Promoting her book on social media - and navigating social media use

You are.

Yeah.

Good morning. How are you? Good morning. How are you?

Good. How are you? How was your trip?

It was good. I went to Cape Town, South Africa, and then Roatan, Honduras, and then Denver and Aspen, Colorado. So I actually had 3 different trips. So it's been a lot of traveling.

Wow.

Have you, have you gone anywhere?

We, um, we've been going around our little bubble for a few wrestling tournaments. Um, we're going to be going to Las Vegas in March for another tournament, but we haven't gone out of, um, out of state.

Got it. And have you done well, or have you had, um, were you happy with your performance at your tournaments?

Yes. My brother and I did really good.

Okay, cool.

What was the reason for you going to South Africa? I'm curious.

It was a Bitcoin conference. So both my wife and I speak, uh, sometimes to the Bitcoin community. So it was, um, yeah. Do you know anything about Bitcoin?

Only that's an online currency. I don't know much about it.

Yep, yep. I'm sure your dad knows about it, so Yeah, it's, it's very cool. But yeah, we spoke on a Bitcoin conference and then we spoke on a startup cities conference and then we went and visited some people who might help us with our projects in Denver and Aspen. So very busy. Awesome.

That sounds great.

It was great. So I was of course very excited to see your I'm a Child Author videos. So tell me all about those videos.

Well, I mean, it's kind of a trend. We've been seeing that a lot. And then we were going to a fish market kind of near the— near a bay. And suddenly my dad just goes, I'm a kid author. Of course I get ticked off when moms buy Girl Scout cookies instead of my books. And I look at him and it just kind of clicked. And he had a few really great ideas. And it was the perfect setting to do it, so we shot it then.

Got it. So you saw several videos, um, explaining, or on, of kid by kid authors? That was what inspired it?

Um, not necessarily by kid authors. Um, the 'I'm a blank, of course I blank' is a trend that's been going around that I've seen it. I've seen a lot of people record it and post it.

Got it. On Instagram primarily?

Uh, yeah, Instagram, and then, um, just, yeah.

Got it. And what are you going to do with your I'm a Kid Author things?

Well, I'm hoping— or the third book got published, it's out on Amazon right now, so I'm thinking— I feel like that was just one of the steps taken toward marketing a little bit more.

Got it. Did you market the first two or just this one?

Um, I had the first two, um, in the video. I ordered author copies, so I don't have a copy yet. They're still being delivered.

Um, and did you have the first two sold on Amazon, or is this the first one that's sold on Amazon?

The other two have been sold numerous times on Amazon. Um, and then I think the third one has so far, but I'm not sure.

Wonderful. And do you put them on Amazon, or do your parents help you get them published on Amazon?

My dad helped me, um, but it was really interesting to help and watch because he's done that kind of stuff before with his own books.

And to go from just word processing document to a book, was it a big deal or not a big deal?

It seems like a big deal because then, um, on Amazon, the KDP, you can see, um, an online version of the format. Seeing the COVID with all the editing you've done, um, looks really nice.

Excellent. Do you think that you know well enough how to do it that you can do the next book up to Amazon on your own?

I think I could try. The periods we've done it, we're a little spaced out, but I think I But could do it once I'm on the site. Um, but I think I'm maybe fairly proficient.

Got it.

And I'd have to read on my own to see.

Yeah. So getting, getting the book on Amazon is cool. Um, do you have a marketing strategy?

Well, not set in stone. Well, we're definitely gonna do more marketing. Um, on social media platforms like Instagram and stuff, and then go into YouTube sometime in the future. Um, yeah, I think that's two kind of bases right now.

Got it. Would you say that, um, selling your book to the public is a priority, or is you're just kind of checking it out to see what happens?

Well, that's always been a goal. Um, I definitely want to make profit off of my books so I can, you know, travel and compete and fund what my goals. So I think definitely selling to the general is, um, or has been a goal for a long time.

Do you have a target market, a specific demographic you'd like to reach?

Well, I mean, initially when I wrote the book, or when I wrote my first book in 20 20, maybe. I wanted it to be a kids book because I was reading a lot of my favorite series at that time for the first time. Um, so I was thinking kids my age and a little older. But, and even now that my writing's kind of progressed, um, I think it's still the same.

And that makes total sense. I, I would assume that was the case, but I always like to check in on your mental model rather than just assuming. And then of course, the tricky thing is numbers, how to get the numbers up. Because, you know, I know you can just put stuff out there and then not necessarily people see it or buy it. You have a strategy for getting, and people talk about more eyeballs on social media. So a strategy for getting more eyeballs on your content and or a strategy for sales.

Well, you know, I'm still working on that, but I think growing my network and people I know and people they know, um, that's kind of a base. People hear about me, and then for general marketing, I am still working on that. I don't have a big, big solid plan yet, but that's something I'm really excited about learning for learning in the future.

Got it. And in terms of your base Are you primarily expanding via social media or do you other, do you have other ways to, um, expand your reach?

Well, I feel like the simplest way to do that is social media. Mm-hmm. Um, there are other ways I could take, maybe somehow put myself or put myself and my books on an ad, but I, or I don't, I don't know, flyers, but We're working with social media platforms right now, but we're definitely thinking of other ways.

Got it. No, that makes sense. Again, I would assume that was the case, but I always like to check your mental model. It's a little bit off topic, but there are, there are a bunch of studies claiming that social media can be harmful for teenagers. Are you aware of those studies at all?

Yes, I am. Or I'm not aware of specific studies, but I know that social media can or is not the best thing for, I mean, just kids who don't know how to navigate it.

Aha. So does that mean that they, you know, how to socially, how to navigate it or how? And is this something you and your parents have talked about? How do you think about this?

