Episode 529: Parenting Tools For Anxiety, OCD, Autism and Hyperactivity

Hello everyone, this is Rebecca Green for the Winey Plousa Podcast, and I am very excited over here because I get to talk to the amazing Dr. Rogers. Dr. Rogers, thank you so much for being here with me today.

Well, I'm very happy to be here.

She, um, has so much amazing experience. We were just talking about more experience that isn't even in this introduction, but But I'm going to tell you a little bit about her. She is a seasoned clinical psychologist from California. Throughout her 30-year career, she worked with children and families. She began her career as a psychological assistant doing psychological education and neuropsychological testing. You really want to test my tongue, tongue twisters today. Soon she branched into individual and group therapy, parenting groups, and implementing school-based interventions. During the span of her career, Dr. Rogers gave presentations on topics of suicide prevention, relaxation techniques, parenting autistic children, and police training on handling autistic individuals. Now retired, Dr. Rogers focuses on authoring books, which we're going to talk about, and articles about mental health, offering her expertise to to a broader audience. She is passionate about helping parents understand what drives their children's actions, arming them with time-tested methods to manage difficult situations, and making mental health and family harmony accessible to people who cannot access therapy when things go wrong. So as you can see, Dr. Rogers, that doesn't even cover some of the stuff we were just talking about.

So, uh, I think I might add to that that my practice, uh, especially towards the end, focused on hyperactive kids, you know, okay, with hyperactive kids, yeah, at least with autistic kids, um, depression and children, anxiety, a lot of anxiety in children, uh, teaching parents how to deal with that. Um, and OCD as well.

Yeah, so I mean, so many topics. I— my amazing producer gave me a list of things that you can talk about, from depression, OCD, autism, anxiety. We're going to talk about all the things, if that's okay with you.

Okay.

All right, so let's start with what do you think are the most common parenting issues, and can you give us some tips to to start with?

Okay, so the most common parenting issues that came into my office, uh, were separation anxiety with school starting, um, a lot of power struggles with kids. If you have a powerful adult, they're likely to beget at least one powerful child. And that powerful child will clash with that powerful parent or grandparent. And the easygoing parent will just, you know, let them go do, you know, do things their way. But the clashes happen between the— power struggles happen between those two individuals. And so what you have to do is you have to teach the parents how to give up their power struggle you know, explain to them what's going on, have them step back and learn how to get around the power struggle, and give them actual things that they can say to their children about various situations, um, so that they can get around the power struggles and there'll be peace in the house, and they get their children to do what the kids need to do. At certain times of the evening or the, you know, morning time, because most of the clashes happen around bedtime, homework, and getting ready for school.

Oh, the power struggles. I have 3 children, and the first 2 are like as sweet as can be, and the third one is spicy, and I love her dearly, and I admire her power. I really do. And I really am aware because I'm a social worker that she wants control.

Yeah.

So I mean, I would love to hear some words of advice because sometimes I really fail.

Okay, so give me a situation.

Oh my gosh. I mean, she doesn't—

Anything happen this morning?

Yeah, no, um, I mean, she doesn't want questions. She, she wants me to just back off. Like, too many questions, you're annoying. Like, that's a perfect example right there.

How old is she?

13.

Okay, so, so did she do that when she was younger?

Um, no, not really.

Too many questions? Yeah.

No, that—

so what you're, you know, so what you're seeing is her 13-year-old personality. And what I tell people is, this too shall pass. So when they enter the teenage years, you have 2.5 to 3 years of awfulness, and then they go back. If they don't get into drugs or some other, you know, horrible stuff, then what you'll get is you'll get your old child back.

It's wonderful advice. I, I needed to hear that.

I refer to it as getting their brain back.

Oh, that's so smart. See, you are so good at this. Ah, we have to remember they lose their brains as teenagers.

Anyhow, that's all that— all that stuff is in the book.

Okay, so tell us what your book is called. Let's talk about the book.

