This 23 mins podcast will change your life! Re-Migration to India #remigration #india

India is a growing market, but there's a lot of demand for, for, um, niche skills such as communication skills, such as negotiation skills, such as— but post-COVID, post the lockdown, when the economy reopened, there's, uh, there's enough supply of blue-collar jobs per se.

So do you, do you mean to say now you don't have to, you know, uh, cater to your boss's needs the way it was back when we were working? You know, the A typical boss, um, thing factor was there and you had to stay back in office for a long period of time to project the fact that you're working.

That's, that's actually shifting a lot. That is there in a couple of sectors, but it's shifting a lot, especially in aspects such as policymaking or think tanks or startups, or in general, unless you're in a very bureaucratic structure.

I—

if I get a PhD, the intention is to have something to do in my technical background, which was in genetics, and not work at Starbucks.

Hey guys, how are you doing? So this is my English podcast once again, and we'll try to do it in Bengali and English as possible. So if you watched my videos about how Canada is fast deteriorating with mounting housing prices and expenses, and the vanishing job market on top of that, and also the rising crime rate in Canada, You will know that how the Canadian dream is getting crushed right before our eyes. A huge number of people who are now facing the reality of going back to their homeland, especially India, which is now a booming country, and they're almost set to be the third largest economy in the world very soon. So if you've seen those videos, you will know that how Canadian dream is getting crushed very soon. Very fast. I'll soon come up with more podcasts, more videos, and with students who are right now studying in Canada and desperate to go back. Okay, so the great Canadian American dream had long crushed before the— after the post-9/11. And now post-COVID, it seems that the Canadian dream is all getting crushed. People are beginning to realize that staying at home is what best you can do. And that field is always—

looks—

the field always looks greener on the other side, right? And it's so much that recently Facebook groups have started. There's been a remigration— groups have started in Facebook, and agencies are helping them with reintegration into the Indian society because, uh, obviously the Indian society has become changed dramatically over the years. due to its huge digital revolution. So today I have with me the pleasure to introduce to you Koheli Dasgupta, who is doing her PhD, who was doing her PhD in Toronto, mind you, and have now decided to go back to India. And she is now the Director of Operations at a science policy startup in India, as well as a freelance policy consultant with a Canadian think tank. So it's been almost 3 months now, right, Koheli? And and this is the first of any such podcast. Please watch out for more podcasts coming up, and we are interviewing a real-life person who's gone back to India and now settled in India. So, Kuheli, say hi to the viewers.

Yes, hello everyone, my name is Kuheli Dasgupta. Um, I have recently relocated back from Canada to India in February 2024. Hello?

हाय प्रथम बार दुबई हुए फिर ची मैं अखंड अबुधाबी एयरपोर्ट पहुंचे आज ची ज़ाहिद अमाद एयरपोर्ट इन अबुधाबी एक घंटे के कोलकाता रुकवा कनाडा या तो दिन छीना एक बार वो घंटे के बेरिएशी कोलकाता ऐश ची वो खाने नीचे पोर्शनों कंप्लीट करे वो खान करेक्ट जॉब नहीं है Work from anywhere. तो एक कोलकाता है वो शो करने जॉब को तो सही चलना और वो शेषे खड़े फिरा ये तो last चक्की वीडियो जहाँ हमें स्टडी परमिट नहीं है देशी ढूंढ़ची एक बात तक कि जो दिक्कत होना चाहा है तो हमें वर्क परमिट नहीं है बेरोना हो गए तो सही चलनी है आज के छोटों के ट्यूटर After spending almost four years, I came to Canada in 2019.

So I spent almost four years in Canada. I lived through COVID in Canada. And while I was pursuing— I had initially come to Canada at the University of Toronto to pursue a PhD, but I was seeing the landscape change very drastically and therefore also planning—

How did it— what kind of a landscape did you— do you mean by landscape changing drastically?

