Author and Motivational Speaker Susan Burrell Finding Freedom

Welcome to a new life podcast with.

Pamela Jean where it's all about empowering.

Women to empower more women. Get ready, friends, to create a new life.

And here is your host, Pamela Jean.

Hello friends and welcome to a new life podcast. I'm so excited for today's episode. I have a very special guest with me and I know that you are going to fall in love with her just as much as I have. Her information is so relevant and so important at this day and time of of our lives. So my guest today is Susan Burrell. She is the author of your life empowered, Live your empowered life a 30 day journey book, which is incredible, I might tell you. Susan is going to expand on that in just a little bit. She's a thought provoking podcast called Empowering chats with Susan Burrell that can be found on Apple podcasts, Spotify, our iHeartRadio and other popular platforms. She also has guided meditations that are accessible through the Insight timer app. This is a fantastic, fantastic thing for you to start doing and thinking about. As we enter into the holiday season, Susan has navigated life by learning how to listen within to that divine urge that keeps pointing her in the direction of her life's purpose even when she can't see the road. And, and friends, I think we all can identify with how that feels. Susan is a guide in the crossroads of life. With a master's degree in consciousness, she has been counseling and supporting people in transformation from the inside out for over 25 years. Susan. So, Susan Burrell, thank you so much for being with us today. I cannot wait for my listeners to hear a part of your world. So Susan, let's take it away. Thanks for being here.

Oh, I'm excited to see what the conversation actually is. And yeah, thanks for having me.

You're welcome. So as I was listening to your information that you have on your website, which is so well done by the way, one of your theme songs is what doesn't kill you makes you're stronger. Thank you, Kelly Clarkson for that. I know same. And I just, you know, that song I think can be a theme song for a lot of people. In particular women. I feel like women are the weight carriers for so many people in their lives and we just, we just take on the burden, other people's burdens because we feel that responsibility. But what I love about one of your conversations I presentations you did was finding your freedom. And I would love for you to expand on finding your freedom.

Well, okay, so I just want to. So what doesn't kill, kill you makes you stronger is actually the entrance point to finding my freedom. And I just have to tell you, Pamela, I used to hate that phrase, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. I. I remember going to the gym and my trainer would say, no pain, no gain. And I want to slap them because why do we have to have pain in life in order to gain? Why do we have to go through stuff that might emotionally, mentally, physically kill us in order to be better and stronger? You know, but when I hit this certain point in my life, that song by Kelly Clarkson became my ringtone because I really needed to affirm that I was going to be coming out of a really hard divorce after 28 years better. You know, because there was points where I thought I was just gonna die in the middle of the divorce, and there were parts. I mean, the entire thing shattered my heart. And so what I felt found as I got three quarters of the way through. So my intention. Let me just say, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger? My intention was to come out better, a better person to. I realized when I went into divorce, I didn't know myself. I didn't love or respect myself. I had been. I'm trying to think of the nice way to put this, Pamela.

Just, you don't have to be nice. You just. It is what it is.

So it is raw. And yes, I had been told for 28 years in a very subtle, covert way that I wasn't good enough. I wasn't pretty enough, I wasn't this, you know, I wasn't enough.

And.

And it was done in a gaslighting kind of way where, you know, wow, did that really happen? No. Yes. No. So it was kind of crazy making. And so when I went into divorce and I began to separate energetically from my soon to be ex husband, I uncovered deep woundings that I had to heal within myself with the intention to be love myself more than I ever had. And I began to focus on freedom. I wanted to be free. Free of the past. I wanted to be free of. Free of what I thought was wrong with me. Free of my old beliefs, you know, and free of the belief systems that were downloaded, whether it was from my family of origin or my ex husband or you know what I mean? So I just focused. Freedom, happiness and love became my. My cornerstone words to focus on. And so when.

