Episode #569 - Proving Your Worth with Steven Hoffman

Welcome to this edition of the Million Dollar Mastermind podcast. This is where we pick the brains of high achievers from all walks of life and get their hard earned real world insights on winning. I'm your host, Larry Wydell. I am talking with Steve Hoffman. Hello, Steve.

Hello, Larry.

Yeah, we're getting ready to have some fun this afternoon, and we're going to be talking about winning, and Steve's done a lot of it. Steve, how did you get on the winning track and where did you. Where was your entry level into the business world and you know, where you could start getting your lessons and making your mark?

Well, I loved a lot of things when I was young. I loved making movies. When I was a kid, I made 50 movies, all different types of anime. 50. They weren't feature films. Some of them, they range from like 15 minutes to 45 minutes. But I really, yeah, I did. I got all my friends together, got sets built, got costumes, produced, the whole things. I'm very passionate about it. I was also very passionate about games. So I would make board game after board game after board game. Then computers came along. I started coding, creating my own games. I went to study electrical computer engineering on my father's recommendation. I actually wanted to go to film school, so I wanted to go to film school. But my father was like, son, computers are going to change everything. You must study computers. So I was like, okay, dad, he's a smart guy. He was a professor. He was a professor of rocket science at mit.

So he was an official rocket scientist.

He was a real rocket scientist. So I respected him. And I was like, okay. He understood control systems and computers in the early days. And I was like, okay, I'll study electrical computer engineering. I did. I went, I studied it. I didn't love it. It was interesting, but it wasn't my passion. So I got the degree because, you know, I set out to do something, I was going to do it, but as soon as I got the chance, I decided to apply to graduate school in film and television. So I went to usc. I got into usc, their film school, went through their film school, got my master's degree, and then got thrown out into the real world. Yeah, and the real world. Nobody was waiting to hand me a job. Not like my electrical engineering degree where I had offers from Hewlett Packard and all these other companies. You know, I was highly prized in the film world. Nobody cared. I had a master's degree in film and television. So I was like, what do I do? Like, I want to make films. Like, how how do you do this in Hollywood when, you know, I didn't have a network, none of my family was in the business. You know, I had just been making films at a film school. That doesn't really count. So I did what any person would do. I think in that situation is I went out and bought a book. And the book I bought was called the Hollywood Directory, and it listed literally the names and the addresses of, you know, almost every Hollywood producer in Hollywood. And I went through and I wrote 150 letters, 100 addressed to each of them. And I put them in the old snail mail, not email, mailed it to them. And I waited for responses. I got three. Three responses. Three out of 150, right? What? It was three. First one was Disney. Disney, you're not bad. So I was like, oh, I'm going to get this job at Disney. I'm going to land it. So I got the head of production at Disney invited me in, and she started asking me all these questions. The interview is going great. We had a good rapport. And then she asked me a trick question. And the trick question, which I wasn't expecting because of my first interview, was, what films do you like? What films do you like? You know what I said? What? I started listing off all the really cool, amazing art films and experimental films that I saw in film school. Fellini, Godard, all these seminal pieces of film history. And then she just sat there silently. And then she goes, you didn't mention any Disney films. I was like, oh, Disney film. You know, the meeting was over. The meeting was over. She couldn't wait to get me out of her office. So I was this, you know, this. She just. They were producing commercial films, and I was mentioning art films. Total disconnect. So I lost it there. The second interview was even more interesting. I got a phone call. It wasn't really an interview. I got a phone call response for my letter from the producer of Star Wars, Empire Strikes Back. He called me up and he was like, I read your letter. I loved your letter. I want to talk to you. And we started talking. He goes, I don't have a job for you. I just wanted to, you know, say hi. And I was like, hi. So we had this conversation, and it ended with no job, just a nice conversation. It was very nice of him to just give me a call out of the blue. And so that was two. Now I only had one left out of 150.

He couldn't give you any advice or any place to go, or it was.

