Mastering Media Relations: Strategies for Brand Success with Priya Dua

Good morning, everybody. Through technical difficulties and not full cups of coffee being drank yet, we are here. Uh, it is Drink Up. On this Saturday, April 25th, we got myself, Adam Smith. We got, uh, Sam Anderson as always. And this morning we have with us Priya Dua from Archive PR. Before we get into it, we'll give the shoutouts as we do. Sam, where's the obligatory Jay Williams Freebird?

Yeah, this guy here. Uh, interesting story. You see the name Freebird? What song does that come from?

Isn't that a song? Freebird?

Song Freebird, Lynyrd Skynyrd. They didn't trademark this though. Guess who owns Freebird is Jay Williams, and it's a water, which just is the most amazing Amazing story. Jay, I'm out of product, man. I need more.

Send it over. This is the only way I can get free water, by the way.

What's not free? I learned all of today talking about Freebird.

There you go. This podcast was all a ploy to get Sam free canned water and it's working beautifully.

That's right.

So we have Jay, we have obviously Sam and Alicia with Bev Assets and Frontline, and we have myself and Alias Advising, and then we have Mr. Halliman and On the Rocks. Yeah, we could spend a lot of time.

Yeah, we, we, so a little bit about that too. So Adam from Alias Advising, if you think about everything operations, like if you want to get like formulation things in the can, get it on the line and get it going and growing, that's what happens. And then Ryan has a big community within his rocks, a lot of people that can plug in, but I think Ryan's more of like logistics, right? And stuff. Is that his like kind of a big deal or?

Yeah, I would say, you know, it's funny, Ryan and I both do operations. Our Venn diagrams overlap really well. So for him personally, the sharpest point of his stick, if you will, is procurement. Right. Whereas, so supply chain purchase orders, getting the best price, making sure you have proper agreements, forecasting, like that's— I do it, he does it better. Whereas my end of it is kind of formula management, right? Understanding the nuts and bolts of the liquid, not being the chemist, but kind of talking like one. And then actually, Priya, it'd be great to put you in touch with him because Ryan's LLC is structured in such a way that like, for example, if somebody came to us and said, And they do, came to us and said, hey, we want operational help, but also like, I need a website. I need to know who the fuck my customer is. Like, I need to know where to reach them and what happens then. Right.

All very important.

Right. The whole idea is in— dog's chewing on things over here. Um, the whole idea is that if it's useful, 'cause sometimes it is and sometimes it isn't depending on the size of the client, but that we can kind of lump all that in under one contract. So in the case that they say, hey, We want operational help. We'd also like feet on the street services. Great. Ryan will write you one agreement that includes my services and Sam's and so on. And you get the idea.

Yeah. So it's a community. So welcome to it. But no, Adam, you're gonna be surprised what I'm about to offer here. When this show publishes on Apple iTunes and YouTube and Spotify, if you like and share the, and send your email to us, you'll go into a drawing where you can get $3,000 worth of free services. Uh, and if Adam wants to step up and participate in it, he can. So we're going to start, uh, if you come in and watch our show, we're going to provide that. So enough with that. This is about you. It's not about us, but we got to do a better job. And maybe, Priya, you can help us figure out how we do that because we've been rolling for about 4 years and we go live, raw, and real. And so welcome. I know I got the pleasure of meeting you. Sorry for computer problems this morning. Adam definitely bailed me out, which was great, but we're excited to talk to you. Now you're coming to us from where?

I'm in Southern California, Orange County area. Yeah.

It's early there.

It's so gray outside. I'm so just sad. I thought it would be a beautiful sunny day. I was hoping to share some sunlight with y'all, but no, not happening.

Yeah. Yeah.

No, it's great here too. You've got them all talking for a while. Um, so, uh, I'm gonna let you know. So how did, how did you were talking before we hit live, how you found us? How did you find us?

Yeah. So, um, one of my interns, she was doing some research on some beverage podcasts, food and beverage, because one of our clients as a food and beverage ingredient manufacturer. And she came upon this one and knowing that we are becoming much more entrenched in both the food and the beverage industries, and she knows my passion, she thought, all right, you know what? I'll reach out and see if they might like Priya. And I'm just so happy, Sam, that you responded. It was quite a nice surprise. And, you know, I bought her some lunch for her, for her hard work.

We should buy her lunch, Sam.

Yeah. Right.

We should talk.

Well, my dad lives in Southern California, so I don't know if you're into San Diego or Los Angeles. I can't remember.

I'm in like Southern Orange County, like really close to San Diego, I would say. Both.

Yeah. There you go. So we'll have to, I owe a lot of people visits. Adam and I have a few friends out there that we need to come see, but we're excited to have you. So tell us a little bit. I did some research, you know, obviously we talked. You know, you're, you're a couple decades worth of, uh, work out there in terms of what you've, um, achieved. You know, I'm interested in getting into, you know, some conversations. Uh, one of the things, uh, that I've been thinking about today is stop selling and start providing solutions.

Yeah.

And I would think, uh, an organization like you could do that. So maybe tell us a little bit about what you're currently doing and where it is you're, you wanna go and what the things you're doing in order to get there and how you help brands.

Yeah. So, in terms of the agency itself, you know, we're just working very hard to continue to provide service to our customers or our clients that really kind of move past just your traditional service offerings. You know, we do our media relations, we do speaking opportunities, all of that good stuff. But, you know, maybe this is my Midwest roots, I'm not sure. But, um, on my end, I, I feel that, um, relationship building has become kind of a lost art. It's kind of dying out. We've become so separated from one another just based on the way the world works now. Technology Love it. Beautiful. We all need it, but we're starting to kind of lose that person-to-person, um, relationship. So as a team—

That's why we go live, raw, and real, by the way. And we didn't warn you, by the way. And I cheated because I said, you know, Adam was going to take control of the helm and I've just come in crazy. But think of me as the pitcher today and Adam is the thinker and we're going to spit some zingers at you. And if you go along, we'll probably come in and interrupt you as well. So we'll see if you're cool. All right.

