REBS Case Study | Kerby Skurat

All right, welcome back for another case study. And today we're gonna chat with Kirby Scurrat out of Minneapolis, Minnesota. And. Yes, sir, I guess we met. What did we meet, like five, six years ago? We spent a couple years working together. Why don't you give us like a minute or two on what the business was like when we met? Maybe what you did last year to kind of hook in the listeners and the watchers here.

Yeah, I think we met. We had just wrapped up about 120 sale year. It was Christina and I. My wife and I are husband and wife team in Minneapolis, mainly Plymouth west metro of Minneapolis, about 15 minutes outside of downtown. And I met you by way of a different coaching program. I was trying to just kind of get to know you, but then you started the coaching program. So I was in your first mastermind, which is pretty fun to think back to how B school has grown for you in the Ballantyne Aloft hotel boardroom. Sitting there with some really cool friends that I'm still friends with Damon and Dan Beer. And to think about that room of 14 and now the countless people that you've helped over the years, it's pretty cool. That's more about you than me. But that was a fun first boardroom session. And we then went to 192, 300 and 256. 380 or 345? 381. 387. And then last year 447. And this year we're already at 291 pending and close. So our goal is 550. We should hit it, hopefully. So it's fun to see the growth. And it's been a fun journey of just getting advice from you, having you kind of call me out on stupid things that I'm doing in my business and just being able to have you as an advocate for our growth.

Yeah. So put yourself back in the days where we just started working together. You know, what did you really want to achieve, you and Christina want to achieve back then?

So at that point, we were both producing at really high levels. I was still on the listing side of the business. Christina was doing the buyer side. And the year we met, I think I did 80 listing sales and mainly, mainly listing sales, some buyer sides. And Christina did about roughly 100 buyer sides with a showing agent. And so that was not going to be conducive for the child that we had conceived to raise her. And so we realized we needed to do something to get out of the production. Treadmill that we were on and it wasn't sustainable. Good money, extremely good margins, but just not a sustainable business model for our family.

Yeah. And what problems were you guys facing as a result of the way it was back then?

Oh, just, you know, divorce, kind of being on the front burner, that kind of thing. No, it wasn't ever a front burner topic, but definitely marriage issues. Just never seeing each other, never getting that quality time that we both believe is extremely critical. I'd say, you know, we're pretty committed to our faith. I know that you are as well. And so that's one thing. We just wanted to make sure that our marriage got in a better spot. And I'd say that that was the biggest that we had at that point in our business was that being a husband and wife team, it spilled into everything and we weren't getting the quality time. And so I think that was one of the biggest things that we just wanted to figure out. How do we get more margin? How do we get, as you can see in the upper right of my screen time, money, freedom. How does that become a reality for us? And I don't think we thought it would be possible, but we were trying to learn from you, which is a guy that had done it, and so that was a big catalyst for us joining you.

Yeah. So in your mind at that time.

You know.

What was really on the line? I mean, what. You know, I know you take what you do in business and what you do in your family as a father and as a husband really seriously. What sort of weight was on you to really get this thing right? Like you were both doing more than you could possibly do. She had, like three babies in three years, you know, and so she's doing more than any of us could do.

Right.

But what was the pressure like? I mean, what were your feelings? What was going on in your head around that time?

Yeah, so I'm a business guy more than I am a salesperson, a real estate agent, I would say. And so for me, it was really getting to. When I started real Estate in 2008, I read the Red Book, the MREA Red Book by Gary Keller, and I really wanted to build a business more than I wanted to. And not that I don't want to serve my clients at a high level, but it just wasn't my end game. And so I felt like we were making tons of progress and selling a bunch of houses, but we weren't getting to the end game that I wanted. So for me, joining B school, it was to really figure out how do we get to that seventh level, as you guys call it. It's a little bit different. It's more the own and the business navigator. But that's where we wanted to get to and from where we were then to where we are now. I mean, it's definitely where we're at, you know.

Yeah, let's. Let's talk a little bit about the framework. So to give anyone watching or listening kind of the framework for what we worked on together, you know, think back, you know, maybe three tools, systems, strategies, different ways of looking at the business that had the biggest impact on your business.

