How Functional Alcoholics Rebuild Trust (Without Rehab)

After months, possibly years of broken promises, just trust me? Sounds like manipulation. So today we're going to talk about what actually rebuilds trust, and it has nothing to do with going to rehab or AA. This is for both family of people who have addictions who are maybe in early recovery, and also for the person who struggles with addiction. So this is for both sides. This video is sponsored by Soberlink. A lot of you have heard me talk about Soberlink. We'll talk more about that later and we'll be taking questions. So if you have questions or comments, go ahead and get those up in the chat. And if you put a question mark on it, it puts a little note in the chat that helps us to see it faster. And Bree's back there moderating. She's going to be looking for us. So we're going to know exactly the dilemma here, and it's a dilemma on both sides. The family member feels like they've heard it all before. They can't trust you. You can say whatever, but you can apologize. You can say it's never going to happen again, but because they've heard it before, they just don't believe it. And so they're having a hard time trusting. But there's also a trust issue on the other side for the person who's struggled with addiction. They feel Criticized and they feel controlled and they feel like no matter what they say, you're not going to believe them. And yeah, there's some good reasons for that and there's good reasons for both feelings on both sides. And so the whole thing is trust isn't going to be rebuilt through words. You're going to need proof. But how do you prove sobriety without going to treatments? And how does— how do families, family members stop being the Drug and alcohol police. You got to get yourself out of this dynamic because otherwise, not only does it ruin the relationship dynamics, but it increases the chances of relapse on both sides. Because I consider that there's a relapse for a person in recovery, but there's also a relapse for the family members because family members can relapse back into old counterproductive, not helpful behaviors too. So let's start by talking about why just trust me isn't quite going to cut it. You've made promises, you've broken promises, you've given apologies. Apologies have been accepted, but then repeated 10, 20, maybe even 50 times in the family. They just stop believing any promises. And so a lot of times what, in my experience, what family members do is they They want to see some kind of evidence that you mean it this time. And usually the only thing that family members want to accept is either you're going to treatment because they feel like if you're not going to treatment, you're not going to get better, or that you're— sometimes it's they want to hear that you're going to AA meetings. And a lot of times what family members will do is they'll ask this question. They'll say, Well, what's different this time? And unfortunately, way too often when they say it, they say it with a bit of sass and sarcasm. Well, what's different this time? You said that before. And that's a legitimate question because you're looking for, how do I know that this time's going to end with a different result? The thing of it is, is even when they've said it in the past, it's possible that they meant it in the past, but just it didn't work because maybe they didn't do all the right things, or maybe they didn't know exactly what they needed to do. It's possible that they said it in the past and didn't mean it at all and never intended to make any real changes. And so families, they're looking for something to prove it. And the only thing that they know is, well, you got to go to treatment. And when they say treatment, that usually means inpatient treatment. Families almost always push for inpatient treatment, and inpatient treatment's usually like 30, 60, 90 days or longer, something like that. Or they want to see that you're going to meetings every day. And if you're not doing those things, they really have a hard time trusting you. It matters to family members because they want you to actually be sober this time, but they don't really have any way of knowing. So the only thing they know how to measure is whether or not you went to treatment or you went to AA. The skepticism isn't necessarily about you as a person, but it's about addiction. And unfortunately, the burden of proof is on you if you're the one who's working to overcome an addiction. The family is exhausted from playing the detective, counting the drinks, checking the bottles, smelling the breath, looking at the bank accounts. The surveillance is destroying everything. It's just putting everything on fire. It's not helping anything. Them The family member or the person with the addiction, but they need to know some kind of way without constantly checking. The point here is that both people have gotten into unhealthy, unproductive patterns, and it's not easy to break. And I see a lot of clients that really are genuinely trying and they mean it and they're trying to do things different. But because they've failed in the past to make those changes, they feel frustrated and stuck because nothing they say gets believed. One question for if you're a family member that you can ask that might get you a better answer and make you feel better is instead of saying what's going to be different this time, smart-alecky kind of way that We want to say it. Say this, say what's changed in your thinking about the drinking, the smoking, whatever the gambling, whatever the thing is. Ask what's changed in their thinking because that's what I look for when I'm working with clients. And almost always it does a bunch of times. Listen, this is not something people get right on the first time. Even people that are really trying, this is something that takes a few running starts. It is a learning process. And so what I look for, for people who are trying to