Marketing Strategies w/ Braden Dennis, The Board Room - 004

You know, we've been friends for a long time, so, you know, maybe the reminiscing is best done with the microphones off.

All right, welcome back. This is another episode of the Boardroom on the C Suite, unfiltered. I am very excited to welcome on a special guest. I'll call you a special guest. Thank you. This is my friend Braden. So without further ado, this is the guy who got us the mugs. So thank you for the mugs.

Cheers.

Cheers. And we've been friends for what, since third grade?

Yeah, something like that.

So I don't know how many years Ms. Olson's class. Yeah, yeah. Shout out Ms. Olson. So I wanted to bring him on because obviously he is one of my confidants, one of my conciliaries, and you also own your own business, and I thought, hey, let's bring you on. I'm bringing other business owners on. Maybe people want to meet you and get to know this guy that I reference on most episodes and talk to you about kind of what you do and your background and maybe bring some value to the business owners out there with your marketing experience. So.

Cool.

Maybe start. Start by a little intro, kind of what do you do? And we'll go from there.

Cool. Well, first and foremost, congratulations on all your success on the pod thousand subscribers. I've watched every single one.

Thank you.

Yeah, they've gotten better and better. And on your recent promotion to VP of sales, the youngest VP in company history, as I like to say. So congratulations on that. Yeah. So I'm Braden Dennis. I run a digital ad agency based here in Bellingham, Washington. I really just help local businesses to get their message out there on digital platforms, so helping them come up with creative campaigns, creating ads, running those ads, and then kind of optimizing and reporting on those ads so that they know that their ad budget is being spent as effectively as possible.

Yeah. Yeah. So you and I obviously went to high school together, and then we graduated, and both kind of did the proverbial know, not sure what we're going to do, kind of go to college. So you went to college for a while. Did. Did you finish college? Did you get a degree? Is this. Did you get a degree in marketing, business management, anything like that, or.

I studied psychology, then switched to marketing and then dropped out.

The psychology of marketing.

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, I was really into. I. I'm. I think that's, like, kind of my main. One of the main things I'm interested in to this day is psychology. I always just found it fascinating. Those were like the, my favorite classes I ever took in college. And so.

And then I did an internship doing like group therapy sessions for, for people with, you know, different issues. Yeah. I was like, I don't want to do this. Yeah.

All right.

So I was like, this is not for me. It's not going to be a good way.

I don't have the soft skills for this.

Yeah, yeah. So I was like, well, you know, maybe I do something business related. I've always had an interest in entrepreneurship. And so I was like, well, you know, marketing has some psychology to it, so.

It does, yeah, it's like, I mean.

It does, but yeah, it's such like a simplistic, like a 20 year old viewpoint of the world, but, you know, that's. It is what it is. So I just ended up taking some marketing classes, dropped out to start a company and then that failed. But I did meet a lot of people and learn a lot of skills through that. And so I was able to utilize that to get a job that kind of put me where I am today.

Cool. So what was the, the job that you kind of first started doing marketing? Like you, you got a marketing job. What was that job and what did it look like?

Yeah, so I got hired by, by a national media company. They had basically gone around and bought up local newspapers around the country. And so I got hired kind of through my local newspaper, but for this, this national company. Okay. Obviously local newspapers are declining industry.

Really?

No, it's, yeah, big news. No pun intended. But the industry, you know, has, has struggled to kind of find its place in the modern world. Yep. And so basically my kind of role when I got hired, there was help all of the local businesses that had previously advertised in the paper and transition them to digital advertising. Got it. So familiarize them and educate them on how to Facebook ads work. How does like Google search work and things like that, so, so that they would be comfortable, you know, moving their ad budgets from print to digital.

I think that was super helpful for me because I basically got thrown into that and I had to talk to all different types of business owners, all different ages, kind of all different backgrounds. And I was forced to kind of be able to explain to them how digital advertising works.

