Building In Podcast Money Making Opportunities You Can Taste Like On the Road With Mr. CA Wine, Chuck Cramer

Wish you were one of those influencers with raving fans who binge on your every word, consume all your content, buy everything you have to sell, and demand even more. Then stay tuned while Authority magazine columnist and buzzfeed contributor Tracy Hazzard shares strategies, tips and tactics from top videocasters, podcasters, authors and social influencers on creating that bingeable factor. Now let's join Tracy as she explores how to rise above all the digital noise with the Binge Factor.

Hey everyone, Tracy Hazard here on the Binge Factor and today's episode. We're going across the pond. We are going to talk to Chuck Kramer on the road with Mr. California wine. But interestingly enough, in London he is not based here. He is selling California wines into the London scene. So it's pretty cool job. He's got a really interesting perspective on everything and he loves California where he's from and loves the wine there and his passion just keeps coming across. So on the road with Mr. California wine is about California's cool, aspirational lifestyle and awesome wines. Hosted by Chuck Kramer, a California native living in London and the director of European sales and marketing for Torlato Wines, this is a wine journey covering the hottest topics in California wine, chatting along the way with the experts who make it all happen. As I was listening to his first episode, he's got this really cool California vibe going on on the music and it had this diners drive ins and dives kind of feel. So I imagining what kind of car he's driving as he's doing this. Of course he's not recording from his car. His recording is too good to be from his car. But I'm imagining that as I'm listening to the show. So let's hear what he's really and how he's really doing this when we talk to Chuck Kramer of On the road with Mr. California Wine.

Chuck, we're getting to talk California wine and a whole different style podcast today. I'm super excited about it because this is just one of those shows that sounds like it should be Diners Drive Ins and Dives, but in podcast format and about wine. So how could that get cooler? So did you intend to sort of follow that model and have that feel to your show?

That's interesting. I guess the whole concept was to, yeah, to take people on the road, I guess visually via audio through the podcast to different parts of California. And you're right. Occasionally I do recommend diners and restaurants and stuff like that and I try and give stories along the way so people can relate and feel as though they're actually on the road with me in California. So I like the way you describe that. That's awesome.

Yeah, it does have that feel. And I think also because of the styling of what you've done with the audio, so you have a really cultivated audio format. And so listeners out there, this is one of the things you definitely want to check out about Chuck's show on the road with Mr. California Wine. You want to check out the way he does the audio because he does this beautiful intro where he's really talking about where it is very descriptive. And I think that probably comes because you have great experience describing wine, which is hard to describe. Something that's esoteric in a way. Right. So you're describing something, you're describing the landscape, you're describing where you are. You're describing all of that with music underlying it. That kind of gives you this energy and beat to it. And then you go into your interview from there and that's a really great style that you have going on. And you have the music come up again at the end as you close. And it's just a really great style that's highly produced, it has a great sound to it.

Well, thank you. I definitely wanted that California beat. It's kind of like the, the. If you go back and listen to the Ventures or the theme song to the Hawaii Five O. I wanted music that is closely associated with California. Growing up near the water, whether I was lifeguarding or swimming or just enjoying a day out on the beach. And you think about California, you think beaches, you think white sandy beaches, you think Hollywood. And I thought that music got me close to what? Just think, okay, I'm on the road, I'm driving. I. I've got the radio on K Earth 101, whatever. And you got the music behind me.

But now you're really dating us.

Yeah, exactly. It is dating this, but also at the same time, I just thought the music would maybe enhance the audio and maybe put up with my voice over like a two minute stretch or something like that.

