Break Through Denial: Speed Up Addiction Recovery

Help this denial process go a little faster. You can't make it go away immediately, but you can speed it up, is what I like to say. And then we're also going to talk a little bit about what is the overall general messaging that you should be thinking about when trying to help somebody who has an addiction. You know, when you're trying to be supportive and caring, what's the overall messages that you want to send? Because so often when we're in this with a family member and we're really scared and we're really angry and what they're doing is messing up our lives, we get so upset and emotionally reactive that we. We do all the wrong things. We start telling them things like, you're never going to beat this. You always say, it's going to be different. It's never going to be different. And then we. The worst thing is, what's different this time? We've said that, right? I've said that, but I've tried to make myself stop saying that. Because then the person. You literally put doubt in that person's mind who maybe is actually even thinking about trying. They're like, I don't know. I always feel, don't I? So you do not want to send these messages. Every time you do that, you're sending, like, these subconscious, like planting these little seeds in their head that they're not going to beat it. We're not going to do that. That's not helpful. So let's take a look at those stages of denial before we go much further. Believe it or not, someone that's in, like, full denial, like, I don't have a problem at all, that's actually the easiest stage to deal with. I know you probably think that would be the hardest stage, but I think that's the easiest stage because it's really clear how to get someone out of that. I'm gonna tell you. So hang in there. It's when we get down to these later stages, this number four and number five, that's a little. A little tricky. And especially when someone gets in number four, five, it can be. That can be so far into it. It's like, are they going to come out of it? That, to me, is the scariest one. So this first level we're going to start up here, I'm going to call this full out, complete denial. I do not have a problem. Y' all people are crazy. I don't even know what y' all are talking about. Like, I barely even drink or I do that. Yeah, but everyone does that or whatever, you know, they have this, like, complete. Not even, like, it's a little problem, like, completely. It is not a problem at all. That actually is the easiest one to deal with because all you have to do to fix that one is step out of the way. Like, literally, you don't even have to do anything except stop doing anything that you might be doing to help fix any problems that that addictive behavior could be causing. Once they start to see that those problems begin to show up, they will start to connect the dot that, okay, like, whatever this is, it's causing some problems. And then eventually, if you'll do that long enough, they'll move into this second stage. And these aren't formal stages. Like, I don't think you can find them in an addiction book anywhere. I made these names of these stages up because I've been doing this for 20 years. And usually, especially in private practice, people that come in my office are usually in some level of denial. And I've kind of had to figure out their sort of categories so you can figure out how to work with each one. So this second level, I'm just going to call it, like, minimization. So it's like, okay, yeah, like, occasionally my drinking gets out of hand. Okay, you know, maybe I, you know, partied too much the past six months, but, you know, my dad just died or something like that. So there's a tiny little acknowledgement that there's a problem, but it's minimized. That's why I call it this, the minimization stage. And they, in their mind, it's like, okay, yeah, like, that got out of hand those couple of times, one or two times, or for that little short period. But I got this under control or it's going to get back under control. So there's still like, a lack of understanding the depth and the breadth of the issue. Then it kind of, oh, let me say this, another version, sort of a, I don't know, level 2.5. I've got little sub levels under minimization. I forgot to say this was kind of like a half step here. Is this okay, I got a problem. But I'm not as bad as those other people. Like, I went to some meeting and I tell you what, them people done. Done some bad stuff. I'm not nearly that bad. So there's the. It was just a phase, just the, you know, like, random bad things happen level. And then there's okay, but it's not as bad as xrz. You know, I don't. I don't hit my wife. I've never pawned anything. I don't steal things. You know, it's like, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Sort of. This is sort of a halfway minimization here. And you might be surprised at how you need to handle this one. How you need to handle that one is you need to say, I know, you're right. What you're gonna want to do when you hear someone say that is you're gonna want to, like, go into, like, lecture mode or scare tactic mode. And you're gonna want to say, oh, no, it's bad. Like, blah, blah. You know, you're just gon this whole extra. Because you're trying to, like, force them to see it faster. But the more directly you come at denial, the stronger it gets. In my mind, it's like. It's like this force field between you and the person. Really. Actually, it's a force field between that person and reality. But when you're working with this person and trying to get them to sort of see something, it is this force field. And if you start to attack this force field, it's going to get stronger. And it might be helpful for you to also remember that this is a defense mechanism, which means denial is some sort of psychological protective thing that's happening. What it means is their ego isn't ready to see it. And so even if you could, like, rip someone's denial down, which doesn't usually work, like, if you could just bust through it with like a tank or something, they're probably. They might fall apart. Some people, if they could, and we'll get more to this in just a minute, but some people, when I'm working