Episode 330: The Peaceful Parent Revolution For Emotional Well-Being

Hello everyone, this is Rebecca Green for the Winey Palooza podcast, and I am very excited today because I get to speak with Kiva Shuler today. Kiva, thank you so much for being here with me today.

Rebecca, thank you for having me.

I was just telling Kiva that I don't think I could have a more perfect guest than her, and you're going to find out why. Um, she is a sought-after mentor, speaker, and coach And I'm going to let her tell us more about her background and how you founded the Jai Institute and why. And like, tell us all the good stuff.

Yeah, thank you. So the Jai Institute for Parenting is really the result of a promise that I made to myself when I was 16. I grew up in a divorced household, so I had this unique— not that unique, but a perspective of a child of being raised in homes that had very different come-froms, different ethos and culture. And so my mom's house, my mom was a dinosaur of the 1970s and '80s, out with her like big shoulder pads, making her way in the media industry. So she wasn't around a lot. I was pretty much a latchkey kid. And but she loved me. And believed in me and raised me to believe that I could do and be anything. My dad remarried a more traditional, um, his, his wife was more traditional. They had a son, my half-brother Ian, who's 7 years younger than me. And that house was super punitive, um, it was erratic, it was inconsistent. Something that he did on Tuesday that was cute and they laughed at him got him locked in the bathroom for an hour on Thursday. And I could just watch this little boy's spirit being drained out of him. One day he was at the kitchen table. One of the rules in that house was you had to finish all your food, didn't matter. And he was literally gagging on cold, soggy, re-microwaved fish sticks. And his little body— he's probably 6 years old, Rebecca— and his little body slumped over, his head is hung down. And I'll never forget this as long as I live. I walked up behind him and I just got one of those, like, you know, those, like, voices of God or downloads or higher self or future self, whatever we want to call it. And the memo I got was, when I become a parent— makes me cry, actually— when I become a parent, I'm going to do whatever it takes to do it well. I love kids. I've always loved them. And so to be out in the world and see that children, you know, parents are doing their best. We all have our stuff. We all have our moments. But what I see is a lot of unhealed adults trying to do the work of raising adults. And so when I had my own kids, I came up against that too, right? Like, I was the lunatic mother of the two toddlers, just like everyone else. And I thought, this is crazy. I have a degree in psychology. I have a specialty in family systems. I'm a certified life coach. If I am struggling like this to not, you know, whack my kids or want to— I never whacked them. I know.

I know.

I wanted to.

No. So here we are.

The Jai Institute for Parenting has now trained over 2,000 parenting coaches in our Peaceful Methodology since 2011. It's kind of mind-blowing, actually.

It's mind-blowing. And I love what you're doing, and I totally relate to your statement because I tell people that it doesn't matter all the classes, degrees, whatever. Like, walking the walk is so different than talking the talk, right?

1000%. And we can talk about why that is. I think people tend to think, oh, I'm not good enough, I'm a bad parent. No, you're a human being with a brain. That is wired to act in a certain way. And building new neural pathways can't happen because we want to change our behavior or read books about it. Really good.

That's so true. And I love the term peaceful parenting. I wish I had learned that term 17 years ago when I had my son. And it's like where I am today versus where I had him is totally different. And I didn't even—

right?

I didn't even know the term peaceful parenting. So can we talk about that? What does that look like?

Yeah, I, I love to talk about it because I think there are so many misconceptions and misunderstandings, which is now leading— you know, there's been so many articles. There's a new book out this week or last week called Bad Therapy, kind of saying like we're overcoddling kids, that their emotions are, are too important. And I, I have to say, I kind of agree. And I think it's because of this fundamental misunderstanding of what peaceful parenting is and is not. So peaceful parenting is still parenting. We still have limits. We set boundaries. We have rules. We try to, to do that from a peaceful place as the adult. So our children are not going to be peaceful all the time. We are not going to be peaceful all the time, but we have the tools to create repair, we gain comfort with our own anger and gain comfort that our children are going to be angry with us. And I think this is where people struggle because they think, oh, if I set a limit and then my child is angry about it, then I'm not doing peaceful parenting right. No, they get to be angry and the anger is beautiful because that's actually the very effective replacement for timeouts, screaming, yelling, threatening, right? Like, it's okay. We're gonna have feelings in a peaceful parenting relationship, but we're not going to resort to tactics or manipulative strategies that harm the trust and the long-term relationship between parents and children. Okay, off my soapbox.

