Healing After Hysterectomy - with Laura Applewhite

My guest today is a women's health advocate and on a mission to help women heal after a hysterectomy. She is the founder of Hysterectomy Healing, and her coaching program puts women at the heart of their own healing journey. Welcome to the show.

Thank you.

Laura Applewhite.

Oh, thank you so, so much for having me and for that wonderful introduction. Thank you.

You're very welcome. It's lovely to have you here. Um, so I met Laura a while ago at a training seminar. We got talking about this topic, and I've really never— I've never heard anybody talk about it before. So it was imperative that I spoke to you about coming on the show, um, and I've— because I think it's such an important topic that, like I said, I don't, you know, it's not in my world, but I have never heard anybody talk about it before, and I've been to a lot of trainings and everything in the past. So if you'd like to tell the listeners, Laura, a little bit about yourself and what you do.

Yeah, absolutely. And I just want to start as well by saying, yes, you're right, it's not commonly spoken about women and hysterectomies in this country. However, Approximately 55,000 women in the UK will have a hysterectomy each year. And in America, that figure is as high as 660,000, if I remember.

Wow.

So it isn't spoken about enough, in my opinion. And yes, so my name's Laura. I help women heal after a hysterectomy. And really, my mission, really wider than that, is to help women heal so that they can help heal the world. Because it is my belief that when women in the world are happy, then the world can be a happier place. And also, I just want to say, because I don't want to exclude men ever in this, but obviously that was very loaded towards women being happy in the world. But actually, it doesn't exclude men, because good women need good men. So very much welcome, welcome in all of the good men like yourself in the world as well. So yeah. So really, what brought me to this work was the fact that I had a hysterectomy approximately 3 years ago. And I found the experience very isolating, and I was terrified of the surgery and how I was going to be afterwards. Also, I was terrified that it was going to go wrong because I had worked in clinical negligence before, and I had had preconceived ideas which were incorrect. I just want to state that they were not right.

Okay.

That everyone who had a hysterectomy, it was going to go wrong, and I was really concerned about that I was going to wake up with a colostomy bag or some kind of bladder issue. I was immediately going to be catapulted into old age, and I might as well just give up my youth and start sitting in the corner knitting with my knitting needles. And I— that was my— those were the main fears that I had going into the surgery. And going through the process, And here I am now, like 3 months— 3 years later. And I just, I know that that's not true. And I really wanted to really help and support as many women as possible through this experience, because it became really important to me that no one went through the procedure in, in the same way that I did. You know, when I say that I felt very isolated, alone, and afraid going into the procedure, really what that means is I isolating myself, and I did not speak about it. So really going back to your first point that no one talks about it, I was ashamed to talk about it, and I was ashamed that I was going through everything that I was going through. And, you know, before the hysterectomy, I was having periods that were horrendous, that were preventing me from going out, and I was ashamed of that. As well. Um, so yes, not many people talk about it because maybe like me, they, they're ashamed, and maybe they worry about what that means about them as a woman. And this is one of the, one of the main things that I do, um, when I'm coaching women is to help them realize that there's nothing wrong with them and they can still live a happy, wonderful, fulfilled life after this procedure.

Yeah. And for the people that are listening, obviously they can't see you. You're very young, aren't you, to have gone through this experience?

Well, I mean, I'm 45, so I— yes, I feel like I'm young. Yeah, really depends, doesn't it, on how old you are, whether you think that's young or not.

But I think for to be— to go through that type of experience, I would, you know, one of my best friends, actually, his wife had his hysterectomy when she was Much younger. I think she must have been in her early 30s when she had her hysterectomy. It's interesting, I was around there last night and we had a little bit of a chat about it, to be honest.

Oh, really?

Coming on the show today. Yeah, I mean, I, to me, that would, that's, that's very young to be going through such and such an operation. I mean, did that impact on you at all, the kind of the age thing? Because you said that you, you know, you were ashamed maybe of what you were going through, not just having to have the hysterectomy, but the The kind of precursors to needing to have it in the first place?