So because I arrived pre-COVID in 2019, I have a—

I had the—

I had the— I would say the benefit of having the comparison of the Canadian life pre-COVID and post-COVID. So back in 2019, the kind of dynamism that existed in the Canadian job market, in the Canadian job market, both in terms of opportunities for students, especially international students, because as we all know, Canada has this aspect of Canadian work experience, which sometimes can be a barrier for newcomers. But having said that, the barrier for entry was relatively low in 2019 because right after I landed, I started at the university. I had started on a couple of part-time jobs, etc. Down when the economy reopened, I personally also faced, and that is also the consensus from a lot of my Indian student friends, because I'm part of many student groups having several international students, not just Indians, several nationalities. The barrier to entry for that has gone up. One primary reason for that is there is a lack of supply of employable jobs. So there's enough supply of blue-collar jobs per se. But there is a lack of supply for skilled jobs. And usually a lot of students who attend universities or attend any kind of technical courses, they're looking at specializations. So they're looking at skills which will not only give them a livelihood, but it will also add to their CV, right? I mean, for me, for example, if I, if I get a PhD, the intention is to have something to do in my technical background, which was in genetics. And not work at Starbucks. So though that kind of barrier to entry has really gone up, additionally, I think what has also gone up is the challenge of work permit filings because international students here automatically automatically get the post graduation work permit. So they for the employers. they're not very selective. So for them, it's an additional pressure because it's kind of like an open work permit. So you're employable anywhere. But the challenge becomes because your employer has no liability towards you, because you're kind of on your own, it becomes challenging to convince the employer of your worth to stay or to hire you because you're sort of self-sponsored. The PG kind of makes you self-sponsored. On the contrary, it's much easier for an employer to hire a local person without having to go through the hectic pressure of filing extra paperwork.

So you've gone back and you've realized that India, it's much more lucrative and much more practical to be in India, right? So, Akhun, when you're in India, we can also talk in Bengali for the lot of people who are Watching in Bengali. I'm sure the ones who are watching in who doesn't understand Bengali will catch up a little bit, and we'll try to put subtitles. So Kolkata, how did you how did you match up, or what difficulties did you face initially?

So honestly, there is a change in the lifestyle pace. Life in Western nations usually is a lot faster than it is out. And Kolkata, चीरो का लिए I'm an actor, so हो जाए एक तो nostalgic, एक तो slow. ecoculturally inclined. So Kolkata always has that flavor of slowness. However, because like I said, I was initially there for a PhD, but then I chose to relocate, I made sure before relocating, some kind of offer in hand. So I relocated with a job offer in hand with a think tank. It's a startup in India that I currently work as the Director of Operations. I head government affairs. That's my vertical.

That's great.

So I have had the good fortune that I now work with various government agencies based out of Delhi.

So mind me interrupting, how did you get this job? Because a lot of people will want to know how you got this offer beforehand, before moving to India.

So I think that's something I want to cover. So a lot of— so what I think right now, the West is a very saturated market right now. is work experience abroad, because India is a growing market, is trying to attract a lot of funding, attention, as well as interest from groups abroad. So anybody who has some kind of leverage, such as work experience abroad, study experience abroad, is actually a very favorable candidate for a lot of agencies.

Okay.

Now, because I was already in a PhD, I was Yes, I was getting technical skills. But additionally, I was also doing a lot of work in terms of policy research. I was volunteering in Canada, I was working with the Dean's Office. So I had a lot of project management and implementation skills. Now, those kinds of transferable skills are very much in demand in India.

Okay.

Because not a lot of people, the Indian education system per se, does not equip students with those kinds of skills. But having lived abroad, worked abroad, and having dealt with different kinds of people, usually who want to come abroad or want to relocate back, expats have these extra skill sets. So I use that as leverage to find such an option where they would be looking for people who have work experience abroad. They have understanding of both kinds of climate. So they have the understanding of the Indian landscape and the Canadian landscape per se. So which means you, you have the negotiation power, the strategic thinking to be able to communicate with clients.

So it's basically for you, it is basically working from home, though you have to go to work sometimes. Is it hybrid situation in India too?

Hybrid situation. Most of my work is done from home. So I'm based out of Kolkata at the moment. However, because I work with a lot of these government think tanks, I do occasionally travel to Delhi.