Well, Chuck, you're a California guy, you're from the LA area. I'm from a little farther south. And I just have to tell you this funny story. So I borrowed my parents car because mine was in the shop and I had to get to an event. I borrowed my parents car and they're watching me drive out of the driveway. I felt like I was in the 80s, 16 all over again, right? And I'm driving out the driveway and the Music turns on in the car and it's my dad's car, so it turns on to K Earth 101. But the weird part is, is when I was a kid and my dad would put K Earth 101, it was all 50s and 60s music, right? And now it's 80s music playing. I felt like I was in a weird time warp, like it was some kind of strange effect. How did K Earth turn from like 50s and 60s, 80s all of a sudden? So, yeah, you're right. California has a vibe to it. I get a sense you're in a convertible. Of course you're not, because the sound is great. We don't hear a lot of wind. But, you know, you get that sense from your music. So you've really set the tone for the show. Right. And set this excitement up for what you're going to hear and excitement up for wanting to follow you, wanting to visit these places, wanting to taste these wines and meet these people. That is really your binge factor right there. And that's what I wanted to point out to everyone, is that someone who's so good at visual descriptions in an audio format and telling stories like you are, Chuck, they are going to do better in a podcast model. And you've picked a perfect format to highlight that.

Thank you very much. You know what? The podcast was born during COVID last year, just kind of taking walks and. And thinking about, well, you know, constantly staying busy, but businesses slowed down over here in Europe, in the uk. And I thought, well, what can I do with my time? I play tennis. Couldn't play tennis during COVID a lot of times over here. And I just thought, let's do a podcast. I sell California wine. A handful of maybe Californians actually selling wine over here. And I just see it. Tracy has an extension of the business and it leads to new business and it gets people excited about California wine. And I love talking about my home state, bottom line.

And you are passionate about it. I love that. You know, I think that that's a really great model. So you're starting this at a time at which you can't make a connection point. You're still connecting to your network back home, so you're making that direct connection by having calls with them. So from a business strategy, this is really smart. You're telling stories, which is going to help you sell wine. You're staying connected with everyone. You can't visit right now. And that's a beautiful way to empower your business amongst a lot of challenges.

Yeah, I agree. Like, I Said I want them to feel as though they're there. When they're able to hop on a flight and visit California, they can say, oh, yeah, I'm in the Santa Cruz Mountains. Chuck talked about going up to the top of the mountain and visiting Ridge or, say, Chimney Rock or Rutherford Hill in Napa, Sanford and Santa Barbara, or the Michael David Winery in Lodi. And they have all this information as a result of this podcast. And like I said, I have fun. I have fun meeting people that I wouldn't necessarily maybe have the opportunity to meet. And Tracy, people. People are great. People are awesome. People say, yes. People I don't know, haven't met yet. They'll say, yeah, we'll do this podcast. And it's just been a lot of fun, and it's been a great experience.

That's wonderful. I'm so glad your podcasting journey has been, like, really beneficial and personally rewarding at the same time, because if you could do both, you're going to stick with it. And you've done a lot of episodes in a. So you've been consistent about it, which is, I think 90% of everything is showing up, and that's what you've done week after week. And it's gotten better and better from the very beginning. What was the biggest challenge, though, when you went to go start it?

The biggest challenge for me was just actually pulling the trigger. So I did a lot of research. I mean, like I told you before we started, I'm a huge fan of your show. So I listen to about 10 podcasts on a regular basis and. And you're up there, number one, because I think you give invaluable insight in terms of how to become a podcaster. And so listening to you, just little tips here and there, I think help make the show or me better. It was buying the equipment, and it was just like, kind of like, well, how am I going to start? What's going to be the first topic? Which wine am I going to talk about? Who am I going to line up? And then I was just kind of like, get not nervous, but was I getting wet feet? I was thinking, well, am I going to sound like an idiot? And you go back to day one, and I just feel a lot more natural now. I think, you know, I've got 63 episodes under my belt, and like you said, I want to come out there every Thursday if I'm out traveling. Like, if I'm in the States or from Europe, I'll preload four or five episodes. So I don't have to worry about it. And I want consistency. I want people to know that this podcast is going to be there.

