In this interview, John Bohan, a Facebook marketing consultant who works with major brands such as DreamWorks, Paramount, Kraft, American Express, and Athenos, shares practical advice for leveraging Facebook. He outlines three core activities: building a fan base, creating simple, shareable fan‑page applications that turn fans into brand evangelists, and using data analytics to measure fan‑page value and engagement. Bohan emphasizes targeting the right demographics (e.g., moms, women 25‑54, younger users) and using humor or cross‑demographic concepts (e.g., a "Most Interesting Cat" campaign for Puss in Boots) to boost reach. He warns against focusing solely on fan‑count numbers and instead stresses the importance of fan‑page value. He also discusses the power of gaming apps on Facebook, noting that about half of users engage with games and that advertisers can embed brand experiences within games. Throughout, he stresses keeping experiences fun, simple, and entertaining, and predicts that analytics from fan pages will become increasingly valuable for understanding consumer behavior and informing broader advertising strategies.
Chapters
Okay, let's talk Facebook. It's sort of a love-hate thing. You have to be there, but it's sort of a puzzle you need to figure out on how to actually engage customers. You're doing a lot on Facebook, although first, can you please drop some names? You mentioned some of the clients that you're working with. It's a really impressive list.
Yeah, sure. We're working about 100 clients. DreamWorks, Paramount, Kraft, American Express, just to name a few.
Those are some major players.
Yes, we all use them in some way or another.
Right. So tell me, what are you doing on Facebook? And then we'll get a little bit into specific advice later.
Sure. Well, essentially we're doing 3 things on Facebook. We're helping companies to build their fan bases. But once they build a fan, it's— the fan is really not very useful until they engage within the particular fan page. So what we've done as well is we've built out development arm where we build out applications, fan page strategies, really getting those fans to become brand evangelists and create earned media. The third thing we do, which is probably the most important, is data. We essentially measure exactly what's going on in terms of the media as well as in terms of the fan engagement.
Okay. So I'm a brand. Let's say I'm Kraft. How do I get the biggest benefit out of using Facebook?
Well, I think it depends on who your customer is. Let's say you're Athenos, happens to be a client of ours, and they're targeting women 25 to 54 who are really reaching out to moms. So the key is, how do we get the moms engaged within the brand so they start talking about it? But the first key is, if you build it, will people come? Usually the answer is no. So you essentially have to build up the fan base. So get that fan base up to say 20,000 to 500,000. But build it with super fans. People are going to engage, not just a number. So once that grows, and then the question is, what can you do that is interactive, that has content value, that moms are really, really going to like? So come up with an application that they're going to send out to their friends and share.
Yeah. Well, and I've heard that Facebook is a great forum for engaging moms. Who else is Facebook the ideal platform to engage in addition to moms?
You know, it's funny because it's a good question, but you look at it, it's really anybody. I mean, Facebook's up to, I'm going to say, about 800 million users now. They're going to be Right. They're going to be at a billion shortly. Women 25 to 54 are probably the most talkative, but obviously the younger set is extremely talkative as well. It really depends on who your audience is, and you can really pinpoint and target them by demographic profile, by interest, etc. For example, we launched an application just today. It was actually about an hour ago for Puss in Boots, the movie. The cat and Shrek. Yeah, I'm looking forward to it. Antonio Banderas. It's going to be a great movie. It's going to launch November 4th, and we created some kind of a spinoff off of Dos Equis' Most Interesting Man in the World.
Oh, very funny.
So you can see, it's the most interesting cat in the world.
I love it.
Yeah. So what people are doing is they're going in and saying, why, Puss in Boots is the most interesting cat in the world. And DreamWorks has kind of created this spoof video, which is absolutely hilarious. So that is a pretty broad-reaching target. It reaches men 18 to 34 who love the Dos Equis commercial. But it also reaches anybody that's interested in that type of humor.
That is a really interesting cross-demographic reach. I mean, that's a great idea.
Yeah, and the great thing about it is, you know, Shrek obviously crosses many, many different generations. So we're kind of doing that because of that, and hopefully it's a big success.
Okay, digital marketing is learn as you go. What have you seen done wrong on Facebook that we need to learn from?
Well, I think, I don't know if it's done wrong, but it's kind of the approach is so much, you know, how big is your fan base? So it's an ego play because it's very visible. If my fan base is at 2 million and my competitor's at 7 million, I want to get to that 7 million number. But we don't think it's so much about the fan, it's really the value of the fan page. With what SocialTies is doing so well now is we're essentially kind of taking a very in-depth analytical look at the value of the fan page and the engagement level, not just that number. So I think there's a preponderance of interest in terms of the number rather than what the value should be.
Sure, sure. Should all companies have a fan page or is there a particular type of company that does great with that and certain companies where that's just not going to resonate as well?
Yeah, I mean, I thought everybody should have a fan page. I was speaking on a panel once and I essentially said so much. Then somebody who works for a divorce lawyer said that, "What am I going to do with my fan page? Who are my customers going to be?" It's really difficult. I've kind of shied away from that. I think most consumer brands, B2B brands, most brands should, but obviously there are those where it really doesn't make any sense.
That's true. Most consumers are just going to assume assume that most companies have one and they're gonna look for it, and then when it's not there, you know, then that sort of affects their experience in the brand and not finding it.
Yeah, I mean, it's like websites really, you know, 12, 15 years ago. If you don't have a fan page and you're a major brand, obviously there's a big question mark there.