No, I love your soapbox. I'm soaking it all in. So what you're saying is it's It's okay for our kids to get angry at us. I mean, I always feel like I'm— I know this sounds silly, like what we have learned about parenting, but I always feel like I'm doing a good job when they're mad at me. I've tried, right? I've tried to reframe that for people. So the goal of peaceful parenting is how we're acting.

Correct.

Yes. Yes.

The G.I., our methodology— methodology, speak Kiva. Our methodology at G.I. is 100% parent-centric. So we have zero education on behavior modification or how you can get your kids to behave. Our thesis, proven time and time again, is that when adults mature, when we become more emotionally intelligent, when we can stay regulated even when everything around us is in chaos, we are creating the best conditions to do the most important thing that parents do, which is to teach our children what to do versus punishing them for what they did wrong.

So good. And a lot of us have past trauma, as you've discussed, and issues within ourselves that we haven't dealt with. So to the parents listening who feel unhealed, like, what advice do you have for them?

Yeah, I would say number one, there is— I mean, I'll talk as a mom right now. There are no other people on the planet more worthy of us doing the very hard work of healing and leaving our past in the past and deciding how we want to show up than our own children. I think that parenting is one of the best doorways to personal growth and transformation because it's hard and it hurts and we fail and we have to get up and try again. But these are our kids. And the thing I would say is that we all have these moments of clarity where we can see that the way that we were treated when we were children is impacting our parenting. But that insight lies behind defense mechanisms. It lies in blind spots. It lies in reactive conditioned patterns of behavior. And so those moments of insight are beautiful. And we have two choices in that moment. We can acknowledge and be vulnerable and humble and say, wow, okay, I've got some work to do here. Or that will get right back into its hidey hole And we will say, my child made me do that. If they hadn't acted that way, I wouldn't have reacted.

I've said that. Me too.

Listen, everything I say here is like one of my jokes. I'm in my 50s, so everyone may not remember this ad, but there was this ad when I was a kid. It was the Hair Club for Men. And he said, not only am I the president of the Hair Club for Men, I'm also a customer.

That's how I feel about Jai. Yes, totally. Well, and I want to speak to that more because you and I both know, I mean, I hear women beat themselves up every single day, including myself. You know, yesterday I have really proud moments where I'm like, okay, you handled that well. Like, do that again. Last night was not— I was toast. Poor coping skills out the window. I wasn't my best self. So, right, so we've all been there. So can we give mothers advice around beating themselves up, doing it wrong, and where to go from there?

Yeah, yeah. I mean, the thing is, um, the way that I see this is peaceful parenting is best done, executed— I don't know what's the word that I want— by actual human adults. And actual human adults develop a capacity and ability to make mistakes, to take responsibility for them, to clean up the mess, and to move on. I think about like the captain of a ship at sea, right? The captain of a ship at sea who makes a mistake cannot crumble, cannot berate and chest beat and crawl in bed for a week. And in our way, we're all the captains of the ship of our homes. And so this is resilience, this is grit, and it's also self-worth, knowing that you are lovable, deserving, and worthy, and you're going to make mistakes. And what I love about this from a kind of meta view is if we can live into this idea that we get to love ourselves and be lovable even when we mess up, even when we have our bad days, what are we showing our kids? We're demonstrating that they don't have to be perfect either, that they don't, that they don't need to like judge their self-worth on whether or not they got the A or made the team or forgot to take the trash out or whatever it is. And I think that will evolve humanity in a really extraordinary way.

I love that you're taking the pressure off of us. We do not need to be perfect. And I do remind myself of that because I fall into that trap of expecting way too much from myself. Yeah. Right?

Right. And then the other side of the coin that I just described is message to children, thou shall also be perfect.