I think that, like, working, you know, one thing that you were learning a lot of at that point or had gone through was the Michael Gerber E myth. And I think you still teach it within the B school framework. A little bit is working on your business versus in your business. So that was one of the big takeaways, just to really figure out how do we get that to be a reality for us. The other thing was economics and setting up our team at that point. I think that the critical factor for us being able to exit production was getting our gross profit to a point where it wasn't 50%, it was more like 70%, which it is today still. So that would be the second one is you've got to have an economic model that's built from a gross profit perspective to really allow you to be able to exit without working off of a super thin margin. I mean, you teach a third, a third, a third. And I, you know, the 60% that comes afterwards. You know, you've given me a hard time about that over the last couple months, which is. Which I still appreciate. And we've actually made some changes to just get back on track with some of those things. But that was the second one. And then I'd say the third one, it was just really getting clear on how do you win listings and get those listings to get signed and be a listing focused. And even though we're still not 100% as focused on listings as you are, becoming more and more focused on listings was a critical factor. Getting your listing presentation dialed into our business and using it at a high level, using a seller guide, just the listing pillar that you teach, I think was a very big catalyst for our growth as well.

Yeah, let's dig a little bit. I want to get a little bit granular on those three, so maybe talk through an example or two of.

You.

And Christina And a licensed assistant did 100 deals, then went into the 192 year where I think you only added a showing agent or two, like you didn't grow the team tremendously. How did it translate? Because people hate, you know, when you say on versus in the business, like it's just what did it actually mean? Like how did you change your weekly calendar? Did you block out time to work on systems? Like what did it mean for you?

Yeah, I think we realized the support staff piece was so critical. So getting our license or our assistant, she wasn't necessarily licensed at the, at that time, but getting our system more dialed into really the non dollar productive stuff that we were doing. So ordering photos and ordering signs and anything to do, measuring the houses, anything to do with our non dollar productive activities, we just shelf that. And I think that you put that on her plate and created a role. And then we ultimately figured out how to really get that her non dollar productive activities to a virtual assistant. So building some virtual assistant capabilities with some of the things that our virtual assistants are able to do was exceedingly helpful. So that allowed us to be able to be more strategic with our marketing and really understanding and analyzing the marketing spend that we were doing and how that works from a set met science sold perspective and getting that really fundamentally built into the business so we could really study and understand what dollars are going where and then how do those dollars translate into multiples of three to seven? You know, and that's, that's kind of, I would say what for us was the biggest thing that we pulled out of real estate B school was just getting a clear picture of our economic model and the tracker. I know you're not, you don't use that as much. I still use it today. But having that, that tracking and just the diagnostics in our business to be able to understand. And now you do you guys use CTE mainly right now, right As a tracker.

We still use about 60% of the tracker that we built together. We just use all of our leading indicators are still in that old tracker. We just kind of put the rest of the business into CTE just because I honestly got sick of supporting that stupid Tracker for like 200 teams across the country. It was painful because most people enter one number in a formula cell and the whole thing blows up and they're.

Like, can you fix it?

So economic model, people don't know what that even means. I feel like there are team leaders running two $3 million businesses that haven't really thought that through and they oftentimes think they're stuck with what they have and so talk about economic model a couple minutes on the power of building this thing the right way. And what you were able in those early years to set up the foundation financially for this thing to have a long life of profitability.

Yeah. So our listing side split to our listing partners is 24%. And we just felt like if we're going to spend the money to drive a marketing on marketing, to drive listing leads that, you know, we want to make sure that we're paying a very fair. To be able to get to 100 and 150k for our listing partners is definitely doable. We have six people that are already on their way to six figures this year on our team. So that's one key pillar is not overpaying listing partners. And even on the buyer side, we have somewhat of an ISA model built. And so the buyer side typical split is in that 30, 30 to 40% range for our buyer agents. And so that really allows us to be able to spend marketing dollars, you know, and I know it's like on PPC, for example, I think we're at a 6, 6 multiple. So every dollar we spend after showing agent pay. I'm sorry, after agent pay, we're at 6A 6X this year. That wouldn't be possible if you were on a split structure. That just didn't make sense. But it also frees up our team to be able to, with our support and staff to be able to sell 30 to 40 homes a year and hit over six figures without any risk or any spend of any kind from a marketing perspective. So the model economically works really well and it allows people to focus on their strengths and their sweet spots, which is selling. And it allows a team to be able to have the cash to invest into marketing dollars and support staff. That drives the result.