We've discussed this definitely a few times. I mean, I'm— I can't navigate social media that well, but— and maybe navigate's not the best word, I guess, because I know there are a lot of harmful and not-for-kids content on all or most of the social media platforms. So I think you have to know how to filter through that stuff and then focus on things that'll help you and not kind of go down the rabbit hole of those bad or that bad content.

And is it mostly a matter of your internal judgment? That is, when you're on there, you have to make internal judgments about how not to go towards bad things and only to go towards good things?

Yeah, internal judgment and then common sense. But I mean, of course, they— mine, my common sense, my judgment may have some flaws. So I think working together with my parents is a good solution.

Got it. And so far, would you say that it's been relatively easy to rely on your judgment, or is it tricky? How hard is it?

I think so far, relatively easy. You know, I haven't gone down so far yet. It's mostly just, um, my, I guess, bubble, um, around me that I look to.

Got it. I mean, and do you know a little bit about how or why the algorithms can take you down bad rabbit holes?

A little bit. I know that they, I mean, once you're on, I mean, Google knows your phone number, your address, your email. It has access to those things cuz it's, you're on there. I'm not too clear whether Instagram or YouTube or Facebook has that kind of stuff. Um, I know that, you know, it's an algorithm. It can look at what you're looking at, it can figure out what you're interested in, and then send you things that are connected to that, or maybe kind of connected to that, and then lead you down another hole, and then lead you down another hole. So I think there are some good things and bad things. And I'm still figuring them out.

Got it. Do you know other teenagers who struggle with social media use at all, or you don't know anybody who, who talks about that?

I, I know I have— I know some kids older than me. I don't know their— if they have any problems with social media, or if— I mean, they're even into social media. Um, so I, I wouldn't say I do right now.

And of course, you're not technically a teenager, but I think of you The teenagers, um, all very interesting. There are proposals, and not that you need to have an opinion on this, but there are proposals not to let teenagers have access to social media. Um, do you have any thoughts on that?

I think that to a point they shouldn't, or they should— I think they should be able to explore, but smartly, and maybe with supervision, because There's a lot of good content on social media, on Instagram and YouTube. I mean, it's easier to learn things now if you don't have access to those. You basically, I mean, I know before when there wasn't any internet, not that I grew up in that era, um, there was no social media. You had to read or you had to learn from another person. Well, I think without access to YouTube, or at least YouTube, if you're just talking about that, you're missing out on a lot of things. But if you aren't careful and you go too deep, then you're going down the wrong path in that sense. So I think it does have to be in moderation.

Um, no, that all makes sense. And actually, your use case is an important one, reason why kids maybe should have access, maybe with their parents' help and support. Um, and then I'm thinking, do you— have you ever heard the term virtues? Do you know what it means to be virtuous or to have virtues?

I think I know we've gone over this before in school, virtues, but it's— I think it's a little— I think it's a hard concept because a lot of people's virtues are different, and I don't, I don't know the clear definition.

Fair enough. And I think of it as traits that lead you to be a better, happier person ultimately. The reason I bring it up was I'm thinking in terms of where we click on social media, you know, we can click on things that, I mean, I would say I think I mostly, I like positive things. I like the world to be a better place. but I know people who click on things that are about worry or anger or kind of emotions like that. And not that we shouldn't have those emotions, of course we should have those emotions. But does it make sense that if you click on certain things based on certain kinds of emotions, you're more likely to get negative content, where if you click on other things, you're more likely to get positive content?

Yes, I think that makes sense.

Yeah, that, that's why I think of it as kind of having to do with virtues. That is, if you have the virtue of picking content that is good for you, then you're less likely to run into negative rabbit holes. Whereas if you allow yourself to give in, and I think of you as a super positive person, but does it make sense that if we have, that we all maybe have some emotions sometimes that make us more prone to pick negative things?

Yeah, I think we do.

So I would describe the virtue as using your reason, actually, even when you have the impulse to pick over a negative thing, using your reason. This is a very Greek notion of virtue, to get yourself to pick the positive thing over the negative thing. Makes sense?

Yes.

Do you think that you do that to some extent, a lot, not at all?

I think I definitely try my best to do that. Just to be positive and have good virtues.

And I can kind of think of two kind of mechanisms. One is habit. Actually, if you have the habit of picking good things rather than bad things, then just that habit sustains you. And then separate from the habit of picking good things over the bad things, there's actually using your mind to stop and think, 'Hmm, maybe it's not good for me to indulge that emotion right now.' Does that make sense as habit versus reason?

Yeah, it does. You—

would you say you have both or other?

I think a lot of people have both, but maybe it might be hard to create that habit or break from bad habits. I think, I think I, I think I try to do both.

Yeah. And, and you can have good habits too, by the way. I didn't mean that the habits are always bad. But ideally reason helps you have even better habits over time. And so one way right now I'm thinking about it is social media is almost kind of exaggerates things so that if we have positive thoughts, it gives us more positive content. We have negative emotions, it can give us more of that. Does that make sense that it could exaggerate our state or emotional? Well, this is— we kind of got far afield from the book, but since you are on social media and since this is such a big issue, you know, as an educator, I'm reading about this all the time. So I wanted to, in addition to congratulate you on your book and understand the process, understand your process as you engage in social media. With your parents' support. Um, it looks like you're in the car. Are you going off to a tournament or surfing or—

Yeah, today's, um, we have a wrestling tournament.

All right, are you excited about it?

Very.

Okay, well, do you still hope to be a national champion?

Yeah, that's a goal.

All right, well, congrats on your third book. And congrats on the tournaments and have a wonderful set of battles today, okay?

Thank you, I will.

Thanks, bye-bye.