Yep. Yep. Absolutely. And, and, and we have to remember that they're watching everything. They're watching me when I don't think they're watching me. Wow. Children—

one of the things I've said 1,297,000 times is children do what we do, not what we say.

Yes, that was perfect. 100%. So I am sure you have spoken to lots of parents, and I'm sure you've seen lots of challenges. I mean, what challenge are you seeing parents most bump up against? So many.

I mean, it's an interesting time to be parenting. You know, the pandemic and all of the fallout of our children really having lost a year of their lives continues to show itself in a myriad of ways. Children are anxious. Children are being diagnosed with ADHD and depression. More than ever before, suicidal ideation. You know, obviously, like, I love children and I want them to have the most glorious experience of childhood possible. But more important than anything, I want them to be safe. And so, you know, when we're talking about issues of safety with children, particularly as it pertains to self-harm, I am, you know, kind of like I say, like, I'm, I'm, I'm a warrior. Um, my fight may be peaceful, but I am warrioring for the needs of children. And I think what parents can recognize is that when we don't develop the ability to meet our children's emotional needs so that they feel seen and heard and understood and not told that they're overreacting and not told that they should just, you know, pick themselves up by the bootstraps and get on with it, and, you know, berated, berated, berated, they will reach for something else to make them feel better. That is also how human brains are wired. And so when I talk about maintaining trust as the primary goal between parents and children, that doesn't mean coddling, it doesn't mean being a pushover, it doesn't mean giving into their every whim. It means seeing them. And I say that because the stakes are so high, and I truly believe that it will save lives.

Wow. I mean, I can't even tell you, based on what my daughter told me yesterday, how you hit the nail on the head. I mean, I'm just blown away by you right now. I mean, that is just like the most perfect advice you could give all of us. So thank you. Oh my goodness, you're gonna make me cry over here. Oh my goodness. Let's talk about your kids. So let's talk about your own, your kids. So how have— what have you learned from your kids? And how have— I mean, so much. We've learned so much from our kids. But what have they taught you? And how have they changed the type of parent? Like, how do they inspire your parenting, I guess, is my question.

Good question. I mean, I started this business when they were like 3 and 4 years old. And we've been through a lot as a family. Um, a pretty brutal divorce. My best friend passed away from cancer.

Oh my gosh.

We've had a journey, my kids and I. And so I think, you know, for me, it kind of boils down to what I said before. Like, they have remained my North Star in trying to become a better and better human. I've made tremendous messes in my life, you know, pretty dramatic ones, financial messes and things. And I've just tried to be really honest with them through all that so that they did not take in the message that they were the problem. Right. Like, I think one of the places parents have an opportunity for growth is to, to be more honest with our children. They are actually quite wise. And they can actually handle a lot more than we give them credit for. And when we try to protect them from the truth or don't open up to them in a vulnerable way, one of two things will happen. When they're young, they will decide it's about them. Um, a child cannot create a narrative where their parent is not the hero because that's who they rely on for safety. And so if you're going through financial stress, if you're going through a divorce and you don't explicitly say, I'm having a hard time because this is going on, their immediate assumption will be, I'm not good enough, I need to be right. Like, how many of us are people pleasers because our parents didn't do that for us? And then as they get older, what will happen is they know, and they will say, my mom does not trust me. And so therefore I will not trust my mom. And so I think that my kids have shown me that it's okay to tell the truth, which was something that I really struggled with as a teenager and even really into my 20s and early 30s, uh, because I was a latchkey kid. I, I learned to kind of lie to get my needs met, and they've taught me to be honest. Um, they're 17 and 19 now. Wow, wow.

17 is— I mean, like, 17 was hard for me. I'm like, how is he 17? How did this happen?

I know my youngest is going to college in the fall. I'm like, what the heck? Oh my gosh, people, I want a do-over.

I, I want you to know I walked out of the grocery store the other day and a baby was walking in with with her mother, and I started crying.

Oh, my kids are like, Mom, stop oogling the babies. Like, literally, we'll walk into the apartment like, hi, hello, hello. My, my beloved is like, oh my God, Kiva, they're gonna call the police.

It's like, I want a label on me that just says safe mom so that I can walk around talking to all the babies.

