Episode 447: Raising an Entrepreneur

Hello everyone, this is Rebecca Green for the Winey Palooza podcast. I'm too busy thinking about college because Margo and I were just having such a good conversation. Um, anyways, I get to speak to the awesome and wonderful Margo McCall Bisnow. Margo, thank you so much for doing this with me. I've been so excited to talk to you.

Oh my gosh, Rebecca, I'm so excited to talk to you also.

When I tell you what Margot does, you're going to understand my excitement because she's going to help all of us. So Margot is the author of Raising an Entrepreneur: How to Help Your Children Achieve Their Dreams, 99 Stories from Families Who Did. After spending 20 years in government, including roles as an FTC commissioner and staff director of the President's Council of Economic Advisers, she has dedicated the past decade to speaking with parent groups about nurturing creative, confident, and resilient kids. Through interviews with 70 entrepreneurs and their parents, Margo has identified key parenting approaches that support entrepreneurial success. She serves as an advisor to several educational organizations, including EQ Generation, the Muse School, and Spark the Journey, which all focus on developing children's skills and passions to achieve their dreams. So now everyone, do you see why I'm so excited to talk to Margo? I have 3 kids. And they are gonna benefit so much from this conversation. So I'm so excited, Margo.

You're so kind.

Let me start with, okay, this is a huge shift. So I wanna ask you about this. What inspired you to shift from your government career to researching and writing about raising entrepreneurs? How did that happen?

My older son started an organization in 2008. Um, and it's a wonderful story about that also. Um, but he had dropped out of college after 2 and a half years. And, um, anyhow, he wanted to meet young entrepreneurs. He didn't think he was cool enough that they would meet with him. And so, um, he cold-called and invited 18 of them to— for a ski weekend in Utah. And they said yes, and it was going to be a one-off. But this was 2008, and none of them had ever met anybody like themselves before. And these were people who were just starting out on their journey. Blake Mykowski had sold 10,000 pairs of Tom's Shoes. Sam Altman had just started OpenAI, which is ChatGPT. I mean, just really cool young people that were just getting started. And they all said, you have to do this again, and I want to bring 10 friends. And, um, so he started, you know, had another one the end of that year. And I mean, it just skyrocketed. And so about 2010, when I decided it was big enough that I could At that point, he had like Bill Clinton and Mark Cuban and John Legend. And I mean, all these speakers. And it was an amazing— oh my gosh, it was amazing. And, and I decided it was okay for me to go. And, um, I'd never met people like this before. And I would go up to all these young entrepreneurs and I'd say, I'm just so curious how you turned out the way you did. Just so willing to take on so much risk and work so single-mindedly. Toward a goal. And they basically all told me the same thing. They all said, I had someone who believed in me, who told me I could do anything I put my mind to. Usually it was a family member, and even more usually it was their mom.

Wow.

And I was so struck by this, and I kept talking about it, and the kids started saying, you have to write a book. And I'm like, I can't write a book. And they said, no, no, you have to write a book. I said, I can't write a book. And they said, you have to write a book. I said, okay, I'll write a book. And, um, they wrote the foreword. They said, everyone needs someone to believe in them, and sometimes that's even your kids.

Oh, that's so beautiful.

Wow. Wow. Anyhow, I was very, um, I don't know if unenthusiastic is the right word, but I wasn't, I wasn't that excited about it, but I just thought, I'll do it and see what I find. And I gathered the most diverse group I could. Half men, half women, every race, every religion, every socioeconomic background. Born in the U.S., born from immigrant parents, born overseas, small towns, big cities. Small families, big families, married parents, divorced parents, single moms, parents who were doctors and lawyers, parents who hadn't graduated from high school, people going into for-profit, nonprofit, artists, activists, anyone who started anything. And to my amazement, they were basically all raised the same. Yeah. And it just like knocked my socks off.

Oh my gosh. Okay, well, you know what I'm going to ask? Like, let's talk about the pattern. What kind of patterns were you seeing in these families?