There was people that were tech savvy that kind of had understandings and were just like, cool. You know, we get into details. And then I have clients to this day that I met back then who, God bless them, like they still use flip phone.

Yeah, yeah, totally.

Like, not like they transitioned back to a flip phone for productivity reasons.

Like, they never had a smartphone.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which I love. That's awesome. But it, like, forced me to meet people where they were and just, you know, be able to explain kind of, you know, more complex stuff in a simple way.

Yeah, that's awesome. And, you know, I. Kind of taking a tangent here. I know that you have worked with a local sporting goods store here in Bellingham that's been around for 100 years. And, you know, I'm a. Mike likes to make fun of me. I'm a big fan of nostalgia. Like, my grandpa shop there, my dad shop there. I shop there. For sure. It's like a classic American sports store.

My.

But they are very old school, little to no online presence. And I've seen some of their ads and I've seen some of the ads you've done for them. What is that transition like, taking, like you said, you know, God bless them, the old school folks, but like meeting them where they are, but also helping them understand if you do not have a digital footprint, like, pretty soon you will not exist.

Yeah.

I think.

They'Re kind of just confronted with it over time. I think that that specific story you're talking about has done a good job over the past few years of really, like, upping their game, getting a new website with e commerce capabilities and things like that.

But yeah, I mean, you. You kind of just have to show them the reality. I mean, there's tons of stats. Yeah, that's the easy part is like going around and being like, hey, this is how many people, you know, listen to traditional radio. This is how many people listen to, you know, know, podcasts on Spotify. Like, yeah, yeah, it's. When you compare them.

Yeah.

You know, the choice is kind of obvious. So I think just pointing things out and. And you just got to make people feel comfortable because I think that a lot of the hesitation was like, oh, well, I, you know, I feel like I'm throwing my money into a black box and I don't know how that's getting out there. I don't know who this is reaching. And so that's where it's. Know, my job to. My job was to go to those people who maybe had hesitations and be like, look, this is exactly how this is going to work. Yeah, this is exactly the process that we're going to follow. And I will come back, you know, in a few weeks, every month, whatever, and I will consistently come back and show you exactly how your money was spent so that you can, you Know, be comfortable advertising in these. In these new spaces. So it was. It was very, very helpful for kind of getting me started.

Yeah, totally. So transitioning now. We're going to skip ahead a little bit. Had the job working with, you know, a national media marketing company. Now you own your own business. So now you are an entrepreneur. Congratulations. And tell us a little bit about that. What was the transition like? And what have you been doing since you've opened your own marketing firm?

Yeah, so the company that I worked for, I worked there about four years before I left, and after about three years, they got bought by a hedge fund. And so it just became, you know, more nationalized, kind of, in a sense, things started to feel less and less local, and a lot of my clients started kind of having issues with the way things were being run.

Treated more like a number than a customer.

100. We're in a pretty small market, and so a lot of them felt like they weren't being. Like their needs weren't being met necessarily.

Decisions were being made in New York City about how to run things in Bellingham, and I'm not saying those were the wrong decisions for that hedge fund. It's probably the right decision, right?

Totally.

But it wasn't necessarily the best decision for me and for the clients that I had to go and actually talk to on a daily basis. So, you know, at that point, I. I kind of saw an opportunity. Like I said, I've always had an interest in entrepreneurship, and I thought, you know, if there's ever a time to kind of break off and do my own thing, it's now. And so I went to my, you know, kind of core favorite clients that I've been working with, and I just asked them, like, hey, if I was to do this for myself, would you come with me? And they all said yes. Awesome. So that was, like, you know, crazy.

Yeah.

Yeah. But it would have been totally understandable for them to say, hey, we like you, but, you know, we're gonna stick with what we know. And I would have totally understood that. So it was. It was like. It gave me a lot of confidence in myself to be able to take that step. And it was also very humbling in the sense that, like, I had to. I was like, okay, I gotta step up my game now, because I was. You know, I've just convinced these people to take this jump with me, and now I'm just, like, terrified of letting them down. Yeah. You know, I. I still am to a certain extent. Like, that's what motivates me. So I just use that kind of fear to keep me, you know, up every day and doing the best I can. Cool.

