Did that Bleed over into other channels. Are you doing. Do you have a podcast? Do you. Are you doing anything regularly elsewhere? Are you still hitting Snapchat really hard right now? Like, what. What is your. What is yours, The Marc K Show ecosystem look like? Like, right now?

That's a great question. You know, and it keeps changing just like the Internet does, as. Whereas I said Snapchat. Snapchat three years ago was the place to be for brands, and every brand just knew they had to be on Snapchat. So they were throwing a lot of money at a lot of different people, and they didn't know what they were doing. There was no way to gauge return on investment. Then, of course, they got wise and they realized they don't know how to see if there's any roi, so we're going to stop paying as much. But then I transitioned kind of into training, because what I learned was there was a lot of opportunity for people to come and speak and about Snapchat. And I got flown all over the world. I went to Germany to speak at a summit about Snapchat. I went to Las Vegas, Dallas. Everyone wanted somebody to come and explain this weird thing to them. And that was great for about a year or two. And then what I started doing was transition to podcasting myself and also Facebook Live. Facebook seems to be the steadfast, always faithful, always there, and always growing and able really just to beat down any competitor, even though it may take a little bit of time. So that's where I kind of focused my efforts. In January of last year, I started a podcast, which was a political talk show based on kind of what I did for Herman Cain. And it was daily. I Facebook lived it as well, and I published it on YouTube. And it grew so fast that it started surpassing the podcasts being created by the company I work for. And they weren't really happy about that. So one day, after about two or three months of creating this podcast, which I thought was incredible and had a huge listenership and was just skyrocketing up the charts, they pulled me into an office and they very politely explained to me, with lawyers present, that they didn't need me competing with them. And so I politely stepped aside from that, and I've been working with them on some other projects. But that's when I went back into teaching. This time, instead of traveling around the entire world, I do it from the comfort of my own home, and I do it with my Facebook group and my private videos and the 1000 shows program, which, as you've seen, you're a part of. And, you know, that's kind of where my. That's kind of where I'm based right now, privately. And then, of course, I do also am also, you know, employed by a company, and we make some great products with their help as well.

Oh, that's fantastic. So.

What are the.

What are some of the ways that. Because I know that there's a lot of people listening who would love to emulate, you know, this show, their favorite shows, you know, all of this, and they want to get going. What do you think is, number one, kind of the biggest hurdle they face, and then number two, the best way for them to get that initial momentum.

Of listeners, of traffic. Because it's one thing to kind of just put out, you know, put your content out there. And in the past, it was a lot easier to get noticed, like on new and noteworthy on itunes and all this other stuff. And it's becoming much more crowded. So, a, what do you think is the biggest hurdle keeping people from doing this? And then B, the best way to get that initial momentum and boost?

Well, I think what I've learned over the years of doing this in all sorts of different medium is people always kind of start with an idea like, oh, I want to do a podcast, or, oh, I'm going to start live streaming. And then it takes them a long time to gain traction to figure out what they're going to talk about, to see who their audience is. And then they want to make money and they have no idea what to sell. So I always tell people to kind of flip it around. It makes it a lot easier. Instead of starting with a show, start with what you want to sell. You need to know your product. And once you come up with your product, whether it's a service or an ebook or an actual physical product, that's what you should start with. And then you look at your audience and say, okay, now who's going to buy this product? And okay, great, so now I know who the consumer is. And now I can kind of tailor, make content that is kind of custom designed for them. And if you have a product, you know your market and you know what kind of content they want to create. Creating the content is so easy. A great example of this, and one that I go back to all the time, is the old infomercials with Billy Mays who sold everything. And every infomercial works that way. And it works brilliantly because it starts with the product, then they take the product and they go, okay, we need to figure out who The Mighty Putty. Who's this for? All right. Mighty Putty is for some guy in suburbia working in a garage and he doesn't want to weld a pipe every time it cracks. We're just going to, you know, wrap it up. Or he's got a hole in his boat and he doesn't want to have to replace his old boat. We'll just. So they create these great visual images of Billy Mays drilling holes in a boat and then filling him with Mighty Putty and going water skiing. And, you know, same thing with Oxiclean. There was that big visual image of a vat of red dye and you throw the Oxiclean in it and all of a sudden everything's clean. Where did the dye? It's all gone. Right? So this is. That was a show. I mean, that was a 30 minute show that was targeted to a specific audience and sold them a specific product. And I think if more people go into their podcasts and their live streams and their vlogs and even their email sequences when they're putting together an email, you know, I say email should be a show too. So whatever content you're creating, flip it around. Don't just try to build an audience. Start with the product and then find consumers who are interested in that product. And it's a lot easier. As far as the new and noteworthy and the best selling list, I think those are the worst goals for someone to have because you're gonna, you're gonna put a lot of time and effort and energy into it and there's very little return. There's so many people that make it on the new and noteworthy, but in the end, you never sell anything. I'd rather have 20 people watching my show who pay me $100 a month than 100,000 people who don't pay me anything.