100%. I know.

Oh my God, I totally got distracted by babies. What, what was my question? Oh, divorce. I want to talk about divorce because that's a huge topic that you have lived through in multiple different ways. So as child— I mean, like, if you can go back to your childhood.

Yeah.

I mean, like, what do you feel like your parents did right with handling the divorce and you going from house to house? And what do you feel like you could have needed that you didn't get?

Yeah, I mean, it was such a different time.

Yeah.

And I really want to answer this question with the lens of my parents were doing the best with what they knew.

100%.

And the support systems that were available. I mean, nobody told me that my dad was leaving. I literally woke up. I think I went to my grandmother's house, came home, my stuff was just gone. I think I was maybe 4 or 5, but that was—

I mean, that's traumatizing.

Yeah, it was traumatic. We moved across the— I lived in Tucson, Arizona. My mom got a job at the New York Times or something on the night. I know my mom's like epic, but she flew us across the country. We moved into this like screaming apartment in Queens, New York. It was a lot. So was there a lot that it could have gone better? Sure. And what I know is that my tenacity, my resilience, my fire, like I wouldn't change any of it. Um, I had a wonderful stepfather. My ma— he passed away recently, but he, um, he, he was the only adult in my life who invested in me. He would do crossword puzzles with me. We would play games, we would play cards. He got me, um, what was that magazine back then? Uh, Games magazine, where it was like all brain puzzles, and we would sit and do Games magazine together. He drove me to my dance class. So I think my message from that is one committed adult, the kids are going to be fine. Because when you go through a divorce, what I had to realize, like, I was a hypervigilant parent because of my everything I just explained. And I control— I will call myself a control enthusiast. A control enthusiast about my children.

Never heard it described that way.

When they went to bed, how they were spoken to. I mean, I was like Mama Bear, too much, too far. And when I got divorced, I had to finally, after being a banshee for a good year screaming my head off, had to realize I gave up the right to control what happened in that house. And I could not agree. I could vehemently disagree. But unless my children's safety was a concern, I had to zip it. And I had to start to empower my children to advocate for themselves in those four walls because I'm not with this person anymore. And I was honestly— was making it worse for my kids. The more that I tried to control him, the worse I, I was messing it up for them.

That makes so much sense. And I think that that's going to help a lot of people who are dealing with this right now. It is so hard. You know, I see this with friends. I mean, it's so hard to have your kids every day and then go from, you know, essentially sharing half the time and not having control over half the time. I mean, that's really hard.

Yeah. I mean, I was— I'll say this, it's going to come out wrong. And I don't mean this to— and I really have a lot of good feelings about my ex-husband. I'm so grateful for our beautiful children. I was kind of lucky he didn't want them that much. Now, that is not good for them, right? That's why I feel a little guilty saying that, because that has caused a ripple effect of impact on their relationship. But what was true for me is I was like, it was me and my kids in our little nest bubble. He traveled a lot for work. He wasn't really that interested when he was there. And so then when I removed us from that situation and we had our— I literally call our house the nest. It is our nest. And I've been in a relationship now for 8 years. And I think because of all this, I was like, this is still our nest and you can have your own home.

And I don't know, that's kind of worked out really well.

I'm not mad about it. Although I'm excited we get to move in next year. So finally.

That's wonderful. I love hearing happy— I love hearing the happiness after, you know, divorce can be messy and hard. So I love hearing the happy stories that come out of it.

Oh, Rebecca, I mean, what I'll say to people is I have not spoken— listen, like, you, you do everything you can. Of course there are children involved, um, but you get one life, and I have yet to meet a person you know, 1, 2 years out of divorce that regrets it. And that's not— I'm not promoting it. I'm just saying that all of us are worthy of living a life with as much joy and pleasure and fulfillment and peace as possible. And so sometimes you have to do hard things to get to a different place. But my life, um, is a— is a— the life I had before is a ghost of what I experience now. I'm grateful for the journey.

That's awesome. I, I hope that people can work on their marriages and make it better, but it's not always the case.

Sometimes you can't, you know, like you, you, you do what you can, you try, and sometimes you can't, and it's okay.

