Family Roles In Addiction And Codependency (A new perspective)

So this video is all about how to get yourself out of the drama, because we all know you're sick of it. I'm Amber Hollingsworth, founder of Hope for Families Recovery center, where we help families get. Get out of the nightmare of addiction every day. And this is one of our counselors, Kim Oakes Garrett. And she's gonna be our expert today. She's gonna tell us all about the drama and how to get out of it. Right?

Yep.

Okay, so the thing you're gonna teach is called.

It's got quite a few names. It's either called the Drama Triangle, the Codependency Triangle, the Shame Generator, or the Three Faces of Victimhood.

None of those names sound very good.

No, none of them are good.

We want to know about this.

Yes. Okay. Because you don't want to live it. All.

Right. Isn't it kind of like a psychological model?

Yes. Yes. So picture a triangle with the point facing down. And so what? This is. Yes, there's a triangle. So the point's going to face down, and this is going to be your victim, this is going to be your rescuer, and this is going to be your persecutor or your bully, the bad guy, basically. Okay, so we all have a starting gate, and this is basically where we walk onto drama. The starting gate is just where you get hooked. Like you and Campbell did a video about being hooked. This is the fish hook. This is where you jump on to the triangle. This is where something inside of you has been pushed and you don't feel good enough. You feel defensive. And so you. Instead of. Instead of using the five muscles to get out of the drama triangle, which we'll talk about, which are the problem solving, instead of using one of those, you jump onto the drama triangle.

So it's like the. Called starting gate. Because it's like the thing that sucks you on. And it's the place, isn't it? Like, it's like the place you tend to get sucked on to first, Right?

Yes.

Okay, so we might all sort of, in our own head and in our relationships fall into different roles at different times, but we have, like a main.

Yes, we all have a main starting gate that we go to. And we learn this in childhood. So. And we typically will go on, like, for me personally, when I go on, I typically go on as a persecutor, which is really. You didn't. Because I'll stuff and stuff and stuff until I can't stuff anymore, and then I'm mad. So then I come out pretty hostile and pretty Quick, like what? That's what you're gonna do. And so. And it's a persecutor, because then it. By default, I'm victimizing somebody else, even though it's super quick. And if you didn't recognize it, you might not see it. It might just look aggressive because it is.

What she's saying is even in her head. If you don't see it even in her head, that's what's going down. Okay, so can you explain to us, sort of start with each of the roles and tell us what they are and what that kind of means.

So the rescuer, what this person is, is. This is kind of the Mother Teresa. This is the mother. This is the. Let me fix your problems. So this person typically comes on overly helpful.

Okay.

So an example would be, let me make sure that I pack everything for you. Let me make sure that you have everything that you need, so I do what you can do for yourself. And from the outside, if I don't recognize this, it looks like I'm just a really nice, sweet person. But the truth is, inside, I feel like you probably can't do it yourself. And so I have to do it for you. I'm trying to relieve my own guilt or my own pain. I'm taking those frustrations. Yes. And if we go into addiction, it's. I'm just have to remind you, hey, remember, you probably shouldn't drink and drive like.

Oh, I call that the drive by knifing right there. It's like the little comment that is just like. You just whipped it in there and then kept going.

Yep. And that's the rescuer. Because inside, the rescuer has so much anxiety that they can't handle it. And so they come out super nice until they can't be nice anymore.

Okay, so they're helpful.

Helpful.

Helpful. But inside sort of building resentment.

Yes. Yes. Okay. Because they've got so much angst inside of them that. That this. They. They feel like they have. Being nice is the only way they can handle it.

So it's like the rescue. I think I've also heard it called the hero. Sometimes called the hero.

So.

And so it's basically the person that comes in to help out, rescue, be the hero for the role that's considered the victim role. So tell us about the victim role.

The victim role is somebody that takes no accountability for their life. They feel that they don't have any personal responsibility, and they feel helpless and hopeless.

Okay. So the victim is poor, pitiful me, basically. So in a lot of Addicted family systems. Is that where the addict would fall?

Yes, to start with. And the addict will jump to the other roles depending on what's going on. But yes, the addict would be in the victim role. Because usually I see inside their head.

