Episode 173: Super Clear at 11 Years Old with Business Leader Vignesh Kumar

Welcome to this episode of the Million Dollar Mastermind. I'm Larry Weidell and let's get started. I'm here with Vignesh Kumar, who is one of the top leaders inside the Neil Patel organization. And together they won Wind up dealing and in the past and currently with the biggest companies out there. Just look at the capitalization out there. The biggest companies, they have worked. They do work. The most famous people, the biggest athletes, the biggest Internet marketers, people who write books and do courses and do anything to do with marketing, sooner or later they're going to get involved with Neil and Vignesh and even people from the TV shows like the Shark Tank. And you probably have seen a lot of some of those advertisements and promotions and everything. But welcome, Vignesh. Glad to have you here.

Thank you, Larry. It is wonderful to be here. Thank you.

And you today let people know where you are physically right now.

So I am currently in Germany, Berlin. So I'm in my apartment. Germany's on lockdown. It is definitely interesting to say the least. But yeah, that's kind of where I'm at.

And sometimes a lot of the time you work out of Copenhagen, is that right?

Yes, I have like an apartment in Denmark as well. So I go back and forth depending on where and what is needed. But yes.

And so Vignesh, you've got a company that is based around the world. Neil is in Pacific Time out in California. And so you've got. Where do you have offices for your organization when you were before the COVID hit, where all were you operating with support people in administration and things like that?

So we have offices, Larry, in San Diego. We have offices in Salt Lake, Utah. Right. We also have offices in Australia. So we have like another office that we kind of opened up in Australia. We have offices in Brazil, actually multiple people in Brazil. And we also have, you know, offices again in India and a bunch of other countries. So we've actually grown, you know, in the last 24 months and we actually opened more offices, hired more people all over the world.

And in the beginning of the, the COVID when the quarantine and lockdown, your head was spinning just like a lot of other businessmen. You didn't know where this was going to take your company, where you and or your, your companies were going to wind up for from this. But is that fair to say?

That is definitely fair to say, Larry. Yes.

And you had to deal with a lot of people who were launching projects in the middle of projects, who had done projects and they were calling, calling you for advice.

Yep.

So. And they weren't happy calls, a lot of them. You know, it's like. So.

Yep, I would say so, Larry. I wouldn't consider them all that happy when lockdown happened. Yeah.

So when you get in that situation, when you're in advisory role and everything, things happen. That has never happened in the history of the world, pretty much. And then people are looking for you to say what to do. It reminds me vignesh of these detective stories, you know, murder mysteries where immediately somebody gets murdered, they're lying all sprawled out bloody on the floor. The detective comes in, checks the scene out, and then he walks outside and there's a hundred reporters saying, do you have any suspects yet?

That is about right, Larry. That is how it felt for sure.

Yeah. You said, I just saw the body, you know, so you've. And so you've come through this and it's turned out to be fantastic because it's driven people more online and that's right in your sweet spot. So right now things are great for you. But how long have you been in the business?

I have been marketing, Larry, for. Since I was 12 years old. Right. Let's just say that I've been trying to get into this or have been trying to think about this and all that for. Yeah, for. Since I was 12. Now, if you do the math on that, that would be 18, 19 years of my life has been spent doing marketing, quote, unquote, learning about marketing or have been kind of devoted to that. So my life, primarily, most of my living life, Larry, has been devoted to learning about business and marketing as a whole. Yes.

And, and how did that, where did you start? Was that in your family? Was that in your relative, your. Your. Your brother, sisters, father? Was that a, A natural career path for you to think about? Where were you located at that time when you growing up?

So I grew up in a city called Bangalore in India. Long time ago. Right. And that's kind of where I was born now in my family, Larry. No, not really. We didn't have any success models. I don't really think there are any success models in my family. But one thing, even when I was younger, Larry was super clear to me. It's like, you know, we were, we were gone, you know, like I was, you know, know, back in school is kind of going through there. And when I was like, I remember this, this was like when I was 11 years old or something crazy like that. I said, like I was looking at everyone doing everything and I'm like, this is just like if everyone does the same type of things, like, this is not. Like, this is not going anywhere. You know what I mean? Like, even when I was, like, you know, 11 years old, I was like, okay, this is. This. This whole thing. This is not where the game is played. You know what I mean? I could just see that, like, happening. It's like, if I do this and I kind of timeline this out for, like, 10, 20 years, this is not going anywhere. You know what I mean? And that's when I started, like, learning marketing, kind of, like doing these things, because it didn't quite add up, you know what I mean? At the end.