with them, it's like I want them to see it's bad, but I don't. I actually don't want them to see how bad it is because that could scare them so bad they would never come out. So it's just a balance. We'll talk more about that balance in just a second. Stage number three is called I could do it myself. So in this stage, the person's like, yes, this is definitely a problem. I mean, I may not be like the worst addict out there, but it's definitely a problem. But I can totally do this myself. So now we're moving into an acknowledgement that there is a problem, but there's a lack of awareness about exactly what it's going to take to fix the problem. So as you can see, it's like we're peeling back these layers of force field here. And now we're somewhere in the middle, which is, you know, I don't know how talking to some stranger, counselor person is possibly going to help me beat an addiction. Which actually I can follow that line of thinking. It. It is sort of hard to wrap your mind around that. And I definitely don't know why talking about my problem in front of a group of strangers is going to be helpful, you know, and so it's like, I don't. I don't need all that. I just need toughen up. I just need to get my act together and have more willpower. There's a little truth in that. But most people don't realize how many things that they need to change in their life. Like logistically, people, places and things. That's the first level of simple changes that have to be made. And then don't even get me started on the depth of the psychological things that have to be changed in order to. To get yourself out of an addiction and stay out of an addiction. Because it's not just the substance, the thing, the behavior or whatever. As that addiction has gone on and on and on, you have wrapped so many psychological defense mechanisms around that. Rationalizations, justifications, resentments, grudges. I mean, you've got. That little addiction is like this little seed inside. And it's got this infection of psychology around it. And if you don't deal with that stuff, and a lot of people talk about it could be trauma and it could. But that's not there for everyone. That's another video. We'll talk about that some other time. But I tell you what is there for everyone is this like, psychological infection. And it's because in order to have maintained that addiction for as long as you did, you've had to convince yourself of some things that aren't true. And you've had to develop these ways of decision making and stuff like that that are now really just habit. And so even when you take the addict out, you don't mean to, but you fall back into those old habit ways of thinking. Like, for. Let me give you an example. One of the things people with addictions do is they. They have to have a bad guy. You guys hear me talk about that on here all the time. Bad guy. They got to have a villain in the story. That villain is usually the person closest to them. It's usually the parent or the spouse or the roommate, the person they live with. It is the person that sort of knows them the best. It's that person, because that's the person that knows what's up. That's the person that knows more of the truth. And that person is usually the one that's like, trying to force them out of denial. So you've got this addicted person and then you got this villain. And I don't mean they're really a villain. Like, they usually love this person, this person loves them back. But there's a real contentious thing going on here. And sometimes consciously, sometimes subconsciously, but nonetheless, this will happen. The addicted person will start fights with this other person. This other person up to act like a crazy, controlling person. They will sort of, in their mind, they have these narrative set about the way things work. And they will subconsciously be recreating that scenario over and over and over, most of the time not realizing it, but they will. And so that's what I mean when I say understanding there's a problem is actually not as hard as understanding the depth of everything that's going to have to happen to get you out of this. Like, you're literally going to have to change where you go, what you do, how you have fun, how you interact. You're going to have to change. Sometimes you have to, like, physically change your location, but you're going to have to address and assess all those mental, psychological layers. That's where the counseling actually comes in or the help. You know, when people say you can't do it by yourself and you need outside help, that's actually where that comes in. It really doesn't have anything to do with some kind of outside help making you not engage in addictive behavior. I mean, what. What's like, what's a counselor gonna do to make someone not drink? Nothing. No way. There's nothing anybody can do to make that happen. Even a sponsor. Anybody. But what the support people can bring, whether that's a support group, a counselor, a sponsor, recovery coach, whoever that is, is, they can help you to sort of unravel that infection of psychological defense mechanisms that we were talking about a second ago. Now we're gonna get these next two, I think are a little harder. Those first three, I know as a family member, it's maddening when you see that, and it makes you feel crazy. But when I see that does scare me because I know exactly where we're at and I know what needs to happen to get us through those. So what needs to happen when someone minimizes it and says something like, I'm not that bad? You say, I know you're right. So that you are catching on to this before you get that bad. Because when they say that there's usually some truth in it. So don't argue with them. Say, you're right. When someone says, I can do it myself, guess what? Don't argue with them. Say, you're right. Say, okay, what's the plan? And let them come up with a plan and let them try doing it theirself. And then guess what? When it doesn't work, usually I try that three or four, sometimes five times the by themselves thing. Then they'll be out of denial about that. So the way you get someone out of denial isn't you tell them what the answer. You cannot tell them the answer. And you definitely can't push the