Episode 338: Navigating Through Grief's Journey

Hello everyone. This is Rebecca Green for the Winey Palooza podcast, and I am very excited today because I get to speak with Nina Gallotto. Nina, thank you so much for doing this with me today.

Oh, you're welcome. I'm happy to be here.

And I told Nina before we started, I'm sure she will mention her amazing credentials. She has like a huge list, but I'm going to tell you a little bit about her to introduce her. Nina has been working in the death industry since 2017, helping families make their final arrangements before the time of need. Nina is known for her powerful networking abilities, which help connect local businesses and several nonprofit groups alike. Nina helps with local grief support groups and often hosts a painting event called Coping with Colors that I can't wait to learn about. How cool is that? I have to start with, I have to ask you, what inspired you to get into the death industry? How the heck did that happen?

Actually, I fell upon it. I didn't seek to get into that industry at all. When we moved to Florida from New York, I really just posted my resume and said, let's just see where it takes us. And I was contacted by a local funeral home. And they asked me to come in for an interview, and I initially thought it was a scam. I thought, this isn't a job or whatever that you get. So I was so curious. I went to the funeral home. I went on the interview, and they described the importance of the role that they were hiring people for, and that they are looking for someone who would be interested in helping families protect their loved ones by making arrangements in advance. And I just fell in love with the concept, to be honest, because I remember when my father died when I was 19 years old, my mother, it was out of the blue really where they weren't prepared. She wasn't prepared. He was only 47 years old. And I remember going with her to the funeral home and it was such a huge impact on me for so many years. So when they were describing how having this done in advance can really save people, people from a lot of those additional emotions they don't need to carry at that time. I just thought, this is meant for me. Sign me up. And I fell in love immediately, signed up, and I started working there 2 weeks later and just loved it, every minute of it. Wow.

I have so many questions about all of that. I did, I did tell Nina that the reason why we brought Nina on, my fabulous producer found her. And I really see people struggling around me with their grief. And I want to talk about the pre-planning, but I want to start with, you started grief support groups. Mm-hmm. And I want to ask you what kind of led to that piece of it. How did you start doing that?

Okay. Yes, sure. So working in that industry, my role was mostly with the pre-planning part of it. However, because we were also affiliated with a cemetery. I often dealt with families at the time of someone passing and the amount of grief that you see and you experience, you just want to help them. You just want to save them and try to make them feel some sort of light or hope or something. And you see so many people that come in that are just so depressed that they can't even complete tasks or they're just, that's it. The grief has just taken over. And it brought me back to a time that I had attended a painting class when I was in New York. And I remember during the time that I had that class, my life was up in different things. And, but during the painting event, it was a 2-hour step-by-step instructional class. All I could think about was the painting. And so I remembered that feeling. So at the funeral home, I said, Why don't I host a painting event here? Because no matter what you're going through, no matter the stress, the grief, whatever it is, when you're doing something like that and you want to make it look beautiful and you want to do it right, your mind only is focused on that. And I was trying to think of a way to just give people even 2 hours of a relief. And so I had asked the management, I said, I want to host these painting events here. I teamed up with a local painter to ask them to bring all the supplies and do everything inside the funeral home, believe it or not. And the managers were, what? I said, listen, there's a lot of grief support groups. I assisted in others. I said, but they need an outlet. They need something in addition to just talking about their grief. And this group of people that, yes, they may have lost someone, but they're surrounded by others that are also in that same emotional state and they can have a nice safe environment to come paint, cry, laugh, whatever it is. And they allowed me to do it and it was such a huge success. Like the first one I had just not enough chairs practically for people to come in and the reception after, people were just so grateful and thankful. And I remember one of the first classes, someone said to me, called me a week or so later and she said, I hung up my picture. By my front door because since my mother passed a year ago, I have been unable to complete tasks. And that was the first task I started and finished. And that just melted my heart, solidified my whole reason of why I'm here and doing this. And I continued it on and I just, I added different things. I had businesses donate gifts and props and things to give them prizes that they just, really loved it. And while we were there, oftentimes some kind of interaction would happen about a mom or a child or someone's loss, and the others would, hey, I tried this, or I do this or that. And it just turned into just, it was really is a support group, but you're also doing something together that's fun and you have as a memory later.

That's amazing. So I was separating it. I wasn't putting it together. So the grief support groups are the Coping with Colors events.

So yes and no. That is one aspect, but I also run an individual grief support group that is not involving that activity. And sometimes we incorporate activities. So I do both. But so that's how I started and how many people know me in this area by the, I'm the Coping with Colors girl. So they know me by that title. Okay.