That's a great point now, but is there a way that you recommend that once people have their show, they've got a few episodes out there that they should be working more? So granted, I know that budget matters, but. So if you have a big budget, you can buy advertising, you can do all this other stuff. Life is grand when you can do that. But some of the ways to start to get publicity for your show that don't involve a big ad spend and especially to get little bit of that traction. I say this also because I know that a lot of people, if they put something out, they put a lot of work into it. They put it out and it flops. It gets really discouraging to Keep going at it. And very few people have an overnight hit.

Oh man. If you can, if you can learn, if you can ignore all your flops, then you definitely will be successful. It's so frustrating, especially when you have, you know, you wake up in the middle of the night with that great idea and you're like, oh, I'm going to start this right now and it's to going be my million dollar idea. And we all have 5,000 of those. You know, if you, if you can just forget about it, if you can ignore it and move on to the next, that's golden. A couple things, if you don't have the budget, I mean, the Gary Vee video again, and if you link to that is a great example. This is something I knew as I was producing it. I knew would get shared. The marketing video too. I knew that would get shared because I knew the audience so well. I'm in these digital marketing groups, I work with digital marketers. I, you know, I watch their videos, I buy their products. I know the kind of the stereotypes and all my videos and all my humor kind of plays off that stereotype, which is just a way to basically, if somebody is the stereotype, they're going to share it because they can totally relate to it. So I packed every Gary Vaynerchuk stereotype I could into a 90 second video and that helped it go viral. Now I did put some money into it too because I started selling and the best thing you can do is if you sell a product that's 100, $200, something that's low end, which for most people buying online is low end, then you can dump even half of that back into Facebook ads and see an incredible return. So I mean, the Gary Vaynerchuk video I've been sponsoring every day for gosh, what's it been like two, maybe three months And I haven't done anything with it. And I keep, every day I get new members, I get new people joining my 1000 shows program and it's just been phenomenal. So anything you can do to get that kind of viral impact. If you're looking for bigger publicity, I'll give you one of my favorite tips. And this is how I got, I got written up one year in Business Insider, MTV News, AOL.com and it was all from this one simple tip. If you go to Google and you go to Google Alerts, just type in whatever your broad topic is. For example, I did Snapchat and every time there was an article or a blog post or a Video about Snapchat. Google sent me an email and what I did was I looked at the authors of all these blogs and every now and then something big would come up and I just write to the author and say, hey, I just read your article about Snapchat. Google sent it directly to me. I didn't have to search it out or anything. I have some more information or I have a related story or I'm an expert. I want to give you another take on it. And I got people writing back. Sure. I mean, they needed content too. They needed to keep creating stories on these same topics for their publications. So they were happy to talk to people that could help them do their jobs. So then would you.

Would you. I interrupted there, but would you then send them some of the content that you had created about that for them to look at and then ideally share, or would you try to get into a conversation with them?

I would try to get directly into a conversation with them. I keep everything conversational. Press releases are death.

Yeah, I agree with you.

I. I get, what, 50 radio pub press releases a day and they just automatically go to my junk mail or I just delete them. Yeah. If you, if you want to stand out, then don't write the press release. Go on Twitter and say, hey, verbatim. What I do is I say something like, hey, I just read your article about podcasting. I have some great information I want to share. Can you give me a good email? And nine times out of 10, they'll at least give you their email address. You send them a little paragraph explaining, say, when's a good time to talk? I always say something like, but you're the expert. What do you think? Would this be good for your magazine? And they think about it. Sometimes they say, no. Sometimes they don't say anything. Sometimes they say, let me talk to my editor. Sometimes they say, yeah, this is right, you know, in line with what we're working on right now. Can I call you? And then, of course, when somebody in the media says, can I call you or are you free? The answer is always yes.