answer on them. You let them figure it out faster by saying, yeah, you're right. Let's try that. The faster you do that, the faster they'll get out. This next level is difficult. And that is once they've sort of figured out, I've got a problem, I can't fix it myself, and is bad. Like, I have alcoholism, I have addiction. I'm really like, this is a big deal. Then they'll kind of move into this stage of, well, that's just who I am. That's what I'm naming this stage. That's just who I am. So. So they've just decided. They've kind of, like, given into it and decided that it's just their identity. You know, I'm just that guy that drinks too much. I'm just that I'm just the pothead living in his mom's basement. They just take it on as who they are. And sometimes they'll even take it on with, like, a sense of pride. Now, underneath that, there is some negative feeling, shame and guilt. But a lot of times, the way they will present that is pride. I mean, how many times have you heard people brag about being able to drink someone else under the table? And they'll say, oh, you're a lightweight. Like, it's a badge of honor. The person that can drink the other person under the table, that is the person with the problem. Because you should be under the table. And if you're not, why not, right? So once you get to that point where you take it on as your identity, then you take that pride and you just hang on to it and you just wear it. You know, you get a. You get a little flag pin, and you put it on your shirt and you say, yeah, man. So that's hard to get through. Because sometimes people even really do kind of come to, like, the identity, especially if they're Young, like a teenager or a young adult, they may still be perceiving that as a kind of a cool identity to have, and so they may cling to it. A lot of times when I deal with young people, they'll get to the point where they're really ready to let go of the substance or the addiction long before they get to the point that they're ready to let go of the image and the lifestyle. Because that for young people, a lot of times, that is the major pull. More than the substance, it's being this cool kid. It's being. It's, I don't know, making money. It's this lifestyle image, which usually isn't true, but this thing they have in their head about who it makes them, and they don't want to let go of that. Now, this last one, the number four, is hard to deal with, but it can be dealt with. But this last one is really tough. This is the one that I don't know that you can get everyone out of this last stage of denial, I'm going to call it. I'm too far gone. So this is a full recognition of, I have a problem. This is like the other end of it. This is like, I have a problem. In fact, I'm like the worst addict in the room. I'm not as bad as those. But now it's like, no, I know I'm the worst one in the room. Like, I can't get better. That one is very hard to pull out of because the number four level is just who I am. There's sort of like this pride thing in it. This level. There's almost like this hopelessness, despair kind of feeling in it. And that one, I think, is the most difficult. I mean, this one is almost like this person has put themselves on hospice. This person has just given into it completely. And a lot of times a person that's in this far level of it will be sometimes even passively suicidal. I mean, sometimes even actively suicidal. But most of the time it's just. It's not so much they have a plan and they're going to do something, but more they don't really care if they wake up. So trying to. When you're talking to this person about how dangerous whatever they're doing is, you might as well be beating your head against the wall. Because it's not that they don't know it's dangerous. They don't care. Because at this point, they're so miserable, they're so depressed, they're so anxious, they've Dug such a deep hole. They've burned so many ridges with the people around them, like they can't see a way out. Now, with addiction, there's always a way out, but it is harder, you know, the deeper you go into it, especially the more bridges you burn. Because as you're going through those other four stages, you're burning bridges because people are going to start. The people around you are going to start trying to get you to see it and trying to help you and bailing you out of trouble here and there and encouraging you along. But then, you know, you reject those people. You don't listen to those people. You say, leave me alone. You say, you don't know what you're talking about. Sometimes you take advantage of those people, and one by one, all of your whole family, friends, support, network begin to just sort of fall away by the wayside. And by the time you get down here in level number five, you may still have some friends, but they're probably in that same stage as you are. And so I don't even know that you could call it friends using buddy. I don't know. You get each other, but you're so addicted to the whatever. The thing is, you can't. There's not a lot left to give to any kind of friendship. So there may be a little loyalty or something there. But it's hard because neither one of you can put anything ahead of the addiction because it's just that far gone. To me, that is the really difficult one. Sometimes when you have someone in that phase of it, I think that's when you need to skip the Amber videos. I know. I said. I can't believe I said that. Skip the Amber videos. That's true. You need to skip my technique, and you need to go to whatever you need to go to. And sometimes that means the person gets arrested. I'm not saying you have to get them written. I'm just saying sometimes that's what it means. Sometimes it means the person gets committed to treatment or some whatever, because this person is literally at the terminal stage of it, and they don't have this thing inside to even want to get better. And that's what I mean when I say that. Like, I don't have problem that's easily fixed. Guess what? Everybody gets past that because it becomes clear you can no longer hide from it. And so it's this stage that's the most difficult. Now, I told you I was going to tell you a little bit about the messaging that I want you to be, not