So the groups, so the painting was helping them, and then you also had this other group of the talking that was helping them. So tell us about the support group with the talking and how you saw that helping people.

And anytime, of course, when there is a loss, being surrounded by others, that is very important. Being surrounded by others that actually have gone through similar situations, because many times when people lose someone, people that have not lost someone have very wrong information to say or wrong words to say to people. And aren't you over this yet? Or what's wrong with you? And they have so many of those things happen to them that they need other people to sit with and talk to and hear how they deal with it or hear from someone to say, okay, I know you're going through this, but maybe try this or try that because Just like in anything, when we're giving advice to someone, we could tell them all the right things to do, but when it's— we're going through it, we have no idea what to do. It can be the same exact scenario. And that's what happens with grief is that they're going through it. And in the past, they may have had great advice for others on how to cope or how to complete tasks and how to handle the holidays, all of those things. What do you do in the store when they're saying Merry Christmas and you just want to strangle them? Like, how dare you tell me to be happy today? My mother died on Christmas. There's so many of those things that they go through because it's an inside sadness. It's nothing that's advertised and they're walking through stores unhappy and they're, they're functioning, but going through this. So they need to talk. They need an outlet. I recommend everyone attend a grief support group, no matter the age, children, adults. So it doesn't matter who they've lost because it just really helps them with understanding that it's okay. To feel the way they feel. And that's one of the things that many of them feel ashamed to still feel sadness. But to be in a group, in a room of others that are still crying a year later or 2 years or 10 years, it's okay because it's your sadness, it's your emotion, it's your grief. You own it. And being together, we can share together with those emotions and work through it and have some suggestions. Nothing to get over. You're not going to get over grief, right? So it's to work through it together, really. So I recommend that, but then there's people that don't want to talk and that painting event helps them with that and sometimes leads them to also attend a talking type of support group. Amazing. Amazing.

I love what you're doing and I often don't know what to say. I'm listening to you and I'm learning a lot as you're talking. And I actually just asked my friend, she said it had been a year and I said, is it Is it easier, harder, or the same a year later? And she said it was harder. And I, I had no idea. I did not expect that answer. We just, we don't always know what to say. And if you have any words of wisdom for all of us, how to support our friends and family going through things, I would love some advice.

Oh, sure. No, absolutely. And I even tell the people in the grief group, groups to educate their family instead of getting upset when they ask them something that is so upsetting to them. Yeah, turn it around and say it and say, listen, I appreciate you asking me this question. However, that is upsetting me right now, and I'd rather just hear about your life. So my most, my main suggestion for everyone is to really not ask them questions. Because asking a question is usually going to lead you down the wrong path when someone is grieving. Like you said, you didn't expect her to say harder, right? You would think, oh, the time is going by, it's easier. But you have to imagine she's gone through one year of the firsts. The first time they weren't there for every holiday, the first time they weren't there for whatever happened to them that year. So it is sometimes harder, especially after the first year because they've missed it all. And then there's the first year anniversary that's very hard for many people to work through with those emotions. So I say questions. I think people really should— we should have a grief support group for people not grieving on how to treat people that are grieving because so many people and people that I know and respect say the most uncomfortable things to people. And I'm mortified because they work in many of the senior industries and they don't know how to people with a loss. And no, it's so sad too, because they, their words make someone think they should be feeling a certain way. And it's not your right to tell them how they should be feeling. And so I say limit the questions. And it is one thing to say, yes, is it better, harder, worse? That's okay to ask. But then what are you going to say in return? So when you're asking a question, you need to know and be prepared with what you're going to say next, because your answer is probably not going to be what you expect. So if you don't have that lined up, your best advice and best words to say to a friend or a relative is to tell them about you. Really, don't ask them questions. Give them the latest of what's happening or whatnot. Invite them somewhere. Do things like that. Because although we're curious to know how they're feeling and what they're going through, until they're ready to talk about it, they most likely won't. And they will bring it up organically most of the time. Oh, last week was this and it was really hard for me to deal with. And when they do bring things up, listen, because really that's all they want is someone to listen because they miss the person that passed. That's who used to listen to them. So they are usually missing that connection and it's very difficult. And when there's holidays and things like that, like I'd be bit stopped just wishing everybody whatever around because you just don't know what they're going through. And I recommend them to limit their shopping around certain holidays, knowing those might be trigger times, limit their social media surfing, because when you see all these happy families, but you may have lost your parents or your children, you're angry. And it's a sensitive subject, but there's their suffering in silence. Yeah.