Yeah. Yeah. So people have pasts, parents have pasts that they, you know, haven't come to terms with or healed from, as we mentioned. Um, how can, how can we help them learn to make peace with that past and move forward?

Yeah, so I'll say a few things. You know, obviously traditional therapy is really effective, right? Cognitive behavioral therapy, Gestalt, all of these ways where we can actually just release what has happened to us by having an observer. So in Jungian psychology, he says an epiphany requires a mirror. What that means is we can't do this work in ourselves. We need a therapist, we need a coach, somebody who can help hold us through that. It's really a purging, right? But there comes a place where this can become ineffective, because the more that we tell the story and the more that we kind of sit in what happened to us, we are constantly re— enforcing to our brain the reality of that circumstance. Now, you know, we've all had our stuff as children, some highly traumatic. And so if you have not done that work, go. But what I say, at some point we get to put the bag of rocks down, right? Like we've been carrying this like bag of generational rocks and wounding and trauma, and we have to put that down and say, okay, who do I want to be? Now? And what do I need to learn to be that person? And that's where I think coaching becomes powerful, because coaches are not here to tell— as parent coaches, we are not here to tell anybody how to raise their kids. What we do is we teach skills and provide accountability and allow parents to create their intentions for their parenting and provide a judgment-free, empathy-fueled relationship for new skills to be developed over time.

I love that. And it's interesting that we can't see things that we need help with other people to help us see. And I don't think everybody realizes that, but we cannot see the tip of—

I mean, I'm looking at myself right now.

I can.

You cannot see the tip of your knows. You cannot— if you were looking outside of a building, you can't see the outside of the building from inside of it. And all of us are seeing the world from our inner worldview. Our perceptions, our limiting beliefs, our assumptions, our fears don't let us see clearly.

So true. And I know there's a lot of parents listening right now who are probably thinking, I'm really struggling with my kid. I mean, I could list so many issues to you of what I'm hearing from parents, you know. Um, the list is endless. So to the parent who is really struggling today, yeah, can we give them some words of advice?

Yeah, so the game of changing children's behavior is kind of an unwinnable game if we're— if If we're not going to use fear, pain, force, or, you know, manipulation, I mean, then we can talk about kind of why not to do that if you want. But let's just imagine for a moment, like, we're going to embrace this idea of peaceful parenting. Okay, so children, children, children's behavior is a reflection of a need and whether that need has been met or unmet. In other words, children are using their behavior because they don't have fully developed brains They don't have— I mean, listen, adults can't ask for what they want effectively. So children use behavior to communicate that they have a problem.

Yes.

That they either don't— that they want to feel less pain or have more joy, essentially. Right. So the behavior is communication. So if we're just trying to change the behavior, We're missing this, like, the reservoir underneath the hard soil. I don't know. That's a terrible analogy. Yeah. Okay. So knowing that their behavior is an attempt, a misguided one perhaps, to solve a problem, and we get triggered, we, like, the behavior is annoying. It's irritating. Our nervous system is starting to go through the roof. Maybe they're acting in a way that we got in a lot of trouble for as a child. Maybe they're acting in a way like, I have ADHD, so loud noises really ramp up my nervous system very quickly. Right? So we may have our own nervous system patterns that that child is not intending to trigger, but they are. And so the first thing to do is to really, as much as we can, practice nervous system regulation for ourselves. And the best analogy that I— or the best vision, what's that called, visualization that I have for this is to practice being an oak tree in a hurricane. Oh, and so if you can imagine yourself as a giant oak tree, a 100-year oak tree, and your roots are all the way down in the earth, they're, they're like rooted to the earth. But then you've got all these limbs and leaves and boughs, and there's a hurricane, so they're going to blow, but you're still grounded and rooted. That's what nervous system regulation feels like. It's not like we're stone, right? Like we're just like, I'm not going to listen. I'm not— that will not do it. You're going to hit through the red zone. But if you can just stay kind of— you can even move like this. I do. And breathe. And I like to give myself a little chest tap, and sometimes I'll put my hands on my face, especially if they're cool. That feels really good. If you can stay there and then remember your child's trying to solve a problem, what's the problem they're trying to solve? And get curious. What's going on environmentally? What's going on with their friends? What's— have their needs been met? Are they tired? Are they hungry? Uh, are they frustrated because they can't get something done? And once we can calm ourselves, we can calm our child. Hey buddy, I see you're pretty frustrated. Want to take a breath with me? What's going on? I noticed you getting so angry at your blocks. Because it's not about the block throwing, right?

