Relationships at Work: How to Authentically Network Within Your Company (Pt. 3)

Welcome to Readers, the podcast for the lifelong learner. Join us on our weekly dose of wisdom where we talk about the real-life lessons and applications of books. Enjoy! Welcome back to Readers, everyone. Today we will be discussing part 3 of Relationships at Work: How to Authentically Network Within Your Company by Rachel Simon. Welcome back to the podcast, Rachel. Thank you so much for joining us today.

Thank you. I've been so delighted to be here. Thanks for having me back for the third time.

Absolutely. It's been a great journey and thank you so much for your time. So in the last episode, we discussed a number of concepts, including the value of networking the right way, how to have the difficult conversations, the importance of sometimes letting go, and finished off with a conversation about gratitude. Today is the third and final part of this book. And without further ado, let's dive into chapter or tip 15. So this chapter kicks off with a discussion about an experience I recently had: networking in a large group setting. Hmm. Now, as I mentioned in the previous episode, I recently went to an info session for one of the most selective organizations on campus, during which everyone is just there for networking. There are about 30 people trying to talk to the president, another 30 people talking to the vice president, yada yada yada. The point is, it seems almost impossible to make an impression or even meet new people without it seeming very, very forced. But that's what this chapter is all about. So you've covered a lot of tips in this chapter. Everything from assigning yourself a minimum time limit to stay, paying attention to body language, setting goals to meet someone new, and even taking notes. I want to ask you, can you share how some of these tips have helped you in such settings and the approach you take to networking in a large group?

I hate these large group settings. I really do. I hate the happy hours. I hate the big ballrooms full of people. It's really, really terrible for an introvert like myself. I connect really well with people one-on-one, which is why I go to coffee, which is why I go to lunch, which is why I sit down with people one-on-one. But the large group settings are really hard. Nonetheless, it's part of life, and as an executive, it's part of my job. So I have taught myself some tips on how to make it work, not just survive, but to thrive. Ironically, I've met some of my closest friends at these kind of events, and I would have completely missed out if I had sat it out. And so, yeah, we won't go through everything that I mentioned in the book, but just a couple of things that you already highlighted is I do set myself a minimum time that I have to stay. In the beginning of my career, I'd walk in, feel intimidated, walk right back out. Now I tell myself I have to stay 20 minutes, 30 minutes, whatever the case may be. And then the other tip that I love to give people I might be the only person in the world that looks for a line, that I'll get in the food line, a drink line, and then I'll turn to the person behind me and I'll say, what brought you here today? Or what did you think of that speaker? And I— but make sure it's the person behind you, because if it's the person in front of you, they get their drink and they're out of there. But if it's the person behind you, you can step to the side and wait for them to finish. And then the final tip that I'll give from this is I look for people sitting down. It's so much easier for me to go up to somebody and say, mind if I join you? If they're sitting down, right? Rather than to go up to people standing and say, "Mind if I join you?" So much easier to say, "Is this chair taken?" rather than, "Is this floor space taken?" Right? So yeah, so those are a couple of ways that I've made it work for me. And it's much less intimidating, of course, if you can talk yourself into the fact that it's not so scary, you're not gonna die there, you know, you will be okay.

Yeah, and I feel like that really goes back to that conversation about introducing yourself, right, that you had in the first chapter. And I feel like that's applicable in so many settings. I feel like when you're starting out somewhere new, of course, it's so hard to introduce yourself, but it's also difficult that when somebody else is starting out new in your space, you know, some place that you may be running or be the executive of, how do you welcome them and how do you make them not feel uncomfortable? And that's all what the next chapter, chapter 16, is about, right? It's difficult to introduce yourself and most people feel uncomfortable in new environments. So this chapter is all about how you can make someone else not feel that way. Now, you bring up an experience where you moved cities, and although you were moved as a result of a promotion, you were still uncomfortable because of the strange new environment, as most people are. But you also mentioned that it was one colleague acknowledging you that made all the difference. And you also discuss how after such an experience, you have made that same effort to do the same to newcomers, to pay it forward. So I want to ask you, can you speak about your experience with being welcomed into a new space and how you go about welcoming the newcomers, making them feel seen and heard?

