Atomic Habits: Ch. 1-3

Hello and welcome to Readers, a podcast where the real-life lessons and applications of books are talked about by a 16-year-old, me, Prithviraj Chavda. Hello everyone and welcome to the first episode of Readers. I'm Prithviraj and this is my guest, Mr. Dutia. Let me hand it over to you.

Hi Prithviraj and hi all the listeners. My name is Anuj Dutia and I'm I'm trying to be a very dedicated and avid reader of nonfiction books. So it's an honor to be here and a great opportunity for me to speak to all of you.

Awesome. It's an honor to have you here. So today we're going to be talking about one of my all-time favorite books, Atomic Habits by James Clear. In my opinion, this book is very unique because it makes the reader think about habits, goals, and systems to achieve those goals in a very different and unique way. At least doing what I did in my everyday normal life was very different for me before I read this book. Okay, without further ado, let's get into the introduction section of the book itself. So before I start talking about the intro, let me just tell you that this intro kind of talks about the author James Clear's backstory about how he was introduced to Atomic Habits and how he really became the book. Before he wrote the book. So he talks about how in one of his years of high school and one of his baseball games, he was hit across the face with a baseball bat by a teammate, and how he had so many injuries, neural injuries, physical injuries, and how this really affected his health. He talks about how he was rushed to the hospital and was rushed to two different hospitals within that time. His parents were freaking out. He was freaking out. And this is how he starts off the book very, very vividly. After he gets over this and he talks about how he was demoted from his team and how he was in the stage of grief for the longest time, sitting in his car and just flipping through the radio station. He talks about after this how he got up and realized that there was more, he could do more, he could get up and start fighting again. He gets into college and although even though he is not a starter at this college, he is still one of the players. So he talks about how he starts having good habits like cleanliness and going to sleep on time instead of staying up and playing video games with his friends. And he talks about how these small habits helped him regain control of his life and ultimately become a very successful person all throughout college, and I would say at least all throughout his adult life as well. What do you think, Mr. Dutta? What do you think about this? And how do you think that these small habits made a difference in his life?

So this introduction, right, Pritvi Raj, was very well defined by you. This was eye-opening to me for two reasons. Firstly, one of the, you know, one of the things that we've heard over and over again in different stories is how a tragic incident changes one's life for good sometimes, if you have control over your emotions and your habits in this particular case. The second thing that impressed me is he talks about in his introduction, as well as upcoming chapters, is there is no Big Bang. There is no one, one fine day you wake up, you realize you're going to change the world and you actually do. It's a matter of those small changes being done every day in a right and consistent manner, which is what got him success. And I'm so glad he ended up writing this book because All of us, at least, at least you and me have learned a lot from this book, and I'm sure everyone who goes through this journey will have their own learning. So I'm very excited to, to discuss this book with you and with all the listeners.

I completely agree. So without going into a very deep dive of the introduction to make it very long-winded, I just want to say the rest of it is kind of about how he applies these things that he's learned throughout the rest of his adult life throughout writing this book. And he talks about using the things that he's learned throughout his whole life and implementing into these books so that we basically get a manual to how to live our lives through it. So let's get into Chapter 1. What is this chapter about? He introduces the concept of what is a habit with a very interesting and unique perspective. He talks about very small atomic changes and the importance of systems rather than goals. He kicks off this chapter with a story, as he often does. About a man named Dave Brailsford and how he was one of the managers for a British cycling team that was not doing very good before he joined them. He talks about how he made very small progressions, including cleaning everything to the smallest detail, changing the colors of the place in order to detail small specks of dust, everything you can imagine, extremely precise, 1% efforts. That eventually added up to an incredible whole. At the end of his career, he said that he had— his British cycling team had set about 9 Olympic records and 7 world records. I feel that this teaches, at least to me, about how very small 1% changes can make such a big difference.