No, no. I'm going to take you with me. Will you just come talk to me all day?

Yes.

We have a tool.

We have a tool. It's one of my favorites. I just did it because I do it really, like, unconsciously now, but it's called low and slow. So when we get low and slow, we're actually not doing that for our child. We're doing it for ourselves. Because what happens when you're getting into a fight, flight, or freeze response is your body literally thinks there's a tiger in the room with you. And so when there's a tiger in the room with you, we start breathing faster and we start talking faster and we get louder because we're like, oh my gosh, the tiger needs to go away. Okay, so when I talk like this, I am telling my nervous system I'm safe. Because if there was a tiger in the room, I would not be talking like this.

No, you would not. No, the tiger is not your child.

But we, our nervous system thinks it is.

Yeah. Oh, 100%. Yes. Yes. I could go back to last night in 2 seconds. So, so you brought up discipline and I really wanna touch on that because I wanna know how, what you think about discipline and effective discipline. Yeah.

I mean, I think discipline as a— what is that, a noun? Having discipline is a very important human quality. Being a disciplined person, following through on your commitments, doing what you say you're going to do to yourself and others. Um, the root of the word discipline is disciple, which is student. And so as a disciplinarian, we are teachers. Wow. So in that definition, I am very pro-discipline.

Got it. That makes so much sense if we think about it that way. Yeah. You know, um, someone said to me the other day, you know, that it drives them nuts when parents take something away that has nothing to do with what the child was just doing. Correct. I thought that was really good. Yeah. Really true.

So, so, so there's 3 kinds of consequences. Natural consequences, logical consequences, and arbitrary consequences. So traditional parenting really relies on arbitrary consequences. You do something wrong, you go to the time-out step. Time-out step. You do something wrong, you don't get to use— you don't get to play your video games tonight. They have nothing to do with what that child needs to learn. They are punishing. They are punitive. They are telling the child You are not worthy of love, attention, and affection when you misbehave, which sets us up for losing trust, children lying to us, children not trusting us and not coming to us when things go wrong, which they will. Okay, so let's talk about the first two, which are my favorites and very effective—natural and logical consequences. Now, natural consequences. Your child forgets to bring their ice skates to practice. They do not get to practice and maybe can't play in the game on Thursday. Now, here's where it gets hard for really loving parents who want their children to be able to do all the things, and we want to be the best support system. We cannot save them from the natural consequences of their actions. Because then we are missing— they are missing out on the lesson. Now, we want to do this in age-appropriate ways, which is why having a good understanding of normal childhood development and what development looks like for your child if they're neurodiverse or have some kind of diagnosis, right? We need to parent the child we have. So we're not going to punish a 2-year-old for forgetting their ice. It's not punish. We're not going to have them sit in the consequences Right. When they're 2, but when they're 9, my favorite word in all of parenting. Mm. Yeah, that's hard. But we can't save them from the natural consequences because this is the natural learning mechanism that they have. Right. I see parents all the time really stressing and fretting about the dynamics between children and their peers. And I get it. But the best thing, 99%, unless there's like bullying happening, the best thing that you can do is go, mm, that's hard. And maybe share some stories of your childhood, but don't go calling the other mothers.

Well, sorry, I shouldn't make fun. Okay, no, I, I love this and I want you to tell us this because You know, I think a lot of us, our natural inclination is to save, fix, save, problem solve. And that's not really teaching.

You know how children learn to fix, save, and problem solve?

Yes.

