Nichol Kessinger, Truth, Lies, Manipulation, and Everything In Between |The Chris Watts Affair

Did Nicole Kessinger actually physically help Chris Watts with the murders of his family? Did she manipulate him into doing it? Was she completely not involved at all? That's what we're going to explore in this video. You guys have been asking me to do this. I recently released a video about Chris Watts and my theory about why he did what he did. And that theory was very, very different than most of the theories, and it seemed to spark a lot of controversial comments. People either really, really like that theory, or they were sort of very much disliked it. But one of the. One of the reoccurring comments that I saw over and over is you guys wanted to know all about Nicole Kessinger. What was her role in this issue, and you wanted an analysis on that. Now, for those of you who are new here, you don't know me. I'm Amber Hollingsworth. I'm a master addiction counselor, a licensed professional counselor, and a whole bunch of other credentials. But basically, what I do is I talk to people all day, every day who get themselves in a really bad situation. I talk to people who find themselves doing things that they never really thought that they would do. And the reason why I went ahead and chose to talk about this and when I made the Chris Watts video is because I want you guys to know exactly how people go from living a somewhat normal life into some kind of horrendous, awful mess like we see here in this Watts family case. And so, you know, we want to think in our mind that these are just easier evil. Everybody's just these evil monster villains. And the interesting thing about this, this case particularly, is that everyone wants to point the finger at a different person that's a villain. Right? People want to point their finger at him because he did commit those murders, and what he did was absolutely horrific. But you have a whole lot of other people who want to point their finger at his mother. You've got people who want to point their finger and say that it was Shanann, his wife, and it was because of the way she was. You've got a whole other set of people out there who want to blame Nicole Kessinger. Hey, Weston. Hey, Emmanuel. I'm probably saying that wrong. And. Hey, Shirley. Thank you for joining me. So today I want to focus particularly on Nicole Kessinger and sort of give you my analysis of it. We're going to talk about the truth, lies, manipulation, and everything in between. So here's the thing. People want to make her the villain because she's the mistress. And when you're the Mistress, you kind of put yourself in the villain spot. So I'm not really going to try to defend that. But what I'd like for you to do is look at the situation objectively. And as you're watching this video, I'd like for you to just try to, just for a few moments, turn off your emotional reaction to what happened. And let's look at the situation with, with our most objective brain. Because I've seen so many comments on this case, and some of them are just outlandish. And it tells me the extreme emotions that people are having about this, and it's really clouding their judgment. And you might think to yourself, well, who cares why? What they did was awful. You know, that was horrible. I should have never done it, which I thousand percent agree with. But the best way to make sure you don't find yourself in a really, really terrible situation is to understand how this happens to people. And you may be thinking, well, this could never happen to me, or it could never happen to my family or anyone I know, but you're wrong. People do bad things. Every person is capable of doing bad things. Now, am I saying that every person is capable of doing what he did? No, but what I am saying is every person is capable of doing bad things that you don't think you would ever do. And the way it happens is we find ourselves crossing little lines a little bit. You know, we cross a line and we justify it and then we redraw the line and we cross that line and we justify it and we redraw that line until people can find themselves in all kind of terrible, terrible situations. You know what it's like? It's like how many of you watch that show Breaking Bad? You know, you got this ordinary chemistry professor who makes some decisions one after the other and progressively finds himself in a crazy situation. Or the Netflix series the Ozarks. You guys watch that with Jason Maitman. That's another good one, right? You got this ordinary Joe, who, because of a series of events, some his fault, some not his fault, makes choices and lands himself in a very, very bad predicament. And you may be thinking, well, that's tv, that's not the way it happens. But those are really sensationalized, extreme ways that that happens. And so is the Chris Watts case. But the thing I want you to get in general is that those kinds of situations, maybe not to that extreme, happen every day. And if you don't want that to happen to you or someone in your family, you better get your head wrapped around how that happens instead of telling yourself like, oh, that couldn't be me, or I would never do that. When you, you put people in certain situations, they're gonna behave in certain ways. So let's look at Nicole Kessinger here. Now, everybody's frustration with this case is all the lies. But honestly, it's not the lies that she tells. It's not the lies that Chris Watts tells the police or even in that, you know, TV interview he did. That is really surprising to me. Right. Anyone in that situation is going to lie. Now, I know what you're thinking. Well, not anyone will get themselves in that situation, which is true. But if you put yourself in that situation for whatever reason, you're going to lie. She told some lies and I'm pretty sure anyone in the situation that she was in initially is probably going to lie. It's almost like a self preservation thing. And I don't. Please don't get crazy and start attacking me here. I'm not saying that it's okay. What I'm saying is like a lot of people talk about how she deleted the text before she went to the police. What was she hiding? And people have some pretty far fetched theories out there about exactly why she did that. But