Finding Brave 144: How To Cultivate and Amplify The Best Stories For Your Brand, with Justin Brady

Oh, hello, everybody. Welcome to this episode of Finding Brave. How are you doing? How is everything going? It's been one heck of a ride, hasn't it, for all of us. There's silver linings, there's suffering. It's been something else. I tend to focus on the silver linings because that's how I stay holding it together. But I'd love to hear from you about how things are going for you right now when this comes out. And I'm so, so excited. You just hang on to your hats, people. Justin Brady's in the house. Woo. And first of all, what a voice. You're just gonna love it. And Justin, I was on Justin's show. Was that a month ago now that that came out? Justin.

Well, first of all, thanks for having me, Kathy. I don't know when that they all blend in together.

I know they do. I have to listen.

I have no idea.

Again, you know, what did we say? But I remember it was in the middle of my book launch. The questions you asked were so there's not much that stumps me generally in terms of what I generally talk about. You asked me questions that I had to just pull back and say, wow, I've never even thought of that. And I. What a mind you have. So thank you for.

I'm sure my mom's proud.

All right, people, let me tell you about Justin and what we're talking about today. Justin can talk about a lot of things. Communication and culture, leadership. You've interviewed so many illustrious people. How many? What episode are you on on your show, the Justin Brady show. Again, you don't know?

I have no idea. It's at least, I mean, I could check, but it's at least a couple hundred or probably more than that.

You've done a lot in a couple hundred, you know, just the most interesting people. But we are going to nail down this topic. How we communicate for our small businesses or mid sized businesses and our brands to cultivate the people we really want to serve and also amplify our voice, amplify our message. Is that right? Did I get that right? Is that what you focus on, especially for emerging tech organizations?

Yeah, yeah. My bread and butter is emerging tech companies. And the whole point of what I do is I cultivate really good stories, what makes them unique and I amplify that to the world, ideally to millions upon millions of people. So. And like, yeah, I do it for emerging tech companies. You asked before we started recording why emerging tech companies?

Yeah, I didn't get the answer, did I?

Oh, that's right. You didn't. Well, first of all, they're cool. They do cool stuff. But the real reason is so many times I interact with emerging tech companies, it's this company that solved an incredible problem that's extremely difficult to solve and it blows your mind. But because they are a problem solver and they're so focused on this solution, what they're not focused on and not. Not naturally good at is connecting that idea to the people, to people in mass.

Wow.

The best example of this is there is a company called Martin Bionics I worked with for a period. And long story short, they worked on NASA's like exoskeleton spacesuit stuff. And then they worked with a Seal Team 6 Talos project. I guess the Navy Seals were working on an Iron man suit.

Oh, wow.

And it was this sock. It was this technology that fit hard surfaces and armor and stuff to people, and people are all different sizes. And so very long story short, they figured out a way to put this into amputee technology. Really, really amazing stuff. So if you know any amputees, go check out Martin Bionics. It'll blow your mind. It's fabric based socket technology. And so one of the things they were talking about early on was like, oh, older sockets are like hard. And the socket we have is fabric. It flexes, it moves with you. And we're having a really tough time communicating that. And a lot of people were like, they heard fabric socket. That sounds really weak. It sounds flimsy.

Socket. You mean like a socket?

Yeah, something. Yeah, that holds on the prosthetic. Yeah, they call that a socket or they, you know, some people call it a bucket. I think they might be wrong on that. Okay, long story short, fabric sounds bad. And they were using the image of, oh, it's like a hammock. Because comfortable, like. Yeah, but hammock is also unstable.

Yeah, No, I don't want a swinging limb.

Right. No one wants to swing and be unstable. So the one of the things we worked with them on at the time was let's, let's just use like old technologies. Like a wooden shoe, like a Dutch wooden shoe. It does the job. It's stable, but it's uncomfortable. And what you have is the tennis shoe.

Metaphor. It's an image that we get that's desirable.

Right, exactly. So it's, you know, people like Jay, the owner of Martin Bionics is a mega genius. And he's amazing at solving problems and helping people and doing so at a great cost. He's Incredible. But, you know, they bring in other people to help them communicate that. And so that's what I do for emerging tech companies.

I love that.

And pr. I mean, I get them in the press and I get them found. Search. So when you search for something and it pops up, it's because I made sure it popped up there.

You know what I love about that? Lately I've been talking a lot with guests about values, our core values. And you know, I'm a career coach. So often I'm helping people understand in your career you're not just doing a functional job, you are also contributing to outcomes. And either they're going to marry up with your values or they're not. And it's really not too happy when you don't. You're killing yourself. And the outcome of that company is not something you align with. Sounds like one of your values is. Let me amplify voices that are making a real positive difference in the world.

