Benefits of Prenuptial Agreement Courtesy of Carol Anne Chan's Personal Story

Hello, we have Scott Levin here, and I'm with my friend and colleague Carol Ann Chan. How are you, Carol Ann?

I'm awesome this morning, thank you.

Good. Carol Ann is with Smile Haven Dentistry. It's a holistic dental practice in La Mesa, and before we get started, can you just tell us a little bit about your practice and your background?

Yeah. Well, I'm an RN and I have my master's in public health, and I'm also a certified health coach. And my husband is a trained general and cosmetic dentist, but he also took oral surgery. But when he went to go get his boards and everything and think about it, he just decided to stick with general and cosmetic dentistry. But he does have all the educational background of oral surgery, which is a benefit for people who come. But about 15 years ago— well, actually, no, I guess it's only been 14 years— he decided to change his dentistry from a— the dental materials used in traditional dentistry are a lot of metals and toxic materials. And he saw that his patients were chronically ill, and he didn't know why is all this happening. And so he went back to school. for looking into environmentally toxic-free dentistry. And he really saw the connection between what was happening from the toxic materials that were being introduced into the mouth that were then having access to the rest of the body because the blood supply is so, you know, it's just a lot in the mouth. It's just, there's so many through the gums and there's all these, they go up to the brain, they go to the heart, lungs. breasts, you name it, right from the mouth. It's almost a direct blood supply line. So he figured out that a lot of these chemicals, and through his education, that how they were affecting the rest of the body. So he decided to be a clean dentist. So he would— he really researches all the things he uses that he puts into your mouth that are clean, that are more biocompatible, so that they do not— cause problems in the rest of your body. And metals, no matter nickel, palladium, cadmium, gold, aluminum in porcelain crowns and all those things, and amalgams are just highly toxic and neurotoxic to the body. And also fluoride, the fluoride treatments are highly neurotoxic. So we are all of that free. Our dental office does not have any of that in there.

Wow.

Yeah, so it's really clean dentistry, and we're really proud. And he's been doing that now for 14 years and has really enjoyed it. His patients are enjoying it as well. And so we're really happy. And we take insurance, which most holistic dental practices are only fee-for-service. So we still— we take Denti-Cal. We do have a few HMOs, but all PPOs. And we now have a new dental membership for people who don't have any insurance, which really makes dental care affordable and holistic dental care affordable.

Great. And you can see a dog in my background, so you know that I'm at home.

Oh, I love it.

I love it. Well, that sounds amazing. And it's amazing that Dr. Chan and yourself made that switch so early in the timeline. I know Holistic dentistry is kind of a buzzword now, but I mean, 15 years ago, you guys were probably on the forefront, it sounds like.

Yeah, we were. And he did it because of me. He met me, I guess it was like almost 20 years ago. And he— I had so many allergies to certain things. And when he took care of me as a dentist, he said, wow, you're very sensitive. And then he realized that a lot of the environmental toxins that I were exposed to were affecting my body. So I kind of gave him a clue.

Yeah, that's awesome. Very cool.

I really love what I do there because I do health consultations. Tell us about that. Yeah, I help them go through detox protocols and help them look at their diet and how to clean it up and, you know, do all kinds of health things there. We do circulation care. We have an infrared sauna. We do ozone therapy and it's just wonderful. We have a lot of wonderful presentations at our office for people who are looking for alternative, more natural ways to get healthy. So we really enjoy our time. We have a great time educating people.

That's great. You have a great space too, and I'm going to be taking advantage of it hopefully to join you for some seminars related to Our industry as well. So, well, the reason that I asked Carol Ann to join me, and you've heard a little bit about her background with Dr. Chan and the dental practice. Carol Ann had mentioned to me, we're friends off Zoom, and she had mentioned that she had gotten a prenuptial agreement, not from me. This was many years ago, and the benefits had really worked out in her favor. And I just thought that it sounded like an interesting conversation for us to have from someone that didn't work with me. So you're not hearing like a, you know, a testimonial for my services. You're hearing Carol Ann's point of view of how the prenuptial agreement affected her life. And in the positive. So to start with, Carol Ann, I guess I just have a couple questions. What made you want to explore a prenuptial agreement?

Well, when I met my husband, I had been a nurse for a long, long time, and I had a lot of professional things like my pensions, and I had a house, and I had different retirement plans that were all in my name. And as a professional, I wasn't ready to change my name to his name. I thought it was important for me to establish or to keep my identity and who I was for professional reasons. There's a lot of things that bureaucratically, if you don't press all the right buttons and legally trying to change your name, a lot of havoc can happen. So I wanted to keep professionally And personally, with my pensions and with my Social Security and all those different benefits, I wanted to keep in my own name. And then I had children who were teenagers. I had one that was married and off, but I had another kid who was a 16-year-old and just beginning to drive. And then Dr. Chan, he had his whole life ahead of him, you know, or behind him, actually. He had a home and he had a practice and he had all these So there was a lot of business things and to maybe, you know, just identify and keep separate for the time being because teenagers, when they're just beginning to drive, they could get in an accident. And we all know that lawyers go for the largest pocket. Where are they going to find the largest money? So I figured I wanted to keep my liability separate from my new husband's liability. And also he had a practice. he could get into malpractice and/or somebody could sue him and then my assets would be involved. So we thought just as older professional couple, we loved each other, we trust each other. That wasn't the issue. It was just professional separation to protect each other's assets. And as it turned out, my son did have a really bad car accident where he accidentally He bumped into somebody on the side of the road and caused him a lot of injuries. And it was just a weird situation. But anyway, so he injured someone. And he was just a new driver. And so it was really great that I had had the prenuptial in place so that then the dental practice wouldn't be liable. And also, this was another big thing. Dr. Chan, Had been in an IRS audit. It started a couple of years before we got married, and the audit was in process, and it didn't look like it was going to blow up, but it did, even though my husband had all the evidence to show that the—

Hmm.