Um, aside from the big one that I mentioned, that they all, they all had a family that believed in them. Um, every single one of them had a passion outside of school.

Interesting.

And in every case, sometimes it took a big gulp, but in every case their parents supported that passion and their parents told them how proud they were for their success in that passion, even if it didn't translate into success in school.

That is interesting. I mean, you have my wheels turning. So can you give us some examples? Can you give us an example of a passion? And does the passion— is the passion what led to the success?

So about a third of them, the passion was sports.

Okay. Okay.

I was almost afraid, you know, to ask. I didn't want to write a book saying you have to have been an athlete in high school if you want to become an entrepreneur. But I'd be, I'd be talking to these people. And then at the end, I'd say, by the way, did you do anything in sports growing up? And it was, oh, yes, I was the national equestrian champion. Oh, yes, I was on the Olympic development team for skating. Oh yeah, I played basketball at Brown. Oh yeah, I played soccer at Cornell. I have two people in here who played soccer at Cornell. I, I played tennis here. I— so I mean, a lot of them, it was sports. None of them do anything professionally in sports today. The ones where the passion transferred to what they do today are the artists. So John Chu, who directed Wicked, was doing movies from 4th grade. Wow. Um, Emmanuel Shriki, an actor who did Superman and Lois and The Entourage, and she was acting from, you know, lower school. Um, but the people who became just regular entrepreneurs, not Because to me, an artist is an entrepreneur, right? I mean, my younger son started a band. I mean, it's the same thing, right? You have to hire and you have to organize and you have to market and you have to budget.

Yes, yes, yes.

So to me, they're entrepreneurs. But the people who started companies, basically their passion had nothing to do with what they're doing today. But because they had this passion that they had discovered, they worked really hard at it. Because they worked really hard at it, they got really good at it. Because they got really good at it, they got confidence that if they worked hard enough at something, they could succeed. Because they were like working at this thing, sports or whatever it was, single-mindedly, They learned how to pivot when it wasn't going well. They learned what to do when they failed. They learned, as Billie Jean King said about failure, we don't call it failure, we call it feedback. Mm.

I like that.

They learned that failure is how you learn and grow. And they learned that there's a direct trade-off between hard work and results. And I mean, they learned all these. They learned about grit and they learned about resilience and they learned about all these things that you need if you're actually going to become an entrepreneur. Okay.

So the parents believed in them around their passion and the skills that they learned about their passion then translated into becoming successful as an adult.

Yes. I don't think the parents like, like my older son was playing tennis 5 hours a day, 7 days a week.

Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Wow.

We don't play tennis. We'd be like, I'd be going to these tournaments with the top 100 kids in the country. And I swear we were the only parents who didn't know the rules.

Interesting.

He doesn't, you know, do anything professionally with tennis. But I mean, he was honored by the tennis center where he trained. Like 10 years ago for what he had done off the court. And, and he said, everything I am today is because of tennis. Tennis. Wow. And this is where I learned hard work and, you know, grit and focus and determination and resilience and not to be afraid to fail. And, you know, on and on and on. And actually, because of this, that the person who runs that tennis center said he changed what he tells parents. He used to tell parents, come here and your kid will either go on the tour or get a tennis scholarship to college. And now he says that no matter what they do with their life, they will be equipped.

Oh, so true.

Because it's hard when, like, I didn't grow up an athlete. It's hard to watch your kid when you think they should be studying and they're playing tennis 5 hours a day, you know?

It's just, it's interesting. You know, of course we're going to think of our own kids as you're talking and whether it's, you know, theater or soccer or whatever it is, it's what they're learning while they're putting in the hours at the thing that they love is what it sounds like to me.

Right. And I didn't think of this at the time. I didn't think, oh, it doesn't matter that he's not studying science because he's learning resilience, you know?

No, no, no. We're thinking, what time are they going to come home to do the science homework? That's what I'm thinking.