If you, if you think about it, right, um, there is, there is, um, one, um, almost funny, uh, funny note that he has about this British cycling team, right? He said one of the bicycle vendors refused to sell their bikes to the British cycling team because he was worried that the sales will dip. I mean, think about how insulting that can be for an Olympic, national Olympic team. So, and then I'm sure that vendor, the bicycle manufacturer, maybe so disappointed in himself when he sees the end goal and the end, or rather the end results, the Olympic medals. But the reason I find it very unique is because this coach was only focused on that 1% improvement, that 1% improvement every day without thinking about a lofty goal of winning so many Olympic gold medals. I'm pretty sure on day 1, he had no clue of how many medals he will win. Why is that important is because if you look at the other parts of the chapter, as the chapter progresses, James Clear talks about the importance of that 1% improvement or the compounding effect. He shares a couple of interesting statistics. You know, like a nerd, he shows some math where he says, where he shows that if you improve 1% every day, by the end of the year, you'll be 37 times better at whatever you started your year with. I mean, that is incredible if you think about it, right? If I really told you that you'd be 37 times better at something, you'd generally jump on it. Then he goes into, you know, giving some real-life examples about how compounding works, like natural examples, the ones from nature. I'm a huge fan of picking examples from nature because that's where we come from. So he talks about there is an ice, you know, ice sitting in a room where the temperature is dipping, or rather rising 1 degree every so often. So it goes to 1 degrees, 2 degrees, 3 degrees, nothing happens. Ice is just there. Then the temperature is 32 degrees. And boom, the ice starts to melt. But the point he's trying to make is it wasn't that 1-degree change, because that 1 degree from 31 to 32 or 32 to 33 was same as, same as when the temperature changed from 1 to 2. What he was— what the point he was trying to make is the compounding effect, um, makes that, that big bang, so to speak, where ice melts. Same thing he talks about tectonic plates, you know, trying to rub with each other for millions of years. And one fine day, when they rub with each other one more time, there's a huge earthquake. Doesn't— it's no different from what it— what they've— it's been doing for hundreds or thousands or millions of years, but it's that compounding effect. So I love, I love the way he uses these examples, but most importantly, then he relates it back to how it can make a difference in our goal, in, in our lives as well. So I I don't know, it was, uh, it was very inspirational, so to speak. And I, I put in a lot of things in my, uh, daily routine. Um, let's see if I'm able to get returns like those, but, uh, definitely inspiring.

Definitely. Um, and he also talks a little bit about how that 1% rule, as much of a positive difference as it is about and able to make, it can also— it's a double-edged sword. It can also reverse that. You know, every time you choose to skip a workout, every time you choose to not cook that healthy food at your house and go pick up some pizza or some takeout instead. Every single time, it is a compounding effect. It does ensure that you follow that pattern every single time. So you have to be careful as to where and when you use this. So now he talks about what he calls the plateau of latent potential. So to use an example to make it a little easier to understand, imagine you are somebody who wants to go to the gym every single day. You know, and you go, you work out for a couple weeks, and you're sweating every time. It takes out 2 hours of your day, and you're exhausted. And, you know, you look in the mirror after a couple of weeks and you see nothing. You see no difference. And you think, what's the point of all of this? I don't understand why I am going this much. I don't see any difference. So this area is what I would like to call the Death Valley of your latent potential. This is the area where you just have to keep pushing, keep pushing through, and after you do that, you can go ahead and even surpass your wildest dreams. Maybe you can even set 9 Olympic world records and 7 world, 7 world records, and that's all dependent on whether you choose to keep pushing forward through that difficult time, and that latent potential just starts to kick in and will send you hurtling forward. Um, after this, he talks and says, um, something. He says, forget about goals, focus on your systems. He talks about how all the winners and all the losers have the same goals. Everyone who participates in the Olympics, their goal is to win a gold medal. That doesn't mean they all win it. Very few do. He talks about how what differentiates these winners and these losers, it's clearly not their goals. It's their systems. How do they work towards achieving that? Do they make every 1% effort that they can in order to maintain that and keep pushing forward, or do they slack off, or do they not keep pushing forward when it's the hardest, when they really have to? He uses an example of if you're a coach, your goal might be to win a championship, but that's not how you're going to get there. It's going to be by your system. And he talks about how your system is the way that you recruit players, how you manage your assistants, your coaches, and how you conduct your practice. And this is how you're going to fully go ahead and win that championship, not just because you said you want to.

If you— that's a very good summary of his thoughts, Pritviraj. I actually loved a quote he used that stays with me a lot more than I thought it would. He says, you do not rise to the level of your goals, You fall to the level of your systems. If you think about it, that has a lot of depth. You know, I personally never thought about goals, habits, and systems so intertwined with each other. He almost— not almost, he actually, he actually strongly recommends to not even think about goals or think about them, set them, and forget them. But the next chunk of energy or your full dedication of time and effort should be around making sure those systems are in place. What are you doing every day, every hour, every minute about, about a specific system kind of gives you a framework. There is one nuance that I, I, or one deduction that I took out of this, which is not even mentioned in the book. That once you have that discipline, systems and processes in place, I call it like a framework that he's proposing in a way. That framework pretty much applies to anything and everything that you may want to accomplish. So there is a unique underlying nuance of his explanation about why these systems are so important because we are, we are so caught up in always thinking about goals that we fall into that same trap of that big bang, you know, how can I make my next million dollars, or how do I lose my next 40 pounds, so on and so forth. And we forget about the systems. And his whole book is about why the systems work more than just, you know, setting these lofty goals. So I love the first chapter, and, and it, it, you know, it The rest of the book became a page-turner for me.