And I love that. Yes. Susan, if I can just interject just briefly. I love that you're saying that because I think as women who I like to think of us sometimes as like the sacrificial lamb of a family and of the relationship. Because oftentimes we are the ones that put our career on hold to take care of the kids. We put our career on hold so our spouse or that person we're supporting can elevate in theirs. And after so much time and so many years of being the, the sacrificial lamb. Wow, it takes a toll. And then if you, you add on top of that, you have that toxic relationship, which I know you, you know so well, you had that toxic relationship, you literally feel like you have gone a tiny bit crazy. Because it's like, is, is that, is that real? Is. Did. Am I, am I, I must be crazy, right? Because everyone around me is telling me I'm crazy. So I guess that must be. Of being that sacrificial lamb, you completely lose who you are and you come out of that in kind of a stunned shell shock state. And you have to redefine who you are, redefine what your dreams are and figure out what is next for you.

Absolutely. And when you have never made those actual choices in a strong way for yourself, it's a huge learning curve. At least it was for me. I mean, I didn't have boundaries. I wasn't taught boundaries as a child. And so I had to learn how to create healthy boundaries, which often felt scary because it felt like shutting people out and that kind of thing. But the, the bound. Creating boundaries is also what helped me find more of my freedom, if you will, because then I, I could. How am I explaining this? When we don't have boundaries, we're often operating off of other people's reactions or off of their energy system, which, you know, if somebody walks in, you know, if you're, if your spouse walks in and he's angry, then you're like picking up the anger and, and trying to diffuse it. So, so. And that's their anger. It's not our anger. Right. Or if they walk in the sad and depressed, we as women, I don't know, maybe it's just me, but we try and make it better. Right? But what that means is like what you're talking about, the sacrificial lamb thing, is we take on that energy, that emotionality, as if it's ours. And so developing healthy, strong boundaries is like one of the first things or the second thing. It depends that you do because. Or that I had to learn how to do. It's very uncomfortable when you've never had boundaries. I did. You know, it's like, where's the rule book that tells me how I'm supposed to do this.

Right, Right, exactly. I understand what you're saying on that because with. When you start implementing healthy boundaries for the first time, it often comes with feeling guilt and shame and selfish. And when you establish those healthy boundaries at, you know, day number one, you, you feel like I'm, I feel like such a jerk. I would. They. I'm hurting that other person. But what you have to realize and understand, and I think you touched on this, Susan, is when like you said, if your spouse comes in angry and mad, their emotions and their insecurities become your fault and your problem. And they're not, they're not your fault and they're not your problem. You are there and you are there simply to help them through a hard time. However, you can't take on physically their emotions because that's their insecurities and it's not. You cannot look at it from a personal standpoint that I personally have done something wrong to make him angry or make her angry. So taking that on yourself is, is too much weight, which again puts you through that place of having to carry everybody else's wounds.

Yes, it's been, it's still, for me, Pamela, it's still a work in progress because I was taught at a very, very, very young age that I was responsible for other people's feelings. From my family of origin, from my mom, I love her, she's passed away, God bless her. But I was taught that I was responsible for her emotions and I needed to take care of her. And so when I went into my primary, my, you know, my marriage, I was already trained up. Oh, if there's something he's not liking or feeling, I'm supposed to fix it. I'm supposed to take care of it. And coming out of all that and attempting to really live with strong boundaries, I am now in the most amazing relationship. If anybody had told me I would find a new relationship like this, there's no way I would think they're delusional. But in this relationship, because I've developed healthier boundaries. When something occurs where he's experiencing emotions, my first thing, my first reaction is, oh my God, what did I do? How can I make it better?

But then, yes, because that was, that was your training from such a young age. That, that, that. And it's hard, it's hard to eliminate that gut reaction because that happened for you when you were probably a five year old little girl learning that. So retraining your brain on that thinking is, is so challenging.

Well, what. So. So for me, I have to. The training or retraining is about recognizing when I'm running to a fire and it's not really there and there is nothing for me to fix. And my current spouse will say that, and he's like, this isn't your problem. This is my stuff. You know, he'll remind me, and then I step back and I'm like, oh, yeah, Or I catch myself. Wait a minute. This has nothing to do with me. He's an adult. He is, you know, a smart individual. He's going to figure this out, and I can be here to listen, but I don't have to do anything, and.

You don't emotionally have to fix.

Exactly.

Oh, my gosh.