Right. So we, we didn't— I, you know, I didn't think about any of this at the time. I mean, it's only after the fact, looking back, that I realized, you know, how wonderful this is. And, and if I can just tell you a quick story. So he was good at every sport and he was going back and he sort of discovered tennis, you know, in 5th grade. And he was kind of going back and forth between tennis and baseball and everything else. And then finally he decided he was just going to, you know, it was, it was tennis. And so he was like 13, 12, 13 when he really decided he was going to do it full, you know, that was going to be his passion. And most kids who end up the top in the country at 12, 13, they're playing regional tournaments. They've been doing this for years, and he lost every match for years. And he'd lose a match and he'd say, I know what I did wrong. I'll beat him next time. And he fought his way up to 35 in the country in the juniors.

Oh, wow.

Wow.

Your son sounds incredible.

He is.

But wow. Wow.

You know, I wasn't thinking at the time, oh, this will— this is good, he'll become an entrepreneur. I was thinking, oh, you know, you look at your child and they just love what they're doing.

Well, and you have me thinking because I'm thinking about the moms who say to me, how do I help them find their passion? Because not all kids have found something. So any advice for them?

Yes. So first of all, if they haven't found their passion when they're in 4th grade, it's okay. And second of all, if their passion changes several times while they're growing up, I mean, some of the people in the book, they had 3 different passions, you know, one in 4th grade to 7th grade and one from 7th grade to 10th grade and one— that's okay too. And the other thing I would say is, you know, parents say this to me all the time, parents of high school kids. Well, I just don't know what their passion is. And I'm like, then you're not paying attention. And they're doing something that they love, and you say, stop wasting so much time on that and come inside and study, or go in, you know, that join this club that's going to help you get into school.

Yes.

Instead of watching what they're doing that gives them joy. My, um, my older son has a little one who just turned 6, and, um, I was in his kindergarten class, and they'd asked, um, all the kids to write, like, on a piece of paper and draw a picture, like, what they wanted to be when they grew up. I want to be a dancer. I want to be a doctor. I want to plant vegetables. I want to grow, you know, things. I want to— I want to climb buildings. I want to build things. I mean, they all— they— all of our children are born with something in them that, that they love, that they— that gives them joy. And I think it's our job. I think this is— if I can— maybe the most important thing I can say to your listeners is see what gives them joy and then encourage them to pursue that and, and, and tell them you're proud of them for working at that. And if after a while they don't like it, that's okay. They can find something else. But let them know that whatever makes them happy is good. You're, you're, you're good with that.

It's really good advice. So, so we can encourage them to do things that bring them joy. What, what should parents stop doing? I know what you're gonna say.

I think the world has changed so much from when we grew up.

Yes.

I think parents are well-meaning. They love their children. They want their children to be successful and happy and make enough money that they can afford to live. They don't understand how different the world is today. And their kids don't have to follow the path that they followed, partly because that path isn't there anymore. I mean, just because you graduate from college with, you know, Bs and no particular interest, and— but you've got that college degree, it's not like you're going to get a job that you can keep for life. Like, that's just— that just doesn't exist anymore. And parents just have to understand that, you know, it's a different world. I mean, I— my dad was a professor. I grew up in university towns. I didn't know anybody who didn't have a PhD, basically. Like, can you imagine how I felt when after 2 and a half years my son said he was dropping out of college? Like, it didn't— It didn't occur to me that that was like an option.

Right, right. And I don't, you know, and I don't want everyone to go crazy when I say this, but before we knew what Max wanted to do, you know, Max is a senior, we had told him, you know, my husband is an entrepreneur with lots of businesses, and we know that you can start a successful business and be successful without college. Now Seth went to college. I'm just saying we know that the college degree is not necessarily what starts the business. So we were with you. Like, if Max had said, I don't wanna go to college, I wanna start this business, honestly, we would've supported him, as crazy as that might sound to people.