I'll do my best, guys. I'll do my best. Uh, but then, uh, in terms of helping brands, um, you know, what we try to do is kind of take those, those specific, um, you know, solutions that all agencies provide and make sure that it becomes more than just, you know, phone call here and there. I'm here to text, to talk, anything they want. I've dog-sitted, if that's not the weirdest thing in the entire world you've heard. It's really here to just help everyone out. At the end of the day, I think that the client-agency relationship, we're all just people at the end of the day. We're all trying to achieve our goals.

Yeah.

to make exciting things happen. And hopefully that at the agency, our person-to-person feel is actually resonating quite well. People seem to really enjoy working with us and the team. So hopefully that answers your question. And if I start to talk too much, just tell me to be quiet. I haven't had enough coffee yet, but, you know.

No, that's, uh, that's perfectly fine. Uh, one of the things that is, you know, you grew up in Fortune 500. It looks like you've done some startups, B2B, B2C. You know, what's, what's your favorite Fortune 500, B2B, B2C, um, having your own entity? Where, where do you sit today on that spectrum?

I have to say my own business, my own business. You know, I, I think growing up in the agency environment, you know, you're a 20-something, you have endless amounts of energy. It's exciting, you know? And then I moved into, you know, in-house as I got into my 30s and that was fine. But now I'm in my 40s and frankly, I just don't want people, people to tell me how to run, run my career. I feel like I know enough now to be more effective. In that kind of position. In terms of the type of industry, you know, I did grow up in the B2B world and I was very, I felt very safe in the B2B space.

Yeah.

But now B2C has become much more part of my life, especially in these particular industries. And there's been a whole new excitement there that, um, you know, I think maybe was lost over the years. So I feel kind of reborn in a sense.

Yeah.

Yeah. It's funny. So did you become an entrepreneur because you wanted to, or did you become one because you had to?

I wanted to, you know, over the years I've always done kind of like a side work, side gig in addition to my agency jobs. It just, it just didn't, it needed to happen for some reason. And then, um, I think maybe it was 2 years ago I decided, all right, enough of this. I've been freelancing, I've been working here and there. It's time to just, what did my, my friend say? To cut the boat, cut the tie. Anyway, I'm on the island. I'm on the island by myself now.

And, um, burn the boat.

I burned the boat.

You got it.

That's the one. Burned the boat.

Yeah.

I think scared me when, when she said that, I thought, wow, that's a, that's a huge way to say it. But yeah, so I made the choice. Here I am. And very happy.

What, what is it that you like about being a founder in your own business? What's the, what's, what do you like about it?

I think it's the feeling that I'm able to control the creative process of the agency, being able to, you know, think a little bit more strategically about what kind of client makes sense for the goals we're trying to achieve. And when you're an an agency, you kind of have to be put on the accounts that you're put on. And if you don't believe in the product, too bad, so sad. That's just the way it works. But having your own agency, you get to really think through, is this client someone that I feel I can have a longstanding relationship with? Can I help them get where they want to go? That kind of thing.

So you get to choose who you work with too, right?

Yeah, absolutely.

Absolutely.

You know, I mean, that's the one thing I like. What is it that you don't like about being, having your own business?

I do think sometimes I get not, not attached, but I'm a people person. I'm a Midwest gal. I, I'm used to just trying to get along, everybody get along. So sometimes, although I think I'm a savvy business person, I do have a tendency to just get a little, I don't know, maybe I'm a little too friendly. Maybe I'm a little too— does that kind of make sense? I don't know what kind of vibe you're getting from me, but, um, it's kind of, I don't know, maybe a little Pollyanna of me.

Yeah, no, I hear you. I mean, I'm learning. I've been, I've been doing this for 4 years. My partner, Alicia Vargo, was, you know, 2 decades in as an entrepreneur and my other partner, I think he has a couple decades as well. So I'm learning every day, but, uh, I didn't do like you did. I became an entrepreneur because I had to, I had to make a choice to put food on the table or not put food on the table. And, uh, now I'm happy that I was forced over the ledge to go dive into this thing and do it.

Mm-hmm.

But what bugs me about it is, uh, what I love about it is I get to go for a dog walk when I wanna go for a dog walk.

Yes.

Right.

I love that. But what I don't like about it is I feel like if I don't like continue to like network and work, you know, the income does not come in because the only person that's going to keep the lights on are the people that own the business. And it's nothing against the people that work with us, but at the end of the day, we own the P&L pro forma and income statement. And we, you know, when we bring— we are the business. So that's the next That's the next, I guess, role I'm trying to figure out is move the business where it can operate without me.

Yeah.

Yeah. Totally.

Yeah. A well-oiled machine.

Right. Like, and I'm not sure how to do that just yet. So, uh, learning. But with that, so, um, a couple things. I wanna ask you about this. I'm gonna throw some questions at you.

Boy.

And, and by the way, we always ask you too, if there's things we don't cover that you wanna cover, we can cover. All right. And then, um, Adam, maybe you can, you can kind of get the vibe of what I'm doing, but I actually posted this on LinkedIn last night. What I wanna get into is, um, can you tell us like why most brands' stories are just noise?

That's a great question. I think, and this, this might be kind of pointed and may— maybe not totally fair, but I do think too often—

Hey, bring it on, man. This, we're, hey, when Adam starts getting in, the juices are gonna start flowing.

You know, it, it's, it's like I'm bringing this, this is just from my experience. I feel like too often the C-suite has a specific idea of what a good story looks like, what a good brand story is for their particular company, when they don't necessarily understand what a story should be, what it should look like, and how it would speak to existing customers and potential customers. So, not to say that CEOs don't know, but some of them just don't understand. They don't know how it works. So, you have—

Isn't the C-suite the most dysfunctional, um, part of the business?

I just, yeah. And I think that's why one great thing about having your own business is you get to be your own CEO. But I think that's such a huge problem. There's a little bit of an ego situation. They want things to go the way they want, which I get. They're in charge of a huge organization or whatever size they are, but you gotta leave the expertise to the experts. You know, you, you gotta be strategic about the stories you tell and make sure they align well with overall objectives. And I think That's a huge problem nowadays. I don't know if you've seen that, but for me, that was a huge frustration in my career. Just like, listen to us, listen to me. We know what's best for this kind of thing.