Yeah, I think it's a really great model for your business as well. And this is the thing is, like, at different stages in more than a year on your podcast, now it's time to concentrate on some different things. And so I'm going to jump into some of my questions because now this is typically when a podcaster starts to amp up these things. So, you know, you've got great guests on there. They're so interesting. They tell fantastic stories. Some of the wines they recommend, I've never heard of. I'm like, I don't know what that is. And my dad makes wine, so I should, like, know better. I don't. Yeah, and it makes wine in our garage when we were kids. Like, not a big vineyard. Although if he could have bought one, he would have. And so, yeah, so, like, I should know because I've been around it for a while, but I don't. And so it's like, oh, I kind of want to make a little note about that. What is that? I've never heard of it before. Should I try that? It's eye opening in that process. So how do you keep finding kind of better and better guests? Because I'm sure after 60 episodes, you've really tapped out your initial network.

Well, it's interesting if you look at California, there's over 4,500 wineries in California. And I'm trying to reach or interview a broad base. So not just like the glamorous side of the business, say, winery owners, winemakers, but I get mates who are sommeliers, F and B directors. Even though I think my podcast is very niche, it's very narrow. Just talking about California wine, I'm trying to get a hold of everybody in the industry, so there's a big pool out there to draw from. I lean on friends, associates, and. And what I just started doing, and I didn't do this in the beginning, is after I'm done interviewing somebody and say, they talk about a mentor, mention somebody else's name. I'll email them afterwards and say, hey, can you do me a favor? Can you set up. Can you introduce me to that person you just talked about? And this is how I'm getting now, more and more guests and tapping into this guest list that I didn't have before. So asking for references has been super helpful.

And that's got to be help growing your business, because you're nothing if you don't have this great network of California wineries right at the end of the day. So that's going to really. It's expanding your knowledge, expanding your network, really helpful to your core business. And you built it into something where you're marketing your business and learning within your business at the same time. So great.

Yeah, it's. It's super educational, and I know quite a bit about California, but there's always something new to learn. There's always that little plot of vineyard to talk about somewhere that I've never been before. Went to Cambria and saw some vineyards for the first time over in July. And it's. Yeah, I. Super educational. I mean, I am learning. I'm probably learning more than I'm actually educating. I guess, if I can put it that way.

That's okay. That's the best way. Your audience wants to come along with you, Right? So now you've got to be working on that stage where you're starting to increase listeners, encourage engagement with your guests as well as with your audience. How is that going for you? What are you doing that you feel is starting to work?

Well, in the beginning, I had a fairly large database. I was emailing, and then I stopped that after a couple months. I just thought maybe I was starting to annoy people on a weekly basis with this email. So I stopped emailing. Don't know if that was the right move or not. I use Instagram a lot to help promote episodes that are coming up, reinforce what was on, and then again the following week, what's new coming up. So a lot of videos on Instagram, a lot of photos on Instagram, photos of myself, photos of guests. I do use Facebook, and I think I need to start using LinkedIn a lot more in terms of the way I use Instagram, because I don't know if I plateaued or not, but I need to throw a broader net out there to get more people to listen.

If I can make a suggestion to you, Chuck, and this is the thing, when I evaluate a show here, I always go and check out your websites and your social media channels. Your Instagram is doing really well. It's got great variety. Whenever you find someone on Instagram and you look at your profile, you look at their grid, they call it, right? And it's all the little photos that you have, and they're all interesting. There's a person in them, there's wine in them. They all look interesting. I don't know what the post is till I click on one, but they all look very visually interesting. So that means I will likely say, I'm going to friend you. Then I'll start following you and I'll see your new posts and you do have videos coming out and things like that which are doing really well on Instagram right now. If you're doing the same thing or pulling that through to Facebook, start to think about doing that same strategy on LinkedIn. Because your LinkedIn posts are your cover art and a description about the show. And you're actually sending to Apple for the file, which we don't want to do, we want to send to our websites. So having a way for people to access, which you already have a player on your website, it's perfectly fine. Just send them to the podcast page on the website instead of sending them to Apple to listen to the episode.

Okay.

And because you're just giving Apple more value, not yourself, you want them to come to your website so they can see more about you. They can listen right there. They can also check, click through the player and go subscribe anywhere. But most people will just, if they see a podcast, will just pick up their favorite app and type in your show name. So they're not even going to click through that link anyway. So why give Apple value? You should give your website value and change up that image there. Use some of the ones that you're using. Use the little video clips that you're using on Instagram, change them up. Then your LinkedIn becomes more dynamic too. And I suspect your Network is on LinkedIn.