How is the pay structure compared to Canada? And do you feel any kind of regret in letting go of the pay structure that is here in Canada?

Honestly, I don't think so, because I think there are a couple of things that one has to consider, is that the cost of living is very different in the 2 countries. Yeah, so the Canadian, uh, pay structure is usually at par for sustaining a middle-income lifestyle in Canada.

Yeah.

But the same is true for India. The fact that you have experience abroad, it actually means you can negotiate a higher price for yourself. So that's one point. So if you do a ratio, there's not much of a difference between the Canadian pricing point and the Indian pricing point. In terms of affording a lifestyle.

Okay.

So you can afford a similar lifestyle. In terms of, of course, the dollar has a lot more purchasing power than the rupee, so that difference is always going to stay. But there are a couple of plus points. A, you get better exposure. B, you can climb up the ladder, the so-called corporate ladder or the career ladder, relatively faster than you can in a foreign land as an international candidate. Uh, people have a lot more flexibility in allowing, uh, different kinds of viewpoints here because it's an expanding market. So they're trying to make room for all kinds of viewpoints. So you have a lot more— the market is unsaturated, so you have a lot more scope. Um, and additionally, if you are somebody— for me, for example, I did want to prioritize being close to my family. I did want to prioritize that I, even if I have to stay and work in Delhi, I should be able to have the flexibility to travel home as and when the situation demands.

Yeah. One thing struck me that you said climbing the ladder in India is easier than in here. But apparently, when we moved in, the situation was different. It was just the opposite. In India, climbing the ladder was much difficult and the work ambience was Work ambience was much complicated. Here it was much more simple. So now you're saying it's just the opposite. Now, like—

Yes, I think, I think a part of it has to do with immigration policies of the government. So because the government is really cracking down on immigration at the moment, and right now I think the Canadian economy is somewhat in a recession, in a recessionary mode.

Yeah, post-COVID. Yeah.

Yes, so I think that is a situation where the government is really trying to control its spending, and that always trickles down to normal public life. Yeah, normal common people are getting at the end of the day pay the price. So I think that's what's happening at the moment. However, India is on a different trajectory. We're a growing economy. Our GDP is expanding. There is not a significant slowdown in terms of post-COVID. I mean, of course, there was a slump during COVID years, but right now that is picking up pace. Second, because of the elections and the political climate, there's a buoyancy in the markets.

Yeah. So do you mean to say now you don't have to, you know, cater to your boss's needs the way it was back when we were working, you know, the a typical boss thing factor was there, and you had to stay back in office for a long period of time to project the fact that you're working. You know, we had those kind of work ambience. And is it still— you mean to say those ambience are still not there anymore?

That's actually shifting a lot. That is there in a couple of sectors, but it's shifting a lot, especially in aspects such as policymaking or think tanks, or startups, or in general, unless you're in a very bureaucratic structure, which is, for example, a typical government office.

Yeah.

Other than that, a lot of these structures are becoming flexible.

That's really very refreshing to know that.

And in fact, I mean, if people will be interested to know, there are a lot of these initiatives that the government now takes in terms of like Startup India, Invest India, etc. where a lot of verticals are available and people work. And those are fairly flexible roles which do not distinguish between academic credentials. Earlier, it used to be the higher up you have in terms of an academic credential, the more likely you'll get the job. Now, sometimes people also consider your work experience and your diversity of experience over just an academic degree.

Okay, that's such a refreshing change.

It's a refreshing change.

Yeah. So how are you finding the transportation, the heat, the heat, which is so, so much talked about? How are you finding— how are you being able to cope up with the heat and the pollution, if there is any pollution now?

I think that's definitely a lifestyle challenge. I have faced it because the pollution levels are really high. compared to Canada. I definitely took around 2 months to get used to it. Yeah, the heat has been— because India has been undergoing a heat wave this summer, so that has been a challenge. Yeah, but other than that, I think infrastructure-wise, transportation is great because right now I would say I'm based out of Kolkata, and Kolkata has, um, uh, it has an underwater metro line.