Yeah, yeah, amplify, amplify Stories. And you know, every, every company has incredible stories and most people don't believe that. Like they'll say, oh, our people make the difference. But then when you really dig past the surface, you realize they actually believe that. But it is true. Like, every company does have some incredible stories to tell. They really, really do. But most don't see it.

All right, so let's dig in. So, you know, let's have the audience be. You can be just starting your business. It can be a mid to small, the mid to large size business. Can you start me with. And we didn't script this. I'm really just asking because I'm fascinated. What do you see are the biggest communication errors or branding errors that companies make? What are they, how are they really messing it up?

Well, as far as, I mean, I'll let branding experts talk about the branding, but as far as communications, what they're really, really screwing up is they just kind of, they get in their own heads and like the very first question a lot of CMOs and CEOs ask is, well, I'll actually tell this in the form of a story. I worked with a company, they're called Accumul. I still work with them. They're my longest client. And their cmo, Aaron, awesome dude, he, he said something about don't waste any time on PR with us because no one cares. They're a, they make microscopic thermoplastic little parts like, for stuff like this and stuff like this. I'm NDA through the nose, so I can't Tell you who they make it through but make it for. But it's amazing technology. And when I say microscopic, it is microscopic. And they, in their mind, they were way too far removed from the customer. Like, no one's going to cover us in the press.

Were they fine with that or they wanted you to help them with that?

I've known Aaron for a while, so he's like, don't waste time on that. I'm like, I'm going to do it anyway. And then I got their CEO Roger Hargens on Bloomberg in two months, so. Or something like that. Two, three months, something like that. The first one he canceled because there was like this thing that came up. I'm like, oh my gosh, we're canceling on Bloomberg. But it was a live interview in Manhattan in their headquarters. It was really, really cool. Bloomberg Markets AM radio and I think it's like 5 million listeners, something like that. And the thing is, it wasn't no one. Like a lot of tech CEOs, a lot of CMOs are like, well, no one's just going to cover our technology or our thing we do. You know, it's. The smart ones think that some people believe in like the mousetrap myth. Like, this is the coolest thing anyone's ever seen. All I need to do is show it to a journalist and they'll freak out. That's never gonna happen. So, you know, in this case, in this case, it was the other problem. Like Aaron is he's so objective. He really gets it. And he's like, no. And he's a former radio guy. And so he's like, no one's gonna care. And the thing was, we pitched. We didn't pitch the here microscopic parts. How cool is that? Because like he said, no one cares. What we pitched was as soon as PIM Fox, the host markets am, said he made some comment about and skilled trades, blah, blah, blah, and no one's figured out how to fill the trades gap. That's what that was, his comment. And as soon as he said that, as soon as I heard it on the podcast, I emailed him and said accumult has figured that out. Here's what they're doing. And then I massage that interview over the next couple months and really they talked about skilled trades, but then they talked about how cool Accumuld was for like a long time. It was really, really awesome. So it comes down to these little stories that everybody has that they don't even think are special. Another example from Acumen.

Wait, can I Stop. I need to highlight something that I. You did. That I want people to listen to. So when you said, you know, so many people think this new thing that I created is whatever.

Oh, yeah.

And I'll hear that. Will you cover us in Forbes? Two things they don't do. They've never read one piece that I've ever written. They don't have any desire to fill any gaps that I have in what I'm covering.

Right.

Number two, they make them. And I want to know if this is accurate from your perspective. Number two, they make the mistake that the standalone thing that this company or you, the coach, or you the consultant, or you, the author have done is enough to get attention. And it isn't. I don't care.

No. It rarely is. Right. It might be.

Maybe.

If it'll. You know, I always told driverless cars.

You know.

Right. If it's something mind blowing. Right. It might be. But even then, if it's something mind blowing, a true journalist probably isn't gonna believe you anyway. Yeah.

So, you know, I'll wait till someone else covers it because I think it's too good to be true or crazy or. You're insane.