Yeah, the hospitality trade sector is on LinkedIn. And you're absolutely right. I need to up my game on LinkedIn. And I appreciate the advice there.

Yeah, you've already got the great workings of it on Instagram. Just sort of translate that in a little professional way on LinkedIn and then make sure you're doing tagging to your guests because I don't see that happening. I don't see your guest name as like being tagged there.

Okay.

And that'll help encourage the cross sell. They want to be highlighted, so they want to share that with their audience. So that'll help them engage in the post at that point. So I think that could up your game here. But your Instagram is doing really well. And everyone, you should check that out because. So it's Mr. California Wine, I think, right?

Yes.

So that's his handle there. And go check that out because you can just see a really good use of images and videos over there that do help promote the show. And I guarantee you listeners are coming because of that.

Okay, great advice. Thank you very much.

You're welcome. So, yeah, let's talk about monetization, but I like to talk about it in alternative monetization views. So you mentioned before that you felt that this was leading to some business. What kind of return on investment have you been seeing?

I work for a company called Charlotte of Wines. I manage a European business over here and it does. I see this extension of the business. Now, not every episode could talk about the wines that I work with. I mean, I want to make it, I want to broaden that reach or broaden the experience. So I have a lot of guests and promote a lot of wines that I don't necessarily work with. But the bottom line is I want to talk about California wine. I want to talk about awesome California is and how awesome California wines are in general. But on occasion, you know, I do have guests on. I have guests that want to be in. We start talking about my wines and next thing I know, the wines listed on their wine list. And so that's the return there in terms of, you know, there's a direct relationship or benefit to what I'm doing and that's fine. And again, I'm getting buy in from a mate who owns a restaurant or is managing a restaurant. I'm getting buy in and I'm going in supporting him and he's now supporting my wines and he's supporting the podcast, which is a lot of fun.

That's so great. Do some leave behinds as everybody start opening up so you'll have a as heard on, on the road. Right? You're absolutely like right by where the wine tasting is happening. That would be a lot. You're going to have to amp that up now that we're moving about. So what have you found to be the most challenging part about podcasting?

I was thinking about this earlier today and I would say I'm a one man band now. I do want to give a shout out to my daughter Audrey because my daughter Audrey is the one who's managing my Instagram on social media and she's.

Been, she's doing a great job.

She's doing a fantastic job. I would say time management. I have a day job. I do all the editing. And I would say if you look at, it's a lot of fun and I love chatting with people. I mean that for me, that's the best part, the interview, just chatting with people. I enjoy writing content. I try and get creative and I try and inject my sense of humor into it so it comes through and it becomes More personable, so I can make that connection. But it's time management. You know, I work during the day, so I'm interviewing especially people in California or on the East Coast. I'm talking to them on Monday nights normally, and I'm editing and I'm putting everything together on the weekend. So time management is the biggest challenge.

For me, and it is for so many podcasters out there. Next thing maybe is to figure out a strategy for you to get some backup help here and actually start to have some sponsorship or some money going into the show for you. So you can afford that.

Right.

You're at a good stage now that where these things are options. What is the strategy for the next year now? Right. And be thinking about that moving forward. If you could have any guests on you, ask your guests who they would love to have and what wine they would love to drink. And I think it's someone not living. Right. Who they'd like to have.

Yeah, Any celebrity, living or dead. Who would you invite to share a bottle of your wine with?

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Well, who would you want to have on your show? I'm going to go with living because we might be able to make that happen. Let's go with living. And if you could do it in person, what would you serve them?

Wow. Okay. Talk about throwing me a curveball here.

Great question.

I would say, you know what? I know. I know I love tennis. I messaged the guy one of the podcasts I listened to as Advantage Connors. Jimmy Connors and his son, Brett Connors. I know Jimmy likes wine. Jimmy likes to cook. Obviously, he's my idol. Growing up. It would be Jimmy Connors just over a burger, a pizza on a tennis court with one of the wines that I sell. I know he would love. It would be Jimmy Connors, without a doubt.