That's awesome. So now how many years into your own company?

This month is two years.

Awesome. Well, congratulations. Two year anniversary. Yeah. So Bloom Creative is the name of the company. What would you say, you know, having been doing marketing for multiple years, running your own business for a couple of years, you know, and obviously the audience here for the C suite Unfiltered is primarily going to be, you know, small business owners, local business owners. What would be, you know, something they can do since you are, you know, focusing heavily on the digital age that is, will be very impactful for their business and this could be more free form. I'm not like, give us the top three or anything like that. Just what do you see that local businesses, small businesses can do better with their digital advertising?

Oh man.

There'S a lot of good tactics. So like, you know, I do everything from meta advertising to Google search, YouTube, Hulu, Spotify, like there's tons of ways to get your message out there. I would say certain tactics are more aligned with your goal. So just, you know, it's. The strategy behind it is typically not as complex as people may think. It's like, are you trying to just put your brand in front of as many people as possible? What we call brand awareness.

Yep.

Are you trying to drive traffic to your website? Are you trying to just get leads? Like think about kind of those categories of, of goals and then whatever kind of category you're most in at any given point in your business, focus on things like that. So if you're trying to build awareness, there's literally campaigns through meta called awareness campaigns. Yeah, yeah. And that just puts your message out to a broad range of as many people as possible within a defined geographic location.

Yep.

And so I would say, you know, that would be a great place to start for that. You can just use a little bit of budget, put it out there and, and make sure that people are familiar with your brand. If you're doing something where you want to drive traffic to your website. Well, there's meta traffic campaigns and then there's also things like Google search where you find people who are searching for things you offer and be at that top result when they're making that search. And so.

Those would be kind of options for driving traffic. If you're looking for leads, I would say especially a lot of people watching are probably in home services.

Yep.

Google local service ads are your best friend. I mean, they're awesome so yeah, you pick your location, you pick your industry. And then the nice part about it is you only pay when somebody calls or messages you. So you're literally paying per lead. It's super cost effective, simple way. It's, it's a newer Google platform but I know Augusta, you know, uses that quite a bit. So it's, it's awesome. Yeah.

Yeah. Mike was definitely an early adopter to Google Local services.

Good to see that.

Hey, you're seeing the same results in the businesses you represent and it allows for success for small business owners. Let's say someone like really wants to focus on like direct response kind of lead generation.

Yeah.

What do you feel is like the best avenue that you see right now? You not holding you to anything but like what are you saying that's work for, for specific lead generation, direct response.

Like in terms of tactics. Yeah, yeah.

In terms of the tactics that you're deploying, if you will.

Yeah, I mean I would just local services is, is, is the best and for just getting leads and, and you know, not a lot else. Like if you're just focused on I need people to call me today, tomorrow, for the next month. Like it's local services for sure.

Yeah.

Not I'm, you know, not paid by Google. It's, it's really effective. Like I've, I've started selling more of that to my clients and kind of reaching out to, to new people who might be interested in that. I've had some people reach out and ask me to set them up for them. So I set up Google Local services campaigns. It's, I'll say it's a hassle to set up like. Cause you have to go through a verification process, you have to go through a background check. Like you got to get all your ducks in a row. Google's customer service is not, you know, it's no Augusta, it's kind of non existent, no call center. Yeah. So you know. Yeah, I would say if you can get it set up, it's super easy.

Yeah.

But if you need help setting it up, reach out.

Be happy to help. Yeah. And I think one of the reasons that you know, Mike has always been a strong proponent of Google Local services and inside of Augusta, it's not necessarily required but it's like it's pseudo required.