Okay, so the book is called, um, Your Journey to Successful Parenting, and, uh, ages between 2 and 11.

Okay.

And the, the reason I did such a long age range, uh, is because parent, you know, you get one book and you can keep it for a long period of time until your kids reach, you know, uh, the teen years. Uh, so part of my book, uh talks about dealing with very small children. Part of it deals with the middle, middle, uh, ages, and part of it deals with the preteens and how to prevent your kids from getting into drugs. Because it starts early on. It doesn't start when your kid hits 14. It starts when you're raising your children, because you have to have a relationship with your children, a good relationship with your children no matter how difficult they are, how testing they are, how hard they are, you know, um, they have to know that they can trust you and they can always come back to you and get your support. Because a lot of parents, when a child is very difficult, um, you know, even the good parents will have a tendency to just try to put a distance between themselves and the child, and they they don't interact as much with that child.

Yes.

And there are also parents who have difficulties themselves and they have trouble, you know, working with a difficult child, period, no matter how many books they read.

Right.

So for those parents, you know, I always recommend therapy. But also, if they can't afford therapy or if they live too far away from the therapist, definitely read books about parenting and try to implement it. But also make sure that you, no matter what your child does, you give them the consequences. And when all is said and done, tell them, you know, you need— I'm giving you consequences so you remember, to improve your memory, to not do this again. 'But remember that I love you even though you did such and such.' Those words are perfect. And, uh, so because later on when they get to the age of your, you know, 13, they still have to know, even though they're prickly. And it's like, you know, loving a teenager is trying to love a cactus.

Oh my gosh, yes.

Like trying to hug a cactus is very painful. And, uh, but if they know that you're in their corner, and if they mess up, they can come back to you when they're really hurting, when they're really in trouble, when they're really troubled about what's happening with their friends. They'll come, they'll come back to you. They'll, they'll talk to you.

Uh, yeah, I mean, I—

yeah, go ahead.

Well, so I want to talk to the parents because I think that what you said is so important. So How can they make sure that their prickly child knows that they're always there for them? Because sometimes it's hard to communicate.

You just tell them. You can write them letters, write them an email.

I love that.

Write them a text if they, you know.

I do want to tell everybody that texting has been working fabulously.

There you go.

Excellent parenting tool. Use the text. Yes. So, um, can I go back to separation anxiety?

Sure.

Um, a lot of kids have trouble, you know, I worked with so many families who the kids would not go to school and that's why I was there. So, um, can we give them some tips to help ease the transition into school?

Right. Uh, so basically what you do is you have to go to therapy and deal with a child's anxiety. Uh, also storytelling works. It depends on how old the child is. Yeah, if they're a teenager and they're refusing to go to school, you've got, uh, socialization issues, and it's a whole different ball game. And they've suffered through many years of school, and, you know, they've had enough and they don't want to deal with it anymore. But for very small children, it's usually just fear of the unknown. They don't know what to expect, and in that case, storytelling is perfect.

I love that.

I use storytelling a lot because storytelling helps you get through to the child when they don't want to listen to you, when when you're just telling them to do stuff, especially the children who are really forceful and are into power struggles, who don't want to listen to anybody. They will listen to the story and they'll get the message from the story. So the structure of such stories is you present a problem in a fiction, talking about somebody else, another child. If it's a very small child, it's a prince and princess that are having some issues. Uh, if a school-aged child, it's another child, and you talk about that child being afraid of going to school and you explain why the child is being afraid, because young children really can't verbalize it. Mm-hmm. You give them the words and you give them all kinds of scenarios. They don't know what to expect. They don't know if they're gonna get lost. They don't know if they're going to know what to do once they get there. They don't know anybody there, and they don't have their friends there. They don't know the teacher. They don't know if the teacher is going to be nice or not, right? So you include all those elements into the story, and you tell them a story about that. And then one of the stories that I have in my book is about a little girl who was afraid of going to school, and— but she had a friend who, uh, graduated into the first grade. So she went to ask her friend about what the first day of school was like. And the friend told her, "I don't really remember, but I remember that it was nice. It was okay." And she said, "Well, how did you—" The little girl in the story said, "How did you know what to do?" And she said, "The teacher explains everything. She shows you everything." And the teacher is very nice, and the teacher explains things many, many times over. Yeah. Until the whole class gets it. Until everybody in the class gets it. Because everybody who comes to kindergarten doesn't know what to do. Excellent tips.