Inside, usually. I say this a lot. I know it's inside their head. Cuz it's what they tell me in session. I say, you know how I know how dictazone is? How much self pity and resentment they got going on. Like that is the measure of addiction. Like it's constantly like this person's meaning. It's not fair. My mama's this, my wife is just too uptight, my boss is a jerk ball. And it's like how they, I always say it's like how they justify their continued bad decisions. So that's what victim is all about.

Right. Okay.

And victim is at like it's at the bottom of the triangle.

Right. And I always say this when I teach this, but the victim role is totally different than being an actual victim.

Right.

This is the victim role.

This is self pity.

Yes, that it means nobody understands me.

Right. The problem with it is that being the victim is how you justify making bad decisions. Which often leads us to jump over to the other big bad rolling bully.

The bad guy.

The bully. Yeah.

And whenever you have a persecutor, there's always a victim living inside the persecutor. Cause that's how they justify their bad behavior.

Cause you did something mean to me or how I perceived it as mean. So now I can say nasty things to you. I can say you're a big jerk. I can not like do what I said I was gonna do. Those kind of things. I can sort of run over you.

Yep.

Okay. So you've got Mother Teresa, woe is me and then big bully.

Yep, yep.

Okay.

And so like for a lot of parents, they struggle with the persecutor role because they'll give and give and give and they'll give a lot of chances to their kid. And then all of a sudden it's like, oh no you didn't. After everything I've done for you, after all the times I bailed you out, after the times I kept that life from your dad. And then it's coming in as the bully.

See to me when I hear that happen, it's like the parent starts in as the rescuer. It's like I'm taking care of you. I had your bag, I kept your secret, whatever. I did your math for you. You turned in whatever it was and then when the victim doesn't appreciate it, then the rescuer turns into the victim. Yes, because that's like you. You don't appreciate me now. You got, like, martyr syndrome. So that's. I've turned from rescuer to victim, and then I'm going to use that to justify saying a bunch of mean, nasty things or get even behaviors, stuff like that. Like revenge? Kind of. Yeah. Okay.

A good. A good example of this, which doesn't. Just to kind of illustrate it, is If I spend 12 hours cleaning my house, which I wouldn't do, but if I did, if I spent 12 hours, I don't have 12 hours. If I had 12 hours to clean my house, and I came home the next day, and it was super messy.

I saw Marta coming out just thinking about it. Do you see that? You're like, I don't have 12 hours. Do you see that? Real life isn't right there.

So If I spent 12 hours cleaning my house, and I came in the garage door, and all of a sudden the kitchen was a total mess, all of a sudden, I could see myself being like, who did this? Really? You guys were home for 12 hours? I did this. You didn't clean anything. So in that moment, I feel victimized because I spent 12 hours cleaning the house, and then they messed it up during the day. So at that point, I walk into persecutor role. You guys were home all day.

How did you do this?

Blah, blah, blah, blah. I might start, you know, making a mess or doing whatever. So at that point, they're my victim. I know myself well enough to know within about 2.5 seconds, I'm gonna feel really guilty. So then if I jump into the rescuer role, I'll be like, hey, you know, I'm sorry. I had a bad day. Why don't we go get pizza? Let's go do this thing that I know you want to do. So I'm rescuing them? No, but if I did, I would just sulk.

I just stay in it. I'd just be mad for, like, the whole day.

We gotta flip it, though. Okay, so then if I'm rescuing, I'm gonna do something they want to do. And then maybe they'll accept it, maybe they won't. But at that point, I jump from victim to persecutor to rescuer. And maybe they're like, no, mom, I'm not gonna talk to you. You were mean to me. So then now they're persecuting me, and then I might go upstairs and sulk in my bedroom, and then Boom. I'm the victim. And all this can happen within like three minutes. Right.

And it happens in the sort of in our own head. You know, we can change those roles in our own head really fast. But it also happens within the context of our relationships.

Right.

So sometimes there's a person in the family that typically starting gate position plays the victim. There's a person that typically plays the rescuer, and a person that typically pays the persecutor or bully. So which one of these girls is like the best ones? You know, I want to stay on the best one. None of them.

They're all terrible.

Not even the hero?

No, they're all horrible.

At least it has a good title. No, I like to say that's my story.

The hero turns into the nastiest of the persecutors because then they use all their good deeds and shove it, like, rubs it in your face. Like, at least the bully is just a straight out bully, you know, to kind of stay away from the bully because you know that the bully is usually mean. But the rescuer, you don't know if you're going to get the good version or the bad version.