get back on the wagon is I look for how they're thinking about it differently and what they've learned since the last time. But you got to either just listen for that in what they're telling you. And if you're going to ask that, just say, what feels different in your thinking? Or just point out to them what seems different in their thinking to you. I do that all the time. I'll say, I can tell that this time different because you're saying this and this and this, and I've never heard you say that before. I can feel in your demeanor, in your tone of voice, that there's like a conviction there. Like, I will reflect that back. I'll mirror that back to the client because then they're like, you're right. Like, I do feel different. It's not so much about what's different this time as far as I'm gonna jump through all these hoops. And that can be part of it. I'm not saying that's not part of it. But it really is, is what is different in your thinking this time about it? And for most people, the thing that shifts, that changes, that really creates the lasting change are changes in ways people think about whether or not they can manage it and changes in what people think is necessary to overcome it. So a lot of those false starts involve things like Feeling like you can cut it back and not stop completely. Feeling like you can use this substance but not that substance. Feeling like you can stop everything but not change anything else in your life, like people, places, and things. Feeling like you can stop and make changes in your life and not have to get any help whatsoever. Like literally not even listen to a podcast or something. Like you don't need to do anything. And when someone's in that frame of mind, it doesn't even necessarily mean that they're insincere about the change, but they probably aren't quite all the way there as far as understanding the severity of the issue. So things I listen for is someone's, the depth of their understanding about the problem. And that can include when people say things like, yeah, I've tried this and that and the other, and that's not going to work. Or I've learned this, I cannot be around that person. A lot of times it's willingness to make certain changes. It's willingness to take certain actions, but ultimately it's a shift of heart. When people really get that last big shift, they think about it different. Like they no longer romanticize and glorify the addictive behavior, whatever that was, in the same way. And you can feel, I call it a It's a spiritual shift, really. It's a shift of heart. And so when someone has that shift of heart, that's the key factor. And even if they don't go to rehab, even if they don't get help like the family member sometimes wants them to get help or to that level, when they have that shift of heart, it's pretty serious. And when someone decides that they don't want to be that person anymore, They'll figure out a way to make it work. So families, the good news for you is you don't have to have all the answers, right? The key isn't telling someone how to get sober and how to stay sober. I don't even consider that my job because in my experience, people already know how to do it. The key is getting people to come to terms with wanting to do it. And when that desire, when they have that shift of heart, Everything changes. Everything sort of turns upside down. I was working with a client a few months ago and my first session with this client, I said, when's the last time you drank? And this client said, well, it was yesterday, the day before I talked to him. And so I was talking to him. I said, well, do you think you could stay sober this week? Sober without like, do you need to go to detox? Like, what do we need to do here? And he is like, I think I can do it. But I could sense that there was Still like a lot of ambivalence around this, the issue. Like I could sense he's like, yeah, I probably could be sober, but there was some hesitation there. You could feel that he was like, well, he didn't say this, but you could sense that it was like, I could tell he wasn't sure if he wanted to do that. And so when I met with him the next week, I was pretty actually surprised to hear that he had stayed sober for the week because I didn't really feel like there was this big super commitment, like, I'm going to do this. I wasn't feeling that yet, but that's okay. That doesn't scare me. That's kind of normal. But when he came back the next week and I said, how are you doing with the drinking thing? He said, well, I haven't had a drink since the day before our last meeting. And I was like, what? And I was like, how'd you do that? And he said that After we had talked, I think it was like one of his kids' birthdays or something like, no, it was a grandkid's birthday. And he was the day after our meeting. And so he and his wife were going to go for the grandkid's birthday, all the things, and the whole family was there. And he didn't drink for that because he had promised his wife he wasn't going to drink for that. And he just had a whole different experience. He said, it was so great. I had such a great time. I really enjoyed myself and I could tell that my kids were responding to me differently. Like I could feel that they were so much lighter and less tense around me. And I really want that. I don't want my family to feel uptight. I don't want special occasions to feel like everyone's walking on eggshells and everyone's already mad at each other because there's been fights leading up to it about whether or not I was going to drink or not and whether or not I could be around the grandkids. And so once he had that experience, he came back to that next session and there was just a shift of heart, right? Like he was like, yeah, I don't want that stuff anymore. I want, you know, he was a guy that was about the retirement age. He was about to retire and he was like, you know what? I don't want to spend this part of my life, which