But it's not crazy. I, um, I gave a talk, um, my son's organization is called Summit, and there was a Summit meeting and I gave it, you know, a talk about Raising Kids, and a parent came up to me afterwards and he was distraught. And he said, you know, my, my son started this little stupid company in his dorm room and he's just announced he's dropping out of college and moving home to work on his little company. And I think he's ruining his life. And I'm so upset. I haven't talked to him in 3 weeks. And I called over this guy, Craig Clemens, who I, I know has made like a gazillion dollars. Um, and I know didn't graduate from college. And I said, Craig, let me ask you a question. You have a choice of two people to hire in your company. One person dropped out of college to work on a little widget company they'd started, did it for a year and a half, ultimately decided it just wasn't that great a product and they just needed a lot more knowledge and skills and they wanted to go into a real company for a while. The other stayed in college, wasn't motivated, wasn't an outstanding student, but somehow graduated. Which one are you going to hire? And Craig, without blinking, said, I'm hiring the first one. And so are the other 150 people in this room.

Wow. See, because the world has changed. And not that we don't want people to get degrees, but there's lots of different routes for lots of different people. Right.

And it depends what you want. I mean, if you want to be a lawyer or a doctor or an architect, I mean, You know, an accountant, right? You know, there's lots of things you actually do need degrees for. I have an MBA. My husband has a law degree. We're not like against degrees, but it just depends what you want.

What if, what if a parent is listening wondering if it's too late? Can you give them some advice? It's never too late.

It's never too late.

I mean, no matter how, no matter how old, it's not too late is what you're saying, right?

I mean, my husband started his company when he was 50.

Wow. That's awesome.

So I think he said, wishes his parents had read my book when he was growing up.

Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. I love that. What do you mean when you say lead by following?

Well, it's kind of what we were just talking about, that see where your child wants to go and then support it. You know, let them lead the way. Let them. And maybe they need help, like, you know, I mean, and maybe you just have to pay for, like, lessons or— I mean, my younger son, it was always writing music. And, you know, he found the teachers he wanted to work with, and we supported that, and we paid for music lessons or whatever, and, you know, let them lead the way.

Is there anything, like, if you could talk to yourself back, you know, 20 years ago, is there anything that you would have done different?

Yeah, I didn't realize that people's brains are really different. I thought everyone's brain was just like my brain. And so my younger son, the music person, he was in 11th grade and he was playing the piano. And I came in, I said, stop playing the piano and go study. It was exam week, and he looked at me and he said, I have a new song in my head, so I just have to play it so I can visualize it so I can write it down when exams are over. And I had this light bulb. I was like, oh my God, like, our brains are actually completely different. I have never had a new song in my head. If I had a song in my head, I couldn't play it. If I played something, I wouldn't visualize it. I certainly wouldn't be like— and it was like the first time I used to think, like, why isn't his— like, I mean, I can read something and then I can take a test and get an A, you know? That's just something I can do because I learned how to do that. I don't have new songs in my head. I can't play the piano with the song in my head. Like, it was the first time I realized, you know, that our brains were just so different. And I had taken music lessons when I was a kid, and I— when they were like 3rd, 4th grade, I gave them piano lessons. And my younger son, after a while, he said he didn't really like the piano. And I'm like, okay, we'll write the— we'll write it off. Done. You know, my rule was, if I've paid for something, you have to finish the semester or the summer or whatever. But if you didn't like it, you don't have to do it again. And then he started writing music and he was writing in 7th grade and he was writing it on the computer. And, and about 10th grade, he found— he said he wanted to take piano lessons and he found a piano teacher to work with. And it was only like much later, looking back, that I realized it wasn't that he didn't like the piano. It was like he didn't like the piano teacher. Very rigid, who was saying, see this black note, play this, play this note on the piano. The noob teacher told him how to take the music in his head and play it.

Amazing. Oh my gosh, what a gift.

Wow. Well, he definitely has a gift, but I also just didn't realize that people's brains are different. And you, like, You just have to understand that. Like, I didn't get that at all.

Yeah, my, my kids have given me a crash course because the three of them are so different.

It's so great that you're right.

Oh my gosh, I mean, you have me thinking of my middle child because like she'll be taking a break and singing. I never was doing anything musical. Like, I didn't need to take a break to sing from my homework. Like, okay, she's singing now. She's not doing her science. Okay. Oh boy. I love it. I know. I know. And I, and I love, and I did tell her yesterday, I love that she's aware of when she needs a break because I think that's something that I needed to learn at her age. You know, when I need, because I would plow through my homework and she is able to say, okay, I need to take a singing break or whatever she needs. So I love that about her.