That would be an interesting conversation. I would love to hear that, too. And I didn't know he liked wine and things like that, so really interesting. See? So thinking about that, anyone out there who can connect Chuck up to Jimmy Connors? Let's do that. Okay. While we're listening here, you never know.

You never know. That would be awesome.

What advice do you have for some out there who are thinking about starting a show?

Advice? I would say do your homework. I know Pat Flynn has, in addition to yourself, Tracy, you know, the binge factor and also feed your mind. Pat Flynn was very helpful in terms of which equipment to buy and how to go. Putting together a timeline to set this up and then finding something you're passionate about. Look at my podcast is very narrow. It's talking about California wine. I'm not talking about wine from all over the world. Find something you're passionate about and just do it. Just invest a little money in the right audio equipment. Try and find a quiet time or place to do it. Just do it. Don't hesitate. You're going to make mistakes, but you just get better, just like anything else as you keep doing it.

That's fantastic. Have you thought about doing videocasts?

Videocast? Educate me.

So the video version of the podcast. Because at some point you going to be able to do these interviews live in a place in a location, and wouldn't we want to see that?

Yeah, videocast. You know what? I'm in California quite a bit, and that would be easy to set up, especially just interviewing somebody in the middle of a vineyard or in the tasting room.

Yeah, it's a sound challenge. Like, you have to have the right equipment for that, but it would be, you know, I mean, you don't have to do every single episode like that. You could do one a month or something, you know, so bank them up when you're in California and then distribute them out one a month. And with those, you don't have to heavily edit because people are really forgiving because people livestream all the time. Right.

So, okay, that sounds great. Another great tip from you.

Because that's the one thing I wanted to do. I was like, I want to see where he is. Like, I really. I want to see what this looks like. And you describe it so well, but I was like, there's gotta be a visual somewhere and then there isn't. Like, I can't find an image. I guess through your Instagram. Maybe I'd be able to find some if I was really connecting the pieces, but because I didn't find the episode from your Instagram to begin with, like, going back through your Instagram to look at the images is hard.

I haven't done any video casting, but it's something I can certainly do.

Sure, yeah. It would just be a lot of fun to see that. And then I keep thinking that maybe in your future there's got to be wine tours, because I want to come along with you. It sounds like fun. You are fun. I don't know, maybe a wine tour is in your future when you make your trips.

Okay.

Taking a group of people on the road with you. Okay.

You're giving me a lot to think about here.

This is great listeners out there. Message Chuck. Let them know that you'd like, to go on the road with them, because once you listen to a show, you're going to see exactly. Or you're going to hear exactly what I mean. Right. I was like, I don't know enough about wine. I don't know enough about that area of California. And I actually lived in Northern California for a period of time. I lived closer to Pleasanton and Oakland area, so not quite Napa area.

Yeah, you're close enough.

And I maybe made a couple of trips. Like, compared to where I am now. That was an easy trip to make, and I should have done it, because I feel like I missed out listening to your show. That's when a show is really great, Chuck, when you're making me want to do something that I didn't even know I wanted to do.

I appreciate that. That's the goal, and I hope I'm doing that on a weekly basis. So thank you.

Well, I think you've got mission accomplished there, so. Yeah, keep going. Keep doing it. Is there any advice that you want to give to the audience about not podcasting in general, but really about staying connected and building your network and building your business amongst these challenging times?

Yeah, definitely challenging times. I mean, during COVID I was as safe as I could be. Always out there, trying, engaging. I mean, Zoom's been. Zoom's been interesting, but there's limitations in terms of what you can do with Zoom. If you work in a bar, restaurant, you can't serve drinks through your laptop. So for me, it's always about making that personal connection and whether it's somebody that you think can help you or not. I think just meeting more and more people can help you, get you to where you want to go and then help them along the way as well. So I'm constantly out there, Traci. I want to talk to everybody. I want to meet everybody. And you might not get a sale or wine listing every time you're meeting with somebody, but that somebody could be super interesting, that somebody can be your best friend six years down the road after knowing them for a period of time. So I just say, keep throwing yourself out there.