Exactly.

I don't care what you're doing, it's always yes. And that's a great way to get some free publicity as well.

Yeah. And I love that strategy. And there's actually a tool that I've used in the past to do this exact same thing called justreachout.

IO. Yeah.

And it allows you to search everything from blogs to different articles and even social on people who are mentioning certain keywords, much like that. And then it's got all these pre written, highly customizable templates to where you can just click, click, click, click the people you want to talk to and then send out an email. And it's a personal email to them. It's not like a, you know, a mass one or. It is mass. It looks like that. And they've actually reach, you know, written quite a bit for you so that you don't have to think of it yourself if this is not your forte. But they're not a sponsor of the show yet. But just Reach Out IO is a great service that I personally used.

Yet if you guys are.

I like that. Yeah. Power, positive thinking, Brad. That's exactly right.

Yes, exactly.

What about.

Some of the bullet points that you write? Okay, as I mentioned, I'm a big copywriter and I loved the bullet points and the teasers that you put on your sales page. I actually think everybody should go check it out just to read these. And I wrote down a handful of them that I really liked and I was going to kind of bring them up to you. So first of all, did you just reveal the only way to get on the most whatever list was that one of the. Is that one of the strategies is reaching out to people or is there something else that.

Well, there's a couple ways. One of them is reaching out to people if they're writing a list. But you know, one of the other things that people underestimate is the value of email marketing. And if you have an email list and you want to get on the most whatever list, or if you want your view count to go up, or if you want some kind of, you know, instant viewership, the best thing to do is to treat that email list like a little army of targeted whatevers that can go. And, you know, Ben Settle. Ben Settle always says, do your bidding. Which is kind of true.

I love Ben Settle. Yeah.

Yeah. And, you know, and a lot of the. I mean, he told me, yeah, I guess if you read his book, there was that one line about bullet points and he said it only takes one. That's why you need 148, because everyone's bullet point is different. So if they read down long enough, eventually they'll hit a bullet point. And it's true. If you go to any website and you start reading bullet points, not every bullet point pertains to you, but if one does, then you'll buy just for that one bullet point. And pretty much everybody buys for one bullet point. I only have about 30. I think I should probably have More. But you know, if you go to some of these big copywriters, they've got 100 bullet points, they've got 52 bullet points and one of them is going to make you buy. But you know, back to your question. That is one of my strategies is to say, look, if you, you know, if you want a best seller on Amazon, you've got to get your email list to go buy the book all at the same time, all on the same day. Offer some kind of incentive. If you want to get the most listened to podcast, put in four or five of them and then blast your list over and over again and say, today's the day, I need you to go download all five of them. Because if you have 100 people that download five episodes, you're already at 500 downloads. And that's an incredible tool that I think people either are scared or embarrassed to use or just underutilize it, but they're, you know, they're on your list for a reason. They want to be part of your world, they want to be part of your project. And if you need their help, they want to help you. So definitely, you know, ask for it.

Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Now you, you also mentioned the power of how game shows have really dialed this in and using some of these aspects, whether it's contests or game show elements in shows. Can you give me some examples of some of the stuff that's either worked really well for you or that you've seen and you've really liked when it comes to that kind of gamification of it?