Does she do any, like, sing in the school musicals or anything?

Yeah, well, she's the, she's the theatrical one. She loves to act. Acting is her, one of her favorite things to do. So, you know, I love seeing, you understand this, I love seeing them find things that they love to do. It's just amazing as a parent. And I do think that the parents that I talk to sometimes struggle with the kids who aren't involved in things that are their passions. So I love your advice to pay attention to what brings them joy. I really loved that advice because I think that's one of the biggest things that I get is people asking me for advice of, but they don't have a passion, or I can't get them involved in school. So paying more attention to our kids and what they're enjoying doing throughout the day, I think, will help those parents.

And also, I talk to parents, and they're like, and I'm, well, what is their passion? And then they'll tell me something. Cooking or sewing or making things or singing or dancing or whatever. And they say, but they can't make a living that way, so they need to study so they can go to college. And I'm like, so let me get this straight. Your goal for your child is that they should spend 40 years in a job that they don't like. That's what you think is a good goal that they should work toward? Being unhappy 40 hours a week for 40 years?

No, no, no, absolutely not. We do not want that. Nobody wants that for their kids. No, but they don't—

but that's what they're saying. They just haven't thought it through. No, they're saying this thing you love, stop doing that because you can't make a living doing that. So you better do what I'm telling you. And you know, Rebecca, I keep thinking about the college admissions scandal. Do you remember that? And everyone was like, oh, these rich kids, you know, they're so lucky they have parents who'll do anything. And I was like, here's what these parents are communicating to their kids: if you don't go to this school, you can't be a success in life. And if this school knew the real you, they wouldn't want you. So we have to pretend you are somebody different from what you are because otherwise you cannot succeed. I can't think of a worse message to give your child. How about, you are so special and so extraordinary, and this school might not get that, but we're going to find a school who does.

Where you—

yes, where they appreciate what you have to offer.

Yes, I think the best advice I have gotten over this last year, you know, the whole college process, is that Max will be successful wherever he goes. It's not a particular school, and I, I needed to hear that, right?

I did too when my kids were growing up. You, you need to find a school where they can thrive. Yes, that's the important thing.

Agree. 100%. Now, what about, you know, I also hear parents who, they want their kids to make money. Okay, so our goal as parents, we want our kids to be happy, but we want them to be happy in a job that can provide enough money for them. So can you give us guidance to the parents who maybe don't agree with the path that their kids are taking because they don't think they're going to make enough money.

So first of all, they have no idea, right?

Yeah. Yeah.

And second, you never know where a path can take you. Maybe you're going to start out cooking and then maybe you're going to start a catering company, or maybe you're going to start managing a restaurant, or like, you don't know where the path is going to go. And also, like, I mean, who knows? Look what's happening in the economy now. Look how many people are being laid off. And I mean, like, it's not like their path is a guarantee. And, you know, the other thing I would say about that is there's this wonderful book called Die with Zero by Bill Perkins. Bill Perkins is a huge fan of my younger son's band, Magic Giant, and he's flown them to perform at some of his events. And so I read his book, and in the book he says, you know, all these parents say, you know, I can't give my kids any money now because I have to save it so I can leave the money when I die.

That sounds funny when you say it out loud.

And he's like, You know, when you say you die at 80, you know, and your kids are 60, like, that's not actually when they need money. When your kids need money is like in their 20s and 30s when they're starting out and they want to buy their first house. And, you know, maybe they want to start a company or so. I would say to parents, like, like, see what you can afford to give them and help them out if it's, if it's a true passion. And if not, you know, maybe, maybe they need to live home for a year while they get something started, you know, and tell them that's okay. You're proud of them for pursuing it and let them follow it. Let them see where it leads. And it may not be immediately obvious, but it may go somewhere.