Mother's Day and Father's Day. I've seen my mother struggle with it 20 years later. It doesn't go, it doesn't go away. Exactly.

It doesn't go away and they never get over it. Those are the two most important things to understand. They learn how to function, but they're never over it because no matter what, no matter if the year has gone by, now 5 years later, someone's getting married, they're still not there. Something else happens, they're still not there. So those, it triggers along the way over the years and it's just their ability to how to function and move forward, but they're not over it. They're not sitting home crying every day, maybe, but that sadness is still inside them. That hole is there. It's a hole that can't be filled.

And there's definitely, as you said, people still at home crying every day, understandably. Absolutely. I'm not— there's no judgment. That's totally expected.

None.

Just— So, so any advice to the people who are struggling to function right now because of their grief?

Absolutely. And I think that their number one message that they need to know is that it is okay to still be struggling no matter how long it's it's been, because no matter if it's a spouse, a child, many people often say, oh, it's worse to lose a child. If you're asking someone who just lost their mother, they think it's worse. There's no worse or better or best. It's very sad. And if they're unable to function, they should reach out to, to get some help. And I know here we have a lot of local hospice locations and things that will offer free groups. Many people, they don't want to pay. For certain things, and that's understandable. They shouldn't have to. There should be free grief support groups in, on, especially around them or online. There's virtual if someone's even unable to go out of their home, but they're so sad and there's options online. They can do virtual support and also to try to be around people. Isolation is the worst thing to do, and we know it's the hardest thing to get through when you're grieving, but you should not be alone. Now, of course, you can't be with someone 24/7. If they've been married 40 years and a spouse passes and the children are out of the area, they are alone and they're going to be alone at times. And when they're alone, it's okay to cry. It's okay even to cry around others, but they should try to get out, whether it's volunteer someplace, Volunteering helps a lot of people that are grieving because they're able to feel needed again. And that's what they miss because most of the people that are suffering them so much, they were caring for that loved one for a long time too. So even while they were alive, they were almost not there. So now they need something to do to fill that, that need to be needed. And volunteering is very helpful. Many of the local hospitals or animal locations or schools, a lot of these places they can get involved with. Now it's not easy. It is very difficult to just get yourself up and out the door, but also starting with some small wins per day. Someone's really that upset and grieving where they're not getting dressed, they're not doing anything. They need to start small. Make the bed every day. Win that, right? Then do that for a few days and then maybe get dressed after that for a few days, but don't forget the bed too. So add, add one more thing every day until they are actually able to do things and function again the way they used to. And it's okay if it takes them a while, unless they have to go to work or something like that. If they're able to still be home and walk through those stages, walk through them. There is no rush. There's also lots of books and suggestions and things on what to do when you've lost someone and read it. A lot of people think it's weak if they read it or if they attend a group. It's not weak at all. When people have a sickness, they have to take medication. That doesn't make them weak, right? The medication makes them stronger. Right, right. Same thing when you're going through something like that. Do use what's around and available, and that will make them stronger as well. And then they'll start to want to do more.

Such good advice. That is such good advice. I love all of that. You can tell That you know what you're doing.

I love it. Yes, I do. And I enjoy it. I love it. I love helping the people and just some of my, sometimes a few words, the amount of thank yous that I get, it just makes my day. I love it because I know I've helped and even got a thank you from a woman who had lost her husband and she had attended one of my painting events with her children. She is actually She loved the painting so much. She wrote a book. I know in this book labeled, she labeled the coping with colors that it helped her start her on this journey of painting. She even sold a couple of paintings and it helped her get to the next stage in her, her life. So I love those stories and anyone that's helping people with grief are, they're usually the same. They're just like me. They want to help. So if someone attends a grief support group and maybe they don't like being in that crowd, if they reach out to individual running that group and they say, I need help, but I'm struggling. I can't be around people. They're going to come up with a solution for that person. It's just like I do for others that have come up to me. You just have to make sure you find the right connection with someone and they can really help them along the way.

Oh, it's so beautiful. I can tell how much you love what you do. And we could talk about grief support groups for hours, but I also want to talk about the fee planning that you do. And when I was reading about it, I was like, she does what?

I know. And it's hard. It's hard to walk into conversation. It's, you're looped in with IRS and all this. You're like, the nos, like they don't want to hear that in a conversation. They hear funeral, IRS, lawyer. They're like, I'm one of those people.