I, I, it's, yeah. I didn't think of that when my children were younger. Where were you? Wish I knew that. Well, I love that tip. And, you know, I talk to so many parents who, you know, they worry about their children and they worry about if their child is depressed. And I want to move to that because I think parents can miss the signs. How do parents know if their kids are depressed?

Okay, so in young children, you can't really tell if the children are depressed. It shows up mostly as anxiety. Mm-hmm. There's an underlying depression element, but it shows up mostly as anxiety. Okay. Because they don't feel good about themselves and they worry a lot. And the hallmark of depression for all ages is worrying. So if you're like, if you're depressed and you go to therapy and you take medication and then you feel better and you get off your medication and you feel better and everything is swimming along, you have to watch out for worrying thoughts. If you start worrying about stuff, use the stuff, you know, use the techniques that the therapist taught you how to get rid of worrying thoughts. Because if you keep it up, that depression is going to come back for sure.

I mean, do you feel like people can get over depression without therapy? What are your thoughts on that?

So the research basically says that you can get over the depression without going to therapy or taking medication because a lot of it is time limited. You can get over depression just with medication. You can get over depression with just therapy. But the fastest way is medication and therapy together.

And then coming off the medication when they can.

Is that what you were explaining? Well, when I had people coming to me, because they came to me— I'm a psychologist, I don't prescribe medications— they would usually, about 90% of them said, I don't want to take medication, I just want to deal with it with therapy. But some people were so profoundly depressed that I told them, well, try therapy, I'll see you 3 times a week. The first 2 weeks. Wow. There's, you know, if there's no change, then I want you to try medication.

Yeah, that's a good—

that's a good compromise because they, you know, they were so, so depressed.

Well, and I think that it's hard to know as a parent, like, how do they know when they need to take that professional step for their child?

Well, if all the techniques that they learn from, you know, reading books if those techniques aren't working and that child continues to worry. Because what happens is you don't really have good access to what's happening in their head, right? So then you start asking questions. Are you worried about this? Are you worrying about this? What do you think about this? Are you, you know, are you thinking about this a lot? So to try to figure out what it is that is— that's in their head that's making them upset.

Yes, absolutely. I always tell everybody, everyone can benefit from therapy, every single one of us. Yeah. So you mentioned pills and drugs. Yes. And I think that parents don't know how to talk to their kids about pills and drugs. Can you give them some words to use?

Okay, so the first thing that you're going to probably notice is that they start talking about their friends using this and that and the other. Yes, yes. And, uh, so instead of, uh, saying, well, that's just terrible, I don't want you to be friends with that person because I don't want you doing it, uh, you start, uh, asking questions. Well, What— how did your friend feel when she or he, you know, took that drug? How did their behavior change? What did you notice about them? Did they seem happier? Did they seem more nervous? What happened? Uh, and, uh, then you start probing a little bit about the friend. Keep it— keep the conversation to the friend. Is the friend continuing to do that? Are they, you know, are they— what happens to the friend if they get in trouble? What happens at your school if somebody gets caught doing stuff? And they'll say, oh, everybody does it in the bathroom. And so, you know, so then your heart sinks, but you keep, you know, you keep a straight face and and you just keep out, you know, talking about the friend. You never put down anybody who's using, you know, using drugs or talking bad about the friend. You never say anything bad about the friend because the flow of information will stop. What you're doing is you're trying to get information. It's really smart. And then you can ask, you know, then you take your child to drug testing, allegedly to test for vitamin deficiencies, to see if they're taking any pills.