It is so intimidating to join a group that's already established, right? It's a, whether it's a job, a company, a committee, a club, it just is really intimidating. And so I try to be that person for other people to welcome them and to make them feel included. And especially part of a job. If somebody joins the team, I will always take them out the first day, second day, and I'll say, let me tell you how things really work around here. Let me tell you where the political landmines are buried. Let me tell you how the boss really likes things. And I just think it cuts through all of the clutter for them. It gives them an ally, gives them a colleague that they can trust. And invariably people hear this and they say, well, nobody welcomed me, you know, when I started. And I always say, But don't you wish they had? Don't you wish they had? So be the change you want to see. Be the culture that you want to see. Be that welcoming person. And again, this applies to a job. It also applies to anything extracurricular. If there's a tight-knit clique, a community, be that person that welcomes other people.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I feel, you know, that the people who end up being welcomed into such an environment, I'm sure they appreciate it so much more than those who are kind of thrown into something so new to them with no one to you know, who they feel like has their back.

That's right.

And, you know, welcoming yourself or being welcomed is probably one of the hardest steps. But I feel like another very difficult step is learning the skills that it takes to succeed there, right? As, you know, going into a new job or even for me, right, going into a new college or a new learning atmosphere, one of the biggest things is that, you know, imposter syndrome. Do I belong here? Do I have the skills that it takes to succeed? There's always expectations that are set for you that sometimes end up seeming too high. And, you know, I'll give myself— I'll give an example from my own life. This past semester, I started on research at a lab. This is something that's usually done, at least in this particular lab, starting late sophomore year, junior year. And as part of this lab, I was expected to conduct data analysis using the R coding language. Now, you know, maybe this is self-incriminating, but I have very limited coding knowledge and little to no experience using it in the real world. So, you know, of course I can't tell my research professor I don't know how to do this very well, um, otherwise I'm not a part of the lab anymore. But, um, because of that, I've kind of been on this grind of just completing courses and watching YouTube videos and, you know, even using ChatGPT to learn how I need to do. Um, but I feel like you have a much more graceful approach to solving such an issue, and that tip is to leverage your network. And I know you already discussed this in the book, But I kind of wanted to ask if you could share an example of a time you may have done this and how to approach as a conversation. How do you leverage your network to grow your skill set?

I literally get stuck in my job 22 times a day. I don't know everything. And even though I've been at my company for 30 years and I've been in my role for, gosh, 5 years now in our organization, I still get stumped on something every single day. The laws are changing, the regulations are changing, the environment's changing. But because I have such a broad network that I could call upon and say, hey, are you working on this? Let's, let's ideate together. And because I have such a broad network, it helps me get my job done with confidence and quickly. I could spend all day looking through our company directory trying to figure out who's working on what, but when I have a broad network in place, I'm just able to pick up the phone, send an email, send a chat and say, you know, gosh, can, can we work on this together? It's so, so, so important. I can't stress enough. Obviously I wrote a book about it and I will likely write a second book about this too, that we sometimes focus so much on the what of our jobs and the how of our jobs that we forget about the who. Who has done this before? Who has a perspective? Who could make it easier? In analogy I like to give, it's kind of like you're, you're put into a kitchen, restaurant, a restaurant kitchen. And you're told, "Go cook." You're like, "What?" "Oh, you're smart. Go, go, you know, you'll figure it out. Go cook." It's like, "Okay, well, I know how to cook salmon. Should I do that?" "Oh yes, but today we need you to bake bread." And so you spend all your time researching recipes for bread and trying to figure all that out when at some point you just need to lift up your head and say, "Well, who has done this before? Who has walked this path? Who am I cooking for? Who, you know, has a perspective?" And so it's the same thing with every single job that we ever had. That the who can make such a difference. So when you have that broad network, it just cuts through all the chaos, it cuts through all the clutter and just makes it go so much easier.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And, you know, although I feel like that's great advice, one thing I was thinking about this whole time is like, how do you feel like your network has been so helpful to you? You know, I feel like a lot of times people, if they can reach out to their network and be like, hey, I don't know how to do this skill or I don't know how to figure this out, can you help me? You know, somebody might once or twice, but it's very hard, I think, to find people who would dedicate that kind of time and effort and energy to you. And I think this is what that next chapter talks a little bit about, is how to reciprocate. How do you make somebody realize that, you know, I see what you did for me, and I see that, you know, you meant a lot to me, and I want you to know that. And often that's not in the literal form of the words, "You mean a lot to me," right? Often it can just be, through small actions that show the other person you are thinking of them. Recently, I was watching an Adam Grant video one day while scrolling on my Instagram feed, and he was talking about pebbling, or sending small messages, reels, or, you know, even memes or something like that to someone else. And, you know, he said that pebbling is not just a trivial pastime, but rather is an act of care to let someone know that, hey, I saw this and I thought of you. And the more I think about it, the truer it is. The most communication I have with a lot of my friends back home isn't through daily phone calls or FaceTime, and maybe that's just me growing up as a teenager in, you know, the digital age, but honestly, that conversation or that connection has happened through some of the most, you know, outlandish Instagram posts you will ever see.