just sending to them, but also believing yourself. Because messaging doesn't work if you don't believe it. It just sounds weird or corny or fake. So you have to really believe this. And I think you probably do. Deep down inside, you just get angry at the person and you just say the negative things because you just want them to wake up and see reality. It's not going to make them wake up. So it's this weird encounter. And I shouldn't say counseling, because it's coaching. Now I see you looking at me, Bri. So it's this weird balance between getting someone to see, like, dude, you got a problem is bad. In fact, you about to ruin your whole life. So you gotta, like, at some point, they gotta, like, see the depth of it. But at the same time, it will help them see the depth of it faster if you can present it in such a way that. Let's see. Protects their ego in some way. So it's like, dude, you got a bad boy. Wow. Like, I can't believe your wife's not left you already. That might be something I would say. And then I would say, but you know what? This happens. Everyone. Everyone has an addiction, which I do believe, which is true. Like, we all have counterproductive habits. So. So you got to, like, help them to see it, but also help them to not feel judged by it. Because the more shame and guilt, the more judgment they feel. They'll either get that denial shield thing back up or they'll just go into this hopelessness stage. And that is definitely not where you want them to go. So it's a balance of. This is a big deal. It's not a big deal. You gotta find the thing in there. Because once they can see that it is severe enough that they need to take action, but not so severe that they can't. Like, you gotta help them know that they're totally capable of it. It's understandable. They ended up in a situation, which it is. That's the good balance that you want to have. And then you sort of want to have this messaging of you got this. Which is the opposite of. You always say that you. You've said you're sorry a hundred times. What's different this time? None of those messages. None of them. I'm serious. Because you're in their mind. They may be, like, really stoked and really mean at this time. And then you're saying that, and they don't have an answer. And then it crushes their, like, little spirit that's trying to do good. So don't say that. You want to say you got this and you want to help them see their strength inside. And if you're close to this person, you know them well, then you probably can think of some real life examples of some hard crap they've done. Like some, some life things that have happened where they showed courage or resiliency or stick with it Ness. Anything like that. And it has to be real examples. It has to be more than like, you can do it. It makes me think of like, what's that? I'm selling waterboy. He says, you can do it. It has to be more than that because it has to be. It has to be real. And, and you got to know someone well enough to know those real things to say to help them be like, oh yeah, I did do that. Oh yeah, I did do that. And remember when they did it before, that will help them. It's like you have to like, pump them up at the same time that you help them see the severity of the problem. That is the combination that will allow someone to start taking action because it's the. I get it's a problem and I'm strong enough to fix it. And then lastly, the other message that I try to remember to throw in regularly, especially in those, like, early days where it's really hard and it kind of sucks, it gets worse when they first get sober. It gets worse before it gets better. So in those early days when the, they're really squirmy and they're like, I just don't, I just don't even know if I can do this. Like, this is hard. Like every day is hard. Then I try to remind them of what's on the other side and how far they are from it, because they're usually closer than they think to getting over to the good side. And I try to remind them of how much better life is going to be over there. Now most of the time when I first start doing this, they sort of like, don't really believe me, but it's still helpful to hear. And, but as they go along and I continue to say, oh, like you're on this many weeks by this week, you're good. This what's gonna happen and it's gonna be great. Like, you're literally gonna have this thought right here. And then they, they start to see that there is light at the end of that tunnel. So hopefully you don't have to say these exact statements. You have to make it work for who you are. These are, these are the kinds of statements that I make. But it's the concept that the balance is, is the balancing act. It's the concept. It's. Yes, this is really bad. But hey, it happens mixed with. You got this and it is going to be better. That is the messaging, that is the support messaging that you need to have. Alright, Bri, I think we got some questions up here. You guys make sure you go ahead and pop those questions up early because every time we click off there's like five more questions pop up. B Chip says, what is an easy way to ask them? Where, what stage are they at? What questions are? Okay, that won't push them away or sit them down. I've never really asked a question because this is they. First of all, I made these stages up so there's no way they're even going to be. They're just going to be like, what are you even talking about? So you can't really ask them what stage you're at. But if you just listen to the statements that they make, you'll know. So if the topic comes up at all, they'll start making those statements and then you'll know exactly where they are. You don't really have to question it. You just have to sort of stand by and watch and you'll, you'll see, you'll see what's happening. Hey, Irma. Happy Thursday. Amber, word of advice. My son is going to rehab this coming Friday. Should I or should I not say anything to him? I think there's more to that. I would like to say something like, don't give up on yourself. Believe in yourself too. Do you think that is right? In a lot of ways what you're saying there kind of fits with the balancing of statements here, the kind of thoughts and beliefs you want to portray. So