I love that so much. I'm going to remember that.

And, you know, for medical checkup. And then depending on whether they find anything in there, um, then you start talking. You know, the doctor will probably talk to them about if they find something in their blood. The doctor will probably start talking to them about it. But then what you can do is you can start— you can talk about not really the consequences of the drug use, but how people do it because it makes them feel more grown-up. Some people do it because it makes them feel more grown-up. Some people do it because it makes them feel happier. Um, some people do it because it makes them feel like they are very popular. And so then you, then you switch to telling stories about other people. Maybe make— I have a story in my book about a mythical friend that the mother had who started using marijuana. Mm-hmm. And it was all about what happened with a friend and that she was friends with this particular marijuana-using friend. Until the friend started using so much of it that she stopped really paying attention to their conversations and was kind of zoned out most of the time. Yeah. And then she had to go find another friend. So again, going around, because lecturing doesn't help, you know, all the slogans that they had at school. Telling kids the scare stories about drug use. None of that, none of that worked because everybody believes they're not going to get addicted. Everybody believes at that age that they're immune from anything bad happening to them. Yeah. So that stuff really doesn't work. That is good for us all to hear.

Yeah, for sure. I am not telling you that I'm in the clear, but I did bring up this conversation with my daughter and she, her response was so funny. She goes, do you see how healthy I eat and how much I exercise? Do you think I'm going to put that crap in my body? I was like, okay, that was a good response. Yeah. Oh goodness, the things our children say. That's right. Yeah.

And it, you know, but it comes from you. They're repeating what they heard from you. I'll remember that.

Oh, I'll remember that one. So there's so many topics that I want to ask you about, and I want to move to OCD, if that's okay. Okay, sure. Because people don't know what it is, and they have no idea how to deal with it with their kids. So can you first tell us what it is?

Okay, so OCD is a combination of anxiety and intrusive thoughts or pictures that people see. Uh, the intrusive thoughts are things that they, uh, usually abhor. So it's, it's unlike, uh, when you try to be on a diet and try to lose weight, you start thinking about all the foods that you crave, you get the cravings. That's not OCD. OCD is, uh, thinking about killing somebody else that you love, about, uh, imagining your parents being dead, about— or dying in a car crash, uh, imagining, uh, your favorite pet, something bad happening to your favorite pet. So these are all thoughts that you don't want in your head. And people try to control their thoughts, and they develop rituals to try to control their thoughts. And the rituals can be counting. They can, if they're, you know, if people become— the most popular, I guess, would be that everybody knows about is the hand washing because of the germ phobia. So when people are afraid of germs, they'll do— wash their hands multiple times. And they— with adults, it's really interesting because they won't clean their house, but they keep washing their hands. So there's no logic behind it. It's illogical, like phobias, but it's very overpowering and the thoughts just don't stop. I tell people with OCD, it's kind of like hiccups. You don't know where it came from and you don't know when it's going to leave. It's a good description. But it's, you know, it just keeps on rolling in your head and the thoughts keep going and going and going. So it makes it really hard to focus on anything else. And if you have some behaviors that are geared towards making your anxiety lower, because it, you know, creates a lot of anxiety for people. But if you have some rituals that make your anxiety lower, like checking and rechecking when you think that you left the stove on or something in your house, uh, it— so if you try to prevent people from doing the rituals or the children from doing the rituals, they can get very upset, upset, angry, and assaultive.

Oh geez, yes, true.

Okay, because they're so worried, they're, they're just a mess inside. All the emotions are going and they can't control it and they feel like they're losing their mind. And, uh, so it's, it's very, very difficult. And you would think, you know, just give the, just give the kids some anxiety medication to make the anxiety go away and the whole thing will go away. But no, the anxiety gets slower, but the intrusive thoughts are still there. So some of the, you know, some of the antidepressants, the newer ones, you'd have to look up which ones because I don't remember. But some of them are— some of them work for OCD to make it less. It makes it a lot less. It still appears, but makes it a lot less. And then you work with people in therapy to help them battle those intrusive thoughts. But usually therapy is pretty necessary for OCD. It's—

well, and I think it's more common than people think it is.