Yeah. So your point three was kind of the listing system and a lot of team leaders, I think for a couple reasons. I think that the real reason is they can't afford to get out of listings. The second part is they think they have to be in listings forever. So talk about the work you did in the listing system and how a good quality salesperson now in your team goes out and they can take your sphere, they can take your past clients, they can handle the entire listing side of the business. Talk about that a little bit.

Yeah, so that was a. That was when we met you. I was doing listings and that's when we transitioned to me kind of moving out of production and Christina moving more into the listing partner role. And she had a Licensed assistant. And so I can't remember what year it was, but one year she did 110 buyer size. And then we transitioned, and the next year between buyer and seller, she did 154 sales with a licensed assistant and a showing agent. And that was completely nutty. But she's a very good salesperson and very good at following that process and that listing system. And so if you are in production, one thing to kind of point out is that with the Rebs list, you guys still call it rebs. Rebs, I think so. Rebs listing system. You can be selling if you're, if you're the rainmaker, you can easily, and you use the tools of hiring a good assistant and you could easily sell 150 listings yourself. But from there it was training our salespeople on how to deliver that presentation. So Eric, who's been on our team for almost going on five years, in October, he sold over 250 homes with us. And he is a beast with the listing process. He uses equity eval, he uses the listing presentation. We send out a seller guide before he goes out. And so everything that you've taught, we've implemented and that's been, you know, it's kind of the franchise model that EOS teaches, which is another thing that, you know, we've, you and I both learned a lot from over the course of the last five years. But I'd say that that franchise prototype and having that listing listing pillar really dialed in and using the revs listing pillar, it's been instrumental in allowing us to take a quality person and train them up to be able to deliver on the promises that we make, that what we'll do for a seller and do it over and over and over. And you know, this time this year we'll probably do 250 listings.

Yeah, that's awesome. Talk about, I want you to talk about results, but I want to, I want you to talk about real Estate B School. We talk a lot about time, money and stress. You know, we want business owners, team leaders to have, you know, more time, more money and less stress. Talk about those three sort of measures of success as it relates to your journey.

Yeah. So I would say when we joined Real Estate B school, we were stressed out and very time poor. I remember I track all of our personal expenses at a super high level. And you know, that first year, which was like 2012ish every weekend and a lot of evenings we were hiring a babysitter above and beyond our typical, you know, and so the, the like weekends, we rounded listing appointments on Saturday and Sunday evenings. Often it was like, hey, do you have a listing appointment tonight? Because I. If you don't, you got to watch, you know, the kid, I always got her scrambled to get a babysitter lined up. And so just that level of stress and anxiety was. Was overwhelming to compare to now. As we built this, I mean, I'm. I'm really having Christina start to execute and run the entire team. And we're building up leaders that are helping from a sales management perspective and operational management perspective and a marketing leadership perspective. And, you know, I've been able to, with a different business partner, build a second company that's going to do, you know, probably $8 million in sales this year. It's a home remodeling and home building company. But if it wasn't for some of the things that we learned in real estate B school, I wouldn't be able to do any of that. And so time, money, freedom, like, stress is super low. I mean, we still have the typical stuff that comes up with any business, but, you know, we're definitely, we're giving. We're empowering people on our team to be able to sell at a high level, to hit six, six and a half, you know, or $150,000 a year and have the ability to be able to provide for their families. But we're also able to not have to work on evenings and weekends anymore, and then also for me, build other businesses, which is a really cool thing.

Yeah, that's awesome. So think back to when we started working together.

What.

What objections did you have? Other than it was you were in the first beta test. Like, who knew if this thing was even going to remotely work? But what were you thinking? Like, I almost didn't join because.