Absolutely. And on that note, we're going to end the first chapter and move on to the second. So in this chapter, James talks about what leads to the creation of habits. He says it's all about behavior change and how to create good habits that change you at the root level. So he starts this off by talking about 3 different layers of behavior change. He says the first layer is changing your outcomes. These are the ones that are about your results, your goals, you know, losing your 40 pounds, publishing a book, winning a championship. The second layer he talks about is changing your process. This is about changing your habits, such as implementing a new routine at the gym or decluttering your desk for better workflow. And this is the third one and the deepest one. This is changing your identity. This one is concerned about changing your beliefs and you at the root level, what you truly believe inside.

You know, these 3 layers sounded very foreign to me in conjunction with the habits when I first read them. And I had to read this chapter a couple of times to get the best out of it. But the exact outcome was absolutely interesting in terms of the learning process, right? He talks about identity is the core of the habit formation. I first thought, what is he even talking about? But then he gives some real good examples. He says, if a smoker is trying to quit, there are two smokers who are trying to quit or who have already quit smoking cigarettes. And one of them says, oh, I'm trying to quit, or I've quit smoking. I'm not going to smoke. And the other says, I'm not a smoker. Um, he, he talks about how the other guy, the one who says I'm not a smoker, is going to be way more successful to keep smoking away because he, he's changed his identity and his habit and his outcome is based on his identity. Whereas the other guy, the first person, it sounds like he is a smoker but he's choosing not to smoke. But at the core he's a smoker, although he doesn't say that. Um, James, James talks about good examples where he, um, he talks about a voter study that they did where, where, um, I forget which country was it, but they did the study where they said, are you, are you going to vote or not, or something to that effect for the elections? And one, one set of responders said 'Yeah, I am going to vote,' and the other set said, 'I am a voter.' Um, so the other set— and, and I'm just, I'm just, you know, paraphrasing, these weren't the exact words— but, um, the other set turned out to be, uh, you know, way more active in the elections. And it— the results was so surprising that they couldn't believe it. So they retested the results in a lot of elections after that, and the same thing came out. So there is, there is, um— I stretched that example a little bit to make a point, point because there is a nuance to this. So if I've heard this so many times, and these are the examples that James gives in the books too, it also— Prithviraj, you mentioned about double-edged sword in the previous chapter, right? He also talks about this in the identity-based habits as a double-edged sword, um, um, you know, nuance. He talks about, you know, people, people say things like, I'm not a morning person. I'm horrible at math. Oh, I'm not good at directions. Think about it. In our daily lives, how many times we would have heard about these things, you know, from people. And we— I myself get frustrated when someone from my family or my friends, friend circle says, oh, I'm not a morning person. I said, there's nothing like a morning person. If you want to wake up, you put an alarm and you wake up. That's— and maybe I say that because I am a morning person. But the funny part is that making that as a part of identity is a game changer. So this is what I'm trying to literally do this every day and trying to, you know, I would almost call it like fool my brain to say always relate whatever I want to get done with my identity. And it works. I mean, it works. We are all human. So it's been— this chapter has taught me a lot as well.

Couldn't have said it better myself. And some of these ideas that you're talking about, you know, I recognize from some different places. You know, I heard it in Sal Khan's talk where he talks about what is called a growth mindset. Carol Dweck talks about this as well. She's got a book called The Growth Mindset where she talks about all this, which is you're not hardwired from birth to, I don't know, be horrible at math or be really good at one thing or really bad at another. You can develop, you can learn, you can grow, you can change. Neuroplasticity is real, and it's always changing and growing every single day. Um, and you know, all of this, maybe it sounds great in theory, but does it really work? Um, and that's what I was thinking as I read this chapter. But you know, then I thought to myself, I've actually experienced this or seen this myself. And I remember about a year ago, uh, my mom was talking to me, and she's somebody who's never read that much and doesn't like reading as much either. She's always tried to get me to read because she knows, she knows it's a great thing to do, but she never enjoyed doing it from before. But, you know, one morning she just walks up to me and she goes, "Hey, you know what? I'm going to be a voracious reader. I am a voracious reader." So I was like, "Oh, okay, you know, like, sure, I'm yet to see it, but, you know, good luck on your journey," right? And within this year, I would say she definitely is a voracious reader. She's reading every time she's got her free time, any time other than when she's working. And I think that those words, that self, self-pushing and self-telling yourself that you can do this, I am this, not I want to do this even though I'm not good at it, is really just pushing and helping yourself be the best you can be. And if it helped my mom and it— James Clear says that it can help him, I don't see why we shouldn't give it a try ourselves.