Oh yeah, and that's, I mean the game shows, if you look at Wheel of Fortune, Jeopardy. These shows have been on every day for 30 plus years and they, they have, they have the formula, they know how to rope people in, they know how to get their attention and they know how to keep them going. The first thing they do and you know a lot of people. You'll hear again. Ben Settle has a great podcast, but, but his intro is a minute long and I always find myself fast forwarding it. The thing about the Internet is if you go to a podcast, you already know who it is. You already know the content a little bit, you've read the description, you know who the interview's about. You don't need to reset the way you used to have to do in radio and television. I mean, in radio, when you turn on the radio, you didn't have any information. You needed to know who the artist was, you needed to know what the song was you needed to keep resetting. But with social media, we have the luxury of just being able to jump in and grabbing people's attention from the get go. And that's what game shows do. If you watch any game show, Wheel of Fortune is a great example. They don't do the intros of the contestants until after the first puzzle. They get in and Pat says, welcome to Wheel of Fortune. Let's give it a spin. And they're off with a puzzle. And it isn't until that first puzzle is done that they go back and then they talk to the people and then they introduce it. Because, let's be honest, nobody really cares who's playing the Wheel of Fortune. We just want to see if we could get the answer right at home before anyone else is in the same room with us. So the contestants are all secondary. What's important is the puzzle. What's important is the game and the competition. And they know that, so they jump right in. Jeopardy does the same thing. They introduce the categories and they go right to the board and they start giving answers and asking for questions. And they don't introduce anybody until really the first commercial break because they know they've got to get people roped in in that first five minutes. Because on television, if you've got somebody watching for five minutes, they're not going to change the channel because they've already missed the five minutes of the show that they're changing to. So, so, so hook them from the get go.

So how would you use something like that more specifically in whether it's a podcast, a video show, or something where you're. The show is not necessarily all about a game. You know, it's not necessarily a game show. But how can. Do you have any specific recommendations for gamifying a show? Maybe it's, I mean, coming up with trivia. Maybe like, I'm just trying to think off the top of my head because maybe I'll do that for my show as well, but it escapes me. Any specific ideas?

Sure. I mean, and gamify with the game shows. Gamification is huge. And if you can use some kind of interactive way to get your audience going. Absolutely. I would also watch, just like I said, those key components that they use to rope the audience in to keep them going. But one thing that they do that's great is they say at the end of the show, somebody could win a car or.

What'S another way that they do it? They'll show you the prizes up front and then it won't be till the end that the person gets their choice or they get to go shopping. If you look at some of the other popular game shows, they'll tease, if you watch America's Got Talent, they'll show you somebody hitting the golden buzzer. Or they'll show you one of the judges going, that was the best act I've ever seen. But they won't show you the actual. And you're more. You're more than welcome to do that same kind of thing. You could, you could show people a result or tell, you know, if you're, if you're doing a video, you throw up a result of somebody who in one day on Shopify, for example, made $24,000 selling a mug or, you know, selling something. And then tell them, you know, at the end of the show, I'll reveal to you the ridiculously stupid thing they sold for $48,000 in one day. Keep them, give them 80% of it, and then hold off on the 10. Or ask them to guess. Say if you guess what it is that made $11,000 in four hours on Shopify, not only will you win the contest, but I'll send you the item and the free copy of my book. Anything at all you can do to get people interacting and involved in your show, but especially roping them in from the get go. The news is brilliant. Have you ever watched the news?

We own a couple of TV stations here in town, too. So I'm always in these seminars about effective teasing. And one of the things that if you watch the news, they promo it with the most obscene, ridiculous hooks. But they're like one of them literally was. There's three things in your fridge that could kill you. We'll tell you what they are at 11. So for 30 minutes, you're sitting there petrified to go to the fridge because you think you're gonna die. And then at 11 o', clock, you watch and it's basically three forms of Staphylococcus ill ABC or whatever that may be in your crisper drawer. What I. Who even knows? It doesn't matter. You're sitting there thinking, oh, my God, I have to watch the news because there's three things in my fridge that could kill me.

Yep.

And that's, that's the way they, they rope you in. So, I mean, again, there's, there's a reason they're on every weekend or every night and they're. And they're good at.

Yeah, well, and, I mean, it's called many things, you know, from an open loop where you're closing the loop later on to this Zeigarnik effect, where people. Abs. If you start them on a story, if you start them on something like people, we hate an uncompleted. We hate incompletion. So we'll stick around just to hear that final. Just to hear that final thing to close that loop and give us exactly Right. Closure. Right. So. And it's not. This is not something that I've actively been doing on my show. I get on and I have conversations with people I want to talk to about things I want to talk about. I've actually proclaimed many times to my listeners that I have the most selfish podcast on itunes for that exact same reason. I know you guys are there listening. I don't. You're not the top of my mind when I'm having these conversations, though, because I'm working on stuff for me and hopes that it bleeds over to their lives.