So you looked at the friends and relatives and adult role models you had and what they were doing for a living, and the light bulb went on in your head at 11 years old.

11 and a half. Yes. I was kind of, like, doing that. Yeah.

Can you remember one specific thing that caused that to. One event that caused you to. That idea to crystallize in your mind? Because it not only got in your mind, it stayed with you. That became. That was. To me, that's like. It sounds like the first step to you, becoming the person that you've grown into.

Yeah. So this is when I remember happening, Larry. This is a long time ago. I'm not quite sure exactly the date or the time, but this was when I was way younger, maybe when I was, like, 12, 12 and a half, 13 years old or something like that. I was watching, like, this news story about Warren Buffett, right? When I was, like, 13 years old or something like that. This is a long time ago. Like, you know, 20 years ago or something like that. And they said something like, oh, Warren Buffett is like the, you know, the youngest. Like, not youngest, but he's like, the richest in the world or something like that. And then there was this news article where I was like. And they had Bill Gates on there as well, right? This was like, when I was 13 or something like that. Like, this is like 20 years ago. Something crazy like that. So what happened was I saw that, and I'm like, okay, what does. Okay, what do these two people. Who are these two people? What did they do to be there? And why aren't anyone else in my life doing that, right? And I'm like, this. This is like, something's off here. And then the next day, my brother comes along and he says. This is what he tells me, right? He's like, this is when I was like, you know, 12, 13 years old. He's like, when I grow up, when I He was actually much more grown up than me. And he was like, I will go and work for Microsoft. I'm like, okay, what does Microsoft do? Like, why does he want to go do that? And I was like, okay, that's interesting. Like what? Like, I didn't quite make the connection yet in my mind, like, what was happening there? So then I was like, oh, okay, something else is going on. So then I kind of like, you know, we got our first computer when I was like something like 12. 12, I think. Yeah, like we were our first computer. Then I was like, okay. And again, it was a Microsoft computer, Windows 95. Right. Like, what is going on here? Who is, what is Microsoft? Who is Bill Gates? Like, what is happening here? Right. That's when I kind of like got into business because it was my first experience kind of being like, okay, the world is a little bit different than what is being taught to me at school or what my other friends and people that I know are doing, right? Because they're looking at small town celebrities and people and they're only talking about that. But then it didn't compute with me. For example, I didn't know exactly how to say it. When you're 13, what is happening? But it's like I had this feeling inside. I'm like, this is not where the game is, you know, this is not what I should be doing or something like that. You see what I mean, Larry?

Exactly. And so that got you started. And the lesson there for people is a lot of people don't have that light bulb go off in their mind until they wound up working in a corporation for 10, 15, 20 years. And then all of a sudden they, you know, they, they've been passed over for promotions, they've reached the top of the heap and then they get thrown out. And they say, wait a minute, you know, I, I was, I, I was following a track that was doomed from the beginning, you know, and people, everybody that's in business for themselves at one time or another has had that light bulb go on in their head. Don't you agree?

Yes, Larry, I am 100% sure. That is what, that is how it works.

Yes, because that is where it starts, where you're saying, I want something better. If that's going to happen to me, I've got to do different things. I've got to focus on different things than the people around me are. Just because the people are doing great things, are not in my living room or not my neighbors or, or I don't know them personally, doesn't mean that I can't learn from them, that I can't get. Just. Just because I don't have anyone who can make it easy for me to get into those industries doesn't mean that I can't find a way to get myself in there. And so you started working your way up the ladder, and the first thing was just to find out what it's all about.