Yes. And this is what's funny is so many journalists are like, I want to break the news, but then they actually want someone else to cover it first. But. And that's the difference between, like, someone who covers that beat and someone who does more commentary or leadership practices. Totally different things. But I tell marketing people and companies, think about. Think about it like a match game. Like, think about your press strategy as a match game. You know, you've probably played, like, a match game where there are cards on this side and cards on the other side and they have the same images and you try to find matches. Yeah. So I always say, act like you have a deck at your company, and the world of journalism has another deck. So really, your goal is twist over the best story in your company, find the best story in your company, flip some cards, go digging. Go finding that best story, and then go digging in journalist land and magazine land and TV land and radio land and find the card that matches. In other words, find that journalist who's already writing about what you do or your topic area. So it's not about, like, so many people. Just blast these pitches. You probably get gotten these.

I get 500amonth.

Yeah. And sometimes they forget to put your name in there.

Oh, no.

Hello, comma, hello, comma, delete.

Let me just ask this, though. Do you think that if the CEO had been hearing that Bloomberg report about the skilled trade, the trades gap, skill trades gap. Would he connect it to what his company is doing? I don't think so.

It's hard to say. And yeah, it's hard to say.

So I think another thing I'm trying to highlight is if you really don't have a big PR team and you're doing this yourself, people, but. Or hire Justin, also listen for the creative ways you are filling a need that has been discussed. Yeah, it may not be the way you view your business, but yeah, jump into the conversation.

Rather than trying to strangle someone and bring them over to your side, jump into an existing conversation that's already happening and I guarantee you it's already happening. There was a new, new client who I just started with and I can't talk a lot about what we're up to, but one angle we played up, they're in the Midwest and one angle we played up was Midwest startups, which is. Wow. Yeah, we found journalists that wanted to write on that. It ended up getting some interest.

Wow. All right, so we're talking first about blunders. Blunders. You know, speak about this if you would, Justin, because I see it happen a lot. I cover in Forbes and my podcast a wide range of stuff. But what I find is if I do something like I did recently, I featured an amazing 21 year old award winning entrepreneur and when you read what she has done, Ananya Jain, she's exceptional and extraordinary in 50,000 different ways. But instantly, literally instantly after we ran that, I got 20 different pitches from people I represent or I am 19 and I've done this. What do you think about that? Like if. So I'm looking for a tip here. If you read something that you think, oh, if they wrote about that, maybe they'll write about my client. Do you hit them one second later with your.

But it has to be relevant, right? Like it has to be relevant like the fact someone's age and being successful, that's not good enough. It has to be really relevant to the focus topic area. So like, for example, I see this happen too because I've written for some places too, like you have. So I probably see a lot of the same pitches. But for example, if I'm writing about emerging tech innovations and creativity or something and I happen to write about like a grocery store now I'm going to get a lot of pitches for people talking about grocery stores like that. They didn't, they may have saw there, they may have read a few keywords, but they didn't actually bother going to my website or reading stuff I actually wrote. If they would have done that, they would have said, oh, this guy doesn't write about grocery stores. He writes about emerging tech companies and the grocery store just happened to be a subject in the story.

There you go. So there, there's the tip I'm pulling out. You know, I know you're excited and I've made the mistake in my earlier years of just publicizing something because I thought it was so exciting about what I was doing. And I, boy, did I get some slap down just because I'm a new therapist. Nobody cares.

Yeah. And I do the same thing. Like, I get excited, you know, I still make mistakes from time to time. I still send things. And like, I think the other day Jonathan, Jonathan Schreiber at TechCrunch like sent me an email back and he's like, he's, he's very, very direct and he's basically in a very kind way said, this is really stupid. Once you have something new, let me know. And I was like, well, that was.

Nice of him that he said commented versus delete in half a second.

Totally agree. I totally agree.

And I'm sure he'll publish the next one. All right, what else can we talk about in terms of, you know, you say, you talk about unique ideas and let us talk for a minute about culture if we can, because you said earlier external communications is not that different from internal communications in a culture is. Can you talk about that for a minute?

Yeah. I mean, when it comes to the core, right, Tactically of course, it's different, but basically it comes down to ext. And I'm sorry, everybody, I have like allergies today, so I'm like all stuffed up. So I don't normally sound like I'm sound good to me, I don't normally sound like that. Man, that really screwed me up. Okay, so the same problems are made in internal communications and external communications. Like in external communications, the problem is we don't value our own stories and our own messages in our own people and what they believe enough. Therefore we don't think it's worthy of covering. And it absolutely is. Again, going back to Accumuld, they also wrote one of their sustainability guys, their goal was to be zero waste. And when you're a manufacturing company, like especially doing injection molding, there are a lot of like, remnants and they he. This guy figured it out. It's like an impossible solution because they're also working in very exotic, different resins and plastics and he actually figured this out. It was an impossible solution. He actually ended up creating. Helping a vendor of theirs create a business model so he could sell them recycled plastic. Like, insane guy. His name's Matt Iverson. And we could not get anyone to run this. I thought it was the coolest thing ever.