And those are the best shows because anything that you do personally is going to. Is gonna print more with people because there's a lot of people just like you that have the same desires and need the same info. I mean, you know, on the radio, there'll be times when we plan a bit or a segment or a conversation for a day or two, and, you know, we put all this emphasis into it. We practice it, and then we do it. And I'll run out, you know, I'll run home to my wife, or I'll go to someone in the office. I'll say, did you hear that bit today? And they're like, oh, yeah, that was cool. I'm like, what do you mean, cool? That was awesome. They go, yeah, it was all right. And then the next day, we'll just randomly stumble into some dumb conversation about Crocs. Or do you keep your peanut butter in the fridge? And someone will come up to me and be like, that was the best show. Oh, my God, that was so funny. I keep my peanut butter in the fridge, too. And, you know, because those are the kind of everyday, ordinary things that everybody is dealing with.

Yeah. And that's. You know, people are starving for entertainment, all of us. If you can combine entertainment with education. Right? Entertainment. Yeah. It can be gold.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah. There's an art and a science to it. But, you know, these days, the tools available for people to have a show, it doesn't matter if it's video, podcast, etc. Are everywhere. I mean, I got started in the online business back almost, I guess, nine years ago this month. And it's Crazy, you know, to me just how much technology has changed and how much more democratized it is for anybody to jump in the game, but at the same time, because it's easier for everybody to get in and there's more noise in the system, you have to be better to stand out so you have a framework behind what you're doing and not just get on there.

And it is true. And you know, there's like, and I'll be honest with you, there's very little new information. A lot of it's the same or similar information that's being delivered in a different way. You know, you're wrapping yours in bacon. And that works if you were just, you know, if you had just a regular business podcast that might not be as exciting and, and, and successful.

Right. And it's having some kind of a hook that a lot like, I didn't personally want to come out with the Brad Costanzo show because I was not a household name. I didn't like, I was, I'm well known in, you know, my industry, but not out there. Widely considered an influencer, especially not when I started this. So I wanted to create something that was a hook that the listener could say, oh, okay, that's, that's interesting. And it created enough curiosity just to go, what the heck is this bacon wrap business? I don't get it. But that's great because it creates curiosity and it can bring people in.

And you know, it's funny, I was having a conversation with somebody the other day regarding, you know, they're just getting into this whole world. And they said, well, what if I created a, a membership site where I just interview experts every month and charge people like 20 bucks a month for it. I go, well, you know, that used to work really, really well.

Right, right.

Like, I remember back in the day when Eben Pagan first had his double your dating business and he had interviews with dating gurus and he was selling them for like $20 a month. And it was like a 10 or 20 million dollar a year business. However, because it's so easy for people to do these general interview shows like this, which could, which used to easily be put behind a paywall, people expect it for free. So it's a lot of stuff is moving just the general interview to be free.

So you do, you have to stand out if you're charging for it. People want insight, not just interviews. And when it's free, they want to be entertained because they can listen to an interview absolutely anywhere.

Yeah, yeah, and you're right about that. I mean, the marketing platform now is give information, give information, give information. So what's left to sell? And what I think most people are doing and what I do really, you know, flat out with the 1000 shows is access. You know, there's. I'm not accessible to everybody all the time, but on Monday nights at 7pm I do a live Q and A. And you're more than welcome to come in and watch and comment or leave a question beforehand and I'll answer your question and I'll give examples. And you know, I even have a phone number that I'm working in so people can call and get direct access during that time frame. And that's what they're paying for. You're right, because the information is out there and you have to give it out to show yourself as an expert. So now anything that's behind a paywall or anything that's a membership site and more people are more looking for that direct access. And that's why you see, I mean, a bevy of coaching as well. That's why that's everywhere. Absolutely.

Yeah. People want the, they want the access and they want insights and because just general information is so. People are drowning in information. Yeah, but it's starving for wisdom. I think that's the, you know, one of the quotes. Who are some of the people's shows? Okay, besides the. Obviously the Gary Vee's, the Grant Cardone's.