sometimes things are just more simple than all that. It really is kind of what it looks like. She's having an affair. This whole thing goes down, it's a mess. She wants to hide it naturally. And so she gets scared because she starts thinking, oh my gosh, like they're gonna figure this out, they're gonna come after me, they're gonna want to see all this. So she has an initial reaction to erase all the text messages. And so I don't think that is that abnormal. I don't think it's that abnormal that she told some lies in the, like the interrogation or really it's not interrogation, like the interview? I guess I would say it. What's really interesting and noteworthy about this case is not the lies that anybody in this story is telling anybody else. Okay? That happens all the time. What's interesting in this case is the self deceit. That's where the problem comes in. And that's what led this whole bad situation to get as bad as it did. It's not the lying to somebody else part, it's the lion to yourself part. It's the lion that Chris did to himself. It's the lion that the lying that Nicole, the lies she was telling herself that got her in the situation. So here are the theories out that I'VE heard. I've heard that she either, you know, killed the family members herself, or she was there and helped, or she told them to do it, or she was the mastermind behind doing it. And I, with the information we have, I really don't think that that is the case. Not that directly. Now, do I think that she has more involvement than she says? Yeah, of course I do. And so I want to talk about where that fine line is. That's what I'm talking about, where that in between stuff really is. So the reason people think that there's several little pieces of evidence, some things that we know. So let's go through those one by one. The first thing that comes out a lot is the fact that she Googled Shannan Watts, like, a long time before the relationship started. So I really think that she. I don't know how long she worked at the place. It's kind of interesting that I haven't seen that anywhere. Do any of you know that? Do y' all know when she got hired to work at Anadarko, I think, is the name of the place? I think she probably saw Chris. I think she probably thought he was cute or whatever and developed a crush on him, and she started, you know, like, searching him on social media and that sort of thing. I don't think that's that abnormal. I think she probably started to develop a crush on him, sort of fantasize about him. A lot of people say the relationship started way back then when she did that, but I really don't think so. And the reason I don't think so is because one of the pieces of evidence that we've all seen, if you're following this case, is the actual emails that start. I think they start on, like, June 5th, I think it is. And you can tell just by the sound of the emails that they're really just work emails. And then you can look at the next email and see how it goes a little further and a little further and a little further. Like, you can watch that relationship go from, like, a work relationship into something else pretty clearly in those emails starting on June 5th. So that's really the reason I don't think that it went back further than that. And I know a lot of people think it did. I think that maybe her feelings for him went back further than that, but I don't think the relationship went back further than that. Let's see what else. Now, one of the most damning things that she did, probably, of, like, all the pieces of evidence, it's like wow. Really, you know, makes you want to be like, seriously, Was the fact that, you know, there was some record that she had Googled Amber Fry's book deal, which is historically, it's another mistress of somebody who killed his family. And so the fact that she did that, that's pretty dark and cold. I don't know what it is. Selfish. It's a whole lot of. It's a whole lot of ugly. And that when you hear something like that, it really, you know, it strikes a nerve in all of us. And it's like, wow, you know, like, what the heck? You know, what kind of person does that? And I can see that she was looking for, you know, wedding dresses, all that stuff. All of that I don't really see as all abnormal, except maybe the Amber Fry thing pretty out of bounds. But I think that she had a crush on this guy. I think that she deluded herself. I think that she was very immature, maybe just because she hadn't been married before. And when you haven't been married, you may think you understand marriage and what love is, but you really don't. And so I think that she convinced herself somehow, because this is usually the case, that either this relationship was over, and I have no doubt that he fed into that and made sure she continued to think that by telling her whatever kind of lies he told her. And you think, oh, okay, that's not. That was over, or that was a bad relationship, or she treated him bad. And then you just feel like, I'm just gonna be the right one. I'm gonna rescue him, he's gonna love me, it's gonna be different. Right. That's just a naiveness right there about not understanding what she's dealing with and a selfishness. But I think it comes from a lack of maturity and understanding because we. She wants to convince herself of what she wants the truth to be there instead of looking at what actually is. Now, do I think that she knew still married? Yeah, clearly. Because how could you not? Do I think she knew that the wife was pregnant? Yeah, how could she not? I think that she knew those things, but I think that she was deluding herself about what the nature of that relationship was. And I think he was deluding himself about it because once he started developing feelings for her, he starts to, you know, lie to himself. Because that's what people do. They self justify. When we make bad decisions, and we all do this to some degree, we then justify those decisions. And a lot of the ways that people do this is they victimize themselves. They see themselves as a victim. They make someone else the villain. And it's almost like they rewrite history, right? And so I. There's no doubt in my mind that he had a lot of that going on. He was deluding himself, and then that was spilling over. I'm