you're right on target with that. But I don't want you to do it in a mom corny way. I'm a mom too, totally guilty of this. Don't be heavy about it. Don't be like, I love you so much. You can. Don't, don't, don't be all momish. Be either casual or upbeat or funny. If depend on your own personality. But bring it up because this person, if they're going to treatment, they're going to be anxious, they're gonna be uncomfortable, they're gonna be in a bad mood, they're gonna be irritable, they might be in withdrawal, they're not gonna be in a good state and they don't want. I know you're just trying to say I love you, but most people don't want, like a bunch of heavy. They don't want a heavy conversation. Like, it's just once you get to the point, you're literally on your way to treatment. It's just like you stand on the high dive and you don't even want to think about it. Just close your eyes and jump. So you can not bring it up at all if you want to. One of the things you could do is just be casual and comfortable and regular and try not to make everything so heavy. That would actually be helpful. Your son knows that you love him. Your son knows that you believe in him. Your son knows all these things that you want to say. So what you can do is you can just be helpful by helping that anxiety and that uncomfortableness of this, like, holy crap, what's about to happen? Feeling. Ex girlfriend just got out of six weeks of treatment. During treatment, she asked for no contact. When she gets out to focus on her recovery, how soon is it okay to try to reconnect and rebuild a relationship? That's really going to be up to her. My guess is that she's saying no contact because she wants some distance from you. Yes. When you go to treatment, your treatment counselors and stuff will tell you things like no relationships this, that, and the other for like this long. I'm. No one listens to that. So, I mean, maybe she's just being like hardcore by the rules, but she's thinking like, I just need some time. And so I don't know what that. My guess is she'll reach out to you. Texas toast. Can you talk about subs? Your thought, good or bad? Are you talking about Suboxone? Texas toast? I think, I think you're probably talking about Suboxone. If you pop it up there in the chat, Brie, you'll probably see it. Let me know. I think, I think you mean Suboxone. Renee says, do they deep down know that they have a problem but don't want to admit it? Most sometimes it depends on circumstance. They know they deep down know it's a problem long before they will admit it to you. But there is a period where they really, for real or in that stage when I talked about, like, I don't have problem, especially if they're younger, as in a teenager in their 20s or in college, where everybody's. Everybody else probably not doing it the way they're doing it, but everybody else is doing it a lot. So they, they really, really, really think you're crazy. So in that stage, they really don't know it, but most time, they are moving through these stages in their own head. Months, months and months before they'll tell it to you. Moonsong says my daughter is three weeks sober today. Hey. All right. It's the longest she's been sober. She's still saying she hopes to be able to drink socially someday. That worries me, and I don't know what to say. It should worry you. That's not helpful, is it, Moon Song? I'm supposed to make you feel better. What that tells me is she has that in recovery. They might call it a reservation in the back of her head. And at some point, she's going to try to drink socially. Okay. Like, it's. It is going to happen. So it. And it's okay. Here's. In the meantime, what I want you to do is just hope she gets as long as possible without drinking. I mean, if she's three weeks sober today, she is literally barely. Barely. And I don't even know what she's using. So I'm guessing here at the point of starting to feel better. So what you want to do is you want to. You want her to get as long as she can get before she tries the social drinking thing. You want her to get to the point that she does it long enough that her life gets better, she feels physically better, her relationships are better, so that when she goes back to social drinking, which is coming and it doesn't work, which it won't, she'll know it quickly and she'll recognize, hey, actually, it was actually better on that side of the fence. I think I'll go back over there because, yeah, I remember this feeling. Not so great. So your goal. I don't want you to freak out. Everybody does that. I'm telling you. I've not dealt with anybody who didn't. So it's just part of the phases. Don't try to make it not happen. Let's just, like, get through it faster. But you want to. Hopefully she'll get as much clean time as possible. After she gets 30 days or so, she'll start to feel a little better. And that's where you want to get, at least to that much. Nancy, question. My son is 34, and he says he is an addict and will probably always need a substance. He uses fentanyl. And I always struggle to respond except to truly listen when he says it. Listen to what he says is the best way. Yeah. So it sounds, Nancy, like he's in one of these, like, four, maybe even five stages where he's sort of given into it. If it were my son and he was 34 and he was using fentanyl and he says he's just always gonna do something, I would probably look at some kind of medication maintenance because he's in that stage of just like, totally giving into it. And he's. He's not even ready to consider the idea of not needing a substance. And fentanyl is so dangerous, which I know has to scare you out of your mind. So if it. If it were my son, I. I would probably go medication assisted treatment, which is subs if that. The other person that was asking that, Annalisa, my daughter, is in the far level of addiction. She's been in five treatments since April. My struggle is, do we turn her in to serve her warrants if we find her and save her life, or do we try another treatment? Will she go to another treatment? Like. Because it sounds to me like what you're saying and Elisa is that you. Like, you don't even know where she's at because it says if we find her, I wouldn't, I wouldn't intervene