It's so inspiring. And if he can do it for his business, I'm thinking he can help other businesses do this, right?

Yeah. It's so inspiring. And no journalist wanted to touch it because it was just kind of technical and we couldn't bring it down to. I just. I don't know what the hang up was. We couldn't get it done. And so I said to him, I was like, matt, I feel like I can't sum this up in a way where any journalist is ever going to run it. And it's going to maybe take me a while to figure it out. So can you just write the piece and we're going to run it as an op ed. And he's like, well, who the heck is going to run that? I said, I think someone will. And so eventually courts ran it and it was the amount of exposure they got on that was incredible.

But like, so the guy writes too. Matt is a writer as well. Like, he could write the story.

Well, he did write a lot, and it wasn't hard. But I. For a lot of my clients, I have them write. I just tell them, write crap. Write a pile of crap. I'll go through and edit it and clean it up. You just get the idea out of your head. That's your job. And so that's what he did. And frankly, his writing was pretty darn good. So I didn't have to do a ton. But again, the problem there was not the problem at Accumul. But here's this guy that's not a C level person. He's the warehouse manager. This is his job. But he is the one who figured this out. And so Accumul's leadership is like, yeah, sure, have him write, let's publish it, whatever. Like, they understood that all people's ideas have value. So they get that right? So that's like, you know, not understanding value, external communications. But internally, I see ideas constantly pop up in an organization that are truly valuable and very well could be the next billion dollar idea. And leadership is just totally. They have the not invented here problem within the. It's not a C level person. It's not someone who has the technical knowledge. So therefore it's. It's stupid. And if you heard on my podcast, three, four weeks ago, Cliff Hudson, the CEO, former CEO of Sonic Drive Ins, he had a franchisee in a market that was doing their. Their whole frozen drinks program. Like that was invented by a franchisee. And some leadership in the company literally told this franchisee, shut it down. This is not ordained by the company. And he's like, no, please don't do that. I'm making so much revenue. They're like, no, you got to shut it down. And so finally he appealed to Cliff, the CEO at the time.

What a story.

And Cliff's like, okay, you know what's. Tell me what's going on? And he told him the idea. He's like, all right, and how much revenue are you making off this? And he like, totally fell. He said, I almost fell off my chair when he told me. And so I don't know the data off the top of my head, but I want to say it was like 30% or it ended up being like a billion dollar idea.

And this in. This person invented some frozen drink.

Yeah, frozen drink program. Like all the slushies and frozen drinks programs that like, Sonic's kind of known for. Oh, my franchisee guy's idea. Right. And so, you know, you and I, Kathy, know that like, brilliance comes in different forms throughout the entire vertical, like throughout the entire company structure. But so many people get the idea that this person doesn't have the experience. And they haven't been doing this forever. So it's not, it's not like people think this person's an idiot. It's just that, well, they don't have this kind of experience, so they don't understand the unique aspect of the problem. And it's the same problem with external communications. Not believing in the unique stories and unique angles and the unique abilities of your people is the same problem with external and internal communications. Same thing. Internally, it leads to bigger, better ideas that make you money. Externally, it leads to press and headlines and people finding you in search engines.

I love this. Can I ask you this? You might not say you feel like you're an expert, but I think you are. When I hear that story. I mean, I spent 18 years in corporate and I have some biases against it. One of them is, you know, if you didn't follow protocol, we can't even listen to the idea. And some of that is such laziness. Some of it is such narrow mindedness in the box. So you were kind and said, you know, someone might think, well, you don't really have the experience to have a billion dollar idea. But I think I ascribe kind of worse tendencies than that, which is.

Oh sure, you know, you're totally right.

You didn't follow this, this, this, you didn't do this. Do you have any tips for how we, in our own businesses, when we have people that are working for us creating things, how we can excavate or identify wonderful ideas? Do you have any ideas about that?

Yeah. So it's, I mean, really simple. It's just like bring a notebook and shut up. It's. It is really. And you know, ask follow up questions, listen, dig, ask follow up questions. Leave room for silence, write stuff down. I mean, even if you're writing gibberish, the other person across from you feels listened to when they see you writing stuff down. And I think so many. And I did this. I totally did this. But the three keys are. Well, I'll tell you what I did. I was a terrible listener. I was. Empathy was kind of low on my priority list. I was not very trusting. And I realized these were.

When was this? When was this? Recently.