I don't know about the frequency because I didn't look it up.

Yeah, no, me neither. It's just my impression. I don't have any stats, people. Yeah. Okay. No stats to give you. So I think that was an excellent explanation because I think people really aren't sure what OCD is and they don't know how to handle it. So I appreciate you explaining that to us. Good. Okay. I also think that parents do not know how to handle their children acting out, and I think that they're trying to get it to stop as quick as they can, and it's not happening. So can you tell us what would effectively help a kid who's having a meltdown?

Okay, so meltdowns are usually part of autism. Hmm. Um, and, uh, so there's no quick way to get rid of it except prevention. So let's talk about the difference between meltdowns and, uh, having a temper tantrum. Okay. Not that autistic children don't have temper tantrums as well, but it's just different. Gotcha. So a temper tantrum is you tell a child no and then they pitch a fit, but they're looking to see if you're noticing their behavior, if it's working, get them what they want. Yes. But in a meltdown, which can happen with kids, teenagers, or adults with autism. What's happening is that they're overwhelmed internally by noises outside, people talking over each other. Usually, people with autism have really poor filters and they can't filter out the noise in other conversations. So if you take them to a restaurant, they can hear what you're talking about at the same time that they can hear what the waiters are talking about in the kitchen, at the same time that they can hear what the people at all other tables are talking about. And all this noise, it just makes them very agitated. And so it's hard for them to control themselves and to control their emotions. And then they just blow up and they don't have any control over it and, you know, you don't have any control over it. So you can remove them from the setting or you can do prevention stuff. You can make sure that you're, um, when you take them to a loud place, you make sure that they have earplugs in or, uh, headphones on. So they're not overwhelmed. Use canceling headphones so they can manage themselves. So a lot of times with autism, it's prevention.

That's really good to know. So, you know, if a parent is finding out that their children has autism, yes, can you tell them some steps to take? Because they're not going to know what to do.

Okay, so the first thing, if the child is young, you know, very young, uh, the first thing that you want to do is occupational therapy. Because occupational therapy handles all the sensitivities and it handles all the, uh, things that, uh, you know, that they have trouble with, um, Handling small objects or using the body, their body in space. A lot of times there's proprioception problems where they can't feel their gut. They don't know when they're full, they don't know when they're hungry. So teaching them all those things, whatever their issues are, because not everybody has all the issues, thankfully, but whatever that particular child's issue is, they will be able to determine what it is. And to help the parents work with their children to help with these particular issues and also reduce, reduce their impact. That's very good to know. So that's the first thing that you want to do. If you don't do it as the first thing, you're going to be very, very sorry, and you're, you're, you're going to, uh, not benefit your child. And keep them in occupational therapy as long as you can afford it, or as the insurance is willing to pay for it, or the school district is willing to pay for it. The next thing is contact your school district and find out at what age they start evaluating and start doing— because they have pre-K, like pre-kindergarten— at what age you can enroll your child in pre-K. If the child has a lot of issues, like behavior issues, biting, scratching, if they're nonverbal, they'll need— if they're nonverbal by the age of 3, they'll need speech therapy. And then start reading books about parenting children with autism because they'll be very helpful. You won't feel alone. Because a lot of times you feel alone. Before COVID there were a lot of support groups, in-person support groups, that seems to have disintegrated. And people, you know, sometimes they do Zoom groups, sometimes not. So try to find support groups online for parents of autistic kids. It's better to have buddies like in your, you know, in your area where you can take— befriend the other parent and bring the children together so they can socialize with each other. Yeah. Because your child is going to have trouble socializing with other kids, and they won't enjoy being with other kids as much as they would with some, you know, another child with autism who gets them, who maybe has some issues but won't put them down, won't ignore them, you know, ignore them. They'll understand each other.