Well, I didn't have any objections. I mean, I was able to kind of be an outsider watching what your business had done through that other coaching program where we were both a part of at one point. And so I knew that I wanted to be coached by you. And I think that that's one thing where it wasn't necessarily an objection. It was an attraction. And so I think that people that are watching you from the outside world, in my opinion, they should not have objections because you are creating for so many people. And I've talked to countless people that you've done it for that are either no longer in the coaching program because they've kind of figured it out and they're like, hey, man, thanks so much for what you delivered. And we feel good about where we're at. We're gonna fly solo to people that have, you know, have been in it for years and years. I just see that you are creating what you promised, which is time, money, and freedom. And so from an objection perspective, I'm like, why would anybody not want to be involved in something like that where they have, especially if they don't have time or money or freedom right now? Even if you can get one of those three back, why would you not jump on and take a run at Real Estate B school being the catalyst to get you where you want to go?

Yeah. What would you say, looking back at our time in B school together, what was your favorite part of that time?

Well, I think the one thing, you know, that I appreciate about you is you don't really, I shouldn't say care. I mean, I think you want clients. Obviously running a business, you need clients. But I don't think that you are afraid to say what is on your mind and what the person that you're working with needs to hear. And I'd say that that's probably one of the biggest, the biggest qualities about your organization, knowing Stacy and and the others that are involved in the coaching process, is that you're gonna get, you know, my grandma, she always said, call a spade a spade. You know, you're gonna get called out on your BS and on your head trash and the stuff, all the limiting beliefs. And I think that's because you've invested, you know, I don't know how many hundreds of thousands of dollars it is, but you've invested in Tony Robbins and Dan Sullivan and EOS and Russell Brunson and just the people that are thought leaders in the space. You've taken the time to invest in that, and then you've got. You've been able to bring that into the culture of real Estate B school. And that's very evident when you're being coached by the people that are part of your organization. I just think that that is so critical as a business owner to have somebody that's going to call you out and say, you can't think like that anymore. You need to think like this, because this is going to get you through that glass ceiling to the next phase in your business journey.

Yeah, I appreciate that. So who would you recommend Real Estate B school to and why?

I mean, I think that the cool thing is you guys have got programs now designed for people at all varying levels. But I would say if you're a team leader, that is still very much entrenched in the day to day sales of the business and you want to help other people get into or you want to build a business using the leverage that's available by way of finding salespeople or other administrative staff to support you, that this is the right fit. And so, you know, team leaders in that 50 to 150 range that want to go from, you know, 50 to 450, definitely the right framework to be a part of it. And there's ways to do that without it breaking the bank. I mean, you have the different program levels now and I think that there's, you know, the boardroom is, it's full of hitters that just. They're amazing businesses. Even if they weren't in real estate, they're still amazing businesses that people should study and learn from. But I think that the biggest thing that I see in the industry, and you kind of beat me up on it a lot, which is great, is that there's chasing growth for growth sake isn't a good idea. You want to be profitable and you want to build a business that's sustainable and built on the referral model that you teach. And I think that over the course of time, the businesses that really focus on that are going to be the ones that sustain. And last in this changing, as you call it, the, the shift storm that we're coming into in the next couple years here with the ibuyers and all the different pressures that we're gonna have from the outside, I think that is if you want to build a sustainable business that's built on a referral model with exceedingly high service delivery, that this is the right place for you to learn how to do that and to build your business.

Yeah. Awesome. I could not have said it better. So, you know, if like Kirby said, if you, if you've kind of gone down this path of leading others and you're building a team and it just doesn't feel like you're getting more time and money and you're more stressed than ever, which is about 90% of team leaders out there. Whether or not they show it is a different story. All I can offer you is a 45 minute conversation with me. So we'll jump on. We'll talk about what's working, what's not working, what's good, what's bad, what's ugly in the business. And we'll talk about what you really want, what you think is possible, what's holding you back. Just go to realestatebschool.com business growth strategy session. That's all I've got for you. Kirby, I appreciate you on so many levels. The way you've challenged me as a man of God and in my family, with my wife, in my fitness, and I just appreciate you. So thanks for. Thanks for the kind words.