sure he was telling her she was deluding herself. So how does all that lead into how or why? You know, what's her involvement in the actual murders? I think that she found herself in a situation where she's dating a married man. And I think there were times it made her really mad and jealous and upset that she had to share. And I think she'd start thinking about that, and then she'd get really upset, and she'd throw a fit. Now, this is where I think the real deception comes in, in those police interviews. I think it's in a place that's different than other people. Like, you know the part where she says. I'm sure you guys have seen it, where she's talking to the police officer, whoever, and she's talking about how she told him to go make things right with his wife. There were a couple of times right when that happened. Here's what I think. I think she did tell him that. I know you're gonna think, really, Amber? I don't think she did that in this. Like, I'm being, like, kind and objective, and I'm trying to make sure that he's, like, closed all those doors with her. Like, she tried to act like it was. I don't think that at all. I think it was. I got mad and I threw a fit, and I said something like, know, why don't you just go fix it with her? You know, I think it was like a fit. I think she may have said what she said she said, but not in the way that she said it. Does that make sense? Because a lot of times it's context. And she may have said those things about, you know, try to fix it with your wife or this or that or the other, but she was not as objective or patient or, you know, detached as she tried to make it sound in that police interview. I think that's where the real deception went on. I don't think it's so much that the story doesn't exactly line up. I know a lot of people don't think it does. But to be honest, his story and her story about the relationship from what came out, it matches up pretty good. Which also matches up to the evidence, which is the text messages and the emails, like, the hard, concrete Things that you can really look at. And those are the things I'm going on. I'm not going to include anything else. Like did he have other affairs before that? I know there's some talk about that, but there's no proof of that. So I'm not including in this theory anything about any of that stuff that's not like what he said, what she said, what's known from facts and evidence. So did she manipulate him into it? I think she put him in a position and I think he was super, like weak willed. I think he was very passive and conflict avoidant. And I think he knew he was stuck in between two really strong personality women. And I think he knew there was not going to be any way out of the marriage he was in. Not any easy way out because Shannan really clearly was trying to fight for the marriage, which meant that was gonna. It was gonna be difficult for him to leave and then financially difficult for him to leave and all of that stuff. And he made a horrible, horrible decision. Now I have another video about how what I think was going on in his thinking, but this one is really just to focus on her, which is more about. I think she just deluded herself and I think she threw some hissy fits. That's what we call it when I was growing up. She threw some hissy fits that made him know very clearly that she didn't want to share and that she didn't want to deal with this being in between thing anymore. Do I think it's that different than any person that's having an affair? I really don't. I really don't think the behaviors are that different. Doesn't mean. I'm saying it's okay. I'm just saying I don't find it that abnormal for that situation. I think his response to that was pretty abnormal, but I think the reason he did that was because of a combination of a whole bunch of factors that I talked about in the other video. The conflict avoidance, the addicted affair state, and all that kind of stuff. All right, so let me. So those of you who are online, let me take a look at some of your comments and questions because I really want you guys to join in this conversation. All right. Takes me just a second. I'm not a good multitasker here. Oh. Just call you Emma. Okay. That's so much easier. I will do that. See, Emma says I never going to let her off the hook. She lied when she said dearest. Something led her up the stairs. Yeah, I do think that she lied. I Don't think that she's like cleaning all this. I don't think she's a victim, that's for sure. I just don't think that she was like, literally like a murderer, like some people are saying that she was. I think that she got herself in a situation that a lot of people find themselves in. And it's like I said, it's one of those things where you, you, you cross the line. You cross the line across the line until you find yourself in the middle of this big storm and you are not thinking straight at all. Ashley says, I believe Nicole has traumas and insecurities from her childhood. Why would she want a married man? That's a really good question. I think it's pretty natural to want to think like something happened in her childhood. What's interesting about this is there's like, I haven't seen really anything about her past, so it's hard to really speculate on that. And if I didn't say that at the beginning, obviously everything we're doing here is just speculation based on what's public and what everybody's seen. Obviously don't know any of these people. I'm not trying to diagnose any situation or anything like that. Let's see. Shirley says, do we know anything about her mother? Seems as if her mother's not in her life. I wonder if it was a long time situation. That's a really good question because you're right. You hear no mention of the mother. There was the, you know, she brought her father to the police interview. So you know that there was some kind of relationship there. But you're right, there's no, there's no mention of that. But it does definitely makes me think there's some kind of attachment issue going on. There's probably something in the past. I just don't want to say what it is because we don't really have enough information to say. Amelia says she wanted to see how far she could push him. I think that she was. I don't know if it's