I don't know, I haven't dated where I kind of came up with a Solution. It was 2012. I wrote a piece in the Wall Street Journal. I think it was 2012.

Wow, Justin.

And it was about some companies foster creativity, others fake it. And it led. And it basically came from this, this whole thing I used to bring a notebook to. I started a graphic design company. So when you see the piece, you'll notice Test of time design. That's his since closed. I made some big mistakes and stupid mistakes and realized I was really slow at design. So I pivoted over to this stuff, which I'm a lot better at. It's more fun. But at the time I was running into a problem. And the problem was I would go into a meeting with clients and I would work, work, work, work, work, and show them what I came up with. And they'd shoot it down and like it would cost me more money and time. And so I was like, what is the problem here? Like, I feel like it's an ego thing. I feel like they just want to get their two cents in there. And so I created this brilliant solution. The brilliant solution was I was going to bring a notebook and I was going to ask them as many questions as possible, right down to their favorite toothpaste. And then when I reveal the product, the project to them, I would not allow them to speak because I would attribute the project to their ideas.

Like, was it ever from their ideas?

Oh, yeah. Oh, oh, okay. I didn't know that. So you're already getting ahead of me. You totally are seeing through this. I didn't even see it myself. And so I just figured it started working. It started working really well. I was making more money, things were going faster, clients were more happy. But what I didn't realize is I wasn't really fooling them at all. What had happened is I had trained myself to be a better listener and I didn't even realize. So that's why I say, wait a.

Minute, let me understand. You came in and went, whatever the heck, this is not working. Let me go in there, take notes, pretend I'm listening, and I'm going to go off and do the thing I was normally going to do. But really, you were really listening.

Well, that is. Yeah, it is, it is. My motivation was I'm just going to tie any arbitrary thing to this design.

Mine's toothpaste, mine is white. Let's do it.

Well, yeah, I mean, so like your favorite color is blue. So as you see, the background's blue. I figured, you know, I'll just attribute these things to them and that'll take the ego thing off the table. And now, now they have ownership and now they're not going to criticize it. And it worked. But it worked because I was truly listening to them and asking great follow up questions and taking lots of notes and internalizing what they believe. And so in design, you'll hear a lot of designers say, everyone thinks they're a designer. Everybody thinks they're. But people are like, people do know deep down inside what it feels like to be right and what something should look like. The problem is there's a breakdown in communication when they try to communicate that to you. That's the problem. It's not necessarily that their ideas are bad. It's that they don't know how to communicate emotional and intangible stuff. So the best way is to write things down, listen, ask follow up questions, and never, ever, ever be thinking about your next question.

Oh, like I'm, I'm riveted.

What? I'm riveted because like me, if I forget, like sometimes I feel like I'm going to forget a good question.

Yeah.

Like if someone's talking and I'm like.

I have to, I jot down a word. Like, go back.

I gotta, I gotta rush that in there. And. But you, your strategy, what you just talked about, is perfect. What I do is I write that question down or I'll actually say, hey, you said something interesting. I'm just gonna write a note for myself. Hold on. Okay. Please keep going. You know, it's so simple, but it works so, so well. I'm also spitting at this camera and maybe it's like a 3D effect.

I thought it was. Can I amplify what I'm hearing? Justin, how are we doing on time? Oh, my God. I could talk to you forever. When you said that, what ran through my mind was a lot of people will say, kathy, you're. I mean, big names will say that was the most fun or best interview I've had about my book. And other people will say, how do you do it? And I'll say, I'm literally listening at the edge of my seat every time. But when I want to learn, I don't have an agenda. I'm like, what? What did he just say? And I'm comfortable enough to go wherever the heck you're taking it. I mean, yes, sometimes I'll want to throw something in, but. But it did occur to me I had to learn this in coaching. It's. I am 100% listening to what you have to say and I am going to take it. I have a process, I have a methodology, and we are going to go there in coaching. But first, I am asking you a million questions. And it is from curiosity to inform what I am going to do. Curiosity. I think so many people. I don't know what happened. Why are so many people. They've eclipsed the curiosity question. I think you even mentioned in your notes what happened that we can't across divides. What happened to curiosity in our world, in our country? Okay, I'm making it way big, but let's go back. Is that right that you actually. I think in external communications, internal communications design, leading your company, it's got to be first about curiosity, about what they are thinking, what they need. Am I right on that?

Yeah, I mean, sure. Of course you're right, Kathy. Of course you're right. It's. That works for both sides. It works for like if I'm. If I'm wanting press from you, I'm going to lead with natural curiosity. Right. Things that I think you're. The only reason I'm going to figure that out about you is if I read your stuff and do some research.