Yeah.

At the moment. Under the River Ganges. So transportation has massively improved.

And the buses are all AC buses, it seems.

Yeah, the offices have at-par infrastructure as one would expect in a Western country. Yeah, so I think transportation-wise, ease of access-wise, most metro cities now operate on a developed economy level. especially cities like Delhi, Gurgaon, in the north, which are very close to the capital, they operate, or even down south, places like Bangalore and Chennai, they operate at par with a developed nation city.

Yeah.

However, certain tier 2 cities might have challenges, or tier 3 cities might have challenges, but infrastructure is something which is really booming. So over the next 5 to 7 years, we might see some positive change.

Yeah. So what about the healthcare, that free healthcare that Indians have, that people have to leave behind? And, you know, because India, as far as healthcare is concerned and emergency situation concerned, India is still staggering. So what do you think about that? How will you cope with that?

So one very important distinction here is that the Canadian system is publicly funded. So, of course, the state takes care of your expenses when there is an emergency. However, if it is not an emergency, if it's a chronic illness or something, which is a more long-term sort of challenge, then that becomes a problem. Because I personally have been a researcher in the healthcare system, and the healthcare system is overburdened. Because it serves a large number of domestic and international individuals. And right now, immigration has really pushed the limit there.

Yeah.

The con of being in the Indian healthcare system is that it is not— the public funding system is not up to the mark. So most people opt for privatized healthcare, which means most expenses are out of pocket. But it also means that the system is more responsive because there are options to have privatized support, access to faster healthcare and immediate attention, even if it is not an emergency, should you be able to afford it. And most people, if they're looking to relocate back and re-immigrate, it's not a challenge for them monetarily.

Okay, now the final question I want to ask you is, since we're running out of time, do you think all this is related to the present government? And now that the election is coming up, If there is a government change or government, do you think India is going to collapse? It's going to have a meltdown or something?

I think, right, I wouldn't comment on it saying that it's because of a government, because I think it's the system that's in place. The system has been improved. There's a lot less bureaucracy right now. The momentum which is there, at the end of the day, I think every country irrespective of government is driven by the economy and the market speed. And the momentum which India right now has, it is something which can be sustained over the medium to long term, at least for the next 5-7 years. So even if the elections, nobody knows the outcome, whatever, whichever party wins, whatever is the outcome, I think the momentum right now would be something which is sustained. There's a lot of investment, foreign investments out here. There's a lot of interest in the Indian market. because of our size and the population.

Yeah.

There's a push to recognize India as an alternative supplier in the East.

Yeah.

So all of these are market conditions which are really favorable for us. So of course, one cannot take away the credit that the current government has put in to achieve this, but I think the momentum in general is, especially Places like the Middle East, India in general, the Global South is expanding. We're living in a multipolar world, so sooner or later we'll have to come to terms with it. It's not just the East and the West anymore.

Yeah, I'm really happy to know that you have really settled down in India and you're going to inspire a lot of people who are still on the brink, you know, on the edge whether they want to go back or be here. I hope we've covered all their questions. Whatever they want to ask, majorly I think about the maybe the you know the obstacles that we face want to we are we are plan we are expecting to face the temperature, the climate, the pollution, and the bureaucracy bureaucracy that India faced a lot earlier. So I hope we have been able to you know clarify to them a lot. And it was really nice chatting with you.

The one statement I'll put towards people is having that courage to make that decision. Yeah. Once you make up your mind, the only way forward is never to look back.

Yeah. So in future, we are kind of expecting India to grow back its population even further, bigger than the current, you know, largest— being the largest populated country in the world, because all the NRIs and experts are planning to go there if they're planning to go back. India is going to have a huge population to handle. And on that note, on that positive, very positive note, okay, Kuheli, thank you so much for your, for you being there and really, really inspiring a lot of youngsters to go back to India. Thank you.

Thank you for giving me this opportunity and have a wonderful, wonderful day and good luck to everyone who's looking to remigrate.

Yes. Yes. Thank you.