Uh, that's really great. Okay, thank you. So much good advice. So much good advice. I mean, you— I can't let you go yet because you worked with hyperactive kids and we didn't touch on that. I told you that we were going to talk about way too many topics. She's like, she's like, I'm exhausted, Rebecca. So you worked with hyperactive children. Parents do not know what strategies to use with them. Can you give them 1 or 2 strategies to help them?

Okay. So basically a lot of times parents don't recognize that their kids are hyperactive because many of the parents are hyperactive themselves. So it seems like normal behavior to them at home. Yeah. So if, you know, if, if your child is talking nonstop from morning to night, and never runs out of topics. Oh my goodness. And if they are, instead of hugging you, if they hang on you like you're playground equipment, that's, that's another thing. If they have a lot of trouble falling asleep, that's another sign. Some children will never sit down to eat. They just, you know, they'll come to the table, get something, and poof, they're off. They just act like they're spring-loaded. So that's the most obvious hyperactivity, and that's the one that the teachers, when the child goes to school, the teachers start insisting that the parents put them on medication because it makes the classroom hard, you know, to handle when you have one child that you're spending most of your time with. Trying to just keep them in their seat. Uh, you can't really teach a class that way. Um, so basically what, uh, what I recommend for parents is to try to teach your child how to be in a classroom situation. Train them at home to sit at a desk or something and do a puzzle or do some drawings do something that is more like schoolwork, you know, for kindergarten, and then time them. See, see how long it takes before they go poof and, you know, they're off running, and try to extend that time, you know. Work with them every day, maybe several times a day if they're really, really are really very active. And then keep it up until they go to school. Do, you know, get workbooks, get him used to sitting there and doing, you know, at the table and doing stuff at the desk or a little table that they have. And try to get a table that's their size. If at all possible, because schools are going to have tables that are their, you know, their size. Yeah. Remove, uh, any distractions from the area of the work, work table in the beginning. Later, as the child gets closer to going to school, start introducing distractions to help your child ignore the distractions. So one important thing that used to just happen naturally in the olden days, because people say, you know, there are so many hyperactive children when I was young, you know, grandparents, when I was young, there weren't all these hyperactive children. Well, when we were young, we walked to school. There was exercise. You didn't— yeah, your parents didn't stuff you in the car. Yeah. Drop you off at school. You had exercise. You had to walk to school. Exercise is so important. If you can walk your kids to school, do it. If not, make sure they have some form of exercise, even if it's running up and down the stairs or running around the house with a timer in your hand. Get them, you know, get some of the energy out of them because it also helps their mind. Not be speeding all the time. Besides all the energy that you see, the outer energy, part of the problem— their problem is the thoughts are going a million, you know, different thoughts are going and thoughts are changing all the time. It's really hard for them to hold on to thoughts. That exercise helps with that, helps to slow down the brain. So it's a lot of work for the parents, but it's really, really important. And it also teaches the child how to help themselves. And you teach the child, you know, you have to have exercise so your mind goes, you know, gets slowed down before they go to sleep. I knew a father who was hyperactive himself, and he would take his daughter before it was time for her bedtime He would stand over the timer and have her run up and down the street until she got tired to help her be able to sleep.

That's really good to know. That's really good. It's interesting because even for any human being, I feel like the busier we are all day, the better we sleep at night, right? If we've been sitting around all day not doing much, it's harder to go to sleep for sure. Yeah. So, I mean, I asked you so many questions. I'm sorry if I exhausted you. I love it. I had— I mean, you know, I could do this all day because I love all of these topics. But do you feel like there's something that I didn't cover that you want to cover before I let you go?

Child molesters. Oh, okay.