And not just perfunctorily, but, oh, what's she about?

Right, right, right. And by the way, this is like the number one way to get like communications and like, well, search engine traffic through communications. Like again here. This is another area that so many People want to make so technical. Like, they want to talk about Semrush and Ahrefs and all these tools and all these technical things because they want to feel like, if I just get this tool, it'll make me great at search engine optimization. And the fact of the matter is the best search engine strategy, like, if you're out there and you're like, I want people to find me via Google, it's really, really easy.

It's really, listen up, people.

It's again, it comes back to listen to your customers, right? Listen to the question they ask. Write down the question exactly as they asked it. Write a blog post answering that question. It doesn't have to be super technical. You don't need all the fancy tools. You need to just listen. And, and the thing is it, you need to be constantly aware when you're interacting with clients or even aware when you're at a cocktail party or not on the clock. Someone might say, what do you do? And you're like, oh, great, the what do you do? Question. And then you start talking to them and then they ask a really good question, and you're like, whoa, that was a good. You know, people, I call it mining customer curiosity. Because, like, when you mine customer curiosity, that is a gold mine. It is. It is pure gold.

I'm shaking my head because I'm about to redo this podcast website. And I reached out to a few people and one person said, you know, let's get all your Google Analytics. And I'm like, okay, great. I frankly didn't need to do that. I know what. So I've written 10 articles that have gotten, whatever, 8 million views. Those are the articles that people are writing to me about every minute of the day. It's what they're interested in. I don't. I mean, yes, data is important. I'm a researcher. Data is important. So you're not winging it. But if you're really listening to people, you shouldn't be shocked at what the analytics are showing. Don't you agree?

I totally agree. I mean, and there are surprises. Sometimes there are things that start to go up the ranking. You're like, how many people are interested in this? But, you know, again, reading, reading data can in a way kind of complement your listening strategy. Right? But, but I do agree. Like some people's search engine optimization tactics are they look at competitors keywords, and then they go after those things. And I'm like, well, I mean, that, that does work. If you're selling a product that's not that imaginative and doesn't really solve any problems. And it's just like another tennis shoe. Like, then, yeah, you have to compete over competitor keywords. Which is probably why I only work in emerging tech, because I don't have to worry about competitors. Like, none of my clients really have competitors. My. My clients only competitors is in a good, like, ignorance of the product.

Yeah, yeah.

And not believing it does what it does, which is almost a harder product or harder sell. Because you can't say, well, we're selling a tennis shoe. Nike or Under Armour. Shoe stinks. And so we're making a better shoe. Here's why you don't have that. You have to say, oh, this problem, we solved it. People like, no, you didn't. Wow.

Fascinating. All right, now lead us to what's the final thing? Let's talk about personal brand building. If you have a few more minutes, Justin.

Sure.

So if we put in mind the listeners that many that I hear from that, let's say they're leaving corporate life and they want to do something. Consult or private practice. They want to be a coach, they want to be a therapist, they want to have a lifestyle business. Oh, my gosh. You know, I don't know. Are you on Instagram?

No. I mean, I. I don't. My account might still be up there.

I just. I bring that up because, you know, interesting. I want to know why. But, you know, I've got a rockin following on LinkedIn. That's my happy place. Little less so on Twitter, a little less so on Facebook. And I'm competitive. Like, wait a minute, let me get on instant and see what I can do. And wow. It's a whole different. Whole different world. But the thing that I see over and over because I train coaches is they have no concept of how they're different, what their niche is, what they really want to do. And in this case, I don't think it's what you're talking about that they just don't see themselves as different. I think they haven't developed anything different, many of them. And I don't mean to be unkind, but, like, for instance, you can't write a leadership book today and expect it to be a bestseller. And you're not. You don't have any new data, any new information. I mean, there's a lot of leadership experts from the history of time. So you do have to kind of get hip to your own inner narcissist. You know what I mean?

Yeah. It's hard.

What am I saying? I'm Rambling. Oh, so personal brands. What would you do with. With a brand that actually you don't think has a unique selling proposition, that really they're not doing anything?

I mean, it's the same thing for a company, right? They don't think they have any unique stories. So they go digging and they find them. You have to go digging into yourself and that this isn't like some, like New agey religious fluffery. Like there, there is a lot of people have these deep ideas that they've suppressed because they think they're alone. They think they're the only one who thinks that. And so they hide that stuff and they don't take. Talk about it out in the open. And then finally someone does talk about it out in the open. And it's usually that person that once they see it, gains enough traction, kind of retweets it or shares it or talks to their friends saying, well, I was saying that in the 90s. And it's like, then why didn't you say it? You had a lot of people ready to hear that message.