So what does your agency do in order to solve for that? If you're working with a client and, uh, their brand stories are not just noise, how do you, how do you course correct 'em to get 'em on track? Yeah.

So in the initial conversations we have, we really do kind of go through an audit, nothing too intensive. You know, we'll do a competitor audit, that kind of thing. You know, that's a little bit more technical, but We do have that initial call, talk through what we've seen and where we can see improvement. So it's not necessarily a, you're doing this wrong. It's, you're doing this in a certain way, but this is how we can solve for it. This is how we can help you. So then that conversation becomes one that's more of a partnership and one of being proactive and making good things happen. Tough conversations to have. You know, I've, I've actually had potential business with some companies where the CEO just would not listen and was not willing to bend to our expertise, and we've not been able to actually work with them. We've turned them away. Because at that end, you know, everyone's just gonna fail. We, we aren't gonna be set up for success on either end. So that's definitely a struggle.

But, how do you identify your CEO? And Adam, come in, man. I'm just gonna keep on going here, but go. Like, so you, you said because of the CEO, uh, when I look at CEOs, or I call 'em founders, we, we work from, you know, different stage brands at different stages.

Yeah.

Sometimes the CEO's an attorney.

Yeah.

And they think like an attorney. Sometimes a CEO is a salesperson and they think like a salesperson. And sometimes a CEO is like a finance person. They think like finance. Do you kind of do that in terms of how you kind of talk to them? Yeah.

Yeah. I have had some interesting situations where CEOs are folks who probably shouldn't have been. And so you do kind of have to have a moment where you think through, okay, this is where this person is coming from. You have to be a little bit gentle. Maybe hold hand a little bit, but it's always important not to come across as threatening, especially when it's folks like these who don't have the education.

You're not gonna tell 'em their baby's ugly?

I have pretended that someone's dog was adorable when it was absolutely not cute, but that's okay. We do what we have to do.

All right, Adam, you ready?

But, um, yeah, you just gotta think about it from, this is their mindset. I'm here to help. I'm not here to make them feel bad. They know what they're doing. They just, we gotta ease into it. So it takes time, but you get there.

Gotcha. Adam, I know you're thinking here, so bring 'em on, man.

That face.

I'm a little worried.

Yeah.

You guys talk me up so much. I'm nervous. I mean, really, my, my question I wanna start with is, is a much simpler version of something Sam kind of asked, and that's, I think people tend to conflate Um, and this goes all the way back to school, but they, they tend to conflate sales and marketing and advertising, especially in the early days of a company when maybe money's a little bit tighter or people can't wear each hat individually. They all kind of just meld into one amorphous blob and it's not the best, right?

Yeah, true.

And so, I think my first question for you is like, how do you help, like, and Sam knows this, I work with a lot of first-time I mean this in the nicest way, founder is too kind a word, right? Like, they're people with an idea who think they might become a founder, right? Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

And so, for folks kind of in that stage, you know, big or small, how do you help explain to them or, or just set the precedent or the expectation of like, hey, marketing is this thing, sales is this thing, right? Does that make sense?

Yeah, it does. It absolutely does. So, what we've typically done is we go in with, I guess, use cases, you know, similar business models, Maybe folks in a similar industry, this kind of business organization, this kind of layout, and then kind of use that as a model, you know, based on what this, this company is doing and the success they've had, you know, this is kind of how we're leveraging these different kinds of folks for, you know, achieving XYZ, especially when it comes to things like marketing. If you have a proof point or some kind of example that you can share that resonates with them, that really helps. Does that make sense? I hope I'm answering your question.

Sort of. Can you give me an example?

Okay. Okay. An example of the—

Yeah. A use case, like something that you've actually gone through. You've talked to a client and you had to walk them through that.

Yes. Yes. So I had a, let's see, it was a healthcare, a digital healthcare company. They did EHR records and they had a very sporadic staff, a lot of, and they were a small company, so they had people kind of mushed into different categories. Sales and marketing, you probably find a lot of people are just kind of smushed into the sales and marketing category. So we really just sat down. We had worked with another company, not in the digital health space, but someone with the same size and a similar structure, and just said, you know, these are the kinds of people that we worked with at this company. So-and-so had this particular role, and I see that you have something similar here. However, we found that by utilizing this portion for marketing this way, you know, kind of breaking, slicing and dicing in this way was actually quite beneficial for them. Is this something you'd be open to considering? And then by kind of having that just initial conversation, gentle conversation, they were open to learning a little bit more about how, you know, they can be separated, how things can work, and how we can partner with one another so that everyone is successful. It's always unfortunate. I feel so bad when sales and marketing folks get lumped together because I feel like sales especially doesn't have as nearly as much knowledge as they should have to honestly about marketing. And it'd be good for them to know more about marketing, of course, but I feel like they're given so much expectation in terms of understanding things like marketing and branding and such. So, um, yeah, it's just those gentle conversations, you know? Um, people don't wanna be told they're doing something wrong and that a structure's wrong. They wanna know that, and they want proof points. They wanna get some sort of example from you. So, um, hope that's a good example for you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, so, and this is something I have to remind even myself on The ops end of it is, isn't the whole point of why we have a job, the royal we on this call, that people are doing something wrong or they're not doing it at all, right? Like, it's one of those two, right? Like, that's what we're getting paid for.

That's true.

That's true.

They're paying for knowledge.

Well, yes, and, and this is, this is my question, right?

Okay.

I know you guys have all dealt with this, but, you know, you'll come in and, can I make this concise? You'll come in and you'll say, hey, based on what I'm seeing, you know, in my expertise and experience and give all the reasons and the supporting data and so on, we need to proceed this way. And then whether it's big brand, small brand, whatever, somebody go, yeah, I don't like that. Pick another one. You're like, no, that's not what I'm here for. Right? Like, so how do you, like, I know how I approach it from an ops perspective, but I'm curious from a marketing or a PR perspective.

Mm-hmm.

Because it's a little more, you know, the reason I like ops is because a lot of times it's very black and white. Like, well, I don't want to do that. Okay.

Yeah.

You can do the other thing, but it costs this much more and it's gonna take this much longer and you can pick your poison. I don't give a shit. Right? Huge choice.