Would you say yes, Larry. I actually spent a couple years of my life figuring that part out, honestly. Like, I think the next five, six years was me just trying things out. For example, I would spend like a year doing something. You know, I'd be like, oh, is this where the game is played? Or is this. You know, for example, there is like one time, Larry, this is a side story, but I spent like a year in a ashram, you know, like, place where you go and, like, you know, you try to meditate and they teach you about God next. Y. Z. Yeah, right. And I was reading this book or this parable about Buddha, right? And this is nothing against people who are Buddhists or anything like that, right? But here's kind of how I saw that, right? So there's a story about Buddha, and Buddha basically says. There's a guy who comes in and says, like, hey, do you know. You know, like, people come to Buddha and it's like, hey, do you think there's God? And the Buddha is like, there is no God. And I'm like, oh, no. Like, what is happening? And then that causes, like, this huge uproar for the first couple of days, you know, where Buddha says that, right? And then everyone's like, oh, no, you know, the enlightened one says, there is no God. And then everyone's kind of coming back, and it's like, you know, the next day they come in and says, you know, ask him, hey, why did you say there is no God? Yesterday? Can you explain that? He's like, no, no, there is a God. And I'm like, okay. And then everyone's like, okay, there's a God. Everything's okay now, blah, blah, blah, right? And then, you know, next thing he says, and this is kind of weird, kind of example here is like, he then says, oh, it all kind of, you know, like, the moral of the story is, it kind of goes on and on. But the moral of the story is, hey, it depends on what you believe. But what you believe is not really reality. You have to actually see what is reality, right? And reality is how you base your decisions on, like, anyone can believe anything and that's just how, you know, a lot of reality works, right? So to. In that story, that kind of gave me this insight of like, okay, you know what, let's just not like, you know, like base things on belief, but let's look at what actually is happening in reality, right? And that's when I figured out that the whole, you know, going down a interesting path isn't ideal, but what ended up happening in the end of that five year kind of learning and learning about things and how business works and all that kind of stuff is that if someone's done something or someone has already done something, right, that that's possible. It's not, maybe not possible for you, but it's possible in the world that we live in, it's possible in reality. So if it's possible in reality, maybe you have a chance of doing it. You know what I mean? So that was my first take on, okay, this is. Okay, there's something called reality. There's a certain way it works, and if someone's done it, you can go do it yourself. And that's kind of when it got into okay. You know, based off of that, then I looked at like, you know, of a. A lot of people who are in the world, you know, where they're saying certain things. For example, there's a lot of people there you may have seen who say a lot of things, but when you actually go and try, that thing that they're saying doesn't quite work as well as they say or doesn't quite work the same way, right? But there's also people who don't say anything, but they're kind of in the top of the leaderboard. Like, for example, the Forrest billionaire list, right? Like, getting an interview or even talking to these people or getting information about them is like in the 1990s, like 19, you know, like in the early 2000s or whatnot was nearly impossible because YouTube was only like a new phenomenon right before that point. Like getting a video about with Bill Gates or like, you know, anyone was nearly not even a possibility. Like, you just can't, you know, like, you have to go to libraries and read about them and all that. Now there's like interviews of like, you know, Bill gates talking from 1986. And all that kind of stuff is like, you can go Google it or you can go to YouTube and you can find that type of information. But back in the day, it was not as commonplace as it is now, right? Like now you can get anything you want within like a couple of clicks. But Back then it wasn't like that. Right. So anyways, back in the day I was kind of doing a lot of searching. I had this entire five year stint about like, let's see where all of this leads. And wherever it ends up is where it ends up. But I wanted to actually like, operate in reality and not base myself on, oh, I believe this, I want to work on this. But I wanted to kind of be pragmatic in a sense, you know what I mean? That's kind of where how I started.