should be a really good part of my life, living that kind of crazy. chaotic way that I was, which was a lot of fighting with his wife, a lot of sneaking and hiding, and like cat and mouse sort of situation, and a ton of resentment going back and forth. And then his kids could feel that resentment. So family get-togethers were always just uncomfortable. Like sometimes some of the kids wouldn't even come and sometimes they would come, but then him and the wife would be fighting the whole time. And he just suddenly from going to that grandkid's birthday party, he just saw the whole situation differently and he saw what things could be. And it wasn't even so much that he came to me and he said, I'm going to change. I'm going to go to AA 90 and 90 and get a sponsor. He didn't say anything like that. He didn't say, I'm going to go to detox. First of all, I didn't need to go to detox because he's already a week sober at that point. So I knew he didn't need to go to detox. What he needed was a heart shift, right? And he had that. And when you can feel that and see that in people, if you're the family member, you can help by pointing that out to them in a good way. So instead of trying to look for how it's not different and how they don't mean it and how they're lying this time, which I know is an instinct and it's a valid way to feel about it. There's a reason why you feel that way about it. But what you want to do is you want to see those things that are different. Notice those thinking shifts that the person has. Validate their positive reasons for change because you're helping to grow that seed in them. So not only did they have the heart shift, but you're helping it blossom even more as the family member. So instead of looking for why it's not going to work and how it's not different, look at your loved one for how it is going to work and how it is different and how they have learned lessons. And how they have come a long way and how you're really proud of them for picking themselves back up and trying it again, even though it's been a long, hard journey with a lot of ups and downs. Look for what is different yourself as the family member. So the person with the addiction needs a heart shift. Essentially, it's not so much they need to jump through any certain hoops. They need to have the heart shift. Once they have that heart shift, they'll figure out what hoops they need to jump through in order to make that happen naturally. Because when you, like, if you decided you wanted to build a house and you were really going to build a house, but you didn't know how, you naturally start researching that, investigating that, figuring out what tools you need or who you need to hire or whatever. So once they have that hardship, they have what they need. But the family still probably doesn't have what they need. Which is a sense of security. So the looking for the heart shift will help give you a sense of security, but because you've been down this road so many times as a family member, it's probably not enough to make you feel secure. You're probably still walking around super hypervigilant. You're probably watching Amber videos and you're like trying not to snoop and spy and sneak and like But it's really, you're either still doing it anyway, or you're really wanting to all the time, but you're resisting and that's taken a lot of energy from you. So when the person with the addiction can take some action steps, when they can verbalize what's different with their thinking, when they can verbalize how the problem has affected not just themselves, but the people around them, that gives the family That goes a long way for helping the family feel secure about it. But one of the biggest things you can do if you're the person who has addiction, if you don't want to go to rehab and maybe meetings aren't for you, you can think about what could you do? Are there things you could do as a person in early recovery to help your family feel better? And I know you may struggle with having resentment over having to do something like that, but You know, if you step back and you think about it for literally 5 seconds, there's a good reason why they don't trust you. It would be ridiculous if they did trust you, and you know that, right? And yeah, you know that you dug yourself this hole and that you need to spend some time getting out of it. And part of that means it's not just how do I get myself better, but how do I help my family heal too, right? So sometimes the family needs things from you that maybe you don't even necessarily feel like you need to heal, but it would help them heal. And guess what? That makes your life as a person in early recovery so much better. If your family is relaxed, it's going to make your recovery— it's like literally one of the best, most helpful things you can do for your own recovery is get your family to relax, right? Because when they're all hypervigilant and they're watching you like a hawk and they're constantly accusing you of whatever. And they think literally every time you walk out the door, you're being sketchy. That keeps everybody on edge and it keeps you in a bad mental space and stressed out, and it takes your resiliency down and it definitely leaves you more open and vulnerable to relapse. And that's just in a normal situation. I'm not even talking about— some people are just super oppositional. So if you're dealing with someone that's oppositional or you know that you're that person yourself, it's almost like you don't even want to do it, but because your family's trying to make you not do it, it's like now you're just resisting the urge to power struggle with them. So you got that layered in on top of everything else. So what are some things that the person with the addiction can do to show that they're serious? One thing is to talk out loud about what shifted in their thinking. About why they've decided to do that. When you can articulate that