Just like, General talk. And I was pretty shy at the time. I'm not anymore. It felt really awkward. I didn't know what to say to him. He told me he didn't have a job, so I wasn't interviewing him. We were supposed to make conversation on the phone. And. Yeah, I just didn't know what to say right. So I kind of blew two of them, let's put it that way. I blew two opportunities. Like, if I. Sure. If I'd said the right thing, I might have gotten a job, but I didn't. So this is my third chance, you know, up to bat. After three, I. I'm gonna strike out on the film of the street. I go in and it's one of the largest TV movie producers in Hollywood. His name was Chuck Freeze. He had this huge office on, you know. Okay, you know. But most people don't. It was on Hollywood Boulevard, right across from the man, Chinese, with his name on the roof. I went up to his office to get a job, and I was like, I'm not going to blow it this time. I'm not going to talk about art films. I'm going to try to sound knowledgeable and make good conversation. And he's there, and he's real character. I don't know if you have seen the movie. Barton Fink, right? Art and Fink, made by the Coen brothers. Great film. The. The. The producer in that film looked just like him and sounded just like him. So he was. Sees this big, huge guy, kind of gray hair, and he's sitting there and he's like. He's like the guy who would be smoking on a cigar. He didn't have a cigar, but the type. And he's like, hey, Hoffman, I read your letter. You're here. Okay, I think I can give you a job. And I was like, oh, great, I'm going to get a job as a writer or director or something, really? Or producer. And he goes, I'm going to make you a script reader. Script reader. You know, I got to get my master's degree, and script reader is the lowest job on the totem pole. Literally. They hand you scripts, and your whole job is to literally read all the bad scripts. And if you happen out of 100 scripts to find one good one, you recommend it so that the actual producers and executives would read it. So. But it was the only job I could get. So when you. It's the only job you can get, you take it. So I took the job on this. Reading scripts, and I kept reading and reading scripts and you know, I'm dyslexic, so it made it really hard because I'm not a fast reader. So just how do you read a script quickly? And there's not even enough money to live off of. Like it's really. They pay you very little money to do this. But it was a job in Hollywood and I was like, how do I get out of this job? Because it's not my dream job and I can't imagine myself doing this for years, let alone there were people in as script readers who kept coming into the office who I got to know who had been doing it for like three years, five years. I think one guy was like seven years he had been doing script reading. I was like, God forbid, I'm doing this seven years from now, reading bad scripts.