if she was going to get arrested, so I wouldn't go hire a fancy pants lawyer to get her out of it because, I mean, it would literally be safe for her being in there. And I know y' all are going to say everyone uses in jail, and yes, they do, but probably not to the level that Annalies is using right now. So. So I wouldn't stop her from going to jail. I don't know for sure if I would call and have the warrants served on. When someone's at this level of it, I'm not adamantly against it. If she's in, like, this level five of it's just who I am and it's probably going to kill me level then at that point, that's when I, you know, when I said earlier, Annalise said, like, that's when you don't even listen to Amber videos. Like, you do what you got to do. So I wouldn't be opposed to you doing that at that level. If you. But if you're watching this and you're looking at Annalise's question and your loved one is at stage one, two, or three, and then you tell their probation officer or you get them arrested, you just set the denial levels back by three years. So if you're a person and if they know you did it, because they will never learn the lesson, they will always blame you. If you get them arrested and they know that you did it. So if your loved one is at the early levels, don't do that. If your loved ones at Annalise's level, you do what you got to do. Chrissy, how many clients that pancreatitis, and this keeps them sober. He went through hell in the hospital, and I feel like it was the only thing to keep him sober. I don't have an answer for how many clients, but I have seen this happen before. Number one, because they're so sick and they're in the hospital, and literally, they have to detox while they're there, because they're in the hospital, because they're so sick they can't leave. So sometimes that just gets them clean and sober because of the medical condition. And then if. If they realize that they have the pancreatitis because of the substance use or the addiction, then that might be enough to keep them away from it after they get sober. The crazy thing, Chrissy, is a lot of times people can have these medical things like. Like gal and some of these other things that are very clear to the family members, like, the addiction is causing that. And they will swear up and down, it's not the addiction. That's them. Levels of denial. And so they'll say, no, that's because whatever. Whatever. That's not because of that. That's my genetics. My daddy had that. They'll say anything. So if they realize that it's that, and pancreatitis is very painful, it can be a deterrent. Vicki, is there a timetable for how long five years of meth smoking takes to get out of a body? No, I don't really know of a timetable. I can tell you that from, like, brain scan imaging research. It does take the brain longer to heal from meth. And in some extreme cases, it may not go all the way back, but for the most part, it. It goes back. But when I get these questions like this, like, even when people say, how long before I'm, like, back to normal? And then people say, well, it could be a year. It could be a year and a half. It makes me nervous when people say that, because, okay, it might be a year or year and a half until you're, like, 100%, but it is probably 30 or 60 days until you're pretty good. Because I think when people hear a year and a half, they think it's going to be that miserable that long, and then they're like, oh, my God, I can't do that. And that's not really accurate. It just gets a little better. And A little better. Priscilla, how do I undo a major blow up that I caused without knowing the details of it? I say you just admit it and apologize. So I don't know what you did, but you can just say, whatever happened, I didn't handle that well. I know I lost it. I said some things I didn't mean, whatever happened, and say, you know, I'm going to try to do better. And then. So you want to say you want to. It's more than an apology. You want to say, acknowledge what you did, acknowledge how what you did impacted that other person and have some kind of insight or statement about how you're going to work on that and do better and communicate that you're taking care of it so it doesn't happen again. Mm. Question too far gone. Thinking boyfriend already kicked him out. I'm doing the invisible intervention. He's currently out of state. I need to draw the line. He won't give me a timeline. What can I do? When. When you're saying he won't give you a timeline, is it like you're asking him, like, are you saying, like, when are you going to get sober? Or. I guess I'm just confused. There's just some conflicting statements here. So you kicked him out. He's out of state. You need to draw the line. It sounds like you drew the line. He won't give me a timeline. So it sounds to me, and I could be reading too much into this, but it sounds to me. Mm. Like what you're saying is I drew the line, kicked him out, but not really. I did it to say, get your act together, and now you're sitting here waiting on him to get fixed. Mm. You know, if you're an invisible intervention, that means you've probably been watching my videos. And, you know, I say, like, you. You. You don't draw that line until, like, you're really ready. Not like I'm making a statement like, when you draw it. Because some. Because a lot of times it doesn't. It doesn't usually work the way you want it to work. Sometimes, though, you need to draw that line for yourself. So. But it sounds to me like you kind of was hoping he would, like, turn around after that. Kristen says, when we give encouragement and praise during active addiction, doesn't that feel like positive reinforcement and feed the addict's narrative that things are all good? And see, I can do X and B high. I got this. That's a really great question, because I get that question from time to time. But, no, I don't really think it does that. What it does is it allows the person to take a look at their problem without focusing on you being a jerk, number one. So then they start self reflecting more and actually they actually feel guilty because they know that you think, you know, you're saying, oh you did so great the other day, but they know that like really lied to you