So, so let's talk about pre-planning.

Okay.

Tell everybody exactly what that is. And why you think that this is so important that we do this.

Oh, absolutely. And as I mentioned, until I went on that interview, I didn't even know this was available. But once I discovered that this is an available option for people, it's like my mission now to make sure the world knows about the importance, because part of the grief and the sadness is the funeral and having to go to that funeral home after that loss and having to pick out caskets and options and pick out a a space if they're going to go to a cemetery or deciding whether someone wants to be cremated or not. So I've seen that side as well and what people go through and how they suffer. And it is so important for them to realize that this is something we are all going to need one day, no matter how old you are, how young, how healthy, it doesn't matter. One day we will all die. And it's just, it's the D word. No one wants to hear that, right? But it is true. Right? No matter how old they're going to be. And to alleviate some of that emotional torture that people go through when they lose a loved one, planning your own funeral or cremation or burial spot is the best gift you can give your loved one. It really is, because you need to put yourself in their shoes. And I say this to people when I give seminars: if you were able, after you pass, to float around in the room where your loved ones are planning your funeral and answering the 100+ questions that funeral director is answering, asking them the questions. You would love to just swoop down and do it all for them. So right now, while you're alive, you have that ability to swoop down and do that for them. You can prepare everything and answer all those questions. They have to go through a list of questions. When you lose someone, you go into that funeral home, and I tell people, if you've never been in a funeral home, imagine it. Imagine now you've just lost your parents together in an accident. You walk into a funeral home, you don't know what to expect. They walk you down a hallway that's probably not long, but it feels like a tunnel. You go into a room that's closed, it feels like it's closing in on you. And they start in a way that's, it's not very soothing. They start with questions for the death certificate. And you're just like, what? Now you have to answer, what is their mother's maiden name, their father's place of birth, and all these questions that you might know the answers to, but emotionally you're freaking out inside. So planning in advance, they are able to complete all of those answers. That's the first thing and very important. And now when it's time to say, did your mom and dad want to be cremated or not? The answer, if you don't know the answer to that as that child, if you don't have the money to give them a full-size traditional funeral and cremation is all you can afford, what kind of mental sadness are you going through? Because now you don't know if you're making the right decisions or wrong decisions. but if you have no choice financially, that's all you can do. And cremation is something that you need to know if that person is okay doing or not, because if the child picks that, they now live with that for the rest of their lives that they may have made the wrong decision for their parents. So I always tell people that is something that needs to be, that information needs to be given to your children or your loved ones or your best friend, whoever it is that is going to be the one in that funeral home at the time of death to plan for you, because if they don't know, it will make them very sad. And you're not here to go through that sadness anymore. You passed. They live with that now for the rest of their lives so they can plan everything. And even if it is, they just want to be cremated. They don't want service. They don't want a viewing. They don't want to be buried. That's okay to plan the cremation only. Answer all of those questions needed for the death certificate. It, have it in a file, put it all together, tell your loved ones it's done, and they will be upset at first when they hear it. No one wants to talk about that. Or when mom and dad says, hey, should I do this? Most of the children are going to say, no, mom, don't even talk about it. I'll do it later. They don't want to hear it. So that's my number one advice is do not ask your children if you should plan your own funeral because they're 9 times out of 10 going to say no. Once it's planned, 9 times out of 10 at that funeral home, they're going to say, boy, mom and dad really did love us this much. They not only came into the funeral home, they answered all these questions. They picked what they wanted and it's paid in full. Thank you, mom and dad. Because a lot of children, grown children, are not financially prepared to spend $20,000 or $30,000 on funerals or whatever. It's expensive. Now, the average cost of a funeral here is $8,000 to $10,000 is really— I think that's the national, like, average if they're still doing traditional funeral.

Wow.