Yeah, I think, I think the biggest thing that you're saying is that we don't know and parents think they know, but we don't know where their path is going to go. And I really love that you're telling us that. No, I really, I'm trying to let my children, I really want my kids to follow their dreams and their passions and be happy. And, and I tell them that success to me is enjoying what you're doing every day. That's success to me. So go to work and have it not feel like work, have it be enjoyable and make money that way. But, you know, I also know from talking to so many parents how hard it is to let your kids fail. And I know you think it's important that we allow that process. Can you talk to that?

Yes. I mean, that's one of the most important things. And you were asking about the, how these parents raised their kids. None of these future entrepreneurs were punished for failure.

Oh, I love that.

They were all, their parents would say to them, What did you learn from this? What would you do differently next time? And the thing is, if you're afraid to fail, you're afraid to take risks. And if you're afraid to take risks, you're never gonna be an entrepreneur. Mm-hmm. And probably at almost anything you do, you're not going to be successful because you have to be willing to take risks. And, and you have to know that if it doesn't work out, it's okay. You'll learn from it and you'll be stronger and better and wiser the next time.

Really good advice. Yep. Let them take risks. Let them fail. Be there to support them through it. Okay, so let's move to support because you have a very directive, structured approach and you have a more supportive approach to parenting. So how do we get parents to move from the more directive, maybe too structured, to the more supportive?

Yeah, so it was interesting again to me, and I didn't— this is actually the second edition of my book, this, this one here.

Oh yay! Oh my goodness.

I didn't really think about this at first, but it's, it's, it's, it's really important, I think. Subsequent to writing the first edition, I read a book about grit, you know, by Angela Duckworth, and she talks about parenting for grit, and she describes it is exactly how everyone in this book was raised. So she talks about there's permissive parenting where you just say, whatever you want, dear, it's just fine. And then there's authoritarian parenting, which is you do it my way and you're doing it this way.

Yeah.

Then there's, I think she calls it respectful parenting, which is what all the, uh, how all these entrepreneurs were raised, which is there's a lot of rules in the house about expectations. You come to dinner every night. You, you know, keep your room clean. You're polite. You're kind. You give 10% of the money you earn to your favorite charity. You know, I mean, whatever the rules in the family are, but all the big things they have complete freedom to make the decision. You know, you, you want to major in what? You want to go hitchhike your way around Europe this summer? You want to, you want to change—

I don't know if I'm that good.

You want to change schools?

You want—

you know, whatever the big things were, they let them do it. They, they said You know, so I just think that's a really important way to look at it.

If my husband's parents are listening, and I will, I will tell this to them in person. My husband majored in acting, okay? Minored in finance, majored in acting. And I have said to him, why did they let you do that? Why would they let you do that? I say to him all the time, and he's like, it was my passion. It's what I wanted to do. No, he's a successful entrepreneur and his parents let him major in acting. I don't know that I'm that good. I don't know that I would let my kids major in acting.

Why?

Well, so the goal was to go to New York City and try to make it as an actor. Okay. That was his original goal, which, you know, Ella was talking about. Ella takes after her dad. She was talking about that and on her own has shifted.

Okay.

But when she was talking about it, I was like, you can do it. You can let her, let her go. Let her try. I was really giving myself lots of pep talks around this subject, not necessarily the life that I want for my child, if I'm going to be honest with you. But if it's what would make her happy, if it was her passion, I would have gotten behind it.

Right. Right.

And you know what?

And just like your husband, and who knows, maybe she'd get a job acting, and maybe she would discover that what she really likes is directing, or, or, or building scene sets, or working with the costume designers, or hiring, you know, and, and trying to fill the different roles. I mean, helping, helping, helping direct commercials. I mean, There's a million things you can do. Like, it's not like, okay, you have one choice. You are going to go to New York and you are going to try to act, and then if you fail, you are screwed for life.

No, it's not. No, no. And it has helped him tremendously in his career. So getting in, right?

He gives these presentations to people.

Yeah.

Let me tell you about my product.