Tom Bilyeuse from Impact Theory and people like that, who are some of the shows that you actually think are doing a good job, that you have paid attention to and you think that people might want to look to for inspiration. Does anything kind of come off the top of your head for those?

Well, I mean, right off the bat I probably have, you know, I'll say I've been influenced the most, but I'll just admit it. I flat out stolen the most from a guy named Philip DeFranco. Phil DeFranco. I don't know if you're familiar with him. He's a huge YouTuber. He started about 10 years ago and he sat down on his couch and he just, he speaks rapidly as I do and he jump cuts everything and he just kind of talks about what's going on in news on the Internet and he's built a huge channel and not just a channel, but a business. He now has a huge studio out in LA and he produces about five or six different channels and on those channels several different shows. He's merchandising at the Yin Yang as well. And he, his formula, if you look at most vloggers and a lot of people doing, you know, pre recorded, edited shows with the jump cut, with the, you know, the formula that he's put it together, they all come back from him, whether they know it or not. So Philip DeFranco is, and he's a down to earth guy. He doesn't do stupid stunts. You know, he's not lighting anything on fire. He's not playing video games for 24 hours a day. He's a good, solid entertainer who delivers great information. So I would definitely check him out on YouTube. Philip DeFranco is his name and he's easy to find. Yeah, I just pulled it up.

And his is more of a general show. It's not necessarily, I mean, it's news, current events, pop culture, things like that.

Exactly. And he's big on YouTube and social media. So, you know, whenever there's a, you know, whenever they have like, you know, anything in YouTube, like when they demonetized everybody, he's right in there on it and he dissects the whole thing. And whenever, whenever there's some, you know, PewDiePie does something stupid, he reports on that as well. So there's, there's a whole, it is a lot of current events, but it's more importantly social media and Internet current events, which is another great reason to watch them. You know, some of the other great shows that I watch, I mean, I did, gosh, I did spend a lot of time watching Casey Neistat. Yeah, I've always loved Casey stuff. Yeah, I mean, I know him. I've actually been in on his vlog. Nice. And I've been to his studio, so I always like to kind of watch the progression. But he definitely, you know, cinematically does more than most people. And that's, you know, he's okay. He's an O. Right. And he goes with his strength. Like, for example, you pointed out, I do comedy. And so I can, I can go out there and try to be Tony Robbins and try to inspire people to walk on hot coals, but really I'm not going to do that. I'm just going to laugh at them when they burn their feet. So I have to go with what I know, and comedy is what I know, and that's what actually helped me work. What Casey Neistat knows is taking drone footage of New York City and riding a skateboard while operating the drone and just looking cool. I mean, again, as a speaker, he's very monotone. He doesn't really have super insight but he makes this beautiful film and he does it every day. And that's another great person to watch. I love watching the tasty videos. I mean.

Oh, those are great.

If you want to talk about something that is a marketing sensation, the tasty video is the. It takes any recipe you can cook anything from a cookie stuffed brownie to a turkey dinner, and they'll break it down for you in a minute and a half. And everything they cook, look, you know, you're like, I want to make that tonight. It's so delicious. And now, after doing this for years and accumulating, I think something ridiculous, like 50 million Facebook fans, they've started selling a hot plate. And I imagine they're selling a lot of these hot plates because they're featured in every one of the videos. So I watch a lot of stuff and I just kind of try to see what's working for people and why it's working and then kind of twist it and turn it to match my own style and message and talents.

Yeah, that's fantastic. Are there any other unique formats that you've kind of seen that just are totally unique, that kind of found effective or not?

Well, Snapchat for a while was great because you could literally just draw on top of photo and video and create whatever you wanted. And some of my, some of my really good friends now who are, who are professional Snapchatters, what they've been able to create with just their finger and a phone is just insane. But that's kind of, you know, going away now. People are moving more toward Instagram. Instagram. And what I'm seeing with Instagram is it's all, again, it's personality, it's access. And some of the, some of the biggest stars on television are now huge stars on Instagram. And they just talk into the camera for hours on end. But they're interesting people or they're doing interesting things, or they say something interesting and I'll catch myself busy. Phillips is an actress. I guess she was most popular in a show called Cougar Town. And I don't even know if she's on TV anymore, but I watch her on Instagram every day. She's super popular. Jason Biggs, his wife, has a super popular Instagram account. She's very sarcastic. She makes fun of him all the time. And, you know, she's become a bigger star than he is. In fact, he's on like a Hallmark movie or something or ABC Family movie. And I go, oh, look, it's Jenny's husband. Because now to me, that's who I. That's where I see him. I see him on her Instagram account. So, you know, I just, like I said, I try to watch as many different people as I can. But, you know, if you can create a new formula, if you can take what you do and do something different with it. When the Flip cam. Do you remember the Flip Cam?