Yeah. I mean, I suppose I don't know necessarily whether I thought that I was young going for the procedure. I think about it now. Yes, maybe. But some of the things that came up for me when, when it was decided that this was the best next step for me, because like I said, I was having horrendous periods for a long time and I was getting to the point where I was quite poorly.

Mm-hmm.

I had anemia. Um, and even though I was still like working really, really hard, my energy levels were just sapped and I was starting to really struggle. And well, you know, going back to what we said before, I didn't, I wasn't talking about that with my friends or my family really. And I wasn't communicating. Yes. My husband knew, cuz You know, my husband is an amazing human being, and he was there and always supporting me. But I didn't talk about it with even my friends, really. You know, it was something that I just sort of hid and swept under the carpet and didn't want to admit. And, you know, when I talk about things, again, that I was ashamed of, like, I had a prolapse, and that was revealed after I had an ablation. So I had an ablation before my hysterectomy, Which was offered to try and prevent the heavy periods. When I had that, my surgeon said to me, Laura, you've got like a grade 4 prolapse here. Like, I'm surprised you don't have any symptoms. And I lied and said, oh no, I don't really have any symptoms, because I had, I was having symptoms. Like, I virtually stopped running because I didn't want to pee myself all the time.

Right.

So again, it goes back to that I was ashamed thing because like now I know, like if you start peeing yourself when you're running, that's something that you go to the doctor and you get treatment for. But then me back then, I was like, oh, I'll just stop running then.

So like the issue.

Exactly. So that can be like a big, a big thing that stops people getting any kind of treatment because they're ashamed to admit to themselves like what's going on. So sorry, I sort of went on a bit of a ramble then, but, um, I didn't— yeah.

Do you understand that what you were actually going through then, that how you were feeling that made you want to keep this to yourself? How did you, how did you think you viewed having a hysterectomy or having problems? How did you think your, your perception of yourself and having those issues came up, came about?

Yeah, well, I just wasn't very good at taking care of myself back then. And so when For example, I had that, and this is why I talk about it now. And at the time, I wouldn't have been admitting to anyone that I had prolapse because, like I said, I was ashamed and I thought that was embarrassing. And also, I thought, oh, it's normal. Like, as women get older, they just pee themselves. Fine. Like, that's okay. But actually, no, it's not. It's not okay. And it's not— I know it can be funny. Like, yes, we can all have a laugh about it, but Not to the extent that—

It's not funny though, is it?

No, no, exactly. And not to the extent that you don't get the treatment that you need. Like, there's a thing, isn't there? Like, I am definitely— and I don't know whether it's just in the UK— like, we can have self-deprecating humor and that's good, and you can laugh about things and that's good, but it gets to a point where, like, don't just laugh about it and not do anything about it. Like, get yourself to the treatment and educate yourself as to what's a problem and what you can do to resolve these problems. Because who knows, had I got treatment earlier, I may have been able to prevent my ultimate hysterectomy. I don't know. I still haven't got an answer to that question.

Is there a stigma, do you think? Is there— I mean, You know, it's a, it's a very important part of a woman's body. Do you think there is something around this, having this operation, or having to have this operation, or having even the idea that there could be a problem that could lead to having a hysterectomy? Do you think there is a resistance in people because of the significance of that part of the body to seek help?

Yeah, definitely. I think that is a really complicated That's a long, long answer as well. Because I definitely felt that having the surgery might make me less of a woman. And I know now that that's not the case, but I did have that fear inside of me before the surgery, like, I'm not going to be a proper woman anymore. But also, that's not true, not in, not in the least bit true.

Mm-hmm.

But These feelings that come up, there's nothing wrong with, with that thought and that feeling. Um, and it's something to be allowed and something to not to block out, um, not to resist, and, and something to allow, allow it to come up and, and work through. Um, and I hate sometimes saying this, working through things, because it's—

Yeah, there's a process, isn't there, that you need to go through in order to be able to manage this for yourself.