That's an eye opener. When you've never lived life that way, it's like, okay, so then what do I. What do I do with all this extra time when I'm running around fixing things or people or whatever?

Right. Right. That is. That is so, so important. I want to have you move next into living your empowered life. Now that you have under, you know, you. You're working on finding your freedom. You're navigating and maneuvering through that. How do we start living your empowered life? Because I know I can speak from experience. When you lose that past life, no matter how dysfunctional it is, you know it's dysfunctional. You know it was not. Okay. There's still a grieving process. There's still. I don't know how you experienced it, but for me, Susan, it was. I grieved for a long time. I grieved the life I thought I had. I grieved the future I thought I was going to have. It was a grieving process for me. So after you go through that first big step of finding your freedom, how do you start to live your empowered life?

Well, first of all, Pamela, I have to say. Oh, my God. Were you in my mind? Because.

Well, I think that's why we. We've connected so well, Susan. I think because we both have been through a very similar path, and. And I think we just. You know, people find each other for a reason, and there's a reason why we found each other because you're in California and I'm in Oklahoma. So, you know, I think it's just we find each other because certain people are meant to be part of your world, and. And our connection is very purposeful. But I would love for you to talk about how you were able to start living your empowered life after you stepped away and found that freedom.

I would love to. So, first of all, I. It's a work in progress, like we've already said. I, and like I intended, wanted to come out happier, healthier, mentally, emotionally, and physically than I'd ever been in my life. And so I focused on learning how to love and respect myself, because I realized I didn't. And I was quite. I am quite accomplished. You know, other people look at me and go, you're crazy. Look at all these amazing things. But I didn't accept it or receive it. So I had to work on really owning my truth of being a spiritual guide and leader, a light leader, being a conduit for spirit. Crazy stuff like that.

Crazy good stuff.

Good stuff. But it. It in learning how to love myself more than I ever had in my life. And that was one of my affirmations. You know, I am love, I am loved, and I love myself more than I ever have in my life. And I just would continue to focus on that through the tears, through the pain. I would go for long walks just repeating that to myself because I knew I was. I really wanted to be happy. And so, Pamela, this is interesting, and I'll talk more about the living, the empowered life. But I. I wrote tons of affirmations while I was going through my divorce, and I. I have a spiritual practice of meditation, and I often read inspiring books and things like that. And so I. I have collected a whole bunch of amazing quotes, too. And so I put them into inspirational card deck. And so I always pull one before I start my day. And this is the one I pulled is so specific, I can't even believe it. This is how the universe worked to what we're talking about. Actually, I pulled three of them. They're all specific. But I want to read this because it speaks to. How do you live your empowered life? And this is by one of my mentors, Ernest Holmes. And he said, you rob no person when you discover your good. You limit no person when you express a greater degree of livingness, and you harm no one by being happy. And so that's another cornerstone for me, is that my happiness was not going to hurt anybody. My happiness was going to enliven others, inspire others. And so the more, the happier I became, the lighter, energetically I became, the more I felt empowered from the inside out. Because I. In my experience, empowerment comes from the inside, from aligning yourself with that divine spark that you are, that intuitive being you are, that ancient wisdom that resides within you, and that's what creates your freedom and your empowerment, being in alignment with that, and that is why it's a constant work in progress. So when I chose to, well, I was actually pushed to write a book, create a book called. I called it Live youe Empowered, a 30 day journey book. And it's a workbook. I called it a journey book because it is the journey I went through to come out of my divorce healthier, happier, more free, and loving myself. And so I put it in a book form and it's a workbook, and I intend it. It's intended to help individuals, and you don't have to do it in 30 days. In fact, most people do it in 60 or more. Because some of the stuff that I ask you to look at is confronting. And if you've been in avoidance all your life, then you're going to be confronted with your inner belief systems that are maybe toxic to you or the shame that was put on you by someone else. That's not your shame, it's other people's shame. And so the book guides you through those things. And it's. I, I hope it's a fairly gentle, yet confronting.

Yes.

Journey.

You know, it is. That is so good, Susan, and amazing that you literally put your journey in a workbook form. And I. I have one question I wanted to ask you. When you establish your happiness for the first time, when you actually started focusing on your happiness, did you have to navigate through guilt of you being happy for the first time?