Oh, yeah, I sure do.

And when the, when the Flip cam came out, I started doing something. I called myself the Flip Chef and I started cooking recipes. They were similar to tasty videos before Tasty, but I had my son in there and we had, we did, you know, Tom Colicchio's meatloaf that we saw on Top Chef one day? And I tried to make those peanut butter cookies with the Hershey's Kiss for Christmas. And, you know, those videos got several thousand views. But then what happened was the Flip company went out of business. So being the Flip Chef didn't really pan out because everyone just started shooting video on their iPhones.

But again, just take your talent, find a unique twist, try something new. If it fails, try something else. Like you said, if that fails, try something else. I mean, 1000 shows is not my first foray into membership programs. It's probably my fourth. But it's the first one that's actually worked because I learned from people. I learned what people wanted. I learned the frequency they wanted it. I learned how they wanted their content delivered. I learned about myself. I learned, you know, I tried to do a newsletter like Ben Settle, but I realized I don't have the patience to write a 16 page newsletter every week, ever. Every month, rather. But I can turn on a camera and talk for an hour, no problem. So you need to look at what your audience wants. You need to look at what you're capable of doing, what you do best, and try to find a happy medium.

I love that. That's very, very sound advice. What, what's kind of a nut you're trying to crack right now in your business, your life? And by that I mean maybe it's just get more eyeballs on your offer of helping people to create their own show, which is thousandshows.com, right?

Yeah, 1000shows.com.

What else are there? Is there anybody you're looking to meet, people you're looking to hire, skills you're trying to learn? Nuts you're trying to crack is where we potentially help you.

And while I appreciate all that, I mean, I have, you know, I've been kind of in the radio business forever, and one thing that I You know, I've always wanted to do and kind of look to do is foray from what I do now into entertainment, which is entertainment radio, into full time talk radio. You know, I'm always looking for opportunities with that. As far as online, one of my favorite things to do is speak to an audience. And getting up on stage, you know, going to these huge events is, is my favorite thing. Even more so than, than radio and television.

I love it.

It's the, it's the best feeling in the world. You get that. You know, if something you say, you can hear the people gasp, oh, wow, I never heard that. Or you can hear them laugh or not laugh, which is another great, you know, which is just as, that's just as informative if you crack a joke and nobody laughs. And that's my favorite thing. Now the difficulty I have there is being able to travel with a full time job with two kids and a wife. So this 1000 shows has actually kind of been. It's like I get to go out and speak every single week, but I just do it here at my home office and I don't have to travel around the world. So that's how I kind of look at it. I look at it as. These are people that are paying money, they're coming to a conference every week, they have questions, they need me to give them that aha moment and I have the power to deliver that, you know, basically in my underwear and then go to bed and wake up and go to work. And that's, that's kind of why I'm building it. And that's why I think it's successful and that's why I'm going to continue to build it.

No, that's, that's great. Now I have, I think I would found one more bullet point. Oh, good.

Yeah.

And it goes back to. Actually there was two. What is the Donald Trump press conference tactic that makes people addicted to watching you?

Oh, the Donald Trump press conference tactic is to never answer the question. I mean, if somebody asks you a question, the thing you need to realize with questions is, and the best speakers and the most successful people do this. A question is just what you need to sit through before you get to deliver your message. And every press secretary, every political superstar knows this, that when someone asks you a question, all it is is 20 seconds where you have to be quiet before you can say pretty much anything you want. In fact, I've done it nine times during this interview. You've asked me a question, I've delivered some answer that I wanted, you know, that I wanted to tell you. And then I go, oh, wait a minute, I should probably circle back to the actual question. But that's something that you need to. You need to, you know, realize if you have pertinent information, you're just, you know, a question is just somebody taking a little bit of time before you can. You can put on your show is basically what it is. And that's what Donald Trump does better than anyone. He never answers the question. He says what he wants to say, and he gets it out there.