Yeah.

And so for you where the PR world is, I assume a little more fluid in terms of, yeah, you could take that approach and here's how we think it might turn out. But obviously like, yes, there's a lot at play cuz it's a little more of a conversation than it is just numbers on a spreadsheet. Right.

Yeah. Yeah.

How do those conversations go when you've got, you know, somebody that's like, yeah, I don't wanna do that even though I'm paying you to tell me to do that. Right. Mm-hmm.

Yeah. No, that's a tough conversation. And I have to say that from a PR standpoint, you gotta have a lot of patience. And I know having that PR understanding, there, there definitely takes a, it's a lot more than the black and white approach of, okay, you know, that's, that's too bad. Right.

Mm-hmm.

That's when you come in with some alternatives. Um, maybe some, something similar. You, I think that it, it is very much like handling children sometimes. You gotta kind of—

Oh, right.

You got, and you gotta do the, the whole make them feel like it was their idea kind of thing. There's a lot of psychology behind that. Um, but honestly, at the end of the day, if there is no way to get through it and this is a new client, then we just, we just can't work with them. I mean, if, if, if it comes down to it and they're not willing to be flexible, I don't wanna invest my time and the time of my employees to where we're all just failing. No one feels good about that. No one wins in the end. So, um, you know.

Yeah.

So the worst client to have is if they're absent and they're not involved. Is that what you're saying?

Yeah. That's also really hard. That's really challenging because it is a collaborative, it, it's a collaborative environment, especially with things like PR. You have to work together. I mean, I know everyone says this and it's so trite, but We consider ourselves an extension of a client. I'm sure we've all heard that, right? But that's truly what it has to be in order to be successful. The collaboration has to be strong and the willingness to participate on the client's end has to be there. A former client I had, I, and I know she was so overwhelmed and I feel terrible because they were a startup, brand new, trying to get through it, you know, and she was such a smart woman, so strong, but she really had a hard time Putting herself into that collaborative mindset. And with that, you know, you just, it's just not gonna work. And I think that she learned her lesson. Maybe over time she will, you know, come to better realize that. But, um, just collaboration is so crucial for this. Absolutely.

So if I could step back a little bit, I don't know if we covered it. Your agency, what is the main thing you do or what are the services that you offer? And then I have a question, uh, to follow up on that.

Okay.

So there are quite a few services. Media relations is obviously one of the biggest things that we do. It's just kind of the, the historical critical nature of PR. And we do a lot of speaking opportunities, um, event management, event coordination. Social media, of course, is huge for everyone now. If, if you don't do that in a PR agency, you're, I mean, who are you? What are you doing? We do that, awards. We do reputation man— uh, crisis management as well. Um, you know, I think that's one thing that I really like about the agency is we are made up of a lot of different specialties.

Can't you turn crisis into opportunity?

You can, you really can. But can I just say, no, When people say any PR is win, what is it?

Any PR is good PR. Any bad, bad.

The biggest lie ever. I'm so sick and tired of people saying that. That is not true. I fully disagree 100%. Um, gosh, that's so frustrating. Um, I don't even know where I was going with that. I just had a moment.

Well, you were just talking about your services, right? So you were going through the services and, um, so what is the main service you offer? Is there a main service or is it just, uh, is it like almost like, uh, as Alicia says, is it a cafeteria style thing? I arrive to you and I say, Priya, I have this business and I want to do some speaking engagements. I also think I have a crisis problem over here. I mean, do you basically do your intake and is that just defined or is it just like, can I just plug and play where I want to plug and play?

Typically media relations is going to be the biggest service I would provide. It's like most people want, which is probably why it's, it's, you know, kind of become that way. What is media?

What's media relations?

I know it's kind of a, a vague term. It's basically engagement with all types of media, whether it's broadcast, podcasts. I mean, I guess you would fall into broadcast as well. Um, print media, online, all of those folks who would potentially—

So we need your, uh, uh, Adam, we need her services for Drink Up.

Come get me. I'm here. But are you open to ideas? Now that's my question.

1,000%. That's why we do this on every Saturday morning. We have 400 hours of of content that all these ideas, we, it's amazing the stuff I've grown so much from this, all seriousness.

Mm-hmm.

I'm smart enough to know this is that I know there's much smarter people than I am, and I know what I don't know, and I want to learn more. And just having these conversations every Saturday, Adam, I don't know if you'd agree, but the things I've learned along the way, it's amazing from where we've been 4 years ago. Yeah.

I can only imagine the types of folks you've had. I mean, I was taking a list to look at some of the podcasts you've had the past episodes, and you've spoken with a lot of different types of people. It's amazing. Has there been a favorite? I guess I shouldn't be asking questions, but—

No, you know, I think they all are good. I mean, Adam can give his take. I mean, you know, I just had, it just comes to mind. I don't know if there's like a favorite, but I had Jayla Siciliano on. I don't know if that Wednesday or Thursday, Adam, but she was on Shark Tank. And she also, Mark Cuban was her partner for 10 years and she had a beverage brand and I was on her podcast.

Oh, very cool.

And we kind of continued the discussion on my podcast. And then, uh, you know, I've had, uh, a guy just recently, uh, Dan Levison, uh, which is a founder of Vible, uh, Teas. Or the guy that from G4, Sean Miller. Oh, I remember Sean Miller. The first thing Sean Miller's told us is, um, you know, some of the, some ex, you know, stuff in front of the face, but Sean is like, Hey, distribution is basically, you have to pay the toll to get over the bridge, and that's the toll in order to get your product to market. Yeah. The guy says one of the hottest, uh, tequila brands, but there's just so many friends that we've made from this and learning. I'd encourage you and others to actually go check those things out. But yeah, I don't know if I really have a favorite. Adam, thoughts on that?

Yeah, we've talked to a lot of really cool people. I think you like Adam Kalanine from Bottle Keeper I'm gonna say Adam Kalanick was a super cool one. Um, was it Dan from Digit was cool.

Yeah.

He and I still keep in touch. Don't—

is that the guy that said, don't be the buffalo or be the buffalo? Yeah. It was Dan from Digit.