Oh, yeah. Well. Oh, yeah. Because.

Yeah, I would love for you to expand on that because that. I experienced that myself. Where the first day that I felt so good and so happy, I found myself carrying around guilt all of a sudden. And it. I. I was just in awe of. You're kidding me. I'm feeling guilty because I'm happy. How is that even a thing? So, not that I'm glad that you felt that too, but I'm relieved because it's like, oh, good. Whew. It wasn't just me. But I would love for you to talk about that because that's part of the process. And I'm assuming that will be something that would be touched on in your. Your book. I regret to say that I didn't do the workbook before our conversation because I know I would have. I would thoroughly enjoy it. But talk a little bit about the guilt that comes in when you actually start feeling healthy and happy with yourself.

Well, so the. A couple things about that, Pamela. So I think I believe you mentioned you tapped on it earlier. I believe that. And this is changing this is changing in the moment that we're speaking this, it's changing. But women, for eons were indoctrinated to feel guilty if they experienced happiness, right?

Yes, I agree.

We enjoyed sex, right? Right. We were shamed. If we were smarter than the boys in the class, we were shamed. Right. And so as we begin to. I call it unshackling those chains, emancipating our inner self, that really we. We were brought here for a purpose. And it wasn't to feel shame and guilt and anger and hatred. It was to be that bright light that we are. And so the guilt surfaces for me because part of it, it was my, I, again, love my mom, but part of it was I. I realized I wasn't allowed as much as she supported me in everything. There was this unspoken thing of, but you can't be better than me, so I couldn't be a better artist painter than her. I couldn't do, you know, so my. And it's interesting because now that she's gone and my. My business has limped along, do you know? And now that she's gone, it's like there. There was that one obstacle. So. So what I found coming out happier is that there were some people that actually kind of acted like they resented me, that I was happy. Right. We're surprised that I found an amazing relationship the day after I got my final divorce papers. You know, there's some jealousy or resentment that I landed better than on my two feet. Do you know? And so, yes, so the guilt comes up every once in a while. That. And it's funny too, Pamela, that that guilt plays a game with us. And for me, I notice, I don't even know sometimes that it's creeped up and it's, you know, piggybacking on me, walking around whispering to me of, you, you shouldn't be, you know, you shouldn't be, whatever. You shouldn't be buying that thing that you like that you were never allowed to buy because there was no money or, you know, you shouldn't be allowed. And because it is, I want to say insidious, right? It does sneak up. I have not noticed it slamming me in the face, but it does sneak up. And then I'm like, why am I feeling. Not. Why am I feeling guilty? And so the thing that guilt does for me, I don't know about you, is it makes me feel not good enough. It draws me down into the depths of low self esteem that I had.

To work so hard for and undeserving that I Don't deserve this joy. I don't deserve this happiness. I don't deserve this relationship. And it's interesting that what you touched on with your mother, perhaps there was a competition with your mother, not from your vantage point, but from her. That her own insecurities were. Were completely pushed on you, that you couldn't exceed her level of success because of her own insecurity.

Yes.

And I think it's really important that as we. And it doesn't have to be, you know, with your parent, this could be with a friend or with a sibling or a spouse or even a coworker, that other people, Their own insecurities, they. They sometimes try to push them off on our. On us and make us feel their own insecurities. And it's important that you can identify that when you're having that feeling of guilt, of, why are you so happy, Susan? You don't deserve to be this happy, Susan. And you start having that conversation or that. That pit in your stomach feeling of guilt, to be able to step back from that and understand, okay, that was just a trigger. That guilt is a trigger because of somebody else's insecurities that they have pushed on me. And it's. It's an interesting thing to. To navigate, but the quicker you understand and learn those triggers, the faster you can move on and start living that empowered life that you're talking about.

Yes. I often have to ask myself, is this mine?

Yes. Such a great question.