Yeah, and it reminds me of a quote that I read yesterday, something like, what you can't feel, you can't heal. So, like, all of these past coping mechanisms that I had created about pushing my feelings down and pretending that they didn't exist, like, again, when it came to my hysterectomy, like, everything, everything from all of those times when I tried to push things down, it all, it all just came up and I had to face it. And As a— as part of my hysterectomy healing, I had to really deeply, deeply heal inside of my heart. It was not just about the physical healing. And this is, um, really one of the things, or one of the main things that I help and, and what I, um, coach women through, is it's not just the physical healing that we're looking at here. It's often, um, that you need to heal Heart, body, and soul. And, and the physical side of things actually can be often the easy part.

Yeah, I guess that's like you said, there's a huge significance in what you do as far as what your coaching and your support is for, um, the people out there, is that you do, you do give them the tools or you give them the space to be able to actually really work through what they are going through and help them to come to terms with what is a very significant, significant Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

And then, you know, going back to that, you know, not feeling like I would be a proper woman, um, moving on from that, I was 42 when I had my hysterectomy, and I wasn't planning on having any more children, but I had to grieve for the fact that I wasn't going to have any more children. So logically you go— well, this is what I went like— well, you weren't going to have any children anyway, why are you sad about this? But I did grieve for that, and I needed to, um, because again, it's not something you can push down and put it in a box and forget about it.

There's one thing knowing that you're making a choice not to, but the second— there's a second thing completely when you know you can't.

Yeah, definitely.

That choice is being removed from you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.

And you work with the women in your group, as you said, and we had a little conversation before, and it was interesting that you um, touched on the relationships that they— and the importance, what they see as a significant factor within relationships for themselves nowadays. Um, would you like to— can you talk a little bit about that? And given this is The Relationship Guy Show, it would be interesting to see if there's a difference between the significance of things that they place on having healthy intimate relationships with people that may be different to what I've come across in the past. So could you share some of that with me?

Definitely. They have come up with— I just wanted to send out a little message of love to the women in my Hysterectomy Healing Community. By the way, my Hysterectomy Healing Community is such a loving space, and I love every single one of them inside of there. And if any of them are listening to this, I just want to say that to all of them. Um, so yeah, I asked a little question this morning to them. What was the most important aspect a loving relationship. And they have come up with quite a few of the things that I came up with as well. And I'm just going to start, because I'm here, I'm going to start with some of mine first.

Mm-hmm.

And then I'll move on to some of theirs. But what I will say, just a little spoiler alert, is some of the things that they have come up with, well, most of the things they've come up with, really are what I've come up with. So I don't think you're going to be shocked by any of these things here.

Right.

But one thing, when I was thinking about what we were going to talk about this morning, is when we're thinking about the importance of relationships, one of my, like, biggest, biggest things for a happy and healthy relationship, and something that I just wanted to mention, was that It was some advice that my grandma gave to me before I got married. So before I got married, I said, because I was desperate to get it right this time, because I'd been married before and it was horrendous, mainly because I was 18 at the time. So 18-year-olds getting married.

Yeah, that's another story altogether.

Definitely. Anyway, so she said to me, Pardon?

I'll have you back and we're going to talk about that.

Yeah, definitely, definitely. Yeah, you can, um, learn from all of my mistakes.

That's exactly what I do in my coaching. Um, yes, I've made into one, into one package. Great stuff.

Yeah, can we do one like that? That would be amazing. Um, yeah, she said to me, um, and I'm gonna pass this on always from now on, well, from, from when she gave the advice to me, was, uh, most important thing in a happy and loving relationship is a sense of humor. And I really, really believe that that is so true because you can't take yourself too seriously in this life, and especially in your relationships. And for me and my husband, like, especially when the chips are down, we like to laugh at and with each other all of the time. So that is really, really, really Helped us through some ups and downs. So, I mean, I've got a lot more as well, but a lot of the other things that I've written down here have come up in my Hysterectomy Healing Community, like commitment. And I always want to say to yourself first and then to everyone around you. Non-judgment, again, of yourself and then extending that to everyone around you.