to your family member, that goes, I mean, I just can't even tell you how far that goes. That goes really, really far. Or you can say, I know I've tried this in the past and I meant it in the past, but I know I was trying not to give up that one friend. And like when you can express insight, I guess that's the word. When you can express that insight that you have to your family, it just helps so much. A lot of times people can express that to me, but they don't express that to their family members. Several reasons. One, because they try to avoid the subject like the plague because they're afraid any mention of anything is going to turn into an argument and they literally just want peace and quiet. So they're certainly not going to bring it up when the family's not bringing it up because they feel like it gets talked about too much anyway. So part of it is just avoidance of the topic, but Part of it is because they don't realize their new level of insights. Like they know it, but they don't know it. They don't realize it. That would be helpful to articulate because usually it just comes out to me, not in this big, like I had this giant insight and they spill it out. It's more in their talking to me about what they're thinking and what's been going on that I'm picking up these little pieces of insight. I'm like, ooh, that's different. Because remember when you used to say that? Now you're saying this. They don't even recognize it as that that's what it is. So sometimes that's why they're not expressing it to the family. And sometimes the reason you're not expressing it to the family is just because you feel so much shame in yourself about everything that's happened that you literally cannot tolerate the amount of discomfort that happens inside your body and your mind to even think about it. So a lot of times family members will ask me and like, well, they haven't even apologized. They don't seem to like recognize how it's going to affect me. I hear this all the time. I get questions about this all the time. Like, when are they going to like say they're sorry? When are they going to make their amends? When are they going to like acknowledge how all this has affected me? And I say to them, I say, well, I hear that they're not doing that, but it doesn't necessarily mean that they Don't know that or that they don't feel that. It could mean that. You can usually tell that by other behaviors. But if you see someone that's actively trying to change, there's some recognition on some level of that. They, it's possible that they're just not saying it because they can't. Think about things you've done that you feel so embarrassed about or so horrible about. Like you'll literally do anything just to not even think about it, let alone talk about it, right? A lot of times that's the way it is for people in early recovery. So rebuilding trust, expressing the insight, right? Being willing to do something different this time. And maybe that is getting some kind of help. Maybe that's going to recovery coaching. Maybe that is getting a sponsor. Maybe that is going over to talk to your cousin Jeffrey who's been in recovery for 10 years and you know that they're insightful. So if you can express a will to do something different to your family, that goes a long way to build trust. Another thing you can do is set up systems for accountability. Now, one of the things that people who are in the early stages of change, they'll say things like, well, you can drug test me anytime you want to, or you can breathalyze me anytime you want to. And they're saying that to the family member To say, "Hey, I'm serious. Like, go ahead, spot check me. I'm good." Like, and they mean it when they say it sometimes. Sometimes they're saying it as a bluff, like, and you can tell by the tone of their voice how they're meaning it. You know, if they say, "Fine then, drug test me anytime you want to," it's probably a bluff, right? And hey, drug test me, breathalyze me, or whatever. It's not that that's a bad idea, but it keeps the family in that policing role, which. Keeps things a little bit on edge. Like used to, before I knew about Soberlink, before I started using Soberlink in my practice, we would have, if it was alcohol in the trust and the spouse, the non-drinking spouse would breathalyze the person like once a day, usually like when they got home from work or something like that. And At the time, it was the most, it was like the best solution that we had, but it definitely had its problems. And the problems are this, when you're trying to do that yourself, when you're trying to be the family member's trying to be the accountability person, it keeps you stuck in that cat and mouse kind of dynamic. And it feels very uncomfortable on both sides every single time, right? Because the family member feels super uncomfortable about having to ask you. And you as the person feel super uncomfortable about having to do it because it makes you feel like a child or a prisoner, or at minimum, it just brings up all those really uncomfortable feelings that you're trying to avoid. And so it's just uncomfortable. And so what happens because it's so uncomfortable is that it'll happen for like a week or two, and then the— and then it'll just start to slide away because Both people don't like it. Neither person likes it. And so you just stop doing it because it's uncomfortable. But then that causes a problem. Well, it causes 2 problems. One problem is when you stop doing it, after a while it leaves rooms for the sneaky thoughts to come back in for the person that has addiction, right? So they weren't even thinking about drinking or using or whatever it was, but Now that you're not doing it, it leaves the opportunity for it to happen open. And even in people who are really trying, that's hard to resist because they're like, well, they're not going to test me. And then if they're having a bad day, if their willpower's down, if something