Yeah.

In that, you know, throughout the day we just send these things and remember each other, and that's what Tip 18 talks all about. It talks about the importance of letting someone know that you were thinking of them. That when you come across a good TED Talk or a good book, to send it to someone in your network to let them know you thought of them. I want to ask you, why do you feel like pebbling has been such an important part of your network journey?

Well, I'll answer the question two ways. So let me, let me say something and then I'll get to your question. It's almost like there's a good, better, best strategy for communication. So good is letting somebody know that you're thinking about them. Hey, I saw this and I thought of you, or sending a text, how are you? But if I were to send you a text and say, how's it going? What would you reply? Hey, all good, right? Yeah, thumbs up, you know, busy, but right, you know, you probably get a 2 or 3 word answer. So that's, but that's good. The person knows you're thinking about them. Better might be sending more of a message through email or through LinkedIn or whatever the case may be, something longer. Hey, I know you're going through a rough time, just wanted to see how you're doing. Then you might get a better answer. But best is having a conversation. I have never had relationships fully develop, you know, just by texting. So, um, yes, you do want people to know you're thinking about them, but always keep in mind that good, better, best strategy. OK, so now I will get to, uh, to actually answering your question. Um, people want to feel seen, they want to feel heard. And so one of the ways that I do that is I follow up on conversations. So if we were talking at coffee about, you know, work-life balance, then I might send a podcast. You know, gosh, I listened to this podcast, it was so good, really resonated with me. Why don't you take a listen? And how about if we go to coffee again next quarter and talk about it? And so those are the kind of opportunities I try to think about, that if I know you're at University of Texas and I see something in the news that I might, you know, send it to you, say this is, you know, this made me think about you and the journey that you're on, and I wish you all the luck, read it, and how about we connect one day? And so it's all about making people feel seen and a great way to lead into your next live conversation.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. I feel like, you know, people who are able to see something and remember other people send it to them, a lot of times you kind of feel nervous to do something like that, or like, hey, you know, I don't know how they're going to take it. But honestly, if I think about it, I've never been sent something, or nobody's ever told me that I've thought of you and I've taken it the wrong way, you know. I feel like most of the time people usually just, you know, you can appreciate that. Um, So I feel like that really resonates, I think, with a lot of people.

Sometimes people, if they are interacting with a salesperson, they may think, oh, you know, they're just being slimy and sending me this article because they want me to buy something from them. But even if that's the case, let's even pretend like that's true. Wouldn't you rather have a thoughtful salesperson than a not thoughtful? So there's still good in it, even regardless.