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So after a few weeks, I literally contacted Chuck again and asked for a meeting. And he gave me a meeting. So I'm in there and he's like, hoffman, what is it? What do you want? It's only been a few weeks. And I'm like, Chuck, I can do more than read scripts. Like, you know, I can read scripts and write up the little synopsis of whether they're good or bad. But you know, I could also write scripts, I could direct for you. I could do all these things. Just give me a chance. He's like, ah, Hoffman, it's only been a few weeks. Whatever, go away. So I went away. A week later I got hit Chuck's and there's a lot of nepotism in Hollywood. So Chuck had his two sons working for them. So one of his sons, his older son, was the head of legal for the company, but he was also a producer. And to top it off, he's a very bitter man. He was a very bitter man because he hadn't made it on Hollywood on his own. He had to go work for his dad in the legal department. And he had. He. Everybody was afraid of him because he would scowl and walk through the office like he's about to punch you. And he was the last person I wanted to work for, but that's the only opportunity I had. So I went and worked for the guy, Chuck's son, Butch. Butch is sitting there, and Butch has this project he wants to get off the ground. And it's. It's a story, a mini series about the Oregon Trail, about this guy, Francis Parkman. So it gives me these books to read and says, read these books and write up a synopsis. I want you to write up the whole synopsis for the whole miniseries. I was like, cool. This is actually writing. I'm reading, and I'm actually writing the outline for a whole miniseries. I was so motivated, so I kept reading scripts at the same time that I was writing this outline synopsis for a miniseries. And I work like crazy, because what do you do when you want to break through? You work like mad, right? So I work night and day, Got the synopsis done in a shape that I felt was really good handed to him. He's no expression at all. Like, go. You know, just go away. So I go away, and I'm waiting, going back. And then a few days later, Butch calls me back in his office, and he's smiling, and he's like, you did a really good job on this. You know, I like, I've never seen him smile. I was like, oh, thank you. And I go, do you have more for me to do? No, no, nothing else. And so I go back to reading scripts. I was like, okay, what do I do now? I did that project. It was fun. I got some, you know, didn't get much money, but I at least got praised. And so I said, I'm gonna ask for another meeting with Chuck, the head of the company. So I contact Chuck again, and I go and I'm waiting and waiting. He calls me back into his office, and I go in. I'm very excited because I got praised by his son, his grumpy son. And Chuck looks at me and goes, hoffman, you're back. Aren't you satisfied? I already gave you a job. And I go, chuck, I did a really good job. Go talk to Butch. Ask Butch. I did a really good job. You can see I can actually write for you. It's like, oh, Hoffman, you're never satisfied. Go away. I go back to reading scripts, and I'm reading scripts, and about a week goes by, and I come into the office and I get My scripts from the head of development, the development director there. She hands me the scripts, and I take them away and give her back the results. And I go into her that day, and she looks at me, and her face is just. Her eyes are shooting daggers. Shooting daggers. She was. Like, she could barely contain her rage. And she stands up, looks at me and says, you got me fired. And storms out of her own off. Like, out of her own office, leaving me in her office. Like, I was just. I was just. She was waiting for me to come to tell me that I'm standing there, and I don't know what to do. And I'm just standing, waiting, Like, I don't have scripts to read because she's gone. Like, who's going to come in and give me a script to read? All of a sudden, Chuck's assistant comes in and says, chuck wants to speak to you. So I go into Chuck's office, and I go and sit down. And I was like, what does Chuck want to see? Does he want to fire me, too? He just fired this person. And I look at him, and he goes, hoffman, you're our new head of development. Wow. He literally, you know, I don't know if you've seen the film. And I use film references because it's appropriate here. Swimming with Sharks, another famous Hollywood film about film executives and how easy it is to get fired. And it was literally happening to me just like in that movie. And so he sent me. He goes, now you're our head of development. There was a big problem here. I actually had no idea what the head of development in a TV production studio did. No idea what. How would you. Yeah, all I did was read script, and I didn't know what she did. And so I go. But he told me to go into her to do the job. He didn't tell me what to do. So I go into her office, and I'm standing there, and I'm literally looking out the window at the Man Chinese Theater. Down at the Man Chinese Theater. And I said, this is so bizarre. Like, I don't know what I'm doing at film school. All I did was watch art films and make my own crazy films. Didn't work, like, in television at all. I have no idea. Her phone starts ringing, and it keeps ringing, and I didn't want to pick it up. It's like, her phone. But I'm development now, so I pick it up, and they ask for the woman. They're like, is she here? And I'm like, no, she's not here. Anymore, but you can talk to me. And it's this agent from icm, one of the big agencies. And he's like, oh, okay, great. Can I send over this script? And he starts describing the script. And I was like, okay, send it over. And then I go back and sit in her desk. And all of a sudden, all the other readers start to come in who've been working their years. And they're like. They're like, where's Karen? She's not here. Where is she? And I'm like, oh, she's not here right now, but I'm sort of doing the job. I was really awkward. And they go, oh, okay. Really? And can I have my script? I didn't even know where the scripts were. And they. They had to show me, like, where their scripts were and where to give them, how she organized it. And so I'm winning this job in the next day I come in. I sort of get through the first day. The next day I come back and I'm like, what do I do? And I'm sitting at the desk again. I didn't know what I did besides hand out scripts and maybe answer the phone and tell them to send me scripts. And then Chuck's assistant comes in and says, chuck wants to see you. I go into Chuck's office, and I'm sitting there in Chuck's office now with his other son, who's the VP of production. And his other son and me are sitting there. And then Chuck's there. And Chuck and his son are talking. They're going. He's going, we have this. This TV miniseries, and it's starring this person, you know, has this character in the script. And Hoffman, you've read it, right, haven't you? Oh, yeah, I read that script. And he goes, who should we cast in the role? We're trying to figure it out. We're trying to figure out who would be perfect for this role. And I'm starting. I'm sitting there, and I don't watch much TV, hardly any @ all. I have no idea who the actors and actresses are that they would even hire, let alone who would be right for this particular part. And I'm hearing them go back and forth. And now Chuck is asking me to tell them who would be the right. Because apparently this is part of my job. So I'm panicking because I cannot answer this question. And Chuck says, hoffman, come on, tell us. Who do you think would be right? And I'm like, chuck, you know what? Let me think about this and get back to you tomorrow. That's all I can say. So he goes, okay, whatever. And so the meeting finally ends, and I get back to my office, and I'm like, how do I figure out this problem? I could get he fired somebody who knew what she was doing. Like, she was like, probably really good at this job. I'm the worst person I asked to be a writer. I didn't want to be a director. I wanted to be a writer director. So I'm starting to figure it out. And I knew one of my friends was in Hollywood, and he's trying to make it in the film business. And he was literally an encyclopedia of everything film. Like, he would. Like, he had a photographic memory, and he read all the, you know, the Hollywood Reporter, variety. Literally knew, like, every A list actor, B list actor, C list actor, cameo part. Like, he knew everybody, you know, and so I'll call him. So I call him up and I said, randy, Randy, please, please tell me who I should cast. And I start describing the role of the female protagonist. Like, who, you know, she. This type of person. He goes, oh, Steve. Well, this would be my first choice. This would be my second choice. And if you can't get them, go for this person, you know, go for this woman. And I'm like, oh, Randy, thank you so much. Sure enough, I get called back into Chuck's office the next day, and I'm sitting there with his son, and Chuck looks at me and goes, hoffman, have you thought about it, Chuck? Yeah, actually, I have. She would be my first choice for the actress. She would be my second choice, and this would be my third choice if you can't get the other two. And I'm waiting for a response. Chuck looks at me, hoffman, you're brilliant. Brilliant. So let me put it this way. I baked my way through this job as I learned, like, what a TV development executive does. And I literally, you know, I started reading the trades, like, voraciously. I started, you know, watching television. I was, like, just trying to do everything I could to get up to speed. And every day I went into that job thinking this might be my last day. I heard the last person. But I ended up being there over a year. And after a year, I was like, you know, I'm doing this job. It's really cool. It's kind of a job a lot of people would kill for. But I wanted to be a creative person. I wanted to be a writer, director. I didn't want to be an executive kind of choosing and casting the shows. It wasn't really what I wanted to do. And I got an opportunity because one of the producers at the company, his cousin was the founder of the game company Sega. And they had just, this was in the early 90s, they just overtaken Nintendo as the number one game company in the world. And I was like, well, that's cool. You know, I love games. I coded games. I, I could probably be creative in that job, which I can't do here. And, and so I said, hey, can I meet your cousin who founded the company? He was an American who went over to Japan after World War II. It's called service Games Sega and they made Sonic the Hedgehog and all these famous games. And I went up to him and said, give me an interview.

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