I watch him present and I just sit back and I'm like, wow, he's a natural. So the acting degree has definitely come in handy, but I give his parents so much credit for supporting him to go do that. I mean, that's, that's good parenting to me. Yes. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. So I could go on and on about this subject. So we want our kids to be successful. We want to raise successful kids. What would you tell parents to start today? What can we start doing today that we probably aren't doing?

Well, I don't know if we aren't doing it, but, um, I mean, there's so many little things like don't scold them when they screw up. Ask them, even if it's spilling the milk. I mean, of course you have to clean it up, but just say, why do you think you spilled it? What were you doing? Were you rushing? Were you carrying too many things? Were you not looking where you were going? I mean, what did you learn from this? Not, you're a bad person, you spilled the milk, right? You know, and not, you know, What's wrong with you? You missed the field goal and, you know, your team lost. It's your— you screwed up. It's your fault. No, it's like, what did you learn? You know, did you work hard enough in practice? Do you like, you know, should you not have caught at that time and tried to do it? I mean, what, what did you learn? What would you do differently? How did you— how can you make it better? Because people are going to be successful in life. They're always going to be asking themselves those questions, right? What, what can I do to make it better? Not how— what a terrible person I am because I didn't do it right this time. No, nobody's going to do it right every time, right? Nobody goes through life with everything being perfect every minute.

Yeah.

Just your attitude toward that, which comes back to the parents, how— what their attitude was, you know?

Yeah. Yeah.

And being I mean, there's so many things. I mean, I could, I could go on for hours. See what gives your child joy and then tell them to pursue it. And tell them, and whatever it is, whether it's, you know, running for student government, whether it's getting an article published in the student newspaper, whether, you know, whether it's singing, whether it's cooking, whether it's building something, whether it's starting a little company. I mean, Very few of these people had companies when they were in high school.

Yeah.

Like, you have to have been an entrepreneur in high school to become an entrepreneur. You know, it's just whatever gives them joy. Tell them how proud you are of them. And, you know, it's more important that they succeed in the thing they love than that they get an A in trigonometry.

100%. And what I'm thinking, listening to you, is You know, you and I have our brains, like you said, and what we're good at and what makes us happy. And our kids are so different from us. Like, I'm sitting here thinking about the joy that Ella gets from being on stage, which is not me at all. And it's just so fascinating to discover what they love and what kind of life they want. And it's— I will tell you, so far with number 1 and number 2, it's not the life that I would pick for myself. But they have their own dreams. It's really interesting.

It is interesting. And the fact that they know you're proud of them for pursuing their dreams, I'm sure means everything to them.

Well, I'm certainly trying. And I love that you said that having someone believe in them is what helped the most. So I will, I will definitely keep doing that. I'm taking that prescription to heart. And is there anything else that you want to share with us before I let you go?

Um, I don't know. This has been such a fun conversation. My, um, my younger son started this band Magic Giant, and they have a song called Disaster Party.

Oh my gosh, I love it!

That I can't get out of my head because of everything that's going on in the world.

Okay, wait, tell me it again. I want to go look it up. Mass— what is his band called?

Magic Giant.

And what is the song?

Disaster Party.

I'm gonna go look it up.

Especially the line, "You might as well throw away all your money." I'm like—

You know, your kids sound awesome. You obviously did a good job and now you're helping all of us.

Well, thank you so much. This has been so fun, Rebecca.

Will you please tell everyone where to find your book and where to find you?

Yes. Um, okay, so Raising an Entrepreneur, here it is, How to Help Your Children Achieve Their Dreams. It's on Amazon. Um, I have a website called raisinganentrepreneur.com, and you can— there's a link there to Amazon. And I'm on, um, Instagram at @margobiznow, and I think there's a link to the book on there, so Awesome.

Wonderful. I can't thank you enough. I loved this conversation.

Thanks so much, Rebecca. Me too.

This is Rebecca Green, and I want to remind everyone to spend every day laughing, learning, and loving. Thank you for tuning in to the Winey Palooza podcast. If you like what you heard, please be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. While you are there, leave a review. I love to hear your feedback. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time.

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