Oh, that's the self righteous kind of anger right there. That's some serious martyr stuff.

Yeah, that's the worst because it's. Remember when I did this for you? Remember when I did that for you? So then even when they're being nice, you're like, oh, do I want to take this? Because it may take, you know, tomorrow I might be eating.

I'll pay for that, right?

Yes.

Do you have someone in your life that you're like, you know, if you let them help you or give you something that you are going to pay the price? Okay. That is the person, that is the rescuer. And you're just like, I don't have anything to do with it. Like, I don't want to borrow your pencil because I know I owe you something.

Right, Exactly.

Okay.

And that's the staff. None of them are good. Okay. So if you're driving to work and so the starting gates start in your head. And so if I'm driving to work and I'm late to work and, you know, and I pull in the parking lot and I look around and I see all the other cars in the parking lot and I'm like, how do all these people get here on time? Like, why am I always late? Boom. Went into victimhood.

Do you hate it when you pull up and you see your client's car there? That's the worst and you sneak in the back door. Does that happen?

I just go in the front door.

They know.

They know. But yes. So I pull in, the cars are there, and I'm like, why am I late? Why am I always late? And then I think, oh, well, Audrey. Audrey wasn't feeling well. Or Elliot got up a couple times in the middle of the night. So then I rescue myself because I feel bad that I'm late. So then I go in and I rescue myself. And then I'll go into the persecutor role. Or maybe I'll be like, well, of course. Of course I got up with the kids because Logan slept through it, because Logan can sleep like a log. So at that point, he's. I'm persecuting him.

He's the persecutor and you're the victim.

Yes.

Okay.

Yes. Because he's all his fault.

Those same husbands, they don't help with nothing.

So then. Yes. So then at that point, he's my persecutor because I'm the one that has to get up with the kids. I'm the one that has to do that, and that's why I'm late to work. So then I think, that's legit. So within, like, two seconds, I was the victim, the rescuer, the persecutor. Because then I'm persecuting him. Because I'm saying, well, you can sleep through the night. That's not fair.

Hey.

Right? So that's just an example of this starts in your head, and you have to watch it because you could live your whole day on it. Here's.

How can I tell you how that goes in my head? Because, you know, I have a late thing sometimes. So if I'm driving to work and I'm running late, I'll be thinking, God, Amber, you're such an idiot. Like, why can't you get your cry together? Bri is gonna kill you when you get to work. And then. So I have that thinking, and then that's me, like, victim. Well, that's actually me beating myself up first. So I'm like, well, yeah, so I'm beating myself up, and then I feel sorry for myself because I just beat myself up. And then I'm like, well, you know what? I do a lot. And, you know, I'm pretty good counselor, so I'm worth waiting on or something. So I might, like, make myself feel better. So it's like I beat myself up, I rescue myself, and then I feel better.

Yep.

Okay. Yeah.

So then. So the victim. Where's the victim there.

The victim was me, because I was being mean to myself, which is what made me feel the need to rescue myself. So that's why I say a lot to people. Like all that negative self talk you do, that's just you persecuting yourself, and that's just you being mean to you. And so if you do that, you're gonna eventually use your own self bullying yourself, a justification or reason to do something to make a poor choice of some sort.

Yeah.

So that negative self talk, don't do it. It's gonna lead to some bad decision making.

Nope.

What's your starting gate position? Tell us in the comments below. Come on, you can do it. You know, you got one. I think I tend to come in as the rescuer first. Which one do you come in as?

I probably come in as the persecutor more, but I go back and forth between the persecutor and the rescuer.

But in your head, you've been like the rescuer and the victim long before you come out as the persecutor. Okay, so it's like in your head, it's this, this, and this. And then as far as the other person's concerned, that comes out as the persecutor. It looks like you come out. Okay, so there is an answer.

Yes.

A way out of this, right? Yes. But we're not gonna give it to you on this video because that's a lot at one time. So the answer is, what is that? Because when you said that when you came. I don't think I ever heard that before.

There's five muscles that. Which are just behaviors that we have to develop in order to stay off of this. And so.

They'Re like these five healthy skills, right?

Yes.

And you'll get that in the next video.