Yeah. And I think that taking that time out just to, you know, send that extra message, send that extra email, you know, however busy you may be. I think it's definitely worth it because something so small can make somebody feel so, you know, important to you. And, you know, and I feel like that's really important. I feel like people miss a lot of these little opportunities because it just seems like, oh, you know, I take the extra time to write that kind of a message, or why take the time to send that email? And I actually have an example of this that recently happened, and it kind of goes into this next chapter pretty well. A few weeks ago, I was in class for my visual and performing arts credit, right? Something everybody has to do. Our teacher asked for a volunteer to be the class scribe, to take notes in order to, you know, publish them and have everybody look at them. Most of us, and, you know, I won't lie, that was including me, just looked around to see if anyone else would volunteer, because you don't really, you know, in my opinion, visual and performing arts is not the most interesting thing in the world. But most people didn't. But that's when one of the girls in the front row, her hand shot up saying she was like, "I would love the opportunity." And that's what this next chapter is all about, right? One person's burden is another person's opportunity. Now, you also share one of my favorite quotes by Thomas Edison here, "Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work." Yeah. I want to ask you, what does this mean to you? How do you feel like you've been able to take on opportunity that other people may have, you know, looked over. You share an example of teaching because that's something that you were passionate about, but I want you to, you know, expand a little bit on how you've been able to do that and how have you seeked out opportunity in what looks like another person's burden.

Yes. So there's different seasons of our life. Some seasons of your life, you know, you're just struggling to keep your head above water and doing your job is all you can do, and that's fantastic. And at some seasons of your life, maybe you're raising your children and volunteering at lots of things outside of work, and it's all you can do to keep your head above water at work, that's great. But for the most part, most of us have bandwidth, and anybody says that they don't have bandwidth is lying, right? We all waste 20 minutes at work, you know, you know, here, here and there. But what do you do with that bandwidth? Do you join a mentoring circle? Do you volunteer for a special project, etc.? And that's the heart of this tip, that doing a good job is table stakes. If you do a good job, you get to come back again tomorrow and we'll pay you for it. But if you're interested in advancement, if you're interested in promotions, you need to have exposure. And the best way to get exposure is to raise your hand for those kind of opportunities. And so it could be something simple. Who wants to lead our next staff meeting? You know, I do, right? That's low stakes. That, that, that may, may not take a lot of time. Or it could be something bigger. Who wants to lead the, the Heart Walk for American Heart Association? Who wants to lead the, the campaign for XYZ? And so you need to know your bandwidth because if you take something on and volunteer and you do a bad job, you would have been better off not having raised your hand at all. So you need to know that you have bandwidth and then you can knock it out of the park. But my whole career I have looked for those special opportunities and I would say that's where I've gotten the most exposure, not in my day job, but by raising my hand to do other things.

That makes a lot of sense. I feel like, you know, I've said this makes a lot of sense probably like 4 times throughout the episode, but That's so interesting. I think a lot of times, whether that's in class or whether that's at an internship or a job or in any setting really, a lot of people, when, you know, the meeting finishes or the daily update is over and that person raises their hand to say, "Hey, here's, you know, one last opportunity or just a little thing if anybody is interested," most people start to zone out at that point. And I feel like that makes a big difference when you're able to that's when you start, you know, locking in and being like, hey, you know, let me seek something like this out because that may be something that differentiates me or something that just gives me a new opportunity or a new experience that most people don't know about. I think that's really cool.

And I love that you're seeing the parallels to your school life as well because they're absolutely there. That volunteering, like that woman that you said that raised her hand in the front row volunteering for special things, it also was a signal to your fellow students, oh wow, she's a go-getter. Oh wow, he, you know, really, you know, does great things. And then they could advocate for you in other areas too. You may be really smart in physics, but you could struggle in literature. And, but if people see you contributing in one area, then they'll have your back in the others. So it's applicable even in the school environment.

Sure. And I think also one of the biggest things about this that also ties into this next chapter is communication, right? Being able to seek out such opportunities, or even when they're not there, go ahead and find or create them. Right? When you see that, hey, this teacher hasn't been publishing notes, you go and offer to be the class scribe. Or take initiative to say, hey, you know, this is something I think I can contribute to this project or this, you know, class. And that really makes people feel like you're there for them. And this is what this final chapter's about. I'm getting a little sad here because this is, you know, the end, near the end of the episode. But that's, it's about one of the most vital parts of any relationship. Both personal or professional, and that's communication. I think most people would agree to that, and that's what this 20th and final chapter of this book is all about. Chances are you won't end up being at the same company, or at least the same job, your whole life. But although your job, your position, or your company might change, the connections you make can last a lifetime. So your final tip to your readers, at least until the next book, is to maintain your relationships and plan to keep in touch. So I want to ask you, how have you had such a conversation that, hey, you know, I'm leaving this place, but I want to make sure that we're, we still stay connected? And how do you keep in touch with your network even when you're not seeing them regularly? How do you maintain that aspect of communication even when it's not convenient?