Because there is a barrier to entry. Right. Anybody can make a Facebook page, anybody can get listed on Google. Google Local Services, there is a higher barrier to entry. Like you're saying you have to be verified, you have to have a background check, some I've heard from some owners inside of Augusta. You need to verify your address and, like, prove that the business is at that physical address. Well, that's frustrating for a home service business owner if they're running out of their garage, a storage unit, their.

Their.

Their buddy shop, whatever it is. So. But, but I think you're, what you're saying and what we say at Augusta is like, that is the best bang for your buck. Like, get verified on Google local services, because most, as we say, chuck in a truck type home service businesses aren't going to go through that process.

Right.

So it's. It's safety for the consumer.

Yeah. And job security for me.

Yeah. There you go.

That's why people, you know. Yeah. That's why people. A lot of my clients hire me is because they're like, you deal with this. I don't have time. Sounds great. Like, you take care of it. And I'm like, you know, that's what I do. So.

Yeah, that's awesome. I love hearing that. Very cool. Well, you know, that was kind of the main stuff I wanted to touch on, so we will jump into some maybe freeform stuff.

All right.

So, you know, if you need time to think about these questions, feel free. What do you feel that since, you know, you're my captive audience, what do you feel that Augusta as an outsider, the cool, I guess, advantage that you have is, you know, we've been friends since before I even became part of Augusta, before I got hired and many years before that.

Before a lot of stuff.

Before a lot of stuff, yes. And so you saw me start as kind of like a field worker, you know, when I was. When I was a field worker, you know, I was. I was in a relationship with my now wife, but she lived out of state, so it's kind of like, hey, I would work, you know, 50 plus hours in the field, and then Friday night, it'd be like hanging out with you and the guys.

Yeah.

So you saw that transition to where I'm at now. What do you feel that and are asking about me? What do you feel that you've seen Augusta do really well over kind of the time you've experienced with me at Augusta and kind of where we've grown. And then after that, I'll ask you the inverse. What do you feel like we could do better? What have we not done? Well, so. And I know you're supportive, but. But, like, talk about it from an outsider's perspective. Right. Because there are people that, you know, watch this a good amount of the audience is not a part of Augusta. So it'd be cool to hear your outsider's perspective about what you've seen Augusta do over the last, you know, six and a half, seven years that I've.

Been with the company. I mean, it's. It went from basically, like, I had no idea what Augusta was when you started working there to, like, oh, cool. Like, you know, you guys, you know, you're out there mowing lawns. That's, you know, summer job or, like, between. You know, between semesters at college or whatever. And so I didn't really think much of it. And then, you know, like, a few months in, we were hanging out, and I remember you talking about, like, Mike and, like, the actual vision of Augusta, and I'm like, okay, you know, like, that sounds cool. Like, you know, maybe. We'll see. Yeah. You know, not everything works out as you plan, but in. In your guys case, like, things have just really kind of snowballed and grown, and so it's been cool to like, watch you kind of, you know, rise up and within the company as it's grown and kind of fill in different roles. Mm. I would say they seem, you know, Augusta seems to.

Take advantage of the talent that's available to them. I really love that. Like, I love the. The loyalty.

Working, like a corporate job for. For years, you realize that, like, a lot of the employees are just viewed as completely expendable, you know, and so that's. People hate that.

Yeah. Yeah, totally.

That's what sucks about corporate America. Right? Like, it's. It's like, you know, you feel like a widget sometimes. And so I feel like for Augusta to kind of take on it, take its employees and be like, hey, you're. You're mowing lawns. But, like, we see more in you, and we see not there's anything wrong with mowing lawns, but, like, you know, we can grow that talent and help you to become the person that you're, you know, meant to be from, you know, humble beginnings. And so that's, like, you know, very commendable.