Clearly you would have a million followers now if you did it right. Like, all right, I'm going to challenge this. Justin, can I. Where I was going is I think you can get buzz, but let's say you're starting out as a coach. If you don't have shops that are different, I think, I think. Okay, let me rephrase. If you have, we dig deep and you have a story, like, for me, you know, my story, 18 year corporate career, it was a mess. I faced a lot of crises. Reinvented marriage and family, therapy, you know, writing, speaking, training. And then seeing why are so many thousands of women facing the same thing. So I've written a lot about it in language that I think speaks to women, speaks to people. But it's not enough. If I want a robust coaching practice and training practice, it's not enough that I'm writing about it. People need help to overcome these challenges, so I have to have chops that do that. What I'm seeing in some of these new brands is they might even have a sizzling story, but they don't have the chops behind the sizzle. Does this make sense too?

Yeah. Yeah. Results matter.

Results matter.

Like, and as hard as that is, no one cares about your theory or your ideas. They want. They want tangible stuff.

Have you ever worked with a client that you were able to get them? No. You wouldn't take them on? Probably.

No, probably not.

You're taking on clients that have Made a real impact.

Right. Right. Yeah.

Well, would you say it is a new brand that says, I mean this is what I hear. I don't know how I'm different and, and I'm not. I don't think I am. What do you do with that?

I'm. I mean, if it's a company that truly isn't doing anything unique, you know, if it was a company. Right. They don't, they have a product that's truly not unique, then it's not a communication problem, it's a product problem. Like there's nothing any brilliant marketer can do in the world that's going to help you. But if it's an internal, if it's a person and they're offering themselves on the same platter that everybody else is. Yeah. There's. You have zero hope of getting that message heard. If you're the same as everybody else and you're just trying to get better press or get better attention or, you know, the only hope you have at that point is drop hundreds of thousands of dollars in advertising and try to outrank people. Right.

Like which I've seen, I've seen that.

Yeah.

So let's say you, it was your sister in law and she wanted, she was starting her coaching practice and you sense that I don't really see much different in what you have as results or product. Would you, what would you, what would be the first thing you would have someone think about to help them get a better product?

Maybe. No, I mean think about again, it comes back to think about what people, who are you trying to help? Who are you trying to solve a problem for?

And if it's everybody, go back to.

The drawing the problem because. And if you are, if you are solving that problem, then that's a great story. But if you're like, oh well, I just want to. And see, I had this problem. Like I was doing design, I was too slow at it. People need design. But I burned myself out because there were people that were better and faster and cheaper.

Marketing design, you mean? Not design, graphic design.

Wow. Yeah. And so I had to. It was a, it was a brutal bloodbath. Like I had to fight every day and it was. Was I just slowly getting pushed back and there was nothing I could do because it just wasn't my thing. It really wasn't. I went to school for it and I was trained and I know good design when I see it, but I was outgunned out, manned out, everything. And you know, there it. I wrote a blog post like 5 reasons you know when to quit. Because everyone says, and here's what's really. I think this is dangerous. You can correct me if I'm wrong. I think the whole never give up thing is really stupid. I think it's really, really dangerous because there are a lot of reasons you should give up. Like, I think I'm gonna riff here because I haven't written down because I forget everything.

We're gonna post. Link to it definitely.

Okay, sure. But like one, one reason is if, like, your health is taking a hit, time to give up. That's not worth it. Your relationships are taking a hit, time to give up. If you're not naturally good at it, if it's just not your thing and no matter how hard you work, because there are some things you're just. I'm not going to be. And I never was going to be an NBA star. This is not in the cards. So, you know, the never give up mentality would probably have like, run me into the grave, you know, I agree with you.

So, and then another thing, I think I wrote a post, I'll link to it. Five things you should never compromise on. One of them is your soul. If every iteration of this thing, you are prostituting yourself, selling your soul and you know, you're, I think you're a walking example of it. So am I. And I think you would agree we can be really good at something we don't enjoy doing in the end, right? And look, look how good you are at this. And you have, have had a radio show. You're very talented. Most of us are multi talented. So to put all the eggs in that one basket and not be flexible and not think, maybe I need a pivot. Like, I think people say, you know, if you have a plan B, you're gonna, you're, you know, sabotaging your plan A. I don't really agree with that. Give everything you got to plan A. But if it's hurting you and it's not working and you're bloodying yourself against.