Okay, so in actually working with Facebook, tell us what is the best thing we need to know about interacting with Facebook or something to avoid in actually working with Facebook?
I'm not sure if there's things to avoid. I mean, Facebook is an incredible organization. I think that Just getting involved. Getting involved in a small way. What we've seen with a lot of companies that have worked with us, or certainly worked with Facebook, is you don't have to know everything to get involved in the medium. It's again like the internet. The folks that embraced it, jumped into it, learned from it, were able to then expand their budgets. I mean, look at some of the top companies in the world, like a Coca-Cola or a Starbucks. Companies that know a little bit about marketing. They started early on, and they've had fan bases over 20 million now. So I don't think there's really anything to avoid, but essentially is, you know, start slow and I think quickly you find that you'll increase your budgets.
Okay. And any surprising best practices that you've come across? Like how to get the most value out of Facebook?
We've certainly done best practices across a number of different arenas or different areas. Some things are surprising. I think best practices in terms of building an application, something that we've learned a lot about. Keep it simple. We've made some really complex applications that look great on paper, but you know, when it comes down to usage, it's just keep it real simple. Get people to come in, get in, get out. Maybe they're there for about a minute. We created this application, for example, for IHOP. It was during March Madness, and it was called, instead of basketball bracketology that everybody was in on March Madness, it was breakfast bracketology. So people came in and they voted on banana pancakes versus Belgian waffles, and we did the sweet 16 instead of, I mean, the savory 16 instead of the sweet 16.
Either would almost work.
Yeah, that's right.
Wait, wait, who won? Who won the breakfast bracket?
Fresh and Fruity. Rooty Tooty Fresh and Fruity won.
Very nice.
Which is interesting. That's fun to say. Oh yeah, it is. Barely why it won. But they were about to take that off the menu, I think. And then all of a sudden it won. So social media can teach you a lot about their customer base. So the average time there was roughly a minute. So people were in, they were out. And we got a tremendous amount of usage. I won't go into the ones that weren't so successful a couple years ago. But usually it's based upon complexities. People, you know, it's an entertaining vehicle. People use it if it's simple and fun.
Well, I was gonna say, it sounds like one of your top pieces of advice is to have fun. Because if you're obviously having fun creating these things, and the idea is like, oh, you know, this Puss in Boots and, you know, most interesting man in the world thing that kinda makes you laugh and just is an exciting idea, sounds like if you're having fun, your audience is probably also going to have fun.
Yeah, I mean, you think about the best videos on YouTube, I mean, the ones that are most viral, they're the most ridiculous. You know, the things that make you laugh, that you want to send on to your friends. It's the same thing as social media. Except in Facebook, it's so much more powerful because you can send it to potentially hundreds of people, maybe thousands of people, very, very easily. With YouTube, it's not as viral. But yeah, keep it fun, keep it simple.
Okay, last two questions. And it doesn't matter which of your clients, but which celebrity do you want to make public comments? I would say tweet, except that you're the Facebook expert. But what celebrity would you want to just say things about one of your clients out in public?
Which celebrity? It depends on, I guess—
Pick the client, pick the celebrity.
Okay, I have to think about this really carefully. That's a tough one. I'm going to have to pass on that. I'm sorry. That's fair. I'm sorry.
No, that's good. That means you put thought into this. You want the right match.
Right, right.
What was my other spontaneous one? Well, this would take a little thought also. I happen to think that gaming is a very interesting realm where a lot is happening within digital marketing. So I was also going to ask, could you match one of your clients to a particular video game and sort of embed a presence there?
Well, sure, certainly. I think gaming is a fantastic way. In fact, another part of what we do is we run ads across a number of game apps. And, you know, there's a tremendous amount— 50% of all the folks that go to Facebook, I think one stat said, that they go in there to play game apps. So we're going to match a particular client up. I mean, I guess the— why don't you pick a client, I'll come up with the game. How's that sound? Fair enough, fair enough.
So let me ask one follow-up question about gaming then. That is an entirely different realm. Some people are coming to Facebook to socialize. Some are coming to play Farmville and to play these different games. What is the opportunity that that opens up for us?
Yeah, well, I think what it does is it really shows what people are doing on the internet. I mean, again, getting back to simplicity and fun and engaging with other consumers. I say the internet, I meant Facebook, which is becoming more of the internet. I, and I think what it says is that advertisers need to come up with more engaging, entertaining content pieces like Zynga has done. I mean, Zynga has taught us a lot about consumer behavior in this environment. So the question becomes, well, you know, how do advertisers come up with something like a Breakfast Bratatology or, you know, or a Most Interesting Cat in the World or something even more complex where their users will engage in the brand but do it in a way that lifts the brand and is much less commercial. It's more about how can I entertain and inform my consumer base better, and that's going to be the best advertising.
Very cool. Any final thoughts? Anything else I should ask you?
One of the things I guess is, again, I'll just get back to value of a fan page and the analytics that go behind that. If you look at the consumer behavioral patterns on a fan page, it's absolutely phenomenal in terms of what you can learn. And I guess my closing comment would be I think what we're going to see over the next couple of years is the information and analytics that you can receive in this environment far surpass anything else that we've seen in terms of providing value and understanding of people's consumer base, which then will lead to potentially how to advertise in traditional media as well.
Interesting. John, thank you so much for your time.