You know, and to let people know more about you. You and I have worked together since probably 2016, I think, on getting my PO, my course from the book serial winner, getting the, the online course put together and you know, the market, starting the marketing of that. And then also with the podcast that we had this year. And this was, you know, that was the reason I wrote the book. I wanted to do the course so people can get real information that really works and has worked and works over and over again, not just for me, but for the people around me and then the people that I do some coaching with. You know, we just see these principles work over and over and over again. And they're not the stuff that you get easily just by listening to an interview of, you know, somebody who's done a bunch of interviews and they think, okay, I know how Bill Gates thinks. He gave me an hour of his time. And I've watched a bunch of videos on Bill Gates and Warren Buffett. I know how they think. I understand them. And so here is how to be like Bill Gates or Warren Buffett or anybody. I mean, they're just interviewers. And as we have you and I have talked about, they're so convincing because they believe they figured it out. And it, you know, going back to that story you told earlier, the it, they build it in their mind where that exists. And that really is how it works. But it's not really how it works as it's just how they structured it in their mind and they've never done anything with it is the proof that it doesn't necessarily work. And on the podcast, that's why I interview people who have made something happen in the real world. And so when they say cover some of these principles, maybe even say the same words, it come comes across differently or a deeper way or a more precise way to where you can get it and it can impact your life rather than la de da di da, you know, someone who's just rattling off and they're posing as winners, but they've never really been a winner. You know, they don't really know how. And usually where they miss it is the complexity and the toughness of unraveling these situations and hanging in there and actually accomplishing things.

Yeah. Another parallel Larry, I would draw to that is, for example, you know, I've. I study a lot of craft and arts and stuff. So one of the best examples of kind of saying that I've heard is, for example, an actor basically would, you know, like, if he wants to be an actor, let's just say he goes and watches like 5 Marlon Van Brando movies and then he reads a couple of, you know, authors who are directors who know about acting. And then five days later he thinks he's an actor. Yeah, he's as good as Brando now he thinks he's good as Brando. You know, that is how people see. Oh, okay. So they listen to like five days of like Bill Gates talking. And then fifth day they think, oh, yeah, I know how Bill Gates does it. No, dude, you don't. You actually have no idea what it actually takes to build up a company. You know what I mean? Or just like, you know, like, for example, same thing with acting, right? It's like an acting, it's like a performing art. You have to actually go perform it for like 5, 10, 20 years before you can quote, unquote, get it, right? Same thing with business, right? Like, you have to not watch like five interviews and be like, oh, I know everything. No, no, no, you have to actually build a business, right? Actually, you know, pay the staff on a month to month basis, build products, market that, launch that, right? And then, you know, keep, keep doing that for five, 10 years. That's when you actually quote, unquote, get it. Like, you don't get it by like, you know, listening to interviews and five days later you're, you're now Bill Gates just saying.

Yeah, and basically you got to do it to really learn it. People can tell you kind of how it goes, but that's like someone telling you any skill, like playing the piano or whatever, at some point you got to sit down and put your fingers on the keys and start making mistakes and starting doing the repetitions to where you can really learn what those words mean and basically make them your own by mastery. Knowing how to operating in the real performing thing is like you've mastered a skill and you can do it. That's professional. You can do it under pressure at a high level, consistently, whether you feel like it or not, varying situations. You can perform and you don't learn that by read just reading a book, you know. So Vignesh, you and I will let's, let's wrap it up this episode here because we've given people plenty of things to think about. I know that that point about the encouraging point, one of the takeaways people should have here is if anyone has ever done anything that doesn't necessarily mean like the said that you can do it or you will do it, but it does mean it can be done. And I remember in our business, Art Williams saying to us as we were building organizations and expanding, he said all I, you know, and we had our compensation plan and our management system and all of that, the company and all of that, he said all I have to show the rest of you. And actually he said the rest of USOBs, he said, is one example. He said if one of you make this thing work, the rest of you don't have any excuse because if one can do it, the rest of you can do it. If you work hard, you keep on and you keep after it. And that's a takeaway that I think we're going to leave this, this episode with. Thanks so much, Vignesh. Can't wait to get back and talk with you again.

Likewise, Larry. Glad to be here. Thank you for having me.

Thanks for listening to this episode of Million Dollar Mastermind with me, Larry Wydell. If I've helped you in any way, leave us a five star rating and review on Apple Podcasts. For more information like this, listen to our other Million Dollar Mastermind episodes and check out my W Academy YouTube channel and visit us on WDL on winning.com I'm the million Dollar Mastermind. And until next time, go, go, go.