My phone's in the other room, but shit, the gentleman in New York, I feel so bad. I'm blanking on his name. He texted me and I gotta get a catch-up call set up with him. But yeah, I mean, it's, it's to answer the question, it's kind of been those people who have seen Regardless of their industry, who have seen kind of the front to back of it and can say like, you know, yeah, this is like, here are all the fuckups I made. Don't repeat. Go.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I mean, there's just things, uh, Priya, you're going to say things to me that I'll use and hopefully I always go back and listen to these podcasts. Like I'm thinking about Mike Levinson. Mike does like, he calls on Like, uh, like the food, uh, quick service food service and all that.

Yeah.

But he used the term, said, you know, everybody wants to play in the ocean, go play in the rivers and streams. Wow. I've never heard that.

Right.

So things like those little things just stick. Or like Adam Kalanine, I mean, his Bottle Keepers is basically a bottle where you could actually keep it cold. Him and his wife hit on a Facebook post, and this like relates to you in terms of like media relations.

Yeah.

Like they did a Facebook post and it went viral.

Wow.

I think it was the number one Shark Tank episode, right, uh, Adam? Something like that. Mm-hmm. In terms of what it was. But if you think about like when you're doing like your media relations, that's why maybe we get into this. Like you have this, this, this brand or this personality and you bring 'em to market. Like how do you put a person in position to get, and it's no guarantee to like, you get that one post, one post can take you viral.

It's true.

Yeah.

Yeah. That's bananas when that happens. It's pretty astonishing for sure. And that's amazing for them. I'm going to have to check out this post because I need to know what this is all about. Because I want to find a way to replicate that in some capacity. Yeah.

Go back. So if you can find us on Apple iTunes or Spotify, uh, and you can, there's a bunch of episodes. We're a little bit behind, um, in terms of, uh, posting the most recent ones.

Okay. Awesome.

So, all right. We got dead silence there. Um, that was my fault. We'll cut that out.

Yeah.

The whole bit, but, um, you guys hear me? Uh, go ahead, Adam.

I was just gonna say, um, so Archive, I think, shit, I had it up. Uh, tell us about just the agency and like, is it you and the whispers in the hallway? Like you mentioned you had an intern, you know, how many people are on this team? Who does, how did you grow from just, I mean, did you start with a team? Did you start doing it yourself and expand from there?

Yeah. So there are 4 of us, including myself. I like to say we're 4. We're 4 very scrappy, hardworking individuals. Yes. One intern, myself, and then 2, 2 individuals who work for me as well. In terms of what we do, one of those people or one of those individuals, she is just amazing at media relations. So she's like our, our big picture. The other folks, we have the other individual, um, he is amazing at thought leadership. So he does a lot of the awards and speaking opportunities. He does a ton of the writing, which is great. So they, they're the perfect balance for us. Dani is just all about administrative. She's incredibly organized, which is very helpful with PR can be crazy messy. So, um, she's great. And then there's, you know, me being me, doing new business, trying to keep us all afloat and just, you know, keep things moving. I didn't start out with a team. It actually all happened rather quickly. I had been a freelancer for another, another agency, agency, just kind of doing my thing, but then decided, you know what, I kind of want to just do my own thing. work with some other folks. 2 of those clients that had worked with her decided to leave, and then they contacted me forever later and said, hey, you know, we actually are in the market for an agency. Saw that you're now working on your own, you know, would you be willing to work with us? So that's kind of how it really began, just that initial relationship prior. And then from there, things just kind of built naturally. Um, and so that's kind of where we are today.

Yeah.

And I don't think we'll, I think we're good now in terms of growth. I mean, if we get more companies on board, I mean, great. But I think that we are, we're working in a good capacity. I don't wanna grow too much until I feel like we are as stable as possible. You know what I mean?

I'm curious on growth. Uh, I'm gonna throw it out there. Are you using AI at all to help, uh, leverage your business?

I honestly don't use AI that much. And I, I, I've actually just started taking on tools for more automation of the business itself. Right. I do think that's really important. You know, I'll use like AI for our content development for internal purposes, but I know a lot of people use AI for content development externally. That is something that I am firmly against, firmly against. Everything that we write at the agency is fully human written. I suppose we could go to AI for an idea, for, you know, research points, but that's something that's very, very important to me. All content is fully original, no AI support. So, yeah.

I, I, I love that. You know, it was funny cuz I grew up, I mean, I'm 61. I'll just put my age out there. So when I was in college, you could not graduate from English Lit 200 or 100 without writing a full essay of 500 words. And you had to be grammatically correct. You had to write with a number 2 pencil on a blue book.

Yes, I remember those.

You had one misspelling, one miscomma, one grammatical error, you flunked the class. Didn't matter what you did the whole semester in that class.

Yeah.

They would give you a statement and you'd have to develop a thesis from that statement, do your, you know, your, um, you know, your body, you know, the whole bit and conclusion and everything had to tie out too, right?

Yeah.

And it was written. Today, I mean, you can write a whole book. You can go into ChatGPT and say, here's my life, write the book. My fear is, I love AI. I'm a big AI advocate, big in robotics, big in AI. My fear is though, you're going to lose the critical thinking.

Yeah, 100%. 100%. And I feel like the content that's created, even though it might be grammatically correct or, you know, it, and it does read well in most cases, there is still that human element that I feel like just cannot be captured. The emotion that you feel from something that's creatively written, that's human generated, that AI just cannot capture, in my opinion, at least in my use.

Well, no, the reason we go live, raw, and real here Is exactly that, is because you don't know what's happening. One of my favorite episodes is, was with, um, Samantha Skyring out of South Africa. And she has, uh, Kalahari salt and it's salt that comes from the Kalahari Desert. And I don't know, Adam, I don't think you made that. I don't think you made that podcast.

It's funny.

There's a trend here. My favorite podcast, Adam's not on. I'm sorry, Adam. I'm just kidding. Anyway, so we're, we're having this podcast, right? So she's in South Africa. Lord knows, I don't know what time it was.

Yeah.

And she had like her sock behind her and she's in Whole Foods, the whole bit, right? These are people you can meet. These people you can probably do work with.

Yeah.