Tell us one of your favorite wines that you sell. Because now everybody's like, now I'm really thirsty. I would like to have a glass of wine.

Oh, boy. We've got some great winemakers that I work with. I would say, in terms of distribution in the United States, walk into a total wine or store and grab a bottle of the Federalists. Great imaging, great packaging, great storytelling. It's all about the United States, the juice is from California, but there's just they got so much going on on the label. And then once you open that bottle, whether it's a Chardonnay as Infidel or Cabin, they're just great coiffing wines. Just barbecue on its own, whatever. I would say the Federalist would be my shout out and Brian Parker is the winemaker.

Wonderful. Well, glad we could do a little shout out here and give our listeners something else to think about besides podcasting for a change. Chuck, I'm so glad you came on my show. I'm so glad you reached out to me and we got to meet each other on the road with Mr. California Wine, Chuck Kramer, Great show. Thank you so much for bringing your podcast to the world.

Tracy, thanks for having me on and keep doing what you're doing because I love the binge factor.

Thank you.

You know, Chuck is on such a path that's so good with a good quality show with a really great topic that people are very interested in. There's a large audience base. Maybe it hadn't occurred to them all to get on podcasts, but there's videos too, right? So he's got all of that going on for him. There is monetization strategies that are capable here, right? There are so many different ways that he could go about it. He can get a large SPAW sponsor who might tourism boards, wineries, all kinds of things that he could get sponsorship from. But I also think that there's another model for him here and that is featuring his own wines on the show, highlighting featured wines and offering that up as paid spots that can help at minimum offset the cost of production, but also really bring exposure and bring sales in a way that you didn't know. So if you're considering, if you have this style show, there's so many alternative monetization options that you really should think about and evaluate before you just dive in with the common thing of just taking ads. And you also really ought to think about doing what Chuck has done here. So I mean, he's waited until he has had a decent number of episodes to really dive into that deeply because you don't want to do it too soon. It can make your show look like a sellout. It can also just degrade the value over time when they don't see the ads recurring. It makes people wonder, well, what happened there? Did the advertiser drop you? When in reality it was just kind of like a one time jump shot that you did to jump your show and get it started and you managed to convince a friend who might advertise on it. So the timing matters. And I think right now, as his show is growing, even though it's not at like such a huge high yet, it's on its path and it's got really good traction and really good reviews and shows. And there's a little bit of fear missing out if you're a winery. So that's important in there as well. So I think all of that bodes well for an alternative monetization strategy. And really look at what's going to be most beneficial for my show, my listeners and my business. And when you combine all of those together and then screen that against and then how does the advertiser or sponsor benefit? Now we have a formula for making it work. And I think that's exactly where Chuck is right now. So I look forward to seeing what he does next. And we'll have to have him back on when he's out here in California, maybe. I definitely would like to go on a trip with him, wouldn't you? I think that's in his future, too. So who knows what alternative monetization ideas Chuck Kramer is going to come up with. So you're just going to have to go check out, especially if you're interested in wines and you want to hear all about it, but also because you want to hear such a highly produced, wonderful show. So go listen to on the road with Mr. California wine. And if you would like to be on the Binge Factor, don't forget that I'm always featuring new binge factor podcasters or podcasters who aren't really sure if they have a binge factor or not. Because maybe you'd like me to psychoanalyze your show. And I'm always happy to do that. So just apply@thebingefactor.com and I look forward to evaluating your show and checking you out and hearing what you're offering. And if you haven't started your podcast yet, listen to the advice from A lot of the podcasters have been on my show, including Chuck Kramer today. Just get started. Until next time, I'm Tracy Hazzard on the Binge Factor.

You've been listening to the Binge Factor Podcast. For more information on podcasting and videocasting success tips and tactics, please go to thebingefactor.com and be sure to listen to our other show for podcasters called Feed you'd Brand. If you'd like to be interviewed on this show as well as featured in Tracy's column, please go to thebingefactor.com guest and apply.