These feelings, is this mine? You know, is this mine to do? Is this mine to act on? Is this mine? Are these my emotions? Especially during this time, Pamela, you know, in everybody being shut off from everybody, emotions are running raw. So even when. And because I'm an intuitive, you know, I go to the grocery store and I come home and I'm like, oh, my God, is this mine? This emotion, this thing? Because everybody's walking around raw that we don't know that we are. We have a mask on, so we think we're protected. But the emotions that everybody's going through and maybe not addressing are still going out because emotions and thoughts are vibrations, and so they're. A vibration is something you can feel, but you can't necessarily touch or see. And because we're all spiritual conduits, we're electrical beings, we pick up on those vibrations, and we don't even know. And then we think it's our stuff when it's not. It could be the person you just were standing in line behind who's suffering, you know, or who's Angry or who's feeling guilty or, you know, because they're out and somebody else isn't, you know, so it's important to be aware of all, you know, the entire spectrum and mine. It's so I can discern where was I, and did I pick up somebody else's stuff?

Well, and picking up somebody else's energy that they are exuding is so important to be able to be able to identify as well. And I'm glad you said that, because I come home from the store and I'm exhausted emotionally from just going to the store, and it really wasn't that hard. And I truly believe that the energy that other people are putting off right now is everything from fear, guilt, shame, uncertainty, everything that you can imagine people are feeling and absolutely giving off that negative energy.

Yes. And part of it, too, Pamela, is. Throughout this entire year, everybody has been wanting to figure it out, right? What's the answer? How do I get out of this? I just had breakfast with two very close friends, and this one friend said, but how do I. I'm feeling depressed. How do. What do I do to make it go away? What. How do I get out of it? And I'm like, oh, my God. It's just what is right now? And I would have. I was that person, my friend. I was looking at her as she's talking, and I'm like, oh, my God, that was me. That was me being depressed in my marriage, being depressed during my divorce. You know, how do I make it different? How do I change the outcome? How do I, you know, can I control the outcome? Please let me control the outcome. Please let me tell everybody what I actually think. And we can, to a degree. But there's this other part that. Oh, it's a hard lesson. I'm still learning it. I'm still learning. It's because we are conduits for spirit. Everyone is on this planet. Everything is connected in a spiritual grid of energy. And because of that, there is this place that goes beyond expectation. There is this place that goes beyond definition. We can't define it right. We can't name it. We can even say, I want out, but we don't know when we get out, where are we going, Right? So what does that really mean? So learning. Learning to become comfortable in the not knowing is often excruciating. My friend I was speaking with yesterday says she often says she feels like she's squirming like a worm on a hook. You know, it's that uncomfortable. But the. The point is, during this entire year. And it's going to continue for a while longer, energetically and emotionally and probably physically. The whole lesson has been that we don't have control. Human beings want to have control, but we don't. We can intend, we can change direction, we can clean up or just put a lot of garbage out there, but the ultimate truth is there is something else at work. And when we can, which is why I guess I do a lot of guided meditations, because I need it when we can sit with ourselves and what is. And this was. It's a continual lesson for me, just sit with what is and not try and make it different. The holidays are coming. We want it to be what it was. It's going to be different. And instead of trying to control how different it's going to be, if we can just sit with what is as we approach those milestones, I guess just be present to yourself, then you can hear what your next step is. And the bottom line is the wanting to control the outcome, the wanting the outcome to look like what I think has kind of gone away. I mean, it's more just being present in the moment with yourself and with whoever you're with, and allow whatever wants to flow through you in terms of creativity, in terms of activity, in terms of just being peace or love in that moment for yourself and for that person, then that takes you to the next step. I guess what I'm saying is that I don't know that there's an end game here. And oftentimes wanting to control the outcome means that there's an end game, right? It means that, oh, well, if I do A, B and C, I'm going to get D. Well, no, there's no Alphabet soup here that we can multiply and subtract and come out even. It's just not possible.