Anyway, she starts going, cacao, cacao, cacao. Why are you going cacao, right? And that's why I love going live. And she like, I'm like, what are you doing? She goes, I'm calling my son. That is our how to communicate. She wanted to have him bring something, but they do like a cacao call. Which is, I guess, a bird in South Africa.

Yeah.

Yeah.

The other kind of outtakes or whatever, Adam's traveling in Arizona, and he's out— I don't know where you were at, Adam, or you were in Nevada or Arizona. I don't know. You were traveling somewhere. But he kept on coming in and out of the episode because of the bandwidth. But that's what makes it fun. I mean, and real and raw, right? I think people are, I do agree. I think people are looking for like the, uh, that you, right? I mean, we use like, we use, um, Claude Coworker. We use, uh, Claude Code. We have AI agents running in the back to identify like tasks. Like we wanna know every liquor license in the US. Now I don't do that. Our partners at Ruby Pro Software do. Mm-hmm. They capture this, but they do a really good job. They use the power of tech.

Mm-hmm.

To get to information.

Yes.

My fear is, is that people are not like looking at that information and validating it and they're just basically taking it and saying, here it is, go look at this.

Yeah. Yeah. Agreed. Agreed. It becomes a situation where people are just too comfortable not doing enough. People just get really comfortable not being lazy exactly, but just being like, okay, yeah, yeah, we'll go ahead and just say that that's correct. Everything's fine there. It's, it's definitely easier to just check that box, but definitely not the smartest move per se.

So I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna keep on going here a little bit on your agency. media campaigns that don't just look pretty, they convert. Can you give us some examples of some campaigns that you've created that actually work? So you're here handwriting them, you're not using AI. So you have to have some great examples here. Yeah.

So I think a particular campaign that really stands out for me involves a current client that I have who's in the energy efficiency space. Clearly the issue with energy efficiency or not even energy efficiency, Energy consumption is ridiculous. The cost for energy is out of control. And so what he did was he did it this very interesting— we did a, a campaign that focused on different regions of the US that are particularly really dealing with high energy costs kind of throughout the nation. And we did special spots for each one of them. We did an SMT for them. We would do a specific dedicated landing page, a webpage for their particular area. We did almost like little packages, media, web, blog posts, all dedicated to these specific areas within the US that really needed the support of us.

So I said 3 things, media, web, and blog posts.

Yes. Yes. Apologies. I just ran over there. Yeah. So obviously we wanted to have media to support, but I think content of course is essential as well. People like to digest information in different ways and blog content is still quite popular, even though we're very visual now. So that's something to consider, but we would take those different pieces across these different hubs in the US and then communicate the need for these kinds of technologies to ensure that energy efficiency improves and costs go down for users. So we've found that to be really, really helpful in terms of sales, and we're trying to take it global now at this point. That's a whole other ballgame.

This is how you create demand though. So we always talk about demand and velocity, Adam, and what you just shared from a beverage standpoint. Again, what does it say? Media, blog posts, and what was the third one?

Web.

Web. So if you did that media, blog posts, and web approach, because when someone arrives at my desk and what I do, I'm a commercial guy. Alicia and I, we're like, hey, you know, we do other things in Bev Access, but frontline, our reps are going into bars, restaurants, packaged liquor stores, grocery stores, and they're gonna go sell a physical thing like Freebird.

Freebird.

Yes.

We can go push it.

Yeah.

But I do think, and I was challenged by someone and I think he was absolutely right. 'Cause I was like, go out in the wild. And he's like, hey, I respect you. That's great. But digital is a big part of it too.

Yeah.

And, uh, and, uh, you know, that was a, a great call out to me. So I've been thinking is you create the demand before I ever even arrive at the store. Is that correct?

Yes. That's the whole point there. Absolutely. Get them excited. And then they also realize that they actually do need it. They may not even know they need it and then they do. And then they, they go ahead and make that purchasing decision. Of course, wish it was that easy, that it was just, you know, takes some time obviously. But yeah, you create that, that demand in advance and then people just fall right in and expect.

Well, everybody's saying is you, before you get distribution, distribution, you should have demand.

Yeah, absolutely.

Right. So do you help, like when you're, you know, just put your head in a frame of a, a beverage brand, if you don't mind.

Yeah.

Because I think it all probably, it could be a widget, it could be, it could be energy, it could be a person or whatever. I get that. But Have I, um, the biggest, hardest part for any brand is to get distribution.

Yes.

It is.

Yes.

It's just, and it's the longest part. The, the second hardest part is once you get distribution, I call it foundation building.

Mm-hmm.

That's the slowest part.

Yeah.

Right.

Absolutely.

You know, if you can get from foundation to the, um, actual, um, growth phase, Mm-hmm. it starts to get easier.

Yeah.

So with your agency, how do you, so when you're thinking about, I'm, I'm trying to create this demand. And I wanna build my foundation. What are the steps? Maybe give us a, you know, like the 3 to 5 steps that a brand has to do and how your agency brings that to life. Or you just want people to know this is what you need to do.

So in terms of steps, um, when engaging with a, a beverage brand, well, I have a, an example, I suppose. I was working with a beer brand, um, who didn't have a distributor at that point. So I would say the first step is to, obviously you have to have everything in place, be ready to go. Um, you start reaching out to, I think I think target trade publications are a good way to go. Folks who are the key decision makers for distributors and such, who learn about the product, get excited, and then they start those conversations. If media coverage results from conversation, that's something they can bring to the table when they go out and have conversations with potential distributors. They've got that credibility backing them. Media relations is so crucial in that way because it does build that credibility and that excitement.

Should you do that before distribution, after distribution, during distribution, or all?

You need it all the time, all day long, truly. It's, it's just, it has to, it's a, it's a wheel. It's an ongoing wheel. But having that in the background, at least to start, has been very helpful. I think this particular brand was pitching Walmart and having had this kind of exposure already in place was huge for them. And now they're, they're in Walmart, they're in Buc-ee's, they're in multiple large, you know, stores. Then they've been very successful.

And that media, so that getting that exposure, because we, um, Alicia, this is kind of Alicia's wheelhouse. When we talk to clients, they'll talk about like a media announcement or whatever, and she'll review it. And, uh, is that, is that, is there an easy path to like, if you're like, you're rolling out something new, is there, is there, is it a costly way to get your name out there through media or is there a way to do it that's not as costly or is there just a whole strategy behind it?