so much like I'm trying to see how far I can push you, like trying to push him over the edge. I think she was trying to force him to choose. And I think that he did not have very good skills on problem solving and he made a very bad choice. Exactly. Why would you want to ever have some man's dirty little secret? Second best. Exactly. But I think she was telling herself that relationship was over. Even if she knew she was still married. It was probably telling her something along the lines, yeah, we're still married, we coexist, we're like roommates. You know, it's just a. A logistical thing or financial thing, or it's for the kids, but we're like, not in this relationship. So I think he was telling her some version of something like that. And I think she was trying to believe it. I think she's trying to believe it. Maybe says, I don't think. I don't think she thought he'd kill his family over her. But I do think she saw him as a challenge and really wanted to push Shannan away hard, fast. You know what? That's well said, Amelia. That's right where I'm at. That's. I don't think that she thought he would do that, and I don't think that she was actively involved in that. Do I think that she did some very out of bounds things and acted pretty immaturely and naively? Yeah, I think she did that. Ezra says objectively, Nicole Kessinger lied. Yeah, everybody lies. I'm not making an excuse for it, but I'm just saying, like, that to me, is not the surprising part of this case. Let's see, she did, and they're saying it's a misprint or something. Is that about one of the dates? I think is what you're talking about there. Ashley says, I can't stand her voice. I think a lot of what real. I mean, as if just being the mistress does not put her in the villain spot enough by itself. But it's just irritating when you watch those interviews and she's just seems so like, flirty and inappropriate and she's trying to act cool, basically, is what it is. She's trying to act like, oh, like what? Like, what are you talking about? Like, what. What happened? Like, how did I. You know, just trying to really play it off, which isn't surprising seeing as how she found herself in that crazy, crazy situation. Ashley says she lost some brain cells watching it. See what Tessie says, I'm glad someone is finally talking about this whole thing. I hope there's a way to take her down. Please. She sure has, like, vanished pretty well. I gotta tell you that there's, like, not a lot about her before and not a lot after. So we have, like, a lot of information about what went on in this very short period of time. And I think that's where a lot of people make mistakes, is they're trying to make all these giant assumptions and even like, giant mental health diagnosis with some thoughts and behaviors and actions. That happen in this very sort of narrow window of time. And I think it's easy to rush to judgment on all those things. But like I said, pretty much anyone can find themselves in that type of situation, this type of situation in the affair. Deluding yourself about a relationship, whether it's like a romantic relationship you have, a friendship you have. We've all done that to some degree, right? We've all been dishonest with ourselves about some situation like that. And it's really strange because you can't see the truth of it until you get outside of it. You know, the clients I see in our office who are struggling with addiction, they really don't know how tangled up they are or even how miserable they are or how messed up things are until they get outside of it. Because you really can't see clearly the situation for the storm. NK talks like a teenager telling off her mom. I kind of agree. And I think that's. That's just one more thing that really just sort of rubs you the wrong way and puts her in that villain spot. Cheryl's got a good comment here. She's talking about the Thrive products, which a lot of people have asked me about, and I don't honestly know a lot about, but I can't. I have to think that it probably plays a part a little bit in the equation. I think his weight loss played a part in the equation. I think he's just kind of like. Honestly sort of like a quiet, boring guy that sort of fades into the background for the most part. And then he lost weight. And then this attractive girl is really attractive to him, and she's making him feel great. And I think that's how he sort of got himself stuck in that situation where he was in that infatuation, passionate limerence, first stage of love, which is really an addicted state of mind. Yolanda said so disrespectful going into Shannan's house. I agree with that. And I've seen some other comments about that, But I think in her mind, and I think I was listening to somebody today talk about her being in Shanann's car. And I think in her mind it's like, oh, I'm in his house or I'm in his car. That's what I'm saying is like people's ability to delude themselves, to be in denial and to not see things that are so clearly there. You really just don't understand how powerful it is. It's very powerful. People come to see me all the time. And the situation is so clearly, clearly right there in front of them and they cannot see it. And I've been doing this kind of work for more than 15 years, and I still get surprised at the people's ability to delude themselves about things. And it comes from that self justification thing that we see what we want to see. And we all have a tendency to do that. And I think that's why it's important for us to think about things like this, because we need to really stop and, you know, do some introspection and ask ourselves how we delude ourselves, how we get ourselves in bad situations. You know, you make one bad choice, it leads you to make another bad choice and another bad choice. And when you can stop and you can acknowledge that and you see how it happens to other people, that's the way you can prevent it. Thank you, everyone who hung out with me. If you want to see more of my thoughts on this case, I've got a couple of other videos about the Chris Watts situation. And if you're really interested in the science and psychology of addiction, I hope to see you around on some of our other videos else, because that's what we talk about here. Bye.