bad happened at work, it leaves room, leaves a crack for addiction to get back in. So that's one thing. But even more problematic than that is what will happen is the family member will stop doing the drug testing or the alcohol breathalyzing or Whatever it is that they were doing for the accountability. And then one day, some days or weeks down the road, something will happen that the family member sees as sketchy, and then they'll want to reimplement the monitoring system, like the breathalyzing or the drug test or whatever. And that does not go well because when that happens, then it's an accusation and going to start a fight. So it's like you're supposed to be breathalyzing your partner every day or whatever when they get home from work. You do that for 2 weeks, it's fine. It's uncomfortable, but it's consistent and it's fine. If you don't do it for a month and then one day they come home 15 minutes late or they seem kind of funny or they seem different, and then you ask them to take a breathalyzer, you could imagine it's going to start a fight because They know when you're asking them that time, it's because you are thinking something, and that's why it feels like an accusation as opposed to when you're just doing it every day. It's not accusation. It's just part of the routine and part of what we're doing. So if you're going to do that kind of thing at home, first of all, both people have to be in agreement that that's what's happening. And it's happening for 2 reasons. One is for accountability to help the person stay sober. And 2, Maybe most importantly, that is about rebuilding trust in the family. So that's as much about what the family needs as what the person needs. It's both. Because sometimes I have people who are seriously done with it. Like I can tell they've had that heart shift and they're done and they don't feel like they need to be tested. And my guess is they probably don't because when they're done, they're done. But I'm like, but your family might need it. Your wife might need it. Your dad might need it. And that's still a good reason to do it for them. It's just hard when the family member's the one that has to say, will you pee in this cup? Will you breathe into this machine? Will you show me your bank account so I can see where you've been spending your money? Whatever that accountability measure is. And that's why I always say it's best if there can be some kind of accountability, some kind of way of proving it that doesn't involve the Family member having to ask for it. So that's why it's one of the reasons why I'm such a big fan of Soberlink, right? Because it's just an automatic way that does it. I always think of that old infomercial that says set it and forget it. I can't remember what that's for, like a crock pot or something. I don't know. Set it and forget it. Like you set the Soberlink system and it runs itself. It doesn't feel uncomfortable, so it doesn't back off. It's consistent. It doesn't Miss, right? And so it just— then the person is still being asked to take a test, but they're not being asked by their family member, so it doesn't feel personal. It's a schedule that they've come up with. It's a system that they've set up as a way for them to prove to you, to be able to show evidence so that they don't have to feel constantly like they're being watched or constantly like the shoe's going to drop on them or something. They can prove it So when the person with the addiction can come up with a solution and when they can come up with a way of showing the proof without the family member having to ask, that's the best. Soberlink's one of the best ways to do that if the problem is alcohol. Let me see if I have, yeah, I got one here. Let me show y'all what the device looks like. It's like, it's more than just a breathalyzing device. It's a system. So this is what one looks like. It's got, this is where the little straw goes in here. It's the camera and you set it. The person with the addiction decides what's the schedule going to be. Research shows 3 times a day is the most effective schedule. And then they just get a text message and then they can have an accountability partner that the results go to. That can be your counselor, your coach, your sponsor. It can be your family member. And sometimes it's not good for the family members to get that because it keeps them vigilant, but it's still better than them having to breathalyze you because they don't have to ask you to do it, right? It takes that level out. So if the person with the addiction wants the accountability, I suggest the person with the addiction sets up the accountability as opposed to the family member sets it up. It just Shifts the dynamic over to, hey, this is me. I'm trying to prove it to you versus the family member saying, you have to prove it to me, which it's just a little mindset difference, but it makes all the difference because it feels like if it's come from you, it's a decision that you've made. It's something that you want to do, not something that you're being forced to do, not some way that you're being questioned or disbelieved or something like that. So with the Soberlink, it's got the facial recognition in it, so you're really not going to cheat it. It happens on autopilot. You can set the results to go to whoever you want to be your accountability partner, as many people as you want to be your accountability partner. And that is one of the most effective things you can do to show proof. But it's, I think it's best if it comes from the person who is trying to prove the addiction, not necessarily comes from the family member. It just will work better. You can do similar things with other recoveries. If it isn't alcohol, maybe the problem is looking at pornography or something like that. There's softwares that you can put on, you can have them put on your own devices. I think there's one called Covenant Eyes. If the problem is gambling, there's