Yeah, no, I appreciate that. Yeah. And that's one of the things I think that I struggle with. And, you know, I've had some conversations with you about it. Like, like I said, you're kind of my confidant. Like, I. You know, it's you and my wife. I try not to talk, work with a lot of people, but if I want to get advice, solicited advice, I'm gonna go to people I trust, and that's Pretty much my wife and you. And you've seen me go through some of those struggles where I got the opportunity to kind of be trained by Mike, learn from Mike and Liz and others on our team that are just phenomenal people to work with. But I've had struggles with kind of training and teaching the folks that I've then been in charge of managing. What do you feel like is a good piece of advice for someone like myself or others that maybe struggle with managing? Like, how do you connect with your clients, people that you work with to. To educate? Because marketing isn't necessarily just like, oh, pay me money and I'll go spend it for you, and you'll get more work. You are educating, you are training, and you are teaching. So what do you feel like is a, Is a good way to go about that, whether you are a manager of direct reports or like, managing clients?

Yeah.

Education is.

It's very hard. I, I come from a family where, you know, when I was in school, high school, my mom was the school nurse. My dad was the transportation director of the school. My brother's a teacher. My other roommate's a teacher. Like, I have a lot of, like, education in my life. And so, like, I, I talk about that sometimes with my clients. Like, I view myself as, as an educator.

Yeah.

First and foremost, like, I'm here to. So that you know how your money's being spent and you can feel informed. I never want them to feel like they're just giving money and like, hoping for the best. Yeah, that's good. And so I would say when you're educating people, to answer your question, the thing that I always try and keep in mind is, like, if somebody isn't getting something that's on me, like, I'm the educator. It's my job to educate them. If the client, if I've explained it five times and they still don't get it, it's not them being stupid. It's me not explaining it in a way that makes sense to them.

Yeah.

And so, like, putting the responsibility on yourself.

You know, it's more stress that way. It's more like responsibility that way. It makes, it puts more pressure on you, but it makes you better at what you do. And it, I think fundamentally is the right, the right way to be a way to think of yourself as an educator.

So, yeah, no, it's a good way of spinning. And obviously my wife is a teacher too, so apparently you and I are just like, drawn, surrounded by educators, if you will, which, which will take. That's Good is, you know, one thing that she's taught me is that you have, you have to embrace like other learning styles.

Right.

Just be. And I know it sounds simple and it's easy to say right or yes or. Good point, Lee. But it's ultimately, just because like Mike led me and taught me one way doesn't mean I can lead and teach the next person the same way. And that's a big frustration. And you know that obviously I've done coaching in the franchise as well. And you know, sometimes I ask you for like tips or suggestions or things of that nature because I trust your advice and I know you'll have, you know, mine and other owners best interests in heart and in mind. But it's very hard to get people to learn when they have a very different learning style than you. And I just don't know, like, I guess this isn't a question, it's just kind of a dead end thought of like, if someone's a visual learner, but you're a, like I need to sit and read and analyze everything. Like, it's just hard to cross that bridge. Right. Does that make sense?

Yeah. Well, I mean, it forces you to learn.

How to educate in different ways, which will help you understand better. Like whatever you're, you're teaching, whether that's, you know, about digital advertising or franchise coaching, being able to explain it in different ways to different types of learners is what will truly make you a master of that content of that subject matter. Right. So going back to earlier, you know, when I was at, at my old job, it was super helpful for me because like I said, I had to explain digital advertising to all different types of people. Yeah. And so I learned how to explain it in very complex things in very simple ways. And that's what my buddy Ryan, you know, Ryan, water dog, shout out water dog. He's a teacher, a great teacher. And he always says that if you can explain a complex thing in the simplest way possible, that means you truly have an understanding of that thing. And so, yeah, you know, by being a. Maybe you learn by listening to lectures, but you have to now teach that content to a visual learner. That's what's going to make you understand that totally thing in a holistic way.

Yeah, 100%. It's, I think about it, the easy example for me is P4P. Right. And you know about pay for performance at Augusta. You've taught, we've talked about it a lot. I was paid on it for a little while. So you literally saw it kind of up close and personal with me is, you know, we can, we can simplify it, but it's such a complex procedure that, okay, I know I can simplify P for P, or I can take a. Of couple complex product P4P and explain a simple way. Employees are guaranteed a percentage of labor revenue they generate for the business.