It, then kill it.

Go to plan A, try.

And the thing is, the plan B might actually become a plan A. That sounds hilarious, but I think you're right. The problem we make is by assuming it was plan A to begin with. You know, like when I started my design company, I asked my dad, like, because he, who is a successful dentist. And I asked him, I was like, did you always know you wanted to be that? He's like, yeah, I did. I was like, what would you have done if that wasn't in the cards. He's like, I, I don't. I always knew that was the thing I was supposed to do and I did it. And I'm. And he loved his job. He loved his job. And so I was like, well, I know this graphic design business is like my thing. I know it will happen. And I just. Because I bought into that, I lied to myself. And now looking back, I was like, my gosh, I am so glad that is dead. And you know, the problem is we have these internal skills, passions and desires and things that make us exciting, but then we try to apply them to the real world somewhere and that's where we make a big mistake usually. And so that's the mistake I made for my first graphic design company. Like, I made the mistake in taking these things, the ability and the desire to help people communicate. But I just did it visually, which wasn't the best fit. I made the wrong jump.

All right, we're going to leave you with this, people. You know, I talk about in. When you're pivoting your career, there's five steps. Step back, let go, say yes, explore it, and then create it smart. The explore piece is the thing nobody even knows how to do. So. So they think I'm miserable in marketing, in corporate life. I want to be graphic designer. But they only project onto it a fantasy of what it is.

Sure, sure.

They haven't tried it on in micro step ways that they're not risking everything, you know, so, you know, it's a Buddhist idea that don't overly attach to any outcome. I've got to make it a success in my graphic design. Yes, you're going to give it your all. But when you overly attach, you just cut out all of those pot opportunities and doors that are screaming to you. But your dad, you know, some people. Was his father a doctor?

No, his father was a milkman.

So he really. Something about dentistry.

Yeah, he like would take pencils and pens and stuff and then like set his stuffed animals on when he was a little kid on chairs and like work on their teeth. Not weird.

How did he even learn what a dent, what a dentist was?

I don't know. I love my dad. He's genius. I love him. But I'm just like, you're working on your stuffed animals as a kid, really?

That was a calling.

My wife is a music teacher and she lined her stuffed animals up on the stairs and would conduct them.

My God. I remember in our basement we had a, a little chalkboard and guess what I was doing on the chalkboard what I was teaching. But. But I have to say, the happiest thing I do is teaching my course. Even though it's coaching, it's teaching. So I don't know what we've really talked about here, but it's everything. And what are you going to leave us with, Justin? Where do we find out all about you? Where do we go? Where do we see your incredible posts? Where do we listen to your podcast? Where do we send people?

It's really easy, justin k.brady.com. now, if you can't, because you know K. Brad, gosh darn it through me.

I was going to say justin Brady.com.

No, Justin Brady lives in Massachusetts and won't give up his URL. So I'll get him one of these days. But. So that's the easiest way. You can just Google me, Justin Brady. I'll come up. I'm. You know, it's really, really easy to find, but here's what everybody needs to do. Open your podcast app. You've already subscribed to this podcast, so I know you're on it. I know you're on it. And go search for Justin Brady show and hit subscribe. That's what everybody can do. That's. That's what I.

That is a wonderful ask.

I just want to see my numbers go up. So I'm like, yes, I'm doing analytics.

Oh, my God, what a blast. Please come back again. We could talk about anything. Anything and everything.

I'll talk about religion and politics.

Can't wait. No. I'd have to take a Valium before that. All right, my friends, if you're not inspired, I throw my. Throw up my hat. What are your questions? And I always say this, if you don't have questions, I'm not doing my job. There should be something that's been tweaked in you or spurred on. Wait a minute. I don't understand what he said. And I do have a plan A. And should I get anything that we've talked about, we'd love to hear. And I have a feeling, Justin, you're probably pretty available, maybe to answer a question or two. If someone posts it where I post this on.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.

All right.

I'm really easy to get in touch with, too. There's a menu button at the bottom of the website. If you hit that and hit contact, it buzzes my phone directly.

How kind.

Super cool. Well, we have, like, a little secret technology built in there to keeps away bots, but it's pretty slick.

Look at you go emerging technology. All right, people, ask your questions of Justin and me, if you're interested. Can't thank you enough for being here. Hope it inspires you in these times of uncertainty. We're going to go back and troll. Thank you, Justin. All right, everybody, have a great week. See you next time.