I had no idea. And you can lose 2 people at once in an accident or 3 or 1. And people don't think about that. I had a friend who lost her parents together and had to pay 2 funerals. And when there are people say, oh, they're young enough in their 40s or what, you know, my dad was 47 when he died. A lot of people die at ages we don't want to mention. Or we have people with their children in their 20s that die suddenly or by accident or overdose or whatever. Sad. Situation, of course they're not thinking about it, but I tell people if they are old enough to understand and have to go into a funeral home to plan for someone else, that they are old enough to have their own plans set up. The importance of that, I can't even stress it. And you can imagine the scenarios that I've seen, but the relief that the family has, because they're still going to be sad. They're still going to have grief when that happens. But the part of the pressure and the guessing and the questions is eliminated. And that's a gift that you— it's priceless. It is a priceless gift. And in addition to that, if someone is a traveler, they should always purchase the travel insurance for when they die, not just if they get sick, if they die, because the other side ends— if they're in Paris and they die, your loved one here has to set up those arrangements and get you here. Then make sure all those things are done. And that's even worse. People go on a cruise. If someone dies on a cruise, they put them in the morgue on the ship and they drop them off at the next port. They can't keep them there. Now you got to go through all these hoops to get that person home. There's so many what-ifs and no one wants to think about it. And I understand that. And I do make people think about the unthinkable things. And I do it with the reasoning of that you're doing it out of love and care and you're not going to convince everyone to do it. But typically, if it's a couple, one of them will say, I'm doing this, and they'll do it for both. And that's my recommendation. Just get it done. Find a local funeral home, a local crematory, and get it done. And visit just like you visit doctors. Maybe you don't like Funeral Home A, you like B better. Go there. Because parents and children, they're not always in the same town. Your kids or parents have to come and pick. You might not want to have been at that funeral home, and now that's what they picked. There's so many reasons why they should plan in advance. Oh my goodness.

My head is spinning. What do you think the misconception, misconceptions are about preplanning?

There's people that are, a lot of them are superstitious. I think it's, oh, if I plan, I'm going to die tomorrow. Like I'm giving the universe a reason to kill me. Many people are very superstitious and think that, but there's so many people that have made their plans and they're still alive to talk about it 20, 30, 40 years later. So that. To me, that superstition isn't valid, but I don't want to judge anyone. But I think many people feel that way. And then others get the whole, what if I move away? Or I don't know if I want to be cremated or not. And so what? That's okay. I tell them, listen, while you're living here, go make your plans. If you do move, it's not that hard to either transfer it, cancel it, and redo it where you move, whatever it is. But while you're living where you're living, anything could happen. I've had people say, I'm leaving in 2 years. Between now and 2 years, you don't know what tomorrow brings.

Yeah.

Get it done because then that is eliminated. They don't have to guess as to what's happening. And many plans you can transfer, depends on who you go to. And if it is cremation, or even if someone doesn't even have their own money and finances ready to do that, there's a lot of places that will make a payment plans for them. But even if you can't pay for it, even if you don't go to a funeral home, I say go to a funeral home and ask them for the publication or the booklets that they give to people to pre-plan. Many of them will give them away free because it at least gives you that questionnaire to answer all of what's needed at that time. At least complete the booklet and give that to your loved ones so they know what to say. It's okay to cremate you and they know if it's okay to bury you and where to go. So at least do that, even if you're not going to buy it, because people do say, I can't buy it, or I don't want to. Fine. But get the information for them to go and be able to finish that at that time. Oh my goodness.

It's so funny. My husband was like, I want this to play at my funeral. And I was like, and I was like, who the heck cares?

Correct. And listen, I'm telling you, they do it. And I also tell people, Collect— if you're going to have a funeral, and most of the time they will play a DVD of your life, right? Or so they'll make something. It's a collection of photographs. Make sure you have a file, and I have one on my computer. These are the approved pictures that I look my best, and that's what I want on that movie. I don't want all the ugly pictures and the most ridiculous things, because at the time when they lose someone, people just come in and they're all just sending photos from their phone or whatever, and some of them are not very attractive photos and we're like, this woman is so pretty. Why is she in this picture like this? But it's just they're just sending because they have a time limit now. They have 2 days to send 200 pictures.

Oh my God.

File. Because it's also supposed to be a story of your life. The pictures from when you were younger and older. Go through your life. Put some when you were a child. Do it when you went to kindergarten, graduated, married, kids. So they have a life story to Otherwise, it's 200 pictures of your last year of your life. And you went, you were sick. It wasn't the best pictures, right? So you need to think of that. So my kids know, my husband know, here's my profile of pictures and I update it and add some as I go through.

Wow. I'm impressed. Can you tell? Like, we need people like you. Can you tell how much I love this topic? I'm over here going, oh my God.

And I love it. And it's true though. And that was the thing. I was always a planner. So even before I started that, at the funeral home, I already had a file for my husband. He doesn't know who to call for electric, water, this, that, because many families, it's the one or the other handles all of the finances, right? So when you have someone where a lot of the older generation women come in, their husbands did everything. They don't even know who their gardener is. They don't know anything. They don't even know what bank. Some of them still get allowance. And so they're here having to pay for a funeral and they're like, I don't know what my money is, but I know I have a lot of it. And you just sit there in awe, like It's true. It's true. So I already had a whole lineup for my husband in case I died. So it was right up my alley when I got the job because I was like, this is what I've been telling people.