Had a farm business, and it was really a business, not a hobby, but the IRS chose to consider it a hobby. Even though, you know, you don't have, you don't have over 200 head of emu. That's not a hobby. That's a business.

Doesn't sound like one.

Over 200 head of goats. That's not a hobby. That's a business. I mean, it was so ludicrous. So anyway, it was totally ridiculous. But they, 7 years, they audited him and finally came out with a decision that about a quarter of a million dollars. And so they, because of our prenuptial, they were not allowed to look at any of my assets.

Hmm.

They could only deal with my husband's assets. So that was a huge thing in our favor. So, um, it really protected us because we, when we got married, we didn't quite know how this IRS audit was going to go. But just having that prenuptial in place, Really saved us because they would have come after my assets as well. So the house I had and anything else. So, you know, it wasn't that we were thinking, oh, in case of divorce or whatever. We've now been married for close to 15 years and everything's fine, everything's wonderful. But it was really great to have those prenups because Who knew? But that IRS audit, it really took him for everything he had. And luckily my assets were saved.

So— Wow. It really came into play then for you guys.

It really did. Yeah. Now, I don't know. Now we've kind of relaxed on that prenuptial and now we have a joint trust and we have all of that. So I hope nothing else happens. But, you know, But for the beginning, it really, really helped.

Absolutely. It sounds like it did. Is there anything differently that you would have put into the prenup or taken out that was in there that you can recall?

No, I think we had a really— it was really great. We met with our lawyer and just like someone would meet with you, we really looked at all the different pieces and put them all In the prenuptial agreement, everything was there. I mean, it was really thorough. It was done really well. So I advise to get someone who really knows what they're doing. It was just really, really, really great. Yeah, it saved us a lot.

That's amazing. Well, I mean, you really hit it all. What, I guess, what tips or suggestions would you give anyone watching this video that's considering a prenuptial agreement? You know, there is kind of a stigma to it. Especially for younger couples, you know, first marriages especially, but any tips or suggestions that someone watching this you would like to impart to them?

Let go of all the stigma. Let go. It is— marriage is an emotional attachment, of course. You're expressing your love for one another, but yet there are so many legal things these days you need to know about, things that could come up out of the blue, out of your control, and that are going to disrupt, you know, your financial standing, your footing. And believe me, as you know, any marriage knows that financial stresses can really put a stress on the marriage. So when you have a prenuptial there, it just, it just helps. It just puts it— it outlines all these things. And I would suggest anybody who is getting married Just go in and look because these people do tell you a lot about— they educate you about your finances and what could be taken, what could not be taken, what could be on the table, what couldn't be on the table. So you just get a lot of good education about how your finances relate with the rest of the world. And it's— it was wonderful. I think everyone who's getting married should do this. And also any professional couple, if you, you know, anybody who's bringing 2 professions to the marriage relationship, and they really need to, to talk about it. And granted, you get all these things cleared up before your marriage, and then you don't have any surprises, which, you know, can lead to hiccups. So I think it's, I think it's good for everyone to at least go in and get the counseling And, and, and have that education.

I think you said it all. I mean, I couldn't agree more. Just, just the understanding of what, what you each other have on the financial counseling aspect is a tremendous benefit to a lot of our clients, whether they end up pursuing the full prenuptial agreement or not. They, they discuss their finances and their debt and their assets. their property. I mean, they have a real serious conversation most of the time for the first time with us. And I can't tell our viewers how many times our clients have thanked us for that education part of it because it's just— it can clear up a lot of the hiccups, like you said, Carol Ann, that come along later on.

Especially young people who have loans, who have school loans. If you can you know, figure out that and how, you know, just education on how those finances work and then how you can maybe separate them so that if somebody loses a job or whatever, gosh, things happen. We just know that unprecedented things happen and nothing is guaranteed. So it is that education would be really important. I know that I didn't have a prenuptial in my first marriage. And then when We ended up, you know, having to financially split all of our things. It was quite a catch-up of education. So I think I actually had prepared, you know, for my second marriage wanting a prenup because the hiccups that happened when I had to end the first marriage. So I learned I really didn't know a lot about finances. And then so that kind of, that divorce gave me an education and that's really, it just made sense to have a prenup and to be educated into what we needed to do. It was, yeah, I wouldn't, I wouldn't do another marriage another way. And then there's not going to be another marriage.

No, there isn't.

I love Dirty Jen. There's no way.

I just want everyone watching and everyone who views this later on, you know, it is a, It takes a very unique person like Carol Ann to come on to an interview forum like this and to share her personal details. And the reason she offered to do it is simply to help people. And I think it speaks to her character and her belief system that she even is gracious enough to give us this information and to tell a lot about herself in this forum, in this public forum. And I just greatly appreciate her friendship. I want anyone to remember that, that you can find Carol Ann Chan and Dr. Chan at Smile Haven Dental Center and Wellness Spa in La Mesa. It's a community within San Diego for all holistic dental needs. This is the office that you should be going to. I've known Carol Ann for a very long time and can't speak highly enough. So thank you so much, Carol Ann.

Thank you. And I have, I have someone I need to send you. I'm gonna give you— yes, he's right in our office and he's— he needs you. So.

Okay. All right, I'm gonna stop recording.

Okay.