and they were drunk when they did that or whatever was happening and that guilt starts to kick in. Now they're not going to tell you that. But in the long run, you're not going to hurt occasionally in a short run. The only time I've ever seen it hurt and it doesn't last long is like in the, in a situation where I see a lot of husbands. So immediately I think of all these, like somebody relapses, it's usually somebody's husband and, and the spouse doesn't know it yet and the spouse is going along fine and they will think to themselves, see, they don't even know it. It doesn't impact them. They don't even know I was doing that. It's fine. That's what they'll say at first until about five minutes later when it gets unmanageable and then it comes out and then we get back to the same place we were before. How can you love them and detach with love? You know that. Detach with love. That's Al Anon saying. It sounds so counselory. Sometimes I roll my eyes at our own counselory recovery type statements. It's like, what the, what does that mean? I'm with you, Tammy. It's really hard to detach with love when they're in your house. So if they live in your house, you do the best you can. You take breaks, you go on something, you try to get some distance and not have that front row seat. If you're trying to detach and sort of deal with self care, it's easier for you if they're not in your house. Yeah. So taking care of your own needs will help you to detach with love. Because if you're literally, literally suffering and suffering and suffering because they won't do anything, it's going to be really hard for me to, for you to detach from that. Ccv. My husband relapsed after two successful months on soberlink. Some emotional family situations triggered him. How can I help him get back on track? Well, I don't know how long the relapses gone on. If it's like literally happened and it was like yesterday, then you move into Damage control mode. If it's been happening and it's been going on for, like, days or even weeks, then probably what you're going to have to do is probably that means that person is moving backwards in those stages of denial, which is so frustrating. I know, but you're going to have to back up and do all those things I tell you to do in the earlier stages, which I know sucks to have to go back, but if you'll do that, like, figure out, are they in denial? Are they saying. Are they saying to themselves, after this relapse, are they saying, it's really not that big a deal, it was just two beers at dinner. Minimization. You go back to those techniques. Are they saying, oh, my gosh, I'm never going to get this better. I always relapse. And then they moved into that number five. So if you can get a gauge on what their thinking is about the relapse, you want to interact with it on whatever level they're at. Sit Ins says, I am going. I'm soon going in a detox for 21 days. But my. Not. But my mom is not in a good space. How should I tell her this? Will your mom be upset that you're going to. I mean, usually moms. If you need to go to detox, moms usually want you to get the help you need. So are you, like a caretaker for your mom or something like that? Are you. Are you worried, like, she doesn't know I've been relapsing and now I have to tell her I'm going in. So there. There may be a little bit more piece of this story, Bri. I feel like there's a teensy bit more information I need there. Sherry says, isn't it true that the alcoholic has. Has to want to be sober if in stage five, you can commit them to treatment? Would it even help if their heart isn't into it? I'm glad you asked this, Sherry. I like to say this. I like to say it once a week. Here it is. No, they do not have to want to get sober. No one ever wants to get sober. Let me say that again. No one ever wants to get sober. I know when you meet sober people, they will tell you, looking back on it, that they decided they want it, but they forgot literally everyone that gets sober gets pushed into it for some kind of external reason. And they may decide, well, I don't want to get sober, but I don't want to lose my kids. I don't want to go to jail. I Don't lose my job. I don't want to die of liver failure. There's some kind of external reason pressure that's pushing them to want to get sober. And that is 100% completely 5. And if they are in stage 5, then probably it may be the only thing is to sort of force them, like by commitment. Or maybe they got put in jail or maybe like somebody said earlier, pancreatitis or another medical problem, force somehow that they had to get sober. You have to get people sober long enough for their brain to work correctly for them to decide to stay sober for themselves. The idea that people have to decide they want to get sober is a myth. What they have to decide is they don't want to deal with the bad crap anymore. That's what has to happen. And they have to know there's no loophole way around it. Let me add that in question. What advice can you give a family whose alcoholic family member in rehab will be going on a day pass with them? Is there a video you can recommend? I don't have a video on that, but I think it was Irma that asked earlier, like, what should I say to my son who's going to rehab? Keep it light, keep it casual. I mean, if they want to have a deep conversation and they start a deep conversation, then by all means do that. But. But they just don't want the awkwardness. Be funny. You know, be your regular self. Don't treat them weird, don't act odd. That is the best thing that you can do for them is just not be all weird. Be regular. Janie says I need tips to keep my cool. After my boyfriend has overindulged, he tries to justify his behavior by comparing his drinking. Just me taking non narcotic prescription meds. Oh. So he, he tries to minimize it. So that's a minimized stage. There you go. That's the minimizing stage. Stage number two, by saying it's not any different than you taking your Zolofter. I don't know, something, whatever. If they're in the here's the thing that probably will keep you the coolest. If you know that he is in the either complete denial or the minimize it sounds like minimize stage, then you need him to overindulge. The very worst possible