That is such great information, Susan. And I think part of most people's issue is the goal post has been checked, changed, and moved. Every, you know, we reach this marker, this is what's going to happen. Well, nope, then we moved the marker and then we almost got to the marker. Oh, moving it again. You know, because when it all started back in, I would say March was really the, the big start of it for most people. Awareness started happening in February, but March, it really seemed to. To crash and burn. I think, you know, we all felt like, okay, we can do this for two weeks, right? We can do this for three weeks. We can shelter in place, do all the things. Well, now here we are to the, to the end of the year and I think that marker keeps getting moved and that's where the depression is starting to settle in. That's where it's like, okay, I can't take this any longer. That marker has been moved so many times. I. It needs to. To stop because I'm going to lose myself. I'm going to lose my mind. I'm going crazy. I think people are really feeling a level of desperation and depression. Tell me about your meditation exercises. If you could dive into that a little bit more specifically and, and tell me about the Insight Timer app. Link all that together for me. Because I just know, Susan, people need that in their life right now. They need an escape and they need a place that they can go to when that anxiety level is going up and the depression level is going up. They need a place to go to and do some meditation. They need a resource. So if you could share that with us, I'm so excited to hear about that.

I'd love to. So there's lots of meditation or mindfulness apps that are out there now. I got involved with Insight Timer, oh, a long time ago, I think when they first came out because I was teaching classes on meditation. And they have a timer where you can set it for five minutes and a bell rings and you don't have to worry about did I fall asleep and sleep through my day. But they also have guided meditations by some really remarkable practitioner of mindfulness and meditation and all sorts of stuff. And so I started loading my guided meditations that I create every Monday. I have a guided meditation on my Facebook page that lasts about from at 9 o' clock Pacific time that lasts about 15, 20 minutes. I find for me that it's not. So people have this idea that meditation is about being silent. I think sometimes what's most helpful is listening to prompts that helps your intuitive unhook or recalibrate. And so that's what I do in my guided meditations that go on Insight Timer. It's an app you can have on your phone and you can access anything. If your listeners want to get specific to my meditations, they can go to my website, susanburrel.com and there is a gold icon at the bottom. That is a bowl. That is the Insight Timer app insignia. Click on that and it'll take you right to Insight Timer so you can listen and to my meditations and specifically. And in fact, I'm. So when I work with clients, I am guided to do a meditation during a session often to help them unhook, unleash, and all that stuff. So I did this one meditation for a client. It's called out of the Box Thinking and I'd love to give that as a gift to your listeners.

PAMELA oh my gosh. SUSAN thank you so much. Yeah, that's that's awesome.

So all if you're listening@susan burrell.com free-gift meditation but Pamela have the information later in the show notes but so meditation for me is something that will calm me down and realign me. Sometimes I kick and scream before I can sit down and really focus. But I find that oftentimes listening to someone else is very helpful so that I can get more centered within myself. It's a really, really, really good tool.

That is fantastic and just absolutely something that we all need going into the holiday season as well as dealing with the COVID situation in our country and in our it's different all across the country, but wherever you are, it's your reality. So whatever that looks like for you, having that meditation option I think is so beneficial. Thank you for sharing that and thank you for the free gift. I look forward to digging into that a little bit more. I have not ever tried meditation before, but I it sounds amazing and I will definitely be playing along. SUSAN thank you for that.

So can I say speak one word about that?

PAMELA yes, please.

I I understand that there's belief systems out there that think that if an individual sits quietly and empties their mind, that evil is going to rush in. I'm not going to diss somebody's belief system, but in my experience, being quiet is when I can open more deeply and hear the divine and hear the good that is vibrationally trying to bring us out of this pandemic. So guided meditations, if you've never practiced meditation, I think is a good entree into how do you listen within yourself by having somebody prompt you. So I just wanted to say that.

Thank you for that because as a newcomer to meditation, I I that is such good information that gives me a place to start. Thank you for that. Thank you. So let's do a few rapid fire questions. SUSAN okay.

Okay.

So where can we purchase your book?

Okay.

Because I know everybody listening is going to want to get on board with your book and do the hard work and come out free on the other side.