Yeah.

Yeah, humility. And when I say humility, I don't mean like how in the sense of, you know, having a low opinion of yourself. I feel like a lot of the time, like, humility can be misconceived, if that's the right word.

Definitely, like low self-worth and low self-esteem.

Yeah, no, I see humility as not being proud and really being aware of yours And then, by extension, after that, everyone else's humanness. And from the women in my community, they've come up with, again, loyalty, honesty, trust, friendship, and being able to take yourself and your partner on dates, open communication, and understanding each other's love language. And I mean, there's just so many things like—

There are so many things. It's interesting when you said about love languages, most people don't even know their own, let alone knowing what their partner's are.

Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.

We have done a show, so if you want to listen back, um, to one of the previous episodes of The Relationship Guy, we have talked about love languages if you are not aware of what they might be.

Yeah, so, um, for example, like, I really love words of affirmation. My husband, um, he doesn't really care so much about that. words of affirmation. And he is definitely— his love language is definitely service. So sometimes we can come at things from a completely different angle. And, you know, just this week, we went out for a lovely romantic little date and ended up having a disagreement because I asked him for some words of affirmation. Obviously, I didn't say it in that way because that's—

Yeah, loser phrasing.

I was just asking for a compliment, basically. And I I forgot myself for a minute there because when I do that, it makes him feel a bit under pressure and he doesn't know, like, he feels a bit like I'm saying that he never says anything nice to me, but that's not, that's not true. And because I put him under pressure, then we ended up having a bit of a disagreement. So I'm not going to say it just because you want me to. Yeah, exactly.

And, um, but actually, again, maybe you needed him to.

Well, yeah, but also, like, and I just want to also then mention again there that before I came on the— or not again, but before I came on the podcast with you here, I asked Paul, like, what would you like me to talk about on the podcast? Because I'm talking about relationships. And, you know, he mentioned the thing about sense of humor.

Mm-hmm.

And I'm just going to quote him here, because this is his sense of humor and mine as well. Um, and, um, he was like, I want this to be a bit light. I don't want you to be all serious and talking about commitment and trust and non-judgment and courage and vulnerability and that. What about remembering that not everyone is like the fucking Waltons? And I'm like, yes, exactly, because not everyone is like the Waltons.

I think that's the importance of the few things that you've intimated to already when you started to kind of talk about this. was the importance of having a really good relationship with yourself.

100%.

Because if you don't have that relationship with yourself that's healthy, then you are going to judge yourself. You're, you have maybe so low self-worth and stuff. So if someone is trying to have a joke with you, you're not going to be able to take it very well. If they don't give you the words of affirmation that you're looking for, conversations can escalate into arguments when they don't need to, um, because of the fact that you haven't dealt Again, go back to whatever we haven't processed, our own stuff. So it's really important that you do work on that relationship with yourself if you want to have a healthy relationship. And like you said, you know, be able to laugh at yourself when it's appropriate.

Yeah, exactly.

Something that's funny.

Yeah.

Rather than get embarrassed, rather than feel shame, rather than feel whatever it is that you might feel, is just to be able to go, you know, well, that's okay. That's quite amusing, really.

Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Like, if I look back at this disagreement that we had the other night, Like, no, no, I wish that we hadn't had the disagreement, but looking back, it is quite funny, like, how we were both coming at it from a different angle. And also, like, you can't have a healthy relationship if you think that you're never gonna fuck up. Like, like, relationships are not perfect, and we're all perfect and imperfect both at the same time.

Wow.

So, like, if you think you're going to be in a relationship and everything has to be like the Waltons every day, you're setting yourself up for a fail. Because, like, relationships sometimes are not easy.