That's a wonderful example, actually. Um, thanks for sharing that with me, Raj. I think this is— that, that is inspiring, to say the least. One thing I noticed is your mom said she is a voracious reader. She did not say, I want to read more books, which is, which is what she could have— she could have said as well, but maybe she couldn't have gotten the success based on what James Clear is teaching us as well. So Amazing. My personal example is actually a little similar, but in a different direction. In my whole life, right, I've never played a sport. I've never exercised a lot. But about 2 years ago, I said, I'm a fit guy and I'm gonna be, you know, I have my fitness goals. In fact, I was so shameless and I don't repent that. I went and told all my friends that, you know, I'm a fitness freak. 2 years later, I've been able to push myself to exercise 5 or 6 days a week, one way or the other, because I realized, right? And one of my other favorite books you talked about, Carol Dweck's Growth Mindset, which is— maybe we can do a review on that. That's an excellent book as well. There's another one by Scott Young. It's called Ultra Learning. It's the same thing. He kind of, kind of, he mixes, mixes James Clear's concepts as well in a way. But he talks about how you practice every day, you show up every day, and that becomes you. Pretty much your habit become you. That's what even James Clear concludes in this book. So by your mom saying she's a voracious reader, or by me saying that, you know, I'm a fit guy, it It motivates us to do the things that is right for that goal every single day. But the crux of this chapter, which I think jives well with these examples, is these are habits born out of identity and not just out of a goal that I want to do this, I want to read a book, or I want to be fitter, or I want to lose weight. It's about I am that, right? It's a huge difference. And if that works, why not, why not tell our brain or ourselves that from day one? Because all of us, all of us want to be successful at what we commit to. Maybe this is one thing worth trying.

Definitely. Um, and so here, you know, all of these things are great, but he says there's a very specific two-step process that he talks about to changing your identity. He says the first is decide the kind of person you want to be, you know. Do I want to be a voracious reader? Do I want to be a fit guy? Do I want to be, you know, whatever I want to be? Do I want to be a sports player, a runner, whatever? So that's the first step. And then second, he says, is to prove it to yourself with small wins, you know. If, say, you want to be a writer, every time, you know, you write a page in this new novel you're creating, say to yourself, tell yourself, and know yourself that I am a writer. I am a writer, you know, I'm somebody who writes, I love it. You know, every time you go out for a jog in the morning, tell yourself I am a runner. Every time, you know, you shoot a hoop or make a basket, tell yourself I am a basketball player. Whatever you want to do, whatever you thrive and strive to do, just tell yourself every small win all adds up like he said at the beginning. Every 1% adds up at the end, and it all matters. And that's how you change your identity. And that's how he talks about— is the core root and philosophy of how to change your habits and your identity in order to become a growth-centered person. So on that end, let's end Chapter 2 and move on to our last chapter, Chapter 3. This chapter is going to go into a little bit of the psychology and the thought process that your brain goes through in order to create good habits and to get rid of the bad ones. So he starts this chapter off with another story about a man named Edward Thorndike. Edward Thorndike was a psychologist, and he conducted a study in which he took a cat and he put it inside which— what he called a puzzle box. And this puzzle box was kind of like a little maze with different levers and buttons and things you could press. That would enable the cat to get out. So the first time we put the cat in there, it took it about 170 seconds, I think, for the cat to figure out whatever it needed to press and get out. You know, it wasn't exactly challenging, but it was new. And so after about 160, about 170 seconds, the cat was able to get out and, you know, eat a treat or something. And he kept putting it in there. He kept doing this, kept doing this. The food was at the end. And at the end I think the cat had gotten out in about 7 seconds. So he uses this example to talk about how our brains are hardwired to finish the tasks that we're meant to do, that we're supposed to do, especially the ones that get us a reward or something at the end, and how our brains are habits that they make it easier that way in order to find or get something in the end. Um, and he says that habits are created in order to make everyday activity and life easier, um, and this happens through, uh, a set of 4 different, um, a set of 4 different reactions that your body does. He says the first is a cue, the second is a craving, the third is a response, and the fourth is a reward. So starting off with the first one, a cue Giving you an example, the cue would be, say, you're sitting on the couch and your phone buzzes with a new text message. That would be the cue. Second, craving. You want to learn the contents of the message. Who's texting me? Is it my best friend? Is it somebody else? Who is this? You pick up your phone. Response. That's the response. You grab your phone and you read the text. The fourth one is the reward. You've satisfied your craving. You now know who it's from and what the message says. Grabbing your phone becomes associated with your phone buzzing, and this creates a neural pathway through your brain that creates a habit. So now every single time you're hearing your phone buzz, what do you want? You want to go grab that thing and you want to go look at the text message. So he says that these are the different things that you go through in order to that create a habit, whether it's intentional or unintentional.