Right, right. So I so I'm so excited that you asked that question, Pamela, because they everybody can go to Susan Burrell.com and you can see how you get the book. Excuse me, and my inspirational cards. But right now we're we're doing for my team and I believe in the gift of giving and that is what the holidays are for us. And our team gets together and everybody records a non profit that they are going to give to this year. We did it last year. We just did it. It's going to go up in December. But so we decided to do a buy one give one book offer. So if you, if you go to the website Susan Burrell.com I think it's backslash book giveaway. You can buy a book for yourself and then receive a second one for free. And that is a book you could give to someone you care about or give to someone you think is in need of some guidance. And the book is built with me guiding with meditations and videos. There's exercises I asked you to do and you can go to watch a video to see how you do it, that kind of stuff. So it's really a book that supports. My intention was to support individuals in their inner transformation. And the book helps you come out with what your new vision and purpose is for your life. And so what better time than now, right?

Absolutely. And what a great way to get on this journey with someone. Sometimes I think we go through some things and feel so isolated and alone. But what a great way to go through this journey with someone. That is awesome. Okay, next rapid fire question. What is your favorite holiday tradition?

Oh, wow. I think it decorating the Christmas tree.

Awesome. Do you have yourself yet?

No, but the Sunday after we're putting it up because we're going to have a small Christmas party for my spouse's Lions Club. He's been working with the Lions and they're for vision and providing all sorts of things for vision around the world. And so they're going to come and we're going to celebrate social distancing and sharing the holiday. But the other thing about that, my other favorite holiday thing is to carve pumpkins with my son for Halloween. So. Yeah, that's.

That's so good. That's so good. So what is your best advice, Susan, in avoiding conflict during the holidays? Isn't that a loaded question? Yeah, it goes for right along with establishing healthy boundaries. So I know those two go hand in hand. So what is your best advice in avoiding conflict during the holidays? Because there's, there's. This is a reality for many people. They dread the holidays because every year there's a conflict. So what can we do to avoid that conflict this year?

So you know what? I'm so glad. I guess when we're done recording this I'm going to have to sit down and work on my inner conflict, because I think so I'll just speak from. What I'm working with is to notice that there's a story you're telling that oh my God, Aunt so and so is going to show up and do what she always does and blah, blah. And so you got to watch the story you're telling yourself, oh my God, I have to sit down and do this now because the story is the thing that creates and amps up the conflict. And so you can walk into a situation with that story created in your head and the reality is not playing out except that you're projecting that story so this, eventually something conflictive is going to show up to match your story. Right. So what's the story you, you were telling yourself in preparation now? This isn't a Pollyanna thing either, Pamela, you know. Well, it could be a happy story, you know, I could tell a happy story. You know, we're all going to get along. I think it's more fine where you can have your inner neutrality watch when you're telling the story that you're making up that hasn't happened happen yet and just put it to the side or let it go if you can, and try and find an inner neutrality where you can be open hearted, loving, kind, receptive and trust that the universe is going to be right with you, allowing only love to come into you, only, only kindness to come towards you if you are. If we project that out, if we are love and kindness and peace, because that's who we are anyway inside, if we focus on those qualities, then that radiates out. That's another kind of unseen boundary barrier. And because when you steep yourself in the love and the peace and the kindness that you are, then those that are coming to you, that may be one of your adversaries kind of thing, a family member will feel that love and that peace and that kindness and whatever conflict that might be brewing can go, can diminish, you know, and your own love and your own peace and your own kindness. Then, then you don't have to react or interact if the conflict in fact does show up.

That is great advice and I think I love how you put it into not just controlling your own emotions, but it's the story you're telling yourself. I love that. I think that can resonate with a lot of people and I think for me on conflicts at the holiday, it's to eliminate a certain expectation to, to not have an expectation. Well, this and this and this and this need to happen. You just go into it with an open mind that it's. And, and a good attitude and a great story that we are going to have a beautiful Christmas or a beautiful Thanksgiving, whatever that looks like for you. But to eliminate a certain expectation. Yes, because expectations seem to end up in disappointment oftentimes. And if you eliminate the expectation, you don't always end up with that. That disappointment that will follow.

Thank you for saying that, Pamela. I swear, when we're done, I am going to sit down and release my expectations of the holiday.

Oh, good, good, good. So good. Okay, so my last question for you. What is your best advice for loneliness during the holiday?

Oh, wow.