Mm-hmm.

And it's about that, you know, going back to what I said before, it's about that humility, about understanding sometimes you're going to get it wrong, and sometimes your partner is going to get it wrong. And if you can always remember that you love each other and not forget that, Then you're going to be, you know, you're going to be doing a little bit better because, you know, you can't go through life— Paul and I have been together 25 years now— you can't go through 25 and, you know, let's hope we're going to get to 50 one day, if, you know, God willing, I'm still here by then. Let's hope we're gonna carry on, like, loving each other and accepting when we get it wrong and just Laughing at and with each other.

Being with each other in that moment when it all goes wrong, you know, like you said, separating and falling out. It's actually just accepting that, as you will, things will go wrong and how we're going to work through this together. And I guess coming back to what you went through with your hysterectomy, just quickly to touch on relationship beliefs, are one of the fundamentals I believe in having and creating a healthy intimate relationship. If you don't understand what your relationship beliefs are, then you will setting up yourself to fail, because if your beliefs are unattainable, then you are going to keep looking to find something within a relationship that is— that really can't exist.

Yeah, exactly.

That importance of those relationships as well. So when you were going through, you said it was Paul that was the person that was your rock. He was there for you. He was the one you shared things with and helped you through. So the significance of relationships to you Especially when you were going through that time in your life? How would you say they helped you and, and got you through the difficult times that you went through?

Yeah, I mean, so if we just, um, you know, talk about Paul being my rock. So I, you know, if we, if we go back to the point where I said I wasn't great at looking after myself. So for example, I, in the, in the first few days after my hysterectomy, I was like, Oh, this is easy. I can just— I'll be all right. I can just hop off the bed. I can just like do the Hoover and I can just move this chair. I can lift this. And Paul was like, no, you are not moving. You are sitting in that chair or lying in that bed and you are not moving.

Hmm.

And I was like sulking like a petulant child because I was like wanting to like hop up and show myself and everyone how I'm invincible. And I joke about this, but he virtually had to tie me to the sofa and the bed and whatever. And maybe not in the way that he'd like, but—

Not in that way.

Yeah. But he was like, no, you are gonna sit there and you are gonna lie there and you are gonna recover. And he would not let me leave the house, like, for 2 weeks. So I wanted to— I was desperate to go for a walk around the block again because I wanted to show myself and everyone that I was invincible. But I needed that discipline and I needed that Yeah, I needed that from Paul. That's that time and that space to rest and let my body heal, especially in the beginning, because left to my own devices, I— goodness knows what I would've tried to do. Yeah.

It's interesting cuz I, my stepmom, she had a hysterectomy as well. And, um, I went round there not long after she came out of the hospital and she was standing on the kitchen units, dusting the top of the units.

Oh my God.

And I was like, what the fuck are you doing? Get down. Oh, this has got to be done. I was like, no, no, you know, you can't be up there. Get down.

Oh my goodness.

Like, rest for the next few weeks or so.

Yeah.

At the time, this was many years ago, at the time, I, you know, I can't, you know, being in the world of trying to understand why people are doing what they're doing, you know, that makes sense because that's the kind of person that she is. She likes to be seen as someone who can just crack on.

Yeah.

I can understand now why she was doing what she was doing. And I'm sure she got straight back up there after I left, to be honest. But—

You're not telling me what to do. Yeah.

I don't think she saw the importance of her own wellbeing.

Exactly. And I think that really, that leads really nicely into one of the things, one of the key things that I had to learn when I was recovering after my hysterectomy was that over the years I had learned, and it had helpful for me in some way, in some ways. So I don't want to completely turn my back on it. But anyway, I'd learned that I could pull my socks up, I could push on through, like, doesn't matter what I'm going through, like, just keep going.

Right.