If you— so it's interesting, I'm just to remind myself of this, these 4 steps of a habit loop. I call them 2 Cs and 2 Rs, right? Cue, craving, response, and reward. He, by the way, he also refers to to the, the one of my other favorite books, The Power of Habits, uh, by Charles Duhigg, right? Um, so, but, but why I like James Clear book as well, um, uh, with, with regards to these 4 things, uh, for habit loop is James goes and then tries to give a framework about how to use these natural instincts for, for the habit loop to make sure you're able to put the right habits in place, of course, and the right systems in place, like, uh, to, you know, to form those habits. Um, a couple of intriguing things he mentions, which is— or rather, I deduced out of, out of these first part of the chapter, Pritviraj, was, um, you know, habits are extremely important for our evolutionary reason as well. I mean, think about it, if we don't he equates these habits or any habits to some amount of automation. Imagine, imagine, you know, our ancestors when they were looking for food and when they had to be scared of predators, they instantly would know not to do something because that would, that would hurt them versus to do something else to go and to go and get more food. So this is, this is a very important, uh, you know, um, uh, important aspect of our evolution. So what he— then he also quotes that, um, from the studies have shown that as habits are created, for example, the cat example that you gave that went from a few minutes to a few seconds, um, when, uh, you know, when, when, when the habits were formed. Because as habits are created, the activity in the brain decreases. So these are, these are some very important underlying, um, aspects of, of making sure that we can create a habit loop to make our lives easier. If you think about it, this concept is kind of intertwined with his point of putting together systems. So what he's saying is, if we know these 2 Cs and 2 Rs are the secret sauce for cultivating a habit, and habits are the secret sauce to accomplishing bigger things, then why not create an environment which, you know, which makes these 4 steps, the cue, craving, response, and reward, which you explained pretty well, to create these habits. So I'm like, huh, he is, he is not only going into the science of, you know, an identity-based habit lasts longer, a 4-step process is natural to human beings. So now why not use all these, these pieces of knowledge to go and create that habit loop, so to speak, that guarantees our, our success, or rather maximizes the chances of success of the goals we want to accomplish.

It's 10 o'clock. Yeah, so that's great. I think that was a great summary of what we just talked about. And I think that that's great that he puts in this awareness and this idea of how, you know, like what the brain goes through and how you think about creating these new habits. But what I personally really love about the book is it's not just about that awareness. He also talks about how to implement these ideas and these awareness into our lives. And this is what he goes into next, is how do you use these 4 laws to create a good habit? You know, it's great to know that, okay, every time my phone dings, I'm going through these 4. That's great, but what do I do with it? And he talks here about how the 4 steps— cue, craving, response, and reward— how you can use them to create a good habit. So he says the first law, cue, he says to make it obvious, you know, make it right in front of you. Say, uh, for me personally, I wanted to learn the guitar because I've never really gone into musical instruments, and I think it's something I should do, and it's really beneficial. Um, so, you know, I decided to take my guitar and I put it smack in the middle of the living room. You know, so like as soon as I sit down, anything else I see is that, that's the first thing I see right there, right? So the second law, craving, make it attractive, make it something I want to do, you know. Every time, say, I learn a new song on the guitar, like it fuels me inside, it makes me feel better, you know. I get to go perform it for my family, I get to go play it by myself, and it feels great. You know, the third law, response. He says to make it easy. Don't make it something that's very, very difficult for you to do. You know, I don't want to go climb up two flights of stairs to reach a guitar when the TV remote's right in front of me and I could just, you know, watch some Netflix. I want it to be easy. I want it to be right in front of me. This is how I can create easy habits that'll make the guitar or whatever I want to do make it so much simpler, so much easier for me to create that habit. And the last one he says is a reward. Make it satisfying, you know. Maybe every time I learn a new song on the guitar, maybe I would go out for ice cream at the end of that week, or, you know, maybe I would go get brownies with my family. Whatever I do, it's, um, it— there's a reward at the end. There's something I accomplished, and I know that I didn't just do this and then get nothing out of it. There was some fruition that happened because of it. And I feel like if I'm able to employ these, um, you know, maybe someday I'll, uh, be able to play a full song on the guitar. And I'll let you know when that happens, but, uh, until then, I'll be following these habits.