You are like, you have found your calling.

I did.

And I love that we have people like you who really put their heart into this work. I see that you put your heart into this. And You've taught me so much. I'm like blown away. What, what do you think that I didn't ask you that is important for everybody to know? Is there anything left that I didn't touch on?

No, I just think again that it's important if someone is, have they experienced a loss and they just don't know what to do or where to turn, I would just recommend that they try to reach out to local resources first if they can. Like I say, most of the hospices and things like that will offer some free support groups and something that they can attend or do. Have people try to find a new, a hobby or something that they've liked, or maybe they liked 40 years ago and they stopped doing it. Maybe try to reintroduce it to not be alone, to not isolate. I think that they just have to know that there's people out there that are available. And if someone does say something to you and it may set you off and it triggers you, it's okay. To cry. Carry tissues. Make sure you have them with you. Have the cry. Don't stop. Just cry. I've cried and sat in my car sometimes. Just let it all out. It's okay. I think people are always afraid of who's judging you, but most of the time you don't even know those people. Just like when you're on the phone with someone and they're going on and on, or you're calling to question something on a credit card. If they're not answering you, hang up, call back, find someone else. So it's okay. They're on the other end of the phone. Stop thinking about what people are thinking of you and just be okay with their feelings and their emotions and their grief and just try to find what can help them really, because that's the importance of this is just what is it that they can do. And you can certainly, I don't know if you include my information or add anyone's email or what, they could certainly feel comfortable to email me even if they don't live near me. I can at least recommend certain steps that they can take so that they know where to look or where to turn, because people need to know that they're not alone and there are others that are going through the same or similar, and, and it's okay to be with them during that time. So as far as any questions, I really don't think that you missed any of them. And the importance of preplanning, again, let them tell people to just go to a funeral home and just ask for a consultation, and I'm sure they're going to give them another long list of reasons why they should do it in advance. And it's just the same as having a will, or we buy car insurance and may never need it. All of these things we buy that we're never going to use sometimes, but you're going to use this funeral whether you're 30 or 20 or 50 or 90 or 80, 100, you're going to use it one day. So buy something you're going to use and figure out what you want as your final disposition. And do you want to be placed in a cemetery or scattered in the ocean? Let people think about it and make those decisions. I used to say, let's have a cremation party. I go to some of these gated communities around here, 2 or 3 couples. Let's talk about cremation. Let me answer the questions you have. So that's really the importance is that it's okay. Investigate, get your answers and move on.

And I think you said, you said so many important things, but two things are sticking out to me because I think that we don't want to cry. And I think a lot of us try not to, which is not allowing the feelings to come out. And I think a lot of us isolate ourselves when we're struggling instead of reaching out. So I hope that we have reached people and that someone will reach out for support. Support today because they listened to this.

I hope so too. Don't be afraid to reach out because like I said, that person that you're calling or the group you show up at or whatever, they're not judging you. They're really not. That is all really just in that person's head and they're just happy to see you or happy to hear from you and they want to help you. People like me want to help you. They're on the other side of that phone waiting to answer, to hear someone like that call them and say, I just need help. Even if it is just calling and saying, I don't even know what I need. Because many times when someone has had a loss, they don't know what they need. And guess what? We understand that. So call and say, I don't even know what I need, but I know I'm crying every day and I don't know what to do. And they will help you. So find some help and it's out there.

Thank you. So I'm going to put it in the show notes, but can you tell everybody where they can find you?

Yes, absolutely. So Again, it's my name is Nina Galato. So I'm definitely out on all the social media with my name. You can find me on Facebook and email me is my name. So nina.galato@gmail.com. So I always tell people, feel free to send me an email. And if they look me up with Coping with Colors, I'm actually going to be creating a website and things soon too. So if they email me, I'll be able to share that and I'll share it with you as I am growing into what I'm doing this summer.

I'm excited for you and the summer and everything that's coming your way. And I just wanna say thank you so much for spending time with me and for sharing so much of your expertise with us.

Oh, thank you so much. I was very happy to be here.

This is Rebecca Green, and I want to remind everyone to spend every day laughing, learning, and loving. Thank you for tuning in to the Winey Palooza podcast. If you like what you heard, please be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. While you are there, leave a review. I love to hear your feedback. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time.

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