I think it's really just strategy taking, you know, utilizing an agency to create almost a pathway is probably the best way to go. You wanna have a formal launch, like a press release. We don't rely solely on press releases, but you wanna announce it to the public. Then you wanna talk about iterations. You wanna talk about new markets. You wanna show the pathway to get to where you are, and you wanna announce that to the media and just keep it going, keep the wheel moving. And as that progresses, then, you know, you continue to take I hope I answered the question with that. I kind of went off on a little bit of a tangent.

No, no, it's fine. I also wanna slow down a little bit cuz, you know, with the last few minutes, um, a couple people that have been in the audience, uh, Duncan owns Firebelly Agency and he wanted to actually see this episode today. And I'll connect you up with Duncan cuz he actually has a podcast.

Awesome.

Yes.

That'd be great.

So a lot of our people in our audience have podcasts like BrandArtica, Firebelly Marketing, Sipping and Saving with Joey Padone. I think there's a lot of different people that you can get on happy to make those. And then obviously I talked about Jayla earlier and she's a neighbor of yours. She's in San Diego. I'm not sure where she's in San Diego, but she's in the California market. Joshua Arrington says, this is making my drive to Des Moines so much better. Thank you.

Good. That's good to hear.

And Alicia says, good morning. That's my partner. So I just always, we'd like to call out. Folks, anybody out there, if you have any questions, please bring 'em on. We'd, uh, love to hear from you.

Sam, do we wanna get to, uh, do we wanna ask, uh, Duncan's question?

Yeah, go ahead. You do it.

So Duncan said, and I have an add-on to it, he said, what role does press play for beverage brands today? And I'm curious with the last few minutes we have, in addition to that, if you have an example of a particularly good or a particularly bad PR moment that you've seen in recent history from a, a beverage brand.

Wow.

There's no bad PR.

That, okay. That's probably one of the biggest issues is believing that, right? So the role media plays for beverage brands, was that the first question?

What role does press play, press, like the press, news, press play for beverage brands today?

So they're, they're huge. They're, the role is, I don't wanna say they're everything, but they are a massive, massive part of brand awareness. Media is constantly changing. There are multiple different platforms you can explore, whether it be through print media, and it's, it's not dead. I know people say it is dead, but it's not fully dead. People are embracing it in a lot of ways. You'll see more people with newspapers now. Anyway, media is the thing that puts you on the market. It keeps you moving and keeps interest going. You'll find that, um, companies that are in the media have that level of credibility that consumers feel comfortable with. If a consumer sees your brand in a publication, they're like, hey, there's a reporter who actually sees value in this brand, in this company. I should feel comfortable with them. I feel safe with them. So that is, that is so important. And you've got to keep that going throughout your brand journey. One thing I will say though, that I think is important to note is there is a difference between earned press and paid press. So when you are on your brand journey, avoid paid press where possible, because a lot of these, let's say there's an article in, you know, Food and Beverage Magazine, and it says sponsored at the top of it because it is in fact paid. That is such a red flag. I mean, if, if you see that, you're like, great, but you paid for this. This is not anything that a reporter endorsed. This is something you just, you know, spent some dollars.

That's a great, that is a great point. It's funny, like you have the LinkedIn, uh, too. They're like, hey, do you wanna boost this? And I've always avoided it.

Yeah.

I'm like, no, man, you, you either like my content or you don't like my content.

Absolutely.

You know, it's fine.

Um, consumers know, like they see it and they, and it's actually kind of a turnoff, honestly.

Yeah.

I, I would rather see the New York Times post something, even, even if it's a tiny mention that's organic for a client versus Wall Street Journal doing something huge that's got—

Can you get, so versus paid press, earned press, can you help clients get to earned press? Like can get exposure?

That's what we're all about. Yeah. Archive PR and most PR agencies are all about fully earned. There is the option to help with paid, but that's more on the advertising side. I always try to steer clients towards earned. That's why we're here. You know, that's why you're, we're your partner because Because we want to get you credible coverage, something that you can share with your customers.

I love that. I'm wondering if Duncan will come back in with a question on that. I want to call out Bill. He's in our public chat on actually Riverside. Bill, thanks for joining us. Bill's been asking us to look at a couple people today and I didn't know, but Bill, I'll definitely check that person out. But Bill said, I wouldn't even know what trade publications is most read by Alkbev distributors.

Oh yeah, there's quite a few. There's a lot. Well, for food and beverage magazine is obviously one that's important.

Yeah.

Gosh, what else are there? I could, I could—

Badminton, Discus, WSWA, MBWA. I live in a world talking about beer.

There are quite a few out there. You just have to do a bit of Googling and find them. And you'll find that a lot of reporters at more general publications, they'll have like wine reporters or they'll have like a a spirits editor. They'll have people very specific to your particular beverage or your industry. That could also be very valuable too. Yeah.

It seems like WineScores comes to mind is I wonder how many of those are actually earned or paid.

Yeah.

Something to look at. Definitely avoid paid. So all the brands out there, earned.

Yeah. And so why do you avoid paid? This doesn't seem authentic.

What was that?

Doesn't seem authentic, right? It's like a commercial. Right. It's like when you're watching, uh, I don't know, I saw Reba McEntire doing a commercial the other day and I'm like, Reba, she was doing a commercial. I'm like, why?

Why Reba?

I'm like, she's doing a commercial. I mean, I, you know, or you have the McDonald's CEO that comes to mind. Did you see that one when he did the whole LinkedIn thing and he was eating the Big Mac?

Hilarious. And such a bad move. Such a bad move.

The guy's like 100 pounds. He's never had a Big Mac. Trust me.

And his face, it's just like, oh man, you really thought about this. That's a bad move. That was a big mistake for sure.

Yeah. So, all right. So we, with the remaining minutes, I'm going to let Adam ask the most important question of the day. And after we ask that question, we'll probably ask you to come back. Is there anything we didn't cover? And we'll wrap it up. So Adam, the most important question, I don't think we prepared, uh, uh, uh, Uh, uh, Priya for this, but, uh, it's a very important question. So I want to give it a lot of thought.