That's fantastic. That's so true. Well, I can tell you my audience this, like, hopefully you guys have enjoyed the insights that Mark has been sharing. As I mentioned, I actually saw this. I went and I purchased a thousand shows. Com, which.

A lot of it is stuff that I didn't personally need, but I'm the type of person to where if I think there's one or two nuggets that will help me out, I'll invest in myself and I'll put that out there. And Mark, you've done a great job. I'm looking at the inside of the membership area now for a thousand shows, and people will be very surprised by how affordable it is.

Oh, thanks.

But he does show you how to pick your product, how to pick your audience, your medium, your network, and go through the most important, important things that are necessary to not only just get the show up off the ground, and by the way, the technical stuff is the easiest, by far the easiest. It's so easy to create a show. Technically.

It'S creating a framework for putting the content out that can be the most frustrating for a lot of people. I mean, I'm kind of good at this, naturally, and it was still frustrating. It took me a long time to kind of understand the format that I wanted to have. So if this is something that you, dear listener, have thought about doing, and I recommend highly having a show, it is. When I. When I look back at the course of just the past year and all of the really cool business opportunities and that I've had this year, from clients to partnerships, etcetera, 100% of them have come as a direct result of the podcast bacon wrap business that you're listening to now, sometimes it's from the guests, sometimes it's from the audience. But it's really amazing at, you know, a show's ability to not only give you access to influence, but build your own access and your own influence. And the two of those just work like compound interest and you'll Be amazed at how some of the opportunities that will come your door, through your door when you start to do this. And you don't have to be the biggest show in the world as long as it's something good and it's adding value in the form of entertainment or education or combination thereof. But I highly recommend that you go check out 1000shows.com if you like, if you've liked what Mark has had to say because he's going to show you a very simple way to get this going and off the ground. So Mark, there's a little unsolicited testimonial for you.

I'm going to have that transcribed and put. That's amazing. Thanks bro. That was great. Better than anything I wrote.

By all means.

Now to all of my listeners, I should have some kind of a contest or a game gamification aspect on this. I don't. However, I do want to make a request to everybody. I just finished reading.

A fantastic book and I'm about to go on vacation for, you know, three weeks over the course of Christmas and New Year's. I'm going to Brazil with my lovely wife. It's going to be amazing and I'm not going to be able to speak to anybody down there except for her because nobody speaks English and I don't speak pork and cheese. So I need book recommendations. I need you dear listeners to email me at askbradaconrattbusiness.com Books that have inspired you, educated you, provoked your thoughts and that have really made an impact on your life. I will probably read four or five books when I'm down there. And if I read one of your books, I will send you a very special surprise gift. You just have to email me at AskBrad. Oh, see, I just gamified this shit. Look at me.

Woohoo. Look at. See, it's not that hard.

It's not that hard to ask Brad at Bacon Wrapped B.

Go check out Mark's program 1000shows.com and take a look at that. Also take a look at some of the show notes because you'll see some of the videos that we talked about in here, including the ones that originally got my attention to Mark. And I think you'll really like what you see and potentially be very inspired. And lastly, if you have enjoyed this, you can hit the share button and share it on social media. Tag myself Rad Costanzo and tag Mark. I'm assuming it's ark K A Y E. Unless it's like, what's your Twitter handle there, Mark?

My Twitter handle is actually Arkshow Coolkaye.

Show, and I'll put that in the show notes as well. But yeah, tag us. Let us know if you really enjoyed this. And I highly encourage you to.

Subscribe to the show if you haven't, because next week, I do have another cool surprise episode coming up for you. You do not want to miss it. And Mark, thank you so much for being a guest on Bacon Wrap business today.

Oh, great. Hey, thanks so much. The pleasure was mine. This was so much fun. I enjoyed it. Good.

I'm glad. Guys. I will see you next week. Stay tuned. And don't hesitate to reach out. Let me know if I can give you a second opinion on something that's not quite working the way you want it to. Talk to you soon.