thing that could happen is that he starts to manage it. Because if he starts to manage it, then he's going to move from stage two denial back to stage one denial to the it's not a problem at all. So what you want in those early, early stages is you want it to. I call it. Actually, Campbell's the one that named this Game on. The phase is called Game On. Bring it like you want it to happen faster. So if he overindulges and he acts like a fool and he feels terrible the next day and whatever, whatever, you don't have to do anything to add on to that. But I'm just saying inside of you, you don't want to hope that it doesn't go too far. It actually has to go too far enough times for them to see that they have to stop. If they're just using a little bit, managing it, that's the worst. Now we're never gonna figure it out. Gail, are slips in early recovery to be expected? How should I react or not react? I'm assuming, Gail, that you're talking about, not necessarily yourself, but like someone you care about is an early recovery and has slips or might have slips or something like that. I have a video, a really good video called. It says relapse on the thumbnail. I'm trying to think. Exactly. I think it's called the Ultimate Guide to Relapse or something like that. But basically the short version is you want to go into damage control. What you don't want to do, you don't want to go into the. This is the end of the world. I told you that wasn't gonna work. Do not. Don't do that. You go into, hey, dude, it's cool, man. It was one day. Let's figure out what happened together. Right. Back on track. Don't look. Don't let this knock you off. You want to go into damage control mode. Most family members go into freak out mode, and that's what you don't want to do. Josephine says question. I finally made the decision to get sober and deal with my PTSD while my wife is on the treatment. I feel so much better. But she said some hurtful words about me getting better. How can I show her that I'm doing it for myself and for us without her feeling bad? Okay, so I think what you're. What you're saying is sort of. You both struggle with addiction, and you're a few steps ahead of her in the recovery process, and that's creating some tension between you. I could see that. Right. Because she might. I don't know, this is totally just me, like, reading into it, but she might think that you think you're better than her or something like that. So some of that. If she's in treatment, she's just feeling Crappy, and it ain't good. I mean, you. You know better than I know. Just, she's grumpy and she's irritable. So you just. You're just gonna give her a little pass while she's in those really early, like, not her regular self phases. And you're gonna try not to have too many deep conversations. Think about if you're. Because you're saying, like, she's in treatment. It makes me think. Sound makes me think she's very early in treatment. You don't have to fix everything. You don't have to have deep conversations. A person is not capable of having deep conversations. What it makes me think of is earlier in my career, I had to work in detox, which is what I call addiction counselor. Hell, as you go to school, you want to do counseling, you want to have some real conversations, you want to teach. And so you go in there, you're all excited. You're trying to, like, preach the gospel or whatever you're trying to do. And those people are not awake sometimes. They're dead. They're not listening to you. And even if they were trying to listen to you, they literally are not at that stage to have these kind of conversations. So it's like, that's what it reminds me of. So there's not a lot you can. You just need to give her some space. Teresa says question. If I get emotional when I talk to my son, should I avoid talking to him? Does it upset him? Well, when you say you get emotional, the first thing I thought was, do you mean I get upset and angry or, like, riled up? Or do you mean, like, I get tearful? When I first read the question, I was thinking that you meant I get tearful. In either case, probably it depends on how well your son tolerates that. Like, does your son freak out if you cry or something like that? Or is he cool with it if most of the time they don't like that because it's just a lot of uncomfortableness? So you should avoid talking about really emotionally heavy things, because he's just gonna. It's just gonna make him not want to talk to you more. One of the ways. One of my best strategies as a counselor that allows me to talk to people about difficult things is that I don't do it in any kind of heavy tone. So when I talk to people about really heavy things, the tone and the way we're talking about it is super cash, or sometimes even sarcastic and funny, and a lot of times even, like, irreverent. Because it allows people to process the things they need to process without being flooded with all those, like, really big emotions. Alright, Bri, give me. Do we have one last one? All right, this is it. Rachel getting the last one. When is it time to leave? An alcoholic relationship. The only way he keeps getting me back is because he has no other support. Rachel, I have a really good video on this channel that's on the thumbnail. It's called Four Reasons to Walk Away. And that's a really good video. It addresses this. And then there's another video that Kim is in, and I think it's called Should I Stay or Should I Go? Which is another good one. But going back to someone with an alcohol problem because there's no other support, I can understand the pressure. Because you feel like because you're the last one to sort of cut the tie, you feel like it's all on your shoulders. But that's a really bad reason to keep going back to a relationship with someone. Because if everybody else has done lift, probably a reason. So I don't think that's a good reason to keep going back, if that, if that's what you're asking. All right, that is it. That's the end of our live for today. Thank you so much. We are live every Thursday at 1 Eastern. Hopefully we will see you guys next week. And until then, I will put up that relapse, that ultimate God to relapse. I'll put it up here so you can watch it next. Bye, everybody.