And as I say, that was helpful for me at times, but in the healing and the recovery part after my hysterectomy, I had to learn to actually start listening to my body. more. And actually, there were, there were a lot of cues that my body would give me, a lot of messages it would send me, um, that I would miss completely because I was just so used to pushing, pushing, pushing. So I had to learn to almost like dial down the mental chatter, dial down my head, um, a little bit and start listening to my body, um, and My heart because it was trying to guide me in the right direction, but I was ignoring it a lot.

Yeah, yeah, that's that's come up quite. It comes up a lot in the coaching that I do, but even some of the interviews that that we've had on on the show is that significance of recognizing what your body's telling you because your mind has a different idea about what your body's capable of, and when it comes to all sorts of different things, you know where your body might be under stress. You know, he's not coping very well, it will tell you. It will tell you. It will give you the signs. If you're living in your head all of the time and you're not allowing yourself to make that connection to what your body's trying to tell you, you can completely screw yourself over.

Yeah, yeah, definitely. And I think it's quite common, especially for women. That's my experience. That's my knowledge. Um, and, you know, especially in the corporate, um, world as well. Like, it's just It's almost celebrated, isn't it? Like, push, push, push, sleep when you're dead, lunch is for wimps, all that kind of stuff.

Yeah, and expected to be at beck and call answering your emails at midnight type thing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, the best employee in the office is the one that stays there the latest, that kind of thing. Yeah, committed to the firm. Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely, 100%. And, you know, Like I say, there's, there's some parts of that that are okay, and there's some parts of that that are good, but you need to— well, I felt that I needed to, and I have needed to, um, get that balance back, um, right, and allow my body to have a bit of a say sometimes.

Yeah, definitely. You need to be in harmony, don't you, in with all different parts of yourself. Again, it's all that self-development, that self-learning, and really sort of spending some time Looking at you and understanding you and figuring out really what's going on in your own life and going on in your own body.

Yeah.

Kind of live the kind of the best version of you possible, I think.

Yes, definitely.

So thank you so much for sharing your story with, with the audience today. If people would like to get in contact with you, because like, as you said, you know, this is not a widely talked about topic. People may not know where they can go, but it's amazing that you've got this Facebook group for people that you can support and help through, either before they have the hysterectomy or after. You know, there's a very supportive and nurturing environment that you offer. How can people become part of that, and how can people get in touch with you in general?

Yeah, lovely, thank you very much. Um, yes, so my hysterectomy healing community can be found on Facebook. It's Hysterectomy Healing with Laura Applewhite. And I think you're going to put the link to that, um, in—

Yes, indeed. We will put your group link in the show notes. So if anybody isn't able to jot this down, then do look in the show notes and you'll see a link to Laura's Facebook group there. And also, yeah, and yeah, on Instagram.

Yeah, and they can connect with me on Instagram. Um, my Instagram handle is laura_apples_, and that's just a little nod to my nickname, which is Apples. So, you know, anyone who calls me Apples, you're my pal. So that's that. And also, you know, if anyone has any questions or if they want support, then they can DM me on Instagram. And if they find me on Facebook too, then they can DM me there as well, because I love to chat, as you can probably tell.

No, no, it's been an amazing conversation. Thank you very much. Like I said, if anybody's there that is in, in the same situation, either you think you've got a problem and you want to talk to someone about it, or you've already been through this experience and you want some support with it, please do get in contact with Laura and join what sounds like an amazing community to help you through any difficulties that you might have with these experiences. I'm going to call you Apples now so we can be pals.

Yes, please.

Thank you, Laura. And for being here, and I look forward to speaking to you again when we come— maybe we'll come back to talking about your, uh, your, your wedding when you were 18.

Yeah, yeah, please do. I mean, I've got a lot, I've got a lot of material here for you. I'm ready, willing, and able whenever you want.

Awesome. Uh, so thanks again, Apples. Been great talking to you, and I'll look forward to speaking to you again soon.

Yeah, lovely. Thank you. Really good talking to you as well. Thanks so much.