Right.

That is a simple and true statement about P4P. But then people want to know the math. And that's where, like, the disconnect happens. Sure. Like, you need to know the math. You need to know it like the back of your hand. And that's one thing. You know, I tell owners in Augusta, it's like, hey, if you're going to do P4P, I 100% believe it. I 110% believe it is the right thing for your business. As a meritocracy, you will reward your employees for working hard. However, you need to know the math. Because one day this will happen. You'll have an employee come in and say, my paycheck's wrong. Explain it to me.

Yeah.

And you go, all right. And what I, what I tell owners is, you know, thankfully we have a whiteboard at the belly hip shop. I say, I have had that question multiple times. I say, okay, great, let's go over the numbers, walk over to the whiteboard, grab a pen and just start doing it. But you have to put in the work to not only reduce the complex to the simple, but also.

Connect the dots or jump the gap or whatever analogy you want to use. So you are. I kind of want to get back to you and your business. You're kind of two years into your entrepreneurial journey, if you will. Obviously have done marketing for more than that, but two years running your own firm, which is awesome. You know, Mike talks a lot about 10 year swings. You've heard us talk about that before on the pod. You know, hey, like, if you can put your head down for, you know, five to 10 years, like minimum five, think about it in terms of 10. Cause it takes a while to get results. So you're two years into a ten year swing. Do you see any, you know, correlations with kind of like not necessarily your success, but what you do as an entrepreneur with maybe what you do in your personal life or how you kind of combine your entrepreneurial life with your personal life? What kind of creates balance for you as a business owner?

Yeah, I think I like looking back, I've always just kind of wanted to do my own thing. And in a way, I never knew what that would look like. But I've always kind of had that entrepreneurial spirit.

Yeah. Just from like making little wallets out of duct tape in fifth grade. Like selling them at school. Yeah, yeah. Duct bills. Name my mom came up with. Yeah. So, yeah, like, there's always just been little things where I've kind of, you know, known that I, that I wanted to do something a little different. And I think for, for me, it's not. Entrepreneurship is not necessarily about.

Like being a multimillionaire, like making a ton of money. I mean, that would be super cool. But like, for me, I'm totally fine just like building my own job. You know, that's kind of what I, what I went into it as or looking for. I, you know, if you, if you go on, if you get in the entrepreneur algorithm. Yeah. On YouTube and, and Instagram and Tick Tock and whatever. You know, you're constantly like barraged with these guys of like this, this is what it means to be an entrepreneur. You're going to be like, you know, make a million dollars a year and, and have these crazy cars and stuff. And like, you just gotta hustle, right?

Yeah. Want it?

Yeah, for sure. Like the over the top kind of hustle culture stuff. And like that's, I'm more relaxed than that. Like, that's just not who I'm gonna be in life. And so, you know, working at my old job and seeing all different types of business owners who were like, you know, they were entrepreneurs, but they're just like, hey, this is my job. Like, I show up every day, it's my job, but I built it for myself. And like, this is what I have to work with. And so it kind of like reframed how I think about entrepreneurship. It's like, oh, it doesn't have to be like the most profitable thing in the world. It doesn't have to be like a world changing startup.

You know, you can be an operator, a solo operator, and you can kind of just build your own job and, and, and live the life that you kind of want to live within reason.

Yeah.

So, yeah, I think it's reframing how I viewed entrepreneurship was important. But yeah, I think it goes back a long ways.

Yeah, no, I think that's smart. I actually really like what you said there. I personally haven't thought of that way. And going to the, you know, the entrepreneurial algorithm, as Alex Hormozi says, you know, his name gets brought up every podcast. As Alex Hormozi says, in sales, the most important thing you can say comes after the but. And I liked what you said, where.

This is my job, but I built it. And I think that's an interesting.