Well, here is the key, is first of all to let people know when you're leaving. I've already mentioned I've been with my company for 30 years. I've had just a remarkable career. But even when I'm leaving that job, to go on to a whole different department, I'll let people know that I'm leaving. That way they're not, hey, whatever happened to Rachel Simon? Oh, she moved over to this group. So I let people know. And the best way to do that is through whatever, whatever is the best communication in your company. But you know, we, I would send an email and I would send it not blind copied, right? I would let people know personally, hey, I'm moving on to a new job and, but I wanna let you know what a great part you're, partner you've been. So it really is my pet peeve, especially when people retire or leave the company. It's my pet peeve when they send something blind copied because it just tells me I'm just one of 1,000. Who did it go to? I don't know, 1,000, 5,000, 2 people, I don't know. But it's the same exact thing, copy paste, copy paste, but just sent one at a time. It makes such a difference if you say to a blind copy distribution list, my last day is on Friday. I've really enjoyed working with you. I wish you all the best. Please keep in touch. If I get something like that, I'll hit delete. But if I get the same thing, Rachel, my last day is on Friday, I've really enjoyed working with you, keep in touch, here's my personal contact, I'll respond back. All just simply by using somebody's name. And so let people know, let them know what you've meant to them. I know I share this example in the book, but something that I got from one of my colleagues that I will use as a best practice when I retire one day is he just wrote a personal note to everybody about like, favorite story about them and some of the things that he respected about them. Oh my gosh, how beautiful, right? I kept it and made it into my book. And so, yeah, what a best practice to make people feel good on your way out.

Wow. You know, I'm not going to say that makes a lot of sense this time, even though, you know, it makes a lot of sense. But, uh, I think, I think people really underestimate the importance of just sending an email or a text message or saying something that really can brighten somebody's day, even if it's something so slight. You know, among all the hundreds of emails I know I get, and I'm sure you get 10 times more of, you know, "Oh hey, we need to have this deliverable done," or "Here's a new homework assignment," or "Here's something you need to finish," just a small email of, you know, gratitude or of, you know, "I've really enjoyed working with you even though I won't be able to anymore." I think that makes so much difference. And the next time somebody brings your name up, That's the last thing they're going to remember. But with this, we are officially finished with the book. Thank you so much for your time, Rachel. I really, really enjoyed having you here and really appreciate your time.

Thank you so much. It's just been absolutely a pleasure to talk to you. You're a very gifted interviewer. So thank you.

I appreciate it. Thank you. And, you know, as I've been saying through our episodes, I highly, highly recommend this book, Relationships at Work: How to Authentically Network Within Your Company. Rachel, I want to ask you, where can people find this book?

It's on Amazon, it's in barnesandnoble.com, it may be at your local bookstore. And if this is a selling point at all, 100% of the profits go to charity. So not even a portion, but 100% of the profits go to United Way. So if anyone is on the fence about buying this book or not, maybe that will put you on the other edge.

Well, I actually didn't even know that. That's amazing. Yeah, that's fantastic. Yeah, so, you know, today we've learned a lot of things, and through the whole course of the book, but today we've learned a lot about how to effectively network in a large group. We've learned about the value of not just welcome— introducing yourself, but also being welcomed into a community. We've talked about the importance of leveraging your network and the importance of pebbling, you know, making people feel like they are seen and that they're remembered. We've also talked about how to find opportunity, even when it's disguised as work. And finally, we've talked about the importance and vitality of communication. Once again, thank you so much for joining us, Rachel, and a big thank you to all of our listeners. We will see you guys next time, and until then, keep on growing, keep on changing, and keep on learning. We'll see you next time.