And I'm sure, I'm sure it'll happen. You're on the right track. Um, the, the, the same concept of double-edged sword that we talked about in the previous two chapters he talks about in regards to these 4 steps as well. So he says, make the bad habits go away by making the cues go away, by making the, you know, craving harder. You talked about, you talked about the video game versus the guitar example. So he exactly says that when you want to break a bad habit, make sure the cues disappear or, or, or they're harder to get to. Same thing with the, with the cravings and response. So this framework is very unique because it not only helps you form good habits, it helps you break the loop for the bad habits as well. So when you actually put this in practice, it's actually much easier than you thought it would be. So none of this is just theoretical. This, this works. You, you give a fantastic example. I have a couple of examples of my own. But the, but the result is same. It's, you know, you, you try to get in tune with the, with the, with the natural law of these 4 steps on both sides of the aisle, uh, for forming good habits and breaking bad ones, and it works like magic. So why not give it a try? I mean, it's, it's a proven science.

Definitely. Um, and he, uh, in this you talked about how to break that bad habit, and I actually have another example for that one. Where, you know, I, for a while, I actually got like some video game console for Christmas, and I was enjoying it a lot and stuff, but I realized every time I would sit down to watch TV or something like that, that's what I would do, and I didn't want to get really just hooked onto those video games because I know it's not good for me. In moderation, it's fine, but I know that it's not good. And after reading this book, actually, I ended up trying to follow some of these habits and seeing if it's good. Um, and so first law, right? He says make it invisible in order to break that bad habit. So I took it and I just, I put it underneath a bunch of papers in a shelf somewhere. Um, make it unattractive, right? I told myself every time I played with this console, I would have to do 20 pushups afterwards. Uh, and you know, it's not the problem with doing those pushups, it's just I'm just too lazy to do that. Um, and, and so I just really didn't want to do it. Um, so that's what made it unattractive. Made it— make it difficult. You know, I didn't want to get up, go all the way upstairs or wherever that shelf was, and dig underneath all of that, find the whole thing, and take it out. Um, and the fourth one, make it unsatisfying, right? Like, I already talked about the push-ups thing. I know that it's not good for me, and after I finish playing, you know, it's just Personally, it's also like a mental drain, you know, like after I finished playing a video game or something, it just doesn't feel good inside. I just pretty much know that I wasted about 2 hours of my life that I'm never getting back on something that was not very useful to me anyway. So these are the different things that I kind of employed. And, you know, now I'm proud to say I haven't, I don't think I've touched that console in 6 months. But, you know, like it's fun to do that in moderation every now and then. But it's also important to know your own limits, to set those limits, and to have that full control over your life that he talks about in that first chapter. And it definitely makes me feel better knowing that, you know, like, that thing is not controlling me. Every time I feel like it, I'm not just gonna go and do it. I've got those control— I've got that control, and I know what I need to do in order to stop myself from forming these habits, even if my mind is just wandering right towards that. From the beginning.

No, you're absolutely right. In fact, if you think about it, in conclusion, what I would say is, um, he is talking about the science, he is giving us the statistics and examples from, um, from real world, and the best part is he's giving us a framework to actually do those two things that we all want to do but are rarely successful. Is form these good habits and break the bad ones. As simple as that. If you're able to take all the science and research and, you know, framework to accomplish these things, voilà, I think that's a win-win. I mean, I'm sure he feels good that people like us benefit, and we can do big things. And I'm I'm super excited to see what compounding will get all his followers at some point, or other followers of the systems at some point, because I think we are all, you know, got to do real big things, real great things, I would say, only if we knew what to— what will get us there on a, you know, daily basis. So here we are. I think this has been a phenomenal journey so far, and I'm sure that all the listeners will Yeah, will benefit as well.

Yeah, many more to come. Make sure you guys stay tuned and, uh, come back for the next one. Thank you so much.

Thank you for having me.