certain softwares that you can have put on your devices if it's an online gambling issue. If it's an in-person issue, you can have yourself excluded. There's ways you can set up accountability for yourself as the person who has an addiction. You can, if it's drugs, you can sign up for recovery monitoring system that randomly draws you every now and then to have to go in and get a drug test. The point here is that it works best if it's coming from the person who is trying to get sober. And it will actually help you get sober and it will help your family member better so they don't feel like they have to be the police officer. And then everybody feels a lot more at ease and that helps everybody make progress faster. If you've heard me talk about Soberlink before, or even if you haven't and you're interested, I have put the link in the description. If you go to that link, it takes you to a page where I literally show you how it works on the back end, how everything's set up and All the things. So you can see on that page all the information about it. So check it out. But if it's not alcohol, there's other ways of doing this. I would like to know from you guys who are watching live, what kind of accountability systems have either you set up for yourself or has maybe like as part of your aftercare plan, if you've left a treatment center, what kind of accountability systems have you come up with? Because you're probably thinking of ones I'm not even thinking of, and that would help someone else in here. To hear about them. If you're the family member, what would help you feel more at ease? What would help you feel like you could turn in your private investigator badge or whatever, and you could stop being the police and you could stop being the monitor? You want to get yourself out of that monitor role because it's not helping. It's really not helping you feel better because even if you're not finding evidence, you constantly feel like You're probably just not finding the evidence. It's probably happening anyway. So it doesn't really help either side, to be honest. And you just want to take yourself out of that role because it's going to take your stress down tremendously. It's going to be hard at first, just like it's hard at first for a person to resist cravings. The family has a craving. It's a craving to check up on you, to monitor you, to see if your car is where your car's supposed to be, to look at where you're at on the tracking app on the phone. Like it's an urge, pretty much the same as an urge to drink or something else. They get in that habit the same way you get in the habit and resisting it is difficult. And it's easier for both people to resist the urges when you have some kind of accountability in place. It is the best way to rebuild trust. It doesn't have to be going to rehab. I had this client one time who had a lot of ambivalence about not drinking and Every time he would mess up, I would know he'd mess up because I would get— Campbell would come in there and tell me, we got to have a couple session together, which I hate because it usually means my person's in trouble. And the question was always, what are you going to do different this time? And they weren't saying it, but what they were looking for was either I'm going to go to treatment or I'm going to go to AA every day. And so my client would usually say, I'm going to go to meetings. It would be his answer, and that would help the wife feel better for 5 minutes. And then he would do that for a week and a half, and then it would fall off because he didn't really want to go to meetings. He didn't really feel like going to meetings was going to help him. And so he would just agree to that plan because he knows that that's basically what he needed to say. To get another chance, essentially. But after you said that, however many times, and it was a bunch of times, you know you don't mean it. They don't believe it. And it just, it's the whole like, just trust me thing. That's when it just doesn't work anymore and you need to do something different. So express insight differently, right? Be willing to do things you haven't been willing to do in the past. Change people, places, and things. Stop going certain places. Be willing to let go of that other substance, whatever you've been hanging onto, those past attempts that have failed. You know why they failed. You know in your heart what it is, why it is. If you really are trying and it's not working, you know why it's not working. Whatever that thing is that you've been resisting, get willing to do that. Maybe it is going to meetings. Maybe it is Going to therapy or getting a recovery coach. Maybe it is going to detox. I don't know. I'm just saying it doesn't necessarily have to be that, but I know that you know in your heart what that thing is, that one thing that you've just been doing and you've just resisted, but you know deep down inside, that's what you need to do. That's what you need to do. And if you can express that to your loved one, it's going to go a long way to build trust and set up some accountability systems. It's a good way to show that you mean it without having to go to treatment. It's a good way to show that you mean it even if you're coming out of treatment, right? Either which way, it's so helpful for both sides. All right, in just a minute we're going to take your questions and your comments, and I'm still hoping that you guys put in there what are some things you've done to build accountability in your family system on either side. So go ahead and get your questions and comments up there. Bree's back there moderating. She's about to put them up here for me. I've put link to Soberlink in the description. I've Put link to recovery coaching in the description. Links to all kinds of other resources are down there, so be sure to check those out. All right, Bree, what do we got back there? Monica. Monica, I feel like your name is new. I