They have to be given the opportunity to do it. I mean, you know, I tell stories about this with my own kids right now. My son got in his first fender bender a couple of years ago, and I was like, well, I mean, it was fine. He wasn't even in the car. Somebody backed into his car while he was parked. So it was no big thing. Okay, what do you do? Well, I think there's an insurance card. Mm-hmm. There's a number here to call. Mm-hmm. And he did it messily. He missed the appointment for the car getting fixed. So many things went wrong. But now he knows what to do when he gets in a car accident. And had I done that all for— I mean, they're, they're grown children. 30-year-old children that are still calling their mom and dad when they have a fender bender. You know, have your kids as they get older make their own doctor's appointments. Have them start to take more responsibility before they're 18. Right? Like my— and again, like my kid's not special. He was just parented a little differently. Like he just negotiated his whole own lease. I literally had nothing to do with it. Wow. But he's had practice.

That's awesome. Yeah, that's a good— that's a good mom over there. Yeah.

And it, like, did I want to say— do I want to, like, be like, oh my gosh, you know, get— let me get in the car, let me come do it for you? Of course I have to, like, sit on my hands. I love mothering. I will mother the whole world given the opportunity. But part of being a mother is learning to let go.

Yeah, it's the hardest part. I think it's so— I think it's hard. I think it's hard. I know it's necessary, but I think it's hard. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh my goodness. So they got it.

They got to sit in their consequences. Logical consequences are things that are directly correlated to teaching them what needs to be learned, right? So we have a child, for example, who won't wear her helmet when she goes out and rides a bike, well, she's gonna lose access to the bike until she can demonstrate safety. We have teens that are, you know, really showing high-risk behavior on social media. The phone is not in the room. You know, like, this is what I mean. We can be peaceful and use natural and logical consequences. So for the lovey-dovey among us, the logical consequences are hard because we don't want our child to be angry at us. And part of this becoming a human adult thing that I'm a big fan of is learning to be okay when people are angry and knowing, like, that's safe. Right? Like even, you know, someone who's like yelling, it's not fun, it's not pleasant, but we're actually safe. And of course, that's not saying to stay in any situation that is not actually safe.

Exactly. That's a really good explanation for everybody because I think sometimes people wonder how to discipline. So I think that's going to be super helpful. And you know that you and I could talk about this all day. I mean, I could just pick her brain all day, but, you know, I've asked you a ton of questions. Is there anything that you think I missed that you want to share?

I think it was a pretty amazing conversation, Rebecca. Thank you. I mean, I would just— I just want to say to parents that it is hard, and that because it's hard doesn't mean that you're doing anything wrong. It's the most important job that we have. We're literally— we have this lump of clay, right? Like, babies are born into the world, and if we told them for the first 5 years that a pen was a cup, they would believe us. Yeah. And, and that's how the whole 18 years are. And so I guess I just have an invitation to gently invite people to do the work of working on their communication, of working on their emotional regulation, of thinking about the values that matter as a parent that you want your child to carry forward into their lives and focus on those. And often the little annoying stuff, it just, it gets better, it goes away, it ebbs and flows. And so save your parenting moments, like the more assertive parenting moments, for when they really matter and have as much fun in the rest of the time as possible. It does go fast.

Oh my gosh, I was going to say, and then you blink and they're 17 and 19, right? Totally. Oh my gosh. Well, will you tell everybody where to find you?

We are online at JAI, which is J-A-I, jaiinstituteforparenting.com. There are tons of free resources on our website, how to stop yelling, a peaceful ultimate guide to peaceful parenting. So whether or not you are considering becoming a parenting coach, there's amazing information for you there. And if parent coaching sparks some curiosity, we'd love to have you check out our program.

It is transformational. Well, and if they want to be coached by one of your parenting coaches, is that on there too?

There is a whole coaches directory in the upper right-hand corner. We have coaches all over the world with specialties and neurodiversity and co-parenting and LGBTQ+ and so you can really— BIPOC— so you can really find coaches that will feel comfortable for you.

Wonderful. Well, I mean, I can't thank you enough. I absolutely loved talking to you today. I love talking to you, Rebecca.

Thank you for having me.

This is Rebecca Green, and I want to remind everybody to spend every day laughing, learning, and loving. Thank you for tuning in to the Winey Palooza podcast.

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