I know, I know. And I'm, I, I ask that question because I really, truly feel people are going to be experiencing loneliness this year because of COVID Because of just a lot of reasons. Money. You know, perhaps you normally would fly to grandmother's house or you would go here or there. People don't have the expendable income. Covid. So what is some advice for loneliness at the holidays?

I think it's so important to make time to be with a friend or a family member. And if that means going to a park and sitting six feet across or going to any kind of restaurant that might still be open and sitting. But I think we are communal beings and so to be isolated and separated is a detriment and in order. I just think I always feel happier if I've been with someone I love and just shared a good laugh or, you know, or listened with a sympathetic ear. I always feel more connected and less lonely. And I know a lot of people are afraid of going out, but I think it's necessary. And even if it's a Facebook thing, you know, a FaceTime thing, zoom. Set up regular times for over the next few weeks to connect with a friend. Like once a week or every other day would be good, you know, and I just think connection is important and that helps us not feel so alone. Because everybody thinks I'm raising my hand, Pamela. Everybody. Everybody thinks that they're in it by themselves. Right, right. And so it's important to get out and communicate and commune with other people to see that we're not in it by ourselves. I mean, you can hear the words and watch the TV shows that say we're all in this together. But you have to have a one on one personal experience with an individual.

I think, definitely. And I think you, you have to have an action plan for the loneliness. And with, you know, technology is A blessing and a curse. You know, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But think about if. Okay, so you are living in a city where you don't know anyone. You're. You're by yourself, but you're. You have a choice of not connecting with people or connecting schedule, a zoom time or a Facebook live where you are having Christmas dinner with a friend, where you're toasting with a glass of wine or a glass of juice or whatever you toast with. And, and you're sharing a meal, but you're, you're doing it online that, that helps. You have to have an action plan for loneliness. And, and part of it is because you get depressed. You're choosing to stay there because, well, it's just the way it's going to be this year. So I'm just going to succumb to being lonely. But it is a choice. And you know, one thing I did several, many years ago where I was in a very, very low and lonely place on Christmas Day. I got up early in the morning and I drove throughout our city and I gave out blankets to homeless people. That made me feel less lonely because I was able to do something for someone else. I took my mind off of my own aloneness and shared something with other people. And I think loneliness can be a choice in some cases, but there's a, there's a strategy. There's a plan you can create to avoid being alone or that feeling of loneliness at the holidays.

Yes. I think that's brilliant that you did that. There's an amazing commercial on about an older couple. Couple that makes Christmas ornament decorations and then gives it out to their neighbors. You know, that, that could be something to do. I have a neighbor down the street. Well, I don't know if you. They always go walk the neighborhood with homemade Christmas cookies. Every single neighbor. I mean, there must be like 200 of us here.

Oh, my gosh, that's amazing.

But just thinking of you or Merry Christmas or whatever, it's. Yeah, there's lots of things to do. And you're right. Giving of yourself helps you feel more connected, too.

Awesome. Well, Susan, I cannot thank you enough for this conversation and this talk today. You have a wealth of knowledge for anyone who, who's looking to find their freedom. I love that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger is now your ringtone. And I know that you can identify that when the scars of your past, when you can look back at those scars and truly appreciate them and be grateful for them. I think that's when you. You can honestly say, I've arrived, I have found a new freedom, because without those scars, I never would have found them. And that's when it becomes a beautiful thing. And I thank you so much for sharing your perspective on that. I look forward to getting a copy of your book and working through that journey. That is awesome. And thank you so much for the gift. The get one and give one of your book. And I'll have all of that information in the show notes, the links to the websites, and. And all of the above. Susan, I just thank you so much for being with me today.

Thank you, Pamela, for having me. It's been a blast.

Okay, well, we're gonna sit down and.

Work on my conflict.

Well, and that's just one quick thing to say. We never stop learning, right? We never stop growing and working on ourselves. We are literally a work in progress all the time. So, so grateful that you said that, because it is very true. We are absolutely a work in progress. All right, thank you everyone, for being here today. And I look forward to our next podcast, which will be released next week.

Thank you for joining us today on.

A new life podcast.

We will see you next time. Sa.