don't remember seeing that one. If you are new, welcome to our little community. We're glad you're here. Monica says, my loved one completed a 20-day inpatient treatment, but a few weeks after coming home, he relapsed. And now shows signs of physical addiction again, as withdrawal symptoms are so severe. I set a boundary that I would move out of our home until I feel comfortable that he's got control of his recovery and detoxes safely under medical supervision. It's been 3 weeks since I moved out, and each time I visit, he thinks I'm staying for good and then gets upset all over again. Not sure what I should do. Is there more to that one, Bree? There's not more. Okay. Not sure what I should do. Well, one of the things, Monica, that's so hard about answering is because I always have 100 questions back for you. So one of my questions back for you, Monica, is, so you're going to visit. Are you seeing signs that they're changing? Like, have they been sober? Do you think they've been sober or are you going to visit and they're still In their active addiction and nothing's changing, but they think you're going to stay? Can you answer me that? Pop that in the chat and we'll look for your answer to that because I can respond better if I know that piece. Is it like they're doing good, but you just need longer, or is it they're not even making any shifts? Hey, thank you for the Super Chat, Margaret. I really appreciate that. Thank you so much. That goes a long way to help all that Those Super Chats and donations, they go to help them produce all this content. And it's kind of expensive to produce this content, believe it or not. I actually have a whole team, video editors and all kinds of stuff. So I really appreciate that. Thank you. We got him out of jail on November 16th. He started using pretty soon after he returned home. In order to keep all safe, we put him in an extended stay hotel. So much lack of trust using his inheritance. How can we build trust with us from his new location at the hotel? So, so that's a that's a good question. But the first thought that I'm having, Elizabeth, is I don't like the setup. That's not really answering your question, but immediately in my mind, him to be at an extended stay hotel. So. Even for people who are really trying, being alone— and this isn't me telling you let them in the house, Elizabeth, I'm just explaining this to you— but being alone, even for people who are really trying, isn't good. Like, I had someone tell me this week, they're like— and they are really serious, like they've had the hardship— they're like, yeah, I'm about to be, you know, out of work for a couple weeks for Christmas break, you know, just normal. And they're like, and normally this is when I would really be off to the races because I would have these days off and my spouse wouldn't. And so this person was like, so he was purposely planning on how to not be alone. And this is someone who's really serious about trying, didn't feel like they could be alone. So if this person is in a relapse and they're in an extended stay hotel and you haven't said anything, I haven't seen anything yet, Elizabeth, that makes me think he's even saying he's sober or saying he's going to try to be sober. And layer on the top of that, you mentioned something about inheritance, which makes me think this person is living by themselves in an extended stay hotel and they've got inheritance money. That's a bad setup. So I'm not even, I mean, of course it's possible that they could be being sober, but not likely. So I wouldn't focus so much on how can we rebuild trust, but I would go back to, you need to go back to looking at some of the earlier things, which is how do we motivate someone to make a change? We're not in a trust-building position here. I don't think we're in an active recovery position here. I don't think, because I'm not hearing that. So I think you need to back up and you're asking the wrong question. You need to go back to like, how do I get someone out of denial? How do I Like invisible intervention kind of stuff. Elizabeth says, this is Elizabeth. She says, we had contact when he came home that he signed a contract when he came home that he signed, but unfortunately it did not make a difference. Our expectations if he continued using was to move him out. Okay. And I have a video, I can't remember what it's called. from way back, but we don't usually advise contracts because they don't work. And families want to do this. And sometimes treatment centers even recommend this, like for aftercare, part of people's aftercare. They'll say they'll help the families and they'll first come up with a contract. But I'm not a big fan because in the family's mind, it's like, okay, it makes it somehow serious and formal and like legitimized. But if you're dealing with addiction, addiction breaks every rule. If you think signing a contract Is going to make one teensy bit of difference to stop addiction. It's not. What ends up happening, Elizabeth, with contracts is it ends up backing the family member into the corner, not the other person, because addiction doesn't care about your contract, but the addicted person will hold you to the letter of the law and they'll look for the loophole in your contract because maybe your contract says You got to pass your drug test to live here, whatever. And maybe they're passing their drug test, but you know good and darn well that they're sketchy as can be. But they're like, it says I got to pass my drug test. Like, they'll hold you to the line. So I'm just not a big fan of contracts. And if someone is really trying to change, like, the contract isn't needed. And if they're not trying to change, It's not going to do anything. So Elizabeth, what you need to do is sort of back up and think, how do I get this person to figure out what they need to do? And that could be sober living. There's something else that needs to change that I can tell you