How do we prevent—

I mean, I talked about anxiety and depression. If a child had been molested, And the molester, it, you know, lives in a home and has easy access to the child. Or if the molester threatened a child that they're going to kill the child or their family, uh, then the child has all this trauma in their head, and but all you see is behaviors on the outside. And so it's really, really important for parents to know how to protect their children and how to talk to their children about telling— make sure you tell me no matter what if somebody's touching you and your private parts, or whatever word you use in your family for private parts. And you never allow somebody to touch you in a way that you don't want them to touch you. And I don't care if it's a teacher, if it's a priest, or if it's, you know, grandpa or whoever, babysitter. You have— you tell them no, and you have to tell me, you know, even if they try to scare you. So I have a chapter about child molesters in my book, which is really unusual for a parenting book, but I think it's really, really important because child molestation is a lot more common than people believe. Terrible.

So how do we prevent this from happening?

Okay, so you have to, uh, so one of the things that I have, uh, it, you know, one of the things that is really important is not to be naive about people. So if somebody is befriending you and, you know, if you're a single mom and, uh, somebody is being really friendly to you and they're really friendly to your kid and they want to take your kid out and they want to treat them to a movie or ice cream or something, watch out. Uh, I've known cases where child molesters married, uh, women just to get access to the children. Terrible. Uh, The other thing is to watch out for is in youth groups. Mm. You know, there have been big scandals about Boy Scouts, big scandals about in church groups, and they try to keep it quiet, but it's still, you know, it still got out. Uh, you know, several priests have been accused of molestation and, you know, switched to another parish or someplace else. So that's always a concern. So make sure that when you go to church, you know where your child is, and make sure, you know, if you have them go to Don't think that just because somebody goes to church they're a good person. Get your head— yeah, um, I've had a child molester tell me that he specifically picks, uh, church groups because the parents are so naive. Oh, good Lord.

Okay, that's— I mean, they're really strategic about that.

And then you have the internet. Yes, yes, mm-hmm.

That's a whole nother can of worms. Yeah. Oh my goodness.

Well, so if your child is showing any signs of being uncomfortable around somebody, you know, really pay attention to that, uh, and keep them away from that person. You can ask questions later, but don't yell at them that they don't want to be with Uncle, you know, sit in Uncle whatever's lap.

Yes, agree, agree. I also learned not to make your children hug.

Yeah, if they don't want to hug somebody, don't make them. Don't make them hug people if they don't want to hug people. Autistic kids don't like hugging anybody, period.

That is a good tip. I mean, you're full of them. You're full of so many tips. Can you leave us with one of your favorite parenting tips that we might not have covered?

Yeah, if you don't do everything according to the books that you've read, don't sweat it, don't worry, because every generation has their own way of doing parenting the correct way. Your kids will do it differently. And, uh, just chill, you know, regroup and try again.

I love it, I love it. Oh my goodness. Well, tell everyone where to find you and your book.

Okay, so are you going to put down my website, note it down someplace? Okay. Yes, yes. AJ, uh, are AJ Rogers Books. Okay. And I'm on Amazon. The name of the book is— I'll show you the COVID Usually people are better at looking at pictures. It's beautiful. There you go, there's a cover.

Your Journey to Successful Parenting.

Yeah, I'm trying really hard to get my book into libraries even though it's not money maker for me because a lot of people Parents can't afford to buy books. Yes. And so I'm trying to get it on Hoopla and all these, all these places.

Well, I cannot thank you enough for spending so much time with me and for teaching us so many wonderful tips, pointers, educating us. It's been my pleasure. This is Rebecca Green, and I want to remind everyone to spend every day laughing, learning, and loving. Thank you for tuning in to the Winey Palooza podcast. If you like what you heard, Please be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode. While you are there, leave a review. I love to hear your feedback. Thank you so much for listening. Until next time.

This show has been produced by Market Domination LLC. To discover how you can have your own show completely done for you and turn it into a real published book and become the authority in your marketplace, go to www.marketdominationllc.com/podcastoffer.