What is the difference between success and failure?

So the difference between success and failure, well, it's hard to say because both of them are constantly in flux. Success is only a blip in time. Failure is only a blip in time. It's really just how you move forward on both of those. Success is great. It's awesome that you get it, but that doesn't mean you land there and you end there. It's all about constant momentum. You know, failure Failure, it's similar. It's all about continuing to push forward. So in some ways there really isn't that much of a difference, to be honest. It's just, you know, you've done a little bit better. The other one is you're still kind of struggling, but at the end of the day, it's just an ebb and flow in business, especially in PR with clients too. They come and they go. It's just the nature of the business. I hope that makes sense. I hope that makes sense to you.

Have you seen the Seinfeld episode Even Steven?

I knew you were gonna bring that up.

Seinfeld is the best.

Always, always, always comes to mind. Well, so how did you get in that frame of mind? Like something in your life got you to where you think that way?

Oh yeah. And for, it took many, many years. I think it's really when you start to step away from working for someone else that you realize what success and failure really mean, at least to you as a person. When you work for an agency or another company, they tell you, this is what success looks This is what failure looks like. And that's what it means to you as a person in your industry. That's what your career looks like. It really took some time stepping away and really thinking about what it actually meant to come to that point, because that's hard. I take those things so hard. I'm being told I wasn't doing something right. When you're so passionate about something and you get crushed, it's tough. So it took a while, but you know, years later.

What gets you outta bed in the morning? Uh, you know, keeps you going?

I have to say, not just coffee, but I think it's creative opportunities. I'm like many PR people, I love to write things. So, I have ideas in the middle of the night, I'll just jot them on my phone or write them on my notepad. And so, it's fun in the morning to wake up and think, okay, what can I do with what I've written and what can I do that's unique and special today? So, maybe that's kind of cheesy, but that's, I feel like that's part of life. You got to be excited about your day ahead of you, you know? Otherwise, what's the point, right?

What, uh, what, so today, as we wrap up, anything we didn't cover today that you want to cover with us? And 2 is how do people find you? Yeah.

Well, I think one thing I just wanted to, to note for, for folks who are listening is that branding is not a static activity. It's something that's always in flux. Give yourself some grace. If you find something isn't working, it's okay. Just pivot. Remember, you can always pivot. And if you work, if you have the right people in place, the right partners, you'll get to where you need to go. So just, just know that there's, there's a lot of opportunity. Where to find me on LinkedIn. Also the website archivepr.com is a great place to go for updates on our coverage and things like that.

A-R-K-P-R dot com. Is this archive.com?

Archivepr.com. Sorry about that.

ArchivePR. I'm going to put it on the screen. Dot com. I'll make sure that it comes up right here. All right.

And, uh, whoops.

I, hopefully you guys can still see me. I left the screen for a second. Yeah. No, go back over here. I went to your website actually. Keep on doing that. Keep on hitting it wrong. I'll stream it. There we go. Show it on the screen. Is that right there? Did it come?

Yeah.

Oh, there it is. Yes. That's me. That's the website.

It worked. I kept, I think I've been, I made 2 massive visits to your screen and can find you on LinkedIn.

Yes, absolutely.

So as we wrap up here, maybe just go around and have some closing thoughts. Adam, anything on your mind in terms of today that you want to share with the group before we close down? And then we'll go to Pria.

Yeah. I mean, I think, you know, you're the first, let me think about this. I hope I don't, I hope this doesn't offend anybody else we've talked to because my memory is a little fuzzy, but I think you're the first, like like PR agency owner we've spoken to, or at least that I have as part of the show.

Oh, yeah.

Uh, I think just in general, um, A, I enjoy your perspective. B, I think for a lot of brands, right, as somebody who has a degree in PR but does operations for a living, the number of people that think, oh, hey, I'm just going to make a product and it'll resonate with people. No, it won't. Like you need to be a better storyteller or you need to hire one.

Yes, absolutely.

And so, yeah, I, uh, I enjoyed the conversation. I enjoyed your insights. Um, we could sit here and do this all day, I'm sure. Uh, and I would encourage anybody who's in need to reach out because I mean, to Sam's question about most brands being noise, I think a lot of people just assume that their story is interesting because it's interesting to them. They don't think like, well, Is that true? So that's my 2 cents for today.

Yeah. For me, it's earned media versus paid media. That really resonated with me. I also respect the fact that you said you write all your content and that you don't use AI. I've used AI for content. I'm not gonna lie. I mean, it's helped me.

Yeah.

Um, I, you know, do, you know, come up with some ideas. I generally will type it in there and I'm like, hey, can you clean this up? Yeah. Help me with this idea and I'll, I'll speak to it. Now we're exploring obviously Claude, but I respect that. Because I think it's really important where we're— I don't know where we're headed as humans. I don't know if we're having a Terminator moment. Certainly appreciate that. So thank you. And people can find you at archivepr.com. Please reach out to Priya. She is awesome. I got a chance to talk to you before this. And I have a lot of energy. I do have to ask before you close down and I'll close back, but you said you're from the Midwest. Was it Ohio?

Kansas. Kansas.

Kansas. That's right. And that's right. And Alicia is living in Wichita. Where in Kansas?

Oh my gosh. I'm in Pittsburgh. I don't know if she knows the area. It's southeast corner, kind of by Missouri, Oklahoma. There's, there's a university there, kind of, sort of.

Yeah. Well, she's coming, she's attending through Wichita, So your nickname is Dorothy now to me.

Okay.

The Wizard of Oz. So, but any closing thoughts from you?

No, no. I just so appreciate both of you speaking with me and I hope that some of what I said was helpful or interesting. It was just such a joy to get to know both of you and to be able to talk a bit about all of this stuff that I love and so much opportunity out there. There's just, we can achieve so much. We can.

Right. That's great. Well, thank you so much for joining today. Thanks everybody for joining us on Saturday. Enjoy your weekend ahead. It's raining here in Minnesota, so we'll just get through the weather and please stay on the line, both of you, and let everybody else get to their weekend. Thanks everybody.

Thanks everyone.