it's not living by yourself and having inheritance money or having a contract. So it's not, you're not to the trust building process yet. You're to the, how do we get them through the stages of change part? Thank you. Thank you so much for that super chat. It's Wabasim. Am I saying that right? The username. Thank you. I don't know what even currency that is, but I appreciate it. What currency is that, Waseem? Bree, do you know what that little symbol is? It's not a dollar. I don't know what it is. Thank you though. I really appreciate that. And I feel like your name is a new username that I haven't seen before either. All right, Monica is back. This is my second live stream, BTW, but watch your videos. Hey, welcome to your second live stream. It saved my sanity, so thank you. My loved one is still drinking but is reducing daily according to him, and I notice he's been drinking when I see him, so it's uncomfortable for me. Okay, so the situation is, is you You said, you guys remember Monica said she moved out and said, I'm not coming back home until you solve this problem. But you're still interacting, you're still visiting. And so according to him, he's cutting back every day, like trying to taper himself off. And then he's mad, like, why aren't you coming back home? I'm fixing it. But you're like, yeah, but we're not there yet. Because when I see you drinking, it triggers me and that's not good. So here's the thing about Monica. I'm not saying it can't be done, but I am going to say I haven't seen it done. The whole idea of tapering yourself off of an addictive substance until you're done and then stopping completely by yourself, I haven't seen that work. It kind of flies in the face of the whole nature of addictions. Like if you control it, We wouldn't be in this situation. So it's a good idea and I think it's going to work. Now that doesn't mean that your loved one doesn't mean it. That doesn't mean that they're lying or that they're not trying. I'm just saying I don't think it's going to work. I'm doubtful. Maybe I'm just skeptical. I haven't seen that work. It sounds good in theory. I've seen it work under medical supervision, like sometimes with medication-assisted treatment, but the whole idea of someone saying, I'm just going to drink less or smoke less or Snort less or whatever it is, a little less every day until I'm off. Like, that's a lot of willpower for a lot of day. I just don't see it happening. So I would say to use something similar to, I said to that last person is I would say you're not even in a trust-building place yet. Your loved one is still bargaining, so you don't even need to be thinking about like How do I trust him? This is about not trusting addiction. I'm not even saying I don't trust him. I'm saying I don't trust addiction can do that. I don't trust alcoholism can do that successfully. But you don't necessarily have to say that to him. You can be very positive. You can say, hey, I love the fact that you're reducing or whatever. I love the fact that you're committed to solving this problem. And once we get there, it's going to be great. But you could kind of put it back in their corner. To like, let's see how it goes. I don't want you to say to them, that's not going to work. Or Amber says, that's not— don't say that. I'm just giving you a heads up, but it's a bad scenario. He's by himself. He's trying to cut it back, taper himself off little by little. Like nothing about that fits with how addiction works. So you're right to be skeptical. And you can say to your loved one, you can say, listen, I want to be supportive and I want to see you, but if If my coming over here is upsetting you, then I won't do that. Not as in, well, I won't come over here, but like, I don't want to keep upsetting you. So that puts them being upset back in their corner. It makes it back their problem instead of them making it your problem. It makes it their decision to decide that they're going to control their upsetness because you're going to say, hey, I don't want to upset you because you are trying hard. So put the problem back in their ball court. Cobra 2543 says, what do you do when your loved one is doing all the things but you still can't trust them? Okay, when you say all the things, you mean all the things right, like they're doing the accountability, this and that and the other. What you do then is you just manage your own feelings inside and you don't necessarily act out loud on those feelings. You just know that it's just going to take time for you to heal and that the feeling will come. So I don't know that there's something you need to necessarily do differently as far as your interaction with them or something they need to necessarily do. Like, it's just a time thing, right? You're not trusting them is like reasonable, right? Like, there's a reason why and it's Your brain's trying to protect you and that craving doesn't go away in you immediately, just like the craving doesn't go away in them immediately, right? So even though they're trying, even though you're trying, that feeling, that urge, that pattern that's developed, it takes a minute to go away. So I would say just give it time. All right, Bree says we are to the end of our time for today. Thank you so much for the super chats and thank you so much for the really great questions and even just for showing up and being part of the conversation. Feels silly when you're talking to yourself, so I really appreciate you guys showing up. If you're watching on the playback, hey, we're glad you're here too. Tell us your story in the comments below. Tell us what you think. What accountability have you tried? What's worked and what hasn't? I read all of your comments. And if you're watching on playback, maybe you can join us live next time. We're live every Thursday at 1:00 PM and we release Other videos on Tuesday. There's resources in the description, and I'll see you guys next week. Bye, everybody.